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Hello and welcome along to the
Celebrity Traitors: Uncloaked,
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your official visualized companion
podcast with me, Ed Gamble.
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00:00:07,480 --> 00:00:10,799
Now you know the drill. Make sure
you've watched episode five
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00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:13,319
before you dive into this,
because there are spoilers galore.
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Coming up...
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Charlotte Church chats to me,
fresh from murder,
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and I reveal the identity
of our Traitors.
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Her reactions are priceless.
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We'll be hearing from another
dearly departed Faithful.
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It's king of the side-eye,
Tom Daley.
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Plus, it's two for one
on Faithful finalists
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as Alexander and Leanne return
from series three!
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Alexander and Leanne, such a delight
to have you on Uncloaked.
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We were hoping to have Helen Mirren
as well, but I'm too young
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to know who she is, sadly. OK. Yeah.
Not a clue!
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And was it Julie Dench? No idea.
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I am Gen Z.
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Look, we've got another
packed episode to feast on.
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We've got Charlotte Church.
She's coming up, mere minutes.
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But first of all,
the mother of all cliffhangers.
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The Round Table vote is a tie.
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Players, it is still a draw.
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Therefore, we will now leave this
banishment to the hands of fate.
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It's a double deadlock.
This has never happened before.
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This has never happened before
in the history of UK Traitors.
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Yeah. So this is absolutely huge,
so tense.
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Obviously you guys
did not go through this,
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leaving up a banishment to fate.
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But do you have any sense
of how they might be feeling?
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You obviously know how tense
the Round Tables are anyway,
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but with that on top of it,
how are those guys feeling?
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I mean, it's a lot, isn't it?
Because if you're voted out,
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that's one thing, you say, well,
I played the game the best I could
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and unfortunately I got voted out.
I kind of know how that feels.
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But it's an honest exit, right?
You did what you could,
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but you didn't make it. Yeah. That's
fine. But I think it's different
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being thrown out with chance.
You'd always look back and say,
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well, if only the coin had fallen
differently, or whatever they use.
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I hope it's really theatrical.
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Well, it is the Traitors. Yes.
Um, so... Because we don't know
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what it means yet. We don't know
how their fates are decided.
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Well, it's just going to be a bit
disappointing for whoever goes out,
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isn't it? Rock, paper, scissors?
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Yeah, I think that sounds
reasonable.
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Yeah. Or maybe an arm wrestle,
maybe we just go, spin the bottle,
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or something like that. Spin the
bottle might be a different game.
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It ends differently, doesn't it,
spin the bottle, yeah?
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How would you feel if you were
in that situation, Leanne?
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Oh, horrible. Not the
spin the bottle thing, I mean...
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Oh, that? Well, then...
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I think we should move on!
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Oh, honestly, I think, you know,
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because it would be
such a sinking feeling.
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Like Alexander just said,
they hadn't been voted out.
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Yeah. You know,
it's literally left to chance.
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We don't know how yet,
but, you know,
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if I left the game
from a toss of a coin,
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say, for example, I'd be devastated.
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Yeah. What a cliffhanger. Well,
look, whether it's David or Mark
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that gets banished,
one of them is going to be
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with me tomorrow night
on Uncloaked, telling me everything.
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Now, though,
we have another murdered player.
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And to everyone's shock,
it was Charlotte Church.
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Straight after she was offed by a
banshee, Charlotte sat down with me
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in Scotland as I revealed
who the Traitors are.
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Hi, Charlotte. Hi!
Welcome to Uncloaked.
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Thank you so much!
It's so good to be here!
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Thanks so much for joining us.
Happy to be here. Have a seat.
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Join me by the fire. Wonderful.
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Very excited to have you here.
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Of course,
the circumstances could be happier.
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Yes. You are no longer
in the Traitors game.
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No. But I think you had
a pretty good stint.
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Are you happy with the time
you got there?
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I'm happy with the time I got there.
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I feel like I had an experience
of most things.
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I'm sad that I didn't get
to experience getting out a Traitor.
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Mmm. Um, but I also think
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that I would have found the
intensification - is that a word? -
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but the intense nature of the game
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and that becoming progressively
more pronounced,
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that would have been quite difficult
for my little sensitive self.
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Let's talk about the missions. Yeah.
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Because you got stuck in
straight away, that first mission
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before you'd even been
in the castle... Yes.
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Digging through the grave,
looking for a shield? Yes!
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Were the missions something
you were looking forward to?
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Yes, absolutely. I think that that
was a big part of why I wanted
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to come in, to have a challenge,
have an adventure.
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And, you know,
those ones which are enormous,
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like the Trojan horse was, I mean,
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it was just so brilliant
to be part of that.
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But, yeah, the first one, as soon
as those Land Rovers - bjoom! -
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sped out, I was like,
hang on a minute!
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All is not quite as it seems.
And, yeah,
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I mean, being in the soil
is one of my favourite things to do.
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And so I had no problem
with digging my own grave.
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Now, you were very sure you were
going to be murdered.
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Yes. You were bang right.
Yes, I was.
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Why did you think that?
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Why did you feel like you were
going to be offed?
