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1
00:00:07,396 --> 00:00:13,366
♪
2
00:00:13,501 --> 00:00:16,803
I never understood why
he needed to take up flying.
3
00:00:17,973 --> 00:00:19,905
I said to him like,
"john, come on.
4
00:00:19,907 --> 00:00:21,975
Look, I know you
pretty damn well.
5
00:00:21,977 --> 00:00:23,643
You know, it's like,
it's not in your --
6
00:00:23,778 --> 00:00:25,111
Not your sweet spot."
7
00:00:25,247 --> 00:00:27,913
And he said to me,
really interestingly,
8
00:00:28,016 --> 00:00:30,650
"it's the only place
where I can go
9
00:00:30,785 --> 00:00:32,752
Where I'm left entirely alone.
10
00:00:32,821 --> 00:00:36,589
♪
11
00:00:36,724 --> 00:00:40,193
"I love the silence.
I love the solitude."
12
00:00:40,195 --> 00:00:43,262
It was a pure escape for him.
13
00:00:43,397 --> 00:00:44,731
How do you argue with that?
14
00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:48,601
♪
15
00:00:48,804 --> 00:00:51,671
Gillon: One of the things
I did not know about john
16
00:00:51,673 --> 00:00:54,674
Was how difficult
that last year of his life was.
17
00:00:54,676 --> 00:00:56,142
The magazine is failing.
18
00:00:56,278 --> 00:00:59,212
John is lying around
trying to find investors.
19
00:00:59,214 --> 00:01:01,014
His marriage was falling apart.
20
00:01:01,016 --> 00:01:03,883
Reporter: Jfk jr. And new wife
headed for splitsville
21
00:01:03,885 --> 00:01:05,218
After just four months.
22
00:01:05,320 --> 00:01:07,953
It seems to kind of be
a typical tiff of things
23
00:01:08,056 --> 00:01:09,422
That go on between
the two of them.
24
00:01:09,424 --> 00:01:11,491
Gillon: And his best friend
and cousin,
25
00:01:11,626 --> 00:01:13,226
Anthony radziwill, was dying.
26
00:01:13,361 --> 00:01:14,727
Man: Anthony,
you all set now?
27
00:01:15,963 --> 00:01:20,233
The symbolism of flying,
psychologically, is power.
28
00:01:20,235 --> 00:01:23,703
It's control.
It's navigation.
29
00:01:23,705 --> 00:01:26,039
A time for john to be
just with himself,
30
00:01:26,041 --> 00:01:27,574
His own thoughts,
his own feelings.
31
00:01:30,345 --> 00:01:38,751
John will forever love flying
because he felt free.
32
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♪
33
00:01:50,865 --> 00:01:54,901
♪
34
00:01:56,804 --> 00:02:00,273
You don't call women [bleep]
you don't call women [bleep]
35
00:02:00,375 --> 00:02:01,941
Your mother ever
tell you that?
36
00:02:01,943 --> 00:02:04,677
Reporter: Dumping a bucket of
water on a prying photographer
37
00:02:04,812 --> 00:02:07,012
Probably wasn't what
"john-john" had in mind
38
00:02:07,014 --> 00:02:08,481
To get some r&r.
39
00:02:08,616 --> 00:02:11,350
So why does john have
such a short fuse lately?
40
00:02:11,352 --> 00:02:14,554
Well, there have been reports
of possible trouble in paradise.
41
00:02:14,689 --> 00:02:17,022
Ginsberg: You know, it seemed
like a storybook marriage.
42
00:02:17,024 --> 00:02:19,825
It's just, you know,
beneath the surface,
43
00:02:19,827 --> 00:02:22,027
Every relationship is
complicated.
44
00:02:22,130 --> 00:02:23,829
Jfk jr. And bride...
45
00:02:23,831 --> 00:02:24,897
Yeah?
46
00:02:24,900 --> 00:02:26,365
Talking bust-up.
47
00:02:26,367 --> 00:02:27,500
No way.
48
00:02:27,635 --> 00:02:28,233
Yeah.
49
00:02:28,235 --> 00:02:29,302
Oh, come on.
50
00:02:29,304 --> 00:02:32,305
South: She loved john.
I think john loved her.
51
00:02:32,307 --> 00:02:35,240
They both knew what
their life was going to be like.
52
00:02:35,242 --> 00:02:39,378
But to take that on and succeed
or fail when you're them
53
00:02:39,513 --> 00:02:42,315
And surrounded
by all that magnification,
54
00:02:42,417 --> 00:02:46,452
I think it's an altogether
different level of pressure.
55
00:02:49,523 --> 00:02:52,258
Reporter: One reason carolyn is
able to travel these days
56
00:02:52,394 --> 00:02:54,127
Is that she recently quit
her job
57
00:02:54,129 --> 00:02:58,131
As a public-relations executive
at calvin klein.
58
00:02:58,133 --> 00:02:59,932
Radziwill:
She had left calvin klein,
59
00:02:59,935 --> 00:03:02,401
So she was at an
inflection point in her own life
60
00:03:02,536 --> 00:03:05,070
And trying to decide
what she was going to do.
61
00:03:05,206 --> 00:03:07,607
Ginsberg:
It was hard for her to work.
62
00:03:07,742 --> 00:03:10,810
In the business that she was in,
you're dealing with people
63
00:03:10,945 --> 00:03:14,547
Who your job is to kind of put
them at the front and center
64
00:03:14,682 --> 00:03:16,349
Of every single conversation.
65
00:03:16,451 --> 00:03:19,418
And to have an employee
working for you
66
00:03:19,420 --> 00:03:23,222
Who overshadows you,
no matter who you are,
67
00:03:23,224 --> 00:03:27,226
Is antithetical to the job.
68
00:03:27,361 --> 00:03:30,363
After the first year,
I was down at their place,
69
00:03:30,365 --> 00:03:33,232
And she must have given me
10 prada suits and
70
00:03:33,234 --> 00:03:35,168
Coats and everything.
71
00:03:35,170 --> 00:03:36,636
She's like,
"I'm never going to wear this."
72
00:03:36,771 --> 00:03:38,237
And I was like,
"I'll wear all of this."
73
00:03:38,339 --> 00:03:39,639
[ laughs ]
74
00:03:40,575 --> 00:03:44,310
She had left everything she knew
up until that point in fashion
75
00:03:44,446 --> 00:03:45,845
And she was just married
76
00:03:45,847 --> 00:03:49,983
And just not used to
that level of scrutiny.
77
00:03:50,118 --> 00:03:52,251
Ginsberg: Carolyn was young
and smart and ambitious
78
00:03:52,386 --> 00:03:54,720
And had a big brain
and, I think,
79
00:03:54,856 --> 00:03:58,724
Really wanted to do things
and to kind of have a big life.
80
00:03:58,860 --> 00:04:00,660
And it's tough
when you go from that
81
00:04:00,795 --> 00:04:06,732
To suddenly being overwhelmingly
known for one thing.
82
00:04:06,868 --> 00:04:10,003
Radziwill: It just felt
sometimes unbearable.
83
00:04:10,138 --> 00:04:11,737
I know it sounds weird,
84
00:04:11,739 --> 00:04:15,474
Because it's like
it seems glamorous, maybe.
85
00:04:15,476 --> 00:04:18,611
But it's not.
It's really intrusive.
86
00:04:18,613 --> 00:04:23,949
This was a woman who had
great confidence and self-esteem
87
00:04:23,951 --> 00:04:28,353
And very grounded, and even I
could see it wears on you.
88
00:04:28,355 --> 00:04:30,556
You start feeling
a little bit insecure
89
00:04:30,692 --> 00:04:32,825
And you always have to look
a certain way.
90
00:04:32,960 --> 00:04:34,927
It was very intense.
91
00:04:36,363 --> 00:04:37,830
Brown:
She was very neurotic.
92
00:04:37,965 --> 00:04:40,700
And as we've seen, you know,
with meghan and harry,
93
00:04:40,835 --> 00:04:42,501
There was quite a lot
about carolyn bessette
94
00:04:42,636 --> 00:04:44,637
That was a bit meghan-ish,
95
00:04:44,772 --> 00:04:48,507
That she had sort of wanted
in for all of these reasons
96
00:04:48,642 --> 00:04:50,509
Of glamour and elegance.
97
00:04:50,511 --> 00:04:53,246
But that came
with so much pressure
98
00:04:53,248 --> 00:04:56,582
In terms of placating
the monster of the media,
99
00:04:56,718 --> 00:05:00,019
That she sort of fell apart,
really.
100
00:05:00,988 --> 00:05:02,655
In the later part
of their lives,
101
00:05:02,790 --> 00:05:05,458
John and carolyn
really begin to argue over this,
102
00:05:05,460 --> 00:05:08,193
Because, yes,
the celebrity is necessary,
103
00:05:08,296 --> 00:05:11,864
It is valuable, but
not at the risk of your life.
104
00:05:11,999 --> 00:05:14,467
But last week, lee radziwill
just made a statement
105
00:05:14,469 --> 00:05:16,201
That the family
didn't really like her.
106
00:05:16,304 --> 00:05:17,937
And then, around two weeks ago,
107
00:05:17,939 --> 00:05:21,140
There were reports that
carolyn was in some paris bar,
108
00:05:21,142 --> 00:05:23,142
Necking with a guy.
109
00:05:23,144 --> 00:05:24,810
And I think that creates
a kind of tension
110
00:05:24,946 --> 00:05:28,080
That is unimaginable
for most people
111
00:05:28,182 --> 00:05:31,684
As they think about
these kinds of situations.
112
00:05:31,686 --> 00:05:33,686
Radziwill:
John couldn't understand,
113
00:05:33,688 --> 00:05:36,555
Being a very privileged male,
114
00:05:36,690 --> 00:05:41,827
He had no sense of what
the press would say about her.
