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1
00:00:08,640 --> 00:00:10,237
Gary, it's started!
2
00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:12,877
Wait. Wait!
3
00:00:12,960 --> 00:00:14,877
Hey, you're in our way.
4
00:00:14,960 --> 00:00:16,877
Well, erm...
5
00:00:16,960 --> 00:00:19,877
KIDS CHATTER
6
00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:21,237
KNOCK AT DOOR
7
00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:22,960
BELL RINGING
8
00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:25,960
Oh, I'll get it, shall I?
9
00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:29,877
Move! You move.
10
00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:30,878
Behave.
11
00:00:30,961 --> 00:00:32,717
KIDS CHATTER
12
00:00:32,800 --> 00:00:33,877
Oh, hi. Good afternoon.
13
00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:35,877
My name's Marion. I
live across the street.
14
00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:37,877
Oh! Nice to meet you. I'm Ann.
15
00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:40,877
The thing is,
Billingham's a nice area.
16
00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:42,917
I'm sure you're perfectly
civil yourself, but...
17
00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:44,960
Ah. Here it is.
18
00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:51,960
As you can see, quite a few of the
neighbours have already signed it.
19
00:00:56,960 --> 00:00:58,877
You're trying to get
rid of us? It's not you.
20
00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:00,877
It's your husband.
21
00:01:00,960 --> 00:01:05,237
All these foreigners pouring
off the boats like rats.
22
00:01:05,320 --> 00:01:07,960
Surely, you could've
done better for yourself.
23
00:01:08,960 --> 00:01:11,960
I think you'd be happier
elsewhere, don't you?
24
00:01:15,960 --> 00:01:17,960
KIDS CHATTER
25
00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:26,877
TV: 'Oh, can you believe this?'
'That's called character, Alf.'
26
00:01:26,960 --> 00:01:31,237
'Character?! It's a chuffin' health
hazard, that's what that is.'
27
00:01:31,320 --> 00:01:32,877
CLATTERING
28
00:01:32,960 --> 00:01:36,960
DOG BARKING
29
00:01:54,640 --> 00:01:55,877
No.
30
00:01:55,960 --> 00:01:57,877
No, I'm not having
this. Honestly...
31
00:01:57,960 --> 00:01:59,877
No. Love, it's not worth it.
32
00:01:59,960 --> 00:02:01,877
Hey! You can shove your
petition up your arse!
33
00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:05,000
And if you ever try anything
like that again, you'll be sorry!
34
00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:08,960
WOMAN: Keep it down, will you?!
35
00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:11,877
MAN: Pack it in, will you?!
36
00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:14,960
HE CHUCKLES Hey.
37
00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:19,877
Sorry. No.
38
00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:22,877
I think I like this side of you.
39
00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:24,960
Really? Well, you'd
better get used to it.
40
00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:28,960
MUSIC: 'Pictures
Of You' by The Cure
41
00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:43,877
♪ I've been looking so long
At these pictures of you
42
00:02:43,960 --> 00:02:48,877
♪ That I almost believe
That they're real
43
00:02:48,960 --> 00:02:54,877
♪ I've been living so long
With my pictures of you
44
00:02:54,960 --> 00:02:57,877
♪ That I almost believe
45
00:02:57,960 --> 00:03:01,960
♪ That the pictures
Are all I can feel. ♪
46
00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:25,877
You've no need to be nervous.
He's a very nice fella.
47
00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:28,877
He could be the spawn
of Satan for all I care.
48
00:03:28,960 --> 00:03:30,877
As long as he listens
to what I have to say.
49
00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:34,160
You don't have to say
anything. That's why I'm here.
50
00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:37,640
WOMAN: Hello. Follow
me, please. Thanks.
51
00:03:45,320 --> 00:03:46,960
It's just round here.
52
00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:49,878
Let me do the
talking. KNOCK AT DOOR
53
00:03:49,961 --> 00:03:51,397
DOOR OPENS
54
00:03:51,480 --> 00:03:53,877
Back to my constituency
on Friday. All right.
55
00:03:53,960 --> 00:03:56,877
Mrs Ming. Mr Ming. Come on in.
56
00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:58,877
Thanks, Isabelle.
57
00:03:58,960 --> 00:04:00,397
Frank. Jack.
58
00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:03,397
Thanks for seeing us today.
I know how busy you are.
59
00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:05,877
Not at all. Always a pleasure.
60
00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:07,877
So, as I mentioned
on the phone, I...
61
00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:10,877
This is our daughter, Mr Straw.
62
00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:13,877
And this? This is the
man who murdered her.
63
00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:16,960
That's not an opinion. He
confessed to it in a court of law.
64
00:04:17,960 --> 00:04:20,877
Yes, I've been following
the case closely, Mrs Ming.
65
00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:22,877
Well, I am not happy with
the perjury sentence,
66
00:04:22,960 --> 00:04:24,877
and I wanna know what
you're gonna do about it.
67
00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:27,877
Well, there's not a great deal
I can do about it, I'm afraid.
68
00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:29,877
Then something needs to be done
69
00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:31,877
about changing the double
jeopardy law, doesn't it?
70
00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:34,877
Double jeopardy is a
very grey area, Mrs Ming.
71
00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:38,160
I'm not bothered what colour it is,
I wanna know what you're gonna do.
72
00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:48,878
Don't bother with that.
73
00:04:48,961 --> 00:04:50,877
There's no case like
ours in that book,
74
00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:51,878
or any other, for that matter.
75
00:04:51,961 --> 00:04:53,237
Am I right?
76
00:04:53,320 --> 00:04:56,960
Well, as a matter
of fact, you are.
77
00:04:57,960 --> 00:04:59,877
Here's where things
currently stand -
78
00:04:59,960 --> 00:05:02,877
the Home Affairs Select
Committee are recommending
79
00:05:02,960 --> 00:05:05,877
that the double
jeopardy law be changed,
80
00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:09,877
and I've asked the Law Commission
to undertake their own review,
81
00:05:09,960 --> 00:05:12,877
but this may take
years, I'm afraid.
82
00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:15,557
Well, we... we
haven't got years.
83
00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:16,877
He'll be out before too long.
84
00:05:16,960 --> 00:05:20,877
And once he's out, it'll be a bloody
sight harder to get him put back in.
85
00:05:20,960 --> 00:05:24,397
It's a general principle of
law-making in this country
86
00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:27,877
that any change should only apply
to the future, not the past.
