Original subtitles

Hello, Traitors super fan, and welcome to another action-packed

episode of Uncloaked with me, Ed Gamble.

We are going to be talking about everything from episode eight

of The Traitors, so you know what I'm going to say.

If you've not seen it, go and watch it,

then come back and watch this, because we have got so much

to talk about. On this edition of Uncloaked...

comedian Nish Kumar,

Radio 1 royalty Clara Amfo,

series one Traitor and close-but-no-cigar finalist Wilf,

and the man the whole nation is talking about -

actual Paul will be here!

CHEERING

This programme contains some strong language

Clara, Nish, Wilf.

Wow. Wow, wow, wow! Wow!

Paul will be here later on in the show,

but first, let's hear that beautiful Traitor's siren.

SIREN

Two sirens in a row.

We've got rid of Miles, we've got rid of Paul.

This is absolutely huge.

I don't want to meet the man! I'm scared.

I think he has killed and will again.

I think this is a huge risk we're exposing ourselves to

by being in a room with him.

He might already be here under the sofa.

This is entrapment. I am unsettled.

Well, we call him the Ginger Godfather on this show.

The Ginger Godfather, I like that.

Now, before we start talking about the episode proper,

I want to do something. I want to try something out.

Will you all individually look at me

and say "I am a Faithful"?

So, Nish, we'll start with you.

Ed, I am full of faith.

OK, so that's immediately suspicious because you didn't...

You didn't do what I told you to do.

Full of faith?! Full of faith.

Do you know how this works? Do you know how this works?

So you'd be banished, episode one, as a Traitor.

Get rid! Clara.

Ed, I'm a Faithful.

That was good.

Wilf.

I am a Faithful.

See. that was very good.

That was, I think, better than any of the Traitors actually managed

on the show, because you'll notice what Paul did was he went,

"I am a Faithful," and closed his eyes

when he said the word "Faithful".

Andrew had to say it and he went, "I am...a Faithful."

We've got a lot to talk about today.

We've got that blockbuster of a round table

and Harry's amazing performance at that.

We've got to talk about Andrew's recruitment, of course,

and how we think he's doing so far.

He might do better later on, you never know.

But how he's doing so far that we've seen in this episode.

But first, we've got to have another look at Paul's banishment.

This has been the best experience of my entire life,

and this moment will stay with me for the rest of my life,

so...thank you.

I'm a Traitor.

CHEERING

What did I say?! I told you!

What did I say?!

We got another one!

We've got another fucking one!

My work here is done. My work here is done.

Harry, you did that, you know?

You... You bloody did that.

Harry, that was you!

Wrapping it up. Absolutely loving it. Amazing.

I mean, the most explosive banishment yet, surely.

Also, the bow. Can we just get into that first?

The bow, I think, is practice for when he's Captain Hook

in pantomime later this year. Yeah!

I feel like it was like, "And finish."

Do you know what I mean? "And scene." Yeah, he's done.

That was it. Perfect, because I think we'd not really seen him come

out of character until that moment.

Maybe when Harry turned on him,

I think you saw his shoulders drop a little bit

and you just saw the real Paul for a second.

But even that felt like an act.

Even that still felt like he was...

I'm not convinced he has a kid. I'll put it out there.

When he started crying, being like, "I just want to see my little boy."

After that point, I thought... I think anything

that this guy's doing is part of, like, a game plan.

So even when his shoulders dropped, I still thought - I thought,

oh, this is amazing because he's still making them

feel sympathy for him.

He's trying to make himself look vulnerable and look like the victim.

I still thought it was all...

I think the closest time we saw was at the bow at the end

because it did genuinely feel like an

"And scene, and I've had you all on the whole time."

Paul was excellent to watch.

I think the thing that I loved/annoyed me deeply about him

is that Paul is what I would call classically high on his own supply.

Yes. Do you know what I mean?

Like, he really thought he had everybody just like that,

which he did, to be fair. He did for a bit.

But I think he just got a little bit too gassed, so to see him

get found out was incredible to watch.

