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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:08,239 --> 00:00:11,760 You can't understand modern Ireland without first 2 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:13,360 understanding our history. 3 00:00:15,919 --> 00:00:19,639 Fifty years ago, the nation said its final farewell 4 00:00:19,680 --> 00:00:21,000 to Éamon de Valera. 5 00:00:25,400 --> 00:00:28,599 From his emergence in the run-up to the Easter Rising, 6 00:00:28,760 --> 00:00:33,400 until his death in 1975, he had come to personify 7 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:36,120 Ireland's difficult journey to independence. 8 00:00:37,879 --> 00:00:41,199 The State Funeral was an opportunity to pay respects 9 00:00:41,480 --> 00:00:45,400 to a leader who left an indelible mark on our national story. 10 00:00:47,080 --> 00:00:50,879 A leader whose legacy to this day still divides the jury. 11 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:55,559 His capacity to bend expectation to his will and bring the public 12 00:00:55,599 --> 00:00:57,360 with him was absolutely superb. 13 00:00:57,680 --> 00:01:00,199 His actions caused a lot of Irish deaths, 14 00:01:00,239 --> 00:01:01,919 a lot of needless brutality. 15 00:01:02,480 --> 00:01:04,360 He was a great statesman. 16 00:01:04,559 --> 00:01:09,639 A man who embedded a very reactive, conservative state. 17 00:01:09,959 --> 00:01:13,000 His willingness to serve Ireland, making a society where 18 00:01:13,040 --> 00:01:14,519 there is religious liberties. 19 00:01:14,680 --> 00:01:18,160 It's hard to know whether he was a force for good or evil. 20 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:22,120 ♪ (music builds) 21 00:01:23,239 --> 00:01:25,199 He had a meteoric rise through 22 00:01:25,239 --> 00:01:27,400 the ranks of Irish nationalism... (gunshots) 23 00:01:27,440 --> 00:01:29,720 and then ruled as the dominant figure 24 00:01:29,760 --> 00:01:31,639 in our 20th century history. 25 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:36,800 But are we still living in De Valera's Ireland? 26 00:01:36,839 --> 00:01:40,279 ♪ (dramatic music) 27 00:01:46,519 --> 00:01:48,199 ♪ (rippling piano music) 28 00:01:53,559 --> 00:01:56,080 Decoding Dev is no easy task. 29 00:01:57,160 --> 00:01:59,760 Plenty of people have had a go, myself included. 30 00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:04,680 I spent a few years of my life in this library, 31 00:02:04,720 --> 00:02:07,519 researching and writing a two-volume biography about 32 00:02:07,559 --> 00:02:09,319 the man they called The Chief. 33 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:14,120 As part of my research, I asked people to tell me the first word 34 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:16,959 that sprang to mind when they heard the name Éamon de Valera, 35 00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:19,400 and the results were a bit surprising. 36 00:02:20,959 --> 00:02:24,199 At the time of his death, De Valera's reputation seemed 37 00:02:24,239 --> 00:02:27,800 unassailable, but 50 years later, a much more critical 38 00:02:27,839 --> 00:02:29,080 view has taken root. 39 00:02:31,279 --> 00:02:34,000 But between hagiography and hatchet job, 40 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:35,760 where lies the history? 41 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:38,160 ♪ (calm piano music, film reel clicking) 42 00:02:55,080 --> 00:02:56,959 To tell this tale, we need to go 43 00:02:57,000 --> 00:02:58,239 back to the very beginning. 44 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:07,680 Éamon de Valera's story begins when his mother, Kate Coll, 45 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:12,559 left rural Limerick for a fresh start in Manhattan in 1878. 46 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:18,160 She was one of millions of people who sailed into New York 47 00:03:18,279 --> 00:03:19,879 looking for a better life. 48 00:03:26,040 --> 00:03:28,400 She found work as a domestic servant, 49 00:03:28,440 --> 00:03:30,760 and in late 1882, 50 00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:33,639 while living in the shadow of Grand Central Station, 51 00:03:33,839 --> 00:03:37,919 she gave birth to a child who would reshape Irish history. 