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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,000 Downloaded from YTS.MX 2 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:13,000 Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX 3 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:15,017 ♪ ♪ 4 00:00:19,006 --> 00:00:21,020 ♪ ♪ 5 00:00:28,001 --> 00:00:30,018 ♪ ♪ 6 00:00:39,017 --> 00:00:41,026 ♪ ♪ 7 00:01:02,008 --> 00:01:05,025 ♪ ♪ 8 00:01:11,020 --> 00:01:13,020 Gail Collins: You know, where I used to go to work, 9 00:01:13,022 --> 00:01:15,017 I would see all these people on the subway, 10 00:01:15,019 --> 00:01:17,002 reading the paper. 11 00:01:17,004 --> 00:01:20,021 They're working at working-class jobs, 12 00:01:20,023 --> 00:01:23,025 and they get up in the morning and they grab this paper, 13 00:01:23,027 --> 00:01:25,025 and they read the whole thing. 14 00:01:25,027 --> 00:01:28,013 The firefighter, the emergency room nurse, 15 00:01:28,015 --> 00:01:30,018 the beleaguered schoolteacher, 16 00:01:30,020 --> 00:01:33,008 the factory worker losing the job. 17 00:01:35,008 --> 00:01:37,009 ♪ ♪ 18 00:01:38,028 --> 00:01:41,029 There was nothing like a big city paper, 19 00:01:42,001 --> 00:01:44,018 especially a big city tabloid. 20 00:01:44,020 --> 00:01:46,003 Nick Pileggi: These cities were big enough 21 00:01:46,005 --> 00:01:48,029 and interesting enough to be able to justify 22 00:01:49,001 --> 00:01:51,008 three, four, in my day, seven newspapers. 23 00:01:51,010 --> 00:01:53,028 Ed Kosner: You know, the WASPs read theHerald Tribune 24 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:55,020 and theWorld-Telegram. 25 00:01:55,022 --> 00:01:58,018 The Jews read thePost and theTimes. 26 00:01:58,020 --> 00:02:00,028 And the Irish and Italians read 27 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:02,023 theJournal-American, 28 00:02:02,025 --> 00:02:05,012 and theDaily News, and theMirror. 29 00:02:05,014 --> 00:02:07,010 And there was the number one columnist, 30 00:02:07,012 --> 00:02:09,010 and, usually, it was an Irish columnist. 31 00:02:09,012 --> 00:02:12,013 Back in the day, I mean, you would buy the papers 32 00:02:12,015 --> 00:02:15,017 to see what Jimmy Breslin's saying, you know, or Pete Hamill. 33 00:02:16,017 --> 00:02:19,028 I mean, these guys were like superstars. 34 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:22,007 They were able to connect, and that's why people saw them 35 00:02:22,009 --> 00:02:24,004 as the voice of true New Yorkers. 36 00:02:24,006 --> 00:02:26,012 Richard Wald: Both of them were people 37 00:02:26,014 --> 00:02:28,014 imbued with that sense 38 00:02:28,016 --> 00:02:31,003 that we're on the side of the little guy. 39 00:02:31,005 --> 00:02:33,013 And the way to be on the side of the little guy 40 00:02:33,015 --> 00:02:34,024 was personal stories. 41 00:02:34,026 --> 00:02:37,028 Tom Brokaw: They had their own kind of street poetry. 42 00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:42,003 They always brought a blue-collars sensibility to whatever they did, 43 00:02:42,005 --> 00:02:45,008 but they could also explain about what was happening in the underclass. 44 00:02:45,010 --> 00:02:46,025 Jonathan Alter: Sometimes they were colleagues 45 00:02:46,027 --> 00:02:47,024 at the same paper, 46 00:02:47,026 --> 00:02:49,024 sometimes they were rivals, 47 00:02:49,026 --> 00:02:52,019 but they were always good friends. 48 00:02:52,021 --> 00:02:56,011 Pete, he had almost no enemies. 49 00:02:56,013 --> 00:02:58,007 Jimmy had more than a few. 50 00:02:58,009 --> 00:02:59,029 Man: How do you define your enemies? 51 00:03:00,001 --> 00:03:02,007 Everybody that doesn't like me, 52 00:03:02,009 --> 00:03:03,023 and that's an awful lot of people, 53 00:03:03,025 --> 00:03:05,007 that's an all-inclusive topic. 54 00:03:06,001 --> 00:03:08,004 Michael Daly: He loved being Jimmy Breslin. 55 00:03:08,006 --> 00:03:09,024 It's infectious to be around somebody 56 00:03:09,026 --> 00:03:11,002 who really loves being who they are. 57 00:03:11,004 --> 00:03:13,013 -(laughing) -I went to John Adams High School, 58 00:03:13,015 --> 00:03:14,019 and I wasn't a dropout. 59 00:03:14,021 --> 00:03:16,007 I went the full five years. 60 00:03:16,009 --> 00:03:18,021 (laughter, applause) 61 00:03:18,023 --> 00:03:20,024 -Man: The New York Times said that you wrote literature. -Yes. 62 00:03:20,026 --> 00:03:22,017 -That this is literature. -That was the worst thing 63 00:03:22,019 --> 00:03:24,005 -that could've happened to me, too. -(laughter) 64 00:03:24,007 --> 00:03:26,007 There's something the matter, I don't know. 65 00:03:26,009 --> 00:03:28,020 There's something very much the matter with the thing. It doesn't work. 66 00:03:28,022 --> 00:03:31,011 Tom Wolfe: He looked like you'd taken a ball of clay, 67 00:03:31,013 --> 00:03:35,006 and then you'd gotten another ball of clay for the head, 68 00:03:35,008 --> 00:03:37,008 and these arms were stuck on. 69 00:03:37,010 --> 00:03:39,021 What color were the four kids who got shot? 70 00:03:39,023 --> 00:03:42,001 -Host: Black. -What color was the gunman? 71 00:03:42,003 --> 00:03:43,025 -White. -Thank you. 72 00:03:43,027 --> 00:03:47,004 So what are you saying, this was a racial murder, is that what you're saying? 73 00:03:47,006 --> 00:03:49,007 No, it was over geraniums. 74 00:03:49,009 --> 00:03:52,006 Lemme call you back in a little while. Okay, bye. 75 00:03:52,008 --> 00:03:53,024 Breslin. 76 00:03:53,026 --> 00:03:55,006 Charlie Carillo: Pete went for the heart 77 00:03:55,008 --> 00:03:56,015 without being sentimental. 78 00:03:56,017 --> 00:03:58,009 Pete had a high school education. 79 00:03:58,011 --> 00:04:00,001 Everything he learned, he learned on the streets. 80 00:04:00,003 --> 00:04:02,011 You would come in the subway home at night, 81 00:04:02,013 --> 00:04:05,002 and there was an aroma of perspiration in the place, 82 00:04:05,004 --> 00:04:07,027 a salty kind of smell in the subways 83 00:04:07,029 --> 00:04:11,008 because working men were on their way home. 84 00:04:11,010 --> 00:04:14,010 Gay Talese: The guy had another side beyond the journalism. 85 00:04:14,012 --> 00:04:16,027 He had this almost movie star life! 86 00:04:16,029 --> 00:04:19,016 You know, with Ms. Kennedy or Onassis. 87 00:04:19,018 --> 00:04:22,004 Shirley MacLaine, they were together for years. 88 00:04:22,006 --> 00:04:24,003 ♪ ♪ 89 00:04:24,005 --> 00:04:25,022 Colin Quinn: Two guys in New York, 90 00:04:25,024 --> 00:04:28,000 they're both like these Irish bar columnists, 91 00:04:28,002 --> 00:04:32,013 and they both are so similar and so different at the same time. 92 00:04:32,015 --> 00:04:35,018 Man: Hamill was, I always thought, like a poet. 93 00:04:35,020 --> 00:04:38,007 He'd give you the poetry of New York. 94 00:04:38,009 --> 00:04:40,028 (Hamill speaking) 95 00:04:52,027 --> 00:04:56,019 Robert Krulwich: This guy had sweep and majesty. 96 00:04:56,021 --> 00:04:59,010 It was like walking into, you know, a French novel-- 97 00:04:59,012 --> 00:05:03,008 the light glancing off the buildings, the atmosphere. 98 00:05:03,010 --> 00:05:05,014 -And Breslin would give you the... -(smacks palm) 99 00:05:05,016 --> 00:05:08,013 ...here's what happened yesterday in New York. 100 00:05:08,015 --> 00:05:11,013 (Breslin speaking) 101 00:05:25,008 --> 00:05:28,026 This is literature in real time, on deadline, 102 00:05:28,028 --> 00:05:31,000 and it still lasts. 103 00:05:31,002 --> 00:05:34,004 ♪ ♪ 104 00:05:40,020 --> 00:05:43,022 (train rattling) 105 00:05:43,024 --> 00:05:45,017 (typewriter clacks) 106 00:05:48,014 --> 00:05:50,029 ♪ ♪ 107 00:05:55,027 --> 00:05:56,023 (gunshot) 108 00:05:58,004 --> 00:05:59,002 (gunshot) 109 00:06:01,003 --> 00:06:01,029 (gunshot) 110 00:06:03,007 --> 00:06:04,003 (gunshot) 111 00:06:05,011 --> 00:06:06,012 Newswoman: Berhnard Goetz, 112 00:06:06,014 --> 00:06:08,013 New York's so-called "Death Wish Gunman," 113 00:06:08,015 --> 00:06:09,027 is in a New York jail this morning, 114 00:06:09,029 --> 00:06:13,002 after confessing to the vigilante-style shooting of four youths 115 00:06:13,004 --> 00:06:14,025 aboard a New York subway last month. 116 00:06:14,027 --> 00:06:16,014 Newsman: Goetz wounded four teenagers 117 00:06:16,016 --> 00:06:18,013 whom he said surrounded him on the subway 118 00:06:18,015 --> 00:06:19,021 and asked for money. 119 00:06:19,023 --> 00:06:21,015 Newsman 2: Police say the teenagers had arrest records 120 00:06:21,017 --> 00:06:23,015 and three were carrying long screwdrivers. 121 00:06:23,017 --> 00:06:26,006 It is not clear exactly what the kids intended. 122 00:06:26,008 --> 00:06:27,027 Newsman 3: Many New Yorkers consider him a hero, 123 00:06:27,029 --> 00:06:30,004 and fundraising efforts are underway to pay 124 00:06:30,006 --> 00:06:32,013 his bail and legal expenses. 125 00:06:32,015 --> 00:06:34,010 If I were in his place and I had a gun, 126 00:06:34,012 --> 00:06:36,001 I would do exactly the same thing. 127 00:06:36,003 --> 00:06:37,023 I have no pity on criminals, you know. 128 00:06:37,025 --> 00:06:40,023 If they're gonna rip off people, they get what they deserve. 129 00:06:41,024 --> 00:06:44,011 Les Payne: This was the most terrifying period 130 00:06:44,013 --> 00:06:47,009 that I have experienced in New York. 131 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:51,000 The city had rose up almost as one, 132 00:06:51,002 --> 00:06:54,004 and said that yes, he should have shot them. 133 00:06:54,006 --> 00:06:56,016 You know, it served them right. 134 00:06:56,018 --> 00:06:58,007 Alfonse D'Amato: I've been on that subway 135 00:06:58,009 --> 00:07:00,006 when these young thugs come in there. 136 00:07:00,008 --> 00:07:02,003 And they don't even have to approach you. 137 00:07:02,005 --> 00:07:03,028 When three or four or five come in, 138 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:05,027 and they start their messing around, 139 00:07:05,029 --> 00:07:09,010 they are menacing by their presence. 140 00:07:09,012 --> 00:07:12,008 Payne: It was that vacuum that happens 141 00:07:12,010 --> 00:07:14,025 when journalism is not doing its job. 142 00:07:15,009 --> 00:07:17,029 Journalism was out to lunch, 143 00:07:18,001 --> 00:07:19,019 save Breslin. 144 00:07:19,021 --> 00:07:22,021 Breslin: They burned down something irreplaceable 145 00:07:22,023 --> 00:07:24,013 in New York this week, 146 00:07:24,015 --> 00:07:26,008 and there were people who looked at the ashes 147 00:07:26,010 --> 00:07:28,021 and termed them beautiful. 148 00:07:28,023 --> 00:07:32,002 A man on a subway took out a gun and shot four people-- 149 00:07:32,004 --> 00:07:34,005 two in the back-- and ran away. 150 00:07:35,009 --> 00:07:37,011 One of the two shot in the back was 19 151 00:07:37,013 --> 00:07:40,001 and he will be in a wheelchair for the rest of his life. 152 00:07:41,028 --> 00:07:44,026 There were people who praised the gunman. 153 00:07:44,028 --> 00:07:46,017 As lawlessness was applauded, 154 00:07:46,019 --> 00:07:50,001 we in New York arrived at the sourest of all moments: 155 00:07:50,003 --> 00:07:52,010 when people become what they hate. 156 00:07:53,013 --> 00:07:54,016 Would the gunman have fired, 157 00:07:54,018 --> 00:07:56,004 and would people now be jubilant 158 00:07:56,006 --> 00:07:57,025 if the four had been white? 159 00:07:58,024 --> 00:08:01,012 Almost no one wants to hear that question 160 00:08:01,014 --> 00:08:03,021 because it would shorten the celebration. 161 00:08:04,027 --> 00:08:07,015 Mr. Breslin, if somebody were to attack you, 162 00:08:07,017 --> 00:08:10,018 would you just stand there with your arms out and not protect yourself? 163 00:08:10,020 --> 00:08:13,000 I hope I'd fight back, and I also hope I wouldn't shoot 164 00:08:13,002 --> 00:08:15,022 two people in the back and another one in the side, 165 00:08:15,024 --> 00:08:17,013 because he didn't turn around quick enough 166 00:08:17,015 --> 00:08:19,007 that I could shoot him in the back! 167 00:08:19,009 --> 00:08:22,018 Once my father found out 168 00:08:22,020 --> 00:08:24,023 from one of his 169 00:08:24,025 --> 00:08:28,001 friends in the NYPD that the kids were shot in the back, 170 00:08:28,003 --> 00:08:29,020 that's when my father said game over. 171 00:08:29,022 --> 00:08:32,022 How can you be threatened when they have their back to you? 172 00:08:32,024 --> 00:08:36,016 I can understand how he cracked, and I think the people who-- 173 00:08:36,018 --> 00:08:38,005 Breslin: Do you know what he did? 174 00:08:38,007 --> 00:08:40,000 Did you know that he bent down 175 00:08:40,002 --> 00:08:42,001 and he shot a kid on the floor with the fifth bullet 176 00:08:42,003 --> 00:08:44,016 because he had one left and he said lemme get rid of it? 177 00:08:44,018 --> 00:08:48,010 Behind this lunatic gunman, you had New York City. 178 00:08:48,012 --> 00:08:52,005 We in America, the victims, have been portrayed to be the wimps. 179 00:08:52,007 --> 00:08:55,001 Give your money over, wave the white flag, roll over 180 00:08:55,003 --> 00:08:58,006 and hope that these guys are gonna spare your life. 181 00:08:58,008 --> 00:09:02,000 Jimmy Breslin was the only voice out there. 182 00:09:02,002 --> 00:09:05,019 Mr. Breslin, sir, you do appear to be 183 00:09:05,021 --> 00:09:07,023 whistling a very lonely tune. 184 00:09:07,025 --> 00:09:09,024 -No. (scoffs) -(laughter) 185 00:09:09,026 --> 00:09:12,005 (applause) 186 00:09:12,007 --> 00:09:14,002 Donahue: This is not to say that you are wrong. 187 00:09:14,004 --> 00:09:17,000 -How can I be wrong? -Your speeches are not playing in New York City. 188 00:09:17,002 --> 00:09:18,029 I don't care! It's the law! 189 00:09:19,001 --> 00:09:21,000 It's in a book! Go look it up in the book! 190 00:09:21,002 --> 00:09:23,003 You're not supposed to shoot four people! 191 00:09:29,010 --> 00:09:31,012 Payne: It began to become obvious 192 00:09:31,014 --> 00:09:34,027 that this guy was not this fair-haired hero, 193 00:09:34,029 --> 00:09:37,021 the Death Wish Gunman that everyone said that he was. 194 00:09:37,023 --> 00:09:40,004 If I had more bullets, I would've shot them all again and again. 195 00:09:40,006 --> 00:09:41,020 Payne: And this is why Breslin, 196 00:09:41,022 --> 00:09:44,010 people who stand head and shoulders above the mob 197 00:09:44,012 --> 00:09:46,006 in this craft of journalism, 198 00:09:46,008 --> 00:09:47,027 they're so important. 199 00:09:47,029 --> 00:09:52,009 They realize that, yes, crime is rampant. 200 00:09:52,011 --> 00:09:54,011 But if your son is one of those four kids, 201 00:09:54,013 --> 00:09:56,013 should he be shot in the back 202 00:09:56,015 --> 00:09:59,016 by Bernhard Goetz because crime is rampant? 203 00:09:59,018 --> 00:10:00,024 (typewriter clacks) 204 00:10:00,026 --> 00:10:02,023 ♪ ♪ 205 00:10:02,025 --> 00:10:05,019 You better believe that I hate the people 206 00:10:05,021 --> 00:10:08,020 that took this girl and raped her brutally. 207 00:10:08,022 --> 00:10:10,014 You better believe it. 208 00:10:10,016 --> 00:10:12,017 And it's more than anger, it's hatred, 209 00:10:12,019 --> 00:10:14,006 and I want society to hate them. 210 00:10:14,008 --> 00:10:16,027 -(yelling) -Newswoman: It is the ages of the accused, 211 00:10:16,029 --> 00:10:19,000 14 to 17 years old, 212 00:10:19,002 --> 00:10:22,013 and the horror of their alleged crimes that has caused a furor. 213 00:10:23,018 --> 00:10:25,017 A woman, jogging in New York Central Park, 214 00:10:25,019 --> 00:10:27,019 raped and nearly beaten to death. 215 00:10:28,002 --> 00:10:30,014 Man: She was dragged about 200 feet 216 00:10:30,016 --> 00:10:33,019 into the woods, where they beat her with their fists, 217 00:10:33,021 --> 00:10:35,024 we believe a rock, and a metal pipe. 218 00:10:39,016 --> 00:10:42,005 We must reinstitute the death penalty. 219 00:10:42,007 --> 00:10:43,028 Newsman: So outraged by the brutal rape attack 220 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:46,010 of the young jogger in New York Central Park, 221 00:10:46,012 --> 00:10:50,007 Trump took out full-page ads in four city newspapers. 222 00:10:50,009 --> 00:10:55,005 It was an ad that suggested that there was no mercy necessary, 223 00:10:55,007 --> 00:10:58,012 no justice, as we know it, necessary. 224 00:10:58,014 --> 00:11:00,024 He thought they just should be killed. 225 00:11:01,022 --> 00:11:03,024 They hadn't even been indicted yet. 226 00:11:03,026 --> 00:11:05,021 They were still in the police precincts. 227 00:11:05,023 --> 00:11:08,011 ♪ ♪ 228 00:11:08,013 --> 00:11:12,001 Trump inflamed race hate in New York City. 229 00:11:12,003 --> 00:11:14,000 Of course I hate these people, 230 00:11:14,002 --> 00:11:15,015 and let's all hate these people, 231 00:11:15,017 --> 00:11:16,029 because maybe hate is what we need 232 00:11:17,001 --> 00:11:18,010 if we're gonna get something done. 233 00:11:18,012 --> 00:11:21,013 Esposito: Donald Trump is happy to inflame divisiveness. 234 00:11:22,010 --> 00:11:26,003 That's what makes a gifted writer like Pete Hamill-- 235 00:11:26,022 --> 00:11:30,015 the sensibility to see that before other people see it. 236 00:11:32,014 --> 00:11:34,004 Hamill: Snarling and heartless 237 00:11:34,006 --> 00:11:36,020 and fraudulently tough, 238 00:11:36,022 --> 00:11:40,000 insisting on the virtues of stupidity, 239 00:11:40,002 --> 00:11:43,010 it was the epitome of blind negation. 240 00:11:44,009 --> 00:11:46,020 Hate was just another luxury. 241 00:11:47,013 --> 00:11:50,006 (Hamill speaking) 242 00:12:04,025 --> 00:12:08,002 ♪ ♪ 243 00:12:08,004 --> 00:12:10,014 Newsman: Now, after each has completed his sentence, 244 00:12:10,016 --> 00:12:12,008 this man, Matias Reyes, 245 00:12:12,010 --> 00:12:13,027 imprisoned for another rape, 246 00:12:13,029 --> 00:12:15,026 says he raped the jogger, 247 00:12:15,028 --> 00:12:18,003 and DNA evidence confirms it. 248 00:12:18,005 --> 00:12:21,005 And then we find out that, years later, 249 00:12:21,007 --> 00:12:22,025 those guys were innocent, 250 00:12:22,027 --> 00:12:25,004 and their lives' are never gonna be the same. 251 00:12:27,018 --> 00:12:30,002 What the best, the past in the tabloid era did 252 00:12:30,004 --> 00:12:32,006 was it put forward big personalities 253 00:12:32,008 --> 00:12:35,016 with big opinions who backed them up with real reporting. 254 00:12:35,018 --> 00:12:37,024 And they were uncompromising in trying 255 00:12:37,026 --> 00:12:39,029 to hold people in power to account, 256 00:12:40,001 --> 00:12:42,009 and tell the stories of people who were suffering. 257 00:12:42,025 --> 00:12:45,026 -(typewriter clacks) -(indistinct chatter) 258 00:12:46,013 --> 00:12:48,013 Keep walking, but watch your step, Jim. 259 00:12:49,014 --> 00:12:51,018 There's wires on the floor. 260 00:12:51,020 --> 00:12:54,018 -Step lightly. -Oh, just what you said. 261 00:12:55,029 --> 00:12:57,027 There you go, almost there. 262 00:12:57,029 --> 00:13:00,011 -Hamill: There we go. -Breslin: All right. 263 00:13:00,013 --> 00:13:03,006 -Hamill: Here. -Breslin: You got coffee here somewhere? 264 00:13:03,008 --> 00:13:06,000 -Man 1: Oh, coffee! -Man 2: You want coffee? 265 00:13:06,002 --> 00:13:08,024 -You okay? Good. -Yeah, I'm all right. 266 00:13:08,026 --> 00:13:14,005 ♪ Nice and easy does it all the time ♪ 267 00:13:14,007 --> 00:13:16,008 -Man: Marking. -(clacks) 268 00:13:16,010 --> 00:13:19,011 ♪ ♪ 269 00:13:23,005 --> 00:13:24,029 Interviewer: Where were you born? 270 00:13:25,001 --> 00:13:27,020 Breslin: Ozone Park, Queens, New York City. 271 00:13:27,022 --> 00:13:28,026 Interviewer: What year? 272 00:13:28,028 --> 00:13:30,029 Breslin: 10/17/29. 273 00:13:34,007 --> 00:13:36,020 I lived on 101st Avenue, 274 00:13:36,022 --> 00:13:39,008 and it was a house with a porch 275 00:13:39,010 --> 00:13:41,017 that people used to sleep on. 276 00:13:41,019 --> 00:13:44,020 Those were the Depression days. 277 00:13:44,022 --> 00:13:46,029 Scraping to get a job. 278 00:13:48,001 --> 00:13:52,011 And then we'd go down two blocks from there to Liberty Avenue, 279 00:13:52,013 --> 00:13:54,009 there was a bar. 280 00:13:54,011 --> 00:13:57,003 By the time I'm 17, 281 00:13:57,005 --> 00:14:00,022 two guys came in with guns and held the joint up. 282 00:14:03,026 --> 00:14:05,021 Hamill: Oh, in my neighborhood, 283 00:14:05,023 --> 00:14:08,016 there was a bar on every corner except 284 00:14:08,018 --> 00:14:10,013 the one with the movie house. 285 00:14:12,027 --> 00:14:16,026 A lot of them had been speakeasies during Prohibition. 