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I feel like probably because
I was so vocally a Faithful,
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and then I was, I think, good at
representing myself as a Faithful,
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then I don't, I think
that the Traitors couldn't use me
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as sort of a diversionary tactic
in terms of trying to frame me
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as a Traitor. And so, then,
what use was I to them, actually,
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where, um, hopefully,
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hopefully I might have become,
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you know, more discerning
as the game would have gone on.
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Um... and, yeah, so I think
that I would have been a threat
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to the Traitors, had I stayed.
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And, then, yeah, I couldn't...
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it would have been difficult
for them to really frame me
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as a Traitor. And maybe
a couple of them did vote for me
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at the Round Table, potentially,
and it wasn't really sticking,
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so they thought,
she's of no use to us,
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let's pop her off.
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Rather excitingly, we are going
to tell you who the Traitors are.
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You're going to find out
for yourself.
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I'm going to hand you a scroll.
It's right here. OK.
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But before I do that...
Chomping at the bit.
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I'm going to make you wait,
I'm going to make you wait. OK!
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Because I want to know
who you think the Traitors are.
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So, by the end of my time,
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I think my suspicions were on Mark,
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Jonathan and Celia. OK.
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Those are your top three.
They were my top three.
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Why Mark? Mark,
because he seemed to be...
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I could feel him acting
at the Round Table.
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Also, how hard he went for Tameka.
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And then with Jonathan,
I think that again,
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he was becoming more
and more of a patriarch,
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and he didn't seem to be driving
himself as mad as everybody else.
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OK. And who are your
definite Faithfuls?
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Oh! I don't think anybody!
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Maybe Nick, maybe Kate...
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maybe Cat.
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But that's it. OK. It's the moment,
Charlotte... Oh, my God!
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I'm going to hand you this. The
names of the Traitors are on here.
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We'll go one by one. OK.
There you are.
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Oh, my gosh, this is so exciting.
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Oh!
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Oh, goodness me!
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Oh!
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Jonathan.
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Jonathan!
And you said Jonathan. I did.
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You're one for one so far.
One for one.
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Cat!
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So she's one of your
close to 100% Faithful?
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She is. Oh, my gosh,
she's playing an exquisite game!
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I really wanted to believe
that she was Faithful, as well.
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Here we go.
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Alan!
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Didn't cross your radar at all, seemingly.
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Oh, my good gosh.
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Oh, my days!
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00:08:01,760 --> 00:08:05,359
Alan, you sleaky little Alan!
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Oh, gosh, Paloma,
she must have been fuming!
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00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:15,439
Oh, my days.
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00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:19,599
I think that Jonathan
is... has probably not got long.
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But I think that Cat and Alan,
wooo!
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That is going to be tough. Wow. Wow.
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Great reflections
from Charlotte there.
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Charlotte hasn't been without heat
at the Round Table. Mm. Yeah.
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But these Traitors don't
seem to care about that?
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They don't seem to want
to just leave people to be banished.
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00:08:41,560 --> 00:08:44,159
But I do think Charlotte would
have been a threat to the Traitors.
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I think she's a very,
very clever woman. Yeah.
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I think she's all the right things, right?
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She wasn't too Faithful,
in my view.
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She had some heat on her. She wasn't
too sort of dodgy as a Traitor.
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So it wasn't obvious to banish her.
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She was right in the middle,
which is where you want to be.
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And she was good at the missions.
So I think she got unlucky.
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I think she played it really well.
Well, some time's passed, we were
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desperate to catch up
with Charlotte again,
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but she's sadly unavailable today.
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So she sent us a video message
and started by telling us
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what it's like watching the show
go out.
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It's been great
watching the show go out so far.
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00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:21,359
I mean, I enjoy Traitors anyway.
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I hardly watch any telly at all,
but I do enjoy Traitors.
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00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:28,559
And so, yeah, it's just so juicy
and everybody's so interesting.
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You know, you've got some really
amazing people and characters
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00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:35,639
and brains and experience
in that cast.
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00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:38,999
So, it's been really great to watch.
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And I, like I think
most of the nation,
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have fallen madly in love
with Celia Imrie.
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I'm getting lots of love
from my friends and family,
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00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:52,879
and I've been having
a lot of people coming up to me
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00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:56,159
in the street. The postman
the other day was like,
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00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:59,439
trying to get some information out
of me, trying to catch me off-guard.
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00:09:59,440 --> 00:10:02,599
When I phoned for a doctor's
appointment the other day,
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00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:07,479
even they mentioned it,
making reference to "my girls",
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00:10:07,480 --> 00:10:09,159
and, uh...
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00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:11,239
that was a little bit awkward!
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00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:15,959
I think my favourite moment
of the series
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00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:19,039
was probably Celia's parp.
199
00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:25,439
Which was just amazing!
Just because she's so cheeky
200
00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:27,879
and mischievous and like,
201
00:10:27,880 --> 00:10:29,759
yeah, she's, um...
202
00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:32,839
oh, she's just so regal
and fabulous as well.
203
00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:38,039
And also, I just love farting. I
love farting in in all of its forms.
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00:10:38,040 --> 00:10:43,799
I think we should all
be doing more fluffing.
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00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:45,839
Great value, as always.
From Charlotte,
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00:10:45,840 --> 00:10:48,279
Leanne and Alexander, what are you
going to miss most about Charlotte
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00:10:48,280 --> 00:10:50,199
from the game? Oh, her energy.
