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1
00:00:07,291 --> 00:00:08,875
Whenever this war is over,
2
00:00:09,083 --> 00:00:12,041
the victory will have been won
by you,
3
00:00:12,542 --> 00:00:16,166
with the uniform you wear,
the chevrons on your sleeves,
4
00:00:16,250 --> 00:00:19,333
and the instincts in your gut,
and the blood on your boots.
5
00:00:20,417 --> 00:00:22,709
We will sail
across God's vast ocean,
6
00:00:23,750 --> 00:00:27,041
where we will meet our enemy
and make the difference
7
00:00:27,125 --> 00:00:30,208
between freedom of the world
and its enslavement.
8
00:00:35,458 --> 00:00:37,792
You fought
bravely for your country.
9
00:00:38,667 --> 00:00:40,333
You found in one another a bond
10
00:00:40,417 --> 00:00:41,750
that exists only in combat.
11
00:00:44,792 --> 00:00:47,500
Every man that's wounded,
every man I lose,
12
00:00:47,750 --> 00:00:50,250
I have to believe
that it's all worthwhile
13
00:00:50,333 --> 00:00:51,834
because our cause is just.
14
00:04:53,583 --> 00:04:58,792
Man:
Well, I don't know.
The odds were all against you.
15
00:04:58,875 --> 00:05:03,834
It was more or less
like being in death row
in a penitentiary,
16
00:05:03,917 --> 00:05:07,709
waiting on your turn,
and you knew it was coming.
17
00:05:10,417 --> 00:05:13,333
Man 2:
You fly a real tough mission,
18
00:05:13,417 --> 00:05:16,625
and you're so glad to get back,
and everybody says,
19
00:05:16,709 --> 00:05:19,792
"Boy, we made it
through that one, didn't we?"
20
00:05:19,875 --> 00:05:22,709
And the next morning
they'd come in,
21
00:05:22,792 --> 00:05:24,667
put the flashlight
in your face--
22
00:05:24,750 --> 00:05:27,500
"All right, boys, get up.
You're gonna be leavin'.
23
00:05:27,583 --> 00:05:30,625
We're gonna be flyin'
in two hours."
24
00:05:30,709 --> 00:05:33,500
Now, that's...
that's tough.
25
00:05:40,667 --> 00:05:42,917
Man 3:
I was 21 years old, yeah,
26
00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:46,750
and we felt like
we could live forever.
27
00:05:48,583 --> 00:05:50,834
Don't get me wrong.
28
00:05:50,917 --> 00:05:54,750
We'd still get
that tight feeling...
29
00:05:57,750 --> 00:06:01,625
...when we would would see
bursting flak nearby,
30
00:06:01,709 --> 00:06:03,333
when we'd see fighters--
31
00:06:03,417 --> 00:06:05,959
we still got that feeling,
but...
32
00:06:08,250 --> 00:06:10,375
...you can't make a living
that way.
33
00:06:11,625 --> 00:06:13,750
All you could do
is make a dying.
34
00:06:21,959 --> 00:06:24,709
Man 4:
Anybody said
they weren't afraid,
35
00:06:24,792 --> 00:06:27,750
they were full of crap.
36
00:06:27,834 --> 00:06:31,125
'Cause you were always afraid
what was gonna happen next,
37
00:06:31,208 --> 00:06:34,583
particularly in flak,
you're just waiting
38
00:06:34,667 --> 00:06:37,166
for something to go off
around you.
39
00:06:41,208 --> 00:06:44,500
And that's when the fighters
would come up.
40
00:07:34,500 --> 00:07:36,291
Man:
One of the men
in our crew kept saying,
41
00:07:36,375 --> 00:07:39,083
"I know I'm not gonna make it,"
et cetera, et cetera.
42
00:07:39,166 --> 00:07:40,667
And you don't like
to hear that.
43
00:07:40,750 --> 00:07:44,583
And he was very concerned
because his wife
44
00:07:44,667 --> 00:07:47,709
was expecting
within a day or two.
45
00:07:47,792 --> 00:07:50,583
And, uh, the next day,
they had him flying,
46
00:07:50,667 --> 00:07:53,750
which they shouldn't have had,
and...
47
00:07:53,834 --> 00:07:57,083
they took so many men
from our crew to fly with him,
48
00:07:57,166 --> 00:08:00,542
and they never made it back.
49
00:08:00,625 --> 00:08:02,375
They crashed into the Channel.
50
00:08:02,458 --> 00:08:05,458
And, incidentally--
and this isn't storytelling--
51
00:08:05,542 --> 00:08:07,834
but he, he, uh...
52
00:08:14,750 --> 00:08:17,917
...he was killed
the day his son was born.
53
00:09:40,500 --> 00:09:42,041
John Ketzner:
The war came,
54
00:09:42,125 --> 00:09:44,375
and we went and did
what they told us to do.
55
00:09:44,458 --> 00:09:47,875
That's the only thing I know.
56
00:09:47,959 --> 00:09:50,959
The Japanese ruined my youth,
57
00:09:51,041 --> 00:09:55,583
because I was 20 years old
or 19 years old
58
00:09:55,667 --> 00:09:57,333
and everything was wonderful,
59
00:09:57,417 --> 00:10:00,750
and the Japanese,
in one fell swoop,
60
00:10:00,834 --> 00:10:02,834
ended all that.
61
00:10:02,917 --> 00:10:05,125
And it lasted four years.
62
00:10:08,625 --> 00:10:13,375
Al Villagran:
Well, I can see why they get
young fellas to fly to war,
63
00:10:13,458 --> 00:10:16,583
or ground or submarines
and so forth.
64
00:10:16,667 --> 00:10:20,083
When you're younger,
you feel you can do anything.
65
00:10:20,166 --> 00:10:24,208
I think when you get older,
you get smarter.
66
00:10:29,709 --> 00:10:32,166
VG Alexander:
There was a 19-year-old
navigator,
67
00:10:32,250 --> 00:10:35,041
Jewish kid, sharp as a tack.
68
00:10:35,125 --> 00:10:37,709
And I had some older boys,
69
00:10:37,792 --> 00:10:40,333
my bombardier was 26 years old.
70
00:10:42,250 --> 00:10:44,250
I was 22, 23.
71
00:10:49,166 --> 00:10:50,750
William Toombs:
Oldest man we had in our crew
72
00:10:50,834 --> 00:10:53,208
was a Pennsylvania Dutchman,
32 years old.
73
00:10:53,291 --> 00:10:55,417
We called him "Pappy."
74
00:10:55,500 --> 00:10:57,792
Thirty-two years old!
75
00:10:57,875 --> 00:11:00,250
Our navigator was 26,
76
00:11:00,333 --> 00:11:04,875
and everybody else
was anywhere from 22, 23.
77
00:11:06,583 --> 00:11:09,792
I can look back now
and see why...
78
00:11:09,875 --> 00:11:14,000
young people are in a war--
not older people.
79
00:11:14,083 --> 00:11:16,250
Old people got better sense.
80
00:11:24,917 --> 00:11:27,458
Paul Haedike:
Sometimes they say that
the older you get,
81
00:11:27,542 --> 00:11:29,000
the more wiser you get.
82
00:11:29,083 --> 00:11:31,458
There weren't too many,
I don't think,
83
00:11:31,542 --> 00:11:34,250
too much younger than me.
84
00:11:34,333 --> 00:11:37,333
I flew every one
of my missions at 19.
85
00:11:37,417 --> 00:11:40,917
The old man on our crew
was our waist gunner.
86
00:11:41,000 --> 00:11:42,375
He was 25.
87
00:11:50,291 --> 00:11:55,250
John Doyle:
I'll tell ya, when we got into
this thing, you wanted to fly.
88
00:11:55,333 --> 00:11:58,291
You know, you had a great time
training and all that.