52 00:03:41,120 --> 00:03:44,959 Six weeks later, he was baptised in the local church. 53 00:03:59,519 --> 00:04:01,360 So we have to find the years. 54 00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:03,720 Okay. This should be it. 55 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:08,639 These are all the records from '82. 56 00:04:11,959 --> 00:04:14,639 It should be here somewhere. Yeah, see? 57 00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:15,919 There it is! Okay, there he is, yeah! 58 00:04:15,959 --> 00:04:18,120 As you can see, the name is Edward, 59 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:19,919 which is obviously English. 60 00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:21,680 It was changed to Eamon. 61 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:23,480 In the actual book? Yeah. 62 00:04:27,720 --> 00:04:31,720 And his surname is down as De Valeros... Yeah. "o s". 63 00:04:31,800 --> 00:04:33,879 Yes. And that's been corrected as well, to De Valera. Yes. 64 00:04:33,959 --> 00:04:37,360 Is it usual for records to be corrected like that, 65 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:41,040 or just if you... When they have some kind of 66 00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:42,800 information that is not correct 67 00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:45,599 in a record, if it's a direct relative 68 00:04:45,639 --> 00:04:47,879 of somebody, then they usually would change it. 69 00:04:47,919 --> 00:04:49,279 They will correct it, yeah. Yeah. Okay. 70 00:04:50,279 --> 00:04:51,279 So... Well, thank you very much. 71 00:04:51,319 --> 00:04:53,639 Oh, you're very welcome. Yes. (laughs) 72 00:04:55,199 --> 00:04:58,080 A misspelt surname is certainly a little odd. 73 00:04:58,440 --> 00:05:01,680 Maybe the official records in the New York City Archives 74 00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:03,000 could shed more light. 75 00:05:03,319 --> 00:05:07,839 They contain millions of documents dating back to the early 1600s. 76 00:05:08,639 --> 00:05:10,120 Given the scale of the material 77 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:11,639 you have here, you must have something 78 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:12,879 on Éamon de Valera. 79 00:05:12,919 --> 00:05:14,519 I think, yes, we do, 80 00:05:14,559 --> 00:05:17,919 and I was able to locate the certificate... 81 00:05:17,959 --> 00:05:20,559 Wow! 352241, and here it is. 82 00:05:20,599 --> 00:05:23,720 Wow. So we have a State of New York birth return. 83 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:26,639 This is the actual original... Sorry, I... 84 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:28,319 (laughs) That's so cool. 85 00:05:28,959 --> 00:05:31,959 Name of child: George De Valero. 86 00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:34,839 Hmm. Okay. 87 00:05:35,239 --> 00:05:39,720 Vivian De Valero, Kate De Valero, but "maiden name Kate Coll." 88 00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:42,080 So that is exactly as we would expect it. 89 00:05:42,199 --> 00:05:44,639 Birthplace: Ireland, birthplace of father: Spain, 90 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:45,919 father is an artist. 91 00:05:47,080 --> 00:05:49,879 There doesn't seem to be any suggestion 92 00:05:49,919 --> 00:05:52,680 that Kate and Vivian are 93 00:05:52,720 --> 00:05:54,279 anything other than a married couple. 94 00:05:54,319 --> 00:05:55,440 I don't think they even asked the question. 95 00:05:55,480 --> 00:05:57,199 They just said "Who's the name of the mother? 96 00:05:57,239 --> 00:05:58,319 Who's the name of the father?" 97 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:00,680 They write it down on the form, and that was that. 98 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:03,239 The fact that the first name is incorrect. 99 00:06:03,319 --> 00:06:06,639 She said subsequently that she originally wanted 100 00:06:06,680 --> 00:06:07,720 to call the child George. 101 00:06:07,760 --> 00:06:09,800 She changed her mind and gave him the name Edward. 