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00:10:50,200 --> 00:10:52,039
She's so... she's got so stuck in.
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00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:54,119
In the missions,
she's not holding back.
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Her head was straight in that water.
I'm not sure
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00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:58,639
my head would have been
in that water as fast as hers,
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00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:01,919
I can't lie. Now, we saw
in Charlotte's castle chat
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00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:05,559
that she also suspected Mark. So,
there's so much suspicion for him,
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00:11:05,560 --> 00:11:08,039
if Charlotte had still been in,
it wouldn't have been deadlock,
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00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:10,679
because I think she would have gone
for Mark as well. What do we think
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00:11:10,680 --> 00:11:13,479
Mark can do, if he escapes
this banishment,
217
00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:16,879
what do we think he can do
to bat suspicion away from him?
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00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:18,879
I think I always had a sort of plan.
219
00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:21,519
I had notes on how I would
push suspicion away. First absorb
220
00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:23,919
and say, "You know, yeah,
look, that's a fair point,
221
00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:25,999
"And I can see what you're saying.
It's this and it's this,
222
00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:28,759
"and you make a good point on that."
But I would also say,
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00:11:28,760 --> 00:11:31,159
and then you lay out your defence,
but you do it quickly, right?
224
00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:33,919
You just want as little time on you
as possible. And that's where
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00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:36,279
the third thing comes in that you
say, actually,
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00:11:36,280 --> 00:11:38,239
"Have you thought about David?"
227
00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:40,679
Because what I'd be looking
for is somebody
228
00:11:40,680 --> 00:11:43,759
who has been quiet for a while,
or whatever it is that they've done,
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00:11:43,760 --> 00:11:46,039
it doesn't really matter
what they've done,
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00:11:46,040 --> 00:11:48,039
you just need a principle
and then make them stick
231
00:11:48,040 --> 00:11:49,959
to that principle
and then move it on.
232
00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:52,239
Somebody who's really starting
to find his voice is Nick.
233
00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:54,959
Now, Nick is obviously
very suspicious of Cat,
234
00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:57,719
but his gameplay around this
is fascinating.
235
00:11:57,720 --> 00:12:01,159
Cat has been playing
an absolutely brilliant game,
236
00:12:01,160 --> 00:12:04,199
and there was something
in the fact that, you know,
237
00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:06,919
she had the shield,
but we chose to not tell everyone
238
00:12:06,920 --> 00:12:08,359
that she had the shield.
239
00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:10,799
I didn't buy that.
And I do think she's slipping
240
00:12:10,800 --> 00:12:13,119
under the radar
in the most brilliant way.
241
00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:15,919
But I don't think I'm going
to name her at this point,
242
00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:18,920
because I think it's safer
to ally myself with her.
243
00:12:20,120 --> 00:12:22,759
How do we rate Nick's strategy here?
Do you know what,
244
00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:25,639
it can go one way or the other.
It could be a really good idea,
245
00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:27,959
you know,
to build an alliance with Cat,
246
00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:31,999
because obviously she's a Traitor.
But we could have another season two
247
00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:34,479
Jaz, where he might leave it
too late,
248
00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:37,319
and then no-one's going to listen
to him at the end,
249
00:12:37,320 --> 00:12:38,759
and then he's lost it.
250
00:12:38,760 --> 00:12:42,159
He's playing his own little game,
is Nick. Personally, I love it.
251
00:12:42,160 --> 00:12:43,959
I think this is great gameplay.
252
00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:47,039
Find a Traitor, sit close to them,
and then ride it a little bit
253
00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:49,199
towards the end of the game
and then turn. Yeah.
254
00:12:49,200 --> 00:12:52,159
I think that maintaining your
behaviour is so important... Yeah.
255
00:12:52,160 --> 00:12:54,439
In the game.
In the first couple of episodes,
256
00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:56,719
as we've seen, if you do something
that stands out,
257
00:12:56,720 --> 00:12:58,879
you run risk of just being banished
for that.
258
00:12:58,880 --> 00:13:00,919
Yeah.
But if people see you keep doing it,
259
00:13:00,920 --> 00:13:03,599
like, Alan has sort of kept his
behaviour pretty much the same.
260
00:13:03,600 --> 00:13:06,479
Kate Garraway under pressure
earlier, because she was
261
00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:08,879
sort of loudly repeating things
262
00:13:08,880 --> 00:13:11,319
that other people said,
which I love!
263
00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:13,599
And then she keeps doing it.
And eventually people just say, "Oh,
264
00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:15,719
"that's just Kate",
or, "That's just Alan." Yeah.
265
00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:18,239
And then you sort of baseline
to a different, different thing.
266
00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:20,199
And everyone just accepts you
as you are.
267
00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:22,439
And at that point, you're much,
much safer.
268
00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:25,679
So let's talk about Alan's growth
as a Traitor.
269
00:13:25,680 --> 00:13:28,439
To be sitting there and outwitting
Stephen Fry, I mean,
270
00:13:28,440 --> 00:13:32,159
it's like beating Albert Einstein
in chess or Cluedo or something.
271
00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:34,599
I just started stuffing cheese
272
00:13:34,600 --> 00:13:37,279
in my mouth
because I can't stop grinning.