87
00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:30,877
So even if their
recommendations are enacted,
88
00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:33,877
the chances of it being
applied retrospectively
89
00:05:33,960 --> 00:05:36,557
to historic cases
such as yours...
90
00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:38,960
pretty slender, I'm afraid.
91
00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:42,000
I'm sorry, I'm just
being honest with you.
92
00:05:44,960 --> 00:05:46,877
OK, well, tell me this.
93
00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:49,960
What would you do if you
were in our situation?
94
00:05:51,960 --> 00:05:54,877
If you're to have any
chance of success,
95
00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:58,397
you'll have to get the Law
Commission on your side.
96
00:05:58,480 --> 00:06:00,237
All right, well, give me
the name of the person
97
00:06:00,320 --> 00:06:02,960
I need speak to
there, then, please.
98
00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:07,397
You've got grit,
I'll give you that.
99
00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:10,877
We've been wronged, Jack.
How can I stay silent?
100
00:06:10,960 --> 00:06:13,877
My advice? Don't.
101
00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:15,960
In fact, the louder
you are, the better.
102
00:06:19,960 --> 00:06:21,557
Bloody hell.
103
00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:23,960
You just had the Home Secretary
eating out of your hand.
104
00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:26,877
Well, I don't know what
all the fuss is about.
105
00:06:26,960 --> 00:06:29,237
He's just a man in a slightly
better suit than yours.
106
00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:31,960
THEY LAUGH CHARLIE:
Good one, love.
107
00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:37,877
Have I missed anything?
108
00:06:37,960 --> 00:06:39,877
You must be joking.
109
00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:42,877
I've seen encyclopaedias
with less detail than this.
110
00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:45,960
Let's just hope they
get back to us quickly.
111
00:06:46,960 --> 00:06:48,877
I'm gonna go to bed.
112
00:06:48,960 --> 00:06:51,077
What are you doing?
113
00:06:51,160 --> 00:06:53,877
Oh, just some paperwork,
love. Sleep tight.
114
00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:55,960
Night, Kev. Night.
115
00:07:01,960 --> 00:07:04,877
What is it? Is it Kev?
116
00:07:04,960 --> 00:07:07,557
I don't think he saw anything.
117
00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:08,960
No, erm...
118
00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:13,960
I'm thinking of
retiring from the NHS.
119
00:07:15,160 --> 00:07:16,800
What?
120
00:07:17,960 --> 00:07:19,000
Just feels like it's time.
121
00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:21,397
But you love your job.
122
00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:23,877
I know.
123
00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:26,960
But this is gonna need all
of my focus and energy now.
124
00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:31,877
What?
125
00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:33,960
You heard what Jack Straw said.
126
00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:36,237
It could take years.
127
00:07:36,320 --> 00:07:38,877
I don't care how long it takes.
128
00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:40,960
What if it's five years?
129
00:07:41,960 --> 00:07:43,877
Ten years, even?
130
00:07:43,960 --> 00:07:45,877
And what if after all
those years of fighting,
131
00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:48,877
you still don't get
the result you want?
132
00:07:48,960 --> 00:07:50,960
We can't think like that.
133
00:07:51,960 --> 00:07:54,917
Look, I know how you feel about
all of this, and that's fine.
134
00:07:55,000 --> 00:07:57,960
I don't need your help,
but I do need your support.
135
00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:29,960
DOOR CLOSES Oh, hi,
love. How was your week?
136
00:08:32,960 --> 00:08:33,960
DOOR SLAMS
137
00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:37,960
MUSIC PLAYS THROUGH HEADPHONES
138
00:08:41,960 --> 00:08:43,877
KNOCK AT DOOR
139
00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:45,000
Come in.
140
00:08:48,960 --> 00:08:50,960
Mind if I sit?
141
00:08:57,480 --> 00:08:58,960
Is everything OK, love?
142
00:09:01,480 --> 00:09:03,080
You'd tell me if it
wasn't, wouldn't you?
143
00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:08,960
Kev, look, whatever it is,
you can be honest with me.
144
00:09:23,960 --> 00:09:25,877
SOFTLY: Oh, my God.
145
00:09:25,960 --> 00:09:29,960
Oh, where did you find
these? The library.
146
00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:33,877
Some kids at school
were saying things.
147
00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:36,800
Oh. Oh, Kev.
148
00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:43,877
I didn't read any
more after that one.
149
00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:45,960
No, of course you couldn't.
150
00:09:47,960 --> 00:09:50,640
Look, please let me explain...
Why would you lie to me?
151
00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:53,877
I don't know. Why?
152
00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:57,557
I don't know, love. I...
I didn't mean to hurt you.
153
00:09:57,640 --> 00:09:59,877
We wanted to protect
you, that's all.
154
00:09:59,960 --> 00:10:02,877
Not just your grandad and
me, but your dad as well.
155
00:10:02,960 --> 00:10:03,960
You were so young.
156
00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:07,877
But I am sorry. I'm sorry.
157
00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:09,160
It's not fair.
158
00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:15,877
Look, you can ask me
anything you like about her,
159
00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:17,877
anything at all, OK?
160
00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:19,877
And I will...
161
00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:22,960
I'll tell you the truth
now, I promise. I promise.
162
00:10:24,960 --> 00:10:27,640
She was murdered, wasn't she?
163
00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:30,960
Yes.
164
00:10:31,960 --> 00:10:33,960
By who?
165
00:10:34,960 --> 00:10:37,077
A man she knew.
166
00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:38,960
Is he in prison?
167
00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:42,717
Yeah. For killing my mam?
168
00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:43,960
No.
169
00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:47,960
But I'm fighting
to put that right.
170
00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:51,397
What do you mean?
171
00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:52,877
Well, I'm trying
to change the law
172
00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:56,960
so that your mam gets
the justice she deserves.
173
00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:01,960
And so I can help other people
in the same situation as us.
174
00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:04,960
Why did he kill her?
175
00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:08,960
I don't know, love.
176
00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:11,120
I don't think I'll ever know.
177
00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:14,960
But I'm gonna make sure
it wasn't for nothing.
178
00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:17,877
EXHALES TEARFULLY
179
00:11:17,960 --> 00:11:19,640
Come here.
180
00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:23,960
TEARFULLY: I'm sorry for lying.
181
00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:27,960
SHE SOBS
182
00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:39,877
Why haven't they replied
yet? The Law Commission?