286 00:14:16,028 --> 00:14:19,021 Most of them were populated by men. 287 00:14:19,023 --> 00:14:23,001 They lived across the street from the bar. 288 00:14:23,003 --> 00:14:26,004 Their favorite bar was the closest one. 289 00:14:26,006 --> 00:14:29,020 That was it, the bar. Everybody was in the bar. 290 00:14:30,016 --> 00:14:32,022 Every-freaking-body. 291 00:14:33,026 --> 00:14:36,006 The main problem in my house 292 00:14:36,008 --> 00:14:38,006 was anything outta the bottle. 293 00:14:38,008 --> 00:14:40,004 There was a lot of drinking. 294 00:14:40,006 --> 00:14:42,004 Interviewer: And you didn't know your father, right? 295 00:14:42,006 --> 00:14:45,029 No, he was around. That didn't last long. 296 00:14:46,001 --> 00:14:49,016 My father took off when, I guess, when I was about seven. 297 00:14:49,018 --> 00:14:52,010 He went out for rolls one morning and didn't come back. 298 00:14:52,012 --> 00:14:54,024 And that took care of that end of the family, 299 00:14:54,026 --> 00:14:57,022 and then the rest of it, it was just a nice, 300 00:14:57,024 --> 00:14:59,017 large, cold Irish family. 301 00:14:59,019 --> 00:15:01,012 Do you know where your father is now? 302 00:15:01,014 --> 00:15:02,027 No, he died a couple of years ago. 303 00:15:02,029 --> 00:15:06,002 -Did you see him after he left the house? -No, never. No. 304 00:15:06,004 --> 00:15:07,011 -He must've-- -No. 305 00:15:07,013 --> 00:15:08,024 What? What, are you gonna tell me 306 00:15:08,026 --> 00:15:10,020 -it's a heart-tugging thing? Who the hell cares? -(laughing) 307 00:15:10,022 --> 00:15:11,026 The guy went away. Who cares? 308 00:15:11,028 --> 00:15:14,027 Oh come on, Breslin, cut it out. (laughing) 309 00:15:14,029 --> 00:15:17,006 ♪ ♪ 310 00:15:17,008 --> 00:15:20,015 Breslin: My mother, she got mad and just declared him dead. 311 00:15:21,014 --> 00:15:23,015 He just was gone, and that's it. 312 00:15:23,017 --> 00:15:26,000 All those years. 313 00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:30,014 When I grew up, my mother never kissed me, ever. 314 00:15:30,016 --> 00:15:32,019 Nor did I ever kiss her. 315 00:15:32,021 --> 00:15:35,008 The closest we ever came to touching each other 316 00:15:35,010 --> 00:15:38,000 was when we sat together on the subway. 317 00:15:38,002 --> 00:15:40,018 I was a stranger who was out of her. 318 00:15:42,028 --> 00:15:46,012 I sat on the staircase and peered through the banister. 319 00:15:46,014 --> 00:15:49,000 My mother was there for a long time, for hours, 320 00:15:49,002 --> 00:15:52,011 weeping and talking to her reflection in the big mirror. 321 00:15:52,013 --> 00:15:53,025 I dozed. 322 00:15:53,027 --> 00:15:56,006 Suddenly, a click woke me up. 323 00:15:56,008 --> 00:15:58,007 My mother was motionless. 324 00:15:58,009 --> 00:16:00,027 My eyes closed. There was another click, 325 00:16:00,029 --> 00:16:03,002 and her weeping rose almost to a shriek, 326 00:16:03,004 --> 00:16:06,011 and I saw that she had a pistol at her left temple. 327 00:16:06,013 --> 00:16:08,023 She was gonna shoot herself. 328 00:16:08,025 --> 00:16:11,020 So, I told my grandmother, 329 00:16:11,022 --> 00:16:14,001 and she just came down from her bed, 330 00:16:14,003 --> 00:16:16,018 and just took it from her and turned around, 331 00:16:16,020 --> 00:16:19,015 and walked back up to the room. 332 00:16:19,017 --> 00:16:24,010 Afterward, nobody ever mentioned in the house what had happened. 333 00:16:24,012 --> 00:16:26,028 The night was part of the dust in the air. 334 00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:30,027 Barry: His father leaves. His mother is troubled. 335 00:16:30,029 --> 00:16:32,024 He's a lonely kid. 336 00:16:32,026 --> 00:16:34,004 And what he would do is, 337 00:16:34,006 --> 00:16:36,003 he would get lost in the newspapers. 338 00:16:36,005 --> 00:16:39,004 ♪ ♪ 339 00:16:39,006 --> 00:16:41,011 Harriet Arnone: Jimmy Breslin was devoted 340 00:16:41,013 --> 00:16:44,008 to newspapers from the day he was able to read. 341 00:16:45,007 --> 00:16:46,021 He always said, 342 00:16:46,023 --> 00:16:49,022 "I'm going to be a newspaper reporter when I grow up." 343 00:16:49,024 --> 00:16:52,028 Breslin: I was in a Catholic grammar school. 344 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:56,014 The nuns were interested in the writing. 345 00:16:56,016 --> 00:16:58,015 Subject, verb, and object-- 346 00:16:58,017 --> 00:17:01,020 that was the story of the whole thing. 347 00:17:01,022 --> 00:17:03,005 Concrete nouns, 348 00:17:03,007 --> 00:17:05,009 -active verbs. -Yeah, it's all... 349 00:17:05,011 --> 00:17:06,028 That's what we were taught that way. 350 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:09,009 It was pretty good teaching. 351 00:17:10,017 --> 00:17:12,002 Well, we'd put out a paper, 352 00:17:12,004 --> 00:17:15,007 the kids' paper, on 134th Street. 353 00:17:15,009 --> 00:17:16,029 The Flash. 354 00:17:17,001 --> 00:17:19,007 We never heard of, in fact, the typewriter thing. 355 00:17:19,009 --> 00:17:20,022 -(chuckles) -Never. 356 00:17:20,024 --> 00:17:23,009 It was always your hand. 357 00:17:23,011 --> 00:17:25,027 I realized early that bad news was great, 358 00:17:25,029 --> 00:17:27,028 even if it involved me. 359 00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:30,023 I protected myself by writing about it. 360 00:17:30,025 --> 00:17:33,029 Interviewer: When you were putting that your mom had tried to kill herself, 361 00:17:34,001 --> 00:17:35,028 were you upset when you wrote the article? 362 00:17:36,000 --> 00:17:38,003 I had to write an article! 363 00:17:38,005 --> 00:17:41,009 What's going on inside your head and your heart at that age? 364 00:17:41,011 --> 00:17:43,008 Me. 365 00:17:43,010 --> 00:17:45,013 When I finishedThe Flash, 366 00:17:45,015 --> 00:17:47,016 I took it around to Worship's Candy Store 367 00:17:47,018 --> 00:17:50,007 and asked them to put it in the newsstand. 368 00:17:50,009 --> 00:17:53,028 My headline said, "Mother Tried Suicide." 369 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:55,008 Later, I learned that the headline 370 00:17:55,010 --> 00:17:57,010 should've been in the present tense. 371 00:17:57,028 --> 00:18:00,004 "Mother Tries Suicide." 372 00:18:00,006 --> 00:18:03,005 ♪ ♪ 373 00:18:03,007 --> 00:18:05,001 To get here, I had to beat a rough, 374 00:18:05,003 --> 00:18:07,005 bleak, shrinking business. 375 00:18:07,007 --> 00:18:08,029 I started out in Queens County, 376 00:18:09,001 --> 00:18:11,016 where I was born, on theLong Island Press, 377 00:18:11,018 --> 00:18:14,006 as one of the last of the generation with no college, 378 00:18:14,008 --> 00:18:16,027 and who came off the copyboys' bench. 379 00:18:16,029 --> 00:18:18,029 People at desks in the City Room called out, 380 00:18:19,001 --> 00:18:20,027 "Boy! Copyboy!" 381 00:18:20,029 --> 00:18:22,020 Copy! 382 00:18:22,022 --> 00:18:24,011 And a copyboy comes running over. 383 00:18:24,013 --> 00:18:26,011 There is no thing like it today. 384 00:18:26,013 --> 00:18:29,012 City rooms have no sound. 385 00:18:29,014 --> 00:18:31,019 People are sitting at their computers, 386 00:18:31,021 --> 00:18:33,000 and they're sending messages 387 00:18:33,002 --> 00:18:35,007 to people six feet away. 388 00:18:35,009 --> 00:18:37,002 Man: Boy! Take that over there. 389 00:18:37,004 --> 00:18:39,005 Breslin: I was 16, just 16. 390 00:18:39,007 --> 00:18:41,013 It was tough making a living 391 00:18:41,015 --> 00:18:44,001 for being that young in that business. 392 00:18:44,003 --> 00:18:47,007 Eighteen dollars a week was a huge amount of money 393 00:18:47,009 --> 00:18:48,021 from the newspaper. 394 00:18:48,023 --> 00:18:51,023 Eighteen dollars and ten cents, that I remember. 395 00:18:51,025 --> 00:18:56,001 That's one fact outta the whole life that I remember. 396 00:18:56,026 --> 00:19:00,006 I mean, in the early, gritty days of journalism, 397 00:19:00,008 --> 00:19:02,014 you didn't have an Ivy League degree, 398 00:19:02,016 --> 00:19:05,019 and you never made a particularly good salary. 399 00:19:05,021 --> 00:19:09,003 You were much more naturally of the street 400 00:19:09,005 --> 00:19:12,008 than you were when the whole thing 401 00:19:12,010 --> 00:19:14,019 became a profession. 402 00:19:14,021 --> 00:19:16,018 These journalists today 403 00:19:16,020 --> 00:19:19,012 go to best-- the elite colleges. 404 00:19:19,014 --> 00:19:21,021 We went to the not-elite colleges. 405 00:19:22,019 --> 00:19:24,016 Hamill didn't even go to any college at all. 406 00:19:24,018 --> 00:19:26,018 I would say more than half of the guys 407 00:19:26,020 --> 00:19:29,020 I was a reporter with in that time had not gone to college. 408 00:19:29,022 --> 00:19:32,003 What happens when you have 409 00:19:32,005 --> 00:19:34,015 that kind of employee base? 410 00:19:34,017 --> 00:19:37,006 You have connections to the street. 411 00:19:37,008 --> 00:19:39,004 You have cops in your family. 412 00:19:39,006 --> 00:19:42,002 You have guys who work at sanitation. You have all that stuff. 413 00:19:42,004 --> 00:19:45,006 If you're gonna cover a city like Breslin covered it, 414 00:19:45,008 --> 00:19:46,023 you have to have that street sense. 415 00:19:46,025 --> 00:19:49,015 You can go to Oxford four and a half, a thousand years, 416 00:19:49,017 --> 00:19:52,010 you're not gonna come in and cover the street like Jimmy Breslin. 417 00:19:52,012 --> 00:19:53,018 ♪ ♪ 418 00:19:53,020 --> 00:19:56,027 Caldwell: He could understand 419 00:19:56,029 --> 00:19:58,019 the working guy's, 420 00:19:58,021 --> 00:20:01,003 or woman's situation. 421 00:20:01,005 --> 00:20:02,016 (typewriter clacks) 422 00:20:05,004 --> 00:20:07,029 Breslin: One day, Cibella Borges met a photographer 423 00:20:08,001 --> 00:20:10,004 who offered her $150 424 00:20:10,006 --> 00:20:12,013 to pose for pictures that were supposed to give men 425 00:20:12,015 --> 00:20:14,028 the thought of incredible pleasures. 426 00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:17,002 Her photographer spent many months 427 00:20:17,004 --> 00:20:19,006 showing the pictures around town. 428 00:20:19,008 --> 00:20:21,019 Jimmy and Cibella: Finally, he was able to sell them to a magazine 429 00:20:21,021 --> 00:20:23,026 "...called Beaver, which is a publication 430 00:20:23,028 --> 00:20:26,010 read with one hand." (chuckles) 431 00:20:26,012 --> 00:20:28,018 TheBeavereditor had no idea of the name 432 00:20:28,020 --> 00:20:31,008 of the small, Hispanic woman in the pictures. 433 00:20:31,010 --> 00:20:33,005 That was me. 434 00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:36,005 When I came on to the police academy, 435 00:20:36,007 --> 00:20:38,006 I knew I was gonna have a rough time. 436 00:20:38,008 --> 00:20:40,007 Number one, I was a female. 437 00:20:40,009 --> 00:20:44,020 I was a Hispanic, and I was 4 feet 11.5 inches. 438 00:20:44,022 --> 00:20:47,005 I was recruited to work for Public Morals Division, 439 00:20:47,007 --> 00:20:48,027 as an undercover. 440 00:20:48,029 --> 00:20:51,007 And when I went to the 19th Precinct 441 00:20:51,009 --> 00:20:52,029 that day, to report to work, 442 00:20:53,001 --> 00:20:55,014 the administrative lieutenant called me into his office, 443 00:20:55,016 --> 00:20:58,001 went into his drawer, took out the magazine, 444 00:20:58,003 --> 00:20:59,027 and just threw it at me, and said, 445 00:20:59,029 --> 00:21:01,013 "Is this you?" 446 00:21:01,015 --> 00:21:04,025 ♪ ♪ 447 00:21:04,027 --> 00:21:06,022 I said, it's me. 448 00:21:06,024 --> 00:21:08,003 Newsman: Cibella Borges, she's a cop 449 00:21:08,005 --> 00:21:09,021 who posed nude in a girlie magazine, 450 00:21:09,023 --> 00:21:11,022 faced police brass... 451 00:21:11,024 --> 00:21:13,020 Newsman 2: ...posed nude in a men's sex magazine 452 00:21:13,022 --> 00:21:15,002 before she joined the force... 453 00:21:15,004 --> 00:21:17,006 Newsman 3: Ms. Borges is accused of misconduct 454 00:21:17,008 --> 00:21:19,019 and bringing discredit to the police department... 455 00:21:19,021 --> 00:21:21,017 Newsman 4: ...disqualifies her as a member 456 00:21:21,019 --> 00:21:22,016 of the police force. 457 00:21:22,018 --> 00:21:24,013 Pictures in Beaver magazine. 458 00:21:25,004 --> 00:21:27,002 Borges: Before I became a police officer, 459 00:21:27,004 --> 00:21:29,002 a guy approached me and told me that I was beautiful, 460 00:21:29,004 --> 00:21:30,019 and I would've been a perfect model. 461 00:21:30,021 --> 00:21:34,024 The pictures never identify me, just by a name, Nina. 462 00:21:34,026 --> 00:21:36,001 Newsman: Well, as of today, 463 00:21:36,003 --> 00:21:38,000 Ms. Borges is no longer a police officer... 464 00:21:38,002 --> 00:21:39,021 Borges: It just ripped my heart out 465 00:21:39,023 --> 00:21:42,007 because this is the job I love. 466 00:21:42,009 --> 00:21:45,009 -(indistinct chatter) -I hated the news media. 467 00:21:46,007 --> 00:21:48,005 It was like a Salem witch hunt. 468 00:21:48,024 --> 00:21:51,017 Major headlines for weeks. 469 00:21:51,019 --> 00:21:52,028 I kept on telling myself, 470 00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:54,023 I'm not a criminal. 471 00:21:54,025 --> 00:21:57,002 I didn't do anything wrong. 472 00:21:58,011 --> 00:21:59,022 And then Jimmy wrote an article 473 00:21:59,024 --> 00:22:02,006 about what was happening to me. 474 00:22:02,008 --> 00:22:04,017 ♪ ♪ 475 00:22:04,019 --> 00:22:06,029 Breslin: The nasty thought arose that the police union 476 00:22:07,001 --> 00:22:09,012 did not stand up for a member because, 477 00:22:09,014 --> 00:22:12,010 in this case, she was Hispanic and female. 478 00:22:12,012 --> 00:22:15,006 And Cibella Borges has been suspended from her job, 479 00:22:15,008 --> 00:22:17,015 which paid over $400 a week, 480 00:22:17,017 --> 00:22:20,015 the most anyone in her family had ever earned. 481 00:22:23,004 --> 00:22:25,008 Borges: The union that was supposed to be representing me 482 00:22:25,010 --> 00:22:27,015 paid $16,000 for an ad 483 00:22:27,017 --> 00:22:30,003 in theDaily News to attack Jimmy Breslin 484 00:22:30,005 --> 00:22:32,014 because Jimmy Breslin was in my corner. 485 00:22:32,016 --> 00:22:34,027 He was my champion. 486 00:22:34,029 --> 00:22:38,018 Bill Clark: Jimmy was probably not running for PBA president. 487 00:22:39,024 --> 00:22:41,026 Jimmy was left of center, 488 00:22:41,028 --> 00:22:44,015 and cops are always... 489 00:22:44,017 --> 00:22:46,002 (chuckles) right of center, 490 00:22:46,004 --> 00:22:48,020 so when it became any kind of political issue, 491 00:22:48,022 --> 00:22:51,000 Jimmy was always on the opposite side. 492 00:22:51,002 --> 00:22:53,026 And he wasn't gonna back down. 493 00:22:53,028 --> 00:22:55,018 Breslin: The police department should've been 494 00:22:55,020 --> 00:22:57,000 proud of the pictures, 495 00:22:57,002 --> 00:22:58,022 as they proved that at least one member of the force 496 00:22:58,024 --> 00:23:01,007 is in marvelous physical condition. 497 00:23:01,009 --> 00:23:03,024 Most officers are in such deplorable shape... 498 00:23:03,026 --> 00:23:06,000 Breslin and Borges: ...that if called upon to pose for pictures, 499 00:23:06,002 --> 00:23:09,010 "they would put on overcoats." (chuckles) 500 00:23:09,012 --> 00:23:10,026 ♪ ♪ 501 00:23:10,028 --> 00:23:14,016 Borges: I was so happy that there was somebody out there, 502 00:23:14,018 --> 00:23:17,002 backing me up because nobody else was doing it. 503 00:23:18,009 --> 00:23:20,021 I was reinstated by the Appellate Division 504 00:23:20,023 --> 00:23:23,025 of the Supreme Court in April of 1985. 505 00:23:23,027 --> 00:23:26,022 Man: Detective Cibella R. Borges. 506 00:23:26,024 --> 00:23:29,025 (applause) 507 00:23:32,010 --> 00:23:34,000 -Man: Two... -(shutter clicks) 508 00:23:34,002 --> 00:23:35,001 That's great. 509 00:23:35,003 --> 00:23:36,029 (smooches) 510 00:23:37,001 --> 00:23:39,003 Take care, and thank you for everything you did. 511 00:23:39,005 --> 00:23:41,021 Oh, shut up. Good. God bless you. 512 00:23:43,019 --> 00:23:45,000 All over the country, 513 00:23:45,002 --> 00:23:47,012 even in little bitty cities and towns, 514 00:23:47,014 --> 00:23:49,012 there were people trying to be a Breslin, 515 00:23:49,014 --> 00:23:50,029 trying to get that kind of writing 516 00:23:51,001 --> 00:23:53,000 about their community out. 517 00:23:53,002 --> 00:23:54,018 Esposito: You have Mike Barnicle 518 00:23:54,020 --> 00:23:56,005 up in Boston. 519 00:23:56,007 --> 00:23:58,010 Mike Royko in Chicago. 520 00:23:58,012 --> 00:24:00,024 These people were anchored in a place and time, 521 00:24:00,026 --> 00:24:03,026 and they told stories to their audience. 522 00:24:04,023 --> 00:24:07,013 Collins: They brought a sense of urgency 523 00:24:07,015 --> 00:24:09,029 about local reporting, in an attempt 524 00:24:10,001 --> 00:24:13,001 to make local stories not only important, 525 00:24:13,003 --> 00:24:15,023 but incredibly, wildly readable. 526 00:24:15,025 --> 00:24:17,023 Interviewer: What happens if communities 527 00:24:17,025 --> 00:24:19,021 don't really have good local journalism? 528 00:24:19,023 --> 00:24:21,004 Well, it's bad. I'll tell you what happens 529 00:24:21,006 --> 00:24:23,012 is the crooks get away with what they wanna get away with. 530 00:24:23,014 --> 00:24:26,022 I mean, you know, it's not at the federal government, 531 00:24:26,024 --> 00:24:29,027 is my view, that your pocket gets picked. 532 00:24:29,029 --> 00:24:32,024 It's in statehouse, and it's the city hall. 533 00:24:32,026 --> 00:24:34,024 You know, the New York Times used to cover local news, 534 00:24:34,026 --> 00:24:37,000 it no longer does. I mean, nothing. 535 00:24:37,002 --> 00:24:39,019 Even if you go on the web page of the Daily News, 536 00:24:39,021 --> 00:24:41,027 it starts with the fact that somebody in Australia 537 00:24:41,029 --> 00:24:43,022 ate their baby or something like that. 538 00:24:43,024 --> 00:24:47,013 The complete obliteration of statehouse coverage 539 00:24:47,015 --> 00:24:49,014 and coverage at the local level... 540 00:24:49,016 --> 00:24:51,028 I mean, if you're gonna be upset about something, 541 00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:55,023 focus on that because that affects you directly, 542 00:24:55,025 --> 00:24:57,028 every single day. 543 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:01,002 -(horns honking) -(sirens wailing) 544 00:25:06,003 --> 00:25:09,010 Hamill: This is 75 West Street. 545 00:25:09,012 --> 00:25:13,010 It was then the home of the New York Post. 546 00:25:13,012 --> 00:25:15,000 I had more laughs 547 00:25:15,002 --> 00:25:18,000 and more joy in this building 548 00:25:18,002 --> 00:25:21,004 than almost any other place I ever worked. 549 00:25:21,006 --> 00:25:24,009 ♪ ♪ 550 00:25:24,011 --> 00:25:25,022 (typewriter clacks) 551 00:25:28,007 --> 00:25:30,027 I had been writing letters to thePosteditor, 552 00:25:30,029 --> 00:25:33,028 and he was publishing these letters every once in a while. 553 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:35,022 And finally he sent me a letter back saying, 554 00:25:35,024 --> 00:25:38,017 have you ever thought about becoming a newspaperman? 555 00:25:38,019 --> 00:25:40,029 If so, give me a call. 556 00:25:41,001 --> 00:25:42,007 Kosner: And he walks in and he says, 557 00:25:42,009 --> 00:25:44,018 "I'm Pete Hamill and I have a tryout." 558 00:25:44,020 --> 00:25:48,002 And lo and behold, his very first story 559 00:25:48,004 --> 00:25:49,013 ran right in the front of the paper, 560 00:25:49,015 --> 00:25:52,001 and that was the beginning of his career. 561 00:25:52,026 --> 00:25:55,006 Hamill: Newspaper people were flamboyant, 562 00:25:55,008 --> 00:25:57,021 hard-drinking, bohemian anarchists 563 00:25:57,023 --> 00:26:00,011 with great gifts for obscenity. 564 00:26:00,013 --> 00:26:02,013 I loved being in their company 565 00:26:02,015 --> 00:26:04,004 in city rooms, 566 00:26:04,006 --> 00:26:05,009 at murder scenes, 567 00:26:05,011 --> 00:26:08,020 or standing at the bar after work. 568 00:26:08,022 --> 00:26:10,013 Kosner: TheNew York Post nightside, 569 00:26:10,015 --> 00:26:12,003 it was like Devil's Island. 570 00:26:12,005 --> 00:26:13,020 The night city editor was 571 00:26:13,022 --> 00:26:16,008 the former managing editor of the Daily Worker. 572 00:26:16,010 --> 00:26:18,019 There were drunks, 573 00:26:18,021 --> 00:26:21,009 and screenwriters, and poets. 574 00:26:21,011 --> 00:26:22,028 Everyone was strange. 575 00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:25,001 There was one guy who was an opera singer, 576 00:26:25,003 --> 00:26:26,023 who wanted to be a newspaperman. 