115
00:05:41,963 --> 00:05:44,096
I remember we
came up with a plan
116
00:05:44,099 --> 00:05:46,832
That every day, she would wear,
like, the same levi jeans
117
00:05:46,968 --> 00:05:49,368
With boots
and a white button-down.
118
00:05:49,503 --> 00:05:51,370
There's a lot of pictures of her
with, like,
119
00:05:51,372 --> 00:05:53,306
White button-down shirts
and blue jeans.
120
00:05:53,308 --> 00:05:56,441
And then she thought, because
if she wears the same thing,
121
00:05:56,443 --> 00:05:58,444
They would just tire
of taking pictures.
122
00:05:58,580 --> 00:06:01,380
But they never tired.
Not once.
123
00:06:01,382 --> 00:06:03,683
You know, she was a commodity.
124
00:06:06,721 --> 00:06:12,525
This is john kennedy here,
speaking from nbc news.
125
00:06:12,527 --> 00:06:16,462
Oh, boy.
Can you help me?
126
00:06:16,598 --> 00:06:18,131
Anthony!
127
00:06:18,266 --> 00:06:22,001
Ginsberg: All of this
was against the backdrop
128
00:06:22,136 --> 00:06:24,670
Of anthony having cancer.
129
00:06:24,806 --> 00:06:28,140
And so while this was going on,
130
00:06:28,143 --> 00:06:31,410
It was interspersed
with a lot of time
131
00:06:31,412 --> 00:06:34,680
Spent at
columbia presbyterian hospital
132
00:06:34,816 --> 00:06:36,682
While anthony got chemo.
133
00:06:36,818 --> 00:06:39,952
And it was a very,
very tough period.
134
00:06:40,755 --> 00:06:42,155
Radziwill: I mean,
it was heartbreaking.
135
00:06:42,290 --> 00:06:43,556
They were really close.
136
00:06:43,558 --> 00:06:46,291
They were best friends
and cousins.
137
00:06:46,293 --> 00:06:48,627
John couldn't believe
it was going to happen.
138
00:06:48,762 --> 00:06:50,429
And I think part of it
was like
139
00:06:50,564 --> 00:06:53,432
He had experienced
a lot of tragedy,
140
00:06:53,567 --> 00:06:55,300
And it becomes your memories.
141
00:06:55,436 --> 00:06:59,572
And anthony was so handsome,
so young, and strong,
142
00:06:59,574 --> 00:07:04,710
And he just refused to believe
that anthony was going to die.
143
00:07:04,846 --> 00:07:06,311
It was so difficult for him,
144
00:07:06,414 --> 00:07:11,416
And this was a physical
embodiment of another death.
145
00:07:11,453 --> 00:07:14,954
♪
146
00:07:16,257 --> 00:07:17,923
♪
147
00:07:18,059 --> 00:07:20,125
I came at this
as somewhat of a novice,
148
00:07:20,261 --> 00:07:21,594
So I didn't really --
I hadn't -- we had --
149
00:07:21,596 --> 00:07:22,928
My partner and I,
michael berman,
150
00:07:23,064 --> 00:07:25,264
We had an idea, and --
151
00:07:25,399 --> 00:07:28,333
But we didn't know quite how
it would show in the real world.
152
00:07:28,335 --> 00:07:31,870
So, yeah -- and I mean, I still,
you know, every month, it's --
153
00:07:31,872 --> 00:07:35,207
I haven't really
gotten rid of the jitters.
154
00:07:35,342 --> 00:07:37,142
Radziwill: He was right at
a crossroads
155
00:07:37,144 --> 00:07:39,344
Of saving his magazine.
156
00:07:39,346 --> 00:07:40,813
I think because it was new
157
00:07:40,815 --> 00:07:42,415
And like anything that's
new and different,
158
00:07:42,550 --> 00:07:44,283
People are a little skeptical.
159
00:07:44,418 --> 00:07:48,087
And it's a start-up
business, right?
160
00:07:48,222 --> 00:07:50,289
I think people understand
what that is more now.
161
00:07:50,291 --> 00:07:51,890
There's, like --
he was an entrepreneur,
162
00:07:52,025 --> 00:07:53,759
And it was a startup business.
163
00:07:53,895 --> 00:07:55,694
And I think it was
at an inflection point
164
00:07:55,696 --> 00:07:59,432
Where people weren't quite sure,
"is this going to be something?"
165
00:07:59,567 --> 00:08:01,033
He definitely had
the right concept,
166
00:08:01,035 --> 00:08:03,836
That politics and entertainment
were fusing,
167
00:08:03,938 --> 00:08:07,172
But he was also editing
in the era of bill clinton,
168
00:08:07,308 --> 00:08:10,309
And the biggest story
around bill clinton was monica.
169
00:08:10,444 --> 00:08:13,578
I did not have
sexual relations
170
00:08:13,580 --> 00:08:16,048
With that woman, miss lewinsky.
171
00:08:16,050 --> 00:08:17,782
Thank you.
172
00:08:17,784 --> 00:08:19,051
And he didn't want to
go there,
173
00:08:19,053 --> 00:08:21,586
Because he was
too much of a gentleman.
174
00:08:22,256 --> 00:08:24,056
So, the shock here
at the white house this morning,
175
00:08:24,058 --> 00:08:26,258
The independent-counsel
investigation now expanded
176
00:08:26,393 --> 00:08:28,727
To include allegations
of sexual misconduct
177
00:08:28,729 --> 00:08:30,796
By the president
in the white house.
178
00:08:30,932 --> 00:08:35,868
She is somebody
who the media treated terribly.
179
00:08:35,870 --> 00:08:37,269
Did you see monica's
new hairdo,
180
00:08:37,404 --> 00:08:38,937
All slicked down
with that hair gel?
181
00:08:39,072 --> 00:08:41,006
At least I think it was
hair gel.
182
00:08:41,142 --> 00:08:43,408
Larry king:
Why is this funny?
183
00:08:43,410 --> 00:08:44,677
Jon stewart:
Why is it funny?
184
00:08:44,679 --> 00:08:47,612
Larry: Why is it funny?
I mean, it's tragic.
185
00:08:47,715 --> 00:08:48,914
Jon: No one gets hurt.
186
00:08:50,851 --> 00:08:53,686
Soren: Her whole life
was turned upside down.
187
00:08:54,088 --> 00:08:56,155
And who was the person
in a position of power
188
00:08:56,290 --> 00:08:57,756
In that relationship?
189
00:08:57,858 --> 00:08:59,892
It was not her.
190
00:09:01,996 --> 00:09:03,762
I wonder if we aren't
going too far in terms
191
00:09:03,864 --> 00:09:05,830
Of excavating the sexual
history of monica lewinsky.
192
00:09:05,832 --> 00:09:07,766
We've seen stories
quoting ex-boyfriends
193
00:09:07,868 --> 00:09:08,968
About what she
did as a teenager.
194
00:09:09,103 --> 00:09:10,969
♪
195
00:09:10,971 --> 00:09:13,772
John kennedy sr.
Had all kinds of
196
00:09:13,874 --> 00:09:16,575
Lurid affairs in and out
of his marriage,
197
00:09:16,577 --> 00:09:19,444
But none had been
in the white house,
198
00:09:19,446 --> 00:09:21,914
While president,
covered with such,
199
00:09:22,049 --> 00:09:26,318
At that moment, seemingly
ghastly graphic specificity
200
00:09:26,453 --> 00:09:29,654
As what had happened
with monica lewinsky.
201
00:09:29,757 --> 00:09:33,125
Ginsberg: You know, having to
grow up with all the suggestions
202
00:09:33,260 --> 00:09:36,461
About his father and fidelity,
203
00:09:36,463 --> 00:09:38,663
I don't think
john wanted to re-examine it.
204
00:09:38,665 --> 00:09:44,269
And I think that infused how
he approached covering clinton
205
00:09:44,271 --> 00:09:46,071
And a story that
otherwise would have been
206
00:09:46,207 --> 00:09:47,806
Kind of tailor-made for george.
207
00:09:47,941 --> 00:09:51,410
Carter: It was simple. The
country was obsessed with it.
208
00:09:51,412 --> 00:09:54,146
And, as we discovered,
it had legs.
209
00:09:54,281 --> 00:09:57,015
It had, you know,
20 years of legs to it.
210
00:09:57,017 --> 00:09:59,552
But that's the part of the issue
is, if your named kennedy,
211
00:09:59,687 --> 00:10:03,288
You're not going to go after the
sitting democratic president.
212
00:10:03,290 --> 00:10:04,823
Can you talk to us further
about the mentality
213
00:10:04,958 --> 00:10:06,625
At the white house tonight?
214
00:10:06,627 --> 00:10:08,693
They're very worried
about all of this,
215
00:10:08,796 --> 00:10:10,495
The accumulation of events.
216
00:10:10,497 --> 00:10:11,964
They're worried
that the charge,
217
00:10:12,066 --> 00:10:14,633
Obstruction of justice,
a cover-up.
218
00:10:14,635 --> 00:10:16,902
That should have been,
like, the story
219
00:10:17,038 --> 00:10:19,704
For george magazine in 1998.
220
00:10:19,706 --> 00:10:20,973
It just should have been.
221
00:10:22,376 --> 00:10:25,177
But, god almighty,
what a mistake.
222
00:10:25,179 --> 00:10:27,646
I mean, was it like, "oh, no,
that's too undignified"?
223
00:10:27,648 --> 00:10:30,515
Well, dude, you
started this magazine
224
00:10:30,517 --> 00:10:35,720
That is about the undignified
nature of stars and starlets
225
00:10:35,722 --> 00:10:37,656
And celebrity
226
00:10:37,658 --> 00:10:40,793
That have nothing to do with
the substance of politics.
227
00:10:40,795 --> 00:10:42,561
Why is this the line
you draw now?