Can I just say about Paul? Like, a lot of people didn't like him.

I loved him.

I feel like he was the only person in the game that I've seen so far -

apart from Amanda - that could take away the emotion

and play the game. Yes. Exactly.

But this guy took it away, brought just the gameplay, and I rate that.

And to be fair, he was the most entertaining Traitor

to watch so far. Yeah. Like, in my opinion.

We should talk about where it went wrong for Paul,

because we mentioned he got a little bit overconfident, perhaps.

A lot of people pinning it on the dungeon episode

where he put himself in the dungeon and then assumed that everyone

loved him so much that he would be the one saved.

Do we think that was the beginning of the end for Paul?

Worst strategy ever. Yeah. Worst strategy ever.

Like, last season, we had to put people on trial.

I was nearly going to put myself, and then we figured out, actually,

if we throw in three Faithfuls, we're going to...

You have to look in the long run. One's going to be murdered,

the other two are most certainly going to be banished,

because they'll think one's a Traitor.

So you've got two, three days left as a group.

And the longer you stay as a big group, the more votes that you have,

the more powerful your votes become around the round table.

I feel like anybody who puts himself forward for anything like that,

I just... Just don't do it, if you're a Traitor.

I just want to strike one note of dissension here.

He had kind of got away with it.

I think he knifed Miles too hard, because what he then did was create

real distrust with his own team.

He had then started the process of knifing Harry.

I agree, but also what I would say is,

did he start the process of doing that to Harry?

Because there was a massive misinterpretation from Charlotte.

Right. So when they were sat in the car after the mission,

Jasmine brought up, "It was a bit weird what Harry said."

Yeah, yeah. And then Paul was just doing the Traitory thing

of going like, "Oh, yeah, I suppose it was, actually,"

and just going with the flow. And then even when Ross went,

"I don't think it was that," he went, "Oh, yeah, maybe not."

Charlotte then reported it back to Harry

as Paul starting that discussion.

Which is what... Which is what put the fire under Harry.

So that's why Paul's gone, because Harry went up,

and it's not necessarily true.

It's like Capone going down for tax evasion.

The very interesting thing is he comes out of that

and he's the hero.

So Jaz is going, "That was you, that was you,"

which...Jaz needs to be more confident.

Got to back himself. Jaz has been loosening the pickle jar on Paul

for the last five episodes, and it was just Harry

who got the tea towel and twisted it off. Yeah, yeah.

Right, so he's going, "That was you. That was you."

Everyone's going, "Harry, you're absolutely amazing."

He's going, "Yeah, they want to vote me for President,"

all of this stuff. But that's what happened with Paul and Miles.

And then the next episode, Paul's gone, so he needs to calm it down

a little bit because he was so specific, as well,

about the dungeon plan.

He was like, "What I think's happened..."

and then he listed off the whole dungeon plan beat by beat.

It's like, how could you possibly know that?

No-one can deny that Harry did an absolutely amazing job

at the round table, so let's remind ourselves of how he played it.

You thought it was a good idea to put you and Ash

down in the dungeon.

You would have been told that someone could have been saved

the next day. And I think you being the most popular,

you thought you would be saved.

And then when it was Andrew,

that sort of cocked the whole thing up.

I've just found out in the journey back from that mission,

not only today have you brought Zack and Jaz into the picture,

you've even brought myself in,

because apparently I was angry about not getting a shield

or something like that. To me, it's a bit like

now you're chucking names out there... It's not.

to cause chaos.

It's not... I think Paul's being genuine, though.

I think he is shocked that Harry's turned on him so quickly.

But let's talk about Harry's gameplay there.

Harry's very aware that he's well-liked.

I think the thing about Harry that's different to Paul is, dare I say,

like, he's a bit of an empath.

Like, I think he's a bit... He's a bit softer with people.

I think people feel a bit more relaxed around him.

And I think he positions himself as a leader just enough so people

don't feel bossed about by him, but they just,

"No, he's my mate. He's my comrade."