577 00:26:26,025 --> 00:26:28,010 So he would sing... ♪ Oh! ♪ 578 00:26:28,012 --> 00:26:29,016 -...and he would type. -(laughter) 579 00:26:29,018 --> 00:26:31,013 You know... ♪ Oh! ♪ ...and type. 580 00:26:31,015 --> 00:26:33,016 (typewriter clacking) 581 00:26:36,006 --> 00:26:38,007 (train clattering) 582 00:26:40,017 --> 00:26:43,001 Hamill: I grew up in a blue-collar neighborhood 583 00:26:43,003 --> 00:26:45,008 in Brooklyn in the 1940s and '50s. 584 00:26:45,010 --> 00:26:47,027 And I was the oldest of seven kids. 585 00:26:47,029 --> 00:26:49,024 ♪ ♪ 586 00:26:49,026 --> 00:26:51,022 We didn't think of ourselves as poor. 587 00:26:51,024 --> 00:26:53,017 And we lived in a place 588 00:26:53,019 --> 00:26:55,020 that was cold water. 589 00:26:55,022 --> 00:26:56,025 There was no heat. 590 00:26:56,027 --> 00:26:58,016 (kids laughing) 591 00:26:58,018 --> 00:27:00,020 ♪ ♪ 592 00:27:00,022 --> 00:27:04,011 Kathy: Our neighborhood was like a small town 593 00:27:04,013 --> 00:27:06,026 because everyone knew everybody else, 594 00:27:06,028 --> 00:27:08,026 and everyone knew one of my brothers. 595 00:27:08,028 --> 00:27:11,013 Hamill: We were poor, but we weren't impoverished 596 00:27:11,015 --> 00:27:15,003 'cause four blocks away was a public library. 597 00:27:15,005 --> 00:27:16,021 They had a sign outside, 598 00:27:16,023 --> 00:27:18,023 chiseled into the wall. It said, 599 00:27:18,025 --> 00:27:23,018 "Here are enshrined the longings of great hearts." 600 00:27:23,020 --> 00:27:26,029 And I'd be 12 or 13, walking around saying, 601 00:27:27,001 --> 00:27:30,002 maybe I could be a great heart some day. 602 00:27:31,018 --> 00:27:34,004 ♪ ♪ 603 00:27:34,006 --> 00:27:36,006 (recording playing) 604 00:27:50,011 --> 00:27:54,005 Kathy: My mother was a really gentle kind of a person. 605 00:27:54,007 --> 00:27:57,008 Everything we are, we can owe to our mother. 606 00:27:57,010 --> 00:28:00,000 Hamill: I remember when the atom bomb dropped, 607 00:28:00,002 --> 00:28:02,020 and we were running around all excited, 608 00:28:02,022 --> 00:28:04,009 "We got a secret weapon!" 609 00:28:05,001 --> 00:28:07,001 And I remember my mother saying, 610 00:28:07,003 --> 00:28:08,018 "Don't do that. 611 00:28:08,020 --> 00:28:10,029 "Pray for those poor Japanese. 612 00:28:11,001 --> 00:28:13,006 "They didn't start the war. 613 00:28:13,008 --> 00:28:16,004 "It was the guys with the fancy uniforms 614 00:28:16,006 --> 00:28:18,004 "and everything who started the war. 615 00:28:18,006 --> 00:28:19,025 They're just like us." 616 00:28:19,027 --> 00:28:21,022 Denis: She was a Catholic, a devout Catholic. 617 00:28:21,024 --> 00:28:24,009 But better than that, she was a real Christian. 618 00:28:24,011 --> 00:28:27,006 -She hated bigotry, in any shape or form. -Kathy: Yeah. 619 00:28:27,008 --> 00:28:29,024 She was an early, early supporter of Martin Luther King. 620 00:28:30,016 --> 00:28:33,006 You were not allowed to use any racist terms in our family. 621 00:28:33,008 --> 00:28:34,029 -You got hit with a wet dish rag. -Kathy: Yeah. 622 00:28:35,001 --> 00:28:37,018 Poverty was not a sin. It wasn't something to be condemned. 623 00:28:37,020 --> 00:28:39,017 It was something to be fought. 624 00:28:40,007 --> 00:28:41,009 (typewriter clacks) 625 00:28:41,011 --> 00:28:44,012 ♪ ♪ 626 00:28:45,002 --> 00:28:48,019 Hamill: There had been no heat at 165 Eldridge 627 00:28:48,021 --> 00:28:50,022 for more than a year. 628 00:28:50,024 --> 00:28:52,013 The kitchen bathtub was filled 629 00:28:52,015 --> 00:28:55,020 with a solid block of dirty yellow ice. 630 00:28:55,022 --> 00:28:58,025 But the inspectors come around, and fill out their forms, 631 00:28:58,027 --> 00:29:01,014 and go away, and nothing happens. 632 00:29:01,016 --> 00:29:03,027 It just stays this way. 633 00:29:03,029 --> 00:29:06,017 Maybe that is the story of the city, 634 00:29:06,019 --> 00:29:09,016 or at the least, the story of the poor: 635 00:29:10,010 --> 00:29:12,017 it just stays this way. 636 00:29:14,028 --> 00:29:16,008 Kathy: He was an ordinary kid, 637 00:29:16,010 --> 00:29:18,006 but he had an extraordinary brain. 638 00:29:19,008 --> 00:29:22,014 He was always looking for the next adventure. 639 00:29:23,010 --> 00:29:25,022 He couldn't wait to get out and actually 640 00:29:25,024 --> 00:29:27,007 experience life. 641 00:29:27,025 --> 00:29:30,007 (recording playing) 642 00:29:34,025 --> 00:29:37,005 Hamill: I had dropped out of high school, 643 00:29:37,007 --> 00:29:39,007 breaking my mother's heart, 644 00:29:39,009 --> 00:29:42,028 and I found this apartment for eight dollars a week. (chuckles) 645 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:44,027 I wanted to be a painter. 646 00:29:44,029 --> 00:29:47,028 I originally wanted to draw comics, 647 00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:50,000 and went to Mexico, 648 00:29:50,002 --> 00:29:53,018 and there I failed out of painting into writing. 649 00:29:53,020 --> 00:29:55,010 By the time I came back, 650 00:29:55,012 --> 00:29:57,009 I was a writer rather than a painter. 651 00:29:58,014 --> 00:30:01,012 I knew nothing. I never went to journalism school, 652 00:30:01,014 --> 00:30:04,026 or anything like that, but you didn't have to in those days. 653 00:30:04,028 --> 00:30:07,005 You needed editors who took a chance 654 00:30:07,007 --> 00:30:10,013 in what they saw as some kind of talent. 655 00:30:10,015 --> 00:30:12,025 'Cause it's a craft, it's teachable. 656 00:30:12,027 --> 00:30:16,013 ♪ ♪ 657 00:30:16,015 --> 00:30:19,000 Breslin: I once went to the racetrack 658 00:30:19,002 --> 00:30:20,021 with one of the sportswriters, 659 00:30:20,023 --> 00:30:22,021 and I saw they had a big cooler of beer, 660 00:30:22,023 --> 00:30:24,029 and all you had to do was reach in, in the press box, 661 00:30:25,001 --> 00:30:27,017 -and you had a free beer. -(laughter) 662 00:30:27,019 --> 00:30:30,024 -So, I sat there that day and I had, like, 50 of them. -(laughter) 663 00:30:30,026 --> 00:30:34,013 And I said, "Jeez, I'm gonna be a sportswriter for sure." 664 00:30:35,026 --> 00:30:38,014 1951, I covered a baseball game, 665 00:30:38,016 --> 00:30:40,022 the Giants against the Dodgers. 666 00:30:40,024 --> 00:30:42,002 The pictures came 667 00:30:42,004 --> 00:30:44,020 by carrier pigeons from the baseball field. 668 00:30:44,022 --> 00:30:47,020 They'd strapped the film, after they took it, 669 00:30:47,022 --> 00:30:49,006 onto the homing pigeon, 670 00:30:49,008 --> 00:30:50,012 and threw them up in the air. 671 00:30:50,014 --> 00:30:51,027 They circle around home plate, 672 00:30:51,029 --> 00:30:53,013 while the umpire and everybody ducked. 673 00:30:53,015 --> 00:30:55,009 And then they went up in the sky, 674 00:30:55,011 --> 00:30:58,000 and they flew to theJournal-American, theHerald Tribune, 675 00:30:58,002 --> 00:31:01,003 all these newspapers, and theLong Island Press. 676 00:31:04,011 --> 00:31:06,029 -(flashbulb pops) -(crowd cheering) 677 00:31:07,001 --> 00:31:08,017 (bell ringing) 678 00:31:11,012 --> 00:31:13,029 Dan Barry: He will tell you, "Go to the losers' locker room. 679 00:31:14,001 --> 00:31:17,003 The person you don't remember, that's where the story is." 680 00:31:17,005 --> 00:31:19,000 Breslin: The losers' dressing room, 681 00:31:19,002 --> 00:31:21,014 or the loser always was the best story 682 00:31:21,016 --> 00:31:24,013 'cause there's nobody there in the language biz. The best. 683 00:31:24,015 --> 00:31:27,002 Then he hauls off and writes the funniest freaking 684 00:31:27,004 --> 00:31:30,013 baseball book that anybody's ever written in the history of the world. 685 00:31:30,015 --> 00:31:32,015 I mean,Can't Anybody Here Play This Game?, 686 00:31:32,017 --> 00:31:34,021 you could pick it up today and read it like a novel 687 00:31:34,023 --> 00:31:36,000 and laugh your ass off. 688 00:31:36,002 --> 00:31:37,024 Barry: Breslin is drawn to the New York Mets 689 00:31:37,026 --> 00:31:40,002 because they sucked so bad. 690 00:31:40,004 --> 00:31:42,019 They're horrible, okay? They're horrible. 691 00:31:42,021 --> 00:31:44,018 Esposito: Jock Whitney, 692 00:31:44,020 --> 00:31:46,024 who is the publisher of theHerald Tribune, 693 00:31:46,026 --> 00:31:48,016 his sister owns the Mets. 694 00:31:48,018 --> 00:31:50,028 And the book led Whitney 695 00:31:51,000 --> 00:31:53,028 to want Jimmy to come to work at the Herald Tribune. 696 00:31:54,000 --> 00:31:55,002 -(typewriter clacks) -(chatter) 697 00:31:55,004 --> 00:31:56,018 His writing his fresh, 698 00:31:56,020 --> 00:31:58,017 his writing is concise, 699 00:31:58,019 --> 00:32:01,000 and his writing cuts to the heart of a matter 700 00:32:01,002 --> 00:32:03,003 very colloquially. 701 00:32:03,005 --> 00:32:05,019 TheHerald Tribunewas none of those things. 702 00:32:05,021 --> 00:32:07,017 It was a dull newspaper. 703 00:32:07,019 --> 00:32:09,004 The New York Times just overwhelmed us, 704 00:32:09,006 --> 00:32:11,010 so the Tribhad to stay in business somehow. 705 00:32:11,012 --> 00:32:12,027 It became a writer's newspaper. 706 00:32:12,029 --> 00:32:15,002 It became kind of, almost avant-garde. 707 00:32:15,004 --> 00:32:17,005 So, Jimmy Breslin was the star columnist, 708 00:32:17,007 --> 00:32:19,002 and Tom Wolfe was the star writer. 709 00:32:19,004 --> 00:32:21,017 Wolfe: The editor would come right over to your desk and says, 710 00:32:21,019 --> 00:32:23,009 "pour it on! Don't worry about length." 711 00:32:23,011 --> 00:32:25,008 'Cause I was always saying, how long should this be? 712 00:32:25,010 --> 00:32:27,001 And he'd look at me incredulously and say, 713 00:32:27,003 --> 00:32:28,009 "Until it's boring!" 714 00:32:29,006 --> 00:32:31,023 Talese: Breslin introduced what became known as, 715 00:32:31,025 --> 00:32:33,015 the New Journalism, 716 00:32:33,017 --> 00:32:37,008 using the specific techniques of fiction, 717 00:32:37,010 --> 00:32:39,018 but sticking to the facts. 718 00:32:39,020 --> 00:32:42,011 He tried to be a storyteller, 719 00:32:42,013 --> 00:32:44,022 but to tell a story that's also true. 720 00:32:44,024 --> 00:32:46,025 Breslin: And they were walking around looking at me 721 00:32:46,027 --> 00:32:49,008 as if I was doing something new and I was a genius. 722 00:32:49,010 --> 00:32:51,003 It was all sports page stuff. 723 00:32:51,005 --> 00:32:54,015 The columns they had in newspapers before that 724 00:32:54,017 --> 00:32:56,029 consisted of somebody like Arthur Krock. 725 00:32:57,001 --> 00:32:59,024 You know, big name from the past. You ever read him? 726 00:32:59,026 --> 00:33:01,026 You wanna freaking die. 727 00:33:01,028 --> 00:33:03,017 (laughter) 728 00:33:03,019 --> 00:33:06,002 Hamill: Before I ever had a column, 729 00:33:06,004 --> 00:33:07,025 Breslin had a column. 730 00:33:07,027 --> 00:33:10,012 It was not the Alsop brothers, 731 00:33:10,014 --> 00:33:12,016 or the guy who read theWashington Post 732 00:33:12,018 --> 00:33:14,000 and wrote a column. 733 00:33:14,002 --> 00:33:17,000 It was going out, get outta the building, 734 00:33:17,002 --> 00:33:18,026 get outta the house. 735 00:33:18,028 --> 00:33:20,027 ♪ ♪ 736 00:33:20,029 --> 00:33:23,003 That was like a revolution. 737 00:33:24,002 --> 00:33:27,008 Bob Costas: How would you define yourself as a journalist? 738 00:33:27,010 --> 00:33:28,028 Breslin: Reporter, not a journalist. 739 00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:30,012 I don't know what those words mean. 740 00:33:30,014 --> 00:33:31,029 That's a college word. 741 00:33:32,001 --> 00:33:34,023 I just go out and report. Wanna chase news. 742 00:33:34,025 --> 00:33:37,008 That's the keyword: chase, chase, chase, chase. 743 00:33:37,010 --> 00:33:39,021 And in the chasing, you always ran into something. 744 00:33:39,023 --> 00:33:42,008 ♪ ♪ 745 00:33:46,020 --> 00:33:48,015 Hamill: Jimmy had opinions 746 00:33:48,017 --> 00:33:50,013 because he was a columnist, 747 00:33:50,015 --> 00:33:53,020 but the opinions were all based on reporting. 748 00:33:53,022 --> 00:33:56,013 Knowledge that you can get only 749 00:33:56,015 --> 00:33:58,023 from talking to ordinary people, 750 00:33:58,025 --> 00:34:00,001 one at a time. 751 00:34:00,003 --> 00:34:02,025 ♪ ♪ 752 00:34:02,027 --> 00:34:05,016 He knew about worlds I didn't know about, 753 00:34:05,018 --> 00:34:08,019 and made me feel like I understood them. 754 00:34:10,001 --> 00:34:12,010 Collins: If something bad happened to somebody, 755 00:34:12,012 --> 00:34:15,009 man, woman, young, old, black, white, 756 00:34:15,011 --> 00:34:18,018 Jimmy was so there, and he was literally there. 757 00:34:18,020 --> 00:34:20,028 He would go there to their place. 758 00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:23,011 Carillo: You hope the dog doesn't bite you. 759 00:34:23,013 --> 00:34:25,004 You sit down there. You accept the drink 760 00:34:25,006 --> 00:34:27,018 from a glass that may or not be clean. 761 00:34:27,020 --> 00:34:28,016 You're part of it. 762 00:34:28,018 --> 00:34:29,020 Breslin: Because you're dead 763 00:34:29,022 --> 00:34:31,014 with stories done by the phone. 764 00:34:31,016 --> 00:34:33,004 You're not gonna hold my interest. 765 00:34:33,006 --> 00:34:35,025 There has to be some chemistry in a story, 766 00:34:35,027 --> 00:34:37,027 and that has to come from the reporter 767 00:34:37,029 --> 00:34:39,022 talking to the person involved, 768 00:34:39,024 --> 00:34:43,008 face-to-face, getting those little odd facts 769 00:34:43,010 --> 00:34:45,013 that really make a story. 770 00:34:45,015 --> 00:34:47,003 Wald: The beginning columns, 771 00:34:47,005 --> 00:34:49,020 the people Jimmy was talking to 772 00:34:49,022 --> 00:34:52,007 were people you could recognize as New Yorkers. 773 00:34:52,009 --> 00:34:54,002 Tony Bennett: I used to be a singing waiter in Astoria 774 00:34:54,004 --> 00:34:55,004 when I was a kid. 775 00:34:55,006 --> 00:34:57,005 I used to wait on tables and take requests. 776 00:34:57,007 --> 00:35:00,019 And he would be going from bar to bar underneath the L trains. 777 00:35:00,021 --> 00:35:02,009 Esposito: He had this place in Queens, 778 00:35:02,011 --> 00:35:03,017 Pep McGuire's Bar, 779 00:35:03,019 --> 00:35:05,017 and that's the place where he held court, 780 00:35:05,019 --> 00:35:07,006 and that's the place where 781 00:35:07,008 --> 00:35:09,020 these characters would congregate. 782 00:35:09,022 --> 00:35:11,019 Jim Hennessey: Pep McGuire's was the center. 783 00:35:11,021 --> 00:35:13,025 There was judges there sometimes, 784 00:35:13,027 --> 00:35:15,016 and there was wise guys there. 785 00:35:15,018 --> 00:35:17,004 It was a colorful place. 786 00:35:17,006 --> 00:35:18,009 Daly: I mean, it's not for nothing 787 00:35:18,011 --> 00:35:20,002 Jimmy wrote a biography of Damon Runyon. 788 00:35:20,015 --> 00:35:22,005 But these are like people who, 789 00:35:22,007 --> 00:35:23,019 it isn't like they were on Broadway. 790 00:35:24,003 --> 00:35:25,019 They were out living their lives in Queens. 791 00:35:25,021 --> 00:35:27,008 Sam Roberts: Queens Boulevard was his 792 00:35:27,010 --> 00:35:29,016 boulevard of broken dreams. 793 00:35:29,018 --> 00:35:31,022 This is where he found his characters. 794 00:35:31,024 --> 00:35:34,013 Fat Thomas, Marvin the Torch, Klein the Lawyer. 795 00:35:34,015 --> 00:35:37,011 They were like some kind of dreamscape of 796 00:35:37,013 --> 00:35:39,023 what it would be like if you lived 797 00:35:39,025 --> 00:35:42,014 in the richest, craziest movie on Earth. 798 00:35:42,016 --> 00:35:44,026 -(alarm ringing) -There was a guy who professionally burned down 799 00:35:44,028 --> 00:35:47,012 any house that ceased to be valuable to its owner, 800 00:35:47,014 --> 00:35:49,013 and you could hire him, his name was Marvin. 801 00:35:49,015 --> 00:35:51,009 Breslin: Two weeks later on a dark night, 802 00:35:51,011 --> 00:35:54,011 Marvin the Torch arrived at the restaurant with his team. 803 00:35:54,013 --> 00:35:56,020 Now, arson is a three-man job. 804 00:35:56,022 --> 00:35:59,008 Two men pour, then one of his pourers comes out 805 00:35:59,010 --> 00:36:01,002 and becomes the blanket man. 806 00:36:01,004 --> 00:36:03,005 He holds an old car blanket and throws it over 807 00:36:03,007 --> 00:36:05,026 anyone coming out whose clothes are on fire. 808 00:36:05,028 --> 00:36:07,029 Marvin the Torch is my favorite. I mean, we used to get 809 00:36:08,001 --> 00:36:11,014 fire helmets for Christmas every year. "MT Torch 1." 810 00:36:11,016 --> 00:36:13,012 We were introduced to 811 00:36:13,014 --> 00:36:15,004 all kinds of felonious people 812 00:36:15,006 --> 00:36:16,011 when we were very, very young. 813 00:36:16,013 --> 00:36:18,003 Fat Thomas, you know, 814 00:36:18,005 --> 00:36:19,025 he was my babysitter a whole bunch of times. 815 00:36:19,027 --> 00:36:21,012 Daly: He was a bookmaker. 816 00:36:21,014 --> 00:36:23,025 His brother was in jail for robbery. 817 00:36:23,027 --> 00:36:25,001 During the Civil Rights Era, 818 00:36:25,003 --> 00:36:26,000 he went down to hotels 819 00:36:26,002 --> 00:36:28,010 and registered as Martin Luther Fat. 820 00:36:28,012 --> 00:36:31,007 Rembrandt was another guy. He was an art thief. 821 00:36:31,009 --> 00:36:33,007 Melvin Lebetkin was Klein the Lawyer, 822 00:36:33,009 --> 00:36:34,020 who he really had a ball with. 823 00:36:34,022 --> 00:36:37,023 Mel was a criminal attorney on Queens Boulevard. 824 00:36:37,025 --> 00:36:40,007 These were all real people. They were real. 825 00:36:40,009 --> 00:36:43,010 Many of Jimmy's characters were at least half Jimmy. 826 00:36:43,012 --> 00:36:45,011 They never complained because he made them look 827 00:36:45,013 --> 00:36:47,007 wonderful and colorful and wise. 828 00:36:47,009 --> 00:36:48,021 But on the street, 829 00:36:48,023 --> 00:36:51,000 when I worked for UPI, it was the saying that, 830 00:36:51,002 --> 00:36:53,026 if a guy jumps out of the 33rd story window, 831 00:36:53,028 --> 00:36:55,011 Breslin's the only person who'll tell you 832 00:36:55,013 --> 00:36:56,028 what he was thinking on the way down. 833 00:36:57,000 --> 00:36:58,002 Daly: Somebody at theTimes 834 00:36:58,004 --> 00:36:59,020 started saying this stuff isn't real. 835 00:36:59,022 --> 00:37:02,010 You know, there's no Marvin the Torch, Fat Thomas. 836 00:37:02,012 --> 00:37:04,027 Jimmy took him out to Pep McGuire's Bar, 837 00:37:04,029 --> 00:37:06,010 and there they all were. 838 00:37:06,012 --> 00:37:08,013 There's Fat Thomas, there's Marvin the Torch. 839 00:37:08,015 --> 00:37:09,018 You know, they're all there. 840 00:37:09,020 --> 00:37:10,025 ♪ ♪ 841 00:37:10,027 --> 00:37:12,014 David Frost: Summarize for us, if you could, 842 00:37:12,016 --> 00:37:15,014 what the gang that couldn't shoot straight were like. 843 00:37:15,016 --> 00:37:17,009 Breslin: Inept criminals, which is 844 00:37:17,011 --> 00:37:19,018 the worst charge of all you can level at people. 845 00:37:19,020 --> 00:37:22,019 They're not as smart as everyone says they are, simply. 846 00:37:22,021 --> 00:37:24,023 They can be buffoons. 847 00:37:25,025 --> 00:37:28,026 Robert De Niro: I read for the movieThe Gang That Couldn't Shoot Straight 848 00:37:28,028 --> 00:37:30,024 for Irwin Winkler and Bob Chartoff, 849 00:37:30,026 --> 00:37:32,019 and somehow I got cast. 850 00:37:32,021 --> 00:37:35,006 (speaking Latin) Amen! 851 00:37:35,008 --> 00:37:37,023 De Niro: I read the book. I loved the book. 852 00:37:37,025 --> 00:37:39,016 I liked the sense of humor. 853 00:37:39,018 --> 00:37:41,024 It had that New York kind of, 854 00:37:41,026 --> 00:37:44,009 Italian neighborhood sort of humor. 855 00:37:44,011 --> 00:37:46,009 Go starta the car. 856 00:37:46,011 --> 00:37:47,025 Breslin: So one guy I know, 857 00:37:47,027 --> 00:37:50,014 when he goes in the morning to start the day, 858 00:37:50,016 --> 00:37:52,006 his wife, they have breakfast, 859 00:37:52,008 --> 00:37:53,024 and then she goes out in the driveway, 860 00:37:53,026 --> 00:37:55,021 and she gets in the car to start it, 861 00:37:55,023 --> 00:37:58,001 and he sits down on the floor of the kitchen, he's like this. 862 00:37:58,003 --> 00:38:00,011 (laughter) 863 00:38:00,013 --> 00:38:02,002 (engine starts) 864 00:38:03,024 --> 00:38:05,002 If there's no explosion 865 00:38:05,004 --> 00:38:07,008 when his wife starts the car, 866 00:38:07,010 --> 00:38:08,019 he comes out and kisses her on the head, 867 00:38:08,021 --> 00:38:10,027 and says thank you, and gets in and drives away. 868 00:38:12,012 --> 00:38:14,007 Oh, he knew everybody. He knew a lot of guys. 869 00:38:14,009 --> 00:38:15,023 He certainly hung out with 870 00:38:15,025 --> 00:38:18,006 certified bad guys 871 00:38:18,008 --> 00:38:19,027 who the cops were looking for. 872 00:38:21,005 --> 00:38:23,021 (John Gotti speaking) 873 00:38:36,013 --> 00:38:37,014 Costas: You, like Runyon, 874 00:38:37,016 --> 00:38:39,010 have always found something fascinating 875 00:38:39,012 --> 00:38:41,028 about these guys who live on either side of the fence. 