273
00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:39,919
Isn't it funny? I was so nervous
when Claudia
274
00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:44,159
squeezed my shoulder blade,
and now I just love being a Traitor.
275
00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:46,799
Do we think he's
in danger of getting too cocky?
276
00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:48,959
If anyone can get away with it,
Alan can.
277
00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:51,239
Yeah. He's very... he's very scatty,
278
00:13:51,240 --> 00:13:52,999
he's very giggly, very sweaty.
279
00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:55,439
But also, from the beginning,
he's been throwing names out there.
280
00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:57,479
He's been calling people out
left, right and centre,
281
00:13:57,480 --> 00:14:00,039
and he's just getting away with it.
Also, he can get away with saying
282
00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:03,199
really horrible stuff to people,
because he's so charming.
283
00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:05,879
Yeah. It's just Alan! If Alan
accused me of being a Traitor
284
00:14:05,880 --> 00:14:09,199
and was horrible about something
I did, I'd be like, "Oh, Alan!
285
00:14:09,200 --> 00:14:12,319
"What a joy it is to be roasted
by you." I think it's one to watch.
286
00:14:12,320 --> 00:14:14,519
I sort of saw him
as a ticking time bomb.
287
00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:17,159
Now I think of him as a sort of evil
genius. Yes. And then the next phase
288
00:14:17,160 --> 00:14:20,039
is sort of some sort of karma.
So let's see. Exploded time bomb.
289
00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:23,159
Exploded time bomb, yeah! Well,
look, we've had a lot of memes
290
00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:26,399
based on Alan's first few episodes
as a Traitor, in the cloak,
291
00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:29,479
walking around with a lantern.
Oh, it's great, those.
292
00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:31,439
Going to put the bins out, etc.
293
00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:35,079
And some of Alan's deflections have
already become quite legendary
294
00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:37,999
as well. Let's not forget this
from episode two.
295
00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:42,919
"Oh, my gosh, I'm flabbergasted!"
Who uses that word.
296
00:14:42,920 --> 00:14:46,159
You can't... just call someone
a Traitor
297
00:14:46,160 --> 00:14:49,359
because they have
a better vocabulary than you.
298
00:14:49,360 --> 00:14:51,919
And that is as good a moment
as any to bring in the wonderful
299
00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:53,639
Tom Daley from LA!
300
00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:58,519
Hellooo! Hey!
Tom, welcome to Uncloaked.
301
00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:00,759
How many times have you used
the word flabbergasted
302
00:15:00,760 --> 00:15:02,879
in everyday conversation
since leaving the castle?
303
00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:05,599
Flabbergasted is like, one thing,
right? I genuinely was like,
304
00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:08,719
"Who still uses that word?"
It's like saying whoopsie-daisy.
305
00:15:08,720 --> 00:15:11,919
It's like saying discombobulated.
At least, like in 2025,
306
00:15:11,920 --> 00:15:14,479
you've got to be flabby-geeed,
or like...
307
00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:16,039
Flabby-geed!
308
00:15:16,040 --> 00:15:18,719
You got to have your flabbers gasted
at some point, you know?
309
00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:22,839
But flab... I don't know, it was,
it just caught me off-guard.
310
00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:25,559
Bless. But I do love Kate, though.
I feel really bad
311
00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:27,839
that like, it's come out
and I'm like, "Oh, my gosh,
312
00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:31,399
"like, why is she using that word?"
But she's really sweet, bless her.
313
00:15:31,400 --> 00:15:34,399
This is what I love about Traitors
is that you can go in and start
314
00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:37,719
watching the series - we had no idea
that the word flabbergasted
315
00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:40,999
would take the nation by storm,
such as it has.
316
00:15:41,000 --> 00:15:44,239
Who knew? And it's weird, because
I'm in LA, I don't have the...
317
00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:48,119
I'm not, like, involved in, like,
all of the UK chat as much,
318
00:15:48,120 --> 00:15:52,159
so now, whenever I see anyone
British, or any time I post anything
319
00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:55,479
on social media, everyone's like,
"Oh, flabbergasting!
320
00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:58,039
"Oh, I'm so flabbergasted!"
And I'm like,
321
00:15:58,040 --> 00:16:00,719
"Oh, my gosh, like, is this...?"
And I'm like, I feel like
322
00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:03,039
at some point I need to knit
a flabbergasted jumper.
323
00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:04,399
I think that's my next thing.
324
00:16:04,400 --> 00:16:05,679
I think you absolutely should.
325
00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:08,959
Have you been enjoying all of the
memes from the, from the side-eye
326
00:16:08,960 --> 00:16:13,759
as well? Yeah! Well, I had no idea
that my side-eye was that obvious.
327
00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:16,039
Well, like, I knew that I gave
a little side-eye, like,
328
00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:19,639
"Oh, God, here we go." But I didn't
realise that my face literally
329
00:16:19,640 --> 00:16:24,479
looked like I was gurning
into some kind of side-eyed monster.
330
00:16:24,480 --> 00:16:27,239
But, you know, it's... I mean,
it is what it is.
331
00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:29,599
It was so much fun.
I wish I could have stayed longer.
