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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:07,390 --> 00:00:08,630 Previously on The Hack. 2 00:00:08,890 --> 00:00:13,390 So, Nick Davis and the Guardian are losing the exclusive, but winning the 3 00:00:13,650 --> 00:00:17,130 Alan Rusbridger and the Guardian have been in touch with us at Panorama. It's 4 00:00:17,130 --> 00:00:20,490 the hacking stuff, but there's also this story on Jonathan Rees that they've 5 00:00:20,490 --> 00:00:21,189 been pushing. 6 00:00:21,190 --> 00:00:22,650 We found invoices on his desk. 7 00:00:23,130 --> 00:00:26,970 Rees, the Alex Maranchuk, and the News of the World. While Andy Coulson was the 8 00:00:26,970 --> 00:00:27,549 end of them. 9 00:00:27,550 --> 00:00:30,570 There was a name that appeared in the top corner of Glenn's notes. 10 00:00:30,850 --> 00:00:34,430 Ian Edmondson. Ian Edmondson? You reported directly to Coulson? 11 00:00:34,730 --> 00:00:35,790 Someone I wanted to meet. 12 00:00:36,140 --> 00:00:37,260 David Cook, Golden Brown. 13 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:39,640 I'm interested to hear more about what's happened to you. 14 00:00:39,940 --> 00:00:42,480 I, uh, I think I might be able to help. 15 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:02,300 I, uh, are you going to find a walk -in? 16 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:04,400 No. 17 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:06,000 Do you have a favourite spot? 18 00:01:07,100 --> 00:01:08,360 Hill walking in Arran, sir. 19 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:10,900 You don't need to call me sir. 20 00:01:12,360 --> 00:01:13,360 Policeman's habit. 21 00:01:14,460 --> 00:01:15,460 Well, I like Arran. 22 00:01:16,380 --> 00:01:20,600 Particularly in the... And this might point to a certain masochistic quality 23 00:01:20,600 --> 00:01:21,359 my part. 24 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:22,480 Particularly in the wintertime. 25 00:01:22,980 --> 00:01:23,980 Well, it's the colours. 26 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:25,400 Arran in the winter. 27 00:01:26,020 --> 00:01:27,720 Well, we shall have to go. 28 00:01:28,200 --> 00:01:29,380 You can show me the route. 29 00:01:30,520 --> 00:01:33,440 Oh, you're making me quite homesick. 30 00:01:33,850 --> 00:01:36,450 No, surely you can get up there more often now you're not... Now that I don't 31 00:01:36,450 --> 00:01:37,068 have a job? 32 00:01:37,070 --> 00:01:42,030 No, I didn't mean... I should be able to, shouldn't I? And yet I keep being 33 00:01:42,030 --> 00:01:43,030 dragged back to London. 34 00:01:45,250 --> 00:01:50,530 Glenn has told me something about what happened to you. Your, uh, your story. 35 00:01:51,470 --> 00:01:52,470 Okay. 36 00:01:52,670 --> 00:01:53,670 The intrusion. 37 00:01:54,130 --> 00:01:57,530 The surveillance. The, uh, the meeting with Rebecca Brooks. 38 00:01:58,790 --> 00:02:00,090 It sounds a merry mess. 39 00:02:01,090 --> 00:02:02,650 Yeah, well, look, I made mistakes. 40 00:02:03,290 --> 00:02:04,290 I should know. 41 00:02:04,330 --> 00:02:06,230 Oh, well, we all do. 42 00:02:07,650 --> 00:02:08,650 We all do. 43 00:02:09,789 --> 00:02:15,130 My father was a minister, as I think you know, in the Church of Scotland. He 44 00:02:15,130 --> 00:02:19,230 would hear everyone's stories. 45 00:02:21,150 --> 00:02:24,350 It's a great feeling on my part that I don't have the time nor the patience 46 00:02:24,350 --> 00:02:28,690 he does, so I think it's my responsibility to tell you why your 47 00:02:28,690 --> 00:02:30,050 unusual story mattered to me. 48 00:02:31,290 --> 00:02:32,290 It's because... 49 00:02:34,709 --> 00:02:38,670 It's because I think this country has become polluted and I think that we 50 00:02:38,670 --> 00:02:42,270 all, should all, try to do something about it, don't you? 51 00:02:45,370 --> 00:02:47,690 You've read the pieces in The Guardian about the hacking? 52 00:02:48,450 --> 00:02:49,450 Yeah, an excellent one. 53 00:02:50,030 --> 00:02:52,210 Did you read the pieces in The New York Times too? 54 00:02:52,530 --> 00:02:54,830 I did. And you know the work that Glenn is doing at Panorama? 55 00:02:55,170 --> 00:02:56,170 Yeah. 56 00:02:58,450 --> 00:02:59,450 Rupert Murdoch. 57 00:02:59,610 --> 00:03:03,490 is trying to take control of BSkyB. If he does that, it's a valuable 58 00:03:03,490 --> 00:03:07,530 organization, and he will leverage the value of it to accumulate the debt 59 00:03:07,530 --> 00:03:13,030 to buy a huge multinational company, perhaps Disney or Time Warner. 60 00:03:13,290 --> 00:03:17,530 He'll have control of our media landscape and a good hold of America. 61 00:03:19,870 --> 00:03:20,990 He needs to be stopped. 62 00:03:22,010 --> 00:03:23,010 I agree. 63 00:03:23,530 --> 00:03:26,590 I will tell you my stories, and you will tell me yours. 64 00:03:27,510 --> 00:03:28,610 And then perhaps, David, 65 00:03:29,540 --> 00:03:31,240 Perhaps we can work out how to help each other. 66 00:03:31,740 --> 00:03:32,740 What do you say? 67 00:03:34,780 --> 00:03:35,780 What do you want me to say? 68 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:04,100 Into the shark's cage. 69 00:04:04,320 --> 00:04:07,020 I don't think they'll be providing us with cages tonight. 70 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:11,780 You're late. Wouldn't a helpful press award are a good idea? A narcissist who 71 00:04:11,780 --> 00:04:15,820 realized it's an industry full of narcissists who pay to be rewarded for 72 00:04:15,820 --> 00:04:17,500 narcissism. I can't be here. 73 00:04:18,540 --> 00:04:19,540 Look over there. 74 00:04:20,779 --> 00:04:21,839 Things of the world. 75 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:25,960 You know, they actually have members of staff under arrest and many more being 76 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:28,600 investigated. Brass neck on them is ridiculous. 77 00:04:29,060 --> 00:04:30,660 So the least I can attempt is some neck. 78 00:04:31,620 --> 00:04:34,680 No, I just want you here. You think we're going to win something? 79 00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:40,040 You're mad. Everyone here hates us. I want you here because I want us to lose 80 00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:41,040 with dignity. 81 00:04:41,440 --> 00:04:42,440 Together. 82 00:04:42,960 --> 00:04:43,960 I've missed you. 83 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:48,400 I feel itchy. I hate this shirt. Well, it makes you look extremely handsome. 84 00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:49,760 Oh, well. 85 00:04:49,780 --> 00:04:52,260 Now, I have to go and play nice with some rich board members. 86 00:04:52,660 --> 00:04:57,360 But please remember, these people, they're more frightened of you than you 87 00:04:57,360 --> 00:04:59,760 of them. Oh, there's a difference between hate and fear. 88 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:20,400 Ladies and gentlemen, your attention please. 89 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:25,480 Before our awards start this evening, we have a special update from journalist 90 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:26,960 Nick Davies. 91 00:05:28,340 --> 00:05:33,240 On Wednesday the 26th of January, News International passed Scotland Yard three 92 00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:36,780 email messages which they claimed to have only just discovered in Ian 93 00:05:36,780 --> 00:05:39,580 Edmondson's computer, and Ian Edmondson was sacked. 94 00:05:40,100 --> 00:05:44,880 Once in receipt of these emails, Scotland Yard announced a new inquiry. 95 00:05:45,830 --> 00:05:49,090 Operation Wheating under the command of Sue Aples. 96 00:05:49,290 --> 00:05:55,070 I dismissed Wheating as a PR move by the Met until on the 9th of February they 97 00:05:55,070 --> 00:05:56,070 released a statement. 98 00:05:56,370 --> 00:06:02,570 The new evidence recently provided by News International is being considered 99 00:06:02,570 --> 00:06:08,230 alongside material already in the Metropolitan Police Service's 100 00:06:08,690 --> 00:06:09,690 Couldn't be. 101 00:06:09,810 --> 00:06:13,470 They weren't finally going to investigate the last four years of their 102 00:06:13,470 --> 00:06:19,640 incompetence. All actions and decisions by the previous investigation are being 103 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:21,640 reviewed. What were they? 104 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:23,520 Were we winning, finally? 