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♪ SONG: The Cranberries - "Zombie" ♪

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Not one clue,

never thought it was historical,

didn't think we were pioneering,

never dreamed we were leaving a
legacy of any kind.

Scrum half at the Coleraine team,

would you like to give us a few
words?

How do you about this match?

I'm scared.

I can't do my laces up.

Women's rugby wasn't started by the
Irish Rugby Football League.

Women's Gaelic football wasn't
started by the GAA.

Womens soccer wasn't started by the
FAI.

These were male organisations.

Tight, tight, tight.

(Grunting)

You think women should be at home?
I do indeed.

And men go out and do the work.
Exactly.

In the kitchen, in the kitchen.
It's the way of the world.

it's been the way of the world for
years.

Why should it change now?

to be honest with the IRFU.

Maybe at the time, they probably
prefer we didn't exist.

That women didn't play rugby.

So much of it is meeting people

and getting to know people and
making friends.

But you can do that playing hockey,
which is much more a women's game.

Isn't it?
(Laughter)

Let's be honest.

The women playing rugby were the
normal ones.

We were actually doing something
really normal,

but we were in a very abnormal
society

which didn't want us to do it.
I mean, that wasn't normal.

♪ (Bagpipe music) ♪

Why did we set up Scotland team?

I mean, why on earth not?

I mean, think about the question.
It's ridiculous.

♪ ♪

It was a pipe dream, and people did
say, No, no way.

It's not going to happen.

They didn't want us to do it.

We changed it.

Women's rugby in Blackrock started
as a bit of a laugh,

we played on the Saturday.

The conversation was having in the
bar on the Saturday after the match.

And then Philip Doyle's girlfriend
at the time, Nicola,

she decided to announce over on the
PA that there was going to be

a training session here in
Stradbrook at 11

on the following morning, Sunday
morning.

So a couple of phone calls were
made between the girls,

and we had about 10 or 12 girls
arrived on the Sunday.

We got a couple of balls, we got a
couple of bags,

just some simple drills, and it was
really good fun.

Alain, a bit of a difference between

captaining the senior side here in
Blackrock

and the ladies' team?

Well, there's a little bit of a
difference,

but there really isn't a hell of a
lot.

My involvement with the team here
would be just to help out

at the weekends and coaching with
two or three other guys.

They just thought it would be a
couple of training sessions.

Ah, yeah, tried that, did that, and
then everything was fine.

Why rugby, Nicola?

Why not another sport?

Well, I do play another sport.
I play hockey as well.

But why not?

I think that we've been coming down
as part of...

Okay, our husbands or boyfriends
have been playing

down here for years. And why not?

I mean, other people play hockey.

I mean, men play hockey. Why not?

And as I say, we didn't know how it
was going to go.

I think the girls love it.

If you're not sitting on that couch,
you can play rugby.

Just give it a go, give it a go.

And so many of them, we got down
just to give it a go,

and they were completely hooked.

Never thought it would ever take
off.

We had a few only for the first
couple of training sessions,

and then it mushroomed into 27, 28.

And we're hoping to get two teams
next year.

The line-out, the scrums, back play,
it's similar in its own way.

So there isn't a hell of a lot of
difference between what goes

on with ourselves and what the girls
are going through.

and it was so interesting.

Every training session, there was
something new.

Obviously, we hadn't a clue because
we'd never played rugby before.

The girls are only at this now since
just after Christmas.

And it takes its toll at the
beginning.

It's a lot of bangs and bruises,

not that they haven't been used to
been getting every day of the week,

whereas we've been doing it since
we've been in school.

So it's a situation where gradually,

as the weeks go by, after the games,

they're not as sore after a match
as now, today,

as they would have been after the
first time they played a match.

They could still go out and maybe
go for a bit of a run around,

but after the very first match,

they came in and they were nearly
exhausted.

If you don't give it your full
effort,

you're going to get injured.

I think that's what most people
have been amazed by,

is that I think people thought we
were going to be

messing around out there

and not doing the stuff,

but it's been very bone-crashing
stuff, must be.

We were lucky, in our own home
grounds, in the university,

because they had the female and male
changing rooms

because we shared it with the other
sports,

the hockey and the other sports on
that.

But it's when we went to other
clubs,

then you realised that there was
only men's changing rooms,

and even sometimes you were lucky if
you got in and you had to...

The men always came first.

How did you find that in Blackrock?

I didn't go in with any preconceived
ideas

we were going to change anything.

All I wanted to do was,

Look, we just wanted to have the
team there

and make as little trouble for
ourselves as possible,

if you get me?