89
00:11:58,375 --> 00:12:02,000
But when you get over there,
and you got shot at
the first time,
90
00:12:02,083 --> 00:12:04,542
you knew you were
in deep doo-doo.
91
00:12:04,625 --> 00:12:08,625
And you really
took life seriously after that.
92
00:12:15,667 --> 00:12:19,417
Robert Rowland:
They said we was gonna fly
30 missions.
93
00:12:19,500 --> 00:12:24,542
They started out at 25,
and then they changed it to 30
when we got there.
94
00:12:24,625 --> 00:12:29,041
Then we got 26 missions in,
and they give us a week off,
95
00:12:29,125 --> 00:12:30,875
then we come back
and they says,
96
00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:33,208
"You're gonna fly 35."
97
00:12:33,291 --> 00:12:36,834
And that was kind of a shock.
98
00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:44,917
Glenn Harrison:
It seemed like I was flying
all the time.
99
00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:48,792
There were 40 bomb groups,
and our bomb group
had a lot of people.
100
00:12:48,875 --> 00:12:52,083
I don't know the logistics
of keepin' the fuel
101
00:12:52,166 --> 00:12:55,250
and the ammunition,
loading the bombs at night,
102
00:12:55,333 --> 00:12:58,583
getting 'em ready
for the next day.
103
00:12:58,667 --> 00:13:00,709
I don't know how they did it.
104
00:13:06,667 --> 00:13:08,917
Morton Kimmel:
When you're in a position
like that,
105
00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:11,333
there's no tomorrow.
106
00:13:11,417 --> 00:13:16,250
You do everything that you
want to do, that you can do,
107
00:13:16,333 --> 00:13:20,291
when you feel like doing it,
and do it then,
108
00:13:20,375 --> 00:13:23,875
because you may not get
the chance to do it again.
109
00:14:31,417 --> 00:14:34,417
Ketzner:
Wouldn't be unusual,
they'd wake you up,
110
00:14:34,500 --> 00:14:36,375
the first thing you'd do
would be
111
00:14:36,458 --> 00:14:39,625
go to the mess hall to eat.
112
00:14:41,542 --> 00:14:42,959
The mess hall was all lit up
113
00:14:43,041 --> 00:14:44,709
and everybody was laughing
and talking,
114
00:14:44,792 --> 00:14:48,083
and usually,
they had Berlin Lynn,
115
00:14:48,166 --> 00:14:51,709
or whatever her name was,
on the radio, broadcasting.
116
00:14:51,792 --> 00:14:53,250
We hadn't been briefed yet,
117
00:14:53,333 --> 00:14:55,000
we didn't know where
we was gonna go,
118
00:14:55,083 --> 00:14:58,083
but this lady in Berlin
knew where we were gonna go.
119
00:14:58,166 --> 00:15:02,000
And she says, "Boys,
you've got a tough one today.
120
00:15:02,083 --> 00:15:04,166
You're going to
so-and-so and so-and-so,
121
00:15:04,250 --> 00:15:07,125
and we'll be waitin' on ya."
And so...
122
00:15:07,208 --> 00:15:09,417
that they knew more
than we did.
123
00:15:17,834 --> 00:15:19,333
Villagran:
Now, in the Air Force,
124
00:15:19,417 --> 00:15:22,125
when we went to the kitchen
for breakfast,
125
00:15:22,208 --> 00:15:26,750
and we were getting, say, eggs,
we'd get powdered eggs.
126
00:15:26,834 --> 00:15:28,458
That's what they had.
127
00:15:28,542 --> 00:15:32,417
Once in a while,
we would get fresh eggs.
128
00:15:32,500 --> 00:15:35,333
You could get two over easy,
129
00:15:35,417 --> 00:15:37,500
and this was a treat.
130
00:15:37,583 --> 00:15:41,542
But we knew after a while
that when you got fresh eggs,
131
00:15:41,625 --> 00:15:44,750
it meant you were gonna have
a real tough mission,
132
00:15:44,834 --> 00:15:47,458
so they gave you fresh eggs.
133
00:15:47,542 --> 00:15:50,250
That's the story.
134
00:15:50,333 --> 00:15:53,625
We don't want fresh eggs,
but we want fresh eggs.
135
00:16:02,792 --> 00:16:05,417
Doyle:
When you go in to get ready
for a flight,
136
00:16:05,500 --> 00:16:09,375
you'd go into the locker room,
and you wore long johns,
137
00:16:09,458 --> 00:16:14,083
and then you'd wear
the heated suit, put that on.
138
00:16:14,166 --> 00:16:16,709
And we had gloves
that were attached to those.
139
00:16:16,792 --> 00:16:19,083
You had to get your gloves
into those.
140
00:16:19,166 --> 00:16:21,583
They came clear around
your ankles, too.
141
00:16:21,667 --> 00:16:25,375
And then you had
your flight suits.
142
00:16:25,458 --> 00:16:27,750
Those were the things
that you just wore.
143
00:16:34,291 --> 00:16:36,166
Ketzner:
Then you'd load back on a truck
144
00:16:36,250 --> 00:16:38,291
and they'd take you to the area
145
00:16:38,375 --> 00:16:41,625
where the debriefing rooms
were,
146
00:16:41,709 --> 00:16:43,458
so all the crews
and everything
147
00:16:43,542 --> 00:16:46,000
would be sitting there,
waiting,
148
00:16:46,083 --> 00:16:48,500
and they had a sheet
over the wall.
149
00:16:48,583 --> 00:16:50,792
They'd pull the sheet back
and say,
150
00:16:50,875 --> 00:16:53,542
"Our target today is Germany.
151
00:16:53,625 --> 00:16:58,041
The weather looks pretty good
as near as we can tell."
152
00:17:04,917 --> 00:17:08,250
Ketzner:
One thing always got me
about these briefings.
153
00:17:10,166 --> 00:17:12,667
The Catholic chaplain,
154
00:17:12,750 --> 00:17:16,792
he was back in the corner
hearing confessions...
155
00:17:19,291 --> 00:17:21,625
...and giving out communions.
156
00:17:21,709 --> 00:17:25,000
So you knew that you
was goin' someplace
157
00:17:25,083 --> 00:17:27,000
that you might not
come back from.
158
00:18:38,417 --> 00:18:41,375
Ketzner:
That was one of the most
amazing things of the war,
159
00:18:41,458 --> 00:18:47,500
the choreographing of
putting 1100 airplanes
together in formation at war.
160
00:18:53,458 --> 00:18:56,750
Toombs:
We'd all line up
on the perimeter strip
161
00:18:56,834 --> 00:18:59,792
that come around to
the end of the runway.
162
00:18:59,875 --> 00:19:04,291
And the lead ship
would taxi around and line up,
163
00:19:04,375 --> 00:19:07,291
and when they fired the flare
to take off,
164
00:19:07,375 --> 00:19:10,166
that lead ship
went down the runway.
165
00:19:14,208 --> 00:19:17,041
Next man pulled right up
behind him.
166
00:19:17,125 --> 00:19:19,709
Thirty seconds, he moved.
167
00:19:23,417 --> 00:19:25,875
Thirty seconds,
the third man moved.
168
00:19:25,959 --> 00:19:29,417
Every 30 seconds a plane
was goin' down that runway.
169
00:19:29,500 --> 00:19:32,667
That lead plane
never got off the ground
170
00:19:32,750 --> 00:19:35,625
before that second plane
was already running.
171
00:19:53,667 --> 00:19:56,417
Harrison:
Well, we'd just spin out there
on the end of the runway
172
00:19:56,500 --> 00:19:57,959
and give it full throttle,
173
00:19:58,041 --> 00:20:00,333
and you had to have
enough speed for it
174
00:20:00,417 --> 00:20:03,208
to lift all that load up.