102 00:06:09,839 --> 00:06:12,000 So it's a little bit odd? 103 00:06:12,120 --> 00:06:13,120 A little bit odd, yes. 104 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:15,760 A lot of mysteries, shall we say. 105 00:06:15,959 --> 00:06:17,599 There is a correction. Oh. 106 00:06:17,639 --> 00:06:19,160 This is a very unusual situation. 107 00:06:19,599 --> 00:06:21,800 There's a second birth certificate. Okay. 108 00:06:22,040 --> 00:06:23,040 Same number. 109 00:06:23,559 --> 00:06:27,800 And as you can see, it says there, "corrected certificate". 110 00:06:27,959 --> 00:06:32,160 Okay. So "Edward de Valera" with a lowercase d 111 00:06:32,239 --> 00:06:34,120 and finishing with an a. 112 00:06:34,519 --> 00:06:38,040 This second version is signed by Catherine Wheelwright, 113 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:39,160 as she was by this stage. 114 00:06:39,199 --> 00:06:41,400 So this is De Valera's mother. Oh! Has remarried a man 115 00:06:41,440 --> 00:06:42,879 called Charles Wheelwright. 116 00:06:42,959 --> 00:06:46,360 The details are the same, October 14, 1882. 117 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:49,040 The date of the corrected certificate 118 00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:51,839 is June the 30th, 1916. 119 00:06:51,959 --> 00:06:54,680 In 1916, De Valera was involved in the Easter Rising. 120 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:56,160 He was sentenced to death. 121 00:06:56,199 --> 00:06:59,160 So we know that his mother campaigned on his behalf 122 00:06:59,199 --> 00:07:01,199 in the United States. Okay. That explains 123 00:07:01,239 --> 00:07:03,879 why she's looking for the corrected version at this time. 124 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:07,360 It doesn't explain why the original version is incorrect. 125 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:12,639 Dr. Murray, you can see his signature there. 126 00:07:12,680 --> 00:07:15,760 He is not the man who filled out this part of the certificate. 127 00:07:16,879 --> 00:07:18,080 Handwriting is different. 128 00:07:19,879 --> 00:07:21,040 Quite like that, though, isn't it? 129 00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:24,839 Now that you say that... Huh. 130 00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:28,120 So it looks 131 00:07:28,160 --> 00:07:30,639 very similar to Catherine Wheelwright... 132 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:33,120 Yeah! Or Kate Coll or Kate De Valera's handwriting, 133 00:07:33,160 --> 00:07:34,959 doesn't it? It does, doesn't it? 134 00:07:35,279 --> 00:07:36,599 She filled out 135 00:07:36,639 --> 00:07:38,639 the original birth return, 136 00:07:38,680 --> 00:07:40,120 and then it was signed by Dr. Murray. 137 00:07:42,000 --> 00:07:44,160 It's all a bit unusual, isn't it? 138 00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:46,080 I agree. I've seen 139 00:07:46,160 --> 00:07:48,760 many, many birth certificates, and this 140 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:51,199 is an exceptional situation. It truly is. 141 00:07:53,919 --> 00:07:57,199 Kate Coll always said that the father of her child was 142 00:07:57,239 --> 00:08:00,680 Vivian De Valera, an artist who fell into ill health 143 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:02,879 and died when his son was just 2. 144 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:08,599 The search for the Spanish side of De Valera's story brings me 145 00:08:08,639 --> 00:08:11,239 across the Hudson River to New Jersey. 146 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:15,160 This is where Kate Coll says she married Vivian De Valera 147 00:08:15,199 --> 00:08:18,000 on the 19th of September, 1881. 148 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:21,040 The only problem is there's no record of that marriage here 149 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:23,839 in this church, or in any Catholic church in New Jersey, 150 00:08:23,879 --> 00:08:27,040 or in any Catholic church across the river in New York City. 151 00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:28,959 And the absent marriage certificate 152 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:30,959 isn't the only bit of missing paperwork. 