Where Paul was, I think, was always very much like,

"Well, I think this," or like - I remember, I think it was, like,

maybe the first or second episode when it was the

first or second round table. He was like, "No, I'll go first."

He was always very up for, like, making himself,

like, the centre of attention, where I think Harry will always wait

a little bit and then go in.

I do worry now that it's been said here that he was way too specific

with the details like that.

That started to make me think, oh, I wonder if he's maybe tipped it

slightly too far because he did say, "Oh, it almost feels like,

"you know, Paul, you were sort of just standing in front of me,

"and you said... And then I was like,

" 'Oh, is anyone else hungry? I could go for a banana.'

"I don't... I mean, someone might have said that."

When you rewatch it back,

it feels very specific and it does feel like someone

might have the question - maybe Evie, like you say,

she might, if she's clocked him.

Someone might have the question of, like,

"Harry, how did you know in that amount of detail?"

Because it had sort of slightly washed over me

that how specific he was about Paul, saying, "You assumed, Paul,

"that you would be saved because you're the most popular person."

Yeah, it's the exact plan. It's the exact plan.

And speaking of being on the back foot, we do need to talk about

the fact that Andrew has now been recruited.

Oh, God bless. God bless.

Harry and him are now partners.

So let's remind ourselves of how Andrew made the decision

whether to accept or not.

I genuinely can't think of the pros of joining.

The cons, all of a sudden going against...

HE SIGHS

..my friends, my fellow Faithful.

Oh, my God.

What if I say no?

But I think, well, if I don't join,

they're going to murder me or something.

Yeah, I'll have to. I'm going to have to.

Yeah, I'll have to join them, I suppose.

I love Andrew - dearly love Andrew. So sweet.

I just love that clip because he goes,

"I can't see the pros. All right, I'll do it."

There's no pros, but I'll do it anyway.

It's... I've never seen someone essentially take themselves hostage.

It was absolutely unfathomable.

I think it must be the fear of murder,

because obviously in series one, Wilf,

when Alex refused being a Traitor,

she was killed pretty swiftly afterwards, right?

Because it guarantees that you're Faithful.

Yeah, so what it does is if you're recruited and you say no,

you sort of, as a Traitor, you want to set a premise.

So if we ever ask you again, you take it.

And Andrew, do you know what?

He's new to this role,

and Harry and Paul are like his parents, right?

That's how it feels, and at the round table, when they're arguing

he looks like a child going...

Just looking at his parents' argument

and doesn't know what to say.

He looked genuinely devastated when Paul left.

Truly, truly. I was surprised he didn't vote for him, actually.

I thought he was going to maybe switch it,

but I think the thing about Andrew is I think he trusted Paul

and I think he trusts Harry maybe a little bit too much

because he will be the next one thrown under the bus, absolutely.

I felt like, at the round table, he obviously didn't vote for Paul,

but in his head he was going, "Well, it's my first day."

I can't... I can't piss off the boss. Yeah, my first day on the job.

I've got to have a go at being a Traitor.

He's on probation, isn't he? Yeah!

Also, what was funny was that he did quickly surmise,

because basically the two of them stood together and they're like,

"Let's just get this bloke in and we'll knife him immediately."

He took the hood off, saw who were the Traitors,

and he went, "I'm going to get knifed immediately."

He did correctly analyse exactly why he was there.

He knew that he'd been brought in as cannon fodder.

But keep that to yourself, right?

So you're going in there, you know that you're going to get killed,

don't then say it to the Traitors.

Everyone was un... It was unique insofar as everybody

was unhappy with the decision. Yeah.

I mean, look, this was Andrew's first episode.

We do not know how he's going to do from this point.

He might suddenly blossom.

The performance at breakfast wasn't ideal, I don't think,

because he does say...

You hear him say, "Oh, it's so difficult, this -

"you've got to listen to about

"ten different conversations all at once,"

and then they cut to breakfast and the way he's listening

to conversations is moving around the table physically.