228
00:10:43,731 --> 00:10:46,064
"are politicians celebrities?
229
00:10:46,199 --> 00:10:48,200
These days, politicians,
like celebrities,
230
00:10:48,335 --> 00:10:51,336
Are as newsworthy
for their private conduct
231
00:10:51,338 --> 00:10:54,072
As they are
for their public duties."
232
00:10:54,207 --> 00:10:56,074
"so why do we hold them
to a higher standard
233
00:10:56,076 --> 00:10:59,478
Than the other glitterati
who are famous for being famous?
234
00:10:59,613 --> 00:11:02,347
And don't tell me it's because
politicians are role models.
235
00:11:02,483 --> 00:11:05,284
That solemn fraud is obsolete."
236
00:11:05,419 --> 00:11:09,488
What mother wants her child to
grow up and become a politician?
237
00:11:09,623 --> 00:11:13,758
It might still be an honorable
profession, but it is combat."
238
00:11:14,561 --> 00:11:19,097
You know, when you are in this
family of political celebrities,
239
00:11:19,232 --> 00:11:22,767
It seems to me you're in
a pickle from the get-go,
240
00:11:22,769 --> 00:11:26,638
And you better have figured out
what you think about it
241
00:11:26,740 --> 00:11:28,640
And what you're going to say
about it.
242
00:11:28,742 --> 00:11:30,843
And if that had been
a republican president
243
00:11:30,845 --> 00:11:32,711
With a 22-year-old intern,
244
00:11:32,713 --> 00:11:34,379
I'm sure they would
have covered it like crazy.
245
00:11:34,381 --> 00:11:36,781
But that's where, like,
not having worked in a magazine
246
00:11:36,884 --> 00:11:39,518
Might have hindered him.
247
00:11:39,653 --> 00:11:43,588
He should have had, like, a
great number two who would say,
248
00:11:43,590 --> 00:11:46,525
"no, this is not the best idea"
or "this is a good idea,"
249
00:11:46,660 --> 00:11:49,862
Because he was probably
just too much in charge,
250
00:11:49,864 --> 00:11:52,130
And you want a lot of people
around you.
251
00:11:52,265 --> 00:11:53,932
You want people around you
252
00:11:54,067 --> 00:11:55,400
Who fold their arms
and come into your office
253
00:11:55,402 --> 00:11:57,001
And say,
"this is a terrible idea."
254
00:11:57,003 --> 00:11:58,737
And then you realize,
"okay, it's a bad idea."
255
00:11:58,739 --> 00:12:00,005
Imus: Well, did
you notice any --
256
00:12:00,141 --> 00:12:01,740
Has it had any impact
on your magazine?
257
00:12:01,742 --> 00:12:03,208
Kennedy: I'm not
sure if the majority
258
00:12:03,344 --> 00:12:05,009
Of the people
in the country --
259
00:12:05,011 --> 00:12:09,014
I mean, certainly, there
are those who care,
260
00:12:09,150 --> 00:12:12,417
And I'm not saying it's not
something not to care about,
261
00:12:12,553 --> 00:12:15,153
But, clearly, if you're in
the journalism business,
262
00:12:15,288 --> 00:12:17,022
It is a much more
riveting story
263
00:12:17,158 --> 00:12:19,491
Than if you have
kids in college
264
00:12:19,626 --> 00:12:21,226
And you're trying to make
payments on your house.
265
00:12:21,362 --> 00:12:22,695
Ginsberg: We didn't
cover it in any kind of
266
00:12:22,830 --> 00:12:25,163
Provocative, colorful way.
267
00:12:25,165 --> 00:12:26,831
You know,
I think people started --
268
00:12:26,833 --> 00:12:28,833
They were expecting to see it,
they didn't see it,
269
00:12:28,835 --> 00:12:30,435
And I think it was
a disappointment.
270
00:12:31,038 --> 00:12:31,904
Leno: Thanks so
much for coming.
271
00:12:32,039 --> 00:12:32,704
Kennedy: Thank you so much.
272
00:12:32,974 --> 00:12:34,439
Leno: A pleasure
to meet you, finally.
273
00:12:34,441 --> 00:12:36,108
Brown: I think it was
a big problem for him.
274
00:12:36,110 --> 00:12:40,312
Clinton began the absolute sort
of cultural change in which,
275
00:12:40,447 --> 00:12:44,449
You know, sex and scandal
and the melding of those things
276
00:12:44,585 --> 00:12:47,452
Became so much a part of the
reporting that we were doing.
277
00:12:47,588 --> 00:12:52,056
That didn't really fit with
the jfk jr., you know,
278
00:12:52,058 --> 00:12:53,325
Ethos, in that sense.
279
00:12:53,327 --> 00:12:55,361
He was too much of a kennedy.
280
00:12:56,663 --> 00:12:59,531
So, in the end,
it wasn't going to work for him,
281
00:12:59,666 --> 00:13:01,299
I think,
as a magazine editor.
282
00:13:01,369 --> 00:13:05,537
♪
283
00:13:06,740 --> 00:13:11,575
♪
284
00:13:11,778 --> 00:13:15,446
I mean, sometimes, I look back,
especially that summer,
285
00:13:15,582 --> 00:13:17,348
And it feels like a film almost.
286
00:13:19,852 --> 00:13:23,121
It feels like a story
that happened to somebody else
287
00:13:23,222 --> 00:13:27,191
Or, like, some weird fever dream
that I'm going to wake up
288
00:13:27,193 --> 00:13:32,330
And be like, "that was intense,"
but I never did.
289
00:13:32,332 --> 00:13:35,466
One of the great lucky
things about being in my family,
290
00:13:35,468 --> 00:13:37,401
Which I'm --
which has stayed.
291
00:13:37,403 --> 00:13:38,469
That gathering
concept, right?
292
00:13:38,605 --> 00:13:39,203
Yeah. Yeah.
293
00:13:39,338 --> 00:13:40,338
It is familial, right?
294
00:13:40,340 --> 00:13:42,072
Mm-hmm. Yes, it is.
295
00:13:42,074 --> 00:13:43,341
It's a touching
family too, right?
296
00:13:43,476 --> 00:13:44,408
Very much so.
297
00:13:44,578 --> 00:13:49,347
The family and the cousins
and making a kind of a
298
00:13:49,349 --> 00:13:51,816
Sense of community, especially
in the summertime.
299
00:13:52,385 --> 00:13:54,418
Radziwill: Anthony had had
cancer for over five years
300
00:13:54,553 --> 00:13:55,886
At that point.
301
00:13:56,022 --> 00:13:58,289
He had started chemotherapy
and radiation
302
00:13:58,425 --> 00:14:00,624
And all these
experimental drugs.
303
00:14:00,626 --> 00:14:03,027
But by the summer of '99,
it was very clear
304
00:14:03,162 --> 00:14:05,363
That he was probably not going
to make it through the summer.
305
00:14:08,167 --> 00:14:10,568
And that's
why we moved up to the vineyard.
306
00:14:10,670 --> 00:14:13,037
John was, like,
resigning to the fact
307
00:14:13,172 --> 00:14:16,040
That anthony was likely
not going to make it back
308
00:14:16,175 --> 00:14:18,276
To the city
at the end of the summer.
309
00:14:20,312 --> 00:14:25,083
And then john broke his foot,
and that was just a disaster.
310
00:14:26,185 --> 00:14:27,785
It was memorial day weekend,
I think.
311
00:14:27,920 --> 00:14:30,321
He would get on
this contraption.
312
00:14:30,423 --> 00:14:31,922
Man: It doesn't
take off real easy,
313
00:14:31,924 --> 00:14:33,924
Unless you get
too much gas in it.
314
00:14:33,926 --> 00:14:36,126
Radziwill: I used to call it
a flying lawnmower.
315
00:14:36,128 --> 00:14:37,461
It looked like a lawnmower.
316
00:14:37,596 --> 00:14:39,197
Man:
Good. Good job.
317
00:14:39,332 --> 00:14:40,731
But I'll tell you,
318
00:14:40,867 --> 00:14:43,234
The damn thing could fly
10,000 feet in the air.
319
00:14:44,070 --> 00:14:45,536
Man: That's good.
320
00:14:45,672 --> 00:14:46,937
Forget how powerful that motor is.
321
00:14:46,939 --> 00:14:49,139
It wants to go up.
322
00:14:49,141 --> 00:14:51,209
I remember him trying one
weekend to get me to go on it,
323
00:14:51,344 --> 00:14:53,343
And I'm like, "fuck that."
324
00:14:53,345 --> 00:14:57,282
Like, "I'm not going on
that thing."
325
00:15:00,453 --> 00:15:05,623
And he landed awkwardly
and he just broke his ankle.
326
00:15:05,725 --> 00:15:07,292
It was, like, a fluke.
327
00:15:08,961 --> 00:15:11,596
Like, a stupid, stupid thing.
328
00:15:14,434 --> 00:15:16,567
I feel like that was,
like, a turning point.
329
00:15:16,569 --> 00:15:18,702
Like, I remember carolyn calling
from the hospital,
330
00:15:18,704 --> 00:15:21,239
And she was crying because
she knew the implications
331
00:15:21,374 --> 00:15:24,708
Of john having to be in a cast
for two months.
332
00:15:24,710 --> 00:15:26,644
Yeah, I'm in a cast.
I broke my ankle.
333
00:15:26,646 --> 00:15:29,580
I was playing sports first
weekend of the summer,
334
00:15:29,582 --> 00:15:31,916
And I'm laid up
for a couple weeks.
335
00:15:32,051 --> 00:15:33,784
John getting hurt
was a big deal,
336
00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:36,587
Because john was such
an active guy.
337
00:15:36,589 --> 00:15:38,923
He loved to play.
338
00:15:39,058 --> 00:15:41,725
♪
339
00:15:41,727 --> 00:15:43,127
I didn't have a hint
340
00:15:43,262 --> 00:15:44,729
That any of the other stuff
was going on.