332
00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:32,239
I can't believe that, you know,
when I was about to,
333
00:16:32,240 --> 00:16:34,599
you know,
when I didn't come to breakfast,
334
00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:38,159
I was so gutted because I was
so excited about all of the missions
335
00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:41,559
to come and all of that stuff,
but, you know,
336
00:16:41,560 --> 00:16:43,559
it is what it is.
337
00:16:43,560 --> 00:16:45,319
You definitely went way too early.
338
00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:47,519
I mean, I'll bring
in Alexandra and Leanne here,
339
00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:49,799
but I think Tom was going
to prove himself
340
00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:52,039
to be quite the useful Faithful?
Oh, 100%.
341
00:16:52,040 --> 00:16:55,119
You are such a huge loss, Tom.
I'm devastated.
342
00:16:55,120 --> 00:16:57,199
You brought so many iconic moments.
343
00:16:57,200 --> 00:16:59,999
You've brought flabbergasted
back into existence.
344
00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:03,119
If you didn't pick up on that,
I don't think it would have ever
345
00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:05,159
been picked up on.
Tom, during our chat
346
00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:07,319
up in the Highlands
after you left the game,
347
00:17:07,320 --> 00:17:09,599
you were absolutely desperate
to know how Paloma
348
00:17:09,600 --> 00:17:11,479
had been murdered in plain sight.
349
00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:13,719
Yes. You really wanted to know.
You asked me a lot.
350
00:17:13,720 --> 00:17:15,839
I was under strict instructions
to not tell you.
351
00:17:15,840 --> 00:17:18,439
Now that you've finally
seen Alan touching Paloma's face,
352
00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:20,639
what did you make of it?
Yeah, I mean,
353
00:17:20,640 --> 00:17:23,879
I would never have known. I mean,
I found myself trying to be
354
00:17:23,880 --> 00:17:25,759
as observant as possible with, like,
355
00:17:25,760 --> 00:17:28,359
with things like the black lily
and the things like
356
00:17:28,360 --> 00:17:31,519
what animals are up on shelves
and where are things placed?
357
00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:34,199
Because I was like, you never know
when that's going to be a question
358
00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:36,719
in a mission. You never know if
that's going to be something
359
00:17:36,720 --> 00:17:39,039
that's going to be used to murder
someone. But, you know,
360
00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:41,999
I didn't pick up on the black lily
at all. So...
361
00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:45,879
It felt like you were a kind
of great sort of Traitor hunter.
362
00:17:45,880 --> 00:17:48,679
And your time was cut a bit short.
You were super observant.
363
00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:51,039
You watched everybody,
you watched everything.
364
00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:54,839
And you were certainly sort of
picking up all of the information.
365
00:17:54,840 --> 00:17:57,399
Yeah. I think that's something that,
as, you know,
366
00:17:57,400 --> 00:17:59,759
as an athlete,
you become quite a high-perceptive,
367
00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:03,359
so when I'm spinning around
and twisting and turning as a diver,
368
00:18:03,360 --> 00:18:05,799
I have to see every single thing
when I'm spinning, to know
369
00:18:05,800 --> 00:18:09,359
where I am in the air. So you learn
to pick up on these little things,
370
00:18:09,360 --> 00:18:12,479
to be able to keep self-centred
and be able to be like,
371
00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:15,679
keep yourself safe.
So for me, walking into a room,
372
00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:17,759
doing the mission,
and looking at the gates
373
00:18:17,760 --> 00:18:20,039
and trying to pick up
on all the little bits
374
00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:24,559
I felt were quite important, um, but
I think obviously the Traitors, um,
375
00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:27,679
saw that as something that maybe
if they slipped up,
376
00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:30,079
I might be someone
that might have been able... Yeah.
377
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:32,319
To sway people to banish them.
Yeah, definitely.
378
00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:35,799
Tom, I'd just be super interested
to know how it was for you,
379
00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:39,159
the difference between what you
expected, having seen a few series,
380
00:18:39,160 --> 00:18:41,439
and actually, what it was like
being on it,
381
00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:43,639
was it the same thing,
was it different?
382
00:18:43,640 --> 00:18:46,399
Yeah. I mean, it was terrifying.
Like, especially going into
383
00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:49,319
that Round Table.
The only Round Table that I was at,
384
00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:51,279
people started coming for me
385
00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:54,279
and I was like, "Oh, my gosh,
what am I going to say here?"
386
00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:57,959
And it was kind of, like, surreal
to see it all play out.
387
00:18:57,960 --> 00:19:00,239
And, you know, when you go into it
388
00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:03,599
thinking one thing, and then
everybody has those discussions,
389
00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:06,759
and then you end up being like,
"Oh, wait, maybe I've got it wrong."
390
00:19:06,760 --> 00:19:09,399
And then you start doubting yourself
and you start thinking,
391
00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:11,199
OK, my name's come up.
392
00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:13,639
Niko's names also come up
and I feel like more people
393
00:19:13,640 --> 00:19:16,759
are going to vote for Niko.
And then you find yourself, like,
394
00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:18,679
voting to try and save yourself,
395
00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:21,879
but not necessarily who you believe
is actually a Traitor.
396
00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:24,599
Tom, you were quite outspoken
with some of your suspicions
397
00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:26,879
in the game, which was a lot of fun
to watch.