There were people who were very much
in favour of us playing rugby,

but there were people who weren't
very favourable either.

♪ ♪

I got taken along to a women's
international in,

I think it was in Newport, in Wales.

It was England, well, Wales,
England.

And I watched this game and I
just thought, That is fantastic.

I just had never seen women playing
rugby before, and I was really,

really taken by it.

And I needed to find a rugby club,

and there wasn't any that I could
join.

So I just wrote to all the clubs
in Edinburgh

and asked if anybody wanted to coach
women.

And one came back, and it was a
Liberton,

and I put an advert in the paper and
got players together,

and then we just started the club.

We were a bit of a nuisance wanting
to use the facilities,

wanting to play rugby.

It wasn't really for women.

So at Liberton, our first club team,

we didn't have any strips, did we?

So we said, well, you can use the
under-18 strips,

but they are dirty.

You can have them on a Sunday when
the boys have used them,

as long as you bring them back on
Monday clean.

Okay, we'll do that.

One member memory for us here was

we could use the training
facilities,

but not the floodlights.

So we were told, Well, the coats,

the under-18 men are training.

The women are happy if you want to
come and use the bit to the side.

That was the behaviour that the men
were treating us at that time.

And we were ultimately saying,
Thanks very much.

Much appreciated. Thank you.

I wanted to do something

and thought, Yeah, we'll just go and
give it a go.

And literally the first night,
that was me hooked.

I loved it.

It was my life, really.

It was just that, student and doing
rugby.

Then I went and played for Waterloo.

That was great.
♪ (Soft piano music) ♪

And then I got on the regional team
very quickly.

So I was playing for the north
region.

I came home and I was doing
preseason training.

And Cooke hadn't started.

And I trained with Cooke men.

So it turned up, I remember being in
the car park

and literally it's quaking in my
boots thinking,

What am I doing?

Is this insane?

I was very aware of their egos.

And so the first session, partly to
do with my fitness,

but partly because I didn't want to
put anybody's nose out of joint,

I just stayed at the back.

Then my confidence grew.

Over the next few weeks,

I did actually probably take great
pleasure

in going past them over the next few
weeks,

I suppose proving to those who were
thinking,

Well, she just shouldn't be here.

I definitely would look back at that
as a positive experience

because since then,

I've bumped into some of the guys
that I did actually train with,

and some of them say, Hi,

and, How are you doing?

And all those things.

So that's a really lovely thing.

There's a lot of respect there and
kindness.

I was working in Dublin,

and on occasion,

I'd go down to this little news
agent in Blackrock Village.

The woman working in the shop was
having a chat with another woman,

and they were chatting away.

My daughter, she's really stiff and
sore after the rugby.

And I thought, she must have made a
mistake.

It has to be her son she's talking
about.

And I asked, I said, did you mean
your son or your daughter?

And she said, No, no, my daughter.

And I went, Your daughter plays
rugby?

And she said, Yeah.

I just didn't know there was such a
thing.

I think that was a Wednesday,

and I went training on the following
Friday in Blackrock.

So the rest, as they say, was
history.

♪ SONG: The Verve - "Lucky Man" ♪

They were fantastic at being able to
absorb all this information,

and we could see as the training
sessions went from

our first training sessions where
there were a lot of dropped passes,

a lot of forward passes,

beginning to understand when they
fall,

fall in a certain way to make the
ball available.

So all these things, as we went
through the weeks,

got better and better, and they just
felt more comfortable with it.

Now, it wasn't all easy in terms of
getting time slots

on the pitch, not been able to play
in the top pitch,

having to play in the lower pitch,

having to get out of the dressing
rooms

so the man could come in and use
the changing rooms an the showers.

Yeah, our training was on a Friday
night when nobody else,

I suppose, would like to train.

6 o'clock. Our matches were on a
Sunday at 12, so that we'd be done,

showered and out by the time the
2:30 game kicked off.

But I mean, we just got on with it.

We trained on a Friday night.

Then invariably, we'd go out.

It did gather a significant
momentum,

fairly quickly to the point where
you could have

a women's national league,

but you're still numbering the
number of women who are playing

in the country in the low hundreds.

♪ SONG: Fontaines DC - "Jackie Down
the Line" ♪

Social change in England happened
much more quickly than it did

in Ireland and the place of women,

although England was a deeply
sexist society itself,

it was also changing already

in terms of access to sport and
sporting facilities.

We'd been playing for four or five
years.

Yeah, I think I've been playing 10
years, actually.