153 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:35,080 There is no record of Vivian de Valera entering the United States. 154 00:08:35,199 --> 00:08:37,839 He's not mentioned in any US census, 155 00:08:37,879 --> 00:08:39,599 and there's no record of his death. 156 00:08:39,839 --> 00:08:42,279 As far as the official record goes, 157 00:08:42,319 --> 00:08:44,400 it's almost as if he didn't exist. 158 00:08:55,959 --> 00:08:58,959 You might ask, does it matter if his parents were really married? 159 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:01,279 Does it matter who his father really was? 160 00:09:01,360 --> 00:09:03,519 But the point is, it mattered to him. 161 00:09:03,559 --> 00:09:05,199 It shaped his character. 162 00:09:05,400 --> 00:09:07,559 And so did his mother's decision to send him, 163 00:09:07,599 --> 00:09:10,000 aged just two and a half, back to Ireland to be 164 00:09:10,040 --> 00:09:11,440 raised by his grandmother. 165 00:09:15,879 --> 00:09:19,760 The doubts about his paternity and his rejection by his mother 166 00:09:19,879 --> 00:09:22,519 left him with questions about his identity, 167 00:09:22,559 --> 00:09:25,480 which would preoccupy him throughout his long life. 168 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:29,279 His uncertain start meant that Bruree in County Limerick 169 00:09:29,319 --> 00:09:30,839 was where he he'd call home. 170 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:35,559 I was born on the 29th of April, 1927. 171 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:41,360 I'm 98 years, but I feel young, and I would advise everyone, 172 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:43,559 go dancing! (both laugh) 173 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:48,839 So Mary, this is where Éamon de Valera, grew up, 174 00:09:48,879 --> 00:09:51,120 and it was a fairly tough upbringing, wasn't it? 175 00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:52,760 It was very, very hard. 176 00:09:52,919 --> 00:09:55,239 I don't know how he survived it. 177 00:09:57,519 --> 00:10:01,959 Unfortunately, the grandmother died when she was only aged 50. 178 00:10:02,239 --> 00:10:05,000 So he was left then with his uncle Pat, 179 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:08,000 who was a very, very strict man. 180 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:10,160 They were very poor. 181 00:10:10,199 --> 00:10:12,599 Actually, my father gave them some land. 182 00:10:12,680 --> 00:10:14,319 That was what they were depending on. 183 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:16,599 They had two or three cows. 184 00:10:18,239 --> 00:10:20,080 De Valera, then, as he grew up, 185 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:22,400 he did every kind of a job in the farm, 186 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:25,639 raking the hay, cutting the hay, cleaning out the hen house, 187 00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:27,120 and look after the cows. 188 00:10:27,160 --> 00:10:28,959 And when they would be milking the cows, 189 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:30,400 he would be reading books. 190 00:10:30,440 --> 00:10:32,199 He was always reading books. 191 00:10:32,519 --> 00:10:34,919 He always enjoyed coming back to Bruree. 192 00:10:35,040 --> 00:10:37,879 Loved it. He was happy when he came back. 193 00:10:37,959 --> 00:10:40,959 He said to me one time, "Oh," he said, "Mary, 194 00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:43,639 I would love to go back to that little home." 195 00:10:43,839 --> 00:10:46,760 And he said "Sit at the fire and read a book." 196 00:10:46,919 --> 00:10:48,879 He said "Mary, that's what I would love." 197 00:10:51,959 --> 00:10:55,839 Whatever it was about this place, it made his character 198 00:10:56,279 --> 00:10:58,239 because he's unique. 199 00:10:58,720 --> 00:10:59,879 Where did he get it? 200 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:01,160 He got it from here. 201 00:11:05,120 --> 00:11:08,879 De Valera loved to romanticise his childhood here in Bruree 202 00:11:08,919 --> 00:11:10,879 once he'd left the place far behind him. 203 00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:13,279 But when he lived here, he wanted to get out. 204 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:15,760 His mother escaped through the emigrant ship. 205 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:18,000 His exit was through education. 