341
00:15:46,732 --> 00:15:47,998
John was
one of these guys who --
342
00:15:48,134 --> 00:15:50,134
Just always optimistic,
always hopeful.
343
00:15:50,269 --> 00:15:55,405
Despite all this enormous pain
that was going on in his life
344
00:15:55,407 --> 00:15:58,008
And the pressure
that was on him,
345
00:15:58,010 --> 00:16:00,010
You know, he never revealed it,
I never saw it.
346
00:16:00,146 --> 00:16:01,211
Larry king: Are there
ever days you say,
347
00:16:01,213 --> 00:16:02,680
"I wish my name
were david?"
348
00:16:02,815 --> 00:16:06,016
No. I'm pretty happy
with what it is.
349
00:16:06,018 --> 00:16:09,887
I mean, if you're asking
if it's hard being me --
350
00:16:09,889 --> 00:16:11,689
Well, it's brought
you a unique life.
351
00:16:11,691 --> 00:16:12,890
Yeah, absolutely.
352
00:16:13,025 --> 00:16:16,694
And great opportunities
and some challenges.
353
00:16:16,696 --> 00:16:19,830
But all in all,
I feel very fortunate.
354
00:16:19,966 --> 00:16:22,266
So it's not so --
it's not so bad.
355
00:16:24,170 --> 00:16:27,705
I only saw john cry one time,
and it was that summer.
356
00:16:27,807 --> 00:16:29,774
Like, really cry.
357
00:16:29,909 --> 00:16:32,643
We were at the beach,
and anthony took his shirt off.
358
00:16:32,645 --> 00:16:36,580
And you could see his chest
was all marked up with scars
359
00:16:36,582 --> 00:16:38,048
From so many operations.
360
00:16:38,050 --> 00:16:40,318
And he was pretty thin
at that point.
361
00:16:40,453 --> 00:16:42,786
And I don't know.
I think the visual, for john,
362
00:16:42,788 --> 00:16:45,790
He just, like, fell to the sand
363
00:16:45,925 --> 00:16:50,394
And just put his head in
his hands and was really crying.
364
00:16:50,396 --> 00:16:52,596
And thank god anthony
was a little ahead of him
365
00:16:52,598 --> 00:16:56,466
And the sound of the waves
were covering up the cries,
366
00:16:56,468 --> 00:16:58,803
But I could see what
was happening.
367
00:17:02,842 --> 00:17:05,609
Anthony -- he was really
the brother he never had.
368
00:17:05,711 --> 00:17:10,481
And I think carole was a real
part of john and carolyn's life
369
00:17:10,617 --> 00:17:13,083
Because they were preparing
to basically take on
370
00:17:13,085 --> 00:17:17,221
Carole as some extension
of their life.
371
00:17:17,223 --> 00:17:20,024
That whole month of June
was really brutal for him.
372
00:17:20,159 --> 00:17:23,494
John was also trying
to save his magazine,
373
00:17:23,630 --> 00:17:25,363
And carolyn was trying to help,
374
00:17:25,365 --> 00:17:27,231
But then, like,
being frustrated at him
375
00:17:27,366 --> 00:17:29,499
Because he wasn't acknowledging,
at that point
376
00:17:29,501 --> 00:17:32,636
In the beginning of the summer,
that anthony was dying
377
00:17:32,638 --> 00:17:37,108
And that he needed to focus
and spend time with anthony.
378
00:17:39,311 --> 00:17:41,045
He was really focused
on the magazine,
379
00:17:41,180 --> 00:17:42,913
And she was really focused
on the magazine.
380
00:17:43,049 --> 00:17:45,416
I feel like it was just
as much her baby as it was his.
381
00:17:47,320 --> 00:17:49,519
Ginsberg: John wanted her
to be a part of the magazine,
382
00:17:49,521 --> 00:17:50,988
Liked her being around.
383
00:17:51,123 --> 00:17:54,258
So it just naturally happened.
384
00:17:54,393 --> 00:17:55,993
She took a particular interest
in the look
385
00:17:56,128 --> 00:17:57,661
And the feel of the magazine,
386
00:17:57,663 --> 00:17:59,529
Spent a lot of time
in the art department.
387
00:18:00,200 --> 00:18:03,133
South: George was meant
to be this collision
388
00:18:03,269 --> 00:18:06,404
Of politics and pop culture.
389
00:18:06,539 --> 00:18:11,209
I think carolyn knew it
in a way that was very immediate
390
00:18:11,344 --> 00:18:13,611
And loved that part of it.
391
00:18:13,613 --> 00:18:15,880
And I'm sure it was a source
of irritation for people
392
00:18:16,015 --> 00:18:19,750
That worked at george
as it is in any situation,
393
00:18:19,886 --> 00:18:22,420
When the kind of boss' wife
has a strong point of view
394
00:18:22,422 --> 00:18:23,754
About things.
395
00:18:23,756 --> 00:18:27,091
And she had a strong
point of view about things.
396
00:18:27,226 --> 00:18:31,229
She was good,
I mean, but sometimes a little
397
00:18:31,364 --> 00:18:34,164
Brutal in her assessments.
398
00:18:34,901 --> 00:18:36,767
Depaulo: Carolyn was
in and out of the office,
399
00:18:36,903 --> 00:18:40,838
But I knew her more from parties
like the correspondents' dinner.
400
00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:43,241
He'd say, "I'm sitting you
next to my wife,
401
00:18:43,376 --> 00:18:45,175
Because she'll have fun
with you."
402
00:18:45,177 --> 00:18:47,778
And we did have fun. We'd, like,
go out and sneak cigarettes.
403
00:18:47,914 --> 00:18:49,547
She was great.
404
00:18:50,917 --> 00:18:53,317
I mean, look,
was she a total
405
00:18:53,319 --> 00:18:54,718
Pain in the ass
to certain people in there?
406
00:18:54,720 --> 00:18:55,853
Yeah.
407
00:18:55,988 --> 00:18:58,689
It was a problem
for michael.
408
00:19:01,594 --> 00:19:04,061
Welcome.
My name is michael berman,
409
00:19:04,196 --> 00:19:07,531
And I am the co-founder and
executive publisher of george.
410
00:19:07,533 --> 00:19:10,334
Gillon: The two of them
together created george.
411
00:19:10,469 --> 00:19:13,671
When john and I first began
to talk about the magazine,
412
00:19:13,673 --> 00:19:15,606
The experts, early on,
advised us,
413
00:19:15,708 --> 00:19:18,275
"never go into business
with a friend."
414
00:19:18,278 --> 00:19:19,810
There would have been
no george magazine
415
00:19:19,812 --> 00:19:21,345
Without michael berman,
416
00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:23,281
And there would have been
no george magazine
417
00:19:23,416 --> 00:19:25,383
Without john kennedy.
418
00:19:26,953 --> 00:19:29,086
They hadn't worked
a lot of things out,
419
00:19:29,088 --> 00:19:30,954
And there are
very different expectations
420
00:19:30,956 --> 00:19:32,622
About how you do that.
421
00:19:32,624 --> 00:19:35,826
It's a constant source
of tension in the magazine,
422
00:19:35,962 --> 00:19:37,828
And michael berman
423
00:19:37,830 --> 00:19:42,232
Wanted john as the editor
to commission stories
424
00:19:42,234 --> 00:19:46,504
And to write stories that would
reflect the uniqueness
425
00:19:46,639 --> 00:19:48,372
Of his life growing up.
426
00:19:48,374 --> 00:19:51,842
And john just had
no interest in doing that.
427
00:19:51,978 --> 00:19:54,312
But there was always
this pressure on john
428
00:19:54,447 --> 00:19:58,849
From every direction for him
to make it more about himself.
429
00:19:58,985 --> 00:20:01,919
David pecker,
the c.E.O. Of hachette,
430
00:20:02,054 --> 00:20:04,254
Would put john on the cover
every day with his shirt off.
431
00:20:04,256 --> 00:20:05,789
That's the magazine they wanted.
432
00:20:05,924 --> 00:20:09,793
Say you have a fight,
michael, over the next cover.
433
00:20:09,795 --> 00:20:12,262
Let's say? I think we've
had about four today.
434
00:20:12,398 --> 00:20:15,665
Advertisers then
re-negotiated their fees.
435
00:20:15,667 --> 00:20:17,201
George was not getting
the amount of money
436
00:20:17,336 --> 00:20:18,736
It was getting before.
437
00:20:18,738 --> 00:20:20,671
Michael was hearing this
from the advertisers --
438
00:20:20,773 --> 00:20:22,472
"it's not distinctive enough.
439
00:20:22,474 --> 00:20:24,542
We wanted a magazine
that had more john in it."
440
00:20:24,677 --> 00:20:26,210
And so michael
was getting that pressure.
441
00:20:26,345 --> 00:20:29,413
And then their own
personal dynamic changed,
442
00:20:29,415 --> 00:20:32,550
Especially when carolyn
comes into the office
443
00:20:32,552 --> 00:20:35,886
And starts getting involved
in some editorial issues.
444
00:20:36,022 --> 00:20:37,688
You know, a partnership
is really difficult,
445
00:20:37,824 --> 00:20:39,823
Especially when you
know the other person
446
00:20:39,925 --> 00:20:41,425
And, you know, you
had a friendship
447
00:20:41,427 --> 00:20:43,361
Before the partnership.
448
00:20:43,496 --> 00:20:46,364
Carmody: John was afraid of
being seen as a business shill.
449
00:20:46,499 --> 00:20:50,234
He wasn't used to having to ask
people for favors.
450
00:20:50,369 --> 00:20:52,570
He was used to people
asking him for favors.
451
00:20:52,705 --> 00:20:53,837
...Wasn't getting the readers.
452
00:20:53,939 --> 00:20:55,573
It wasn't getting
the advertisers.