I mean, I think probably one of my highlights of the entire episode,

if not the entire series, was this wonderful moment

from Ross in the car.

Let's remind ourselves.

Diane would be looking down on us now and going...

NORTHERN IRISH ACCENT: "Go get that Traitors, guys.

"Go get the Traitors now."

NORTHERN IRISH ACCENT: "Absolutely."

I love her. She was like my mum.

Hey, mate, she WAS my mum. No, she was MY mum first. My mum first!

No, stop it. Stop it.

Yay!

I love it. Love, love, love, love.

Just perfect. It's really good.

It's not often a player on Traitors goes full Fleabag

and acknowledges the camera. He broke the fourth wall. Yeah.

Did you enjoy that moment, Clara? I absolutely loved it.

I just think, do you know what?

Because as we know, Ross,

not to carry on the Brian, like, sheep thing,

but like, you know, he's a bit of a follower.

So to see him take charge of that moment and be like,

"You know what? Yeah, that was my mother." Made me feel good.

Do we think that Ross has put a bit of a target on his back now?

We've obviously talked about the fact he's proclaimed

that if Paul's a traitor,

then he has to be banished straight away.

Do we think he's in trouble now, Clara?

I think the thing about Ross is that I think he's just quite easily...

He's very... He's very malleable to, I think,

the Traitors and to the Faithful.

So I think he has put a bit of a target on his back.

Well, guys, it's the moment we've all been waiting for

because we've seen him swagger, we've seen him falter,

but the Ginger Godfather, Paul, finally came a cropper

thanks to another Traitor.

Let's remind ourselves of the moment that Harry saw red.

I was in the car coming back

and we were having chats about the mission today.

He said, "What do you think to Harry's reaction

"about the fact he was the most chased?" or whatever.

But then me and Jaz both at the same time just went,

we think it was mostly just in jest and banter, to be honest,

where he says, "Oh, I think they're coming after me" sort of thing.

But it kind of to me made me think

he was going... He was trying to... Yeah.

Fucking hell.

Paul telling Charlotte that,

"Don't you think Harry was a bit weird

"because he cared about the shield too much?"

Like, planting seeds about me. That caught me off my feet.

And I mean, if he wants to come at me, let the games begin.

And Paul is here with us now!

Don't make eye contact with him!

Paul, welcome.

He'll turn you to stone!

Wow. Welcome to Uncloaked, Paul.

Thank you. It's an absolute delight to have you.

It's not good to be here, actually, but, yeah. Yeah. I am here.

Yeah, we're glad you're here. Good.

Actually, these three are absolutely terrified of you.

But let's talk about that clip straight away.

The moment that Harry got that fire lit under him.

Yes! How does it feel, watching that moment back?

I just think it's bonkers what happens in there,

because the Faithfuls almost turn into bigger Traitors

than what the Traitors are.

So, Charlotte, in that moment, bless her, there's no malice there.

She's just thinking that is actually what happened.

And it wasn't. It's not what happened at all.

It's not what happened at all. What DID happen, Paul?

So I think it was Ross or Jasmine.

Jasmine brought it up. Jasmine.

They brought it up, and I basically was in the conversation

but had a tiny little remark back, but then squashed it

to remove Harry from being even part of the equation.

Cos I think Ross then said something along the lines of,

"Oh, I think that's just Harry reacting."

And I was like, "Yeah, I think it probably was just Harry reacting."

You were just doing what you have to do as a Traitor, which is go

with the flow of the conversation sometimes. You go with the flow,

but if you hear one of your other kind of team-mates mentioned,

then you have to either deflect away from them or offer another name

or just try and squash it there and then type of thing.

Charlotte was right in a way, because you were a Traitor.

And, let's be honest, you weren't that far off from turning

on Harry anyway. Oh - no, to be fair, with Harry,

I would never have turned my back on him

and I wouldn't have betrayed him. ALL PROTEST

You're such a liar! Get out!

I promise you now.

"Excuse me, I'm ready to go to my cell."