206 00:11:18,199 --> 00:11:20,239 ♪ (electronic music) 207 00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:24,599 (gulls crying) 208 00:11:24,680 --> 00:11:27,279 An obvious flair for the books caught the eye 209 00:11:27,319 --> 00:11:30,239 of the local parish priest who arranged a scholarship 210 00:11:30,279 --> 00:11:31,639 to Blackrock College. 211 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:34,360 (rugby crowd chanting) About to turn 16, De Valera moved 212 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:36,879 from Limerick to Dublin, a short distance, 213 00:11:36,959 --> 00:11:38,400 but a million miles away 214 00:11:38,440 --> 00:11:39,919 from the world he knew. 215 00:11:39,959 --> 00:11:42,000 (crowd chanting) 216 00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:49,160 So Paul, you have the advantage over me 217 00:11:49,199 --> 00:11:51,800 'cause you actually had a face-to-face encounter with Dev. 218 00:11:52,360 --> 00:11:54,599 Well, I saw him lying in state, David, it was 219 00:11:54,639 --> 00:11:57,879 the year I turned five, queued for what seemed like hours. 220 00:11:57,919 --> 00:11:59,279 And I whinged the whole way through, 221 00:11:59,319 --> 00:12:00,319 but having seen the body, 222 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:02,440 I wanted to go back and queue again. 223 00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:04,199 It was... it's one of my earliest memories. 224 00:12:04,639 --> 00:12:07,839 (crowd cheering, feet stamping) 225 00:12:07,879 --> 00:12:11,279 Blackrock College, a very elite sort of an establishment. 226 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:13,080 Really not what you'd expect for de Valera. 227 00:12:13,160 --> 00:12:14,639 Blackrock is a launching pad 228 00:12:14,680 --> 00:12:16,360 which defined the rest of his life. 229 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:19,639 He wanted to rise up out of poverty into the middle classes, 230 00:12:19,919 --> 00:12:23,720 and he used education as the conduit to do that. 231 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:25,559 (crowd cheering and clapping) 232 00:12:26,639 --> 00:12:30,519 And this is a guy who has lacked emotional support 233 00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:32,239 in both places he'd lived previously. 234 00:12:32,599 --> 00:12:36,239 He spoke always of a loneliness in Bruree, and all the while, 235 00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:38,680 there's New York, where his mother is, 236 00:12:39,319 --> 00:12:41,879 like, thousands of miles away, that he's separated from. 237 00:12:44,919 --> 00:12:46,040 (crowd roars) 238 00:12:47,839 --> 00:12:51,919 But even in Blackrock College, he was conscious that he needed 239 00:12:52,279 --> 00:12:54,239 to earn the scholarships that would keep him there. 240 00:12:54,279 --> 00:12:56,639 He was always conscious of where he came from, 241 00:12:56,839 --> 00:12:58,199 and it marked him apart. 242 00:13:00,639 --> 00:13:03,279 It takes time, but there's a gathering momentum 243 00:13:03,919 --> 00:13:07,279 around his life, and you can feel it moving on. 244 00:13:07,319 --> 00:13:09,120 I know you have to be very careful here not to 245 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:11,480 look at that in hindsight and say it was obvious 246 00:13:11,519 --> 00:13:13,120 that he was going to come through it 247 00:13:13,160 --> 00:13:14,480 in the manner in which he did, and that 248 00:13:14,519 --> 00:13:16,400 he would gather momentum. That wasn't clear. 249 00:13:16,440 --> 00:13:17,680 He drove himself on. 250 00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:18,879 (crowd cheering) 251 00:13:19,839 --> 00:13:22,919 It goes a bit against the grain that this great Nationalist 252 00:13:23,400 --> 00:13:25,279 has a real enthusiasm for rugby. 253 00:13:25,319 --> 00:13:28,639 Oh, he loved rugby and was always interested in the game. 254 00:13:28,680 --> 00:13:31,279 Throughout his life, he retained that interest. 