183
00:11:39,960 --> 00:11:41,960
Yes, of course the
Law Commission.
184
00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:47,877
Sorry. It's just
been weeks, Charlie.
185
00:11:47,960 --> 00:11:49,237
Maybe they're just very busy.
186
00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:50,877
No.
187
00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:53,877
We've been fobbed off yet again.
188
00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:54,960
You don't know that.
189
00:11:56,960 --> 00:11:59,717
Maybe we should go to London.
190
00:11:59,800 --> 00:12:01,960
Get a meeting in person.
191
00:12:02,960 --> 00:12:05,237
Well, that might be easier
said than done, love.
192
00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:08,960
Well, what do you suggest?
You know I can't just give up.
193
00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:14,878
SIGHS
194
00:12:14,961 --> 00:12:17,877
I haven't the energy
any more, love.
195
00:12:17,960 --> 00:12:18,960
I'm sorry.
196
00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:23,320
Told you you should've
married someone younger.
197
00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:29,960
Charlie. What?
198
00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:34,557
Give me your hand.
No, it's fine...
199
00:12:34,640 --> 00:12:35,960
Give me it.
200
00:12:36,960 --> 00:12:38,877
Oh, darling.
201
00:12:38,960 --> 00:12:39,960
It's getting worse.
202
00:12:40,960 --> 00:12:43,557
There's no definitive
test for it,
203
00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:46,877
but based on the physical
examination and your symptoms,
204
00:12:46,960 --> 00:12:49,877
so the chronic
fatigue and tremors,
205
00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:53,397
then I'm afraid it
is highly likely.
206
00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:54,877
Thank you, doctor.
207
00:12:54,960 --> 00:12:57,877
If you have any
questions... No. Thank you.
208
00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:00,877
You've been very helpful.
209
00:13:00,960 --> 00:13:02,960
Come on. Mrs Ming.
210
00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:07,877
ANN EXHALES
211
00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:09,557
Thank you.
212
00:13:09,640 --> 00:13:10,960
Charlie, wait.
213
00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:15,800
We will get through
this, Charlie.
214
00:13:17,960 --> 00:13:21,960
What about the Law Commission?
What are you talking about?
215
00:13:22,960 --> 00:13:25,877
Everything's changed,
love. No, it hasn't.
216
00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:29,397
Yes, it has. This
is about you now.
217
00:13:29,480 --> 00:13:31,960
It's not, and nor should it be.
218
00:13:32,960 --> 00:13:34,960
Not for a good while anyway.
219
00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:45,877
I don't want you
fussing over me.
220
00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:49,000
What I want is for
you to keep fighting.
221
00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:54,877
I don't think that's true, Charlie.
But it is. You have to, Ann.
222
00:13:54,960 --> 00:13:58,877
Because otherwise, I don't
think you'll ever find peace.
223
00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:01,877
If the Law Commission have decided
double jeopardy's not a priority,
224
00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:04,877
then you need to do
whatever it takes
225
00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:07,960
to make them sit
up and take notice.
226
00:14:08,960 --> 00:14:11,480
OK? OK.
227
00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:15,160
And don't stop till
the fight is done.
228
00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:26,877
With me on the show today
is the mother of Julie Hogg,
229
00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:31,877
a young woman murdered in 1989
by a man who has escaped justice
230
00:14:31,960 --> 00:14:35,877
because of a centuries-old
law known as double jeopardy.
231
00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:39,877
Ann Ming, welcome to News Hour.
Thanks, Penny. It's good to be here.
232
00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:42,877
I should start by talking
about double jeopardy,
233
00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:45,877
which some people claim is
there to prevent endless trials
234
00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:47,077
of the same person.
235
00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:51,877
'Now, I can understand why it was
created more than 800 years ago,
236
00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:53,557
'but today, it's not
fit for purpose.'
237
00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:55,717
It shouldn't apply to someone
238
00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:57,877
who's openly boasted
about committing a murder,
239
00:14:57,960 --> 00:14:59,877
and that's exactly what
my daughter's killer did.
240
00:14:59,960 --> 00:15:03,717
He bragged about pulling
off the perfect crime.
241
00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:05,877
Now, if that's not a
reason to change the law,
242
00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:07,000
then I don't know what is.
243
00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:10,877
You've embarked on quite
a campaign, haven't you?
244
00:15:10,960 --> 00:15:12,877
'Yes. Yes, I have, Penny.
245
00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:16,877
'I'm doing newspapers and
radio, a TV documentary,
246
00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:19,160
'I'm talking to
politicians, you name it.'
247
00:15:20,960 --> 00:15:22,877
If you could follow
me, Mrs Ming.
248
00:15:22,960 --> 00:15:25,237
It must be painful, though.
249
00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:29,877
'It is. But my daughter
has been denied justice,
250
00:15:29,960 --> 00:15:31,960
'and I won't stop until
it's been rectified.'
251
00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:35,877
I hear you're also going to
be on national television
252
00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:40,557
to debate Imran Khan, the lawyer
for Stephen Lawrence's family?
253
00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:41,877
'Yes, that's right.
254
00:15:41,960 --> 00:15:44,877
'For some reason, he believes
the law should stay as it is.
255
00:15:44,960 --> 00:15:46,877
'So I'll have to change
his mind, won't I?'
256
00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:50,397
CREW MEMBER: 15 seconds.
Stand by, please.
257
00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:52,237
With all its power
and resources,
258
00:15:52,320 --> 00:15:54,557
the state shouldn't be
permitted to make repeated,
259
00:15:54,640 --> 00:15:55,877
theoretically unlimited attempts
260
00:15:55,960 --> 00:15:59,237
to convict a man when he doesn't
have the analogous resources
261
00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:00,960
to find the evidence
that clears him.
262
00:16:02,480 --> 00:16:04,480
REPORTER: Would you
agree, Mrs Ming?
263
00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:07,877
Look, well, I don't know
all these fancy words.
264
00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:10,917
I just know that the law's unfair,
and it needs to be changed.
265
00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:14,877
Look, the real problem here's
ineffectual police investigations.
266
00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:17,877
Now, without double jeopardy,
you'd just get sloppy police work
267
00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:19,877
because they'd know they
could just try again
268
00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:21,557
if things didn't go their way.
269
00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:23,877
But surely, there'd be safeguards
for... to prevent that...
270
00:16:23,960 --> 00:16:25,397
And where would that leave us?