876 00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:44,018 Oh, I like bad boys. Legitimate people are boring. 877 00:38:44,020 --> 00:38:46,017 They're terrible, I mean... 878 00:38:46,019 --> 00:38:47,024 That's the worst sentence of all, 879 00:38:47,026 --> 00:38:49,016 to spend the night with legitimate people. 880 00:38:49,018 --> 00:38:52,022 ♪ ♪ 881 00:38:52,024 --> 00:38:54,008 (typewriter clacks) 882 00:38:54,010 --> 00:38:56,016 Newsman: This is what we have on a flash basis 883 00:38:56,018 --> 00:38:58,013 from the Associated Press. 884 00:38:58,015 --> 00:39:01,021 Two priests in Dallas who were with President Kennedy 885 00:39:01,023 --> 00:39:03,025 say he is dead of bullet wounds. 886 00:39:03,027 --> 00:39:05,005 There is no further confirmation... 887 00:39:05,007 --> 00:39:08,020 Breslin: I went to Dallas on November 22nd, 1963, 888 00:39:08,022 --> 00:39:10,013 when Kennedy was shot, 889 00:39:10,015 --> 00:39:13,013 and I thought that every minute of every hour I ever had worked 890 00:39:13,015 --> 00:39:15,022 had prepared me for writing about this. 891 00:39:16,016 --> 00:39:18,020 This is a marvelous emotion for you to have 892 00:39:18,022 --> 00:39:21,011 when a guy with a wife and two children gets shot. 893 00:39:22,016 --> 00:39:24,017 That is called news reporting. 894 00:39:26,017 --> 00:39:28,007 Pileggi: You know, you have the press conference, 895 00:39:28,009 --> 00:39:30,012 and everybody gets the same information. 896 00:39:30,014 --> 00:39:32,009 So, you all go off and you write it differently, 897 00:39:32,011 --> 00:39:34,017 but it's the same pool of information. 898 00:39:34,019 --> 00:39:37,007 Harvey Araton: Most journalists would've said, 899 00:39:37,009 --> 00:39:39,025 Fine, I have enough. I have an incredible deadline. 900 00:39:39,027 --> 00:39:41,018 But this was the essence of Breslin. 901 00:39:41,020 --> 00:39:43,006 Breslin said, no, I don't have enough. 902 00:39:43,008 --> 00:39:45,000 I want more. I want more than every other person, 903 00:39:45,002 --> 00:39:47,016 every other journalist who's in this room right now. 904 00:39:47,018 --> 00:39:50,009 And so, he pursued Malcolm Perry, 905 00:39:50,011 --> 00:39:51,025 and he got an interview with him 906 00:39:51,027 --> 00:39:53,010 where he found out everything 907 00:39:53,012 --> 00:39:56,011 down to what the guy was eating for lunch when the call came 908 00:39:56,013 --> 00:39:58,003 that Friday afternoon. 909 00:39:58,005 --> 00:40:00,021 John Avlon: He opens up with the doctor 910 00:40:00,023 --> 00:40:03,002 who gets called to see if he can save 911 00:40:03,004 --> 00:40:05,002 the president's life, and... 912 00:40:05,004 --> 00:40:07,002 Jackie Kennedy is standing there, 913 00:40:07,004 --> 00:40:09,019 and you're in the room, and he's telling their stories. 914 00:40:09,021 --> 00:40:12,008 ♪ ♪ 915 00:40:12,010 --> 00:40:15,004 (Breslin speaking) 916 00:40:23,001 --> 00:40:25,007 (Breslin continues) 917 00:40:51,019 --> 00:40:53,005 Lupica: "A Death in Emergency Room One" 918 00:40:53,007 --> 00:40:54,025 just blew the doors off of 919 00:40:54,027 --> 00:40:57,006 however people had covered stories like this, 920 00:40:57,008 --> 00:40:59,009 from the beginning of time in newspapers. 921 00:41:01,017 --> 00:41:03,013 What you were basically doing 922 00:41:03,015 --> 00:41:06,006 is using the tools of a novelist 923 00:41:06,008 --> 00:41:07,011 to tell a news story. 924 00:41:08,015 --> 00:41:10,000 (typewriter clacks) 925 00:41:10,002 --> 00:41:12,000 ♪ ♪ 926 00:41:12,002 --> 00:41:15,003 Breslin: I came to the White House for the day of the funeral, 927 00:41:15,005 --> 00:41:18,012 and there were 3,000 reporters there. 928 00:41:18,014 --> 00:41:20,018 I can't make a living here. 929 00:41:20,020 --> 00:41:23,018 Everybody's gonna have the same thing. 930 00:41:23,020 --> 00:41:26,015 So, where does he go? He goes to the cemetery. 931 00:41:26,017 --> 00:41:28,021 He finds the poor bastard 932 00:41:28,023 --> 00:41:30,011 who has to dig the grave. 933 00:41:30,013 --> 00:41:33,018 A working man, a black man, 934 00:41:33,020 --> 00:41:34,025 digging a grave 935 00:41:34,027 --> 00:41:37,027 for the assassinated President of the United States. 936 00:41:37,029 --> 00:41:41,007 And in the midst of what we're witnessing on television, 937 00:41:41,009 --> 00:41:44,021 a parade filled with heads of state following a casket 938 00:41:44,023 --> 00:41:47,021 borne on a caisson and horses driving the casket, 939 00:41:47,023 --> 00:41:49,019 you have this piece, 940 00:41:49,021 --> 00:41:53,012 and it appears when the country cries together. 941 00:41:55,010 --> 00:41:57,026 The whole country cries together. 942 00:41:58,029 --> 00:42:00,019 Breslin: Clifton Pollard was pretty sure 943 00:42:00,021 --> 00:42:02,023 he was gonna be working on Sunday. 944 00:42:02,025 --> 00:42:04,010 So, when he woke up at 9 a.m. 945 00:42:04,012 --> 00:42:07,001 in his three-room apartment on Corcoran Street, 946 00:42:07,003 --> 00:42:09,000 he put on khaki overalls 947 00:42:09,002 --> 00:42:11,025 before going into the kitchen for breakfast. 948 00:42:11,027 --> 00:42:13,009 His wife, Nettie, 949 00:42:13,011 --> 00:42:15,011 made bacon and eggs for him. 950 00:42:15,013 --> 00:42:17,015 Pollard was in the middle of eating them when he received 951 00:42:17,017 --> 00:42:19,029 the phone call he had been expecting. 952 00:42:20,001 --> 00:42:21,028 Wolfe: You're in the home of this gravedigger, 953 00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:24,008 and you don't even know how he fits into the story. 954 00:42:24,010 --> 00:42:26,004 But he wakes up, he gets a phone call... 955 00:42:26,006 --> 00:42:29,020 (Breslin speaking) 956 00:42:43,002 --> 00:42:45,018 ♪ ♪ 957 00:42:47,003 --> 00:42:50,005 Clifton Pollard wasn't at the funeral. 958 00:42:50,007 --> 00:42:51,021 He was over behind the hill, 959 00:42:51,023 --> 00:42:54,018 digging graves for $3.01 an hour, 960 00:42:54,020 --> 00:42:56,016 in another section of the cemetery. 961 00:42:59,001 --> 00:43:01,017 "I tried to go over to see the grave," he said. 962 00:43:01,019 --> 00:43:05,004 "But it was so crowded, a soldier told me I couldn't get through. 963 00:43:05,006 --> 00:43:07,029 "So I just stayed here and worked, sir. 964 00:43:08,021 --> 00:43:11,005 "But I'll get over there later a little bit. 965 00:43:12,013 --> 00:43:15,014 "Just sort of look around and see how it is, you know. 966 00:43:15,016 --> 00:43:17,007 "Like I told you, 967 00:43:17,009 --> 00:43:19,010 it's an honor." 968 00:43:22,014 --> 00:43:26,028 Jimmy Breslin wrote that our father earned $3.01 969 00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:29,022 to dig the Kennedy grave, per hour. 970 00:43:29,024 --> 00:43:31,027 And he came in on his off day, which was Sunday, 971 00:43:31,029 --> 00:43:34,001 and I don't think he got overtime for that. 972 00:43:34,003 --> 00:43:35,015 But he didn't care about the money. 973 00:43:35,017 --> 00:43:38,013 He cared more about being able to perform that honor. 974 00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:43,001 ♪ ♪ 975 00:43:50,015 --> 00:43:53,016 Hamill: Jimmy revolutionized the column 976 00:43:53,018 --> 00:43:56,000 when he was at theHerald Tribune, 977 00:43:56,016 --> 00:43:57,019 and... 978 00:43:57,021 --> 00:44:00,029 I ended up with an opportunity at the Post 979 00:44:01,028 --> 00:44:03,010 because the editor said, 980 00:44:03,012 --> 00:44:06,005 we have to have some equivalent of Breslin. 981 00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:09,021 And I was offered the shot. 982 00:44:09,023 --> 00:44:11,011 Breslin: We were doing the same thing, 983 00:44:11,013 --> 00:44:13,012 against the world. 984 00:44:13,025 --> 00:44:14,027 Araton: They were like Zelig. 985 00:44:14,029 --> 00:44:16,013 They were like Forrest Gump. 986 00:44:16,015 --> 00:44:17,016 They were everywhere. 987 00:44:17,018 --> 00:44:20,016 (gunfire) 988 00:44:22,026 --> 00:44:24,008 (explosion) 989 00:44:24,010 --> 00:44:25,023 -(gunfire) -(yelling) 990 00:44:25,025 --> 00:44:28,008 Hamill: In all wars, some men die 991 00:44:28,010 --> 00:44:31,004 and some men add up the losses. 992 00:44:32,001 --> 00:44:35,022 The foot soldier lies in the stink of a rice paddy, 993 00:44:35,024 --> 00:44:38,012 his feet rotting in his boots. 994 00:44:38,014 --> 00:44:40,024 The clerks move in to compile 995 00:44:40,026 --> 00:44:42,027 the statistics of horror, 996 00:44:43,013 --> 00:44:45,028 and hope that, somehow, 997 00:44:46,000 --> 00:44:49,026 such statistics will dilute the brutality. 998 00:44:50,026 --> 00:44:53,029 ♪ ♪ 999 00:44:59,024 --> 00:45:01,009 Breslin: There are people who have been beaten 1000 00:45:01,011 --> 00:45:03,002 because they are black. 1001 00:45:03,004 --> 00:45:04,027 They have had friends and relatives killed 1002 00:45:04,029 --> 00:45:06,015 because they are black. 1003 00:45:06,017 --> 00:45:08,005 They have been laughed at and spat at 1004 00:45:08,007 --> 00:45:09,020 because they are black. 1005 00:45:09,022 --> 00:45:11,029 And they have been held down on the dust of the streets 1006 00:45:12,001 --> 00:45:14,004 and made to be dirty and uneducated 1007 00:45:14,006 --> 00:45:17,002 for all their lives because they are black. 1008 00:45:17,004 --> 00:45:19,004 Yesterday, they stood up from the dust, 1009 00:45:19,006 --> 00:45:20,026 and they asked for the right to vote, 1010 00:45:20,028 --> 00:45:23,014 which is the start of the right to live. 1011 00:45:24,024 --> 00:45:28,003 -(crowd cheering) -King: We come baring a message 1012 00:45:28,005 --> 00:45:30,021 that Chicago can change. 1013 00:45:32,009 --> 00:45:34,021 Hamill: King got up and shook hands. 1014 00:45:34,023 --> 00:45:37,016 He had caused more controversy in Chicago 1015 00:45:37,018 --> 00:45:40,003 than anyone since Al Capone. 1016 00:45:40,005 --> 00:45:43,019 But on this afternoon, he just looked very tired. 1017 00:45:44,006 --> 00:45:46,012 He knows what is coming up, 1018 00:45:46,014 --> 00:45:48,015 and none of it will be pretty. 1019 00:45:49,011 --> 00:45:51,010 For Martin Luther King, 1020 00:45:51,012 --> 00:45:54,006 it was all a more innocent time 1021 00:45:54,008 --> 00:45:56,002 when your only goal 1022 00:45:56,004 --> 00:45:59,013 was to sit in the front of a Montgomery bus. 1023 00:45:59,015 --> 00:46:01,021 ♪ ♪ 1024 00:46:03,007 --> 00:46:06,026 Breslin: One cold Sunday morning in January of 1965, 1025 00:46:06,028 --> 00:46:10,001 I went to the Audubon Ballroom to see Malcolm X. 1026 00:46:10,003 --> 00:46:11,023 He was working on a Sunday, 1027 00:46:11,025 --> 00:46:14,002 and I needed a column for the Monday paper. 1028 00:46:14,004 --> 00:46:15,029 I went upstairs into the back 1029 00:46:16,001 --> 00:46:17,016 where the fighters used to get dressed, 1030 00:46:17,018 --> 00:46:19,016 and I was smoking a Pall Mall cigarette there. 1031 00:46:20,014 --> 00:46:22,023 You couldn't smoke at a Muslim gathering, 1032 00:46:22,025 --> 00:46:24,026 but you could shoot guns. 1033 00:46:25,023 --> 00:46:26,024 (gunshot) 1034 00:46:27,026 --> 00:46:30,008 By the time I looked out, Malcolm had been shot down. 1035 00:46:32,002 --> 00:46:35,004 In the Audubon, a uniformed cop asked if anybody had any chalk. 1036 00:46:39,025 --> 00:46:41,015 (typewriter clacks) 1037 00:46:42,020 --> 00:46:44,004 Hamill: We're lecturing people in Detroit 1038 00:46:44,006 --> 00:46:46,006 and Newark about violence, 1039 00:46:46,008 --> 00:46:47,024 when we're using violence to attain 1040 00:46:47,026 --> 00:46:49,027 the same ends that they think they're after. 1041 00:46:49,029 --> 00:46:52,026 I think it's quite clear that some of the domestic programs 1042 00:46:52,028 --> 00:46:55,008 are going to be cut back because of the war... 1043 00:46:55,010 --> 00:46:59,004 Kathy: Bobby Kennedy was getting ready to run for president. 1044 00:46:59,006 --> 00:47:00,024 Denis: Bobby was on the fence about running, 1045 00:47:00,026 --> 00:47:02,014 and Pete wrote him a letter. 1046 00:47:02,016 --> 00:47:04,025 ♪ ♪ 1047 00:47:05,017 --> 00:47:07,008 Hamill: Dear Bob. 1048 00:47:07,010 --> 00:47:09,012 In Watts, I didn't see pictures 1049 00:47:09,014 --> 00:47:12,026 of Malcolm X or Ron Karenga on the walls. 1050 00:47:12,028 --> 00:47:15,025 I saw pictures of JFK. 1051 00:47:15,027 --> 00:47:19,016 That is your capital in the most cynical sense. 1052 00:47:20,015 --> 00:47:23,024 It is your obligation in another. 1053 00:47:23,026 --> 00:47:26,005 The obligation of staying true 1054 00:47:26,007 --> 00:47:28,001 to whatever it was 1055 00:47:28,003 --> 00:47:30,000 that put those pictures 1056 00:47:30,002 --> 00:47:32,018 on those walls. 1057 00:47:32,020 --> 00:47:35,007 Denis: Two days later, a telegram came. 1058 00:47:35,009 --> 00:47:37,007 "I've decided to run. I need your help." 1059 00:47:37,009 --> 00:47:40,010 I think he had learned from his brother 1060 00:47:41,007 --> 00:47:43,012 that you can't postpone everything. 1061 00:47:43,014 --> 00:47:46,027 -(crowd cheering) -(typewriter clacks) 1062 00:47:46,029 --> 00:47:48,015 Kennedy: So, uh... 1063 00:47:48,017 --> 00:47:50,000 My thanks to all of you, 1064 00:47:50,002 --> 00:47:52,007 and now it's on to Chicago and let's win there. 1065 00:47:52,009 --> 00:47:54,009 -Thank you very much. -(cheering) 1066 00:47:57,020 --> 00:47:59,013 Man: Senator! Senator... 1067 00:47:59,015 --> 00:48:03,004 (indistinct chatter) 1068 00:48:07,002 --> 00:48:08,011 And then, bang. 1069 00:48:11,005 --> 00:48:13,009 Senator Kennedy has been shot. Is that possible? 1070 00:48:13,011 --> 00:48:14,019 -Is that possible? -(screaming) 1071 00:48:14,021 --> 00:48:16,022 Oh my God. 1072 00:48:16,024 --> 00:48:18,025 Senator Kennedy has been shot. 1073 00:48:19,027 --> 00:48:21,024 Pow-pow-pow! 1074 00:48:21,026 --> 00:48:23,016 Pow pow! Five shots. 1075 00:48:23,018 --> 00:48:25,004 (indistinct shouting) 1076 00:48:26,019 --> 00:48:28,025 (yelling continues) 1077 00:48:28,027 --> 00:48:31,005 (Hamill speaking) 1078 00:48:43,015 --> 00:48:45,018 (indistinct yelling) 1079 00:48:45,020 --> 00:48:48,017 Hamill: And there was Sirhan with his arm out 1080 00:48:48,019 --> 00:48:50,020 like this and a long... 1081 00:48:50,022 --> 00:48:53,003 group of us... 1082 00:48:53,005 --> 00:48:54,016 leaped on him. 1083 00:48:54,018 --> 00:48:56,023 Breslin: What's his name, Sirhan. 1084 00:48:56,025 --> 00:48:58,019 I'm on his feet, 1085 00:48:58,021 --> 00:49:00,010 and sat on him. 1086 00:49:00,012 --> 00:49:02,007 (yelling continues) 1087 00:49:02,009 --> 00:49:04,010 Hamill: Robert Kennedy was on the floor. 1088 00:49:04,012 --> 00:49:06,011 His eyes were open. 1089 00:49:06,013 --> 00:49:09,029 And the blood coming from back here. 1090 00:49:10,001 --> 00:49:12,004 He had a look that was... 1091 00:49:12,006 --> 00:49:15,007 fatalistic. He never said a word. 1092 00:49:16,005 --> 00:49:18,011 Man: Move back! Move back, please. 1093 00:49:18,013 --> 00:49:21,002 Hamill: He got rushed to a hospital. 1094 00:49:21,004 --> 00:49:23,019 He lived through all that night into the morning, 1095 00:49:23,021 --> 00:49:25,021 and then died. 1096 00:49:25,023 --> 00:49:28,020 Did you go with him to the hospital, Jimmy? 1097 00:49:28,022 --> 00:49:30,018 (siren wails) 1098 00:49:30,020 --> 00:49:33,006 Breslin: They took him back into the hospital, 1099 00:49:33,008 --> 00:49:35,026 and I went right into the first cab 1100 00:49:35,028 --> 00:49:37,011 there or something. 1101 00:49:37,013 --> 00:49:39,014 'Cause I had to make a deadline. 1102 00:49:40,026 --> 00:49:43,013 Robert Kennedy is on his back. 1103 00:49:43,015 --> 00:49:45,024 His lips are open in pain. 1104 00:49:45,026 --> 00:49:48,008 He has a sad look on his face. 1105 00:49:48,010 --> 00:49:49,023 You see, 1106 00:49:49,025 --> 00:49:52,011 he knows so much about this thing. 1107 00:49:55,028 --> 00:49:58,008 It affected me 1108 00:49:58,010 --> 00:50:01,016 even worse because I had made a terrible mistake 1109 00:50:01,018 --> 00:50:03,013 as a journalist. 1110 00:50:03,015 --> 00:50:06,017 I had become friends with Robert Kennedy. 1111 00:50:07,005 --> 00:50:08,013 You know, I liked him, 1112 00:50:08,015 --> 00:50:11,000 and I was friends with him, and that was a mistake. 1113 00:50:11,002 --> 00:50:14,004 I never was friends with a politician again. 1114 00:50:14,006 --> 00:50:16,012 Right after it happened, we went to the hospital, 1115 00:50:16,014 --> 00:50:18,013 and we were both still drinking in those days, 1116 00:50:18,015 --> 00:50:20,019 and we bought a bottle of booze, and we sat on the curb 1117 00:50:20,021 --> 00:50:23,013 right across from the hospital, and got drunk. 1118 00:50:23,015 --> 00:50:25,011 In the days after, Pete was... 1119 00:50:26,009 --> 00:50:27,021 you know, he was depressed. 1120 00:50:27,023 --> 00:50:29,020 Hamill: I went into a funk. 1121 00:50:30,008 --> 00:50:31,022 Wasn't writing, 1122 00:50:31,024 --> 00:50:33,016 and I had lunch 1123 00:50:33,018 --> 00:50:36,020 with Paul O'Dwyer, one of my favorite Irishmen. 1124 00:50:37,008 --> 00:50:39,029 He said, "What are you doing now?" 1125 00:50:40,001 --> 00:50:41,015 I said, nothing, Paul. 1126 00:50:41,017 --> 00:50:44,003 I have a kind of a writer's block. 1127 00:50:45,009 --> 00:50:47,006 He says, "For Christ's sakes! 1128 00:50:47,008 --> 00:50:51,002 You're not important enough to have a writer's block!" 1129 00:50:51,004 --> 00:50:52,019 And I laughed out loud, 1130 00:50:52,021 --> 00:50:55,017 and I started writing as soon as I got home. 1131 00:50:56,018 --> 00:50:58,025 ♪ ♪ 1132 00:50:58,027 --> 00:51:00,016 Hamill: For almost 20 years... 1133 00:51:06,025 --> 00:51:08,026 Hamill: On a national stage, 1134 00:51:08,028 --> 00:51:10,026 -cultivating the haters... -(cheering) 1135 00:51:10,028 --> 00:51:13,025 ...the resenters, the paranoids. 1136 00:51:13,027 --> 00:51:17,015 He played on the very worst instincts of Americans 1137 00:51:17,017 --> 00:51:19,016 on his way to power. 1138 00:51:19,018 --> 00:51:21,025 And when he finally attained power, 1139 00:51:21,027 --> 00:51:23,021 he did not change. 1140 00:51:25,007 --> 00:51:27,020 (indistinct chatter) 1141 00:51:28,015 --> 00:51:29,026 At Kent State, 1142 00:51:29,028 --> 00:51:32,009 two boys and two girls were shot to death 1143 00:51:32,011 --> 00:51:34,005 by men unleashed 1144 00:51:34,007 --> 00:51:36,026 by a president's slovenly rhetoric. 1145 00:51:37,018 --> 00:51:40,009 If that's the brave new America, 1146 00:51:40,011 --> 00:51:42,006 the hell with it. 1147 00:51:42,008 --> 00:51:43,011 Cronkite: Vice President Agnew 1148 00:51:43,013 --> 00:51:45,002 charged that the liberal news media 1149 00:51:45,004 --> 00:51:47,001 are so irresponsible and thoughtless, 1150 00:51:47,003 --> 00:51:49,002 that the American people are beyond 1151 00:51:49,004 --> 00:51:50,025 being shocked by what they read and hear. 1152 00:51:51,014 --> 00:51:54,002 In the United States today, we have 1153 00:51:54,004 --> 00:51:55,027 more than our share of 1154 00:51:55,029 --> 00:51:59,002 the nattering nabobs of negativism. 1155 00:51:59,004 --> 00:52:00,022 Hamill: Then to find out that by writing 1156 00:52:00,024 --> 00:52:02,003 what in fact is happening 1157 00:52:02,005 --> 00:52:05,000 that you're under attack for being vicious, outrageous, etc. 1158 00:52:05,002 --> 00:52:07,011 by the president of the United States, is a little strange. 1159 00:52:07,013 --> 00:52:09,024 Interviewer: Agnew attacked you at one point, right? 1160 00:52:09,026 --> 00:52:13,008 Hamill: Oh, yeah. He said, "But worst of all is Pete Hamill 1161 00:52:13,010 --> 00:52:15,018 "of the illiberal New York Post. 1162 00:52:15,020 --> 00:52:19,007 Listen to his irrational ravings." 1163 00:52:19,009 --> 00:52:22,027 I used it as the name of my first book of journalism. 1164 00:52:22,029 --> 00:52:25,007 Irrational Ravings. 1165 00:52:25,009 --> 00:52:27,017 Interviewer: What was it like to be on Nixon's enemies list? 1166 00:52:27,019 --> 00:52:29,026 Hamill: Oh, it was an honor. 1167 00:52:29,028 --> 00:52:31,029 There were a lot of good people on that list. 1168 00:52:35,017 --> 00:52:37,003 They call my people 1169 00:52:37,005 --> 00:52:40,006 the white lower middle class these days. 1170 00:52:41,001 --> 00:52:44,011 It is an ugly, ice-cold phrase. 