175
00:20:03,291 --> 00:20:05,667
You had a full gas load,
176
00:20:05,750 --> 00:20:09,417
you had all your ammunition
for the guns,
177
00:20:09,500 --> 00:20:11,917
and you had the bombload.
178
00:21:23,583 --> 00:21:25,959
Villagran:
'Course, while you're up there,
179
00:21:26,041 --> 00:21:28,750
I could see the sun comin' up
around the Earth,
180
00:21:28,834 --> 00:21:31,250
and I thought that
was the most weird thing,
181
00:21:31,333 --> 00:21:36,125
to see the sun comin' up
and it's dark on Earth,
you're knowing.
182
00:21:36,208 --> 00:21:38,667
But you realized what was
happening to you,
183
00:21:38,750 --> 00:21:41,125
and the next thing you know,
why, the sun come up,
184
00:21:41,208 --> 00:21:44,333
and you see all these airplanes
circling,
185
00:21:44,417 --> 00:21:47,291
straining, so to speak,
to get up to the altitude
186
00:21:47,375 --> 00:21:49,500
with a heavy load of bombs.
187
00:22:05,041 --> 00:22:07,917
Rowland:
You had to form up,
and you had a circle
188
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:12,041
you were supposed to fly
till you got formed up
with your group.
189
00:22:12,125 --> 00:22:15,875
And then there'd be
another bomb group over here.
190
00:22:15,959 --> 00:22:20,709
And one day we come within
three or four inches...
191
00:22:20,792 --> 00:22:25,125
...of flakin' up
another bomb group.
192
00:22:33,583 --> 00:22:35,667
Alexander:
Well, on some of 'em,
193
00:22:35,750 --> 00:22:38,166
when the young pilots'd come in
as replacements,
194
00:22:38,250 --> 00:22:41,500
if I was first man to take off,
we'd be up in the air,
195
00:22:41,583 --> 00:22:44,917
say, two or three hundred feet,
climbing,
196
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:47,250
all of a sudden, boom!
197
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:51,875
Doyle:
You'd see a bright flash,
198
00:22:51,959 --> 00:22:54,875
a red flash,
and stuff coming down,
199
00:22:54,959 --> 00:22:57,917
you knew darn well
it was a midair collision.
200
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:03,291
And those were scary times,
as far as getting up.
201
00:23:05,959 --> 00:23:11,875
Haedike:
Two B-17s, one came down
right on top of the other.
202
00:23:11,959 --> 00:23:13,750
They all went to their death.
203
00:23:16,041 --> 00:23:19,333
That's when I started smokin',
by the way.
204
00:24:05,417 --> 00:24:08,125
Kimmel:
Well, actually,
I believe that our officers
205
00:24:08,208 --> 00:24:10,250
were closer to the crew
206
00:24:10,333 --> 00:24:12,375
than they were
with other officers.
207
00:24:16,458 --> 00:24:19,834
As a crew, most crews
stuck pretty well together.
208
00:24:19,917 --> 00:24:21,375
We did a lot together.
209
00:24:25,834 --> 00:24:29,083
I don't think
we would have appreciated
210
00:24:29,166 --> 00:24:31,458
one new man joining us.
211
00:24:31,542 --> 00:24:34,709
We knew what each man
was capable of doing.
212
00:24:34,792 --> 00:24:38,875
Each man did his job good,
and no one complained.
213
00:24:42,792 --> 00:24:47,583
Haedike:
We were family in the air--
you absolutely had to be.
214
00:24:47,667 --> 00:24:49,417
We all had our duties.
215
00:24:51,625 --> 00:24:54,041
Villagran:
We just wanted
to stay together.
216
00:24:54,125 --> 00:24:59,000
And we flew 25 missions
as a crew, all of us together.
217
00:25:05,875 --> 00:25:07,667
Haedike:
You're a family...
218
00:25:07,750 --> 00:25:09,709
exactly--
you have to be.
219
00:25:09,792 --> 00:25:12,166
However,
I can remember one mission
220
00:25:12,250 --> 00:25:15,417
when our flight engineer
came out smashed.
221
00:25:15,500 --> 00:25:17,792
And I climbed all over him.
222
00:25:17,875 --> 00:25:20,083
I said,
"What is wrong with you?"
223
00:25:20,166 --> 00:25:22,208
We depended on one another.
224
00:25:25,917 --> 00:25:28,000
Kimmel:
There was a lot
of spit and polish
225
00:25:28,083 --> 00:25:31,834
with the officers,
and that didn't happen.
226
00:25:31,917 --> 00:25:35,125
Like you say,
we're a family of brothers...
227
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:40,208
...and we didn't have time
for all that stuff.
228
00:25:42,250 --> 00:25:45,417
But there was no saluting
and...
229
00:25:45,500 --> 00:25:48,458
and "Yes sir, no sir"
and all that.
230
00:25:49,750 --> 00:25:52,625
Each guy was his own guy.
231
00:25:54,834 --> 00:25:59,375
Alexander:
Well, of course,
each man would do his job
232
00:25:59,458 --> 00:26:03,375
and we all knew exactly
who was gonna do what,
233
00:26:03,458 --> 00:26:04,667
so to speak.
234
00:26:07,208 --> 00:26:10,125
So I knew I had a good crew.
235
00:26:11,792 --> 00:26:14,834
And we just
got along beautifully.
236
00:26:55,667 --> 00:26:57,750
Toombs:
We had a crew chief
that took care of that plane
237
00:26:57,834 --> 00:27:00,333
after we got it back
off a mission.
238
00:27:00,417 --> 00:27:03,792
So the three of us
walked that plane,
239
00:27:03,875 --> 00:27:06,166
looked at everything
on the ground,
240
00:27:06,250 --> 00:27:08,667
ask him all the questions
we could think of.
241
00:27:08,750 --> 00:27:10,917
If there was any little thing
242
00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,625
that we thought we should
pay particular attention to,
243
00:27:14,709 --> 00:27:16,667
for him to tell us.
244
00:27:31,333 --> 00:27:34,083
Haedike:
You never flew
the same plane all the time.
245
00:27:34,166 --> 00:27:37,291
It's just like your car
havin' an ouchie
246
00:27:37,375 --> 00:27:40,875
and you take it in
to Firestone or somewhere
to get fixed.
247
00:27:40,959 --> 00:27:43,792
They'd work overnight,
all night long,
248
00:27:43,875 --> 00:27:45,834
trying to patch planes.
249
00:27:53,959 --> 00:27:55,625
Doyle:
As soon as you got in,
250
00:27:55,709 --> 00:27:58,208
they would take care
of any damage,
251
00:27:58,291 --> 00:28:01,417
they would get in the plane
and check the engines out,
252
00:28:01,500 --> 00:28:03,375
start 'em up and check 'em out.
253
00:28:03,458 --> 00:28:05,583
And they would
clean up everything.
254
00:28:12,500 --> 00:28:13,917
Kimmel:
Tremendous workers.
255
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:15,625
They were so good.
256
00:28:15,709 --> 00:28:18,709
We came back in B-17s
with two engines,
257
00:28:18,792 --> 00:28:22,750
with the tail fin shot up
and busted away...
258
00:28:24,250 --> 00:28:26,917
...with all kinds of holes
in the plane,
259
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:31,667
and in two days, that plane
was flying missions again.
260
00:28:47,125 --> 00:28:49,083
Toombs:
We had armor on our crew.
261
00:28:49,166 --> 00:28:52,709
And he'd be there when they--
most cases, not all cases--
262
00:28:52,792 --> 00:28:56,834
sometimes a plane'd be loaded
before we ever got there.
263
00:29:03,291 --> 00:29:06,000
Doyle:
The armor gunners
took care of all that.
264
00:29:06,083 --> 00:29:10,917
They'd bring 'em out
on big carriers, and...