271
00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:28,877
With an individual living in a state
of constant anxiety and insecurity,
272
00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:31,877
subjected to embarrassment,
expense and ordeal
273
00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:34,960
and the police disincentivised
to be rigorous or proficient.
274
00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:39,000
Mrs Ming?
275
00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:43,960
Er, you have a daughter,
I believe, Mr Khan?
276
00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:48,557
Yes, I do.
277
00:16:48,640 --> 00:16:50,877
Well, if your daughter
had been murdered
278
00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:53,877
and a man had confessed to
killing her in a court of law,
279
00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:55,877
would you be happy with
a perjury sentence?
280
00:16:55,960 --> 00:16:57,877
Well, legally speaking...
281
00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:00,200
No, I'm not talking as a
lawyer, I'm talking as a father.
282
00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:07,800
Well, I wouldn't say... Would you
be happy with a perjury sentence?
283
00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:12,877
Of course I wouldn't.
284
00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:13,917
You wouldn't. Well,
that says it all.
285
00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:16,397
You can stop the cameras now
because that says it all.
286
00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:18,877
He wouldn't be happy with a
perjury sentence, and we're not.
287
00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:21,237
And we'll go to the European Court
of Human Rights if we have to
288
00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:22,960
for justice for our daughter.
289
00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:25,877
BREATHES HEAVILY
290
00:17:25,960 --> 00:17:28,877
Mr Khan, Mrs Ming. Thank
you very much for your time.
291
00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:31,557
Yes, that's correct.
How can I help you?
292
00:17:31,640 --> 00:17:32,877
WOMAN: 'Is Mrs Ming there?'
293
00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:34,877
No, I'm sorry, she's
not here right now.
294
00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:35,878
Can I give her a message?
295
00:17:35,961 --> 00:17:37,877
'Oh, I'm calling from
the Law Commission.'
296
00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:39,077
Oh. 'Mr Wilkie would
like to meet her.'
297
00:17:39,160 --> 00:17:40,877
I see.
298
00:17:40,960 --> 00:17:43,877
Right, I'll be sure to
pass that on to her.
299
00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:45,960
'Thank you very much.' Ta-ra.
300
00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:50,877
That was them. Who?
301
00:17:50,960 --> 00:17:53,397
The Law Commission.
302
00:17:53,480 --> 00:17:55,960
Alan Wilkie saw the
debate on the telly.
303
00:17:57,960 --> 00:17:59,000
Says he wants to meet you.
304
00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:04,877
SHE CHUCKLES
305
00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:06,877
I'm sorry for the delay
306
00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:10,877
in responding to your thorough
and very moving letter.
307
00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:14,320
So you did read it, then? Yes.
308
00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:18,960
Let's just say you've made
yourself hard to ignore.
309
00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:22,877
We know there are several other
families around the country
310
00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:24,877
in your situation,
and we were hoping...
311
00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:27,877
35. I beg your pardon?
312
00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:32,877
Other cases, that is.
I've met most of them.
313
00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:35,960
They are just as desperate for
the law to be changed as us.
314
00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:38,877
I'll get to the point, Ann.
315
00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:42,077
Erm... We agree wholeheartedly
316
00:18:42,160 --> 00:18:45,877
that a review should
be a priority.
317
00:18:45,960 --> 00:18:47,237
Good.
318
00:18:47,320 --> 00:18:49,397
But it needs to
be retrospective.
319
00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:51,960
Otherwise, it's of
no bloody use to us.
320
00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:54,877
We'll do what we can.
321
00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:58,877
He's out in a few years, you see...
the man who murdered our Julie.
322
00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:01,877
So I hope you mean that.
323
00:19:01,960 --> 00:19:04,877
It's understandable that you're
keen to get things moving,
324
00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:06,877
especially in the
light of his appeal.
325
00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:09,717
He's appealing?
326
00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:11,960
Yes. Against his
perjury sentence?
327
00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:15,397
I'm sorry, I assumed
you'd have heard.
328
00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:16,877
Well, then...
329
00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:19,717
then that's even more reason to
get your skates on, isn't it?
330
00:19:19,800 --> 00:19:21,800
No time for messing around!
331
00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:24,878
About this appeal, Ann,
332
00:19:24,961 --> 00:19:28,877
you might consider
writing to the justices.
333
00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:30,877
We're seeing some
compelling evidence
334
00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:33,877
that something called a
victim impact statement
335
00:19:33,960 --> 00:19:35,960
can influence the court.
336
00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:38,877
I wrote one of those
for his perjury case.
337
00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:40,557
Didn't make a blind
bit of difference.
338
00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:43,877
You wrote an impact statement
for the perjury sentencing?
339
00:19:43,960 --> 00:19:46,877
Took years off my
life, it did. Why?
340
00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:48,877
No, I've read that file
from cover to cover.
341
00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:52,917
I'm sorry to say that there
was no such statement in there.
342
00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:56,877
What? But I... I handed it
in at the CPS personally.
343
00:19:56,960 --> 00:19:59,877
I can only imagine it's some
sort of bureaucratic oversight.
344
00:19:59,960 --> 00:20:02,877
Oh, for God's sake. No
wonder he only got six years!
345
00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:06,877
I was told it would play a big
role in the judge's sentencing.
346
00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:08,557
That's certainly how
it's supposed to work.
347
00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:11,077
God, it's like we
don't bloody matter!
348
00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:13,877
You must have a very low opinion
of the legal establishment.
349
00:20:13,960 --> 00:20:17,877
Honestly, Alan, it's been
like this from the start.
350
00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:18,878
The police not listening to me,
351
00:20:18,961 --> 00:20:20,877
Julie's reputation
dragged through the mud,
352
00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,960
and now no-one's bothered
to even read my statement.
353
00:20:25,960 --> 00:20:28,877
I realise you probably won't want
to write another impact statement.
354
00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:32,960
But if you do, I will make
sure that the justices read it.
355
00:20:33,960 --> 00:20:35,960
You have my word on that.
356
00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:41,480
You're writing
another one? Yeah.
357
00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:45,960
He's appealing his perjury
sentence. Oh, for...
358
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:52,960
Yeah, you haven't forgotten we're
out for Gary's birthday tonight?
359
00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:55,717
No, course not.
360
00:20:55,800 --> 00:20:58,077
A CPS courier's picking it
up from the house at 4:30.