105 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:29,160 I certainly didn't feel like a winner. Show business, shall we? And the award 106 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:34,120 for showbiz reporter of the year goes to... It's Stephen Moyes of the News of 107 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:35,039 the World! 108 00:06:35,040 --> 00:06:36,400 Congratulations, Stephen. 109 00:06:37,450 --> 00:06:41,690 and the award for News Reporter of the Year goes to... It's the fake Sheikh 110 00:06:41,690 --> 00:06:44,010 Mazam Amr for the News of the World. 111 00:06:45,970 --> 00:06:50,430 The Scoop of the Year now. The Scoop of the Year is awarded to the News of the 112 00:06:50,430 --> 00:06:53,930 World for its excellent coverage of the cricket corruption scandal. 113 00:06:54,410 --> 00:06:57,670 And the award goes to... The News of the World! 114 00:06:57,890 --> 00:06:58,890 The News of the World! 115 00:07:00,410 --> 00:07:04,430 OK, the moment we've all been waiting for. It's the big one. The Newspaper of 116 00:07:04,430 --> 00:07:05,149 the Year. 117 00:07:05,150 --> 00:07:09,070 Now, the Newspaper of the Year goes to, for what the judges say is a paper 118 00:07:09,070 --> 00:07:12,350 completely unafraid to take on the powers that be. 119 00:07:12,950 --> 00:07:17,130 So, the Newspaper of the Year award goes to... The Guardian! 120 00:07:36,750 --> 00:07:38,170 Jackie Ames? Yes. 121 00:07:38,750 --> 00:07:40,630 My name is D .S. Slater. 122 00:07:40,870 --> 00:07:42,450 This is D .C. Grossman. 123 00:07:43,310 --> 00:07:44,310 Is it David? 124 00:07:44,870 --> 00:07:45,849 David Cook? 125 00:07:45,850 --> 00:07:52,630 No. Well, I suppose, in a way, yes. We are here investigating. 126 00:07:52,850 --> 00:07:54,170 We're part of a new operation. 127 00:07:55,130 --> 00:07:56,210 Operation Wheating? 128 00:07:56,850 --> 00:07:59,890 We're investigating allegations of phone hacking. 129 00:08:01,010 --> 00:08:02,670 Do you work for Johnny Eats? 130 00:08:02,910 --> 00:08:05,030 No, we're part of the Special Crime Directorate. 131 00:08:06,060 --> 00:08:09,280 Under the command of Deputy Assistant Commissioner Akers. 132 00:08:14,020 --> 00:08:17,660 Great, thank you. You were found in the notebooks of Glenmill Care. 133 00:08:18,340 --> 00:08:19,800 This doesn't surprise me. 134 00:08:21,340 --> 00:08:23,020 We'd like you to take a look at these details. 135 00:08:24,060 --> 00:08:27,100 Is this your police payroll and warrant numbers? 136 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:28,360 Yes. 137 00:08:28,620 --> 00:08:29,820 How did he have these? 138 00:08:32,039 --> 00:08:33,440 That's where I lived in 1977. 139 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:35,539 Is this where you worked in 2002? 140 00:08:35,820 --> 00:08:39,520 Yes. And this phone number, this is... This is correct, yeah. 141 00:08:41,860 --> 00:08:44,760 There's information here that could only have come from my police personnel 142 00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:45,760 file. 143 00:08:45,880 --> 00:08:48,900 Yeah, we, um... That's what we think. 144 00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:54,600 Someone within the Met sold him my information. 145 00:08:55,960 --> 00:08:56,960 David's information. 146 00:08:57,440 --> 00:08:58,440 It's, um... 147 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:02,960 Is it possible? 148 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:07,100 When was this known? 149 00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:08,539 I'm sorry? 150 00:09:08,540 --> 00:09:11,040 When did the Metropolitan Police have this information? 151 00:09:13,360 --> 00:09:16,280 A notebook was taken from Eau Claire in 2006. 152 00:09:21,700 --> 00:09:22,700 2006? 153 00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:28,620 Yeah. And the Metro was neither too informing nor investigate this 154 00:09:28,620 --> 00:09:30,940 possible corruption. 155 00:09:32,319 --> 00:09:36,300 Well, that's... That's what we're trying to do now, Mum. 156 00:09:51,100 --> 00:09:52,100 Glenn Campbell. 157 00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:53,160 Luke Davis. Hi. 158 00:09:53,300 --> 00:09:54,300 Honour and a privilege. 159 00:09:56,620 --> 00:09:59,340 I hear that you're not well liked at Panorama. 160 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:01,180 I hear you're adored at the Guardian. 161 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:03,900 So, who do you usually meet here? 162 00:10:04,220 --> 00:10:06,380 Is this where you meet criminals or politicians? 163 00:10:06,800 --> 00:10:09,760 I float between cafes and pubs like a butterfly at a festival. 164 00:10:10,260 --> 00:10:12,340 I liked the panorama on Alex Marinchak. 165 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:13,600 It wasn't one of mine. 166 00:10:13,940 --> 00:10:15,720 You helped a lot. It was good. 167 00:10:16,240 --> 00:10:20,060 You've got some particularly great hits in on Jonathan Rees. I really liked your 168 00:10:20,060 --> 00:10:21,060 piece on him, too. 169 00:10:21,300 --> 00:10:22,300 Mr. A. 170 00:10:22,480 --> 00:10:23,480 Very good. 171 00:10:23,860 --> 00:10:24,860 You writing more? 172 00:10:25,100 --> 00:10:26,100 No. 173 00:10:27,380 --> 00:10:29,320 I'm... Didn't Dave say I'm out? 174 00:10:29,880 --> 00:10:31,320 Coulson's gone. It's as far as I can go. 175 00:10:32,140 --> 00:10:33,140 Don't look like that. 176 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:35,580 An engineer death, but something. 177 00:10:35,820 --> 00:10:40,120 I wanted people to take it seriously. They didn't. So I'm handing everything 178 00:10:41,080 --> 00:10:43,160 Trying to persuade Ireland to give me Belgium. 179 00:10:44,140 --> 00:10:45,980 I gave you newspaper of the year. 180 00:10:46,220 --> 00:10:48,580 That was for the Guardian, not me. I lost my category. 181 00:10:49,160 --> 00:10:51,360 You're getting somewhere, Nick. I got somewhere. 182 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:55,460 Look, I know this must have cost you. Cost me in the heart of it. 183 00:10:56,100 --> 00:10:57,720 But no one... 184 00:10:58,890 --> 00:11:03,030 No one cared. The whole industry turned away like a complete snake. 185 00:11:03,490 --> 00:11:06,210 What if I said I came to see you today with an agenda? 186 00:11:07,250 --> 00:11:12,150 I'm friends with Claire Rue Castle -Brown, the journalist and sister -in 187 00:11:12,150 --> 00:11:17,850 Gordon Brown. He's leaning in. I took Dave to see him, and he now wants to 188 00:11:17,850 --> 00:11:18,850 you. 189 00:11:19,330 --> 00:11:20,330 Gordon Brown? 190 00:11:20,350 --> 00:11:23,290 Gordon's been looking at your work, and he thinks there's a way to use it to go 191 00:11:23,290 --> 00:11:24,290 further. 192 00:11:25,050 --> 00:11:26,050 Come on, Nick. 193 00:11:26,670 --> 00:11:28,010 What's meeting him going to cost you? 194 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:42,700 Well, it's wonderful to have you all here. Thank you, Claire and Glenn, for 195 00:11:42,700 --> 00:11:43,700 organising it. 196 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:47,220 You know, I have such respect for the work of everyone in this room. 197 00:11:47,780 --> 00:11:50,000 And I used to be Prime Minister. There, does that start us off? 198 00:11:50,460 --> 00:11:51,460 Yes. 199 00:11:51,740 --> 00:11:52,740 Just about. 200 00:11:53,180 --> 00:11:58,300 The Murdoch B -Sky B -Bid would be a disaster for our country. This hacking 201 00:11:58,300 --> 00:12:01,860 investigation needs better scrutiny than people have chosen to give it. If 202 00:12:01,860 --> 00:12:04,740 people understood, properly understood the hacking, what was happening with 203 00:12:04,740 --> 00:12:07,460 hacking, it may mean they rethink the B -Sky B -Bid. 204 00:12:07,740 --> 00:12:09,240 We have a shared objective. 205 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:16,220 How we achieve that objective is, well, I increasingly believe, as it is clear, 206 00:12:16,340 --> 00:12:18,520 and Tom, would be best achieved together. 