265
00:29:11,000 --> 00:29:13,458
it was a dangerous job.
266
00:29:26,583 --> 00:29:30,542
Haedike:
We did not load the bombs, no,
but we did come out and check.
267
00:29:53,709 --> 00:29:55,542
Doyle:
They were all fused,
268
00:29:55,625 --> 00:29:59,750
and they had fusing wires
stuck to the propeller.
269
00:30:04,709 --> 00:30:08,458
These fusing wires
were hooked on the shackles
270
00:30:08,542 --> 00:30:10,792
that the bombs are hung on,
271
00:30:10,875 --> 00:30:14,041
and when they left the plane,
they would pull the wire out.
272
00:30:17,709 --> 00:30:20,375
Haedike:
Now the bomb is alive.
273
00:30:22,041 --> 00:30:24,500
If you've seen movies
and you hear bombs...
274
00:30:24,583 --> 00:30:29,375
...goin' down,
that's this fuse spinning out.
275
00:30:33,709 --> 00:30:36,125
Now the bomb is live,
and once it hit,
276
00:30:36,208 --> 00:30:37,750
of course,
it detonates.
277
00:30:41,083 --> 00:30:45,083
We had two missions
where I had to go back
in the bomb bay
278
00:30:45,166 --> 00:30:47,250
and put the cotter pins
back in.
279
00:30:47,333 --> 00:30:50,000
And that is a little hairy.
280
00:30:50,083 --> 00:30:52,083
Why? 'Cause when you landed,
281
00:30:52,166 --> 00:30:54,750
if you didn't,
the bombs were armed,
282
00:30:54,834 --> 00:30:57,750
and if you had trouble,
of course, you'd detonate.
283
00:32:27,750 --> 00:32:31,041
Villagran:
Well, we talked about
just about everything.
284
00:32:31,125 --> 00:32:35,709
Our families, et cetera.
It didn't matter what it was.
285
00:32:35,792 --> 00:32:39,542
We kept pretty much of
a running conversation
between everybody.
286
00:32:39,625 --> 00:32:41,834
It made the mission
go a little easier.
287
00:32:50,041 --> 00:32:51,500
Ketzner:
First thing you did,
288
00:32:51,583 --> 00:32:53,834
soon as we cleared
the coast of England,
289
00:32:53,917 --> 00:32:56,291
everybody would test
their guns.
290
00:33:15,834 --> 00:33:19,542
Toombs:
Well, of course,
I can only speak for myself,
291
00:33:19,625 --> 00:33:23,250
but when you're in
hostile territory,
292
00:33:23,333 --> 00:33:25,625
and I was in a top turret,
293
00:33:25,709 --> 00:33:29,500
so all of my vision was 360--
294
00:33:29,583 --> 00:33:31,709
90 degrees this way, ya know.
295
00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:45,542
Harrison:
Contrails would form
at the tail of the ship.
296
00:33:47,875 --> 00:33:51,375
The moisture in the air
and the ship flying through it
297
00:33:51,458 --> 00:33:53,750
made the contrails.
298
00:33:55,333 --> 00:33:58,333
And a lot times
we wouldn't have 'em,
299
00:33:58,417 --> 00:34:02,291
because it depended on
the amount of moisture
in the air.
300
00:34:42,208 --> 00:34:44,792
Toombs:
Couldn't see
a prettier sight than that.
301
00:34:46,542 --> 00:34:49,500
Kind of spell-bound,
ya know, spell-bound.
302
00:34:51,291 --> 00:34:53,041
A beautiful sight.
303
00:34:58,083 --> 00:35:01,041
Ketzner:
If you're watching
on the ground over in Germany,
304
00:35:01,125 --> 00:35:04,959
they tell me,
it took about 30 minutes
for 'em all to come over.
305
00:35:07,792 --> 00:35:10,041
Haedike:
They said on a clear day
306
00:35:10,125 --> 00:35:13,917
that the Germans could see us
coming 50 miles out
307
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,291
from the contrails.
308
00:35:19,333 --> 00:35:21,333
And unfortunately,
when that happened,
309
00:35:21,417 --> 00:35:24,875
that wasn't too good,
because they were ready for us.
310
00:36:12,917 --> 00:36:17,041
Kimmel:
In 1938, I was down in Chile,
311
00:36:17,125 --> 00:36:19,542
and they threw a good will tour
down there.
312
00:36:19,625 --> 00:36:21,959
I remember going out
with my father
313
00:36:22,041 --> 00:36:23,417
and seeing these big planes.
314
00:36:27,583 --> 00:36:31,458
And I said to my father,
"Someday I'm gonna fly
in one of those."
315
00:36:31,542 --> 00:36:34,875
Little did I know.
316
00:36:44,083 --> 00:36:48,500
Toombs:
The B-17 was not only
a beautiful ship,
317
00:36:48,583 --> 00:36:49,834
but it flew like a dream,
318
00:36:49,917 --> 00:36:53,917
it flew like
an overgrown Piper Cub.
319
00:36:56,875 --> 00:36:59,417
It flew nice and smooth.
Beautiful.
320
00:36:59,500 --> 00:37:01,917
Took a lot of punishment.
321
00:37:04,333 --> 00:37:06,667
Kimmel:
The greatest airplane
ever built,
322
00:37:06,750 --> 00:37:08,709
as far as I'm concerned.
323
00:37:08,792 --> 00:37:11,166
It brought us back 35 times.
324
00:37:11,250 --> 00:37:15,709
Sometimes in condition
that you would never even think
325
00:37:15,792 --> 00:37:17,750
of trying to fly an airplane,
326
00:37:17,834 --> 00:37:20,166
any other airplane,
327
00:37:20,250 --> 00:37:24,458
that plane came back,
and that plane brought us back.
328
00:37:26,500 --> 00:37:28,792
It was a marriage,
I'll tell ya.
329
00:37:40,834 --> 00:37:44,709
Haedike:
A lot of guys, they'd name
their own planes.
330
00:37:44,792 --> 00:37:47,000
And they had
all kinds of kooky names.
331
00:37:52,875 --> 00:37:55,000
Kimmel:
The original crews
332
00:37:55,083 --> 00:37:56,583
had a lot of good painters
333
00:37:56,667 --> 00:38:00,250
and they had a of planes
that were decorated
334
00:38:00,333 --> 00:38:03,375
and had logos on 'em
and so on.
335
00:38:12,667 --> 00:38:16,959
Haedike:
Vargas girls, like Petty girl--
Petty girls, Vargas girls,
336
00:38:17,041 --> 00:38:18,333
sexy girls--
337
00:38:18,417 --> 00:38:20,709
there weren't too many
serious things.
338
00:38:20,792 --> 00:38:23,166
I think to keep guys loose.
339
00:39:08,917 --> 00:39:10,625
Villagran:
Well...
340
00:39:10,709 --> 00:39:14,291
...on a warm day
it would be 20 below.
341
00:39:14,375 --> 00:39:17,083
But sometimes it got 60 below.
342
00:39:17,166 --> 00:39:20,458
And oftentimes
I had to take my oxygen mask
343
00:39:20,542 --> 00:39:22,542
and crack the ice out of it
344
00:39:22,625 --> 00:39:26,375
and check if it would
freeze into the tube.
345
00:39:26,458 --> 00:39:28,500
That was one of the worst parts
of the mission,
346
00:39:28,583 --> 00:39:30,792
was the cold air.
347
00:39:30,875 --> 00:39:32,417
The only time
you didn't feel it
348
00:39:32,500 --> 00:39:34,500
is when you were
fightin' fighters
349
00:39:34,583 --> 00:39:37,709
or goin' over the target.