398
00:19:26,880 --> 00:19:30,039
Obviously, you were suspicious
of Kate being flabbergasted,
399
00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:33,439
but you also had your doubts
about Clare, after she messed up
400
00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:34,999
the Trojan horse mission.
401
00:19:35,000 --> 00:19:37,439
You've known Clare since you were
a wee lad.
402
00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:40,759
Did you not believe her when she
was so remorseful about the mission?
403
00:19:40,760 --> 00:19:45,279
You know, looking back on it,
of course, like, it makes sense.
404
00:19:45,280 --> 00:19:48,039
But knowing that the Traitors met,
405
00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:50,239
I knew that they
were up to something that day.
406
00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:53,359
Like, who knew what it was going
to be, whether it was going to be...
407
00:19:53,360 --> 00:19:55,479
It ended up being a murder
in plain sight.
408
00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:58,399
Were they trying to sabotage the
mission? And something like that,
409
00:19:58,400 --> 00:20:00,839
yeah, it looks like an honest
mistake. But in this game,
410
00:20:00,840 --> 00:20:03,719
honest mistakes can cost
you your life.
411
00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:07,919
So it's... Yeah, instantly I
was like, "Hmm."
412
00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:10,759
Have you spoken to Claire
since the show started going out?
413
00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:12,759
I mean, we've got the WhatsApp
group.
414
00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:14,839
Of course.
The WhatsApp group pops off.
415
00:20:14,840 --> 00:20:17,279
Honestly, I wake
up to about 30 messages
416
00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:18,439
and I can't keep up.
417
00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:19,519
It's like going...
418
00:20:19,520 --> 00:20:21,519
It's like the school WhatsApp groups
with the parents.
419
00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:23,079
You're like, "Oh!"
420
00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:25,519
And Tameka is the voice-note queen
421
00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:27,559
of 2.5-minute-long voice notes.
422
00:20:27,560 --> 00:20:30,759
I can imagine.
And they are played on fast forward,
423
00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:33,319
even though they're already kind of
in fast forward.
424
00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:36,799
Um, so it's... Yeah,
it's lovely though,
425
00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:39,399
because Tameka reaches out to me
all the time,
426
00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:41,959
because obviously she was banished
in the same episode.
427
00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:44,639
So it's... Yeah, it's a... It's fun.
428
00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:46,759
It's really sweet.
Everybody is really,
429
00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:49,399
like, excited and watching
it back together,
430
00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:52,239
it feels like we've all been
on this journey together.
431
00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:55,719
So, at the Round Table, Niko voted
for you.
432
00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:58,239
And Joe Wilkinson was also
suspicious
433
00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:00,159
and voted for you. Did you worry
434
00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:02,840
that their votes might start to give
the other players ideas?
435
00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:05,399
Yeah, I thought
436
00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:07,799
that I was going to be banished
in the next Round Table,
437
00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:09,679
which is
why I was surprised to be murdered,
438
00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:12,239
because I thought, well,
my name's going to come up again
439
00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:14,719
and I'm going to have to try
and defend myself.
440
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:16,359
But, yeah,
441
00:21:16,360 --> 00:21:18,879
it's really kind of quite scary
when your name does come up,
442
00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:20,359
it takes you aback and you think,
443
00:21:20,360 --> 00:21:23,959
"What did I do other than try and
win as much money
444
00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:26,639
"in the mission as possible?
Running back, trying to get...
445
00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:30,399
"and trying to throw ideas out
there for who to banish."
446
00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:31,639
Because in the beginning,
447
00:21:31,640 --> 00:21:33,919
you've got nothing
to go on whatsoever.
448
00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:35,679
Like you say, just have to survive.
449
00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:38,039
So if you come
up in the first Round Table,
450
00:21:38,040 --> 00:21:40,279
you try to do anything to, you know,
451
00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:42,719
make sure that you're still there
the next day.
452
00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:44,959
Now, I should say this, Tom,
I don't want to grass her up,
453
00:21:44,960 --> 00:21:47,079
but we had Paloma on Uncloaked
the other night,
454
00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:50,679
and she was very suspicious of you
for a quite specific reason.
455
00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:52,079
Have a listen to this.
456
00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:53,679
I did have Tom in my head.
457
00:21:53,680 --> 00:21:56,399
I just felt like his outfit at
the funeral
458
00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:58,040
was very serial killer-y.
459
00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:03,519
And that's... Like American Psycho
460
00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:05,959
with the buttons done all the way
down.
461
00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:09,559
I was like, "Oh, my God!
He's a psychopath."
462
00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:12,319
Well, the thing is, Paloma -
463
00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:17,319
she was like wearing "I love me"
the first day, like so...
464
00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:19,279
So who's the real psychopath there?
465
00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:21,279
No, I love Paloma.
466
00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:23,119
I think she's, I think she's great.
467
00:22:23,120 --> 00:22:25,359
And I was like, you know,
everyone has been messaging me like,
468
00:22:25,360 --> 00:22:28,719
"Oh, my gosh, that's the most
inappropriate outfit for a funeral."
469
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:31,239
That's like, "I can't believe he
showed so much chest."
470
00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:33,559
I was like, "You do know it
was a game,
471
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:34,959
"and nobody actually died?"
472
00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:37,159
Yeah, you wouldn't wear that to a
normal funeral, Tom.
473
00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:38,999
Thank you. No! Well, no.
