Original subtitles

It was in 1989 when I was approached by the BBC to see if I would like to script

my novel, Oranges Are Not the Only Fruit, into a three -part drama.

I was told that this would be low budget because there were other priorities,

because the BBC was always brutally honest.

But they would let me write it by myself and I would have full control.

And I was allowed to suggest directors and I wanted to work with a young

director, she was then, called Beeban Kidron.

whose work i knew from the greenham common days when i've been on the

protest marches about nuclear weapons and b band made a fantastic documentary

called carrie greenham home and she trained as a camera woman actually at

national film school she wasn't really directing then and i thought she had an

interesting vision and a beautiful color sense

And I wondered if they'd let me get away with it. And then a third young woman,

Philippa Giles, was suddenly attached to it as a producer.

And we hadn't done anything. And those were the days when the BBC would say to

you, if it was low budget, go away and see what happens.

So we went away, saw what happened, did the scripts, and they said, OK,

here's your money, start filming.

I don't think they had any expectation of what would happen. And that's how it

came about. And then, of course, it was a huge success, won us the BAFTA, got

Geraldine McEwen a BAFTA for Best Actress, and the whole thing rolled on.

We don't see you at church much any more.

No. I found somewhere quieter.

Oh, I thought you were a Methodist.

Mum! Be quiet.

What?

I don't think Jake can move her arm.

Have I been overzealous?

I'm fed up. I'm going home. I'm going to join the methadone. Growing pains, Miss

Dewsbury. Goodbye.

When we began to cast oranges...

I had no idea who would want to play those roles. And Beban went out and

approached Geraldine McEwan, who read the scripts and said, this is fantastic

for an actress.

And she said, I want to do this. I'm doing it. I'm signing up. So once she

on board, then we began to see other people getting interested. Kenneth

was the pastor.

Beban was looking for a young girl who could really do the job of playing.

Little Jeanette.

It's not autobiographical, but it is what you now call autofiction, I guess.

we had to find somebody who could manage that sensibility in a way which was not

self -conscious.

And Charlotte Coleman was fabulous at that.

Great seriousness on the set all the way through in that this was something

important that we were making. We really felt that. And we wanted to respect the

fact that we'd been left alone, allowed to do it and not let anybody down, not

screw it up. So that was the level of seriousness. But there was also such

playfulness and fun because Oranges is very funny. And I think when people

it now, they'll laugh out loud just as much as they ever did. And especially

relationship between mother and daughter, which is a relationship that

really can relate to and understand, even if their own isn't crazy.

Can't pay very well.

What's the matter?

I don't know.

It'll be the Lord blocking your ears to all but the words of the Spirit.

I heard you, Danny.

That's because I'm telling the truth.

It's a miracle.

A miracle in our midst.

Wait till I tell the pastor.

When we had to approach episode two, which is where the moment happens where

two girls realise that they've fallen in love, and it's not naked roll -around

sex, but they do have their clothes off and they kiss each other as they realise

that this friendship has grown into something which is deeper and more

significant to both of them.

And everyone there...

Everyone on the set, the cameraman, the sound guy, everybody really wanted this

to be beautiful as much as anything else so that anybody watching it wouldn't be

able to make any obvious complaints. We knew that there would be trouble.

We were living in a Margaret Thatcher world of Section 28 where gay

relationships couldn't even be talked about in schools and where there was so

much fear.

still, and repression. So we wanted this, not to be like a soft porn

titillation, but neither did we want it to be obviously offensive in any way. We

thought you're going to have to find the offence and not make it easy for people

to jump on any bandwagon there.

I was brought up in the Mary White House years, so I knew how easy it would be

for all of that, especially with the tabloids, to come crashing down.

But in fact...

That didn't happen. I think because by then, everybody watched episode one and

loved it. By the time people are halfway through episode two, we have the

audience with us.

So it was absolutely the right place to put it.

It was a pivotal moment there, and then from there the rest of the drama

developed. So it's structurally very sound where it is, and I think that's

important. You have to get people with you on your side before you do something

which is potentially a little more challenging.

We didn't have a big budget for Oranges, so the filming timetable was quite

short, and it was done up in the north, not in Accrington, my hometown, but in

places around there.

almost the time because I was fascinated by it and I wanted to see it happen and

also

We were rewriting things all of the time. In that sense, it was lovely.

I mean, because although we had a finished script, if something just

working or one of the actors would say, do you think I could do it differently

or shall we?

We were together, much more in a kind of theatre ensemble way, really. So

remaking it, building it as we needed to.

And every night, we'd look at what we'd filmed, we'd talk about it, we'd discuss

if there were things we wanted to make.

for the next day. So yes, I didn't realise at the time that this is not

how it works, that level of collaboration, just that confidence.

I think it was because we didn't know enough to realise how wrong it might

gone. We didn't know that we were doing it differently as well as making

something that was different because we were young.

They're fornicating.

Thinking about watching Oranges now, whatever generation you are, I think

of the same things would apply that applied then in that it was risky and it

groundbreaking because it was about love between two young women at a time when

this really wasn't subject matter for TV. And in fact, we were the first kiss

television. It wasn't Brookside.

We were out of ourselves there.

But it was more than that. It wasn't...

and never has been a coming out drama because it was tethered to a strongly

religious background sensibility, absolutely bonkers Pentecostalism

And what I've noticed over the years is now a lot of young women who are in

Muslim communities find oranges both reassuring and liberating because they

what it's like to grow up in a very strict, repressive, sexually rigid

and faith.

And so these same problems repeat themselves across time. And of course it

was... early for it to be all about young women as the stars and as the

of the story. And that's still so important.

You know, in 30 years we've made progress, but perhaps we wish we made

progress. We are doing now, you know, and I'm so happy that Oranges and those

us who made it were in the vanguard of something, the beginning of a change, I

guess.