I promise. I promise you now...

And if you believe that, I've got magic beans to sell you.

No, I think, in my brain, right there and then -

because when Harry did that to me, it was a shock.

And I thought, "Oh, no, I thought me and you were going to win it."

Like, my plan was for me and Harry to win it, for Andrew to go,

and then we just carry on going down that process.

So, no, there wasn't one part of me that was going to betray Harry.

But you planted seeds for Harry. I feel like...

You mentioned his name a couple of times.

Well, you have to mention everybody's name,

but it's how you mention them.

But not one part of me was going to double cross Harry.

But Harry had already started on you before... Harry did, yeah!

..at the round table where Miles got banished.

Because he said to Zack, it's like two Traitors going at each other,

which was a genius seed to plant. Genius move.

And I think... I mean, that's... When I watched that,

it just... It blew me away, because I, obviously,

I know what happened from my perspective from being in there,

but I never know what's happening behind my back.

And it was beautiful, actually, in the earlier episodes,

Harry was defending me and my name would come up and he would say,

"Oh, no, it's this and that." And he would deflect.

Whereas Miles didn't do that.

If my name came up, he wouldn't, you know, try and deter it away

or mention another name. He would just say, "I don't know."

Do you think your confidence had anything to do with his decision

to actually start planting your name?

Because you was very confident and very - quite a strong player

and a strong Traitor.

So do you think he got a bit insecure thinking,

"Oh, maybe he's going to throw me," and that's why he started?

With Harry? Yeah. 100%.

I think as soon as... Like, it just makes so much sense now,

because at the time it didn't really make sense.

So, almost like in Jonny's game, the entire castle knew

that Jonny was going.

Yeah. And it was so bonkers that we were all just sat there

and I was like, "Oh, they're all going to vote for him,

"even though I've just come back from the dungeon."

Great Faithfuls! It's so obviously me.

And I was like... But then, all the accusations that came against me

were never too strong.

If I'm really confident or if I'm smiley,

they're not Traitor things, that's just my personality.

Whereas Anthony was like,

"You've come back, you've not been killed, we've killed Meg.

"It's so obviously you."

And I think Jaz at that point could have gone,

"Well, yeah, actually, Paul,"

because he's got that rhetoric going, as well, bless him.

But then they didn't do it and I didn't get a vote.

That was incredible. Very slippery.

You managed to wriggle out of that one

and then Harry brought that back in at your banishment.

Exactly right. But let's go back to that dungeon episode... Yes!

..because I feel like that was a major mistake.

Such a mistake.

I was way too cocky, just like, the character...

Was you?! Yeah, you might have noticed.

You might have noticed at one point, but, yeah, I was just too, you know,

like, I'm doing this act, I'm doing this character, and I'm just like,

"No, no, we're going to do this and we're going to do that."

And I was like, convinced, like, this is the way

that it's going to happen. And then, even - you can see me

almost trying to convince myself afterwards, like, in the turret,

I put my hood down. "Well, that worked perfectly."

Yeah, that was an amazing moment where you went,

"Well, it's all gone to plan," and it couldn't have gone worse.

It couldn't have gone worse! And I was sat there, but I almost felt

like I needed to try and convince the other guys that I was still

in control, because for some reason I was trying to, like...

I wanted to be in control of my own kind of fate and destiny.

I didn't want to sit back and, yeah, that was, I guess,

the character I was playing, the way I was trying to do it.

It just felt like the right thing to do. Because you were pretty...

You all seemed to be convinced that you would be saved... Yes.

..I guess, based on being voted the most popular player...

Yeah. ..earlier.

But then you're putting someone like Andrew in who's very -

who's very, very popular.

Yeah, exactly right. But then I thought maybe later on

down the line, can we recruit someone like Andrew?

And then we've already planted a seed then that he was in the dungeon

and then maybe Andrew could go.

So, like, we're trying to lay up strategies for the future

by bringing in characters that may also be considered as a Traitor.