207 00:12:19,660 --> 00:12:21,560 And perhaps everyone would like some tea. 208 00:12:21,780 --> 00:12:23,400 And perhaps everyone would like some tea. 209 00:12:24,040 --> 00:12:25,060 That's it, that's it, I'll pour. 210 00:12:25,260 --> 00:12:26,260 No, I'll pour. 211 00:12:27,460 --> 00:12:28,460 Right. 212 00:12:29,560 --> 00:12:30,560 Who would like to begin? 213 00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:32,380 Well, maybe I should speak first. 214 00:12:33,680 --> 00:12:38,580 I was recently interrupted in an investigation room and shown details of 215 00:12:38,580 --> 00:12:39,820 in Operation Wheating that were. 216 00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:43,180 Well, the level of intrusion was troubling. 217 00:12:43,380 --> 00:12:46,600 It's just possible that Operation Wheating is the first Met Op to be run 218 00:12:46,600 --> 00:12:49,380 properly. Well, the secret is John Yates hasn't been running it. 219 00:12:49,660 --> 00:12:53,120 Good. Good. So, how do we help them? 220 00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:55,160 Where will they struggle? 221 00:12:55,520 --> 00:12:57,560 Well, we have to get them to include Jonathan Rees. 222 00:12:57,920 --> 00:13:00,600 It makes no sense to tackle Mulcair and not Rees. 223 00:13:01,610 --> 00:13:05,090 I've got invoices to show that they were both up to exactly the same activities. 224 00:13:05,290 --> 00:13:08,150 Prepare me a file and I'll send it to Sue Akers. 225 00:13:08,750 --> 00:13:09,750 Is it that simple? 226 00:13:10,070 --> 00:13:14,150 Well, I have access to Sue through the Select Committee. I can't promise 227 00:13:14,150 --> 00:13:16,090 results, but it's a start, no? 228 00:13:16,390 --> 00:13:21,090 Sue and I were DSs at the same time. I've already asked her to expand the 229 00:13:21,090 --> 00:13:25,550 of the investigation, but... It'll mean more coming from a parliamentary 230 00:13:25,550 --> 00:13:26,550 perspective. 231 00:13:26,910 --> 00:13:27,910 Good. 232 00:13:28,130 --> 00:13:29,130 What else? 233 00:13:30,120 --> 00:13:32,540 You seem to all be constantly looking at me surprised. 234 00:13:33,160 --> 00:13:35,820 Correct me if I'm wrong, but the problem we have is that the police, 235 00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:38,900 politicians, and press are all collaborating under Murdoch's aegis. 236 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:43,020 We are also made up of police, politicians, and press. 237 00:13:43,340 --> 00:13:45,600 I'm not official opposition, if you like. 238 00:13:46,140 --> 00:13:48,380 So, let's talk. 239 00:13:49,500 --> 00:13:50,500 What do we need to do? 240 00:13:57,460 --> 00:13:58,460 You are... 241 00:13:59,329 --> 00:14:00,570 Are you having a nice time? 242 00:14:01,190 --> 00:14:02,190 Uh, what? 243 00:14:02,870 --> 00:14:05,710 You know, you're a remarkable campaigner, Mick. Did you ever consider 244 00:14:05,710 --> 00:14:06,710 politics? 245 00:14:08,610 --> 00:14:11,070 Um... Well, I don't know. I don't know. 246 00:14:11,730 --> 00:14:12,730 Why would you say that? 247 00:14:13,310 --> 00:14:15,430 Perhaps a bit too suspicious of other people to be a politician. 248 00:14:15,790 --> 00:14:17,570 Something I struggle with myself sometimes. 249 00:14:18,450 --> 00:14:20,570 And, uh... And I believe it because I've seen it. 250 00:14:20,950 --> 00:14:21,950 On this case. 251 00:14:24,070 --> 00:14:25,570 You're not sure whether I mean this, are you? 252 00:14:26,170 --> 00:14:27,170 Sorry? 253 00:14:27,210 --> 00:14:28,210 You don't trust me? 254 00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:30,940 I think this is the ball that I picked up that I will quickly drop. 255 00:14:31,660 --> 00:14:33,300 You're saying you won't drop the ball? 256 00:14:36,460 --> 00:14:41,280 You know, they, um... They came at me in every way, as you might expect. 257 00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:43,200 They blagged my lawyer. 258 00:14:43,860 --> 00:14:48,580 They procured my family's medical information, and they, um... This is 259 00:14:48,580 --> 00:14:52,020 something. They impersonated me to get into my building society account. 260 00:14:52,740 --> 00:14:53,740 That's a lot. 261 00:14:53,850 --> 00:14:58,350 I tried to hold a judicial inquiry into phone hacking in, let's see now, autumn 262 00:14:58,350 --> 00:15:02,810 2009. After I read a piece of yours, that was my first article. 263 00:15:03,090 --> 00:15:06,370 The civil service resisted it, I think is a kind term. 264 00:15:06,670 --> 00:15:08,670 It did not meet the tests of public concern. 265 00:15:09,930 --> 00:15:15,910 You know, everyone thinks I'm close to Rupert. He's very adept at that. He 266 00:15:15,910 --> 00:15:20,970 quietly, you know all this. He rarely disagrees. He asks questions and... 267 00:15:22,410 --> 00:15:24,130 He makes everyone feel interesting. 268 00:15:24,890 --> 00:15:28,810 It fascinates me how the powerful let him in. 269 00:15:29,190 --> 00:15:32,790 I wasn't as good at that game as Tony. 270 00:15:33,890 --> 00:15:37,910 When he came for me, and he did, I was unprepared. 271 00:15:38,570 --> 00:15:41,710 Whether it was how I bowed my head at the cenotaph or how I wrote to the 272 00:15:41,710 --> 00:15:43,230 grieving mothers of dead soldiers. 273 00:15:43,630 --> 00:15:44,630 Yes, I remember. 274 00:15:44,950 --> 00:15:46,250 You know, I rang Rupert. 275 00:15:47,020 --> 00:15:52,280 To tell him that his papers were damaging morale in Afghanistan. As Prime 276 00:15:52,280 --> 00:15:57,280 Minister, I was asking people to fight, to risk, and he was telling them article 277 00:15:57,280 --> 00:16:01,180 after article that I was casual with their lives, with soldiers' lives, that 278 00:16:01,180 --> 00:16:05,780 didn't care, to undermine that, to make those young people feel 279 00:16:05,780 --> 00:16:10,240 undervalued by their government. 280 00:16:13,220 --> 00:16:14,220 Which is not right. 281 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:21,680 Sometimes you can tell that you're the son of a preacher. 282 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:26,580 You know he wants everything. 283 00:16:27,700 --> 00:16:29,100 His ambition is limitless. 284 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:32,260 But he's overstepped here. 285 00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:34,320 And badly. 286 00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:39,260 We can, and we should, do something important to counter him. 287 00:16:40,580 --> 00:16:41,800 But they started with you. 288 00:16:43,180 --> 00:16:44,660 And it's going to need to end with you. 289 00:16:46,660 --> 00:16:47,900 All of which is to say... 290 00:16:50,300 --> 00:16:51,300 We need you, Nick. 291 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:01,280 Dave? 292 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:02,760 Dave? Yes, sir. 293 00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:05,640 How's life at soccer? 294 00:17:06,540 --> 00:17:07,540 We're getting somewhere. 295 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:10,700 Did I hear you've been giving orders to GCHQ? That must be fun. 296 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:12,839 It's a bit more complicated than that. 297 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:15,400 What can I do for you, John? 298 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:17,300 Would you mind popping in a mic for a minute? 299 00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:19,200 Sure. 300 00:17:19,649 --> 00:17:25,030 Internal investigations caught an email coming from your computer to Mike 301 00:17:25,030 --> 00:17:26,050 Sullivan at the Sun. 302 00:17:26,290 --> 00:17:27,290 Which email? 303 00:17:31,590 --> 00:17:32,590 So why is this a problem? 304 00:17:32,770 --> 00:17:35,530 I said you'd rather be told it by me. Well, and he was useful in morgue, and 305 00:17:35,530 --> 00:17:38,090 he's still useful now. I mean, you've got a good relationship with him 306 00:17:38,250 --> 00:17:41,030 haven't you? I also have one or two questions about the Panorama programme 307 00:17:41,030 --> 00:17:41,709 went out. 308 00:17:41,710 --> 00:17:45,050 Yep. I believe you're friends with Glen Campbell at Panorama. 309 00:17:45,270 --> 00:17:47,090 Pardon me? Do you think you could ask him? 310 00:17:47,690 --> 00:17:50,030 Have we got footage of Jonathan Rees with his computer? 