255 00:13:31,319 --> 00:13:33,480 (crowd cheering, feet stamping) 256 00:13:34,319 --> 00:13:35,599 (crowd roars) 257 00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:37,000 He loved playing the game. 258 00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:40,400 He was good enough to get a trial for the Munster rugby team 259 00:13:40,440 --> 00:13:42,800 in a North v South match, and his opposite number 260 00:13:42,839 --> 00:13:44,080 outperformed him slightly and 261 00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:45,360 became an Irish international. 262 00:13:45,400 --> 00:13:48,480 So that road was almost taken by de Valera. 263 00:13:51,919 --> 00:13:53,680 (whistle blows, crowd cheers) 264 00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:59,239 De Valera strove for excellence in everything that he did. 265 00:13:59,519 --> 00:14:03,040 Blackrock is that place where he revealed once more his ambition, 266 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:04,360 his capacity for work. 267 00:14:07,839 --> 00:14:11,559 People came through those gates and walked out 268 00:14:11,599 --> 00:14:14,559 into the professions, and that's what de Valera wished to do. 269 00:14:17,760 --> 00:14:20,800 There's this lovely photograph that really sums up 270 00:14:20,839 --> 00:14:22,720 Eddie de Valera as he then was. 271 00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:25,519 It's a group shot, a couple of lads standing around, 272 00:14:25,559 --> 00:14:27,879 they're holding rugby balls, they're about to go off 273 00:14:27,919 --> 00:14:29,480 and have a game, it looks like. 274 00:14:29,519 --> 00:14:32,639 And de Valera is the only one holding a book. 275 00:14:33,199 --> 00:14:36,720 He has a finger marking his place in the book. 276 00:14:37,199 --> 00:14:38,279 A bit of a swot. 277 00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:42,360 He stayed in Blackrock for his final years of school, 278 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:45,239 and then he stayed here to study for his university exams, 279 00:14:45,279 --> 00:14:47,319 but he ended up with a pass degree, 280 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:49,199 which was a huge disappointment to him. 281 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:52,839 The problem was with a pass degree, he ended up doing 282 00:14:53,360 --> 00:14:55,559 different bits of part-time teaching jobs, 283 00:14:55,599 --> 00:14:57,559 kind of scraping an existence. 284 00:14:58,559 --> 00:15:02,440 It was for career advancement that he signed up for classes in 285 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:04,040 the Gaelic League to learn Irish. 286 00:15:04,199 --> 00:15:06,959 They gave him a cause which he pursued for the rest of his life, 287 00:15:07,000 --> 00:15:08,519 the restoration of the Irish language. 288 00:15:08,720 --> 00:15:09,800 It gave him a new name. 289 00:15:09,839 --> 00:15:12,199 Eddie de Valera became Éamon de Valera, 290 00:15:12,239 --> 00:15:15,239 and most important of all, it gave him a wife. 291 00:15:15,599 --> 00:15:18,680 Sinéad Ní Fhlannagáin was his teacher in the Gaelic League, 292 00:15:18,800 --> 00:15:21,599 and they got married very soon after they met. 293 00:15:22,919 --> 00:15:25,319 Conradh na Gaeilge, where love stories begin. 294 00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:27,800 (slide projector clicking) 295 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:31,760 By the time he turned 30 in October 1912, 296 00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:34,480 he had a permanent teaching job in Carysfort College. 297 00:15:34,519 --> 00:15:38,000 He was married with a growing family, and he seemed destined 298 00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:39,760 for middle class obscurity. 299 00:15:39,959 --> 00:15:43,160 But then, everything changed on the island of Ireland. 300 00:15:44,559 --> 00:15:47,480 Ulster loyalists pledged to protect the Union with Britain 301 00:15:47,519 --> 00:15:49,319 through violence, if necessary. 302 00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:54,800 Nationalists responded by forming the Irish Volunteers in 1913, 303 00:15:54,919 --> 00:15:58,800 determined to see the promise of independence become a reality. 