Yeah, I'm much younger than you.
(Laughter)

When you played for divisional
for Midlands,

you had to sign to say you're
available for English selection.

When you live away from home,

your sense of Irishness,

I would say from your appearance as
well, is massive.

You're very proud of your home,

and you're very proud to be Irish,
aren't you?

So it wouldn't be...

Not that I'd be selected for England,
but if you did get in,

I don't think I think I'd be disowned
if I went home.

I was mixing with those ones who
were

going for the trials in England.

So it was the talk of English
trials,

and if you went for the trials, you
couldn't go for anything else.

It was then, it was like, there must
be an Irish set up

or we should do something about
setting up. Yeah.

Not that we'd get in, but we wanted
to start the ball rolling, really.

We've got a resource of a lot of
Irish players based in England.

There was this desire to play
together.

Pulling on the green jersey would
have meant...

It just means more to me. It still
does.

I think England had already set up
well Wales were set up,

France were set up, the States,

and a few other international teams
were set up.

Some of them, I think, were pretty
much associated or

connected with their own rugby
football unions at the time,

but the IRFU,

I don't know why we weren't brought
into that.

I think they might have thought this
was just a fly-by-night.

It'll happen, it'll just fizzle out.

But I think there was a few
determined people

that were insured to make that
that didn't happen.

The World Cup was the following
year, so that was another...

How could Ireland not attend another
World Cup?

We missed the first one.

We're not going to miss the second.

How far behind are we going to be?

All those things probably
contributed to it.

It is hoped to have a national
women's team in three years time.

So back in '92...
That was February '92.

So the following year, Valentine's
Day,

we had an Irish team. Yeah.

♪ ♪

The clubhouses have been
traditionally places

where men wanted to meet,

where they make decisions, where
they help each other out.

Us becoming more involved by
actually picking

up a ball and running with it or
hitting a golf ball or whatever

has been a threat to that male
space and a threat

to power, basically.

It's all just been how patriarchy
has worked.

(Paul Rouse) And if you take a
little step into politics,

look at the number of women
who were in the Dáil

in the early 1990s.

Look at the number of women who have
been cabinet ministers

since the foundation of the state.

And what you're looking at here
at every level of this society

is discrimination.

(Sue Brodie) We just wanted to play.

Actually, so long as people weren't
saying,

You cannot touch a rugby ball, then
I was happy, actually.

I just wanted to play.

That was just the most important
thing.

We had an invitation then from
Scotland to play,

and they hadn't played, I think,
a full international at the time.

So it was a bit like, now or
never, let's go and do it.

It seemed like a pretty obvious
choice.

We were going to be fairly equally
matched.

They weren't too far away.

They were willing to come over.

It seemed just like the obvious
choice, really,

in terms of the first proper
international.

It would be the first international
for both of us.

That was, that was, that was really
nice, actually.

(Chatter)

Come on, harder. And the backs.

And the sides.

Come on Tania, go for it!

So I think around November,
December, 1992,

we decided we would form an
international team.

And...

Alain Rolland was going to be
selecting, wasn't he? Yeah.

It was nothing that anybody would
have experienced before.

So you really were starting.

It was like, Here's a blank piece of
paper,

and then what do we need to be able
to put a team together?

And I think there was a part of me
that was definitely thinking,

I feel quite sick about this.

This is crazy because we've
committed to this.

Are we going to be able to achieve
it?

It was very challenging,

but the girls took on a huge amount
of that responsibility themselves.

It was like another job.

It was quite mad at times.

I might not be good enough to play
on the team,

but I would certainly have got a lot
of pride

and satisfaction if I had been
involved,

but not played or even been on the
bench.

♪ ♪

We had to have a couple of different
venues

because the girls were spread out

and there was a lot of girls over in
the UK.

So it wasn't a simple case where we
could say,

Here's one place that we can have
everybody come to,

because there wasn't anybody
paying for anybody to travel.

It was all at their own expense.

So the first trials took place in
Sale Rugby Club near Manchester.

So it was one month before the match
was all.

It was decided afterwards that you
had to have trials in Ireland so

that another trial took place in
Cooke Rugby Club.

I saw a little tiny bit in the
bottom

of the rugby world that said,

Ireland trials in Cooke next month.

I'll go for that.

I remember saying... I played at
Wasps with Kath Mullally.

I was saying to Kath, Well, you're
Irish.

Do you want to fancy coming
over to Belfast to the trials?

Oh, yeah, we'll go.

This is the pitch that we had the
trials on or we held the trials.