453
00:20:55,674 --> 00:20:58,108
South: Just by nature
of that business,
454
00:20:58,244 --> 00:21:01,044
Everybody is chasing newness.
455
00:21:01,046 --> 00:21:03,047
Advertisers were horrible then,
456
00:21:03,182 --> 00:21:05,783
And carolyn knew that john
457
00:21:05,785 --> 00:21:08,986
Could be a little princely
about things.
458
00:21:09,088 --> 00:21:14,392
And I think carolyn certainly
knew how the system worked.
459
00:21:14,527 --> 00:21:17,795
I'm sure carolyn
was a taskmaster
460
00:21:17,797 --> 00:21:18,996
About that stuff with john.
461
00:21:19,131 --> 00:21:22,266
If people call 316-8735,
462
00:21:22,401 --> 00:21:24,602
They'll be able to get
a subscription to george.
463
00:21:24,703 --> 00:21:27,071
King: An 800 number -- did you
think it would come to this?
464
00:21:27,206 --> 00:21:29,907
Kennedy: Spoken
like a true publisher.
465
00:21:31,810 --> 00:21:35,479
Gillon: Michael berman believes
that george has no identity,
466
00:21:35,481 --> 00:21:37,547
No definition separate
from other magazines.
467
00:21:37,549 --> 00:21:39,617
And he's coming
to editorial meetings
468
00:21:39,619 --> 00:21:41,151
And trashing the writers.
469
00:21:41,287 --> 00:21:42,886
And it got to the point
where john was actually
470
00:21:42,988 --> 00:21:45,489
Holding editorial meetings
at a hotel across the street.
471
00:21:45,624 --> 00:21:46,890
You're having fights.
How is it --
472
00:21:46,892 --> 00:21:47,691
Absolutely.
473
00:21:47,693 --> 00:21:49,093
It makes for a
great partnership.
474
00:21:49,228 --> 00:21:50,227
Who wins?
475
00:21:50,362 --> 00:21:51,228
It depends.
476
00:21:51,230 --> 00:21:53,096
You know, some --
477
00:21:53,098 --> 00:21:54,765
The better party
usually wins,
478
00:21:54,901 --> 00:21:57,234
And that's the great thing
about a 50/50 partnership.
479
00:21:57,236 --> 00:21:59,303
Gillon: You know, in most
magazines, you have a publisher
480
00:21:59,438 --> 00:22:00,904
And then you have an editor.
481
00:22:01,006 --> 00:22:04,574
And because john and michael
were both partners,
482
00:22:04,576 --> 00:22:07,711
Michael wanted to be involved in
every decision that john made,
483
00:22:07,713 --> 00:22:09,980
Including editorial.
484
00:22:09,982 --> 00:22:13,917
His battles with michael berman
culminated in a shoving match
485
00:22:13,919 --> 00:22:16,053
Where john ripped
michael's shirt.
486
00:22:16,155 --> 00:22:19,523
Michael chased john across
the floor of george magazine.
487
00:22:19,525 --> 00:22:20,991
And when john
went into his office,
488
00:22:21,127 --> 00:22:23,060
Michael was trying
to pick the lock to get in.
489
00:22:23,062 --> 00:22:24,862
It was really
an explosive relationship.
490
00:22:24,864 --> 00:22:26,130
Imus: How are things
at the magazine?
491
00:22:26,265 --> 00:22:27,264
We had a big
power struggle there
492
00:22:27,266 --> 00:22:28,598
Last time we
talked, right?
493
00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:30,133
Kennedy: No, I mean,
I think we had, um --
494
00:22:30,135 --> 00:22:33,337
What's the term of art? --
Creative differences.
495
00:22:33,339 --> 00:22:35,339
Anthony: I believe the fights
that took place at george
496
00:22:35,474 --> 00:22:37,741
Were about the editorial.
497
00:22:37,743 --> 00:22:39,677
They were really having
fights up there every day,
498
00:22:39,812 --> 00:22:41,479
Physical fights.
499
00:22:44,483 --> 00:22:47,485
There was enormous pressure.
500
00:22:47,620 --> 00:22:50,821
John -- when he was mad,
he could be raw.
501
00:22:50,923 --> 00:22:53,623
He and michael?
It was a fucking disaster.
502
00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:56,293
It just went from bad to worse,
503
00:22:56,428 --> 00:22:58,896
And eventually michael
left the magazine for good.
504
00:23:00,299 --> 00:23:02,165
I feel like the vision
for the magazine
505
00:23:02,167 --> 00:23:03,968
Got really blurry
after michael left.
506
00:23:04,103 --> 00:23:08,405
♪
507
00:23:10,076 --> 00:23:11,442
♪
508
00:23:13,712 --> 00:23:16,145
King:
Who runs the show?
509
00:23:16,147 --> 00:23:17,681
Berman: Should we
both answer at once?
510
00:23:17,816 --> 00:23:19,683
Ohh.
511
00:23:19,818 --> 00:23:23,787
Carmody: I think
they started going wrong...
512
00:23:26,091 --> 00:23:27,691
...Right when michael left.
513
00:23:27,693 --> 00:23:29,026
Now, you're a friend
of his, right?
514
00:23:29,161 --> 00:23:30,493
Absolutely. Some days.
515
00:23:30,495 --> 00:23:32,095
How do you -- [ laughs ]
516
00:23:32,097 --> 00:23:33,630
Michael and john's
relationship
517
00:23:33,765 --> 00:23:35,965
Had deteriorated before that.
518
00:23:35,967 --> 00:23:38,702
And also michael was
the gatekeeper for john.
519
00:23:38,704 --> 00:23:40,370
He would be the one
to go to john
520
00:23:40,472 --> 00:23:42,840
And say, "you have to do this,"
or, "you have to do that."
521
00:23:42,975 --> 00:23:44,574
Lamb: Does the
magazine make money?
522
00:23:44,710 --> 00:23:47,176
Uh, not quite yet.
Soon.
523
00:23:47,178 --> 00:23:48,645
Lamb: When do you
think it will?
524
00:23:48,647 --> 00:23:51,648
Well, I mean, usually it
takes about 10 years or so
525
00:23:51,650 --> 00:23:53,617
For a magazine
to get into the black.
526
00:23:55,120 --> 00:23:56,653
Gillon: He was down.
527
00:23:56,655 --> 00:23:58,187
He was tired.
528
00:23:58,189 --> 00:24:00,523
He had just gotten a letter
from hachette
529
00:24:00,525 --> 00:24:03,526
That shook him up.
530
00:24:03,528 --> 00:24:06,930
And he said,
"come back to the apartment,
531
00:24:07,065 --> 00:24:08,465
And I want you
to read the letter
532
00:24:08,467 --> 00:24:10,667
And give me, you know,
fresh eyes."
533
00:24:10,669 --> 00:24:13,470
And carolyn comes in,
and she's smoking a cigarette.
534
00:24:13,472 --> 00:24:15,004
She's wearing
a columbia university
535
00:24:15,006 --> 00:24:16,540
Oversized sweater.
536
00:24:16,641 --> 00:24:19,142
And I'm trying
to read the letter,
537
00:24:19,277 --> 00:24:22,679
And she's like, "john,
everybody [bleep] you, john.
538
00:24:22,781 --> 00:24:24,081
You let everybody [bleep] you.
539
00:24:24,216 --> 00:24:26,750
You got to start [bleep]
people back, john."
540
00:24:26,885 --> 00:24:29,419
With carolyn, I mean,
it's obvious from what I saw
541
00:24:29,421 --> 00:24:31,688
That there was, you know,
issues there.
542
00:24:31,823 --> 00:24:34,157
He was trying
to keep the magazine alive,
543
00:24:34,292 --> 00:24:35,892
And it was failing.
544
00:24:35,895 --> 00:24:37,961
It was clear that hachette
545
00:24:38,096 --> 00:24:40,931
Was not interested
in publishing the magazine.
546
00:24:43,234 --> 00:24:45,234
Reporter: Stars and gossip
hasn't increased
547
00:24:45,236 --> 00:24:47,771
The magazine's readership
or ad sales.
548
00:24:47,773 --> 00:24:51,308
Monthly circulation hovers
at about 400,000.
549
00:24:51,443 --> 00:24:53,777
Kennedy recently said
it would take a circulation
550
00:24:53,779 --> 00:24:57,681
Of about 600,000 for
george to turn a profit.
551
00:25:00,419 --> 00:25:03,787
With george,
I definitely sensed a stress
552
00:25:03,789 --> 00:25:06,990
That I never sensed when we were
in college, law school,
553
00:25:07,125 --> 00:25:08,725
The d.A., never.
554
00:25:08,860 --> 00:25:12,329
You know, I'd known him at that
point for 20 years, I guess,
555
00:25:12,464 --> 00:25:14,597
And I'd never sensed
556
00:25:14,599 --> 00:25:19,068
That he felt professional
pressure until george.
557
00:25:19,070 --> 00:25:21,070
You know,
now he's in his mid 30s.
558
00:25:21,072 --> 00:25:23,340
"I'm gonna devote
however many years
559
00:25:23,342 --> 00:25:25,408
I need to devote
to make this work
560
00:25:25,410 --> 00:25:26,943
So that I can get on
to the next,
561
00:25:26,946 --> 00:25:28,812
More important part of my life."
562
00:25:28,814 --> 00:25:31,481
King: Your own interest in
politics -- you write about it.
563
00:25:31,617 --> 00:25:33,817
You were raised in a
family that lives off it...
564
00:25:33,819 --> 00:25:34,417
Mm.
565
00:25:34,787 --> 00:25:35,953
...And on it and
through it and with it.
566
00:25:36,088 --> 00:25:36,619
Mm-hmm.
567
00:25:36,621 --> 00:25:37,821
What about you?