311 00:17:50,650 --> 00:17:52,330 Well, he's quite protective of his sources. 312 00:17:52,650 --> 00:17:56,390 Rees is convinced, as am I, that the footage could only have come from inside 313 00:17:56,390 --> 00:17:57,390 the Met. 314 00:17:57,490 --> 00:17:59,230 He's threatening to take action again. 315 00:18:00,390 --> 00:18:05,110 Did it come from inside the Met? Is that a further press release? The request to 316 00:18:05,110 --> 00:18:06,970 pass information to Mike Sutherland came for you. 317 00:18:07,410 --> 00:18:08,410 I mean, he's your mate. 318 00:18:08,570 --> 00:18:11,110 But there are rules, Dave, and you know that. I do. 319 00:18:12,090 --> 00:18:15,150 And there's an operation waiting for you, Mr. Lawrence. 320 00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:23,420 Give Panorama, Mike Sullivan, Nick Davis, or anyone fucking else anything 321 00:18:23,420 --> 00:18:25,880 our cases, and you'll be strung up for all to see. 322 00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:27,280 Do you hear me? 323 00:18:28,620 --> 00:18:29,620 Yeah, I hear you. 324 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:38,540 I've got permission to talk about it with you and you alone. 325 00:18:39,420 --> 00:18:40,540 I am privileged. 326 00:18:40,800 --> 00:18:42,680 These private meetings, you and I outside of editorial. 327 00:18:43,500 --> 00:18:44,419 Of course. 328 00:18:44,420 --> 00:18:45,740 When have we not had those? 329 00:18:47,300 --> 00:18:48,300 Welcome back. 330 00:18:48,980 --> 00:18:51,700 Alan, our Scottish friend, you know it better than I do. 331 00:18:54,520 --> 00:18:55,700 We can trust him, right? 332 00:18:56,260 --> 00:18:57,680 I want to say two things. 333 00:18:58,340 --> 00:19:04,700 One, you're a journalist and I'm scared that getting into bed with certain 334 00:19:04,700 --> 00:19:08,320 politicians, well, we'll lose our vital independence. 335 00:19:08,740 --> 00:19:13,560 You do it all the time. I share my bed with all political parties and I hope 336 00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:16,120 pretty fair at sharing the... 337 00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:28,500 Nick, we've just removed a senior member of Conservative staff, and I don't want 338 00:19:28,500 --> 00:19:31,580 that dismissed as coming from the newspaper arm of the Labour group. 339 00:19:31,840 --> 00:19:33,660 Understood, but I asked about Gordon. 340 00:19:33,900 --> 00:19:35,100 And that's the second thing. 341 00:19:36,300 --> 00:19:40,880 You don't go into a room with Gordon Brown and get what you want. You go into 342 00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:41,960 room and get what he wants. 343 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:45,160 He's ferociously intelligent and... 344 00:19:45,610 --> 00:19:46,950 Very used to power. 345 00:19:47,350 --> 00:19:53,050 But if your interests align, as I think they do here, 346 00:19:53,970 --> 00:19:56,270 he can be a remarkable ally. 347 00:19:57,870 --> 00:19:59,450 One last push, is it? 348 00:19:59,810 --> 00:20:01,510 And then I want Brussels. 349 00:20:01,810 --> 00:20:04,830 Then you want your well -paid chocolate dream. 350 00:20:05,670 --> 00:20:09,530 Of course. Good. But please, Nick, take it slow. 351 00:20:10,270 --> 00:20:12,230 To work. What have you got? 352 00:20:12,810 --> 00:20:16,230 The flood of cases is overwhelming the courts, so they've appointed a hacking 353 00:20:16,230 --> 00:20:19,610 judge. He's already causing trouble. At the Andy Gray trial, he said it's clear 354 00:20:19,610 --> 00:20:24,530 Mulcair had been regularly hacking him. So that's an invitation. Any man, woman 355 00:20:24,530 --> 00:20:28,350 or creature who has anything in those books has been given licence to sue. 356 00:20:28,570 --> 00:20:30,270 And you'll write it up? Yeah. 357 00:20:33,870 --> 00:20:35,250 Why do you think they gave us this? 358 00:20:36,710 --> 00:20:38,430 They're good journalists. 359 00:20:38,930 --> 00:20:41,510 None of them support the story, our story. 360 00:20:42,390 --> 00:20:43,390 Guilt. 361 00:20:43,890 --> 00:20:45,850 The world's most powerful motive. 362 00:20:48,990 --> 00:20:51,350 I love you, darling. Yeah, love you too. 363 00:20:51,670 --> 00:20:52,790 It's better than I know her. 364 00:20:53,170 --> 00:20:55,110 Okay. It's Mike and Chief. 365 00:20:57,810 --> 00:21:00,350 She's, uh, she's not been sleeping very well. 366 00:21:00,930 --> 00:21:05,050 I've been making her leave her phone downstairs most nights. I'm not sure 367 00:21:05,050 --> 00:21:06,250 get away with that. 368 00:21:06,690 --> 00:21:07,690 I've been my best. 369 00:21:08,230 --> 00:21:09,370 Also, um... 370 00:21:12,490 --> 00:21:15,310 I've been contacted by Operation Weeting. 371 00:21:16,650 --> 00:21:17,650 Oh, have you? 372 00:21:19,870 --> 00:21:20,870 You knew then? 373 00:21:24,810 --> 00:21:26,050 The things they had on me. 374 00:21:26,610 --> 00:21:28,370 Oh, no, I'm sorry. I should have warned you. Yeah. 375 00:21:33,050 --> 00:21:34,350 Yates came after me today. 376 00:21:34,710 --> 00:21:35,710 And? 377 00:21:35,950 --> 00:21:36,950 Didn't land a punch. 378 00:21:37,150 --> 00:21:38,150 Good. 379 00:21:39,210 --> 00:21:40,590 They're keeping me at arm's length. 380 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:45,460 But they did tell me a few pieces of useful information. You remember that 381 00:21:45,460 --> 00:21:48,840 Surrey Police got a call fishing for my details? 382 00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:55,380 Mm -hm. Well, Wheating told me that, um, it was probably Mulcair who made that 383 00:21:55,380 --> 00:21:56,660 call. Jesus Christ. 384 00:21:59,980 --> 00:22:03,120 I don't think anyone's understood the depth of criminality here. 385 00:22:04,780 --> 00:22:06,360 Destabilising police investigations. 386 00:22:06,820 --> 00:22:10,980 I mean, we're talking about a murder charge being... Yeah, look who I'm... 387 00:22:10,980 --> 00:22:11,980 telling you, right? 388 00:22:12,820 --> 00:22:14,560 Please don't laugh at me about this. No. 389 00:22:16,020 --> 00:22:17,020 No. 390 00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:22,800 You know, right at the beginning of this, I went to see Rebecca Brooks. 391 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:28,140 And I said, um, well, you're doing it outrageous. 392 00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:30,760 And you know what she said? 393 00:22:32,580 --> 00:22:35,900 She said, we believed that you and Jackie were having an affair. 394 00:22:36,460 --> 00:22:39,620 And as you're both public figures, public interest. 395 00:22:40,300 --> 00:22:41,300 With all I find. 396 00:22:42,060 --> 00:22:44,540 They thought we were having an affair and we were already married. 397 00:22:44,860 --> 00:22:45,860 Ridiculous. 398 00:22:47,620 --> 00:22:50,020 Absurd. Cruel, I think, is a better word. 399 00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:54,800 Yeah. 400 00:23:02,360 --> 00:23:06,260 I have a source in the police. I'm quite openly victimized. 401 00:23:06,500 --> 00:23:09,260 Might stop the whining celebrity angle. 402 00:23:10,060 --> 00:23:11,820 What whining celebrity angle? 403 00:23:12,120 --> 00:23:16,440 People dismissing it because they think it's just celebrities whining. Get him 404 00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:17,219 on the record. 405 00:23:17,220 --> 00:23:19,680 You've been badly damaged by overs already. 406 00:23:19,940 --> 00:23:20,940 You're Nick Davis? 407 00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:23,280 Only on weekdays. 408 00:23:23,820 --> 00:23:26,940 Have we met? How can I help? By telling me what the fuck you think you're doing, 409 00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:27,960 stealing my story. 410 00:23:30,060 --> 00:23:31,180 Can we use your office? 411 00:23:32,780 --> 00:23:38,940 Which story have I stolen? 412 00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:41,180 Apparently you're Mr. Hacking. 413 00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:43,600 Every hacking story carries your byline. 414 00:23:43,820 --> 00:23:44,820 It doesn't. 415 00:23:45,500 --> 00:23:49,260 Today, in the paper, published, you didn't write one word of it. 416 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:51,000 No. 417 00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:55,000 Well, aren't you going to apologize? 