I don't even know if we even asked,
could we use the first pitch?

I think we just assumed that the
answer would be no.

I'd never been to the North.

Only my family's from the south,
so I'd never been to the North.

I remember seeing all the police
wagons

and everything being a little bit
nervous.

But up we went anyway.

Up we went to Cooke in the absolute
horrors of weather.

Freezing cold, hailstones.

There was no fitness test.
We were super fit.

I think they had games, a, possible
versus... Probables.

...probables, and mixing them
around, trying different positions.

I don't even remember.

I just remember the hailstones
going sideways on the pitch,

having no feelings in your hand,
but loving every second of it.

There was a lot of excitement.

We can do this.

We can build on this.

There's real potential for this.

And then for Alain to say you're in
the team playing in two weeks time.

It's just so quick.

I just remember we got a tin of beer
each

and just toasted it, and that was
it.

That was the little celebration.

Yeah, privileged to have that.

That's just inviting you to the
first ever game.

From Nicola Doyle as the captain
of the Blackrock team saying,

It's such a good achievement for us
to get five on the panel.

And that's what I remember feeling.

I remember feeling that there was a
great sense of celebration

and success at the idea of getting
so many people

on the panel on the first trial.

We were meeting people that we'd
never met before

that we were going to be playing
with.

And I think the next time we met
them actually would have been

the night before the first
international match.

Well, maybe in the future, in
another 50 years time,

there might be a plaque or something
to say that the first

Irish women's selection trial was
held here at Cooke.

Sometimes it just takes a couple of
people to make a decision

to change something, to do something
that they really
,

regardless of what social
convention says,

regardless of the barriers that are
placed in front of them,

that they will make that leap
and ignore any ridicule.

It's ponytail power.

That haunted us for years. Yeah.

I mean, we were looking for any
publicity we could get.

We were involved in that photo shoot
where

they caught us at the end of a match
or training session

in our muddy jerseys and so on,
and then brought us off

to have almost like a modelling
session of clothes

where we were all spruced up and
everything.

I have really strong memories
of having the best,

best, best craic that.

We just had so much fun that day.

What message did it send across?

I don't find it the worst of what
went on

or the worst of things that were out
there.

It certainly did grab a lot of
attention at the time.

And if that got a few more people
playing

or a few more people interested,

then maybe it'll have been worth it.

Gather round me. Come on.

Gather round.

Spread out, girls.

If I may say so, you don't
look very robust people.

You haven't seen us in our kits yet.

I haven't seen you in the kit yet,
no.

But you're not heavyweight people.

< A lot of the time, it was, do you
not think

it's very physical or very rough?

There was this, I won't say it's a
hang-up,

but a deep concern, it seemed that it
would be too rough.

And you don't mind the mud and the
dirt and the- No.

Sure, it's a free face pack.
(Laughter)

Well done. Alright.

Now, what? The hooker.

The hooker. Don't be funny, Dennis.

Which one is the hooker?

I don't want to hear that from you.
(Laughter)

Which one is the hooker?
You're the hooker.

How do you do? How are you?

I think it is really revealing that
the leading broadcaster

in Ireland feel absolutely
comfortable in asking

a group of women who play rugby,
which one is the hooker,

with the obvious innuendo that swims
around that question,

and know with certainty,

that not alone will there not be
a problem,

but that he will get a laugh.

How did you get involved in this
game?

I initially just started off because
I wanted to get fit

many years ago, well, six years ago,

and I got completely hooked straight
away.

I enjoyed the game and have
developed from it.

But the hard question is, should
women play rugby?

Is it a women's game?

We're not trying to compete with the
men.

We want to compete on our own level.

We're obviously not as strong.

We're obviously not as big.

But women do not play contact
sports, do they?

Well, I know a lot of women who
played judo

and a few other sports like that.

And I would have considered them to
be contact, definitely.

They'd always assumed the rules were
different.

They'd always asked me, And do you
tackle?

So I think a lot of times, they
assumed that

you weren't playing full-on rugby.

I mean, so much of it is meeting
people

and getting to know people and
making friends.

Because of the team atmosphere,
you have to- But you can do

that playing hockey, which is much
more a women's game.

Come on, answer Frank, because
Frank's stirring it.

This is great.

We had the trials, and two weeks
later,

there was the match, so there wasn't
much time to organise anything.

The Irish players would have had to
pay their own travel to get here,

and then that would be reciprocated
when we went back.

And I have to say, I don't know any
players that didn't find

the cash to play for the country.

I mean, they just found it.