568
00:25:37,823 --> 00:25:39,156
The old definition
of politics
569
00:25:39,291 --> 00:25:40,757
Was that you bring it
at the end of your life,
570
00:25:40,859 --> 00:25:42,492
When you really have
something to sort of offer.
571
00:25:42,494 --> 00:25:44,161
And maybe that's
a good thing for me.
572
00:25:44,296 --> 00:25:47,831
I think that just added
to this sense
573
00:25:47,966 --> 00:25:49,366
That he's the chosen one.
574
00:25:49,468 --> 00:25:51,835
He believed
that he was the heir apparent.
575
00:25:51,970 --> 00:25:54,037
[ cheers and applause ]
576
00:25:54,172 --> 00:25:55,505
I never looked so good.
577
00:25:55,507 --> 00:25:56,373
[ laughter ]
578
00:25:56,608 --> 00:25:58,441
Reporter: Kennedy even hired
political figures
579
00:25:58,443 --> 00:25:59,843
To jazz up the magazine.
580
00:25:59,845 --> 00:26:01,711
Former u.S. Senator al d'amato
581
00:26:01,713 --> 00:26:03,980
Dispenses advice in his column.
582
00:26:03,983 --> 00:26:05,982
Ginsberg: He was looking
at the political horizon.
583
00:26:05,985 --> 00:26:08,385
What al d'amato had been
kind of encouraging him
584
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:10,253
Was to run for office.
585
00:26:10,255 --> 00:26:13,523
At some point in time,
there's going to be a vacancy.
586
00:26:13,625 --> 00:26:16,793
And so who knows?
It may be john kennedy.
587
00:26:16,795 --> 00:26:18,528
What do you think, john?
588
00:26:18,530 --> 00:26:22,065
Not today, certainly,
and not --
589
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:24,801
Not while we have such an
exciting roster of columnists.
590
00:26:24,903 --> 00:26:26,603
[ laughter ]
591
00:26:26,605 --> 00:26:28,805
On saint patrick's day 1999,
592
00:26:28,807 --> 00:26:32,542
He met with a powerful leader
of a new york labor union,
593
00:26:32,678 --> 00:26:36,413
Who said, if john were to run,
he would throw his support.
594
00:26:36,515 --> 00:26:39,015
And he sent a message to
hillary clinton not to get in.
595
00:26:39,018 --> 00:26:42,151
Reporter:
On February 16, 1999,
596
00:26:42,287 --> 00:26:44,221
Hillary clinton confirmed
she was considering
597
00:26:44,356 --> 00:26:46,356
Running for the u.S. Senate.
598
00:26:48,293 --> 00:26:50,560
Well, I mean, listen, it's made
599
00:26:50,662 --> 00:26:53,496
A otherwise humdrum race
600
00:26:53,498 --> 00:26:55,498
Into something
that is truly exciting
601
00:26:55,500 --> 00:26:58,501
And has engaged new yorkers
of all stripes.
602
00:26:58,503 --> 00:27:00,303
But john didn't want to be
in the senate.
603
00:27:00,305 --> 00:27:02,239
He was gonna run
for governor of new york.
604
00:27:02,374 --> 00:27:03,907
And I'm not being coy here,
605
00:27:03,909 --> 00:27:05,842
But if it changes
into something else in --
606
00:27:05,844 --> 00:27:07,977
In a number of years, great.
607
00:27:08,113 --> 00:27:10,347
And if it doesn't,
then I have no complaints.
608
00:27:12,317 --> 00:27:17,054
He was now ready to serve
the public in a meaningful job.
609
00:27:18,256 --> 00:27:20,590
You know,
he looked at his father's career
610
00:27:20,692 --> 00:27:22,725
And had heard enough
611
00:27:22,727 --> 00:27:25,394
About how his father
was frustrated
612
00:27:25,396 --> 00:27:27,797
Being a house member
and a senator
613
00:27:27,799 --> 00:27:30,199
Because of the tedium
of legislative hearings.
614
00:27:30,335 --> 00:27:31,735
If he had a choice,
615
00:27:31,836 --> 00:27:33,937
He'd much rather be
in an executive role
616
00:27:34,072 --> 00:27:35,472
Than in a legislative role.
617
00:27:35,574 --> 00:27:38,207
So what john, I think, realized
from george
618
00:27:38,209 --> 00:27:40,877
Was what a good leader he was,
a leader of men and women,
619
00:27:41,012 --> 00:27:44,281
That he could inspire,
he could set agendas,
620
00:27:44,416 --> 00:27:48,919
He could set priorities and
then let others execute on that.
621
00:27:51,156 --> 00:27:56,025
John's greatest accomplishment
was his ability to navigate
622
00:27:56,161 --> 00:27:59,829
These pressures that were placed
upon him by everybody
623
00:27:59,831 --> 00:28:02,966
And come up with
a true identity.
624
00:28:03,101 --> 00:28:07,436
And it took him
a long time to do it.
625
00:28:07,438 --> 00:28:10,707
And one of the many tragedies
of his death
626
00:28:10,709 --> 00:28:12,976
Was that he had finally
figured it out.
627
00:28:12,978 --> 00:28:14,577
He had finally decided that,
628
00:28:14,579 --> 00:28:16,445
"yes, I want to get
into politics."
629
00:28:16,447 --> 00:28:17,780
Do you still use the "jr."?
630
00:28:17,782 --> 00:28:20,383
Sometimes, but generally not.
631
00:28:20,385 --> 00:28:21,785
King: You're your own
man, aren't you, john?
632
00:28:21,886 --> 00:28:23,520
You are your
own bewilderment.
633
00:28:23,655 --> 00:28:24,854
We'll be right back.
634
00:28:24,856 --> 00:28:26,389
He's in the right
business -- media.
635
00:28:26,524 --> 00:28:28,458
We'll be right back.
Don't go away.
636
00:28:31,563 --> 00:28:34,396
♪
637
00:28:34,999 --> 00:28:38,200
Radziwill: Ironically and -- oh,
it's sort of awful to think --
638
00:28:38,336 --> 00:28:40,536
But what would be
the last week of his life,
639
00:28:40,671 --> 00:28:43,339
He was writing anthony's eulogy.
640
00:28:43,341 --> 00:28:45,341
And carolyn was really glad
about that
641
00:28:45,343 --> 00:28:47,209
Because he was finally coming
to terms
642
00:28:47,312 --> 00:28:49,345
With the fact
that anthony was going to die.
643
00:28:49,447 --> 00:28:52,414
And he struggled with it
so much.
644
00:28:52,550 --> 00:28:57,419
The heartache that he was in
over his cousin dying
645
00:28:57,421 --> 00:29:01,557
And the pressure and the stress
he was feeling
646
00:29:01,692 --> 00:29:04,527
Over trying to save his magazine
at the same time.
647
00:29:07,565 --> 00:29:09,098
Brown: You know,
I think that john kennedy
648
00:29:09,233 --> 00:29:11,034
Loved that magazine.
649
00:29:12,436 --> 00:29:15,304
It was also a major
embarrassment for him
650
00:29:15,307 --> 00:29:18,440
If the magazine folded,
and everybody would have said,
651
00:29:18,442 --> 00:29:22,044
"you know,
'gilded kid' couldn't do it."
652
00:29:22,046 --> 00:29:24,113
He would have had to find
someone to buy it,
653
00:29:24,215 --> 00:29:25,915
I think,
to get out from under.
654
00:29:25,917 --> 00:29:29,118
Reporter: George achieved
a circulation of 420,000,
655
00:29:29,220 --> 00:29:30,586
But it's been struggling,
656
00:29:30,721 --> 00:29:32,522
Its publisher weighing
whether to drop it.
657
00:29:32,524 --> 00:29:35,457
And in recent weeks, kennedy has
been looking for other partners
658
00:29:35,593 --> 00:29:38,861
In an effort to keep
his creation alive.
659
00:29:38,997 --> 00:29:42,398
I knew that john was looking
for new owners for the magazine.
660
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:45,401
Hachette had already told him
a few months earlier
661
00:29:45,503 --> 00:29:47,403
That they were no longer
gonna finance it.
662
00:29:47,405 --> 00:29:50,606
If he wanted to keep it alive,
he had to finance it on his own.
663
00:29:50,608 --> 00:29:53,075
James murdoch
and lachlan murdoch
664
00:29:53,077 --> 00:29:55,378
Were interested
in taking a look at it.
665
00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,949
Announcer: John kennedy jr.
In the ballpark tonight.
666
00:30:00,084 --> 00:30:02,484
So I was like, "hey, john, let's
just go to this yankees game
667
00:30:02,486 --> 00:30:04,721
With lachlan and james."
668
00:30:17,301 --> 00:30:20,102
Lachlan and james
chatted with john,
669
00:30:20,104 --> 00:30:22,504
You know,
during the break in innings.
670
00:30:22,506 --> 00:30:24,774
Um, it wasn't gonna go anywhere.
671
00:30:24,776 --> 00:30:26,809
I could tell.
672
00:30:29,647 --> 00:30:33,916
He had to make a graceful exit
out of that
673
00:30:33,918 --> 00:30:35,885
Into a political future.
674
00:30:37,321 --> 00:30:38,921
This was actually
the last night of his --
675
00:30:39,057 --> 00:30:41,457
Last full night of his life.
676
00:30:43,928 --> 00:30:46,662
He was gonna fly the next day,
677
00:30:46,797 --> 00:30:49,732
Friday night, the 16th.
678
00:30:53,938 --> 00:30:55,671
It was just, you know,
one of those phone calls
679
00:30:55,806 --> 00:30:58,674
That you dread.
Immediately, you know.
680
00:30:58,676 --> 00:31:02,078
It's 11:00 or nearly midnight
Friday night.
681
00:31:02,213 --> 00:31:08,083
And john's friend pinky
was calling from hyannis airport
682
00:31:08,085 --> 00:31:11,821
Saying, "they're not here.