418 00:23:55,620 --> 00:23:56,620 No. 419 00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:02,660 You know, the Guardian gives out all this shit about what kind of world it 420 00:24:02,660 --> 00:24:04,840 wants, and yet... This is well written. Fuck off. 421 00:24:06,300 --> 00:24:09,100 I didn't ask for credit, Ollie. Whoever said it was wrong. 422 00:24:09,610 --> 00:24:10,890 Right then, who do we see next? 423 00:24:11,250 --> 00:24:12,370 Alan? Old. 424 00:24:12,690 --> 00:24:16,750 Anything? Writing a story about the hacking scandal without consulting 425 00:24:16,750 --> 00:24:19,310 who spent the last three years having his life destroyed by it. 426 00:24:21,670 --> 00:24:22,910 Is this what works for you? 427 00:24:23,210 --> 00:24:25,310 When you're attacked, you just attack back? 428 00:24:25,630 --> 00:24:26,630 No, sometimes. 429 00:24:27,230 --> 00:24:28,570 Maybe you could have something there. 430 00:24:28,830 --> 00:24:30,210 This is about Operation Waiting. 431 00:24:30,810 --> 00:24:32,050 It's a totally different thing. 432 00:24:32,570 --> 00:24:34,950 How come I haven't seen you round the offices before? 433 00:24:36,370 --> 00:24:37,370 I work alone. 434 00:24:37,690 --> 00:24:38,690 My own hours. 435 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:41,580 They're supportive of it. And what have you got on Wheaton? 436 00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:44,720 Contact of mine in the force has been put on it. 437 00:24:45,060 --> 00:24:46,060 He's feeding me. 438 00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:47,680 Tell me everything. 439 00:24:47,780 --> 00:24:48,780 No. 440 00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:53,380 He says it's timid. 441 00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:56,240 He's eager for more action. 442 00:24:56,820 --> 00:24:57,820 What's he giving you? 443 00:24:57,940 --> 00:24:59,180 Each arrest as it happens. 444 00:25:00,500 --> 00:25:03,940 Neville Thirlbeck is going to be at Kingston Police Station between 9 and 445 00:25:03,940 --> 00:25:05,360 I'm there conveniently for the arrest. 446 00:25:06,220 --> 00:25:08,320 Can you, at my view, 447 00:25:09,360 --> 00:25:10,360 Tell your source. 448 00:25:11,420 --> 00:25:14,340 Tell them to look into the initial select committee hearings, and in 449 00:25:14,340 --> 00:25:17,240 the letter they received from News International lawyers, because there's 450 00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:19,420 disclosures in that the police never got the answer to. 451 00:25:23,660 --> 00:25:24,660 Thanks. 452 00:25:25,540 --> 00:25:26,540 Yeah, I will. 453 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:30,120 It wouldn't be so bad, us working together. 454 00:25:31,360 --> 00:25:32,360 You need to see this. 455 00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:36,620 Here's Ben Razier in Watling with more on this story. 456 00:25:36,970 --> 00:25:41,150 First, the denials that celebrity voicemail messages were listened to. 457 00:25:41,150 --> 00:25:44,750 claim it was down to a single rogue reporter and his private investigator 458 00:25:44,750 --> 00:25:49,910 sidekick. Now the admission, we failed to uncover what was going on. We're 459 00:25:49,910 --> 00:25:52,690 to apologize, and we're going to pay up. Fuck. 460 00:25:53,650 --> 00:25:54,770 Absolutely right. 461 00:25:56,110 --> 00:25:58,530 Exactly the news of the world in missing terms. 462 00:25:59,070 --> 00:26:00,070 It's brilliant. 463 00:26:00,690 --> 00:26:02,130 Is it? Bob. 464 00:26:02,700 --> 00:26:05,520 By admitting they were at fault and agreeing to cooperate. In fact, what 465 00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:09,480 doing is they're finding a new device for concealing the truth. Nick, will it 466 00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:10,480 cheaper? 467 00:26:10,760 --> 00:26:13,960 Standard rate damages rather than the million pound hush money they've had to 468 00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:16,480 pay out. And getting this out in court now is next to impossible. 469 00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:17,499 Am I right? 470 00:26:17,500 --> 00:26:22,620 Well, if you are, for instance, Fiona Miller, and you do take it to trial, 471 00:26:22,620 --> 00:26:27,320 if she ends up getting less at trial than they offered her before, then she 472 00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:30,420 risks being ordered to pay both sides costs, which could be astronomical. 473 00:26:31,390 --> 00:26:34,710 And so, yes, it makes getting to trial almost impossible. 474 00:26:35,170 --> 00:26:39,890 Shit. My advice is, they've twisted one way, we must twist another. 475 00:26:40,210 --> 00:26:43,030 I've had a reply from Sue Akers on Rhys. 476 00:26:43,810 --> 00:26:44,810 She's shown you that? 477 00:26:44,890 --> 00:26:49,410 She says her remit is limited to more care and the notebook. She isn't going 478 00:26:49,410 --> 00:26:51,490 near Rhys. Should we try to leak something? 479 00:26:51,730 --> 00:26:52,730 Put pressure on that way? 480 00:26:53,310 --> 00:26:55,830 I've got Rhys specifically targeting Kate Middleton. 481 00:26:56,050 --> 00:26:57,630 I've just heard he targeted John Yates. 482 00:26:57,930 --> 00:27:00,910 Or we could... Do you think... 483 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:05,000 If we twisted an arm or two, do you think we could get me up the list for 484 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:07,740 That's a very good idea. 485 00:27:08,340 --> 00:27:09,340 I'm not following. 486 00:27:09,580 --> 00:27:10,980 What does Sue Akers want? 487 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:15,280 To be free to take the evidence wherever it leads her with a swift prod from the 488 00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:16,280 left? 489 00:27:16,460 --> 00:27:18,760 Maybe the Prime Minister will extend her brief. 490 00:27:19,180 --> 00:27:21,060 You could even name, Rhys. 491 00:27:21,700 --> 00:27:23,320 Good, good. Hang on. 492 00:27:23,820 --> 00:27:26,340 All of this exposes Dave to scrutiny again. 493 00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:29,080 Not already. 494 00:27:30,030 --> 00:27:31,030 Tom, can I help? 495 00:27:31,430 --> 00:27:32,430 Please do. 496 00:27:32,470 --> 00:27:33,830 Good. Good. 497 00:27:34,170 --> 00:27:35,810 Let's box Cameron in. 498 00:27:36,090 --> 00:27:40,150 As the Prime Minister has previously said, the hacking inquiry should go 499 00:27:40,150 --> 00:27:44,270 the evidence takes it. The Metropolitan Police are in possession of paperwork 500 00:27:44,270 --> 00:27:48,950 which details the dealings of criminal private investigator Jonathan Rees. 501 00:27:49,230 --> 00:27:53,170 It strongly suggests that on behalf of News International, he was illegally 502 00:27:53,170 --> 00:27:57,850 targeting members of the Royal Family, senior politicians and high -level 503 00:27:57,850 --> 00:27:59,110 terrorist informers. 504 00:27:59,480 --> 00:28:03,320 Yet the head of Operation Wheating has recently written to me to explain that 505 00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:06,680 this evidence may be outside the inquiry's terms of reference. 506 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:11,780 Prime Minister, I believe powerful forces are involved in a cover -up. 507 00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:18,140 Please, please tell me what you intend to do to make sure that this doesn't 508 00:28:18,140 --> 00:28:19,140 happen. 509 00:28:20,940 --> 00:28:24,080 The point I'd make to the Honourable Gentleman, I know he takes a close 510 00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:26,320 in this, is there is a police inquiry. 511 00:28:26,700 --> 00:28:29,040 A police inquiry doesn't need terms of reference. 512 00:28:29,300 --> 00:28:33,520 The police are free to investigate the evidence and take that wherever it leads 513 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,460 them, and then mount a prosecution with the CPS. 514 00:28:38,500 --> 00:28:39,500 Amelia, hi. 515 00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:42,640 Thought you'd go in. Sorry, a bit weird to wait for people outside toilets. 