Oh, look, there's the programme.

From that for the first match. Yeah.

That's great to have.

I'm a graphic designer.

That's what I've done for a living.

So I knew that I could help with
designing a logo,

I could do a programme.

I could I talked to the press.

I knew how to talk to newspapers.

But most things that were in print
at that time were designed by me.

♪ SONG: Blur - "Sing" ♪

Lovely bed and breakfast in
Edinburgh.

We arrive from north, south, east,
and west,

and not one clue about the team we
were going to be playing with

and on or about the team we were
going to be playing against.

Not one clue.

That gathering on the stairs in the
B&B, and one by one,

we introduced ourselves.

So quite literally, Hi, my name is
Aoife Rogers,

and I play fullback, or I play 15.

And it went around person after
person,

and literally meeting people for the
first time

that you were going to put on a green
jersey with the following day.

I'm Therese.

I'm from Old Leamingtonians, and I
play number 5.

Pleased to meet you. Hello.

It was madness.

Didn't know who was going to be
captain, either,

until the night before.

Gosh, yeah.

That was as a shock.
Forgot about that.

Then Alain said. I was like, What?

What?

I think he had a conversation with
me, but I was literally in shock.

It was something I hadn't thought
about.

I suppose... do you know what?

I was looking at everybody else
thinking who's going to be captain,

and I hadn't put myself in the
equation.

But when he said,

it made sense because I did know
everybody.

We didn't really have a coaching
session with Alain

before that game.

We met him the night before in the
bed and breakfast,

and the morning of, we went up to
the ground

and we did a warm-up and we talked
through.

I mean, it was really the exiles who
knew a move or two together

who suggested we might use those.

All our focus was on us, what we
were trying to do.

And it wasn't like there was 50
moves that they had to learn.

It was more a case where just try
and concentrate

and this is what we want to do at
the scrum,

this is what we want to do with the
line out.

And when we get the ball
to the backs,

we tried maybe one or two simple
moves,

maybe a loop or a cut back inside.

Nothing complicated.

It was just, let's get, I think, 21
on the field or whatever it was.

And that was our makeup of our squad
back then.

These are the jerseys.

So this was my jersey, number 15.

And...

On mine, number 10.

They were mediums, but they were
men's mediums of the day.

It was such an unfortunate time
period for fashion and rugby

because it was made of 100 percent
cotton. And it must...

When you If it got wet, it was
like...

And if you're 5'1, there was no
Lycra vibes going on.

It's what it represents, what it
means.

I'll hold up yours for a second.
No, no.

Well, hold up your own.

So this is an actual jersey that was
given to me by Ciara Gryphon.

Big difference.
That's Ciara Griffin number 8

versus a fullback of the day.

Unreal. Yeah.

Pushing that shirt into the tiny
shorts, it was ridiculous.

The arms came to here.

You just cut it to size,

and then you tucked it in and you

did whatever you needed to do with
it, and then you just played.

You just got the ball in your hand
and you got on with it.

I didn't have a problem with this.

My jersey, my jersey was about the
right size.

I think we had to buy them if we
wanted to keep them

because that was as simple as
of course,

everyone just spent the £20

or whatever to buy the shirt to keep
it.

But yeah, still, precious item to be
handed.

Good to see you. Nice to see you.

Good to see you, too.

Hello. How are you?

You're still very tall.

Raven Place has historical
significance because it's the place

where the very first men's rugby
international was played.

It feels bigger? It feels bigger .

The pitch looks bigger.

Must be relative to your fitness, I
think.

(Laughter)

I think it's still quite an amazing
story that 1871,

the men played their first
international here, and then 1993,

the first international for Scotland
and Ireland

in the women's game was here.

What I love is the fact that this
is still not painted,

and the seats are identical.
(Laughs)

I'm feeling sad that I'm so old
and crocked

and can't play any more because I
look at the pitch,

it's in perfect condition.

There were people sitting up on the
roof.

There were kids up on the roof
watching the game.

There were people hanging over that
wall over there.

The whole sideline all the way
around was people all the way round.

I love that there are facilities
now.

(Chatter)

I think they wooden benches.

I remember the benches, too.
That's what I remember.

But I do I remember the blue as
well.

No.

Hi, Tanya! Hi!

and as you say, the grass, and the
mud,

and obviously, the excitement.

When we were in there, we said a few
words.

This was something that was going to
be historic.

This is something that was going to
be...

No matter what happens next,

you're the first women to represent
Ireland in a test match,

and you just have to enjoy the
occasion.