Are they there with you?"
683
00:31:11,956 --> 00:31:13,823
And I mean, even like --
oh, my god --
684
00:31:13,958 --> 00:31:16,558
25 years later, I still get,
like, this pit in my stomach.
685
00:31:16,694 --> 00:31:18,227
And then I went
into the kitchen,
686
00:31:18,362 --> 00:31:19,829
And I just started
making phone calls.
687
00:31:19,964 --> 00:31:22,098
And, you know, I was a reporter,
so I knew how to get
688
00:31:22,233 --> 00:31:24,233
Information from people.
689
00:31:24,368 --> 00:31:25,968
And I just started calling --
690
00:31:25,970 --> 00:31:28,304
You know, I called everybody,
691
00:31:28,306 --> 00:31:31,841
The coast guard, the faa,
logan air traffic control,
692
00:31:31,976 --> 00:31:34,977
Caldwell airport,
hyannis airport.
693
00:31:35,113 --> 00:31:39,048
Every call I made was just
more bad news, more bad news.
694
00:31:39,183 --> 00:31:40,983
Called caldwell,
and I got a janitor.
695
00:31:41,119 --> 00:31:43,119
He said, "I see his car.
It's in the corner of the lot.
696
00:31:43,254 --> 00:31:44,987
But his plane's not here."
697
00:31:45,123 --> 00:31:48,858
John was flying carolyn's
sister lauren to the vineyard.
698
00:31:48,860 --> 00:31:50,993
And so I called again,
and I said,
699
00:31:50,995 --> 00:31:52,594
"did she -- is lauren there?"
700
00:31:52,730 --> 00:31:53,996
And he said, "no."
701
00:31:54,132 --> 00:31:55,731
You know,
I called carolyn's mom
702
00:31:55,866 --> 00:31:58,400
Just to tell her that, you know,
they hadn't arrived
703
00:31:58,402 --> 00:32:00,135
And that the plane
was kind of missing,
704
00:32:00,137 --> 00:32:03,806
But, you know,
how do you say that to a mother?
705
00:32:03,942 --> 00:32:06,942
Finally, someone from hyannis
called.
706
00:32:07,077 --> 00:32:09,411
I think it was joe kennedy,
yeah.
707
00:32:09,547 --> 00:32:13,148
And I'm like,
"um, joe, john never arrived,
708
00:32:13,150 --> 00:32:14,884
His plane is missing, and I just
called the coast guard
709
00:32:15,019 --> 00:32:17,019
And reported it missing,"
you know, just thinking,
710
00:32:17,021 --> 00:32:18,487
"well, wait a minute.
Maybe it's not
711
00:32:18,490 --> 00:32:20,389
What I think it definitely is."
712
00:32:22,827 --> 00:32:26,896
Anthony did get up,
and he came into the kitchen.
713
00:32:27,031 --> 00:32:31,167
And he saw at that point
I had, uh, yellow post-it notes
714
00:32:31,302 --> 00:32:35,037
All over the wall
next to the phone.
715
00:32:35,039 --> 00:32:37,907
He just looked at it
and was like --
716
00:32:37,909 --> 00:32:41,711
Just the sadness, just like...
717
00:32:41,713 --> 00:32:43,713
I remember him just
putting his head down
718
00:32:43,715 --> 00:32:46,248
In his -- his -- his hands
and was just like --
719
00:32:46,250 --> 00:32:48,984
He couldn't even cry,
he was so weak.
720
00:32:49,119 --> 00:32:52,188
Gillon:
The last time I saw john,
721
00:32:52,323 --> 00:32:53,655
I think I, you know, hugged him
722
00:32:53,657 --> 00:32:55,925
And I went right
and he went left.
723
00:32:56,060 --> 00:32:57,393
And at some point,
for some reason,
724
00:32:57,395 --> 00:33:00,129
I turned around and saw him,
725
00:33:00,264 --> 00:33:03,065
The silhouette
in the streetlight.
726
00:33:06,938 --> 00:33:09,138
He just looked so lonely.
727
00:33:09,273 --> 00:33:13,409
His hands in his coat pocket
and head bowed down.
728
00:33:13,411 --> 00:33:16,345
I just felt so bad for him.
729
00:33:16,347 --> 00:33:18,347
Yeah.
730
00:33:18,349 --> 00:33:21,083
Reporter: Many are saying
that the kennedy legacy meant
731
00:33:21,085 --> 00:33:24,153
That if john jr. Had decided
at some point in the future
732
00:33:24,288 --> 00:33:27,890
To run for office, he would have
had enormous potential.
733
00:33:28,026 --> 00:33:31,561
It was on every news channel
across the world.
734
00:33:32,964 --> 00:33:35,998
It was a crazy fucking summer.
735
00:33:39,737 --> 00:33:41,737
[ airplane engine humming ]
736
00:33:46,244 --> 00:33:48,110
South: The one thing
I will never forget
737
00:33:48,246 --> 00:33:50,913
Is the sound of the helicopters.
738
00:33:51,049 --> 00:33:54,716
[ helicopter blades whirring ]
739
00:33:54,718 --> 00:33:56,385
Helicopters
that were doing the search,
740
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:58,988
But also news helicopters.
741
00:33:59,123 --> 00:34:01,257
And then it just kind of
went from there.
742
00:34:05,063 --> 00:34:06,595
I was in connecticut.
743
00:34:06,598 --> 00:34:10,065
I was supposed to have been
with them that weekend,
744
00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:11,733
But I'm a nervous flyer.
745
00:34:11,735 --> 00:34:14,403
And I flew enough times
with john.
746
00:34:14,538 --> 00:34:17,072
I think john
was a very good pilot,
747
00:34:17,207 --> 00:34:20,276
But the idea of, like,
those little planes,
748
00:34:20,411 --> 00:34:22,478
Going back and forth with him --
749
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:26,215
I'd done it enough
and thought, "never again."
750
00:34:26,350 --> 00:34:30,820
I got a phone call from carole
like 5:00 a.M. In the morning.
751
00:34:30,922 --> 00:34:32,754
I got on a plane
752
00:34:32,756 --> 00:34:35,691
And flew to the vineyard
early enough that morning
753
00:34:35,693 --> 00:34:38,227
That we still didn't know
the news.
754
00:34:38,362 --> 00:34:40,762
Reporter: The us coast guard
is conducting a search
755
00:34:40,764 --> 00:34:42,698
For a private aircraft.
756
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:46,035
South: Senator kennedy's
office had been notified.
757
00:34:46,037 --> 00:34:47,769
There are reporters
everywhere,
758
00:34:47,771 --> 00:34:49,839
And they're gonna find out
that john kennedy's plane
759
00:34:49,841 --> 00:34:52,307
Has been reported missing.
760
00:34:52,309 --> 00:34:55,044
Reporter: The faa would not
confirm the number of passengers
761
00:34:55,179 --> 00:34:57,179
On board the aircraft,
but all odds are pointing
762
00:34:57,315 --> 00:34:59,582
Toward it being the plane
with john kennedy jr.
763
00:35:01,719 --> 00:35:03,585
Gillon: I'm on the phone
with people at george,
764
00:35:03,721 --> 00:35:05,587
And I was like,
"they're gonna find
765
00:35:05,589 --> 00:35:07,389
That the plane
made a soft landing
766
00:35:07,391 --> 00:35:10,125
And john had a rope in his mouth
and he's swimming to an island
767
00:35:10,260 --> 00:35:12,928
And lauren and carolyn
are sitting in the back seat."
768
00:35:12,930 --> 00:35:15,464
I just couldn't -- I couldn't
imagine john being gone.
769
00:35:15,599 --> 00:35:18,734
More information
now concerning a private plane
770
00:35:18,736 --> 00:35:20,936
Believed to be piloted
by john f. Kennedy jr.
771
00:35:20,938 --> 00:35:22,804
Thought to have been
on board with him
772
00:35:22,806 --> 00:35:25,741
Was his wife
and one other person.
773
00:35:25,843 --> 00:35:27,543
Anthony: That morning
there was a news alert
774
00:35:27,545 --> 00:35:29,078
The plane had gone missing
775
00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:32,614
Because he was going for
rory's wedding.
776
00:35:32,616 --> 00:35:34,216
It was dark.
777
00:35:34,218 --> 00:35:37,819
It became something
that people obsessed about.
778
00:35:37,955 --> 00:35:39,621
It got non-stop coverage.
779
00:35:39,757 --> 00:35:42,824
It was something
that every person in america
780
00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:44,760
Was well aware of.
781
00:35:48,366 --> 00:35:49,698
Gillon:
I just couldn't imagine it.
782
00:35:49,701 --> 00:35:51,233
As the day went on,
783
00:35:51,369 --> 00:35:53,969
The big thing was
that john's sister, caroline,
784
00:35:54,104 --> 00:35:57,373
Called george and told them
to tape up john's office.
785
00:35:57,508 --> 00:35:59,775
And that's when we kind of knew
that it was over.
786
00:35:59,777 --> 00:36:01,243
Reporter:
The transportation safety board
787
00:36:01,245 --> 00:36:02,844
Has just made it official.
788
00:36:02,846 --> 00:36:05,314
At the wreckage site,
the divers successfully located
789
00:36:05,449 --> 00:36:07,449
The bodies
of john f. Kennedy jr.,
790
00:36:07,451 --> 00:36:10,385
Carolyn bessette-kennedy,
and lauren bessette.
791
00:36:10,387 --> 00:36:13,923
Radziwill: It was so cruel for
anthony to have to watch that.
792
00:36:14,025 --> 00:36:18,460
John and anthony --
they were real brothers.
793
00:36:18,462 --> 00:36:22,131
And all I could think of
is, like,
794
00:36:22,133 --> 00:36:24,233
"I'm the only one left."