350
00:39:42,208 --> 00:39:45,542
Toombs:
Oh, at 30,000 feet the--
351
00:39:45,625 --> 00:39:50,166
I think the temperature drops
two degrees every thousand.
352
00:39:52,208 --> 00:39:56,458
It'd be about 40 below
at that altitude.
353
00:39:56,542 --> 00:40:02,375
In the cockpit,
a little bit of heat came off
the number three engine,
354
00:40:02,458 --> 00:40:08,208
it came into the cockpit
where the pilot and I sat.
355
00:40:08,291 --> 00:40:11,875
And there's enough
to kind of keep your feet warm
356
00:40:11,959 --> 00:40:13,959
and your hands.
357
00:40:21,500 --> 00:40:24,709
Toombs:
Our ball turret gunner
had a gun problem,
358
00:40:24,792 --> 00:40:28,792
his gun jammed,
and he took his gloves off
to work on it,
359
00:40:28,875 --> 00:40:31,250
and both his hands
got frostbitten
360
00:40:31,333 --> 00:40:34,709
and he didn't fly with us
for a month until
his hands healed up.
361
00:40:41,875 --> 00:40:45,583
Kimmel:
Well, it was so cold
on one mission
362
00:40:45,667 --> 00:40:50,792
our copilot suffered
an anoxia situation
where he passed out,
363
00:40:50,875 --> 00:40:55,083
and his hand froze
to the plexiglass window,
364
00:40:55,166 --> 00:40:58,125
and then they had
to amputate the fingers
of his hand
365
00:40:58,208 --> 00:41:02,125
because it was so cold
that his hand, when he tried
to help himself,
366
00:41:02,208 --> 00:41:05,500
froze to the plexiglass window.
367
00:42:04,500 --> 00:42:08,125
Toombs:
Well, the British
treated us very nice,
368
00:42:08,208 --> 00:42:11,417
in some cases royally.
369
00:42:14,125 --> 00:42:15,875
They called it
"The Friendly Invasion"
370
00:42:15,959 --> 00:42:18,250
'cause we flat invaded
that country.
371
00:42:27,083 --> 00:42:29,208
England's a small country,
and we had it
372
00:42:29,291 --> 00:42:32,625
absolutely covered up
with American soldiers.
373
00:42:35,625 --> 00:42:38,542
And they tolerated us.
374
00:42:55,792 --> 00:42:57,291
Villagran:
I was single then,
375
00:42:57,375 --> 00:42:59,875
I could run around,
do whatever I wanted.
376
00:42:59,959 --> 00:43:01,750
But I didn't feel uncomfortable
377
00:43:01,834 --> 00:43:04,709
with the British people
at all...
378
00:43:04,792 --> 00:43:07,709
once I got to be able
to understand the language,
379
00:43:07,792 --> 00:43:10,500
because...
that English language
380
00:43:10,583 --> 00:43:12,792
is a little different
then ours.
381
00:43:14,667 --> 00:43:16,250
Alexander:
Very good people.
382
00:43:16,333 --> 00:43:19,542
As you know,
at the beginning of the war
383
00:43:19,625 --> 00:43:23,625
they weren't too enamored
by the Yanks comin' over.
384
00:43:23,709 --> 00:43:29,041
They said we were "overpaid,
oversexed, and over here."
385
00:43:29,125 --> 00:43:31,333
I remember that.
386
00:44:10,333 --> 00:44:15,417
Alexander:
Flak is German
88-millimeter cannon shells.
387
00:44:15,500 --> 00:44:19,625
Flak was responsible
for more planes being shot down
388
00:44:19,709 --> 00:44:21,875
than enemy fighters.
389
00:44:21,959 --> 00:44:25,041
And when you see a flak,
black puffs of smoke,
390
00:44:25,125 --> 00:44:28,542
that's after the shell,
of course, has exploded.
391
00:44:28,625 --> 00:44:31,500
And it explodes,
hypothetically,
392
00:44:31,583 --> 00:44:34,291
into 200 pieces...
393
00:44:34,375 --> 00:44:36,417
and it's powerful.
394
00:44:41,417 --> 00:44:43,750
Rowland:
You don't know where
the flak is coming from.
395
00:44:43,834 --> 00:44:47,083
You don't know
if the next burst
is gonna hit you or not.
396
00:44:47,166 --> 00:44:50,333
You never know where
the next one is gonna be
397
00:44:50,417 --> 00:44:53,250
in a case like that,
and that's what scares ya.
398
00:44:55,417 --> 00:44:57,583
Toombs:
It just looked like
a big thunderstorm,
399
00:44:57,667 --> 00:44:59,875
so to speak,
that's what it amounted to.
400
00:44:59,959 --> 00:45:02,250
But you had to keep on flyin'.
401
00:45:07,959 --> 00:45:11,625
Kimmel:
God was on your side
when you didn't get hit.
402
00:45:11,709 --> 00:45:13,875
The flak would vary so much.
403
00:45:13,959 --> 00:45:16,041
The Germans had
pretty good radar--
404
00:45:16,125 --> 00:45:19,750
they could judge your altitude,
your speed,
405
00:45:19,834 --> 00:45:22,125
and your direction.
406
00:45:28,709 --> 00:45:31,166
Harrison:
I think the worst
that I ever had--
407
00:45:31,250 --> 00:45:34,542
over Kassel, Germany,
I will never forget that one--
408
00:45:34,625 --> 00:45:36,750
it blew my windshield out
409
00:45:36,834 --> 00:45:40,792
and come into my face
at 160 miles an hour.
410
00:45:48,667 --> 00:45:51,291
Villagran:
You'd look at that flak
out there, and you'd swear
411
00:45:51,375 --> 00:45:54,250
you're not gonna
get through it...
412
00:45:54,333 --> 00:45:56,417
where the sky's almost black
with these things
413
00:45:56,500 --> 00:45:59,583
bustin' all over the place.
414
00:45:59,667 --> 00:46:03,333
It's amazing
we did make it through
as much as we did.
415
00:46:17,750 --> 00:46:19,375
Villagran:
Well, we had a dog,
416
00:46:19,458 --> 00:46:22,208
and it looked more like a pig
than a dog.
417
00:46:22,291 --> 00:46:25,041
But it was our mascot.
418
00:46:32,458 --> 00:46:36,000
We had a stove
in the middle of the barracks,
419
00:46:36,083 --> 00:46:38,959
and we used to make sandwiches
on it and so forth.
420
00:46:39,041 --> 00:46:42,875
If the dog was around,
we'd feed him whatever
we had left over.
421
00:46:44,542 --> 00:46:47,000
He hung around the barracks
until we got back.
422
00:46:47,083 --> 00:46:49,625
Don't know if
he had a name or not.
423
00:46:49,709 --> 00:46:51,959
He was a faithful little dog.
424
00:46:52,041 --> 00:46:55,250
But it had a real wide nose.
425
00:47:02,709 --> 00:47:05,250
Harrison:
Oh, you get superstitious.
426
00:47:05,333 --> 00:47:09,041
I remember I had to put on
a clean pair of socks
427
00:47:09,125 --> 00:47:11,333
the day I was shot down.
428
00:47:11,417 --> 00:47:15,875
I'd been wearing
the same pair of socks.
429
00:47:15,959 --> 00:47:20,125
Evidently, I think that the pup
got one of my socks
430
00:47:20,208 --> 00:47:22,834
and was chewing on it
and hid it,
431
00:47:22,917 --> 00:47:24,458
and I couldn't find it
that morning,
432
00:47:24,542 --> 00:47:27,417
I had to put on
a clean pair of socks.
433
00:47:27,500 --> 00:47:30,625
That might have been the reason
I was shot down.