Am I reading too much into it, or just at the end, as Harry goes

for you, is there just like a little flicker in your eyes of going,

"Well, well, well, the student has become the master"?

Is there a little flicker of pride like Logan Roy in Succession?

PAUL: I loved him.

I think, for me, it's Star Wars.

Like, it richly felt like, you know, when Darth Vader gets killed,

it was like, you know, "Harry, I am your father" type of thing.

And he got rid of me and...

Oh, God, not another revelation!

Well, I know, that's another secret.

Is he the son?

I'm Harry's dad!

I'm just trying to get back to my boy. He's just sat over there.

Do you know what? there was a beautiful moment

I had with Harry. I was having a little chat with him

and I was like, "Oh, I really love you, man.

"We're almost like brothers, aren't we?" I was saying that in one of my interviews.

And then Harry was like, "Oh, I said the same to you, but more like uncle and nephew."

And I was like, "I'm not that much older than you, please!"

To be fair, Harry's definition of an old person

is someone who has a wife, so...

"They've all got wives and stuff."

That took me out!

It's such a lovely line.

I think what we all loved about you, Paul, is clearly how much

you relished being a Traitor. Oh, yeah.

You were there for the game, you treated it as a game,

and you... I mean, you said murdering people is like eating

delicious dark chocolate. Yeah, wonderful, yeah.

Aubrey was the tastiest one out of the bunch.

I'm joking. Sorry, Aubrey.

Sorry, Aubrey. I'm sure he'd love to hear that.

Yeah, yeah. No, it was... And I think... I mean, I was trying

to get into character, like, the whole time when I was there.

I was reading American Psycho.

I was trying to picture Patrick Bateman.

I was just thinking, I can't break character,

and it's so funny. And I think you were kind of like this, as well,

like, when the other Traitors went into the interviews

and they would kind of like talk like a normal person -

I think you did that, as well -

I couldn't do that, because as soon as I went to normal me,

I start crumbling. So I remained in character.

But what's interesting is you almost see a crossover between me and Harry

where I start getting more emotional and sensitive

because I can't keep it up.

But then it seems like Harry almost kind of perfectly replaced me.

Especially after he got you banished.

Exactly, and then when I was watching that, I was like,

"Oh, my God!" Like, he's so devious.

Yeah. But when I went, I was proud of the group.

Like, I was happy, and genuinely, you have to be a Faithful, right?

And I was buzzing because we got one.

NISH: Yeah. Were you reading American Psycho

when you were in the castle?

Because that would've been a real red flag for me.

"D'you hear Paul's reading American Psycho?"

Yeah, yeah. Just walking around holding it.

WILF: The thing is, I feel like you was,

compared to every other Traitor, apart from Amanda -

I've said this - you've been able to separate the emotion

to the game. Tried, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, you tried. Well, you did.

Yeah. I don't think the emotion was real all the time, Paul.

Did you cry... Oh, no, it was. Yeah, yeah, I promise.

The son bit, was that real?

Yeah, yeah, my little boy, I missed him dearly.

But what you said was you took that genuine emotion about your son

and funnelled it into something else, which is pure Patrick Bateman. CLARA LAUGHS

Which is - yeah. I reframed it, I repositioned it.

I want to talk about how the reaction has been

since the series has started. Yes.

How has it all been going? How are you taking it?

I think it's... It's been the most amazing thing I've ever seen.

And it's... I love that we've taken part in it.

I've absolutely no regrets. You know, like, even...

I've had a lot of love from people online and stuff like that,

but I've also had a lot of, like, the opposite, of get me out.

Yeah, fair. But then I'm kind of happy with that because

even I got to the point where I'm watching it back now going,

"He has to go.

They have to find him.

THEY LAUGH

"We need to get this guy out. He's so cocky there."

What would you've done if you'd been a Faithful?

Cos it seemed like you had such a specific, worked-out plan

- for being a Traitor. - Yeah.

What would have happened if she hadn't tapped you?

Did you read the Bible, as well?

PAUL: Yeah. Did you read the Bible and Norman Bates at the same time?