795
00:36:24,936 --> 00:36:27,603
♪
796
00:36:30,007 --> 00:36:32,807
♪
797
00:36:32,976 --> 00:36:35,009
Reporter: The skies were hazy,
it was dark,
798
00:36:35,111 --> 00:36:36,611
And he was over water.
799
00:36:36,613 --> 00:36:38,146
Those are conditions
that contributed
800
00:36:38,248 --> 00:36:39,881
To spatial disorientation,
801
00:36:39,983 --> 00:36:42,150
Where a pilot
has difficulty determining
802
00:36:42,152 --> 00:36:45,086
Whether the plane is climbing,
descending, or in a turn.
803
00:36:45,088 --> 00:36:47,622
Anthony: He was there almost,
804
00:36:47,624 --> 00:36:49,758
But he flew by sight.
805
00:36:49,859 --> 00:36:51,892
He didn't fly by instruments.
806
00:36:51,894 --> 00:36:54,696
The whole thing was just
not a good idea.
807
00:36:56,099 --> 00:36:57,898
I just said, you know,
808
00:36:57,900 --> 00:37:00,301
"how could he do this
to himself, to his family?"
809
00:37:00,437 --> 00:37:03,037
Just no matter what,
I wish he hadn't done that.
810
00:37:03,039 --> 00:37:05,173
Obviously, we all do.
811
00:37:05,275 --> 00:37:06,841
Crawford: I remember having
that thought, like,
812
00:37:06,843 --> 00:37:09,310
"oh, I'm gonna remember this,
813
00:37:09,446 --> 00:37:13,782
Just like my mother remembered
when john kennedy was shot."
814
00:37:13,883 --> 00:37:15,850
Brown: It's just astounding
how many of the kennedys
815
00:37:15,852 --> 00:37:17,986
Have ended in tragic ways.
816
00:37:17,988 --> 00:37:21,389
Jfk jr. Should not have been
at the helm of that plane.
817
00:37:21,391 --> 00:37:24,058
He was told it was
not a good time to fly.
818
00:37:24,060 --> 00:37:26,394
So, in that sense,
character is destiny.
819
00:37:26,396 --> 00:37:29,063
You know, it was like,
"I'm gonna do it anyway."
820
00:37:29,165 --> 00:37:32,066
And that's really what the
kennedy curse is, essentially.
821
00:37:32,168 --> 00:37:34,068
People don't say no to you.
822
00:37:34,070 --> 00:37:37,071
And sometimes
you have to listen.
823
00:37:37,073 --> 00:37:39,474
They are,
as a family collectively,
824
00:37:39,609 --> 00:37:41,209
Often doing reckless things,
825
00:37:41,211 --> 00:37:44,379
Dying in ski accidents
and air crashes.
826
00:37:45,948 --> 00:37:47,548
Gillon:
The whole week was a blur.
827
00:37:47,550 --> 00:37:50,084
I couldn't watch the news.
I didn't watch tv.
828
00:37:50,086 --> 00:37:51,752
I just couldn't read a paper,
829
00:37:51,754 --> 00:37:53,888
Just blocked it out completely.
830
00:37:53,890 --> 00:37:56,090
Some of the streets
are now being shut down
831
00:37:56,092 --> 00:37:58,092
As the family members
of john f. Kennedy jr.
832
00:37:58,194 --> 00:37:59,694
And carolyn bessette-kennedy
833
00:37:59,829 --> 00:38:02,030
Prepare to say a final goodbye
to their loved ones.
834
00:38:02,032 --> 00:38:04,232
The overwhelming memory
I have of that day
835
00:38:04,367 --> 00:38:08,903
Was just silence of getting
to the upper east side
836
00:38:08,905 --> 00:38:15,176
And then walking into the church
and seeing just pure grief,
837
00:38:15,312 --> 00:38:18,312
Seeing john kerry crying
in the back.
838
00:38:18,314 --> 00:38:21,716
It was less than a week
after the plane had gone down.
839
00:38:23,253 --> 00:38:27,988
Carolyn will ever be
that beautiful, 6'0" blond,
840
00:38:27,990 --> 00:38:33,161
Blue-eyed, mysterious woman
who married john f. Kennedy.
841
00:38:34,597 --> 00:38:36,197
Gillon:
And then we left the church,
842
00:38:36,199 --> 00:38:38,599
And there was a reception
a few blocks away.
843
00:38:38,735 --> 00:38:41,002
And the streets were lined
with people.
844
00:38:41,104 --> 00:38:45,206
And for me, that was
the first realization I had
845
00:38:45,208 --> 00:38:48,810
Of what john meant
to so many other people.
846
00:38:50,246 --> 00:38:52,146
He was john to me.
847
00:38:52,248 --> 00:38:54,148
And every once in a while,
I had to be pulled out of that
848
00:38:54,250 --> 00:38:58,018
And to recognize
that he was john f. Kennedy jr.
849
00:38:58,020 --> 00:39:00,354
And we were walking
to the convent.
850
00:39:00,356 --> 00:39:03,024
I was like, "you know, john,
you did okay."
851
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:05,593
[ cries ]
852
00:39:08,131 --> 00:39:10,699
Wright rigueur: When we think
of these big political moments
853
00:39:10,834 --> 00:39:12,367
From the 1960s --
854
00:39:12,502 --> 00:39:15,636
The assassination
of john f. Kennedy,
855
00:39:15,638 --> 00:39:17,572
The assassination
of martin luther king jr.,
856
00:39:17,707 --> 00:39:19,840
The assassination
of robert f. Kennedy --
857
00:39:19,842 --> 00:39:23,511
Similar kind of gravitas
in the 1990s
858
00:39:23,646 --> 00:39:26,047
Because of princess diana's
death
859
00:39:26,149 --> 00:39:29,450
And then john and carolyn's
disappearance.
860
00:39:29,586 --> 00:39:31,852
It's not political violence,
861
00:39:31,854 --> 00:39:35,523
But it still has
the kind of weight that matters.
862
00:39:35,525 --> 00:39:38,392
This has implications
for politics
863
00:39:38,394 --> 00:39:40,729
And how we understand, you know,
864
00:39:40,864 --> 00:39:43,864
Our connection
to political memory.
865
00:39:43,866 --> 00:39:46,134
It's a generational-defining
moment.
866
00:39:46,136 --> 00:39:49,203
Clinton:
For more than 40 years now,
867
00:39:49,205 --> 00:39:52,941
The kennedy family has inspired
americans to public service,
868
00:39:53,042 --> 00:39:56,076
Strengthened our faith
in the future,
869
00:39:56,078 --> 00:39:58,079
And moved our nation forward.
870
00:39:59,315 --> 00:40:02,951
And through it all,
they have suffered much.
871
00:40:03,086 --> 00:40:07,422
From the time he saluted
his dad at the funeral,
872
00:40:07,557 --> 00:40:12,493
John was never going to be
fully human, you know?
873
00:40:12,629 --> 00:40:15,096
He was always
gonna be part of the myth
874
00:40:15,198 --> 00:40:17,298
Of camelot in the culture.
875
00:40:17,434 --> 00:40:18,967
Born of the sun,
876
00:40:19,068 --> 00:40:21,569
They traveled a short while
towards the sun.
877
00:40:21,704 --> 00:40:25,573
An unwavering commitment
to the poor,
878
00:40:25,708 --> 00:40:27,375
To the elderly,
879
00:40:27,377 --> 00:40:29,377
To those without hope,
880
00:40:29,379 --> 00:40:33,114
Regardless of fashion
or convention,
881
00:40:33,216 --> 00:40:36,517
Is the greatest reward
of public service.
882
00:40:36,653 --> 00:40:38,386
Wright rigueur:
But actually, I think if we look
883
00:40:38,388 --> 00:40:41,990
At the brief flash of success
of george,
884
00:40:42,091 --> 00:40:45,860
He ushers in an era
that really captures
885
00:40:45,862 --> 00:40:50,064
The intersection
of politics and celebrity.
886
00:40:50,066 --> 00:40:52,200
He had the foresight
to understand,
887
00:40:52,202 --> 00:40:54,535
"this is where the country
is going,
888
00:40:54,671 --> 00:40:56,136
And we need to address it."
889
00:40:56,138 --> 00:40:57,538
There was
an opportunity here
890
00:40:57,674 --> 00:41:01,009
To change the definition
of a political magazine.
891
00:41:01,144 --> 00:41:04,278
Lots of people write about john
as the "what-ifs."
892
00:41:04,280 --> 00:41:05,680
What could he have been?
893
00:41:05,815 --> 00:41:08,883
And this is, I think,
the great tragedy
894
00:41:09,018 --> 00:41:10,885
Of john's death,
895
00:41:11,020 --> 00:41:13,287
Which is, at exactly the moment
896
00:41:13,389 --> 00:41:17,892
Where he looks poised to take
the mantle from his father,
897
00:41:18,027 --> 00:41:20,294
His life is cut short.
898
00:41:20,429 --> 00:41:22,296
What would he have done?
899
00:41:22,298 --> 00:41:24,365
What would he have been?
900
00:41:24,501 --> 00:41:28,436
I think john's legacy is far
more complex and comprehensive
901
00:41:28,438 --> 00:41:31,238
Than we actually give
credit for.
902
00:41:31,308 --> 00:41:40,515
♪
903
00:41:40,650 --> 00:41:50,458
♪
904
00:41:50,560 --> 00:41:54,529
Kennedy: If you're asking
if it's hard being me, it's --
905
00:41:54,664 --> 00:41:56,064
King: Well, it's brought you
a unique life.
906
00:41:56,199 --> 00:41:58,666
Kennedy: Yeah, absolutely,
and great opportunities
907
00:41:58,668 --> 00:42:01,069
And some challenges.
908
00:42:01,071 --> 00:42:04,104
But all in all,
I feel very fortunate.
909
00:42:04,141 --> 00:42:11,813
♪
71752
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