361
00:20:58,160 --> 00:20:59,960
I'll have plenty of time.
362
00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:03,877
All right. I'll do you a coffee.
363
00:21:03,960 --> 00:21:04,960
Yeah. Thanks, love.
364
00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:10,077
TV PLAYS
365
00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:12,960
What time's the taxi
coming? 15 minutes.
366
00:21:15,640 --> 00:21:17,960
You look very nice. Thank you.
367
00:21:20,960 --> 00:21:23,877
They said they'd call to
confirm they received it.
368
00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:24,878
Hm?
369
00:21:24,961 --> 00:21:26,877
I'm gonna have to
call them, Charlie.
370
00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:28,960
KEYPAD TONES
371
00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:35,877
MAN: 'Royal Courts of Justice.'
Hello. Yeah, erm, it's Ann Ming.
372
00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:38,877
Case number 201208.
373
00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:42,800
I'm calling to check that you
received my impact statement.
374
00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:46,877
'No, we haven't received anything
for that case, I'm afraid.'
375
00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:48,877
What? No, are you sure?
376
00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:50,877
It should've been faxed
over in the last hour or so.
377
00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:53,557
'No, I can't see anything
here.' Unbelievable. All right.
378
00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:54,877
'I'll get them to
send it again.'
379
00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:56,877
Yeah, well, thanks. 'Thank you.'
380
00:21:56,960 --> 00:21:59,397
They haven't bloody
sent it. Who?
381
00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:02,717
The CPS! How hard
is it to send a fax?
382
00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:04,877
Where you going? You go ahead.
383
00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:05,878
I'll just get there when I can.
384
00:22:05,961 --> 00:22:08,877
Surely, you don't have to drive
round there? Can't you just...?
385
00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:12,877
Yes, I do! Look, I don't trust them
to do anything after the last time.
386
00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:14,877
Ann. Ann!
387
00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:17,160
Just, er, tell Gary not to
open his presents without me.
388
00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:20,960
DOOR CLOSES
389
00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:24,878
Is it finished? Sorry?
390
00:22:24,961 --> 00:22:26,877
The meeting? Excuse me,
miss, you can't go in there!
391
00:22:26,960 --> 00:22:28,877
Oh, can't I? He's in
the middle of a...
392
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:30,877
I'm sorry, sir.
We've met before.
393
00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:31,878
Excuse me. Do you remember?
394
00:22:31,961 --> 00:22:33,877
A year or so ago. Mrs Ming...
395
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:35,877
I was promised that the judge
at the perjury sentencing
396
00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:36,878
would get my victim statement.
397
00:22:36,961 --> 00:22:38,877
He never received
it. As you can see...
398
00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:40,877
And now the man who
killed my daughter
399
00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:42,877
is appealing against his
poxy six-year sentence.
400
00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:44,877
So do you know what I
did? I wrote another one.
401
00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:47,397
I went through the torture of
reliving our Julie's murder,
402
00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:50,557
and I wrote another
very detailed statement.
403
00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:52,917
A statement I was promised would be
in London before six o'clock today.
404
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:55,877
And guess what? You lot have
bloody well let me down again!
405
00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:56,878
Mrs Ming! No!
406
00:22:56,961 --> 00:23:00,877
I will call Frank Cook, Alan Wilkie,
Jack bleedin' Straw if I have to!
407
00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:02,877
I am not leaving this room
408
00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:06,000
until you call the clerk of court
in London and fax him my document!
409
00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:15,160
I think I'd listen to
Mrs Ming if I were you.
410
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:22,960
KEYPAD TONES Thank you.
411
00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:41,960
Where is everyone?
412
00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:46,960
They left already? They
waited as long as they could.
413
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:51,960
They've got their
own lives, Ann.
414
00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:56,960
I thought I'd make it.
415
00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:09,877
I didn't know what
to order, so...
416
00:24:09,960 --> 00:24:13,160
No, this is fine, thanks. Yeah.
417
00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:23,960
If it's cold, I can ask them
that... It's fine, thanks.
418
00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:35,040
I wish I could be in
two places at once.
419
00:24:36,960 --> 00:24:38,960
But you can't, Ann.
420
00:24:40,960 --> 00:24:42,160
It's not for nothing, Charlie.
421
00:24:44,320 --> 00:24:45,960
I hope you're right.
422
00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:55,877
Now, remember, it really
isn't the end of the world
423
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:58,877
if this appeal is successful
and his sentence is reduced.
424
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:00,877
Anything that puts that
man back on the streets
425
00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:02,877
is catastrophic in my book.
426
00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:04,877
Well, let's keep
everything crossed.
427
00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,877
Having considered the evidence,
428
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,237
and especially in
light of the, er...
429
00:25:11,320 --> 00:25:14,877
thorough and affecting
victim impact statement
430
00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:19,877
supplied by Mrs Ming, we are
unanimous in our judgement
431
00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:23,877
that a sentence of six years
was not manifestly excessive,
432
00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:28,397
and we do not seek to interfere
with the judge's ruling.
433
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:32,877
And consequently, we dismiss
the appeal against the sentence.
434
00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:35,877
EXHALES
435
00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:36,960
Thank goodness for that.
436
00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:40,877
So, what happens next,
about double jeopardy?
437
00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:42,877
Well, that's a small matter
438
00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:45,077
of unpicking 800 years
of legal history.
439
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:48,877
But, you know, it's in the
hands of the Home Secretary
440
00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:50,877
and the Lord Chancellor now.
441
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:53,877
They have our report, and they'll
give it their consideration.
442
00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:56,960
How long will that take?
Shouldn't be too long.
443
00:25:58,960 --> 00:25:59,960
Right.
444
00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:07,877
Thanks for coming with me. I
wouldn't miss it for anything.
445
00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:09,877
I know it's not easy for you.
446
00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:14,960
You know, it will be quite
something if they overturn the law.
447
00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:20,717
Well, unless it's retrospective,
it's all been for nothing.
448
00:26:20,800 --> 00:26:21,877
No.
449
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:25,320
Whatever happens,
you've done her proud.
450
00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:30,960
Government white paper,
and all because of you.
451
00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:33,960
We best get going. Aye.
452
00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:38,877
Right, you look after
Angela for us, won't you?
453
00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:40,877
Mwah. Got everything.
454
00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:43,237
I wanna come too.
455
00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:45,877
Oh, no, darling, I don't
think that's a good idea.