Like I would have had, without
really knowing, a routine.

The way you put your boots on,
your socks on,

your sports bras, your shoulder
pads,

gumshield head gear, all that stuff.

So we would have said a few words,
but then I had to go out

because they had to get changed.
You know what I mean?

It's not like a men's team where as
they're getting changed,

you can still say a few words
and continue on.

So we had to set a few things
and then had to disappear.

I think it was more of trying
to stay calm, not that...

Because if you over egg and your
nerves get the better of you,

if you think about the moment.

This is the first time. Here we go.

This is the first time I play for
Ireland.

Everybody was nervous at the same
time.

Nobody knew what to expect.

Nobody knew how it was going to work
out.

There was always that fear, what if
we lose by 50 points?

But I think we were able to dispel
that part.

I mean, honestly, I get goosebumps.

Even just thinking about it, I still
get goosebumps.

I think we had a piper that came
out, and for Scots,

that's all this gets you going.

But the anthems, anybody who ever
listened

to an anthem who's ever played any
sport or what sport,

you get your hair stand up on the
back of your neck.

It is just the only time that
happens is

when it's an international.

My dad flew over from Dublin by
himself, actually,

and he came and took a run out
in the pitch

and seeing him there as well was
quite special.

It felt like...

It's not that we were mimicking
the men,

the men are the men's
game,

but this is something I've watched on
television.

I hadn't watched women do it,

but I had watched it for years
years and years,

and I thought, Oh, my God, I am
standing up here in Edinburgh,

and they're about to play the
national anthem.

An anthem is when people go to
battle.

Is it not traditionally the pipes
are for when men are off to war?

So you can't not get goosebumps
when you hear an anthem,

but to do it and then know that
you're the one

to step forward onto the pitch, and
people have done that for you,

is just something incredible.

♪ ♪

There was a photograph of you
kicking off,

which I think would be very
significant

because it was the first ball kicked
in anger.

Where is it? There.

That one.

The biggest memory is actually the
connection with the crowd.

Because I'd never experienced that
before.

So every time you touch the ball or
something happened,

you got that reaction from the
crowd, and it was just really nice.

It was big. It was busy.

For the few Irish were there,

including my brother, he could
be clearly haired on the pitch.

But there was an isolated cheers for
Ireland

at stages throughout the game.

Memories of the match, an honest
memory of the match is

not a good one for me because the
very first touch of the ball,

the first touch I had when I made
that spin pass,

which I'd visualised since I was
five, it was terrible.

It was so bad.

And I remember the crowd groaned.

And I thought, Oh God.

That was my personal memory.

Luckily for me, I pulled it back and
there was

a couple of better ones as the game
progressed.

But the game memory, in general,
it passed really quickly.

Skill set, if you were to look back
at that now, compared

to how the girls play now.

It's not fair to be able to compare
what

happened 30 years ago to what's
happening now.

It's the same with the men's game,
even.

You look at how the game was played
back then to the way it is today.

It's like it's a different game
altogether.

But when they put a few things
together, it went well.

It was a very close contest.

It really was.

We did have a rolling ball at one
point,

and it was just going beautifully,

and I was thinking, Yeah, this is
great. Let's build on this.

The Irish-based players within that
first team, they were good players.

We certainly didn't think they were
a level below.

And I think they got a lot of
experience out of those early games.

It was a step up.

It was great to play at that level.

I think all the girls were fit and
athletes as well.

So they were grand, really good.

Yeah, natural athletes.

I remember loving it.

I remember thinking that we're good
enough to win this game.

♪ (Sombre music) ♪

And if only we had had a week or two,

we're as good as this team and
probably better.

It absolutely was not easy.

Nobody knew what the outcome was
going to be.

It was a good close match.

I do remember it was more of a
forwards game,

and I think we would have been
mopping up their attacks

from the back's point of view.

That's maybe bias, but as forwards,
I thought we had the stronger pack.

Yeah, definitely.

I think from memory, we came close to
their line on a good few occasions.

There was nothing in it.

There really wasn't.

The first try was a back row move in
the far corner to the right.

Fairly simple, like number eight to
nine and over.

The Scots score just before
half-time.

When we're in the dressing room,
I mean,

Alain said it like it was all to
play for.

We had it.

There you are. That's a great
photograph of you.

Getting ready for another Scottish
attack, maybe.

Kim Littlejohn.

There was a tackle she did
where she absolutely smacked.

It was a crunching tackle, and the
crowd went, oh,

that noise that the crowd makes when
they see something.

And I remember just being so,
wow, this is incredible.