474
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:40,559
Well, maybe I would. You know,
475
00:22:40,560 --> 00:22:42,439
some people appreciate
the jubblies out,
476
00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:43,639
but I don't know, not everyone.
477
00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:45,439
Look, if she thought
that shirt was revealing,
478
00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:47,719
she should see
what you wear for diving, you know?
479
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:49,039
Exactly. There's not many people
480
00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:51,439
that wear more clothes to bed than
they do to work.
481
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:52,599
You could have gone
482
00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:54,559
in your little, your
little demure black trunks.
483
00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:56,079
That would have been very
respectful.
484
00:22:56,080 --> 00:22:57,759
Exactly. Yeah, exactly.
485
00:22:57,760 --> 00:22:59,559
It's probably the most respectful.
486
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:02,519
You know, I felt like I did
dress quite conservatively
487
00:23:02,520 --> 00:23:05,759
my time there. I was... You know,
I wore a suit on day one.
488
00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:08,719
Yeah. And you looked smashing.
Thank you.
489
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:10,119
Tom, if you hadn't been murdered,
490
00:23:10,120 --> 00:23:11,479
you said you thought
you might be banished.
491
00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:13,479
Did you have any idea of
what you might say
492
00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:16,319
at the next Round Table to prevent
that banishment?
493
00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:18,359
You know, at that point,
494
00:23:18,360 --> 00:23:20,079
you never know
what you are going to say.
495
00:23:20,080 --> 00:23:22,119
And I think being able to like,
if you were
496
00:23:22,120 --> 00:23:24,479
to plan something going into
a Round Table,
497
00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:26,919
it's always going to look rehearsed
and it's always going
498
00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:29,839
to look like you're a Traitor
if you've rehearsed something.
499
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:31,719
So I feel like you have
to really listen,
500
00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:32,759
really be in the moment
501
00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:35,399
and bounce off of
what other people are saying.
502
00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:36,719
But I think the whole time,
503
00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:39,719
if I was going into that
as a Faithful, like I was,
504
00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:43,159
I would have just had
to explain exactly my
505
00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:44,879
reasonings behind everything.
506
00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:48,439
And also give the understanding of
why someone might think that I was
507
00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:52,639
a Traitor, so that they feel heard,
but then also tell them why I'm not.
508
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:54,999
And then you just have to wish
for the best,
509
00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:57,999
because people are either going
to believe you or not.
510
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:00,719
Leanne and Alexander, from
an audience perspective,
511
00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:03,079
who do we think is closest
to catching a Traitor
512
00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:04,159
in there at the moment?
513
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:05,239
I mean, Clare Balding
514
00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:07,479
was really close
to catching Jonathan.
515
00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,359
Also, Joe Marler was really close to
going for Jonathan,
516
00:24:10,360 --> 00:24:12,599
but he just completely switched at
the Round Table.
517
00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:15,119
I feel like Joe has lots
of good ideas,
518
00:24:15,120 --> 00:24:18,399
but nobody really listens to him
all that much,
519
00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,799
and then he gets swayed by lots
of people.
520
00:24:20,800 --> 00:24:24,399
And I think the way that they were
looking straight away at David,
521
00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:27,079
because he all of a sudden voiced
an opinion, when that's
522
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:29,119
all they've been asking everyone
to do.
523
00:24:29,120 --> 00:24:32,919
Yeah. It's hard to tell
who might be close to catching.
524
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,719
I still can't believe
that nobody has caught on to Alan,
525
00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:39,199
because at every turn I'm just like,
"Come on!
526
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:41,559
"Someone's got
to see it sometime soon."
527
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:43,919
Watching it back,
it's almost embarrassing,
528
00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:45,479
isn't it, why not. But, yeah. Yeah!
529
00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:47,359
I completely agree, when you're in
there,
530
00:24:47,360 --> 00:24:48,799
it looks like he's just being Alan,
531
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:50,039
so it makes sense. Yeah.
532
00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:52,479
They're currently on the wrong
track with Mark.
533
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:53,759
What did you make of Mark?
534
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:56,079
There was obviously a lot of talk
about his looking
535
00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:57,519
at everyone at the funeral,
536
00:24:57,520 --> 00:24:59,399
standing aside
and staring at everyone,
537
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:01,119
whereas he should have
used your technique
538
00:25:01,120 --> 00:25:03,119
of just flicking his eyes to
the side.
539
00:25:03,120 --> 00:25:05,519
That's all he needed to do to look
at people.
540
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:07,599
Yeah, I mean, exactly.
You just look to one side,
541
00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:09,439
you can see everything.
542
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:10,639
Yeah. I mean,
543
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,559
it wasn't so much that Mark did
the...
544
00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:15,319
I think what people had a problem
with
545
00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:17,039
and why they thought he was
a Traitor,
546
00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:19,199
it wasn't that he just kind of like,
turned and, like,
547
00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:21,839
did like a, "Oh, I'm just going
to see how people are reacting."
548
00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:24,399
He made a real point
when we were there,
549
00:25:24,400 --> 00:25:27,679
he really stepped and really made
sure everyone saw that
550
00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:30,679
he did the whole peer around
the corner thing.