516 00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:44,119 Oh, I don't know. 517 00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:45,019 Got a minute? 518 00:28:45,020 --> 00:28:46,020 Sure. 519 00:28:46,500 --> 00:28:48,400 Two inquiries are being set up. 520 00:28:48,730 --> 00:28:52,130 Operation Thelita, looking specifically into Jonathan Rees. Good. 521 00:28:52,630 --> 00:28:55,730 Operation Eldon. Never get over Scotland Yard's need for a strange name. 522 00:28:55,930 --> 00:28:59,070 To investigate the alleged payment of bribes to police officers and other 523 00:28:59,070 --> 00:29:02,350 officials from journalists from the News of the World. And to make them do this. 524 00:29:03,090 --> 00:29:04,650 You didn't see Tom Watson's speech? 525 00:29:04,970 --> 00:29:05,970 Oh, I may have, Tom. 526 00:29:06,090 --> 00:29:07,090 Did you write it? 527 00:29:12,170 --> 00:29:16,690 Also, the select committee wading, you suggested to my officer. 528 00:29:16,990 --> 00:29:18,050 Let's call him... 529 00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:19,640 Jingle. Fine. 530 00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:21,460 It proved fruitful. 531 00:29:22,700 --> 00:29:26,200 Operation Waiting forced some emails out of News International, and the Met 532 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:28,420 discovered on their service some systematic deletions. 533 00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:29,679 Of course. 534 00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:33,080 In particular, one enormous deletion in January. 535 00:29:34,300 --> 00:29:39,720 While they were handing over those three emails from Ian Edmonton, can we print? 536 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:41,460 I'm working on it. 537 00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:45,120 Look, Jingle was grateful for the advice. 538 00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:49,980 He said he can't volunteer information on active cases, but ask him a question, 539 00:29:50,140 --> 00:29:51,140 he'll tell no lie. 540 00:29:59,100 --> 00:30:02,080 We've had something interesting come on. What is Judge Voss doing? I feel like 541 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:05,420 we've only seen a tiny percent of Malkhead. Voss is being robust with 542 00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:08,900 It's yielding fruit. It feels important. 543 00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:12,080 Where are we? Nick, I've got something if you're interested, but you'll need to 544 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:13,580 listen. Sorry, go on. 545 00:30:17,260 --> 00:30:20,880 I've been representing, as you know, Leslie Ash and Lee Chapman. Yeah, I read 546 00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:21,880 about it. You're doing brilliantly. 547 00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:25,520 You're like my ex. 548 00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:28,140 You always get complimentary when you know you're in the wrong. 549 00:30:29,460 --> 00:30:31,060 Sorry. I am sorry. 550 00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:34,220 I heard you were a mess. 551 00:30:34,980 --> 00:30:40,800 Oh, I can see an island of sanity. I'm floating close to it. Go on. 552 00:30:45,550 --> 00:30:49,070 I went to Patney so that the waiting officers could show me the notes Mulcair 553 00:30:49,070 --> 00:30:51,770 had taken from Leslie Ash and Lee Chapman's voicemail. Yeah. 554 00:30:52,170 --> 00:30:59,150 Now, some genius combined the two names and gave me 555 00:30:59,150 --> 00:31:01,710 the details of Leslie Chapman. 556 00:31:03,330 --> 00:31:04,330 Remind me. 557 00:31:04,430 --> 00:31:06,090 Jessica Chapman's father. 558 00:31:07,170 --> 00:31:10,190 Jessica Chapman was one of the murdered schoolgirls, right? The Soren murders. 559 00:31:11,150 --> 00:31:13,670 It looks like Leslie Chapman's voicemail was hacked. 560 00:31:14,380 --> 00:31:18,680 They hacked the voicemail of a grieving father. I'm not sure, but it looks that 561 00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:20,080 way. You can't use it. 562 00:31:21,140 --> 00:31:22,140 Yet. 563 00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:24,580 This could change everything. 564 00:31:25,040 --> 00:31:26,220 I need to talk to the family. 565 00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:27,760 I need permissions. 566 00:31:28,420 --> 00:31:29,980 I need to be sure. 567 00:31:30,940 --> 00:31:33,480 Chapman family, I could talk to them. That's not why I'm telling you this. 568 00:31:35,380 --> 00:31:36,380 Nick, think. 569 00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:40,820 If they're doing this to the Chapmans... Where else have they been? 570 00:31:41,660 --> 00:31:42,660 Exactly. 571 00:31:48,709 --> 00:31:49,709 Jessica Chapman. 572 00:31:50,710 --> 00:31:53,810 Oh, the Soane murders tore the police apart for a while. 573 00:31:54,550 --> 00:31:56,330 She's sure they were into the parents' phone. 574 00:31:56,830 --> 00:31:58,970 It's in Mulcair's notebooks, but I can't get in there. 575 00:31:59,490 --> 00:32:00,610 I've got to find another way in. 576 00:32:01,390 --> 00:32:02,390 There you are. 577 00:32:02,650 --> 00:32:03,850 I envy your confidence. 578 00:32:05,490 --> 00:32:11,290 No, I'm just, um... Just happy to have you back. 579 00:32:14,510 --> 00:32:15,650 I thought that was better. 580 00:32:16,210 --> 00:32:17,210 Sometimes. 581 00:32:18,090 --> 00:32:19,090 Come on then, guys. 582 00:32:20,130 --> 00:32:23,350 Are you just frying that cheese? 583 00:32:23,710 --> 00:32:25,350 It's halloumi cheese if you like it. 584 00:32:25,730 --> 00:32:26,730 I'm not hungry anymore. 585 00:32:27,030 --> 00:32:31,210 What? No, it's just I don't get it. I mean, I eat when I know that I have to 586 00:32:31,210 --> 00:32:32,210 eat. 587 00:32:32,930 --> 00:32:34,330 I just don't get hungry anymore. 588 00:32:36,310 --> 00:32:37,870 Don't. What? Well, that's sympathy. 589 00:32:38,150 --> 00:32:39,190 I've been sympathetic. 590 00:32:39,490 --> 00:32:41,430 Don't try and pretend you're any better state than me. 591 00:32:41,970 --> 00:32:45,250 I've seen you, mate. You are this close to total collapse, I'm telling you. 592 00:32:45,450 --> 00:32:46,750 You know the story of the dung beetle? 593 00:32:47,150 --> 00:32:49,150 Oh. God, have I slipped that low. 594 00:32:49,470 --> 00:32:51,450 What? What, you trot out? 595 00:32:52,110 --> 00:32:54,090 You trot out that story quite a lot, you know. 596 00:32:54,370 --> 00:32:56,110 Ask your kids, cry pity your kids. 597 00:32:56,790 --> 00:32:58,810 What was going on? Have you heard about the dung beetle? 598 00:32:59,090 --> 00:33:00,190 An aggressive response. 599 00:33:01,750 --> 00:33:02,750 Come on. 600 00:33:02,930 --> 00:33:03,930 That'll make you hungry. 601 00:33:05,030 --> 00:33:06,030 Thank you. 602 00:33:09,270 --> 00:33:10,990 You want to know how I do it now? Hmm. 603 00:33:12,190 --> 00:33:13,490 I focus on the details. 604 00:33:14,790 --> 00:33:15,790 Always the next detail. 605 00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:20,320 I've been phobic of blood ever since a body exploded on me. 606 00:33:21,460 --> 00:33:24,660 Body exploded on you? Yeah, well, an older man full of hernias. 607 00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:29,840 Normally, when a pathologist's scalpel enters a cadaver, you hear a hiss. 608 00:33:30,420 --> 00:33:32,440 Well, this time, it exploded. 609 00:33:33,340 --> 00:33:34,860 Blood was everywhere. I was covered in it. 610 00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:38,820 But I was in homicide, so I'd gone to pathology as a key part of my job, 611 00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:41,060 So focus on the details. 612 00:33:43,100 --> 00:33:44,100 Ears. 613 00:33:44,500 --> 00:33:45,500 Toes. 614 00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:47,640 Even how the wound looked. 615 00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:50,600 The blood I made disappear. 616 00:33:56,260 --> 00:33:57,260 So how do you do it, Nick? 617 00:34:48,330 --> 00:34:49,330 Tell me I'm mad. 618 00:34:51,270 --> 00:34:56,850 With pleasure. I was in the database, News of the World, April 14th, 2002, 250 619 00:34:56,850 --> 00:35:01,130 words long, page 9. It claims that voicemail messages were sent to Millie's 620 00:35:01,130 --> 00:35:03,150 phone after she disappeared. 