This is incredible. This is
happening.

So I would think that a lot of
people that came to watch

for the first time probably could
see

that we still had a lot to learn,

but they would see also that we gave
it 100 percent on the pitch.

Of course, we weren't perfect, but
there was a real passion in there.

Yeah, definitely.

I mean, honestly, the we wanted to
come off the result...

we wanted to win. Of course we did.

But I think you could ask every
player what was

most important at that moment,
and it was that we played well.

Felt like we were sisters in arms in
that respect.

I think we had the same mission was
to educate the men around

the pitch that women could play
rugby.

You can only do what you can do.

You're not playing.

You're trying not to emulate the
men's style of rugby.

And less kicking, more running.

And that was the one thing that I
remember.

Yeah, a lot of people observed that
over the years.

Almost like that it could be more
enjoyable to watch.

I think it must have been well into
the second half.

It was down the our corner, and it
was a charge down.

So the Irish were defending the 22,
I seem to remember.

And it was a charge.

I can't remember if I charged it,
and maybe not.

I might have just landed on someone
else charging.

And it was such good spirit because
it was a tight game.

And there were times where we were
absolutely not

thinking we'd won that game.

So that was It was a real moment
where I think by then, 10-nil,

you feel maybe we've just won the
game here now

because it was quite towards the end
of the second half,

I think, when that happened.

I think we were absolutely gutted.

I remember being determined that

it wasn't going to be like a one-cap
thing.

Yeah, definitely. We're going to...

Come back.

It stays with you.

I would still wish you had won it.

(Cheering and applause)

So you can choose to focus on not
winning,

or you can choose to focus on what
we did create

and what we did manage to do.

The match ended, and it was
Valentine's Day.

So one of our girls was her mother
was a florist.

She handed us all roses.

So that's the roses.

And I think it was after-
After the game.

The fact it was an English rose, we
were trying not to worry about,

it wasn't a thistle, it was a red
rose.

And we were like, Oh, thanks.

So we've got these photos of us all
holding this red rose,

not really knowing what to do with
it.

I suppose we had created history
together,

and we couldn't have done it
without them,

and they couldn't have done it
without us.

In fact, I have a lovely memory
of my father who's now...

He's since passed, but he came up to
me and honestly

tears in his eyes in the clubhouse.
He had a beer.

He's hugging me, and he helped me
understand

what had happened that day.

He actually said, You never need to
play again.

You all go down in history. You'll
be on...

It's like, Hey, dad, don't be...

But of course, here we are, 30 years
later,

and he couldn't have been more true
what he said.

It's always held a very special part
of what I would have felt as

being achievements in my career.

Yes, I've been successful.

I've been fortunate to be involved
in a number of things,

both as a player and as a referee.

But this never happened before.

There has never been an
international before.

And that in itself is very special.

Our coach said, I think we should go
to the World Cup.

We were like, Can you imagine?
(Gasps) Wow.

Yes, please! So that became the new
goal.

And there was 18 months,

which at that time was going to be
in Holland.

And so for us, we felt we suddenly
had this new mission.

It's like the Olympics for us.

It was like we had something to work
towards.

Well, I was still the chair

of the Scottish Women's Rugby Union
at that point,

and it was me that received the fax
from the Dutch organisers

to say that it had been cancelled,
which was quite stunning, actually.

I mean, I was quite stunned.

I was a player who was emotionally
gutted by that news.

I was also an administrator.

I just, probably quite naively,

just thought, Well, it's only a
tournament.

We just thought, we'll just organise
it here.

And the whole reason for us playing
that game was so we could

enter into the World Cup
the following year,

which was held in Edinburgh.

So it was lovely to be in Edinburgh
again and to see the girls again.

We'd go support them and they would
support us.

So it was lovely to have that.

I remember the World Cup letter said
something like,

We want to go to the World Cup,

but we need you to commit to £200
worth of hotel.

Yeah.
Which was a lot of money back then.

You'd to pay for a sub.
In school, yeah.

To cover her teaching because it
was in April.

I was freelancer, so if you don't
like,

you don't work, you don't get paid.

So people made a lot of sacrifices,

but those sacrifices for those two
weeks,

we were able to train, have a match,
analyse,

train again, next match.

And that's what we didn't have in
the very first match.

But we knew once we had that
condensed time together,

we would establish a good solid
foundation.

And so the World Cup cemented that
completely.

France, USA. That's France.

USA. USA.
Okay. Scotland.

Scotland.

Alright. Okay.

I'm not sure the rest of my body.