456
00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:47,960
Why not? Why
shouldn't I be there?
457
00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:51,960
I wanna be there to support you.
458
00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:57,960
And for my mam.
459
00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:04,877
I'm just... I'm getting nervous
now. Ah, don't be nervous.
460
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:06,237
Does my hair look all
right in this wind?
461
00:27:06,320 --> 00:27:07,877
Your hair looks great.
You look very nice.
462
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:09,877
It's blowing everywhere.
You look very nice.
463
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:12,877
REPORTERS CLAMOUR
464
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:13,960
No.
465
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:16,480
Thank you.
466
00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:19,877
Hello.
467
00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:21,557
Hello. My name's Ann
Ming. I'm here...
468
00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:23,960
This is for you, Mrs
Ming. Oh, thank you.
469
00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:28,917
GASPS
470
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:31,877
Oh, God, it's retrospective!
471
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:33,877
The double jeopardy
law's being overturned,
472
00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:35,877
and it's gonna be retrospective.
473
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:36,878
Oh, I can't believe it.
474
00:27:36,961 --> 00:27:38,877
REPORTER: It's a monumental
moment for you, Ann.
475
00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:40,877
It is, yeah. I'm shaking. God!
476
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,877
I just can't believe
it. ANN LAUGHS
477
00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:45,960
REPORTERS CHATTER
478
00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:49,877
Well, I suppose the lesson is...
479
00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:52,877
being a bloody-minded pain in
the arse can pay off sometimes.
480
00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:55,237
MARK LAUGHS Yes.
481
00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:57,960
Here's to you. Frank! Hiya. Aw.
482
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:00,877
Sorry I couldn't be there.
483
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:04,717
But you probably heard me cheering
from the other end of the A1.
484
00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:06,917
Do you know Mark Braithwaite?
He's another one of the good guys.
485
00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:10,877
Nice to meet you, Mark.
Likewise. Take a seat.
486
00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:12,877
Without fellas like you, we'd
never have achieved what we have.
487
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:14,960
Well, we're not quite there yet.
488
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:17,877
Which is not to say we
shouldn't celebrate.
489
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:20,717
You've got to recognise
your victories
490
00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:21,877
along the way, haven't you?
491
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:24,877
Well, I... I mean, I know it
needs to be debated, but I...
492
00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:26,877
From what I understand, after
a bit of back and forth,
493
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:28,877
it is likely to get
the votes, isn't it?
494
00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:30,877
In the Commons, yes.
495
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:32,877
But remember, the Lords
is a different matter.
496
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:34,877
There you go. Thanks.
497
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:38,877
They're a bunch of old
conservative white men in the main.
498
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:43,557
They're not generally keen on
dismantling ancient English laws.
499
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:45,960
Well, do you think
they'll block it?
500
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:48,917
I won't lie.
501
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:50,960
I think it'll be
tough to get through.
502
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:55,717
Well, who do I talk
to? About what?
503
00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:58,480
Speaking to the Lords.
Would they allow it?
504
00:28:59,960 --> 00:29:01,397
It's very unconventional.
505
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:03,877
But it is allowed?
You'd really do that?
506
00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:05,877
Make a speech to the Lords?
507
00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:08,717
Can you help me or not?
508
00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:10,557
HE SCOFFS
509
00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:13,877
I know Lord Falconer a
little. Let me speak to him.
510
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:14,917
Thanks.
511
00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:17,877
Don't screw it up.
I'll try not to.
512
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:19,960
Good luck with
that. FRANK CHUCKLES
513
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:30,960
Safe and sober or
bold and red? Hmm.
514
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:34,960
I'd play it safe if I were you.
515
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:37,877
Are you sure you don't
wanna come with me?
516
00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:38,960
I'd love to.
517
00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:41,960
I just...
518
00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:45,877
Right.
519
00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:47,877
Now some shoes.
520
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:50,320
You'll look great
whatever you wear.
521
00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:00,960
MAN: Good morning.
522
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:10,877
This must all seem rather
grand to you, but don't worry.
523
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:12,877
The committee room
isn't quite as medieval.
524
00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:13,878
MAN: Morning. Morning.
525
00:30:13,961 --> 00:30:17,557
MAN: Morning. Morning?
It's 2:30 in the afternoon.
526
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:19,877
Well, it's always morning
here until the House sits.
527
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:22,877
One of our little
conventions. BELL RINGS
528
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,237
Now, when we vote, we
queue in two lines,
529
00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:29,877
either the content or
the not-content corridor,
530
00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:33,237
and we are counted off by
a peer holding a drumstick.
531
00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:34,960
Musical or chicken?
532
00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:38,877
HE CHUCKLES Right, here we are.
533
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:42,877
You ready? Er... yeah.
534
00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:44,877
You do have a speech, don't you?
535
00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:46,877
I've made some notes, but I
don't think I'll need them.
536
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:49,877
Mrs Ming, these are some
of the most powerful
537
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:51,877
and respected people
in the country.
538
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:54,960
I have seen seasoned
speakers go completely dry.
539
00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:59,877
Look, I may not be
hoity-toity like you lot,
540
00:30:59,960 --> 00:31:01,960
but I know what I wanna say.
541
00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:06,160
I've had 13 years
to think about it.
542
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:09,160
All right. All right.
543
00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:14,877
My most noble and learned Lords,
544
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:18,877
may I introduce
my guest today...
545
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:21,877
Mrs Ann Ming, who'll
be talking to us
546
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:23,877
with regards to the
Criminal Justice Bill,
547
00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:25,877
specifically part 10,
548
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:29,877
which concerns the so-called
double jeopardy rule.
549
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:31,960
LORDS CHATTER
550
00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:34,877
Thank you.
551
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:36,960
ANN CLEARS THROAT
552
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:43,877
My Lords and Ladies, erm...
553
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:48,237
thank you most humbly for,
erm, letting me speak today.
554
00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:50,960
I'll try not to take up
too much of your time.
555
00:31:54,960 --> 00:31:57,557
On November 16th, 1989,
556
00:31:57,640 --> 00:31:59,960
our eldest daughter,
Julie, went missing.
557
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:04,397
The police, when
I spoke to them...
558
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:06,877
We hadn't seen her, you
see, since the previous day,
559
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:09,877
and she was due in court in
Stockton the next morning...
560
00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:10,960
Speak up.
561
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:15,917
SHE CLEARS THROAT
562
00:32:16,000 --> 00:32:17,877
Anyway, I had a gut...