1171 00:52:45,003 --> 00:52:47,007 All over New York City tonight, 1172 00:52:47,009 --> 00:52:48,028 in places like Inwood, 1173 00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:51,015 Corona, and Bay Ridge, 1174 00:52:51,017 --> 00:52:53,028 men are standing around saloons, 1175 00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:56,029 talking darkly about their grievances, 1176 00:52:57,001 --> 00:52:58,027 and even more darkly 1177 00:52:58,029 --> 00:53:01,022 about possible remedies. 1178 00:53:01,024 --> 00:53:05,022 (Hamill speaking) 1179 00:53:21,000 --> 00:53:24,026 Kosner: Pete was drinking all through hisPostperiod, 1180 00:53:24,028 --> 00:53:26,021 and he got sent home once. 1181 00:53:26,023 --> 00:53:29,011 He didn't think anybody knew he was drunk, 1182 00:53:29,013 --> 00:53:32,026 but Paul Sann, the executive editor, spotted it. 1183 00:53:33,014 --> 00:53:36,010 Pete always felt that he was undereducated, 1184 00:53:36,012 --> 00:53:38,020 and he was kind of an outsider. 1185 00:53:38,022 --> 00:53:40,021 That these guys were towering 1186 00:53:40,023 --> 00:53:42,005 journalistic talents, 1187 00:53:42,007 --> 00:53:45,004 and so the drinking probably helped then. 1188 00:53:45,016 --> 00:53:47,029 And then I guess, at a certain point, it kind of tipped over, 1189 00:53:48,001 --> 00:53:50,018 and he felt it wasn't helping him, 1190 00:53:50,020 --> 00:53:52,022 and he wasn't in control of it anymore. 1191 00:53:54,001 --> 00:53:56,005 Interviewer: So, you quit in 1972, right? 1192 00:53:56,007 --> 00:53:59,025 Hamill: Yeah. I had exhausted the good times, 1193 00:53:59,027 --> 00:54:01,010 and I had other things to do. 1194 00:54:01,012 --> 00:54:05,010 I had Deirdre, my daughter, and Adriene, 1195 00:54:05,012 --> 00:54:08,019 who were in my custody, and I didn't wanna be 1196 00:54:08,021 --> 00:54:11,010 an asshole in front of them. 1197 00:54:11,012 --> 00:54:13,026 ♪ ♪ 1198 00:54:13,028 --> 00:54:16,006 One night, drunk again, I came home, 1199 00:54:16,008 --> 00:54:18,018 and lurched into the inner door, 1200 00:54:18,020 --> 00:54:21,008 smashing the window. 1201 00:54:21,010 --> 00:54:24,001 (Hamill speaking) 1202 00:54:31,008 --> 00:54:32,027 Hamill: They'd awakened with the crash, 1203 00:54:32,029 --> 00:54:35,019 and there, suddenly, was their father. 1204 00:54:36,013 --> 00:54:39,020 Their eyes were wide in fright or apprehension. 1205 00:54:40,017 --> 00:54:42,011 I handed each of them a rose, 1206 00:54:42,013 --> 00:54:44,019 and told them I loved them. 1207 00:54:44,021 --> 00:54:46,011 I did, 1208 00:54:46,013 --> 00:54:48,029 but I'd broken too many things. 1209 00:54:50,004 --> 00:54:51,009 I realized, 1210 00:54:51,011 --> 00:54:53,028 I don't wanna do this anymore. 1211 00:54:54,000 --> 00:54:55,017 On a different level, 1212 00:54:55,019 --> 00:54:59,014 I wanted to see how big my talent might be. 1213 00:54:59,016 --> 00:55:00,024 I had no idea. 1214 00:55:00,026 --> 00:55:03,010 And I couldn't do that while 1215 00:55:03,012 --> 00:55:05,024 semi-conscious part of the day. 1216 00:55:06,026 --> 00:55:08,003 (typewriter clacks) 1217 00:55:08,005 --> 00:55:11,006 ♪ ♪ 1218 00:55:12,006 --> 00:55:13,010 Jonathan Alter: In the 1970s, 1219 00:55:13,012 --> 00:55:14,023 theNew York Daily News, which was then 1220 00:55:14,025 --> 00:55:17,005 the largest-selling newspaper in America, 1221 00:55:17,007 --> 00:55:19,021 scored a coups. They had both Jimmy and Pete 1222 00:55:19,023 --> 00:55:22,009 in the newspaper at the same time. 1223 00:55:22,027 --> 00:55:24,026 Some people preferred Jimmy's column. 1224 00:55:24,028 --> 00:55:26,017 Other people preferred Pete's column. 1225 00:55:27,002 --> 00:55:28,018 Lupica: At a time when most people 1226 00:55:28,020 --> 00:55:30,014 are trying to do Jimmy's act, 1227 00:55:30,016 --> 00:55:32,006 Pete never tried to do Jimmy's act. 1228 00:55:32,008 --> 00:55:34,029 Hamill: I didn't feel a rivalry at all. 1229 00:55:35,001 --> 00:55:37,015 I was a big fan. 1230 00:55:37,017 --> 00:55:40,005 Alter: Jimmy, by then, was the most famous 1231 00:55:40,007 --> 00:55:42,012 print journalist in the United States. 1232 00:55:42,014 --> 00:55:43,028 But he did all this other stuff. 1233 00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:46,025 He had run for city council president of New York 1234 00:55:46,027 --> 00:55:49,020 on a ticket with Norman Mailer for mayor. 1235 00:55:49,022 --> 00:55:51,009 Gloria Steinem: Jimmy came to me and said, 1236 00:55:51,011 --> 00:55:54,007 he wouldn't do it unless I ran as controller. 1237 00:55:54,009 --> 00:55:56,011 I said, Jimmy, no way I can do this. 1238 00:55:56,013 --> 00:55:58,012 I can't speak in public. I had never 1239 00:55:58,014 --> 00:55:59,022 spoken in public in my life. 1240 00:55:59,024 --> 00:56:02,009 Breslin: The first step should be taken to start New York 1241 00:56:02,011 --> 00:56:04,018 on its way to becoming the 51st state. 1242 00:56:04,020 --> 00:56:06,022 We've been trying to live under a system 1243 00:56:06,024 --> 00:56:08,011 where a man from an upstate county, 1244 00:56:08,013 --> 00:56:10,018 which has more cows than people, 1245 00:56:10,020 --> 00:56:13,020 decides the destiny of our public school system. 1246 00:56:13,022 --> 00:56:15,018 ...and let Harlem run its own businesses. 1247 00:56:15,020 --> 00:56:18,009 Start getting the white guys out of your lives. Start running it yourself. 1248 00:56:18,011 --> 00:56:20,012 Steinem: It was never intended to win. 1249 00:56:20,014 --> 00:56:21,021 It was trying to insert 1250 00:56:21,023 --> 00:56:24,006 new ideas into the atmosphere, which I think it did. 1251 00:56:24,020 --> 00:56:26,025 Breslin: I'd like to say that I am mortified 1252 00:56:26,027 --> 00:56:29,015 to have taken part in a process 1253 00:56:29,017 --> 00:56:30,025 which required 1254 00:56:30,027 --> 00:56:33,004 the bars to be closed all day. 1255 00:56:33,006 --> 00:56:34,025 (laughter) 1256 00:56:34,027 --> 00:56:36,023 Nothing gets my Irish up more 1257 00:56:36,025 --> 00:56:39,010 than a soggy, wishy-washy cereal. 1258 00:56:39,012 --> 00:56:40,014 I'm Jimmy Breslin... 1259 00:56:40,016 --> 00:56:42,010 Krulwich: He was famous for being famous. 1260 00:56:42,012 --> 00:56:44,000 He was really famous. 1261 00:56:44,002 --> 00:56:46,002 It's a good drinking beer. 1262 00:56:46,004 --> 00:56:49,007 That's how I describe Piels. It's a good drinking beer. 1263 00:56:49,009 --> 00:56:51,025 ♪ Piels! It's a good... ♪ 1264 00:56:51,027 --> 00:56:54,003 I don't think there's ever been 1265 00:56:54,005 --> 00:56:56,017 another journalist 1266 00:56:56,019 --> 00:56:58,001 bigger than Jimmy Breslin. 1267 00:56:58,003 --> 00:57:01,019 Announcer: Ladies and gentlemen, Jimmy Breslin! 1268 00:57:01,021 --> 00:57:03,000 -(music playing) -(cheering) 1269 00:57:03,002 --> 00:57:05,011 Hamill: Occasionally, someone in the subway would say, 1270 00:57:05,013 --> 00:57:07,024 "Are you Jimmy Breslin?" 1271 00:57:07,026 --> 00:57:09,018 And I'd laugh and say, 1272 00:57:09,020 --> 00:57:11,004 no, I'm the other guy. 1273 00:57:11,006 --> 00:57:13,002 ♪ ♪ 1274 00:57:13,004 --> 00:57:14,016 Lupica: There was a time at theDaily News 1275 00:57:14,018 --> 00:57:15,022 when you'd smell the smoke 1276 00:57:15,024 --> 00:57:18,001 before you got to the office 1277 00:57:18,003 --> 00:57:19,026 because Jimmy's smoking cigars 1278 00:57:19,028 --> 00:57:21,011 on this side, 1279 00:57:21,013 --> 00:57:23,026 and Pete's smoking cigarettes on this side. 1280 00:57:23,028 --> 00:57:25,028 And if secondary smoke can kill you, 1281 00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:27,002 it would've killed Anne Marie, 1282 00:57:27,004 --> 00:57:29,025 who sat between them, often, 1283 00:57:29,027 --> 00:57:31,005 you know, like Switzerland. 1284 00:57:31,007 --> 00:57:33,012 Caldwell: Anne Marie was the secretary. 1285 00:57:33,014 --> 00:57:36,024 She knew a lot of stuff that was going on, 1286 00:57:36,026 --> 00:57:39,013 you know, in... 1287 00:57:39,015 --> 00:57:41,003 Interviewer: Organized crime. 1288 00:57:41,005 --> 00:57:43,026 (laughing) 1289 00:57:43,028 --> 00:57:46,009 There is a name for everything, isn't there? 1290 00:57:46,011 --> 00:57:47,024 I knew she had connections. 1291 00:57:47,026 --> 00:57:50,009 Her dad was a guy named Quiet Dom. 1292 00:57:50,011 --> 00:57:52,000 Patrick: My father wrote something about 1293 00:57:52,002 --> 00:57:53,011 Tony Salerno once, 1294 00:57:53,013 --> 00:57:55,006 and Anne Marie came in the next day and said, 1295 00:57:55,008 --> 00:57:57,010 "Mr. Salerno says thank you." 1296 00:57:57,012 --> 00:57:59,021 That's when my mother said, "Anne Marie is... 1297 00:57:59,023 --> 00:58:00,028 she's hardcore." 1298 00:58:01,000 --> 00:58:03,004 Lupica: And then you'd hear Jimmy yelling, 1299 00:58:03,006 --> 00:58:04,005 and Pete laughing. 1300 00:58:04,007 --> 00:58:06,019 It was like a carnival. 1301 00:58:06,021 --> 00:58:08,026 And if you were going to add it up, 1302 00:58:08,028 --> 00:58:11,027 one of them was a bit more of a handful to manage than... 1303 00:58:11,029 --> 00:58:14,003 (chuckle) than the other one. 1304 00:58:15,005 --> 00:58:17,005 Breslin: All these people today, they run around 1305 00:58:17,007 --> 00:58:18,004 and they put their arms 1306 00:58:18,006 --> 00:58:19,012 around each other's shoulders, 1307 00:58:19,014 --> 00:58:21,019 and they say how much they like each other, 1308 00:58:21,021 --> 00:58:24,019 and they hope the new year is better than the old year. 1309 00:58:24,021 --> 00:58:27,010 (Breslin speaking) 1310 00:58:33,010 --> 00:58:35,012 (typewriter clacks) 1311 00:58:35,014 --> 00:58:36,027 ♪ ♪ 1312 00:58:36,029 --> 00:58:38,026 Lupica: Every phone conversation we ever had 1313 00:58:38,028 --> 00:58:40,015 would begin the following way. 1314 00:58:40,017 --> 00:58:42,005 "Yeah?" 1315 00:58:42,007 --> 00:58:43,025 What kind of greeting is that!? 1316 00:58:43,027 --> 00:58:46,006 Barnicle: "Yeah?" That's when you know Breslin's on the line. 1317 00:58:46,008 --> 00:58:47,028 "What are you doing? What are you doing? 1318 00:58:48,000 --> 00:58:49,014 The fuck are you doing?" 1319 00:58:49,016 --> 00:58:52,013 I was the media critic at Newsweekon deadline, 1320 00:58:52,015 --> 00:58:54,022 on a story about Jimmy that was a little critical. 1321 00:58:54,024 --> 00:58:56,020 The phone rings. All I hear is, 1322 00:58:56,022 --> 00:59:00,000 "Alter! You fuck with me, I will fuck you good 1323 00:59:00,002 --> 00:59:01,029 'cause I'm the fucking John Gotti of journalism!" 1324 00:59:02,025 --> 00:59:04,002 Daly: "JB Number One!" 1325 00:59:04,004 --> 00:59:06,028 My kids'll go, "It's Mr. Breslin on the phone." 1326 00:59:07,000 --> 00:59:08,006 "JB Number One." 1327 00:59:08,008 --> 00:59:10,002 Who says that!? Nobody says that! 1328 00:59:10,004 --> 00:59:12,009 Pileggi: It's like he starts talking to me 1329 00:59:12,011 --> 00:59:13,024 before he gets to the phone. 1330 00:59:13,026 --> 00:59:15,026 Then he gets to the phone, he dials. Then I answer, 1331 00:59:15,028 --> 00:59:17,024 and he's in the middle of the conversation. 1332 00:59:17,026 --> 00:59:19,024 And then he says, "okay!" Boom! And he hangs up! 1333 00:59:19,026 --> 00:59:22,027 But then he'd call and my wife Nora would answer the phone. 1334 00:59:22,029 --> 00:59:25,017 And he'd be this sweet guy on the phone. 1335 00:59:25,019 --> 00:59:27,026 And she's, "Eh, Jimmy's on the phone!" 1336 00:59:27,028 --> 00:59:29,029 Jim Dwyer: There was a fire in Brooklyn. 1337 00:59:30,001 --> 00:59:32,005 The editor had one of the clerks call him. 1338 00:59:32,007 --> 00:59:34,008 "Uh, Mr. Breslin..." "What, what, what!?" 1339 00:59:34,010 --> 00:59:36,003 "There was a fire in Brooklyn and..." 1340 00:59:36,005 --> 00:59:37,009 "How many dead?" 1341 00:59:37,011 --> 00:59:39,023 Kid said, "Well, there's two people dead." He said, 1342 00:59:39,025 --> 00:59:42,013 "More must die before Breslin goes!" 1343 00:59:42,015 --> 00:59:43,029 And then he hung up the phone. 1344 00:59:44,001 --> 00:59:45,010 Cuomo: My father would answer the phone 1345 00:59:45,012 --> 00:59:46,014 and just say, "Yep! Yep!" 1346 00:59:46,016 --> 00:59:49,007 So I would imitate my father's yep. 1347 00:59:49,009 --> 00:59:51,012 That's all it took to start 1348 00:59:51,014 --> 00:59:53,018 the Jimmy Breslin machine. 1349 00:59:53,020 --> 00:59:56,023 And he would just go, "F-ing this, that." 1350 00:59:56,025 --> 00:59:58,011 Just a string of profanity, 1351 00:59:58,013 --> 00:59:59,020 which I enjoyed. 1352 00:59:59,022 --> 01:00:02,003 And I would say, "Oh, Mr. Breslin. 1353 01:00:02,005 --> 01:00:03,020 You must want my father." 1354 01:00:03,022 --> 01:00:06,007 To which he would take off again 1355 01:00:06,009 --> 01:00:09,005 with a string of expletives. 1356 01:00:09,007 --> 01:00:12,008 "You little this, you little that--" Click! 1357 01:00:13,008 --> 01:00:14,028 Breslin: I'm very rude in the course of business 1358 01:00:15,000 --> 01:00:16,012 because I got no time. 1359 01:00:16,014 --> 01:00:19,013 I'm always late and I'm always nervous about deadlines. 1360 01:00:19,015 --> 01:00:22,003 Bombast never hurt anybody. 1361 01:00:22,020 --> 01:00:24,002 Kevin: We grew up in Forest Hills Gardens, 1362 01:00:24,004 --> 01:00:26,010 which is a very elite neighborhood. 1363 01:00:26,012 --> 01:00:27,018 All our neighbors were doctors. 1364 01:00:28,017 --> 01:00:30,025 Everybody, and their wives, were perfectly quiet. 1365 01:00:30,027 --> 01:00:32,024 And he were the Breslins, who's bombastic. 1366 01:00:32,026 --> 01:00:34,027 He always worked hard. 1367 01:00:34,029 --> 01:00:37,015 You thought a machine gun was going off inside. 1368 01:00:37,017 --> 01:00:39,007 (imitates typing) 1369 01:00:39,009 --> 01:00:40,029 With the cage, he'd slam it. 1370 01:00:41,001 --> 01:00:44,015 He built the office right next to the kitchen refrigerator. 1371 01:00:44,017 --> 01:00:46,011 You couldn't open the refrigerator. 1372 01:00:46,013 --> 01:00:47,014 You'd open the door, 1373 01:00:47,016 --> 01:00:48,029 "Aah!" he'd scream. 1374 01:00:49,001 --> 01:00:50,017 "I can't hear sounds! 1375 01:00:50,019 --> 01:00:52,006 I have to think!" 1376 01:00:52,008 --> 01:00:53,020 Breslin: I've decided that boring people 1377 01:00:53,022 --> 01:00:55,005 are the true criminals. 1378 01:00:55,007 --> 01:00:57,023 In a world where you live for about a minute and 40 seconds, 1379 01:00:57,025 --> 01:01:00,020 what right does anybody have to deaden one moment of time? 1380 01:01:00,022 --> 01:01:02,018 Kevin: He's like a mad scientist. 1381 01:01:02,020 --> 01:01:04,007 Everybody would walk on eggshells 1382 01:01:04,009 --> 01:01:06,010 because he was writing. 1383 01:01:08,005 --> 01:01:11,024 Jimmy, of course, would sweat over every single word. 1384 01:01:11,026 --> 01:01:15,008 Pete would either phone in from the Hamptons, 1385 01:01:15,010 --> 01:01:17,005 or come in, 1386 01:01:17,007 --> 01:01:20,023 dash out a column in 45 minutes, 1387 01:01:20,025 --> 01:01:22,004 and disappear. 1388 01:01:22,006 --> 01:01:25,011 ♪ ♪ 1389 01:01:26,028 --> 01:01:29,023 Interviewer: So, what do you mean by hearing the music? 1390 01:01:29,025 --> 01:01:32,003 You write about that. What does that mean? 1391 01:01:32,005 --> 01:01:35,015 I wanna see whether while I'm reading, 1392 01:01:35,017 --> 01:01:38,017 my foot starts to keep time 1393 01:01:38,019 --> 01:01:40,020 to the rhythm of the sentences. 1394 01:01:41,027 --> 01:01:45,009 I remember reading an interview with Gene Krupa. 1395 01:01:45,011 --> 01:01:48,021 "You're keeping a rhythm going for the band. 1396 01:01:48,023 --> 01:01:51,021 What keeps the rhythm going for you?" 1397 01:01:53,002 --> 01:01:55,004 And he said, "I have a sentence 1398 01:01:55,006 --> 01:01:57,017 "I use all the time. 1399 01:01:57,019 --> 01:02:01,001 "Lyonnaise potatoes, no pork chops. 1400 01:02:01,003 --> 01:02:05,004 Say, "Lyonnaise potatoes, no pork chops." 1401 01:02:05,006 --> 01:02:09,009 ♪ Lyonnaise potatoes and some pork chops ♪ 1402 01:02:09,011 --> 01:02:12,020 Hamill: Was trying to get a rhythm into the language, 1403 01:02:12,022 --> 01:02:14,024 and still tell the story. 1404 01:02:14,026 --> 01:02:16,018 ♪ ♪ 1405 01:02:16,020 --> 01:02:19,007 Man: Pete was this dashing guy 1406 01:02:19,009 --> 01:02:21,012 who you saw everywhere, 1407 01:02:21,014 --> 01:02:23,025 with his shirt sleeves rolled up. 1408 01:02:23,027 --> 01:02:25,011 Brokaw: He was... 1409 01:02:25,013 --> 01:02:26,028 so authentically male. 1410 01:02:27,000 --> 01:02:29,002 Man: He dated Jackie Kennedy. 1411 01:02:29,004 --> 01:02:30,020 Brokaw: I was on a boat with Jackie Kennedy 1412 01:02:30,022 --> 01:02:32,008 and Pete Hamill one time. 1413 01:02:32,010 --> 01:02:34,000 He was wearing a bathing suit that came out of 1414 01:02:34,002 --> 01:02:37,008 Queens, 1948, (laughing) and... 1415 01:02:37,010 --> 01:02:39,017 there was the elegant first lady. 1416 01:02:39,019 --> 01:02:41,006 So I thought, that's Yin and Yang, 1417 01:02:41,008 --> 01:02:42,025 if you ever want to describe it. 1418 01:02:42,027 --> 01:02:44,009 You couldn't walk down the street with him. 1419 01:02:44,011 --> 01:02:47,017 Ron Galella was a famous paparazzi photographer, 1420 01:02:47,019 --> 01:02:49,000 and he hounded Jackie Onassis. 1421 01:02:49,002 --> 01:02:51,027 And Pete wanted to whack him out a couple of times. 1422 01:02:51,029 --> 01:02:53,009 It made the old Brooklyn come out. 1423 01:02:53,011 --> 01:02:55,017 ♪ That's the way to live ♪ 1424 01:02:55,019 --> 01:02:56,028 You never knew who the hell 1425 01:02:57,000 --> 01:02:58,026 he was bringing to Thanksgiving dinner. 1426 01:02:58,028 --> 01:03:02,020 One day, Linda Ronstadt came walking into my house. 1427 01:03:02,022 --> 01:03:04,015 Talese: I thought, what does he have? 1428 01:03:04,017 --> 01:03:06,022 I mean, what is he, Mr. America in the bed? 1429 01:03:06,024 --> 01:03:08,001 What is the deal with him? 1430 01:03:08,003 --> 01:03:10,010 He knew how to listen. And these women, 1431 01:03:10,012 --> 01:03:14,016 they didn't have men who gave a shit about what they said, 1432 01:03:14,018 --> 01:03:16,010 and they didn't know how to listen. 1433 01:03:16,012 --> 01:03:19,008 And listening is the route to sex and grammar. 1434 01:03:19,010 --> 01:03:21,012 And Pete Hamill, who went to high school, 1435 01:03:21,014 --> 01:03:22,025 maybe, and not much further, 1436 01:03:22,027 --> 01:03:26,000 seemed to pick up that this is the key 1437 01:03:26,002 --> 01:03:29,000 to a glamorous life, with some damn glamorous women. 1438 01:03:29,028 --> 01:03:31,029 Man: I got to know Shirley MacLaine through Pete Hamill. 1439 01:03:32,001 --> 01:03:33,021 ♪ ♪ 1440 01:03:33,023 --> 01:03:35,028 MacLaine: His assuredness in what was fair 1441 01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:39,001 and what wasn't really moved me. 1442 01:03:39,026 --> 01:03:42,022 I loved that he was from Brooklyn. 1443 01:03:42,024 --> 01:03:44,017 We lived in Brooklyn for a while. 1444 01:03:44,019 --> 01:03:47,026 We had so much fun doing nothing. 1445 01:03:47,028 --> 01:03:51,019 I loved our long walks in New York. 1446 01:03:51,021 --> 01:03:55,001 But Jimmy, I remember, called me up one day, 1447 01:03:55,003 --> 01:03:56,023 and said, "God damn it, 1448 01:03:56,025 --> 01:04:00,000 "I hope what you're writing is all made up. 1449 01:04:00,002 --> 01:04:02,014 You can't believe that shit, can you?" 1450 01:04:02,016 --> 01:04:03,016 I said, no, Jimmy. 1451 01:04:03,018 --> 01:04:05,015 I'm believing what I'm learning, 1452 01:04:05,017 --> 01:04:10,000 from other dimensional truth, Jimmy. Um... 1453 01:04:10,025 --> 01:04:13,013 (Breslin speaking) 1454 01:04:23,011 --> 01:04:26,000 Denis (laughing): And then God damn Breslin writes a column! 1455 01:04:26,002 --> 01:04:29,012 And then Pete's sitting in New York, 1456 01:04:29,014 --> 01:04:30,023 and he sees this column! 1457 01:04:31,015 --> 01:04:34,025 Breslin writing about Shirley and Jackie! 1458 01:04:34,027 --> 01:04:36,013 Breslin: Shirley should get another guy 1459 01:04:36,015 --> 01:04:37,026 and go out on Pete Hamill. 1460 01:04:37,028 --> 01:04:40,016 What's good for the goose is good for the gander. 1461 01:04:40,018 --> 01:04:42,001 Denis: Shirley hit the roof, 1462 01:04:42,003 --> 01:04:44,024 but Jackie got a big kick out of it. You know... 1463 01:04:45,025 --> 01:04:47,015 And he finally got Breslin on the phone, 1464 01:04:47,017 --> 01:04:48,018 and in classic Breslin, 1465 01:04:48,020 --> 01:04:50,009 Breslin said, "I needed it!" 1466 01:04:50,011 --> 01:04:52,025 Like he was stuck for a column! 1467 01:04:52,027 --> 01:04:54,005 Breslin was a notorious thief. 1468 01:04:54,007 --> 01:04:55,017 You could give Jimmy an idea, 1469 01:04:55,019 --> 01:04:57,025 you'll find it in his column the next day. 1470 01:04:57,027 --> 01:04:59,019 MacLaine: I called Jimmy and raised hell. 1471 01:04:59,021 --> 01:05:02,003 What the hell are you doing? 