434
00:47:32,417 --> 00:47:34,333
Kimmel:
You are to believe this or not,
435
00:47:34,417 --> 00:47:37,083
but somewheres around
the 10th or 12th mission,
436
00:47:37,166 --> 00:47:42,333
I got to a point, and I know
some of the other fellas
reached the same thing,
437
00:47:42,417 --> 00:47:44,750
that they were feeling blasé.
438
00:47:44,834 --> 00:47:46,792
"They didn't get us
up to here,
439
00:47:46,875 --> 00:47:49,542
they ain't gonna
get us hereon."
440
00:47:51,333 --> 00:47:54,291
Haedike:
I was somewhat superstitious.
441
00:47:54,375 --> 00:47:57,125
I always felt
God would bring me home--
442
00:47:57,208 --> 00:47:59,041
and I mean that sincerely--
443
00:47:59,125 --> 00:48:03,250
however, I wasn't sure
if it would be in one piece.
444
00:48:08,166 --> 00:48:10,917
I flew five days in a row.
445
00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:12,542
Five missions.
446
00:48:12,625 --> 00:48:14,959
And I remember
by the fourth or fifth one,
447
00:48:15,041 --> 00:48:18,041
you really didn't care--
you were worn out.
448
00:48:18,125 --> 00:48:21,000
You wanted to get away from it.
449
00:48:21,083 --> 00:48:23,583
Toombs:
I saw a lot of 'em
break under pressure.
450
00:48:23,667 --> 00:48:28,208
Come back and told
the flight sergeant,
"I can't fly anymore."
451
00:48:28,291 --> 00:48:29,583
And they didn't.
452
00:48:29,667 --> 00:48:30,959
Nobody pointed
their finger at 'em
453
00:48:31,041 --> 00:48:32,625
and ridiculed 'em.
454
00:48:33,792 --> 00:48:35,458
Nobody.
455
00:49:15,208 --> 00:49:17,125
Kimmel:
Yes, the bomb run.
456
00:49:17,208 --> 00:49:18,750
That was the worst,
457
00:49:18,834 --> 00:49:21,792
'cause you had to
keep everything steady.
458
00:49:23,208 --> 00:49:24,625
If you weren't on a bomb run,
459
00:49:24,709 --> 00:49:27,333
you could slide over
once in a while,
460
00:49:27,417 --> 00:49:29,792
that made 'em
think they'd miss ya.
461
00:49:29,875 --> 00:49:33,875
But on a bomb run, you just
had to set there and take it.
462
00:49:37,458 --> 00:49:40,917
Try to shrivel up,
I guess.
463
00:49:43,041 --> 00:49:46,083
Harrison:
The lead ship does it all.
464
00:49:46,166 --> 00:49:48,625
You just follow what he does.
465
00:49:48,709 --> 00:49:51,667
The lead ship, and then
the two on each side,
466
00:49:51,750 --> 00:49:55,041
one down there and one up here
and around there.
467
00:49:59,709 --> 00:50:03,458
Toombs:
I was flyin' right above
the leader,
468
00:50:03,542 --> 00:50:05,625
and when you're watching him
469
00:50:05,709 --> 00:50:10,041
and you see that the bomb door
is open, then you open too.
470
00:50:10,125 --> 00:50:12,000
And then you wait
for him to drop bombs,
471
00:50:12,083 --> 00:50:14,291
and when he drops bombs,
then you drop 'em.
472
00:50:25,125 --> 00:50:27,333
Kimmel:
We can't change our altitude,
473
00:50:27,417 --> 00:50:29,500
and we can't change
our direction,
474
00:50:29,583 --> 00:50:32,750
and we're what you call
sitting ducks at that moment.
475
00:50:36,500 --> 00:50:39,500
Harrison:
It was rough,
because any minute,
476
00:50:39,583 --> 00:50:41,583
you were gonna get hit.
477
00:52:02,834 --> 00:52:05,667
Kimmel:
The bombs are dropped,
bombs away,
478
00:52:05,750 --> 00:52:08,667
and the first thing
you hear is,
479
00:52:08,750 --> 00:52:11,792
"Let's get the hell
outta here."
480
00:52:11,875 --> 00:52:16,875
We make a sharp turn,
and the group follows the lead.
481
00:52:19,959 --> 00:52:21,417
Doyle:
After a while,
482
00:52:21,500 --> 00:52:23,500
fighter attacks
started coming in,
483
00:52:23,583 --> 00:52:26,208
and they didn't miss
very often.
484
00:52:48,583 --> 00:52:50,792
Toombs:
They'd be out 20, 30 miles,
485
00:52:50,875 --> 00:52:54,208
and they'd come rush
straight at your level.
486
00:53:01,291 --> 00:53:05,333
Harrison:
You couldn't hit anything
with those guns like that.
487
00:53:05,417 --> 00:53:08,792
By the time you saw a guy,
he was gone.
488
00:53:08,875 --> 00:53:11,875
You'd see one comin',
he's gone.
489
00:53:35,208 --> 00:53:39,166
Rowland:
You don't have much time
to shoot at 'em.
490
00:53:39,250 --> 00:53:42,500
If you get off a burst or two,
well, you're lucky,
491
00:53:42,583 --> 00:53:44,750
then they'd go zoop!
492
00:54:03,041 --> 00:54:06,333
Toombs:
He'll drop off,
he'll fly down,
493
00:54:06,417 --> 00:54:08,291
and then he'll line up on ya.
494
00:54:08,375 --> 00:54:11,125
Then he'll peel off.
495
00:54:48,959 --> 00:54:52,250
Harrison:
The copilot was hit pretty hard
when we were shot down.
496
00:54:52,333 --> 00:54:57,583
A 20-millimeter shell
popped right above his head
497
00:54:57,667 --> 00:54:59,750
and it knocked an eye out.
498
00:55:01,750 --> 00:55:07,458
So it was high noon,
an ME-109 was back there
blasting at us,
499
00:55:07,542 --> 00:55:12,208
and I heard the copilot,
he said, "Jesus Christ,
500
00:55:12,291 --> 00:55:15,500
number four's on fire.
Get out."
501
00:55:19,542 --> 00:55:22,583
When that thing is spinnin'
and headin' down,
502
00:55:22,667 --> 00:55:24,291
you were glued to your seat,
503
00:55:24,375 --> 00:55:26,750
you couldn't move
if you wanted to.
504
00:55:30,709 --> 00:55:34,417
Villagran:
And you're lucky if you see
two or three guys bail out.
505
00:55:37,709 --> 00:55:39,166
We would count the chutes,
506
00:55:39,250 --> 00:55:41,667
and usually if we
started to look too long
507
00:55:41,750 --> 00:55:43,583
after a ship
that was going down,
508
00:55:43,667 --> 00:55:46,333
the pilot would say,
"OK, guys, off--"
509
00:55:46,417 --> 00:55:47,792
We didn't want
to spend too much time
510
00:55:47,875 --> 00:55:49,667
looking at a plane going down
511
00:55:49,750 --> 00:55:52,917
when we had fighters
in the area and so forth.
512
00:56:01,083 --> 00:56:04,917
Harrison:
The gunners and the others
that were watching all the time
513
00:56:05,000 --> 00:56:09,083
would tell ya, "Boy,
I don't think anybody got out
of that one, nobody got out,"
514
00:56:09,166 --> 00:56:13,542
and then sometimes
you'd see chutes
comin' out of 'em
515
00:56:13,625 --> 00:56:15,917
before they blew up
or anything.
516
00:56:18,625 --> 00:56:20,625
If you didn't
have your chute on
517
00:56:20,709 --> 00:56:24,000
and get out of there
in less than 30 seconds,
518
00:56:24,083 --> 00:56:25,458
you're gone.
519
00:56:27,083 --> 00:56:28,959
You're gone.
520
00:56:30,750 --> 00:56:36,125
And seven out of eleven
out of my crew got out alive...