621 00:35:04,450 --> 00:35:05,470 Millie Dowler. 622 00:35:06,230 --> 00:35:10,610 Police say voicemails were left by a mentally disturbed woman who has hoaxed 623 00:35:10,610 --> 00:35:11,610 previous inquiries. 624 00:35:11,790 --> 00:35:13,530 Even quotes what she said. 625 00:35:14,560 --> 00:35:18,360 Uh, hello, we're ringing because we have some interviews starting. Can you call 626 00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:19,380 me back? Thank you, bye -bye. 627 00:35:22,720 --> 00:35:25,420 This is six days after Millie had disappeared. 628 00:35:29,140 --> 00:35:30,420 Final edition of the paper. 629 00:35:32,880 --> 00:35:34,480 That reference was remote. 630 00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:41,880 Because they might have realized what a boobie they'd made. 631 00:35:42,330 --> 00:35:46,610 Charlotte has evidence that they hacked Jessica Chapman's father on the Soane 632 00:35:46,610 --> 00:35:50,250 case. We can't get close to that. That was the family, but... This is the girl 633 00:35:50,250 --> 00:35:51,250 herself. 634 00:35:52,010 --> 00:35:53,150 Rebecca was editor then. 635 00:35:54,290 --> 00:35:55,750 This was under her aegis. 636 00:35:58,530 --> 00:35:59,990 Can you confirm this? 637 00:36:00,230 --> 00:36:01,230 I think so. 638 00:36:05,670 --> 00:36:07,250 Is this as big as I think it is? 639 00:36:09,650 --> 00:36:10,650 Yes, it is. 640 00:36:13,770 --> 00:36:15,230 Make sure it stands up. 641 00:36:28,210 --> 00:36:29,510 Bill, hi. Any fruit? 642 00:36:29,970 --> 00:36:31,250 Jingle says they've been investigating. 643 00:36:31,730 --> 00:36:32,529 Is that confirmation? 644 00:36:32,530 --> 00:36:35,990 Are they confirming that it happened? Yes, there is a page on Dowler in 645 00:36:35,990 --> 00:36:36,990 Mulcair's notebooks. 646 00:36:37,790 --> 00:36:40,450 Right, we need to be absolutely watertight. 647 00:36:40,860 --> 00:36:44,640 Nick, he also says they're pursuing a line of inquiry. They deleted messages 648 00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:46,380 because the voicemail box was full. 649 00:36:47,260 --> 00:36:48,620 They deleted messages? 650 00:36:48,900 --> 00:36:50,500 I'll get us a firm anonymous quote from Jingle. 651 00:36:50,940 --> 00:36:52,900 OK. Thanks, Mindy. Bye. Bye -bye. 652 00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:58,740 I have a source from inside Wheating. I've got the article. Glenn, I've got a 653 00:36:58,740 --> 00:37:01,760 good source saying that Surrey police know about it and the Dowler family did 654 00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:02,760 not. 655 00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:04,120 Well, this is it. 656 00:37:04,900 --> 00:37:09,440 This is it. I don't want to believe, but I do. 657 00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:11,080 The source is clear. 658 00:37:11,140 --> 00:37:12,700 Stuart Kuttner... Remember him. 659 00:37:12,940 --> 00:37:14,440 ..even called Surrey Police. 660 00:37:14,700 --> 00:37:17,780 He didn't just hear the voicemail, he followed up on it. They even think they 661 00:37:17,780 --> 00:37:22,680 deleted her answer phone messages to allow space for messages to be given, 662 00:37:22,680 --> 00:37:24,000 made the family think she was still alive. 663 00:37:24,420 --> 00:37:25,420 Oh, God. 664 00:37:25,540 --> 00:37:29,300 Do you know, if we can land this, this changes everything. 665 00:37:30,260 --> 00:37:31,260 How? 666 00:37:31,700 --> 00:37:32,700 A child. 667 00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:35,960 A dead child's phone. It's despicable. 668 00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:39,140 You know, part of the British public think that celebrities, politicians, 669 00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:43,860 journalists even deserve everything that they get. But when an innocent is 670 00:37:43,860 --> 00:37:47,920 harmed, an innocent already wronged, trust me, 671 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:51,620 the news of the world will not be forgiven for this. 672 00:37:56,920 --> 00:37:58,980 Hi, this is Dave. Leave a message. 673 00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:03,220 David, I've been offered to go onto Channel 4. 674 00:38:04,310 --> 00:38:06,710 I don't have a career to protect and I think I should do it. 675 00:38:07,350 --> 00:38:10,270 If you have a problem with any of this, could you just call me or text me, 676 00:38:10,310 --> 00:38:11,410 please? Thank you. 677 00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:46,040 Mrs. Dowler, my name is Nick Davis. I know. 678 00:38:46,320 --> 00:38:47,540 They said you'd be coming by. 679 00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:49,520 I've just been watching you on YouTube. 680 00:38:51,260 --> 00:38:52,260 Come on, come in. 681 00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:53,600 Thank you. 682 00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:01,320 Thank you. 683 00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:07,100 So the police are keeping you... Up to date with it all, yes. 684 00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:11,080 Operation Wheating, good team, it seems. 685 00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:12,480 They say it was true. 686 00:39:13,770 --> 00:39:14,830 Our daughter was hacked. 687 00:39:16,950 --> 00:39:17,950 Yes. 688 00:39:19,470 --> 00:39:20,490 You tell us why. 689 00:39:22,950 --> 00:39:23,950 Why, sorry? 690 00:39:24,730 --> 00:39:28,090 What we don't understand is why someone would do this. 691 00:39:29,490 --> 00:39:30,490 You're a journalist. 692 00:39:30,570 --> 00:39:31,570 Can you explain? 693 00:39:38,110 --> 00:39:39,990 I think there's a good story in it. 694 00:39:41,750 --> 00:39:42,750 A good story? 695 00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:49,440 They wanted to either to find her or to find something printable about her. 696 00:39:50,060 --> 00:39:52,140 So the phone promised all those things. 697 00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:56,040 But we'd only just lost her, didn't they know it was wrong? 698 00:39:58,540 --> 00:40:00,160 I think they didn't consider that. 699 00:40:01,100 --> 00:40:02,900 And they know it would hurt us. 700 00:40:12,080 --> 00:40:14,400 At that time, Millie was the most famous person in the UK. 701 00:40:15,600 --> 00:40:17,400 Everyone wanted to read about her. 702 00:40:19,980 --> 00:40:22,180 And I'm afraid they needed to sell their newspaper. 703 00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:25,100 Now you're here. 704 00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:28,260 Someone else selling a newspaper? 705 00:40:28,740 --> 00:40:29,740 I am. 706 00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:38,060 Yes, but I'm hoping... what we are doing... 707 00:40:40,880 --> 00:40:44,120 will help expose a wrong that was done to your daughter. 708 00:40:45,080 --> 00:40:47,200 However, yes, we are selling newspapers. 709 00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:53,300 And I know that all this will be bringing her back into the spotlight 710 00:40:53,900 --> 00:40:55,620 And I know... And that's painful. 711 00:40:57,840 --> 00:40:58,840 Just slightly. 712 00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:01,200 Yeah. 713 00:41:03,420 --> 00:41:04,840 But you should do it all the same. 714 00:41:06,860 --> 00:41:08,360 You have our permission, Nick. 715 00:41:08,940 --> 00:41:10,220 If you needed it, that is. 716 00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:14,840 Thank you. 717 00:41:16,900 --> 00:41:19,740 Always can never get used to microphones being poked everywhere. 718 00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:22,380 I'm used to it. It's a crime watch. 719 00:41:22,820 --> 00:41:23,799 Of course. 720 00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:24,820 Of course you are. 721 00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:26,440 More used to it than me. 722 00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:27,760 Oh. 723 00:41:33,220 --> 00:41:35,140 Do you want to share the byline with Amelia? 