Because I think you even said to Claudia

in the gold interview - you said, "The game is being a Traitor."

Like you're almost not playing the game if you're a Faithful.

Yeah, and I thought that. Going in, I thought the only way to truly,

like, participate in the game

and the whole strategic nature of it is by being a Traitor,

cos then you get to dictate the play.

And I thought, for me, my personality,

I'd be better to do that, then be someone that has to hide.

But I think if I was a Faithful, I would have been exactly the same,

except for, you know, I would just have been my normal self

and hopefully people still would have liked me for it.

I guess maybe I would have been a bit of a Jonny.

Like that type of, like, you know, people like him,

he's making people laugh and blah blah blah.

But I think if I was a Faithful, I wouldn't have got as far.

I think I would've been killed quite quick.

I think you would've been...

If you are seen to be a strategic Faithful...

Yeah. ..you get murdered early.

Oh, well, I couldn't do - yeah, I wouldn't do that.

I would literally go in and just be the affable guy.

Yeah. And I kind of started doing that in episode one,

even though I knew I was a Traitor. I was trying to be a Faithful.

So I was even saying to people,

you know, "I'm not writing things down at night,

"I'm not really thinking about it.

"I'm just, you know, trying to enjoy the experience."

But every night I'm writing down, you know, I'll do ten pages

of American Psycho and then I'll write down people's names.

THEY LAUGH

And, you know...

We've got some of our favourite social media posts...

OK. ..about you, Paul.

If you don't mind us reading them out? I'll brace myself.

Sasha on X says, "I feel like this may be a controversial opinion,

"but you can't play the Traitors and be a nice Traitor.

"Of course you're going to come across as a complete sociopath.

"That is literally the show.

"It is about being a joyful, lying manipulator.

"I love it."

I mean, I agree. Yeah. I think it is very hard to be nice

because it's going to catch up with you at some point.

But then the biggest thing for me was,

if I go into this show and not participate in it properly

and maybe sit back and say "I don't know",

then I probably still wouldn't have won and I still would have gone,

"Oh, well, if only I, you know, tried a bit of a strategy

and tried to own it a bit more," type of thing. Yeah.

Well, what Wilf did very cleverly on his series of the Traitors

is...was a sociopath, enjoyed killing people,

then at the end showed real emotion, and now everyone loves him. Yes.

But would you have liked to have been in the turret with Paul?

D'you know what? Probably not,

because my game plan was to stick together.

I know you probably won't believe that,

but it actually was.

It was... The only person I brought on to possibly backstab was Kieran.

And if I went in with this guy and he was doing it straightaway,

I'd feel very insecure very quickly. Yeah.

No, you'd be fine.

WILF LAUGHS

Wilf, are you OK?

THEY LAUGH

The best line from the whole show is them two words.

"You OK?" "You OK?"

"Paul from the Traitors was on Deal Or No Deal

"and won 10p. No wonder he's evil."

THEY LAUGH

Oh...

10p?! The supervillain origin story.

That is, yeah.

To be fair, that is more than you won on The Traitors. It's not...

Oh!

THEY LAUGH

Now, look, we continue the chat over on BBC Sounds

because we've got so much more to talk about.

I want Paul to rate his fellow Traitors,

and I want to get his reaction to the huge revelation

that Diane and Ross - Diana Ross -

are secret mother and son.

But for now, thank you so much

to Nish, Clara, Wilf and, of course, Paul!

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

Now, as you wait to find out just who our Traitors have murdered next,

why not play along at home with thousands of others

by joining our Traitors online predictor game?

Head here to find it.

And if your friends are glued to the show,

you can even invite them to play

in your own private mini competitions.

I think I'm going to set one up with Clara, Nish, Wilf and Paul.

We're going to do it as we go along.

I'm back for more Uncloaked tomorrow -

join us straight after episode nine.

We're getting closer to the end.

There are just two Traitors left.

And are their days numbered?

I'm Ed Gamble. Stay faithful.