563
00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:20,877
a gut feeling that something
dreadful had happened to her.
564
00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:25,960
The police spent a week searching
her home, and they found nothing.
565
00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:41,960
Look, I'm gonna tell you how
it feels to lose a child.
566
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:46,000
And how it feels to
be shafted by the law.
567
00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:51,960
There have been two moments
of deep trauma in my life.
568
00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:57,960
One was the moment I found my
daughter's body under the bath.
569
00:32:59,960 --> 00:33:02,640
13 years later, I
still have nightmares.
570
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:05,877
The second was the moment
571
00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:08,960
I had to watch my daughter's
murderer walk free.
572
00:33:12,960 --> 00:33:16,640
Nobody here will ever,
ever know how that feels.
573
00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:21,960
Trusting the state to bring
you justice and peace...
574
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:27,397
...only to find yourself
marginalised and betrayed.
575
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:29,877
For you, the law is just
something you make for others
576
00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:32,877
in this ivory tower with
your inherited privileges.
577
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:34,877
But for me, it's a cancer.
578
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:38,917
For the last 13 years, I have
fought to get justice for Julie.
579
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:42,877
I've had to deal with
rank police incompetence,
580
00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:44,877
two mistrials, two
home secretaries
581
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:48,877
and a CPS who didn't even
seem to care about us victims.
582
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:50,000
On top of all that...
583
00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:52,877
...I had to figure out a way
584
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:55,960
of telling my grandson what
happened to his mammy...
585
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:00,877
...and how to keep
my marriage together
586
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,877
when me and my husband,
Charlie, were drowning in grief.
587
00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:04,960
EXHALES
588
00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:08,877
No, look, I don't want
your sympathy, I just...
589
00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:09,878
I just need you to listen.
590
00:34:09,961 --> 00:34:12,877
If someone is sent
to prison for a crime
591
00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:15,877
and new evidence proves that
they were innocent all along,
592
00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:18,877
well, it's only right that
they should walk free.
593
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:22,877
Well, surely, it should work
the other way round, too.
594
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:24,877
If someone is acquitted
595
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:27,877
and new evidence proves that
they were guilty all along,
596
00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:29,960
well, then they should
take the rap for it.
597
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:34,877
Look, I'm not...
598
00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:38,960
I'm not interested in
revenge or even compensation.
599
00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:43,877
I just want the man who
took our little girl from us
600
00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:45,000
to pay for his crime.
601
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:51,960
Our daughter's right to
life was stolen from her.
602
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:55,877
The only way we can get justice
603
00:34:55,960 --> 00:34:58,960
is by changing the double
jeopardy law retrospectively.
604
00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:02,960
LORDS: Hear, hear.
605
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:08,960
Thank you.
606
00:35:26,000 --> 00:35:27,960
Fancy seeing you here.
607
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:31,557
I'm here all the time.
608
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:33,877
You are? I didn't know that.
609
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:35,960
There's a lot you
don't know, Mam.
610
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:41,877
I don't think I've got the energy
to keep on fighting, you know.
611
00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:44,237
If the Lords block it...
612
00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:46,000
SHE EXHALES DEEPLY
613
00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:50,877
Do you ever see her? Who?
614
00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:52,000
Our Julie.
615
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:57,160
I miss her so much. SHE SIGHS
616
00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:00,877
I don't care...
who she was with,
617
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:03,077
what she went through
in her private life.
618
00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:04,877
I just...
619
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:06,960
I just wish I could tell
her that I love her.
620
00:36:11,960 --> 00:36:13,960
Mam. What?
621
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:18,960
I miss her too.
622
00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:22,960
But I think you need
to move on, Mam.
623
00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:26,960
I think you need to let her go.
624
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:30,960
What do you mean?
625
00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:35,960
I'm saying, Mam, that you've
got two living children.
626
00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:40,960
Gary, love... Bye, Mam.
627
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:54,237
DOOR CLOSES
628
00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:56,877
Where have you been? Huh?
629
00:36:56,960 --> 00:37:00,077
We've been waiting for
hours! Who's been waiting?
630
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:02,237
Well, come and see. What?
631
00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:03,960
Through here, love.
632
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:06,877
SHE CHUCKLES Frank.
633
00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:08,877
It's my birthday today.
634
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:12,877
And it's the best one
I've ever had. BOTTLE POPS
635
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:13,960
Congratulations.
636
00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:19,960
The bill's gone through, love.
It's got through the Lords.
637
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:22,960
And it's retrospective.
638
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:26,877
What? It is true, Ann.
639
00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:28,877
SHE MUMBLES Really?
640
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:30,397
We've done it.
641
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:32,877
You've done it.
642
00:37:32,960 --> 00:37:33,917
SHE SOBS
643
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:36,960
Really, has it
happened? Oh, God.
644
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:42,877
Oh, my God, I can't
believe it. It's over.
645
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:45,877
Oh, no, really? Yeah.
646
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:47,397
SHE SOBS
647
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:49,877
TEARFULLY: Charlie, we did
it. No, you did it. You did.
648
00:37:49,960 --> 00:37:51,557
We did.
649
00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:53,877
Oh, God, it's all over.
650
00:37:53,960 --> 00:37:55,877
We've won.
651
00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:58,877
SHE SOBS We did it.
652
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:00,960
You did it, it was all you.
653
00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:06,917
My government will continue
to make the reduction of crime
654
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:09,877
and the fear of
crime a priority.
655
00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:13,877
The government will be implementing
the Criminal Justice Act
656
00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:15,877
to ensure the
effective punishment
657
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:18,877
of dangerous and
persistent offenders.
658
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:21,397
REPORTER: It took the High
Court only a matter of minutes
659
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:24,877
to quash the original
acquittal of October 1991,
660
00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:27,877
opening the door to
today's historic retrial
661
00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:31,877
in the case of Julie Hogg's
murder. REPORTERS CLAMOUR
662
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:33,877
Mrs Ming, do you think
they'll let him off the hook?
663
00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:35,877
What do you mean, "let
him off the hook"?
664
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:38,877
Well, the judge might decide
he's spent long enough in prison.
665
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:39,878
He's done nearly ten years.
666
00:38:39,961 --> 00:38:42,960
What does she mean by
that? Let's get you inside.