724 00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:36,860 Our source helped confirm it. 725 00:41:37,420 --> 00:41:40,000 It needs something clearer. 726 00:41:41,230 --> 00:41:42,910 Is the world targeted? 727 00:41:43,290 --> 00:41:44,290 Illegally targeted. 728 00:41:44,310 --> 00:41:45,650 Good. Illegally targeted. 729 00:41:46,110 --> 00:41:52,530 Missing schoolgirl Millie Dallow and her family in dates interfering with the 730 00:41:52,530 --> 00:41:54,810 police investigation into... No. 731 00:41:55,450 --> 00:42:01,190 Interfering with police inquiries into her disappearance and deleted messages. 732 00:42:01,650 --> 00:42:04,250 Then what the family believed. 733 00:42:05,650 --> 00:42:06,770 She's alive. 734 00:42:08,290 --> 00:42:09,710 The lie of that. 735 00:42:10,200 --> 00:42:11,700 Do we have a source and a secondary source? 736 00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:13,160 Yes, we do. 737 00:42:13,260 --> 00:42:16,500 Have we spoken to Scotland Yard? Of course. I even asked for a quote. 738 00:42:18,240 --> 00:42:21,780 This is... quite something. 739 00:42:23,880 --> 00:42:28,660 Channel 4 News can tonight reveal that allegations have been aired that a 740 00:42:28,660 --> 00:42:32,800 Metropolitan Police detective was put under surveillance... by the News of the 741 00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:35,800 World journalists, and his personal details were targeted. 742 00:42:36,060 --> 00:42:40,900 The former Crimewatch presenter and detective, Jackie Haynes, has spoken out 743 00:42:40,900 --> 00:42:41,900 the first time. 744 00:42:42,440 --> 00:42:45,400 So, Jackie, you were approached by Operation Wheating. 745 00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:47,180 What did they show you? 746 00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:55,580 They showed me various sheets of paper, which I was told came from Glenn 747 00:42:55,580 --> 00:42:59,300 Mulcair's diaries and notes, and... 748 00:43:00,620 --> 00:43:04,800 sat there and read the extent to which he had delved into my private life. 749 00:43:05,500 --> 00:43:07,140 And it was quite a body blow. 750 00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:13,160 I want to know who instigated the surveillance and the research that was 751 00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:14,160 us. 752 00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:18,380 I would like to know how they got and who they got that personal information 753 00:43:18,380 --> 00:43:19,540 from about us. 754 00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:25,380 I would like to know what the purpose of it was from them. 755 00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:28,340 Do you think there was an attempt here to... 756 00:43:28,730 --> 00:43:34,770 interfere with your ex -husband's criminal investigation and if so what 757 00:43:34,770 --> 00:43:41,530 evidence for that it's very difficult when you look at the um the order in 758 00:43:41,530 --> 00:43:47,710 things happen the chronology of this not to at least want to shine a light on it 759 00:43:47,710 --> 00:43:51,430 and say you know how is it that the day after that appeal went out on crime 760 00:43:51,430 --> 00:43:53,590 watch that this started to happen 761 00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:57,600 And it's very difficult not to come to that conclusion that they were somehow 762 00:43:57,600 --> 00:44:01,540 complicit in all of it, or someone within the organisation was. 763 00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:03,060 Complicit in what exactly? 764 00:44:03,640 --> 00:44:08,300 In trying to discredit David or myself. 765 00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:26,700 Of course they didn't print it. 766 00:45:30,600 --> 00:45:36,140 And so, it finally begins. 767 00:45:37,460 --> 00:45:40,860 More revelations. The pressure on the news of the world grows with another day 768 00:45:40,860 --> 00:45:45,440 of dramatic development. Shocking story. It is alleged that Glenn Mulcair hacked 769 00:45:45,440 --> 00:45:49,280 into the mobile phone of the murdered schoolgirl Millie Dowler. Well, this 770 00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:51,560 girl's dead and they're trying to get stories. 771 00:45:51,820 --> 00:45:55,080 There is a new allegation that the tabloid may have hacked into the phones 772 00:45:55,080 --> 00:45:57,140 the relatives of soldiers killed in Iraq. 773 00:45:57,460 --> 00:46:00,280 If the actions are proved to have been verified. 774 00:46:01,150 --> 00:46:03,170 I'm appalled. I find it quite disgusting. 775 00:46:03,530 --> 00:46:07,550 Tonight, Chief Executive Rebecca Brooks says we're told that she's shocked and 776 00:46:07,550 --> 00:46:12,090 that she knew nothing about it. Today is the anniversary of 7 -7. Relatives of 777 00:46:12,090 --> 00:46:15,630 victims of the London bombings may also have had their phones hacked into. 778 00:46:16,300 --> 00:46:20,060 Somebody was listening to that. It's a violation, isn't it? An extraordinary 779 00:46:20,060 --> 00:46:21,620 moment in British journalism. 780 00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:23,520 The news of the world is to close. 781 00:46:23,760 --> 00:46:25,560 What happened happened very, very quickly. 782 00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:27,240 It's like a bomb's hit the place. 783 00:46:27,460 --> 00:46:30,880 Those decent people up there have been thrown out of a job today. The sense 784 00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:34,320 everyone gets is that Rupert Murdoch is getting rid of the news of the world. 785 00:46:34,650 --> 00:46:39,870 in order to protect taking over B -Sky B. I'm interested in those who were 786 00:46:39,870 --> 00:46:43,490 responsible for being brought to justice. Scotland Yard confirmed today 787 00:46:43,490 --> 00:46:46,690 had received documents suggesting a number of its officers were given 788 00:46:46,690 --> 00:46:49,110 inappropriate payments by News International. 789 00:46:49,570 --> 00:46:53,770 Paying police for information is a criminal offence. It's corrupt. 790 00:46:54,330 --> 00:46:55,209 It's bribery. 791 00:46:55,210 --> 00:46:59,430 David Cameron, former head of communications, is arrested over 792 00:46:59,430 --> 00:47:00,430 phone hacking. 793 00:47:00,450 --> 00:47:03,770 The decision to hire him was mine, and I take full responsibility. 794 00:47:04,170 --> 00:47:07,930 There's an awful lot I'd like to say, but I can't. The pressure is mounting on 795 00:47:07,930 --> 00:47:08,828 Rebecca Brooks. 796 00:47:08,830 --> 00:47:13,950 Both her and James Murdoch should be leaving their desks. The Prime Minister 797 00:47:13,950 --> 00:47:18,010 announced details of the independent public inquiry led by Lord Justice 798 00:47:18,150 --> 00:47:22,430 We'll have the power to summon and question newspaper proprietors, 799 00:47:22,630 --> 00:47:23,770 police and politicians. 800 00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:29,020 I recognize the vital importance of reaching a number of conclusions, and I 801 00:47:29,020 --> 00:47:33,440 strive to do so. Rebecca Brooks, who finally bowed to pressure and resigned 802 00:47:33,440 --> 00:47:36,040 the past ten days, she's been at the heart of the storm. 803 00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:38,580 Now, she has decided to step away. 804 00:47:38,860 --> 00:47:41,320 Assistant Commissioner John Yates has also quit. 805 00:47:41,580 --> 00:47:44,560 It is with great regret that I make this decision. 806 00:47:44,800 --> 00:47:49,680 The mighty Murdoch empire has suffered its most humiliating blow yet, as it 807 00:47:49,680 --> 00:47:50,900 suddenly dropped its bid. 808 00:47:51,230 --> 00:47:52,810 To take control of B -Sky B. 809 00:47:53,130 --> 00:47:57,970 Murdoch has abandoned his bid for B -Sky B. But will he face wider consequences 810 00:47:57,970 --> 00:48:00,230 in relation to the phone hacking scandal? 811 00:48:00,530 --> 00:48:02,590 What will come next in this show? 812 00:48:05,290 --> 00:48:12,010 And I 813 00:48:12,010 --> 00:48:14,090 heard, as it were, the noise of thunder. 814 00:48:16,050 --> 00:48:20,170 One of the four beasts saying, Come and see. 815 00:48:21,870 --> 00:48:28,070 And I saw, and behold, a white horse. 62640

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