Do you know, the most important
thing that stays with me about

the World Championships in 94,
let's call it the World Cup now,

which apparently we're allowed
to use,

is that there were women that were
not able to play in it.

There were still women that were
excluded.

Nations where the women's rugby was
affiliated to their men's union

meant that the IRFB would not allow
them to play.

So New Zealand couldn't be there.

They weren't allowed to come.

And obviously, the Dutch couldn't
come.

They weren't allowed to come.

They were not allowed to play.

Their governing bodies prevented
them from playing their sport.

The It should be some recognition
about the fact

that there were women that were not
allowed to play.

And that's the bit that actually
stays with me.

(Alain) It put the game on, I
suppose, on the radar.

It meant that women knew that
there was an opportunity

to play the game.

It began to grow a little bit.

Now it was slow, but it began to
grow a little bit.

But if you go fast forward to 2013
and you look at the success

of that Irish team, that kicked
it to a whole new level then.

Stacey Lee-Kennedy, and to the front
they go,

and Reilly grabs hold of it, grasps
hold of the opportunity,

and Muldoon fires it to touch, and is
that it?

(Full-time whistle)
Yes, it is!

♪ SONG: Avicii - "Levels" ♪

Ireland, are the Grand Slam
champions.

It wasn't pretty, but it was
committed and it was courageous.

It is a wonderful day for Irish
women's rugby.

Oh, God, Ryan, you said it.

At times it's felt like a dream, the
Six Nations, but I tell you,

those girls have been absolutely
outstanding.

And all the girls that are here
today

who've all put on the Irish
jersey, it's a legacy.

And I know that the 23,
the 24 out there

all feel that they're only in
possession of this Irish jersey

for a short while and that that
legacy lives on.

It is just the most fantastic day.

I remember going, I cannot
believe... I did not expect

to see this in my lifetime, was what
I saw to see women's

rugby being played on television.

And in the same breath as, well,
it's about time.

Good evening. Welcome to The Late
Late Show.

My first guests this evening have
been the underdogs

of their chosen sport for several
years,

but on St. Patrick's Day,

they silenced their critics and
lifted the spirit of the nation.

Would you welcome, please,
Ladies and gentlemen,

Grand Slam champions,

the Ireland women's rugby team,
ladies and gentlemen.

♪ (Late Late house band plays "Hall
of Fame" by The Script) ♪

between the appearance on The Late
Late Show around Tubridy in 2013

as against the one from two decades
previously,

where it was as if it was a kind of
a freak show presentation.

But 2013 was respect, belatedly
given,

but respect for people who had
achieved something

remarkable in Irish sport.

But what about the section of
society...

I don't know if it's big or small
at all

who say that they'd prefer if women
didn't play rugby.

Do people like that still exist
any more?

I think it's fading out.

It must be.
Yeah, no, it is.

We've had such positive reception
this season.

It's absolutely been brilliant.

I don't see why sport has to be
gender-specific.

We should be delighted that people
are being fit, healthy,

and enjoying something that they do

and trying to achieve the best they
can.

So, yeah, it shouldn't be
gender-specific.

The exposure that they got

and the subsequent appearances at
the World Cups

and beating New Zealand,

and that started just to feed it an
awful lot more.

And the same thing was happening in
other countries.

♪ SONG: Blur - "The Universal" ♪

It's going to continue to grow.

It's now a case where women's rugby
is no longer

tagged on to when men's rugby is
being played.

It's very much got its own identity
now, and rightly so.

Now, the young people that are
coming through,

they're absolutely seeing it as an
option.

So the world has changed for the
better.

And I think the next decade is going
to be sell-out crowds.

I think they're going to outgrow
some of the smaller stadiums,

which is what the women now are
doing

in the Premier League in football.

I know it's hard to get my head
around, actually.

And you're watching this thinking,
My goodness.

I actually find it quite hard to
realise,

but it is incredible to think that
we are definitely all connected.

We were like the little acorns.

(Laughs)

Yeah, it means a lot to me. It
really does.

The whole...

I played rugby for 20 years.

I can't imagine what my life would
have been like

without playing rugby.

What I'd be like as a person, I'd
definitely be a different person.

My whole life path would have been
very different.

Well, not that long ago,

my youngest said to me he was
proud of me, which was lovely.

♪ This is the next century

♪ Where the universal's free

♪ How we like to sing along

♪ Though the words are wrong

♪ It really, really, really could
happen

♪ Yes, it really, really, when it
could happen

♪ When the days they seem to fall
through you, well, just let them go.

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