1472 01:05:03,006 --> 01:05:05,015 Think of something more 1473 01:05:05,017 --> 01:05:09,006 advanced where your intelligence is concerned, 1474 01:05:09,008 --> 01:05:12,006 than who Pete dates, for God's sake. 1475 01:05:12,008 --> 01:05:14,001 Interviewer: So, talking about Jackie, 1476 01:05:14,003 --> 01:05:15,018 were you in love with her, Pete? 1477 01:05:15,020 --> 01:05:18,008 Uh, I wouldn't tell you that. 1478 01:05:18,010 --> 01:05:19,029 I'd really agree with 1479 01:05:20,001 --> 01:05:22,017 Garcia Marquez, who said once, 1480 01:05:22,019 --> 01:05:25,029 that everybody's got three lives. 1481 01:05:26,001 --> 01:05:28,009 Public life, a private life, 1482 01:05:28,011 --> 01:05:29,027 and a secret life. 1483 01:05:29,029 --> 01:05:33,007 Private life is by invitation only. 1484 01:05:33,009 --> 01:05:36,019 The secret life is nobody's business. 1485 01:05:38,003 --> 01:05:39,022 (typewriter clacks) 1486 01:05:39,024 --> 01:05:41,014 ♪ ♪ 1487 01:05:41,016 --> 01:05:43,004 Newsman: In New York, the search continues 1488 01:05:43,006 --> 01:05:46,002 for the .44 Caliber Killer, Son of Sam. 1489 01:05:46,004 --> 01:05:48,013 His victims, mostly young women 1490 01:05:48,015 --> 01:05:50,011 with shoulder-length dark hair, 1491 01:05:50,013 --> 01:05:52,020 usually shot at very close range, 1492 01:05:52,022 --> 01:05:55,010 while sitting in parked cars at night. 1493 01:05:55,012 --> 01:05:58,027 They've been shot with a .44 caliber, Bulldog revolver. 1494 01:05:58,029 --> 01:06:00,017 (gunshots) 1495 01:06:00,019 --> 01:06:02,020 (alarm ringing) 1496 01:06:03,026 --> 01:06:05,019 Breslin: I was living in a section of Queens 1497 01:06:05,021 --> 01:06:07,020 called Forest Hills Gardens. 1498 01:06:07,022 --> 01:06:10,014 He killed one young woman, Christine Freund, 1499 01:06:10,016 --> 01:06:12,018 five blocks from my house. 1500 01:06:13,019 --> 01:06:16,018 Five weeks later, at virtually the same spot, 1501 01:06:16,020 --> 01:06:19,010 Virgina Voskerichian, walking from the subway 1502 01:06:19,012 --> 01:06:22,007 after classes at Barnard College in Manhattan, 1503 01:06:22,009 --> 01:06:24,025 had a gunman suddenly crouch in front of her. 1504 01:06:25,020 --> 01:06:28,015 (Breslin speaking) 1505 01:06:37,006 --> 01:06:38,025 Patrick: Anne Marie called and said, "Jimmy, 1506 01:06:38,027 --> 01:06:40,025 "I got the scariest letter in the world 1507 01:06:40,027 --> 01:06:42,021 here at the paper." 1508 01:06:42,023 --> 01:06:44,002 ♪ ♪ 1509 01:06:44,004 --> 01:06:46,016 Breslin: "Hello from the gutters of NYC, 1510 01:06:46,018 --> 01:06:49,010 "which are filled with dog manure, vomit, 1511 01:06:49,012 --> 01:06:51,018 "stale wine, urine, and blood. 1512 01:06:51,020 --> 01:06:55,010 "Hello from the sewers which swallow up these delicacies 1513 01:06:55,012 --> 01:06:58,002 when they are washed away by the sweeper trucks." 1514 01:06:58,020 --> 01:07:02,001 It was printed in big, backslash printing, 1515 01:07:02,003 --> 01:07:04,009 marvelous cadence. 1516 01:07:04,011 --> 01:07:06,000 Signed, Son of Sam. 1517 01:07:07,000 --> 01:07:09,027 All of a sudden, you get a letter from Hannibal Lecter 1518 01:07:09,029 --> 01:07:12,019 saying I wanna talk to you. Holy smokes! 1519 01:07:12,021 --> 01:07:14,024 What kind of power did he have? I mean, 1520 01:07:14,026 --> 01:07:16,021 that gives you an indication of the... 1521 01:07:16,023 --> 01:07:19,011 seductiveness of those columns he wrote. 1522 01:07:19,013 --> 01:07:21,014 He got into people's heads 1523 01:07:21,016 --> 01:07:23,021 in a way that most writers can't do. 1524 01:07:23,023 --> 01:07:26,005 "Oh wow, he wrote to Breslin! He wrote to Jimmy Bre--" 1525 01:07:26,007 --> 01:07:29,000 But like in those days, Jimmy Breslin was a big enough 1526 01:07:29,002 --> 01:07:30,018 star, where you'd be like, 1527 01:07:30,020 --> 01:07:33,009 oh, it's a little crazy, but yeah. (laughing) 1528 01:07:33,011 --> 01:07:34,019 Yeah, why not Jimmy Breslin? 1529 01:07:35,018 --> 01:07:36,023 Breslin: The police called and said, 1530 01:07:36,025 --> 01:07:38,019 "could we meet you at the 109th Precinct? 1531 01:07:38,021 --> 01:07:40,013 This is a letter from the fella." 1532 01:07:40,015 --> 01:07:43,028 He said now, "What do you think you could do with it to help us?" 1533 01:07:44,017 --> 01:07:47,002 Clark: Jimmy comes up to the squad room. It was like, 1534 01:07:47,004 --> 01:07:49,028 "What the hell is that guy doing here? You know, 1535 01:07:50,000 --> 01:07:52,022 he hates cops. What is he doing up here? Who let him in?" 1536 01:07:52,024 --> 01:07:56,024 This is the guy who brought us the letter from the Son of Sam. 1537 01:07:56,026 --> 01:07:58,012 Roberts: The police urged us to 1538 01:07:58,014 --> 01:08:02,007 print the letters and Jimmy to reply to the letters, 1539 01:08:02,009 --> 01:08:04,018 in hopes that he would continue writing, 1540 01:08:04,020 --> 01:08:07,023 and there would be more clues to his identity. 1541 01:08:08,009 --> 01:08:10,000 Interviewer: What would you wanna talk to him about? 1542 01:08:10,002 --> 01:08:12,010 -You wanna talk to him about his writing? -I mean, he writes so well. 1543 01:08:12,012 --> 01:08:14,003 It's a shame to waste it out there! 1544 01:08:14,005 --> 01:08:16,013 I thought Hamill wrote the thing, it was... to me. 1545 01:08:16,015 --> 01:08:18,007 I'm not kidding! It's a well-written piece. 1546 01:08:18,009 --> 01:08:20,005 The guy could make a living writing! 1547 01:08:20,007 --> 01:08:22,012 He told me, "We're telling the guy he's a good writer." 1548 01:08:22,014 --> 01:08:24,028 I was like, what!? You're using the newspaper 1549 01:08:25,001 --> 01:08:26,021 to see if he can sucker a guy? 1550 01:08:26,023 --> 01:08:28,015 And he said, "Well, basically, yes." 1551 01:08:28,017 --> 01:08:30,026 He probably is the first 1552 01:08:30,028 --> 01:08:32,018 killer that I can ever recall 1553 01:08:32,020 --> 01:08:35,006 who understands the use of the semi-colon. 1554 01:08:35,008 --> 01:08:38,015 I think he's had some kind of training, obviously. 1555 01:08:38,017 --> 01:08:39,027 Clark: There's no doubt in the world that 1556 01:08:39,029 --> 01:08:41,018 Jimmy was very instrumental in keeping attention 1557 01:08:41,020 --> 01:08:45,002 on the case. I mean, he was a major player in the thing. 1558 01:08:45,004 --> 01:08:46,028 ♪ ♪ 1559 01:08:47,000 --> 01:08:48,012 Shane Smith: "The only way for the killer 1560 01:08:48,014 --> 01:08:50,003 "to leave this special torment 1561 01:08:50,005 --> 01:08:52,001 "is to give himself up to me. 1562 01:08:52,003 --> 01:08:55,005 "All he has to do is call or write me at theDaily News. 1563 01:08:55,007 --> 01:08:56,010 "It's simple to get me. 1564 01:08:56,012 --> 01:08:59,015 The only people I don't answer are bill collectors." 1565 01:08:59,017 --> 01:09:01,012 So, he's asking a serial killer 1566 01:09:01,014 --> 01:09:03,018 to give himself up to him. 1567 01:09:03,020 --> 01:09:05,016 Fantastic. Takes balls. 1568 01:09:06,023 --> 01:09:09,021 Man: I am very pleased to announce that the police 1569 01:09:09,023 --> 01:09:11,012 have captured 1570 01:09:11,014 --> 01:09:14,014 a man whom they believe to be the Son of Sam. 1571 01:09:14,016 --> 01:09:16,014 Newsman: David Berkowitz, 24, 1572 01:09:16,016 --> 01:09:19,006 spent his days sorting letters in the post office, 1573 01:09:19,008 --> 01:09:22,012 so meek and mild and quiet, nobody ever noticed him. 1574 01:09:22,014 --> 01:09:23,024 Newsman 2: He had a faint smile 1575 01:09:23,026 --> 01:09:25,020 as police moved him around the city today 1576 01:09:25,022 --> 01:09:27,008 for booking, to court, 1577 01:09:27,010 --> 01:09:29,003 finally, to a mental ward. 1578 01:09:29,005 --> 01:09:32,013 He made a statement, "Well, you got me." 1579 01:09:32,015 --> 01:09:34,021 Newsman: In the end, it was this parking ticket 1580 01:09:34,023 --> 01:09:36,016 that lead police to Berkowitz. 1581 01:09:36,018 --> 01:09:38,013 Breslin: There was a woman in Brooklyn was out the night 1582 01:09:38,015 --> 01:09:40,018 Son of Sam had shot the last two people. 1583 01:09:40,020 --> 01:09:42,010 And she had seen the car 1584 01:09:42,012 --> 01:09:45,010 and remembered it had a parking ticket in the car. 1585 01:09:45,012 --> 01:09:47,010 And when she told police what she had seen, 1586 01:09:47,012 --> 01:09:49,006 it was bingo. 1587 01:09:50,003 --> 01:09:51,024 Interviewer: Did you ever have a moment saying, 1588 01:09:51,026 --> 01:09:53,006 "Jeez, did I cause this? 1589 01:09:53,008 --> 01:09:55,004 Did this column trigger this nut?" 1590 01:09:55,006 --> 01:09:59,020 No. And in reading the psychiatric report 1591 01:09:59,022 --> 01:10:02,021 on Berkowitz, it just would-- when it's released finally, 1592 01:10:02,023 --> 01:10:04,008 it'll just reinforce that, too. I mean... 1593 01:10:04,010 --> 01:10:05,028 Garry Trudeau: The Son of Sam story 1594 01:10:06,000 --> 01:10:08,019 raised all kinds of horrible questions about, 1595 01:10:08,021 --> 01:10:10,028 you know, how this is taking new journalism 1596 01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:14,012 into new territory by having 1597 01:10:14,014 --> 01:10:17,015 a public dialogue with a serial killer. 1598 01:10:17,017 --> 01:10:19,010 You know, I think it came to the fact that, 1599 01:10:19,012 --> 01:10:21,022 explaining why that original letter was published in the news, 1600 01:10:21,024 --> 01:10:23,001 which I have a lot of problems with, 1601 01:10:23,003 --> 01:10:25,013 -it's the police-- -You have problems with 1602 01:10:25,015 --> 01:10:26,018 publishing that letter? 1603 01:10:26,020 --> 01:10:28,015 Then obviously, you're not in the news business. 1604 01:10:28,017 --> 01:10:30,010 You never even considered that that 1605 01:10:30,012 --> 01:10:32,016 might have prompted him to do a killing that particular time? 1606 01:10:32,018 --> 01:10:34,014 Well, then, what should we do? Not write? 1607 01:10:34,016 --> 01:10:36,021 I think you wrote a good deal too much about it, yeah. 1608 01:10:36,023 --> 01:10:38,000 I certainly do, and I think that... 1609 01:10:38,002 --> 01:10:40,025 The strips that I did were a parody 1610 01:10:40,027 --> 01:10:44,003 on this exploitation of a very terrible story. 1611 01:10:44,005 --> 01:10:45,016 ♪ ♪ 1612 01:10:45,018 --> 01:10:47,024 In the strip, I had a fictional character named 1613 01:10:47,026 --> 01:10:49,026 Son of Arnold and Mary Leiberman, 1614 01:10:49,028 --> 01:10:52,024 call into the New York Daily News, and try to pitch his story 1615 01:10:52,026 --> 01:10:55,005 before he'd actually started committing murders. 1616 01:10:55,007 --> 01:10:56,026 And over the week, 1617 01:10:56,028 --> 01:10:58,019 he couldn't get a hold of Breslin, 1618 01:10:58,021 --> 01:11:00,017 because Breslin's too busy negotiating 1619 01:11:00,019 --> 01:11:02,015 the movie rights for Son of Sam. 1620 01:11:02,017 --> 01:11:04,026 And by the end of the week, he gives up. 1621 01:11:06,028 --> 01:11:10,007 Interviewer: Do you think that that was the biggest story of your career? 1622 01:11:10,009 --> 01:11:12,022 Oh, God forbid, no, I hope not. 1623 01:11:12,024 --> 01:11:14,025 What was the biggest story of your career? 1624 01:11:14,027 --> 01:11:17,029 -Me. -Why were you the biggest story of your career? 1625 01:11:18,001 --> 01:11:20,021 Read! You'll see. 1626 01:11:20,023 --> 01:11:22,023 (thunder rumbling) 1627 01:11:22,025 --> 01:11:26,010 ♪ ♪ 1628 01:11:26,012 --> 01:11:29,000 Breslin: My first wife Rosemary and I lived together 1629 01:11:29,002 --> 01:11:31,001 in love and affection that was deeper 1630 01:11:31,003 --> 01:11:34,029 when she died in the middle of a rainy night in June in 1981, 1631 01:11:35,001 --> 01:11:37,003 than when I met her on a Saturday night 1632 01:11:37,005 --> 01:11:40,000 in the spring of 1952. 1633 01:11:40,002 --> 01:11:42,027 She came running into the Crossroads Bar. 1634 01:11:42,029 --> 01:11:44,018 The car had dropped dead across the street 1635 01:11:44,020 --> 01:11:46,018 on the way home from the wedding. 1636 01:11:47,006 --> 01:11:48,023 She came through the door laughing 1637 01:11:48,025 --> 01:11:50,021 and with rain on her face. 1638 01:11:50,023 --> 01:11:53,003 "I caught the bride's bouquet," she said. 1639 01:11:53,005 --> 01:11:54,028 She threw the flowers to me. 1640 01:11:55,000 --> 01:11:57,016 "Now you caught it! You wanna get married?" 1641 01:11:57,018 --> 01:11:59,008 ♪ ♪ 1642 01:12:00,025 --> 01:12:04,017 I knew she was gone just as fast as I fell in love with her. 1643 01:12:04,019 --> 01:12:07,023 She had an operation for breast cancer in 1976, 1644 01:12:07,025 --> 01:12:10,010 and then seemed fine for years. 1645 01:12:10,025 --> 01:12:14,019 She ran my life, and those of her children, almost totally. 1646 01:12:14,021 --> 01:12:16,028 She leaves us with a tradition of decency 1647 01:12:17,000 --> 01:12:19,014 that we must accept to carry on. 1648 01:12:20,006 --> 01:12:23,001 As was said of another aristocrat such as this one... 1649 01:12:24,008 --> 01:12:26,029 "Earth received an honored guest." 1650 01:12:28,011 --> 01:12:29,027 He was devastated. 1651 01:12:29,029 --> 01:12:32,011 Completely devastated. 1652 01:12:33,014 --> 01:12:36,015 ♪ ♪ 1653 01:12:40,002 --> 01:12:43,018 James: It was really the end of the era in Forest Hills. 1654 01:12:43,020 --> 01:12:46,017 The door on that house, for him, was closed. 1655 01:12:46,019 --> 01:12:49,000 He did not have the ability 1656 01:12:49,002 --> 01:12:51,000 to, you know, really deal with 1657 01:12:51,002 --> 01:12:53,013 the single-parent family. 1658 01:12:54,012 --> 01:12:56,017 Patrick: I've never seen a person 1659 01:12:56,019 --> 01:12:59,003 who cares about people so much, 1660 01:12:59,005 --> 01:13:01,023 but doesn't express it directly to that person. 1661 01:13:02,022 --> 01:13:06,002 And I don't even think I saw him cry at my mother's funeral. 1662 01:13:06,004 --> 01:13:09,000 And he wouldn't let us do it either. 1663 01:13:17,019 --> 01:13:19,020 ♪ ♪ 1664 01:13:33,016 --> 01:13:35,021 Breslin: My wife died and that took me out of here. 1665 01:13:35,023 --> 01:13:38,021 I walked out. I couldn't even look at the place. 1666 01:13:39,018 --> 01:13:41,004 Gone! 1667 01:13:41,028 --> 01:13:43,014 Get me out. 1668 01:13:44,019 --> 01:13:46,015 I don't want any memories. 1669 01:13:50,002 --> 01:13:53,003 ♪ ♪ 1670 01:14:07,006 --> 01:14:09,022 I always went to work the next day. 1671 01:14:12,004 --> 01:14:14,005 What do you-- Do you wanna sit home? 1672 01:14:14,024 --> 01:14:16,014 Oh... 1673 01:14:17,013 --> 01:14:19,014 Not I. 1674 01:14:20,025 --> 01:14:23,015 He came up to the bedroom in Forest Hills. 1675 01:14:23,017 --> 01:14:26,003 It was six o'clock in the morning. Kicked my bed, told me to... 1676 01:14:26,023 --> 01:14:28,023 I'll speak truthfully, "Get the fuck up and go to work." 1677 01:14:28,025 --> 01:14:31,006 That was the day after my mother was buried. 1678 01:14:31,008 --> 01:14:33,004 "Stop your crying. 1679 01:14:34,000 --> 01:14:36,003 Life goes on, the clock doesn't stop." 1680 01:14:36,005 --> 01:14:37,010 I remember those quotes. 1681 01:14:37,012 --> 01:14:40,001 They're burned in my brain. 1682 01:14:40,003 --> 01:14:42,014 The clock doesn't stop. 1683 01:14:42,016 --> 01:14:45,018 Time is the most valuable thing on Earth. 1684 01:14:48,007 --> 01:14:51,023 ♪ ♪ 1685 01:14:55,004 --> 01:14:56,025 Ronnie Eldridge: He thinks there's nothing 1686 01:14:56,027 --> 01:14:59,008 as lonely as the sun on a blade of grass, 1687 01:14:59,010 --> 01:15:02,016 and nothing as beautiful as a crowded street in Brooklyn. 1688 01:15:02,018 --> 01:15:05,006 He thinks boring is a felony crime. 1689 01:15:05,008 --> 01:15:06,021 He loves New York 1690 01:15:06,023 --> 01:15:09,017 and thrives on its energy and excitement. 1691 01:15:09,019 --> 01:15:13,010 And finally, he's been my husband for almost 20 years. 1692 01:15:13,012 --> 01:15:15,015 Together, we have nine children, 1693 01:15:15,017 --> 01:15:17,020 and 10 grandchildren. 1694 01:15:17,022 --> 01:15:19,019 So, welcome to my program, 1695 01:15:19,021 --> 01:15:21,006 Eldridge & Company. 1696 01:15:21,008 --> 01:15:23,010 -Yes. -Can you believe that you've been married to me 1697 01:15:23,012 --> 01:15:25,005 -for almost 20 years? -Yes. 1698 01:15:25,007 --> 01:15:26,023 Been delightful. Why, you haven't liked it? 1699 01:15:26,025 --> 01:15:29,004 No, it's been a challenge, but it's been great. 1700 01:15:29,006 --> 01:15:31,015 It's never boring. As we've already said, 1701 01:15:31,017 --> 01:15:33,005 -you don't like that, right? -No. 1702 01:15:33,007 --> 01:15:36,000 Anybody out there that is thinking 1703 01:15:36,002 --> 01:15:38,010 of getting married, and gonna take on 1704 01:15:38,012 --> 01:15:40,012 step-children from two marriages, 1705 01:15:40,014 --> 01:15:42,008 under the same roof, 1706 01:15:42,010 --> 01:15:45,001 do me a favor, I'll give you the home number. 212-496-- 1707 01:15:45,003 --> 01:15:46,015 -Host: Oh, I wouldn't do that. -(laughter) 1708 01:15:46,017 --> 01:15:48,017 Call me! 7616. 1709 01:15:48,019 --> 01:15:50,018 Call me, I'll tell you the truth. 1710 01:15:50,020 --> 01:15:52,011 Don't even try it! 1711 01:15:52,013 --> 01:15:54,025 (laughter, applause) 1712 01:15:54,027 --> 01:15:57,003 Everybody hated everybody. 1713 01:15:57,005 --> 01:15:59,010 It was beautiful. 1714 01:15:59,012 --> 01:16:02,025 Eldridge: Jimmy is very supportive of me and my career. 1715 01:16:02,027 --> 01:16:04,009 He wanted me to run for office. 1716 01:16:04,011 --> 01:16:07,014 I don't think I would've if he hadn't really prodded me. 1717 01:16:07,016 --> 01:16:10,015 He taught me a lot because he has that ability 1718 01:16:10,017 --> 01:16:12,009 to go to the heart of an issue. 1719 01:16:12,011 --> 01:16:14,008 You know, shortly after we were married, 1720 01:16:14,010 --> 01:16:16,012 I'd pick up the news, and it's Jimmy saying 1721 01:16:16,014 --> 01:16:18,019 he's gonna go and live on the street. 1722 01:16:18,021 --> 01:16:20,010 He's gonna be a homeless man. 1723 01:16:20,012 --> 01:16:22,027 He had had a feud with the Koch administration 1724 01:16:22,029 --> 01:16:25,019 'cause they had moved a homeless man off a highway. 1725 01:16:25,021 --> 01:16:27,001 This homeless man had been living there 1726 01:16:27,003 --> 01:16:29,020 in a beach lounge chair and holding his cup out. 1727 01:16:29,022 --> 01:16:30,024 And Jimmy wrote about him, 1728 01:16:30,026 --> 01:16:32,001 and the next thing you knew, 1729 01:16:32,003 --> 01:16:34,010 Jimmy became a homeless man. 1730 01:16:34,012 --> 01:16:35,023 Every homeless person in New York, 1731 01:16:35,025 --> 01:16:37,023 it seemed to me, came to visit him. 1732 01:16:37,025 --> 01:16:39,013 Interviewer: When he finally got his Pulitzer, 1733 01:16:39,015 --> 01:16:43,002 it was for that connection to ordinary people. 1734 01:16:43,004 --> 01:16:45,000 And putting faces to AIDS patients. 1735 01:16:45,002 --> 01:16:47,010 To me, he won the Pulitzer Prize for that, 1736 01:16:47,012 --> 01:16:50,007 in a time when AIDS was scaring people half to death. 1737 01:16:50,009 --> 01:16:51,005 (typewriter clacks) 1738 01:16:52,012 --> 01:16:53,028 (crowd shouting) 1739 01:16:57,003 --> 01:17:00,027 James Duff: All around us, there was a crisis. 1740 01:17:00,029 --> 01:17:03,024 I lost 70% of my friends. 1741 01:17:04,026 --> 01:17:07,004 David Camacho was 1742 01:17:07,006 --> 01:17:10,002 the first big love of my life. 1743 01:17:10,023 --> 01:17:13,002 When David got sick, 1744 01:17:13,004 --> 01:17:15,015 we went to dinner with 10 people. 1745 01:17:15,017 --> 01:17:17,023 And everybody else was served 1746 01:17:17,025 --> 01:17:19,025 with plates and silverware, 1747 01:17:19,027 --> 01:17:22,005 and we were served with plastic dishes 1748 01:17:22,007 --> 01:17:24,028 and plastic forks and knives. 1749 01:17:25,000 --> 01:17:27,019 And this is the kind of willful ignorance 1750 01:17:27,021 --> 01:17:29,024 in which people were living. 1751 01:17:29,026 --> 01:17:33,014 And into this walked Jimmy Breslin. 1752 01:17:34,003 --> 01:17:37,012 Jimmy was looking for a way to tell this story, 1753 01:17:37,014 --> 01:17:40,004 and asked David if he... 1754 01:17:40,006 --> 01:17:41,017 would be willing to talk about it. 1755 01:17:41,019 --> 01:17:44,002 David was, "Absolutely. 1756 01:17:44,004 --> 01:17:47,014 I want people to know this is happening to human beings." 1757 01:17:48,012 --> 01:17:49,023 Breslin: He had two good weeks in July, 1758 01:17:49,025 --> 01:17:50,027 and then the fever returned 1759 01:17:50,029 --> 01:17:52,008 and he was back in the hospital 1760 01:17:52,010 --> 01:17:54,001 for half of last August. 