551
00:25:30,680 --> 00:25:33,159
So I think sometimes
if you're doing it to be like,
552
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:35,759
"Look, I'm being Faithful,
I'm really looking,"
553
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:38,559
it makes you look suspicious.
You just have to...
554
00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:40,879
I always think you always have to...
555
00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:42,759
If I was going to do it again,
556
00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:45,519
I would imagine I was a Traitor
and - what would I do
557
00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:47,999
in order to make people think I was
a Faithful? -
558
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:51,919
rather than just acting in a way
that you are truly Faithful.
559
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:54,599
Because that way you end
up being more suspicious...
560
00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:57,439
Yeah. That's so clever... because
you start overcompensating.
561
00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:00,399
Yeah. Also, David's up against Mark
in this banishment
562
00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:01,679
that's left to fate.
563
00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:04,119
What did you make
of David when you were in there?
564
00:26:04,120 --> 00:26:06,439
Oh, he's an incredibly smart person.
565
00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:08,999
He's somebody that is incredibly...
566
00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:11,759
He just... But he does sit back
and he just does observe.
567
00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:14,919
But, I do see
why it might be suspicious
568
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:16,279
that all of a sudden...
569
00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:17,959
He's not really throwing
anything out
570
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:20,399
and then all of a sudden he
has an opinion of who it might be.
571
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:22,199
Do you have a sense of
who you might have voted
572
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:25,239
for at that banishment tie-breaker,
between David and Mark?
573
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:27,479
Yeah,
I probably would have said Mark,
574
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:31,039
because I feel like David would not
be banished from the Round Table.
575
00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:32,559
So I feel like he would be someone
576
00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:34,439
that would get murdered
rather than banished,
577
00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:36,519
whereas Mark is somebody
that was going to get banished.
578
00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:38,119
So towards the end,
579
00:26:38,120 --> 00:26:40,199
if you want to survive
as a Faithful,
580
00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:43,239
you want to keep people in the game
that are going to get banished at
581
00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:45,919
the Round Table, and leave the ones
that are likely to get murdered.
582
00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:47,919
But again,
these Traitors are doing things
583
00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:50,719
that you just never
would have even thought to do.
584
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:53,279
Now, we're almost out of time,
but I've mentioned already
585
00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:55,279
on Uncloaked that I'm actually
hidden
586
00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,519
in this series
of the Celebrity Traitors somewhere,
587
00:26:57,520 --> 00:26:58,999
on one episode, I'm hidden.
588
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:01,159
Any ideas? I'm not going to reveal,
589
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:02,959
but, all three of you,
do you have a guess of
590
00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:05,400
where I might be popping
up or have popped up?
591
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:09,559
I think, what were they called
in the mission? Sirens?
592
00:27:09,560 --> 00:27:11,919
The banshees. The banshees. Yeah,
I think you're a banshee.
593
00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:13,599
You think I'm a banshee?
Well, thank you very much.
594
00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:14,879
You're welcome.
595
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:18,879
I'm kind of hoping you were in
the choir in the funeral?
596
00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:20,919
Yeah. Maybe I'm just projecting
here.
597
00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:23,359
You want to be in the choir.
I'd love to see you behind the mask.
598
00:27:23,360 --> 00:27:25,919
I didn't see you in the...
I didn't see you in the choir.
599
00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:28,159
You must have been - one of
those people that were, like,
600
00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:30,599
pulling people out of the car,
fully masked and cloaked.
601
00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:33,879
Interesting. What, for the
chained-up mission?
602
00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:35,879
Yeah. Episode three.
603
00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:38,679
All interesting. Are any of us
close? Was I in the choir?
604
00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:39,999
I'm not going to tell you.
605
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:41,279
What an awful reveal that would be!
606
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:42,679
When are we going to find out?
607
00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:45,399
Is it for the finale reveal?
608
00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:47,359
Yeah. We're keeping it until the
finale, I think.
609
00:27:47,360 --> 00:27:48,759
Imagine if one of you was close
610
00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:50,359
and I went, "Yeah, you're right.
611
00:27:50,360 --> 00:27:51,840
"Anyway..."
612
00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:55,599
Obviously, if you've got guesses
at home,
613
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,119
comment on socials, and tell me
where you think I am.
614
00:27:58,120 --> 00:27:59,959
That's an interesting sentence.
615
00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:02,999
Meanwhile, the chat
continues over on BBC Sounds.
616
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,359
I'll ask Tom how he'd play the game
as a Traitor,
617
00:28:05,360 --> 00:28:07,679
and what his husband thinks
of his time on the show.
618
00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:09,839
That's in your bonus episode
of Uncloaked.
619
00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:11,559
Just scan the QR code on your screen
620
00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:14,239
and then listen straight away,
as you get into your jimjams.
621
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:15,559
I'm back tomorrow night,
622
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:17,439
and I'll be joined
by whoever gets banished.
623
00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:19,079
It's either David or Mark,
624
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:22,039
so one of them will get to find out
who the Traitors are.
625
00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:24,799
Plus, we'll have any other murdered
or banished players.
626
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:27,159
Thanks for now to Leanne,
Alexander and Tom.
627
00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:29,279
And to you for watching.
I'm Ed Gamble,
628
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:30,680
stay Faithful.
629
00:29:01,470 --> 00:29:05,470
https://ko-fi.com/TheArmory
54574
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