521
00:56:36,208 --> 00:56:39,667
and one of 'em,
when he got on the ground,
522
00:56:39,750 --> 00:56:42,250
they pitchforked him to death.
523
00:56:43,917 --> 00:56:47,000
How could you kill a human
like that?
524
00:57:23,333 --> 00:57:27,250
Kimmel:
As we approached the field,
we set off flares.
525
00:57:27,333 --> 00:57:30,625
Red flares means
you have wounded aboard.
526
00:57:30,709 --> 00:57:32,917
Everybody else
gets out of the way
527
00:57:33,000 --> 00:57:35,125
and the wounded comes in first.
528
00:58:24,458 --> 00:58:26,750
Kimmel:
To this day, I still see it.
529
00:58:26,834 --> 00:58:29,125
When I think of it,
I choke up.
530
00:58:29,208 --> 00:58:31,500
I can't help it,
they were friends of mine,
531
00:58:31,583 --> 00:58:34,959
they were good friends,
and it hurt so bad.
532
00:58:35,041 --> 00:58:38,875
Especially we all felt like:
"What a waste."
533
00:58:42,500 --> 00:58:47,333
With the job we had,
the chance of dying
was at least 50%.
534
00:58:47,417 --> 00:58:51,625
50% chance of living,
50% chance of dying.
535
00:58:55,375 --> 00:58:57,291
Haedike:
You know, a guy said,
"Your name's on it."
536
00:58:57,375 --> 00:58:59,333
Well, maybe it was.
537
00:58:59,417 --> 00:59:01,667
But it was scary.
538
00:59:01,750 --> 00:59:07,959
And I get very irritated
when I hear some of these guys
say, "I wasn't scared one bit."
539
00:59:08,041 --> 00:59:10,291
They're full of prunes.
540
00:59:14,250 --> 00:59:16,834
I was scared every time.
541
00:59:23,625 --> 00:59:26,208
Kimmel:
I went out to a ship one time
542
00:59:26,291 --> 00:59:28,750
when they were taking
a young fella off,
543
00:59:28,834 --> 00:59:32,125
and I thought
I could help them.
544
00:59:34,208 --> 00:59:36,417
The guy they were pulling
out of the ship...
545
00:59:39,625 --> 00:59:43,166
...he was
calling for his mother.
546
01:00:33,250 --> 01:00:37,291
Haedike:
In about late 1944,
547
01:00:37,375 --> 01:00:40,458
the Allies decided
548
01:00:40,542 --> 01:00:44,041
to do away
with precision bombing.
549
01:00:45,875 --> 01:00:48,333
We went to pattern bombing.
550
01:00:50,041 --> 01:00:52,375
Unfortunately, it killed
a lot of people,
551
01:00:52,458 --> 01:00:57,208
but brought the war to a close
about a year sooner.
552
01:01:06,583 --> 01:01:09,500
Doyle:
The United States military
553
01:01:09,583 --> 01:01:13,500
did not go out
to carpet-bomb civilians
or anything.
554
01:01:13,583 --> 01:01:16,041
They went out
to bomb factories,
555
01:01:16,125 --> 01:01:18,333
rail yards, refineries,
556
01:01:18,417 --> 01:01:20,750
and places that had something
to do with the war.
557
01:01:20,834 --> 01:01:23,542
I don't think that
I felt bad about that at all.
558
01:01:23,625 --> 01:01:25,750
That's what we were
supposed to do.
559
01:01:25,834 --> 01:01:29,959
But toward the end of the war,
the Germans would not give up.
560
01:01:50,375 --> 01:01:52,000
Toombs:
Never thought a thing about it.
561
01:01:52,083 --> 01:01:55,166
We didn't think about people
being down there.
562
01:01:56,417 --> 01:01:57,875
That never crossed my mind,
563
01:01:57,959 --> 01:02:00,458
about a human being
bein' down there.
564
01:02:11,834 --> 01:02:14,709
Alexander:
Never gave it a thought,
they just Germans,
565
01:02:14,792 --> 01:02:17,625
you know, and I never
gave it a thought.
566
01:02:28,250 --> 01:02:30,917
Doyle:
For some reason,
I didn't hate 'em.
567
01:02:31,000 --> 01:02:32,750
If I had a fighter plane
568
01:02:32,834 --> 01:02:35,333
come within
shooting-me distance,
569
01:02:35,417 --> 01:02:39,875
my thought was, "This kid
probably wanted to live
as bad as you did."
570
01:02:42,166 --> 01:02:44,625
I really didn't have
any hate for 'em.
571
01:02:44,709 --> 01:02:46,458
I was just scared of 'em.
572
01:02:50,291 --> 01:02:52,166
Kimmel:
Never gave it a thought.
573
01:02:52,250 --> 01:02:54,583
I honestly
never gave it a thought.
574
01:02:54,667 --> 01:02:57,333
I just felt this way:
575
01:02:57,417 --> 01:02:59,083
"They're gonna do it to us,
576
01:02:59,166 --> 01:03:01,625
we better do it to them
before they do it to us."
577
01:03:01,709 --> 01:03:04,500
And that's the way I felt,
and I couldn't help it.
578
01:03:44,333 --> 01:03:48,458
Interviewer:
Bring any thoughts,
seeing that?
579
01:03:48,542 --> 01:03:52,542
Toombs:
Well, I drifted off into
several thoughts.
580
01:03:52,625 --> 01:03:56,000
Most of 'em, you know, uh...
581
01:03:56,083 --> 01:03:58,500
were bad thoughts when
you're lookin' at a mission.
582
01:03:58,583 --> 01:04:03,500
I see what took place
on that mission,
583
01:04:03,583 --> 01:04:07,208
and your mind drifts back
to those times, you know.
584
01:04:22,875 --> 01:04:25,625
Doyle:
We had a lot
of midair collisions.
585
01:04:25,709 --> 01:04:28,500
Some guys would get mixed up,
pilots,
586
01:04:28,583 --> 01:04:33,000
and they'd start flying...
the wrong direction and so on.
587
01:04:33,083 --> 01:04:37,000
But the scary part
of most of our missions
588
01:04:37,083 --> 01:04:39,125
was just getting through
all of that.
589
01:04:41,542 --> 01:04:46,041
Interviewer:
Did it get easier or harder
as you flew more missions?
590
01:04:46,125 --> 01:04:49,417
Doyle:
I just-- Like I say,
I was scared to death.
591
01:04:49,500 --> 01:04:53,667
But, uh...
those were not good days.
592
01:05:04,458 --> 01:05:07,709
There was no radio
communication at all.
593
01:05:07,792 --> 01:05:11,125
We had the intercom goin'
all the time, though.
594
01:05:11,208 --> 01:05:14,834
I'd check in with the man
with the oxygen mask on,
595
01:05:14,917 --> 01:05:18,792
make sure their oxygen
was flowing right.
596
01:05:18,875 --> 01:05:20,500
Especially the tail gunner,
597
01:05:20,583 --> 01:05:23,959
he was layin' back there
by himself so much.
598
01:05:31,792 --> 01:05:35,500
Harrison:
You got very close with
the men and everything.
599
01:05:35,583 --> 01:05:38,041
And they're all young kids.
600
01:05:42,208 --> 01:05:45,166
They're all dead now,
I'm sure.
601
01:05:56,709 --> 01:05:58,125
When you're that high up,
602
01:05:58,208 --> 01:06:01,834
everything on the ground
looks like a little toy.
603
01:06:01,917 --> 01:06:04,667
If you see a truck or something,
604
01:06:04,750 --> 01:06:06,709
it really looks small.
605
01:06:08,333 --> 01:06:12,000
It was hard,
but you had to do it.
606
01:06:12,083 --> 01:06:15,875
We had to get rid of Hitler,
and so we did it.
607
01:06:28,208 --> 01:06:32,542
You guys know that some bombs
went through the wings of B-17s?