1761 01:17:54,026 --> 01:17:57,014 He got out again and returned to 8th Street. 1762 01:17:57,016 --> 01:17:59,022 The date this time doesn't count. 1763 01:17:59,024 --> 01:18:02,026 (Breslin speaking) 1764 01:18:15,023 --> 01:18:17,017 Tell me about living with David. 1765 01:18:17,019 --> 01:18:19,008 Duff: Well, let's see. 1766 01:18:19,010 --> 01:18:22,011 He came home from work one day 1767 01:18:22,013 --> 01:18:24,022 with a temperature of 104 degrees, 1768 01:18:24,024 --> 01:18:26,014 and he was bright red. 1769 01:18:26,016 --> 01:18:27,029 He had those damn things 1770 01:18:28,001 --> 01:18:30,003 -that show on your face. Those... -The lesions, yeah. 1771 01:18:30,005 --> 01:18:32,009 He didn't care about the lesions, out he was going. 1772 01:18:32,011 --> 01:18:34,020 But you can't convince a government that a disease is... 1773 01:18:34,022 --> 01:18:37,023 No, this person, this person, who went to Rutgers, 1774 01:18:37,025 --> 01:18:40,007 who worked his, his heart out... 1775 01:18:40,009 --> 01:18:41,003 Mmm. 1776 01:18:41,005 --> 01:18:43,026 for the rights of the... 1777 01:18:43,028 --> 01:18:45,027 underprivileged in this country, 1778 01:18:45,029 --> 01:18:48,019 is not considered a human being by this government. 1779 01:18:48,021 --> 01:18:51,004 -Hmm. -And so, what does it matter? 1780 01:18:51,006 --> 01:18:53,001 It's just one more faggot 1781 01:18:53,003 --> 01:18:55,001 in a graveyard. 1782 01:18:55,003 --> 01:18:57,028 ♪ ♪ 1783 01:18:58,000 --> 01:19:00,029 After the interview Jimmy did with me, 1784 01:19:01,022 --> 01:19:04,002 I was working at a theater restaurant, 1785 01:19:04,004 --> 01:19:07,016 and Jimmy would come in, 1786 01:19:07,018 --> 01:19:10,011 and he would ask for a coffee. 1787 01:19:10,013 --> 01:19:12,020 And he said to me, 1788 01:19:12,022 --> 01:19:16,000 "What are you doing, James? What are you doing here?" 1789 01:19:16,002 --> 01:19:18,003 I didn't come from a wealthy family. 1790 01:19:18,005 --> 01:19:19,017 I had to work. 1791 01:19:19,019 --> 01:19:22,011 And I also thought I was probably gonna drop dead soon. 1792 01:19:22,013 --> 01:19:25,001 And Jimmy was like, "But, what if you don't drop dead? 1793 01:19:26,005 --> 01:19:28,020 "You don't wanna do this the rest of your life. 1794 01:19:28,022 --> 01:19:29,028 You should be writing something." 1795 01:19:30,000 --> 01:19:31,021 And I would say, "Well, I don't know what to write." 1796 01:19:31,023 --> 01:19:33,026 And he goes, "Like that makes a difference. 1797 01:19:33,028 --> 01:19:35,029 "I don't know what to write most of the time. 1798 01:19:36,001 --> 01:19:37,024 "I go outside, I find something to write about. 1799 01:19:37,026 --> 01:19:38,028 Write something." 1800 01:19:39,000 --> 01:19:40,016 He would hector me. 1801 01:19:41,027 --> 01:19:43,020 He came in a difficult time, 1802 01:19:43,022 --> 01:19:45,005 and he could have just walked away. 1803 01:19:45,007 --> 01:19:46,024 He got everything he needed. 1804 01:19:47,015 --> 01:19:49,001 And he didn't. 1805 01:20:04,010 --> 01:20:06,016 Carillo: We're looking at the Manhattan Mini Storage facility 1806 01:20:06,018 --> 01:20:08,029 in Lower Manhattan, and this used to be the New York Post. 1807 01:20:09,001 --> 01:20:10,019 This is where I worked for many years. 1808 01:20:10,021 --> 01:20:13,028 Right on the river, between the Manhattan and the Brooklyn Bridges. 1809 01:20:14,000 --> 01:20:16,003 Any time there was a Brooklyn Bridge jumper, 1810 01:20:16,005 --> 01:20:17,020 everybody would rush to the window, 1811 01:20:17,022 --> 01:20:19,020 and the photographer would put a long lens on the camera, 1812 01:20:19,022 --> 01:20:22,025 and follow the guy. Click, click, click, click, splash! 1813 01:20:22,027 --> 01:20:24,020 It was quite an experience for a young man. 1814 01:20:24,022 --> 01:20:27,010 And this is where I knew Pete Hamill. 1815 01:20:27,012 --> 01:20:28,019 (typewriter clacks) 1816 01:20:30,005 --> 01:20:33,005 Alter: In the '90s, when newspapers were hemorrhaging cash, 1817 01:20:33,007 --> 01:20:35,012 and often changing hands, 1818 01:20:35,014 --> 01:20:37,022 Pete somehow managed, at different times, 1819 01:20:37,024 --> 01:20:41,024 to be editor of both the New York Daily News and the New York Post. 1820 01:20:41,026 --> 01:20:44,008 Avlon: Pete Hamill goes on an editor's track. 1821 01:20:44,010 --> 01:20:47,000 He notably goes and tries to be editor-in-chief 1822 01:20:47,002 --> 01:20:49,013 at theNew York Post, in a time of real flux, 1823 01:20:49,015 --> 01:20:51,012 trying to turn the tide 1824 01:20:51,014 --> 01:20:52,014 during the death of print. 1825 01:20:52,016 --> 01:20:54,017 Kosner: Pete is a wonderful editor. 1826 01:20:54,019 --> 01:20:56,000 And he was a wonderful manager 1827 01:20:56,002 --> 01:20:58,014 because he's a wonderful person. Everybody loved him, 1828 01:20:58,016 --> 01:21:00,002 and people respected him. 1829 01:21:00,004 --> 01:21:01,027 Carillo: He'd come to you, and he'd say, "Well, 1830 01:21:01,029 --> 01:21:04,005 you know, that lead, maybe you should try..." 1831 01:21:04,007 --> 01:21:05,008 He would never say, "Do this!" 1832 01:21:05,010 --> 01:21:07,005 And you'd realize, oh, he's right. He's right. 1833 01:21:07,007 --> 01:21:10,026 I think this man knows what he's talking about, and he certainly did. 1834 01:21:12,006 --> 01:21:14,010 I did not fire Pete Hamill. 1835 01:21:14,012 --> 01:21:17,004 (crowd shouting angrily) 1836 01:21:17,006 --> 01:21:19,022 Newswoman: Two days after a bankruptcy judge awarded ownership 1837 01:21:19,024 --> 01:21:21,010 of thePost to Abe Hirschfeld, 1838 01:21:21,012 --> 01:21:23,013 Hirschfeld held a news conference announcing 1839 01:21:23,015 --> 01:21:25,006 Wilbert Tatum to run the paper. 1840 01:21:25,008 --> 01:21:27,010 This is what happened when Hirschfeld told workers 1841 01:21:27,012 --> 01:21:28,021 he didn't fire Hamill. 1842 01:21:28,023 --> 01:21:30,027 (angry shouting) 1843 01:21:30,029 --> 01:21:34,000 ♪ ♪ 1844 01:21:36,017 --> 01:21:37,026 Newsman: Hirschfeld shot back today 1845 01:21:37,028 --> 01:21:39,027 by firing 71 employees, 1846 01:21:39,029 --> 01:21:41,011 and threatening to fold the paper 1847 01:21:41,013 --> 01:21:42,018 if it doesn't publish tomorrow. 1848 01:21:43,010 --> 01:21:44,026 Man: This is for Abe Hirschfeld, 1849 01:21:44,028 --> 01:21:48,004 this is a cheap two-dollar tie that he gives out as a gift. 1850 01:21:48,006 --> 01:21:49,023 This is a cheap piece of shit. 1851 01:21:49,025 --> 01:21:51,022 We're gonna burn it here. 1852 01:21:53,008 --> 01:21:55,008 Fuck you, Abe! Fuck you! 1853 01:21:56,002 --> 01:21:57,029 Hamill: More than anything else, 1854 01:21:58,001 --> 01:21:59,021 I'm sad about the possibility 1855 01:21:59,023 --> 01:22:01,028 that this paper is in mortal danger. 1856 01:22:03,006 --> 01:22:04,025 Alter: In defiance of Abe Hirschfeld, 1857 01:22:04,027 --> 01:22:06,029 the inmates, basically, took over the asylum. 1858 01:22:07,001 --> 01:22:08,022 And with Pete barred from the building, 1859 01:22:09,010 --> 01:22:12,014 the staff put out a paper that trashed their owner. 1860 01:22:13,001 --> 01:22:15,005 Carillo: The opponent's weapons are money and power. 1861 01:22:15,007 --> 01:22:18,005 Our weapons are only words and images. 1862 01:22:18,017 --> 01:22:19,028 So, we fight with what we've got. 1863 01:22:20,000 --> 01:22:21,025 Newsman: After Hirschfield got a court order 1864 01:22:21,027 --> 01:22:23,028 banning Hamill from thePostbuilding, 1865 01:22:24,000 --> 01:22:26,014 the renegade editor conferred with his reporters and editors 1866 01:22:26,016 --> 01:22:28,013 from a diner next door. 1867 01:22:28,015 --> 01:22:30,024 When I picked up today's paper and I saw what those guys did, 1868 01:22:30,026 --> 01:22:33,020 laying their entire careers on the line, 1869 01:22:33,022 --> 01:22:36,023 to put out a newspaper that was totally fearless, 1870 01:22:36,025 --> 01:22:38,002 I had no choice. 1871 01:22:38,004 --> 01:22:40,009 Carillo: So, Pete sat in the South Street Diner, 1872 01:22:40,011 --> 01:22:42,016 and the layout sheets were brought down to him, 1873 01:22:42,018 --> 01:22:44,019 so he could edit the paper, and they went back upstairs 1874 01:22:44,021 --> 01:22:46,026 with ketchup and vinaigrette dressing on them. 1875 01:22:46,028 --> 01:22:48,004 And it was really glory days. 1876 01:22:48,017 --> 01:22:50,011 People got a vicarious thrill 1877 01:22:50,013 --> 01:22:52,028 about the wild west element of theNew York Post. 1878 01:22:54,001 --> 01:22:55,029 -(shutter clicks) -(laughter) 1879 01:22:56,001 --> 01:22:57,010 Newsman: It was a zany scene 1880 01:22:57,012 --> 01:22:58,020 outside bankruptcy court, 1881 01:22:58,022 --> 01:23:00,018 as prospective New York Post publisher, 1882 01:23:00,020 --> 01:23:02,012 Abe Hirschfeld, kissed and made up 1883 01:23:02,014 --> 01:23:04,013 with the editor he fired last week. 1884 01:23:04,015 --> 01:23:06,000 The slaphappy ending came 1885 01:23:06,002 --> 01:23:08,005 after the judge worked out a compromise 1886 01:23:08,007 --> 01:23:09,029 in which Editor-in-Chief Pete Hamill 1887 01:23:10,001 --> 01:23:11,006 gets editorial control, 1888 01:23:11,008 --> 01:23:13,021 and Hirschfeld has legal control of the business. 1889 01:23:14,002 --> 01:23:16,016 Carillo: The revolution was a thrilling thing, 1890 01:23:16,018 --> 01:23:19,014 and even though it wound up to be, sort of, in a losing cause, 1891 01:23:19,016 --> 01:23:20,025 it was unforgettable. 1892 01:23:20,027 --> 01:23:23,014 ♪ ♪ 1893 01:23:23,016 --> 01:23:24,015 Newsman: The nation's oldest, 1894 01:23:24,017 --> 01:23:26,003 continuously published newspaper, 1895 01:23:26,005 --> 01:23:27,021 is now officially bankrupt. 1896 01:23:29,012 --> 01:23:30,027 Newswoman: Enter thePost's former owner, 1897 01:23:30,029 --> 01:23:32,026 Rupert Murdoch. 1898 01:23:34,004 --> 01:23:35,029 Alter: When Murdoch demoted Pete, 1899 01:23:36,001 --> 01:23:38,027 he quit, and that chapter was closed. 1900 01:23:40,020 --> 01:23:42,026 Jimmy was also in the headlines around that time, 1901 01:23:42,028 --> 01:23:44,029 but not in a way you would wanna be. 1902 01:23:46,014 --> 01:23:48,002 Dwyer: I think Jimmy is a genius 1903 01:23:48,004 --> 01:23:50,009 who spent a good part of his life 1904 01:23:50,011 --> 01:23:53,003 trying to persuade people that he's not. 1905 01:23:53,005 --> 01:23:56,010 He does this by being boorish, 1906 01:23:56,012 --> 01:23:57,024 by being impossible, 1907 01:23:57,026 --> 01:24:02,002 making up lists of people he's not talking to this year. 1908 01:24:02,004 --> 01:24:05,011 And it's an act, but sometimes, 1909 01:24:06,010 --> 01:24:08,020 as they say, the dancer becomes the dance. 1910 01:24:08,022 --> 01:24:11,017 ♪ ♪ 1911 01:24:11,019 --> 01:24:13,018 Newsman: Jimmy Breslin is in a heap of trouble 1912 01:24:13,020 --> 01:24:15,013 for alleged racial slurs, 1913 01:24:15,015 --> 01:24:18,001 and the staff of Newsday's in an uproar. 1914 01:24:18,003 --> 01:24:19,006 Newsman 2: It all began when 1915 01:24:19,008 --> 01:24:21,016 New YorkNewsday columnist Jimmy Breslin 1916 01:24:21,018 --> 01:24:23,007 wrote this column last week, 1917 01:24:23,009 --> 01:24:24,013 complaining that his wife 1918 01:24:24,015 --> 01:24:26,019 was not spending enough time at home with him. 1919 01:24:26,021 --> 01:24:28,022 Enter Ji-Yeon Mary Yuh, 1920 01:24:28,024 --> 01:24:32,004 25-year-old reporter working for the same newspaper. 1921 01:24:32,006 --> 01:24:35,002 Yuh: It seemed off from the image 1922 01:24:35,004 --> 01:24:36,015 of Jimmy Breslin, the columnist, 1923 01:24:36,017 --> 01:24:38,005 that I had in my mind. 1924 01:24:39,003 --> 01:24:40,019 And so, I sent him an email, 1925 01:24:40,021 --> 01:24:42,028 saying that I was disappointed with his column today, 1926 01:24:43,000 --> 01:24:44,026 and outlining my reasons why. 1927 01:24:44,028 --> 01:24:46,014 Newsman: She sent a message to Breslin, 1928 01:24:46,016 --> 01:24:48,002 saying the column was sexist. 1929 01:24:48,017 --> 01:24:50,026 Breslin reportedly stormed into the newsroom, 1930 01:24:50,028 --> 01:24:53,016 taking aim at Yuh's Korean heritage. 1931 01:24:53,018 --> 01:24:55,029 The tirade went something like this. 1932 01:24:56,001 --> 01:24:58,024 "I can't stand people who don't know their place. 1933 01:24:58,026 --> 01:25:01,003 "The explicative doesn't know her place. 1934 01:25:01,005 --> 01:25:03,021 "She's a little dog. Just a little cur, 1935 01:25:03,023 --> 01:25:05,019 "a cur running down the street. 1936 01:25:05,021 --> 01:25:07,000 "She's a yellow cur. 1937 01:25:07,002 --> 01:25:08,023 Let's make it racial." 1938 01:25:08,025 --> 01:25:10,020 Esposito: He insulted the woman. 1939 01:25:10,022 --> 01:25:12,012 Jimmy was a big commodity, 1940 01:25:12,014 --> 01:25:13,021 an important part of the paper, 1941 01:25:13,023 --> 01:25:15,029 but Newsdaywas a very ethical place, 1942 01:25:16,001 --> 01:25:17,028 and so this was taken very seriously. 1943 01:25:18,000 --> 01:25:21,005 So, I said, well, you know, you have to write an apology. 1944 01:25:21,007 --> 01:25:24,008 And he goes, "This is my apology. 1945 01:25:24,010 --> 01:25:26,020 "Once again, I am wrong. 1946 01:25:27,008 --> 01:25:28,028 JB Number One." 1947 01:25:29,000 --> 01:25:30,019 It was like... 1948 01:25:30,021 --> 01:25:31,020 that's it? 1949 01:25:31,022 --> 01:25:34,005 Okay, that's the apology? 1950 01:25:34,007 --> 01:25:35,021 It's not an apology, of course. 1951 01:25:35,023 --> 01:25:37,022 It's an acknowledgment that he was wrong. 1952 01:25:38,008 --> 01:25:41,000 So I write, you know, an apology for him. 1953 01:25:41,021 --> 01:25:43,025 Yuh: He did send me a note. 1954 01:25:43,027 --> 01:25:45,013 It wasn't quite an apology. 1955 01:25:45,015 --> 01:25:48,016 "I'm sorry if I offended you," I believe is what he said. 1956 01:25:48,018 --> 01:25:50,011 But, 1957 01:25:50,013 --> 01:25:52,028 after I received that note, 1958 01:25:53,000 --> 01:25:55,007 is when he went on the Howard Stern Show. 1959 01:25:55,009 --> 01:25:57,014 (recording playing) 1960 01:26:12,024 --> 01:26:15,007 ♪ ♪ 1961 01:26:15,009 --> 01:26:16,019 Esposito: He made it worse. 1962 01:26:16,021 --> 01:26:19,028 He dug himself in and he made it worse. 1963 01:26:20,000 --> 01:26:21,012 So, we had a meeting. 1964 01:26:21,014 --> 01:26:24,001 And there was a debate as to whether we would fire Jimmy. 1965 01:26:25,015 --> 01:26:27,015 I objected. I thought 1966 01:26:27,017 --> 01:26:29,029 that was too big a price to pay. 1967 01:26:30,001 --> 01:26:32,008 So, they said, "Well, we'll suspend him." 1968 01:26:32,010 --> 01:26:34,002 At which point they told me, "You do it." 1969 01:26:34,016 --> 01:26:36,009 I was like, "Thank you very much. 1970 01:26:36,011 --> 01:26:38,013 I'm the youngest person in the room." 1971 01:26:38,015 --> 01:26:40,021 So, I call Jimmy up, and I say, 1972 01:26:40,023 --> 01:26:43,023 "Look, you're suspended, two weeks." 1973 01:26:43,025 --> 01:26:45,023 He just lets me have it. 1974 01:26:45,025 --> 01:26:47,028 "You're just a clerk. You were always a clerk. 1975 01:26:48,000 --> 01:26:49,003 You're no good." 1976 01:26:51,012 --> 01:26:54,001 Patrick: I think the suspension probably killed him, 1977 01:26:54,003 --> 01:26:57,004 'cause I don't think he had a bigoted bone in his body. 1978 01:26:57,006 --> 01:26:59,022 We weren't brought up to be like a lot of the other people 1979 01:26:59,024 --> 01:27:01,015 in our neighborhood who, you know, 1980 01:27:01,017 --> 01:27:02,028 were bigots. True bigots. 1981 01:27:04,014 --> 01:27:06,022 Costas: Suppose I work next to you, and you're 20 years, 1982 01:27:06,024 --> 01:27:08,006 and there's a general level of respect, 1983 01:27:08,008 --> 01:27:10,003 and I didn't think you didn't have your fastball one day, 1984 01:27:10,005 --> 01:27:11,026 or you missed the point and I say, "Jimmy, 1985 01:27:11,028 --> 01:27:13,028 that column wasn't very good." 1986 01:27:14,000 --> 01:27:15,026 -Gonna take a swing... -No, you don't come up and say, 1987 01:27:15,028 --> 01:27:18,004 "How could you write such a thing?" 1988 01:27:18,018 --> 01:27:20,017 "How could write such a thing about women," or something. 1989 01:27:20,019 --> 01:27:22,009 "How could you write such a thing about men?" 1990 01:27:22,011 --> 01:27:24,011 I do what I please, and you shut up, huh? 1991 01:27:24,013 --> 01:27:26,013 Do me a favor. And that's the way it must go! 1992 01:27:26,015 --> 01:27:28,023 -I've got to-- -To anybody, or just to Jimmy Breslin, 1993 01:27:28,025 --> 01:27:29,026 because he's Jimmy Breslin? 1994 01:27:29,028 --> 01:27:31,012 Because I've gotta do it tomorrow. 1995 01:27:31,014 --> 01:27:33,002 I don't know what you're doing tomorrow. 1996 01:27:33,004 --> 01:27:36,003 I have to do my thing tomorrow, and I don't wanna be bothered. 1997 01:27:36,016 --> 01:27:39,010 You know, Jimmy is an impulsive 1998 01:27:39,012 --> 01:27:41,003 guy from the streets, 1999 01:27:41,005 --> 01:27:42,025 and I thought, you know, 2000 01:27:42,027 --> 01:27:45,000 he just made a huge mistake. 2001 01:27:45,002 --> 01:27:48,025 In anger, he said a really dumb, destructive thing. 2002 01:27:49,016 --> 01:27:51,022 Eldridge: You know, I said, how could you have done that? 2003 01:27:52,013 --> 01:27:54,007 But he never realizes 2004 01:27:54,009 --> 01:27:56,020 the impact of what he says on other people. 2005 01:27:56,022 --> 01:27:58,008 He doesn't. 2006 01:27:59,007 --> 01:28:01,028 I don't even know if he knows what he said, 2007 01:28:02,010 --> 01:28:04,020 but he doesn't like it when other people criticize him. 2008 01:28:05,013 --> 01:28:07,001 Esposito: It's been said of Breslin that 2009 01:28:07,003 --> 01:28:09,002 no sleight was too small 2010 01:28:09,004 --> 01:28:11,006 for him to elevate to a feud. 2011 01:28:12,005 --> 01:28:13,022 That you are gifted, 2012 01:28:13,024 --> 01:28:16,022 that you are creative, doesn't mean you're wise. 2013 01:28:16,024 --> 01:28:18,025 Doesn't mean you're balanced. 2014 01:28:18,027 --> 01:28:21,004 Doesn't mean you're not an insecure, 2015 01:28:21,006 --> 01:28:23,018 sniveling little child inside 2016 01:28:23,020 --> 01:28:25,003 who takes an insult from a rookie 2017 01:28:25,005 --> 01:28:27,002 and turns it into a war. 2018 01:28:27,022 --> 01:28:30,021 Like anyone who's so self-involved, 2019 01:28:30,023 --> 01:28:32,026 that was part of who he was. 2020 01:28:32,028 --> 01:28:35,010 Collins: He was terrible in many ways, but... 2021 01:28:35,012 --> 01:28:37,028 his sense of sympathy 2022 01:28:39,011 --> 01:28:40,023 was just amazing. 2023 01:28:40,025 --> 01:28:42,018 ♪ ♪ 2024 01:28:42,020 --> 01:28:44,029 Caldwell: From the time that I met Breslin, 2025 01:28:45,001 --> 01:28:47,020 he had such a feel 2026 01:28:47,022 --> 01:28:49,018 for the plight, 2027 01:28:49,020 --> 01:28:52,019 condition of black people. 2028 01:28:52,021 --> 01:28:54,004 Breslin wasn't 2029 01:28:54,006 --> 01:28:56,008 afraid to go into their homes. 2030 01:28:56,010 --> 01:28:59,003 He wasn't afraid to go into their communities. 2031 01:28:59,005 --> 01:29:01,000 He asked me to take him a lot of places. 2032 01:29:01,002 --> 01:29:02,002 "I want you to take me to 2033 01:29:02,004 --> 01:29:04,013 the roughest black bar in this town." 2034 01:29:04,015 --> 01:29:07,005 And I told him, if he went down there, you might get hurt. 2035 01:29:08,007 --> 01:29:09,029 I can't defend you down there. 2036 01:29:10,001 --> 01:29:12,016 I don't even like to go there myself! 2037 01:29:12,018 --> 01:29:14,013 We went down there, 2038 01:29:14,015 --> 01:29:17,003 and he went right talking to people, 2039 01:29:17,005 --> 01:29:19,018 and they were acting sensibly to him. 2040 01:29:20,003 --> 01:29:21,014 (typewriter clacks) 2041 01:29:23,000 --> 01:29:24,010 -(yelling) -(glass breaking) 2042 01:29:24,012 --> 01:29:26,012 Reporter: Demonstrators gathered again near the site 2043 01:29:26,014 --> 01:29:28,007 of a car accident that left a child dead, 2044 01:29:28,009 --> 01:29:31,002 and set off violence in that Brooklyn community, 2045 01:29:31,004 --> 01:29:33,022 where blacks and Hasidic Jews live as neighbors. 2046 01:29:33,024 --> 01:29:36,019 (yelling) 2047 01:29:36,021 --> 01:29:38,028 Reporter 2: Angry protesters took to the streets, 2048 01:29:39,000 --> 01:29:40,029 tossing Molotov cocktails, 2049 01:29:41,001 --> 01:29:42,014 overturning cars, 2050 01:29:42,016 --> 01:29:44,000 setting fires... 