667
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:45,877
In deciding your sentence,
668
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:48,877
I have borne in mind
your guilty plea,
669
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,397
which has saved Julie
Hogg's family and friends
670
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:53,917
from enduring a further trial.
671
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:58,397
Before I come to sentence you,
I should like to read an extract
672
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:01,877
from Mrs Ming's
impact statement,
673
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:05,877
a harrowing and moving account
674
00:39:05,960 --> 00:39:07,960
of the harm you have
done to the family.
675
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:14,877
"As a family, we are
damaged beyond repair"
676
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:19,960
"and will never be the same again
as Julie will never return home."
677
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:24,717
"The love we feel for Julie
678
00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:29,717
"means it is we who are
serving the life sentence.
679
00:39:29,800 --> 00:39:34,877
"Julie's son, Kevin, has
missed out on a mother's love."
680
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:37,237
"He has missed out
on a childhood."
681
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:40,960
"All he has left of her
are a few photographs."
682
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:49,960
Notwithstanding
your guilty plea...
683
00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:55,877
...I have seen no evidence of
genuine contrition on your part
684
00:39:55,960 --> 00:39:58,960
as opposed to
evident self-pity...
685
00:40:00,480 --> 00:40:04,557
...and attempts by you
to avoid or minimise
686
00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:06,960
the proper consequences
of what you have done.
687
00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:12,877
Those consequences are that
on the count of murder,
688
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:14,877
you will be imprisoned for life
689
00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:18,877
with a minimum
tariff of 17 years.
690
00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:19,960
Mm.
691
00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:22,960
Take him down.
692
00:40:41,960 --> 00:40:44,877
REPORTER: Ann! Ann!
693
00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:47,877
I... I just can't believe
what's happened today.
694
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,877
I can't believe that we've finally
got justice for our daughter.
695
00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:51,878
I'd, erm...
696
00:40:51,961 --> 00:40:54,877
Mrs Ming, this is the first
person in Britain to be convicted
697
00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:57,557
of a crime for which they'd
previously been acquitted.
698
00:40:57,640 --> 00:40:59,877
It's historic, isn't it?
699
00:40:59,960 --> 00:41:01,960
Yeah, I suppose. Suppose
it is, really, yeah.
700
00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:06,877
Sorry, it's not often
that I'm speechless.
701
00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:10,877
Your campaign, it has taken
up so much of your life.
702
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:12,960
What will you do now?
703
00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:16,960
Erm, more line
dancing, probably.
704
00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:21,877
Ann, I don't think you realise
quite what you've achieved.
705
00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:23,877
Don't be daft.
706
00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:27,877
To overturn one of the most
established legal principles
707
00:41:27,960 --> 00:41:29,717
in Western democracy.
708
00:41:29,800 --> 00:41:32,877
People talk about
speaking truth to power.
709
00:41:32,960 --> 00:41:35,877
Well, you've made history today.
710
00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:38,877
I just hope he never gets out.
711
00:41:38,960 --> 00:41:41,877
You've ignited a debate
around the world.
712
00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:44,237
Every country with
double jeopardy laws
713
00:41:44,320 --> 00:41:47,640
has been watching us
very closely indeed.
714
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:51,877
Here, Mark's got us another round
to celebrate. You deserve that.
715
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:53,717
It's the least we deserve.
716
00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:55,877
To Ann! MEN: To Ann.
717
00:41:55,960 --> 00:41:56,960
Cheers.
718
00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:00,960
COUNTRY POP MUSIC PLAYS
719
00:42:09,960 --> 00:42:11,877
Do people do this sober?
720
00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:14,960
Nothing to be worried about.
721
00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:19,877
I'm getting a drink. A
large one. What do you want?
722
00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:21,960
Whatever they've got.
723
00:42:25,960 --> 00:42:29,077
♪ This used to be my heart
724
00:42:29,160 --> 00:42:31,397
♪ I was torn apart
725
00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:34,557
♪ And I'm fading
726
00:42:34,640 --> 00:42:36,877
♪ Deeper in my soul
727
00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:39,877
♪ Blackening, so cold
728
00:42:39,960 --> 00:42:44,320
♪ I'm fading away. ♪
729
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:20,800
LAUGHS TEARFULLY
730
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:40,960
Queue was too long. I'll
go back in a few minutes.
731
00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:44,877
What's wrong? Is everything OK?
732
00:43:44,960 --> 00:43:48,077
MAN: 'All right, everyone, are we
all ready? Grab your favourite...'
733
00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:50,877
You all right? '..pair of
cowboy boots, it's time.'
734
00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:52,917
Yeah. I'm OK. 'A-five, six...'
735
00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:54,077
I'm OK.
736
00:43:54,160 --> 00:43:55,877
'A-five, six, seven,
eight.' You sure?
737
00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:57,877
COUNTRY POP MUSIC PLAYS
738
00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:00,877
I love you. Gosh, that's nice.
739
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:01,878
Oh, it's starting.
740
00:44:01,961 --> 00:44:03,877
Bloody hell, is that
it? Let's have a go.
741
00:44:03,960 --> 00:44:06,877
♪ Out on the road for sunrise
742
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:09,877
♪ Another town left behind
743
00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:13,397
♪ Opened up the throttle
On this old big rig
744
00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:15,877
♪ And tried to make
up A little time
745
00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:18,877
♪ If I can drop
this load off early
746
00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:22,557
♪ I'll pick another
one up tonight
747
00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:25,877
♪ Make it to the woods And
keep the end of the road
748
00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:27,877
♪ Only just out of sight
749
00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:29,877
♪ I'ma clicking those miles... ♪
750
00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:32,877
Oh, you came! I can't
believe that you came.
751
00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:34,877
All right, Dad? Hi, Dad.
752
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:36,877
Hiya, Mam, all right?
753
00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:38,877
I think I need my head
checking. Come on, it'll be fun.
754
00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:40,960
Come on.
755
00:44:41,960 --> 00:44:43,877
You know the moves, Mam!
756
00:44:43,960 --> 00:44:46,877
♪ Everything's all right
757
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:51,877
♪ And I always keep
The end of the road
758
00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:52,878
♪ Just out of sight
759
00:44:52,961 --> 00:44:55,917
♪ I'ma clicking those miles
760
00:44:56,000 --> 00:44:57,877
♪ There ain't no
reason To count... ♪
761
00:44:57,960 --> 00:44:59,960
MUSIC FADES
762
00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:56,960
APPLAUSE
763
00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:10,960
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