608
01:06:33,875 --> 01:06:35,875
I always wondered
how in the world--
609
01:06:35,959 --> 01:06:38,041
They were out of position...
610
01:06:38,125 --> 01:06:40,041
in the formation.
611
01:06:41,375 --> 01:06:44,208
God's been good to me.
612
01:06:44,291 --> 01:06:47,291
First of all,
he's given me 70 years
613
01:06:47,375 --> 01:06:49,333
with that lady over there,
614
01:06:49,417 --> 01:06:52,083
and we have a wonderful family.
615
01:06:56,291 --> 01:06:57,917
We have six kids
616
01:06:58,000 --> 01:07:01,667
and we have 20 grandkids,
22 great-grandkids.
617
01:07:01,750 --> 01:07:05,750
So we've been
a very blessed family.
618
01:07:05,834 --> 01:07:09,083
I didn't say I want 'em all
at the house at once.
619
01:07:16,208 --> 01:07:18,667
Interviewer:
What do you think
about "The Good War"
620
01:07:18,750 --> 01:07:20,709
and "You're
the Greatest Generation"?
621
01:07:23,125 --> 01:07:27,375
Villagran:
Well...
I'm beginning to believe it.
622
01:07:30,375 --> 01:07:32,667
Does that make sense to ya?
623
01:07:34,917 --> 01:07:39,458
You kind of grew up 10 years
when you went into that thing.
624
01:07:41,083 --> 01:07:44,208
And when I came back home,
625
01:07:44,291 --> 01:07:47,125
I didn't feel like
the same man anymore.
626
01:07:54,625 --> 01:07:58,333
Interviewer:
What do you say to people
who say, "John, you're a hero.
627
01:07:58,417 --> 01:07:59,917
You're a hero"?
628
01:08:00,000 --> 01:08:01,625
Ketzner:
I say, "OK,
you're probably right."
629
01:08:01,709 --> 01:08:04,542
I don't know what else to say.
630
01:08:04,625 --> 01:08:07,041
I wasn't one
of the hero-heroes,
631
01:08:07,125 --> 01:08:10,625
the guys that finish
their tour and sign up
for another one,
632
01:08:10,709 --> 01:08:13,667
I wasn't them kind of heroes.
633
01:08:15,792 --> 01:08:17,917
Alexander:
But I want it clearly known:
634
01:08:18,000 --> 01:08:20,792
I do not profess myself
to be a hero.
635
01:08:20,875 --> 01:08:23,417
I was the pilot;
636
01:08:23,500 --> 01:08:27,750
the heroes are buried in
England, Germany, and France.
637
01:08:27,834 --> 01:08:31,041
The boys didn't make it,
they're the heroes.
638
01:08:31,125 --> 01:08:33,333
I was just a normal pilot.
639
01:08:52,917 --> 01:08:55,542
This is called pattern bombing.
640
01:09:02,041 --> 01:09:04,542
Interviewer:
No offense, but you guys
aren't getting any younger.
641
01:09:04,625 --> 01:09:06,250
Why do you think
it's important
642
01:09:06,333 --> 01:09:09,083
that people know
what you guys did?
643
01:09:11,375 --> 01:09:12,959
Kimmel:
Well, for one thing,
644
01:09:13,041 --> 01:09:14,917
we don't want it
to to happen again,
645
01:09:15,000 --> 01:09:18,458
in fact or in fancy.
646
01:09:18,542 --> 01:09:20,500
We just don't want it
to happen again,
647
01:09:20,583 --> 01:09:25,709
for my grandson,
my granddaughters
and their husbands.
648
01:09:28,583 --> 01:09:32,750
I don't want to see them
have to face what we did.
649
01:10:19,625 --> 01:10:22,792
Haedike:
I cannot say it
much more eloquently--
650
01:10:22,875 --> 01:10:25,792
it was a hazardous profession.
651
01:10:27,834 --> 01:10:31,208
OK, up at altitude and,
of course, bombs away and all,
652
01:10:31,291 --> 01:10:32,792
and you got this on,
653
01:10:32,875 --> 01:10:35,166
I think fear
more than anything,
654
01:10:35,250 --> 01:10:38,208
you'd perspire and sweat.
655
01:10:38,291 --> 01:10:40,333
You got this on.
656
01:10:40,417 --> 01:10:43,500
Ice would form,
and you'd take a deep breath
657
01:10:43,583 --> 01:10:46,500
and break the ice
out of the oxygen mask.
658
01:10:46,583 --> 01:10:49,083
And then put it back on.
659
01:10:51,667 --> 01:10:55,333
This is Bud
trying to get down on the floor.
660
01:10:55,417 --> 01:10:57,417
This is the Mae West.
661
01:10:57,500 --> 01:10:59,917
Remember I told ya
about the oxygen?
662
01:11:00,000 --> 01:11:02,125
I mean, the CO2 cylinder?
663
01:11:02,208 --> 01:11:05,083
This is it.
There it is.
664
01:11:05,166 --> 01:11:07,083
CO2 cylinder.
665
01:11:07,166 --> 01:11:10,583
This was before
underarm deodorant,
hair spray--
666
01:11:10,667 --> 01:11:14,834
I think this was the birth
of aerosol containers.
667
01:11:14,917 --> 01:11:18,917
And if guys bailed out,
they didn't want it
totally inflated
668
01:11:19,000 --> 01:11:20,750
couple hundred feet up,
669
01:11:20,834 --> 01:11:24,583
because if they hit the water,
they could break their backs.
670
01:11:24,667 --> 01:11:27,083
So it wasn't that easy.
I never did it.
671
01:11:27,166 --> 01:11:28,917
This is a throat mic.
672
01:11:29,000 --> 01:11:31,333
This is how
I talked to Eric.
673
01:11:31,417 --> 01:11:32,917
And this plugged in.
674
01:11:33,000 --> 01:11:35,709
And as I showed ya
on the helmet,
675
01:11:35,792 --> 01:11:37,291
this is how I heard.
676
01:11:37,375 --> 01:11:39,458
So we had
our communication system.
677
01:11:39,542 --> 01:11:41,291
Interviewer:
But, Bud, to be clear,
678
01:11:41,375 --> 01:11:44,208
this should have been returned
to the government in 1945.
679
01:11:46,542 --> 01:11:48,417
Come and get 'em, baby.
680
01:11:48,500 --> 01:11:50,542
Interviewer:
What we just did with you
681
01:11:50,625 --> 01:11:52,333
might be the credit roll
to our movie,
682
01:11:52,417 --> 01:11:53,959
so you have any messages
for people
683
01:11:54,041 --> 01:11:55,709
that just watched
this movie?
684
01:11:55,792 --> 01:11:59,792
Well, I'm just so glad
that people in America,
685
01:11:59,875 --> 01:12:04,625
or anywhere,
can get an idea what 19 and 20
686
01:12:04,709 --> 01:12:07,417
and 21-year-old kids
went through,
687
01:12:07,500 --> 01:12:10,875
and as I tell kids
when I get done with my talk,
688
01:12:10,959 --> 01:12:13,667
"I'm gonna ask you guys
a favor now."
689
01:12:13,750 --> 01:12:15,166
"What's that, Bud?"
690
01:12:15,250 --> 01:12:16,542
"When you go home tonight,
691
01:12:16,625 --> 01:12:19,125
you say a prayer of thanks
to God
692
01:12:19,208 --> 01:12:22,709
for those 28,000 guys
that gave their lives
693
01:12:22,792 --> 01:12:25,542
so that you got
the life you got today."
694
01:12:27,917 --> 01:12:29,333
Interviewer:
Well, thank you
for your service, Bud.
695
01:12:29,417 --> 01:12:31,250
Haedike:
Not at all. Not at all.
55349