2051 01:29:44,002 --> 01:29:45,022 Daly: I remember coming home. On the TV, 2052 01:29:45,024 --> 01:29:48,007 there's a picture of a burning yellow cab. 2053 01:29:48,009 --> 01:29:50,022 I say to myself, there's only one person on Earth, 2054 01:29:50,024 --> 01:29:52,028 first of all, who's dumb enough to take a cab to a riot. 2055 01:29:53,000 --> 01:29:54,024 Second of all, could get the cabbie to do it. 2056 01:29:54,026 --> 01:29:56,013 And I was right, it was him. 2057 01:29:56,015 --> 01:29:58,016 -(yelling) -(police radio beeping) 2058 01:30:01,029 --> 01:30:04,004 (yelling continues) 2059 01:30:05,014 --> 01:30:07,016 (siren) 2060 01:30:09,029 --> 01:30:11,009 Breslin: The cab I'm riding in 2061 01:30:11,011 --> 01:30:13,019 suddenly is running into a wall of young black kids. 2062 01:30:13,021 --> 01:30:15,022 -(yelling) -(glass breaking) 2063 01:30:17,026 --> 01:30:20,027 Into the cab, they piled, the young and the angry. 2064 01:30:22,020 --> 01:30:24,022 One of these young guys was up on the hood of the cab, 2065 01:30:24,024 --> 01:30:27,000 and he swung a baseball bat at the windshield, 2066 01:30:27,002 --> 01:30:29,023 until the windshield turned seafoam green. 2067 01:30:30,022 --> 01:30:32,015 They were throwing punches, holding me, 2068 01:30:32,017 --> 01:30:33,021 ripping up my clothes 2069 01:30:33,023 --> 01:30:35,024 for the only thing they wanted at the moment. 2070 01:30:35,026 --> 01:30:37,010 Money. 2071 01:30:37,012 --> 01:30:38,011 (yelling) 2072 01:30:38,013 --> 01:30:39,022 Quinn: They ripped his clothes off, 2073 01:30:40,005 --> 01:30:41,021 and he's there in his underwear. 2074 01:30:41,023 --> 01:30:43,026 Jimmy probably had, like, the old-school underwear. 2075 01:30:43,028 --> 01:30:45,023 You know, just those old-school, 2076 01:30:45,025 --> 01:30:47,020 you know, tighty-whiteys and T-shirt. 2077 01:30:48,017 --> 01:30:49,027 Eldridge: We had to go to the hospital 2078 01:30:49,029 --> 01:30:51,028 to have stitches in the eye. 2079 01:30:52,000 --> 01:30:53,005 He didn't make it a big issue. 2080 01:30:53,007 --> 01:30:55,016 Other people made it a bigger issue than he did. 2081 01:30:55,018 --> 01:30:57,027 The thing he made a big thing of was 2082 01:30:57,029 --> 01:31:01,003 that what stopped the crowd was some black man 2083 01:31:01,005 --> 01:31:03,006 there recognized Jimmy, 2084 01:31:03,024 --> 01:31:06,009 and pulled-- got everybody away from him. 2085 01:31:06,011 --> 01:31:08,015 That was what was important to him. 2086 01:31:08,017 --> 01:31:09,021 ♪ ♪ 2087 01:31:09,023 --> 01:31:11,018 Costas: Did the irony of this occur to you? 2088 01:31:11,020 --> 01:31:12,026 You spent a whole career... 2089 01:31:12,028 --> 01:31:14,027 -Breslin: Yeah. -...as a champion of blacks... 2090 01:31:14,029 --> 01:31:16,009 -Yeah, sure. -...for decades, 2091 01:31:16,011 --> 01:31:18,012 putting their words and their concerns in the paper, 2092 01:31:18,014 --> 01:31:21,005 -and now, you were just another white guy. -So, what? 2093 01:31:21,023 --> 01:31:23,018 I've been for them all their lives, 2094 01:31:23,020 --> 01:31:25,010 what do they care? What does that mean? 2095 01:31:25,012 --> 01:31:27,005 You've been for me all of your life, 2096 01:31:27,007 --> 01:31:28,025 well, you didn't do very good for me, 2097 01:31:28,027 --> 01:31:31,000 I'll tell you that 'cause I'm still here. 2098 01:31:31,002 --> 01:31:33,020 (yelling) 2099 01:31:36,018 --> 01:31:37,028 Daly: The cops came and basically said, 2100 01:31:38,000 --> 01:31:40,016 "How do you like all your stinking friends now, huh?" 2101 01:31:41,021 --> 01:31:44,002 Real happy you've been championing these...? 2102 01:31:44,020 --> 01:31:46,024 Some cop said, "How do you like the animals now?" 2103 01:31:46,026 --> 01:31:47,022 That was a cop. 2104 01:31:48,017 --> 01:31:50,018 -Interviewer: What did Jimmy say? -Fuck you. 2105 01:31:51,018 --> 01:31:53,007 Breslin: I get down to the police station. 2106 01:31:53,009 --> 01:31:54,022 They were standing outside. "What happened?" 2107 01:31:54,024 --> 01:31:55,027 I says, get lost, 2108 01:31:55,029 --> 01:31:57,003 and I got in the cab and went. 2109 01:31:57,005 --> 01:31:58,005 I didn't even want them. 2110 01:31:58,007 --> 01:31:59,024 I got beat up. I wouldn't even go in there. 2111 01:31:59,026 --> 01:32:01,024 How do you like that? Now that's carrying a feud good. 2112 01:32:01,026 --> 01:32:04,008 -You gotta gimme that, right? -(laughing) 2113 01:32:05,006 --> 01:32:07,002 Payne: Jimmy's an Irish American. 2114 01:32:07,004 --> 01:32:08,026 And the Irish, over time, occupied 2115 01:32:08,028 --> 01:32:11,002 a dominant space in the New York City Police Department. 2116 01:32:11,017 --> 01:32:13,012 Breslin: People with Irish backgrounds 2117 01:32:13,014 --> 01:32:14,011 in the city of New York 2118 01:32:14,013 --> 01:32:15,027 have hardly been in the forefront 2119 01:32:15,029 --> 01:32:17,028 of the drive towards civil rights. In fact, 2120 01:32:18,000 --> 01:32:19,024 they might have been on the other side of the fence 2121 01:32:19,026 --> 01:32:21,014 too much and there was... 2122 01:32:21,016 --> 01:32:23,004 I've had quarrels with them over that. 2123 01:32:24,002 --> 01:32:26,029 Barry: He famously referred to the Irish as having those 2124 01:32:27,001 --> 01:32:28,026 shopping center faces. 2125 01:32:28,028 --> 01:32:31,006 In other words, the Irish had come up 2126 01:32:31,008 --> 01:32:33,006 and struggled in a city that didn't initially 2127 01:32:33,008 --> 01:32:36,007 welcome them, and now, we're not as receptive 2128 01:32:36,009 --> 01:32:38,010 to others who had come up behind them. 2129 01:32:39,009 --> 01:32:40,019 Daly: Crown Heights, that just shows 2130 01:32:40,021 --> 01:32:41,025 that it was all genuine. 2131 01:32:41,027 --> 01:32:43,013 Here's a guy who actually 2132 01:32:43,015 --> 01:32:45,023 believes and feels what he writes. 2133 01:32:45,025 --> 01:32:47,025 If you go and you read him, 2134 01:32:48,002 --> 01:32:50,019 you see what's wrong about us 2135 01:32:51,011 --> 01:32:53,001 and what's right about us. 2136 01:32:54,009 --> 01:32:57,024 Interviewer: You didn't have even a touch of bitterness about 2137 01:32:57,026 --> 01:32:59,026 the fact that you'd just gotten the shit kicked out of you? 2138 01:32:59,028 --> 01:33:02,014 No, it's part of the game! 2139 01:33:04,001 --> 01:33:05,021 I really believe that. 2140 01:33:09,019 --> 01:33:12,016 If Jimmy Breslin would just put it down in plain words, 2141 01:33:12,018 --> 01:33:14,026 you know, short sentences, and build, 2142 01:33:14,028 --> 01:33:16,023 build little bricks of beauty 2143 01:33:16,025 --> 01:33:18,015 from small little parts... 2144 01:33:19,017 --> 01:33:22,000 Pete Hamill was like Mahler. 2145 01:33:22,002 --> 01:33:25,003 ♪ ♪ 2146 01:33:26,029 --> 01:33:28,020 Hamill: A great gray cloud 2147 01:33:28,022 --> 01:33:31,003 billowed in slow motion, 2148 01:33:31,005 --> 01:33:34,024 growing larger and larger, like some evil genie 2149 01:33:34,026 --> 01:33:37,013 released into the cloudless sky. 2150 01:33:38,016 --> 01:33:42,014 Sheets of paper fluttered against the grayness, 2151 01:33:42,024 --> 01:33:45,002 like ghostly snowflakes. 2152 01:33:45,017 --> 01:33:49,000 Anybody who can place you in the moment, 2153 01:33:49,002 --> 01:33:52,018 and make you feel what he was feeling in that moment, 2154 01:33:53,000 --> 01:33:55,003 has done all the job you can ever ask 2155 01:33:55,005 --> 01:33:56,020 for a reporter or a columnist. 2156 01:33:56,022 --> 01:33:57,029 And Pete did that that day. 2157 01:34:01,018 --> 01:34:02,019 (inaudible) 2158 01:34:02,021 --> 01:34:03,029 Woman: Oh my God! 2159 01:34:04,018 --> 01:34:07,019 -(rumbling) -(people screaming) 2160 01:34:12,020 --> 01:34:14,026 Hamill: I yelled to my wife, "Run!" 2161 01:34:14,028 --> 01:34:17,010 And we start together, and this immense cloud, 2162 01:34:17,012 --> 01:34:20,017 perhaps 25 stories high, 2163 01:34:20,019 --> 01:34:22,002 is rolling at us. 2164 01:34:22,026 --> 01:34:26,004 Bodies come smashing together in the doorway of 2165 01:34:26,006 --> 01:34:27,029 25 Vesey Street, 2166 01:34:28,001 --> 01:34:30,003 and I can't see my wife. 2167 01:34:30,005 --> 01:34:32,019 I keep calling her name and saying, 2168 01:34:32,021 --> 01:34:35,018 "I've gotta get outta here! Please, my wife!" 2169 01:34:36,020 --> 01:34:38,006 Go, go, go, go! 2170 01:34:38,008 --> 01:34:40,019 I thought he is following me. 2171 01:34:40,021 --> 01:34:42,008 Finally, I turn back and, 2172 01:34:42,010 --> 01:34:44,004 "Oh my gosh, he's not here!" 2173 01:34:44,006 --> 01:34:46,013 And I said, oh my gosh, I... 2174 01:34:46,015 --> 01:34:49,022 made the worst mistake in my life. 2175 01:34:49,024 --> 01:34:52,007 I felt that I had failed her somehow. 2176 01:34:52,009 --> 01:34:54,002 That I should've been with her, 2177 01:34:54,004 --> 01:34:56,020 hand in hand all the way. 2178 01:34:56,022 --> 01:35:00,010 ♪ ♪ 2179 01:35:00,012 --> 01:35:03,029 The street before us is now a pale gray wilderness. 2180 01:35:05,000 --> 01:35:08,020 There is powdery white dust in gutter and sidewalk, 2181 01:35:09,007 --> 01:35:11,013 and dust on the roofs of cars, 2182 01:35:11,015 --> 01:35:15,003 and dust on the tombstones of Saint Paul's. 2183 01:35:15,027 --> 01:35:18,014 Dust coats police and the civilians, 2184 01:35:19,002 --> 01:35:20,016 white people and black, 2185 01:35:21,002 --> 01:35:22,014 men and women. 2186 01:35:23,006 --> 01:35:25,027 It's like an assembly of ghosts. 2187 01:35:28,000 --> 01:35:30,016 (Hamill speaking) 2188 01:35:42,023 --> 01:35:45,000 That moment where I opened the door, 2189 01:35:45,002 --> 01:35:47,010 and she was right there coming out, 2190 01:35:47,012 --> 01:35:49,002 tried to find me. 2191 01:35:49,024 --> 01:35:50,020 Uh... 2192 01:35:51,021 --> 01:35:53,025 it was like, phew! 2193 01:35:53,027 --> 01:35:56,028 ♪ ♪ 2194 01:36:03,022 --> 01:36:05,004 -Woman (on phone): Hi, Mr. Breslin. -Hi. 2195 01:36:05,006 --> 01:36:07,027 I just finished your daughter's book, and I really enjoyed it. 2196 01:36:07,029 --> 01:36:10,002 I thought she was very honest and courageous, 2197 01:36:10,004 --> 01:36:12,021 and I just wanted to know how she's doing right now. 2198 01:36:12,023 --> 01:36:13,029 S'all right. 2199 01:36:14,001 --> 01:36:16,019 You know, this week, fine. Thank you. 2200 01:36:16,021 --> 01:36:19,006 She's got a blood disease. That's what that's about. 2201 01:36:19,008 --> 01:36:21,007 -(hospital chatter) -(machine beeping) 2202 01:36:21,009 --> 01:36:23,010 ♪ ♪ 2203 01:36:29,024 --> 01:36:31,015 Eldridge: You know, she was sick for 16 years, 2204 01:36:31,017 --> 01:36:34,012 and he never missed a visit. 2205 01:36:34,014 --> 01:36:35,016 Never. 2206 01:36:37,004 --> 01:36:39,021 Dunne: Every doctor's appointment. 2207 01:36:39,023 --> 01:36:43,001 Every infusion. Every transfusion. 2208 01:36:43,003 --> 01:36:45,011 Jimmy was there, 2209 01:36:46,011 --> 01:36:49,006 100%. 2210 01:36:49,020 --> 01:36:51,019 Culkin: She had her mother's name, 2211 01:36:51,021 --> 01:36:55,014 and because Rosemary pursued writing, 2212 01:36:55,016 --> 01:36:58,008 I think the apple of Daddy's eye was exactly who she was. 2213 01:36:58,010 --> 01:37:00,011 (beeping) 2214 01:37:04,013 --> 01:37:05,029 Patrick: What Tony Dunne said to my father 2215 01:37:06,001 --> 01:37:08,003 while my sister Rosemary was deathly ill, 2216 01:37:08,005 --> 01:37:10,009 he goes, "You know, JB, we love you. I love you. 2217 01:37:10,011 --> 01:37:13,003 Rosie loves you." And my father, he... 2218 01:37:13,005 --> 01:37:16,027 the word was hard to say. But he gave you a little dip. 2219 01:37:16,029 --> 01:37:18,024 A little hit with his right shoulder. 2220 01:37:18,026 --> 01:37:20,013 And that's a big thing, 2221 01:37:20,015 --> 01:37:22,012 to get the shoulder. 2222 01:37:22,014 --> 01:37:24,016 I knew exactly what that meant. 2223 01:37:24,018 --> 01:37:26,009 You know, it meant... 2224 01:37:27,008 --> 01:37:29,023 It meant, "Thank you. I love you, too." 2225 01:37:29,025 --> 01:37:31,011 Interviewer: But he would never say it. 2226 01:37:31,013 --> 01:37:33,004 I don't think he ever could. 2227 01:37:34,016 --> 01:37:36,000 I don't think he ever could. 2228 01:37:36,002 --> 01:37:39,014 ♪ ♪ 2229 01:37:39,016 --> 01:37:41,021 Maria: His column after Rosemary's death, 2230 01:37:41,023 --> 01:37:43,018 Jimmy had this vision. 2231 01:37:43,020 --> 01:37:46,015 In the last moments of Rosemary's life that 2232 01:37:46,017 --> 01:37:48,018 her mother came to her. 2233 01:37:50,028 --> 01:37:53,007 (Breslin speaking) 2234 01:38:18,000 --> 01:38:21,001 ...as if to the first day of school. 2235 01:38:35,020 --> 01:38:39,010 ♪ ♪ 2236 01:38:45,025 --> 01:38:47,015 Eldridge: He would always talk about the fact that 2237 01:38:47,017 --> 01:38:49,022 three women in his life died. 2238 01:38:49,024 --> 01:38:51,019 His wife Rosemary, his daughter Rosemary, 2239 01:38:51,021 --> 01:38:54,000 and his daughter Kelly. Always. 2240 01:38:54,026 --> 01:38:58,005 He would just say it. "Three women in my life died." 2241 01:38:59,010 --> 01:39:01,011 Death's taken a lot out of Jimmy. 2242 01:39:03,001 --> 01:39:05,009 Jimmy, Jimmy gets angry. 2243 01:39:05,011 --> 01:39:08,016 Jimmy's angry at the people who've been taken from him. 2244 01:39:11,023 --> 01:39:14,014 Interviewer: When are you absolutely the happiest? 2245 01:39:17,017 --> 01:39:20,007 You're not put on this Earth to be happy. 2246 01:39:20,009 --> 01:39:22,000 You're really not. 2247 01:39:24,002 --> 01:39:24,028 Eldridge: Jimmy... 2248 01:39:25,010 --> 01:39:26,028 What do you want? 2249 01:39:27,000 --> 01:39:29,005 You have... a thing about 2250 01:39:29,007 --> 01:39:32,004 people dying. I mean, you say you don't have any feelings. 2251 01:39:32,006 --> 01:39:33,008 But, you know, the other day, 2252 01:39:33,010 --> 01:39:35,000 we were looking up a number in your phone book, 2253 01:39:35,022 --> 01:39:37,016 and you looked at the page and you said, 2254 01:39:37,018 --> 01:39:40,011 "God, everybody's gone." Right? 2255 01:39:40,013 --> 01:39:43,004 And what do you do when they die? 2256 01:39:43,006 --> 01:39:44,028 You write what? 2257 01:39:45,000 --> 01:39:47,014 What's that? Oh, in the book? What do I write? 2258 01:39:47,016 --> 01:39:49,010 -1-800-Heaven? -Oh yeah. 2259 01:39:49,012 --> 01:39:52,010 -So what does that mean? -That's his number. 2260 01:39:52,012 --> 01:39:54,005 So, you do believe they're in Heaven? 2261 01:39:54,007 --> 01:39:56,011 I don't know. I'm rooting for them. 2262 01:39:56,013 --> 01:39:58,025 I don't think they deserve it, if I knew them. 2263 01:39:58,027 --> 01:40:00,017 (Eldridge laughing) 2264 01:40:00,019 --> 01:40:02,009 Interviewer: Are you scared of dying? 2265 01:40:02,011 --> 01:40:04,013 Breslin: No, it's too late. 2266 01:40:04,015 --> 01:40:06,007 I'm gonna be 87. 2267 01:40:06,020 --> 01:40:08,008 So, what does it matter 2268 01:40:08,010 --> 01:40:11,006 whether I wanna go or I don't wanna go? 2269 01:40:11,008 --> 01:40:13,019 The game-- (chuckles) look at the scoreboard. 2270 01:40:13,027 --> 01:40:17,025 How exciting can it be when you're in the last inning? 2271 01:40:17,027 --> 01:40:19,026 ♪ ♪ 2272 01:40:19,028 --> 01:40:21,011 (indistinct chatter) 2273 01:40:21,013 --> 01:40:22,024 One, two, three! 2274 01:40:22,026 --> 01:40:24,005 -(blowing) -(laughing) 2275 01:40:24,007 --> 01:40:26,018 -Man: Give him a hand. One for good luck. -Woman: Woo hoo! 2276 01:40:26,020 --> 01:40:29,000 -(clapping) -Happy birthday! 2277 01:40:29,002 --> 01:40:30,020 Look at that. 2278 01:40:30,022 --> 01:40:32,015 (indistinct chatter) 2279 01:40:32,017 --> 01:40:33,027 Jim, I'll talk to you later. 2280 01:40:33,029 --> 01:40:36,006 Yeah. I'll call you, I'll give you a call. 2281 01:40:38,027 --> 01:40:41,017 (typewriter clacks) 2282 01:40:59,004 --> 01:41:02,005 Man: There aren't anymore Breslins and Hamills. 2283 01:41:05,001 --> 01:41:07,024 This was the last expression 2284 01:41:07,026 --> 01:41:10,015 of great 20th-century, 2285 01:41:10,017 --> 01:41:12,025 muscular American journalism. 2286 01:41:21,028 --> 01:41:24,014 Journalism that's gone. 2287 01:41:24,016 --> 01:41:26,002 It's gone. 2288 01:41:34,005 --> 01:41:37,024 ♪ ♪ 2289 01:41:37,026 --> 01:41:41,010 Hamill: When I got the news that Jimmy had died, 2290 01:41:41,012 --> 01:41:45,012 it was like 25, 30 people had just left the room. 2291 01:41:47,006 --> 01:41:50,017 He had adapted certain masks 2292 01:41:50,019 --> 01:41:53,000 to get through life. 2293 01:41:55,004 --> 01:41:57,000 I never mistook the masks 2294 01:41:57,002 --> 01:42:00,003 with the complicated human being that he was. 2295 01:42:01,006 --> 01:42:04,013 -(typewriter clacks) -(chatter) 2296 01:42:05,012 --> 01:42:08,020 Breslin: I wrote the day seen exactly as it was. 2297 01:42:08,022 --> 01:42:11,014 I always figured that this was the only game. 2298 01:42:11,016 --> 01:42:13,023 Just go to any neighborhood where the poor live, 2299 01:42:13,025 --> 01:42:15,026 and tell the truth about what you see. 2300 01:42:17,011 --> 01:42:19,010 Please do not put out a sermon. 2301 01:42:19,012 --> 01:42:21,014 That is for Sunday. 2302 01:42:39,013 --> 01:42:41,014 Avlon: The old newsroom culture, 2303 01:42:41,016 --> 01:42:44,002 that he came out of, certainly is gone. 2304 01:42:44,004 --> 01:42:45,019 But the heart of it 2305 01:42:45,021 --> 01:42:47,025 is absolutely real and transcendent, 2306 01:42:47,027 --> 01:42:50,021 which is real reporting with a ton of voice, 2307 01:42:50,023 --> 01:42:53,002 that comforts the afflicted and afflicts the comfortable. 2308 01:42:53,004 --> 01:42:54,023 And that's eternal, 2309 01:42:54,025 --> 01:42:57,003 as long as the press is doing its job in a free society. 2310 01:42:57,005 --> 01:42:59,010 The need for narrative is never gonna go away. 2311 01:42:59,012 --> 01:43:02,003 It is why we've been sitting around campfires 2312 01:43:02,005 --> 01:43:04,021 for 100,000 years, listening to stories. 2313 01:43:04,023 --> 01:43:06,015 But it's gonna change form. 2314 01:43:06,017 --> 01:43:09,013 So, it may be the same content in different bottles. 2315 01:43:09,015 --> 01:43:11,012 It's more democratic. 2316 01:43:11,014 --> 01:43:13,010 There's more public access. 2317 01:43:13,012 --> 01:43:16,007 On the other hand, there's more public access 2318 01:43:16,009 --> 01:43:17,019 to a lot of bullshit. 2319 01:43:17,026 --> 01:43:19,004 You know, I think if you hooked 2320 01:43:19,006 --> 01:43:21,012 the craft up to technology, 2321 01:43:21,023 --> 01:43:24,007 I think it would be greater than we ever imagined. 2322 01:43:24,009 --> 01:43:26,007 I think you just get older and you die. 2323 01:43:27,005 --> 01:43:30,003 It's over, and some other guy will pick it up and... 2324 01:43:30,005 --> 01:43:32,003 do something that we've never seen before. 2325 01:43:32,005 --> 01:43:33,025 I mean (laugh), it's that simple. 2326 01:43:33,027 --> 01:43:35,006 There's always gonna be new people. 2327 01:43:35,008 --> 01:43:37,015 Hopefully who take up the time, 2328 01:43:37,017 --> 01:43:39,007 and keep moving forward. 2329 01:43:39,009 --> 01:43:42,005 Whatever it is, this chaos of the moment, 2330 01:43:42,007 --> 01:43:43,022 will resolve itself eventually, 2331 01:43:43,024 --> 01:43:46,025 and those people will swim into place. 2332 01:43:46,027 --> 01:43:47,028 They're there. 2333 01:43:48,000 --> 01:43:51,010 ♪ ♪ 2334 01:43:52,025 --> 01:43:55,006 Hamill: Journalism, if it's any good, 2335 01:43:55,008 --> 01:43:57,015 becomes history. 2336 01:43:57,017 --> 01:43:59,001 (birds chirping) 2337 01:43:59,003 --> 01:44:01,007 It's always being adjusted. 2338 01:44:01,009 --> 01:44:05,001 It's always being enriched by the new people that come, 2339 01:44:05,003 --> 01:44:06,026 who, in turn, get enriched by 2340 01:44:06,028 --> 01:44:08,025 the old people who are here. 2341 01:44:12,004 --> 01:44:15,005 This tree is a symbol of it. 2342 01:44:17,005 --> 01:44:20,010 This tree has watched the change. 2343 01:44:20,012 --> 01:44:23,011 Has lived through it. Has survived. 2344 01:44:24,006 --> 01:44:25,015 It's held up with help, 2345 01:44:25,017 --> 01:44:27,028 like most old creatures. 2346 01:44:29,028 --> 01:44:32,006 It's got a cable running across it 2347 01:44:32,008 --> 01:44:34,007 to help some of the branches. 2348 01:44:35,000 --> 01:44:36,011 But, here it is. 2349 01:44:36,028 --> 01:44:39,004 And so this tree reminds us 2350 01:44:39,006 --> 01:44:41,007 of the passage of time, 2351 01:44:42,007 --> 01:44:44,014 and the ache we have, 2352 01:44:44,016 --> 01:44:46,024 and the joy we have, 2353 01:44:46,026 --> 01:44:49,025 being able to find out and say, 2354 01:44:49,027 --> 01:44:52,028 it's still here, God damn it. 2355 01:45:09,023 --> 01:45:12,024 ♪ ♪ 2356 01:45:46,002 --> 01:45:49,003 ♪ ♪ 2357 01:46:16,001 --> 01:46:19,002 ♪ ♪ 184049

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