304 00:15:58,839 --> 00:16:00,160 Éamon de Valera signed up, 305 00:16:00,199 --> 00:16:02,279 and his drive and single-mindedness 306 00:16:02,319 --> 00:16:04,440 saw him quickly rise through the ranks. 307 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:05,559 ♪ (dramatic music) 308 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:07,440 (marching feet) 309 00:16:07,559 --> 00:16:09,800 ♪ (gentle music) 310 00:16:12,199 --> 00:16:13,720 By the time the Rising came along 311 00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:17,480 in 1916, De Valera was Commandant of the Third Battalion, 312 00:16:17,519 --> 00:16:20,360 a key position for what was about to unfold. 313 00:16:21,599 --> 00:16:23,120 (gull crying) 314 00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:25,120 Dev did his homework. He always did his homework, 315 00:16:25,160 --> 00:16:27,519 and he did his study, as he always did his study. 316 00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:30,160 To avoid suspicion, he used to take his son Vivian 317 00:16:30,199 --> 00:16:31,879 with him, he was only 3 or 4 at the time. 318 00:16:31,919 --> 00:16:35,000 They'd take what looked like a Sunday stroll, but actually, 319 00:16:35,040 --> 00:16:36,800 he was assessing the lie of the land. 320 00:16:36,919 --> 00:16:39,360 He knew where they'd be able to find water if they needed it. 321 00:16:39,400 --> 00:16:41,519 He knew where they'd be able to find tools. 322 00:16:41,839 --> 00:16:45,279 He was completely on top of every single detail. 323 00:16:48,839 --> 00:16:52,959 The rising began on Easter Monday, 1916, when Irish volunteers 324 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:56,319 and the Irish Citizen Army seized key buildings in Dublin. 325 00:16:57,160 --> 00:16:59,559 British reinforcements were expected to arrive 326 00:16:59,599 --> 00:17:00,879 into Dun Laoghaire. 327 00:17:00,919 --> 00:17:03,959 De Valera's mission was to stop them getting into the city 328 00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:06,160 to attack the main rebel positions. 329 00:17:07,120 --> 00:17:10,919 Despite popular legend, his base wasn't in Boland's Mills. 330 00:17:11,239 --> 00:17:14,559 It was actually in Boland's bakery, half a kilometre away 331 00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:19,959 The site was later occupied by the headquarters of NAMA, 332 00:17:21,239 --> 00:17:23,839 ground zero for the Irish economic crash. 333 00:17:25,319 --> 00:17:27,760 ♪ (sinister music, building collapsing) 334 00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:31,160 Some people said in later years 335 00:17:31,199 --> 00:17:34,720 that de Valera had some kind of a breakdown in 1916, 336 00:17:34,760 --> 00:17:35,919 that his nerve went. 337 00:17:35,959 --> 00:17:39,239 He felt that with his grasp of detail, he was the only one 338 00:17:39,279 --> 00:17:40,319 that could look after everything. 339 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:42,959 But obviously, if you don't have any sleep for three or four days, 340 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:44,559 that isn't good for your decision-making. 341 00:17:49,279 --> 00:17:52,440 While de Valera's position was shelled, it didn't come under 342 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:54,400 direct assault by the British. 343 00:17:54,680 --> 00:17:58,599 The garrison felt they could fight on, but reluctantly obeyed 344 00:17:58,639 --> 00:18:00,360 Pearse's order to surrender. 345 00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:03,040 They went out, they laid down their arms, 346 00:18:03,080 --> 00:18:04,559 they marched out onto Mount Street. 347 00:18:04,959 --> 00:18:08,000 And this is one of the sliding door moments 348 00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:10,559 in Éamon de Valera's life, and in Irish history. 349 00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:13,559 Instead of turning right and going to Richmond Barracks, 350 00:18:13,599 --> 00:18:15,080 where the court-martials were going on, 351 00:18:15,120 --> 00:18:16,279 they were taken to the left, 352 00:18:16,319 --> 00:18:18,680 down to Ballsbridge, to the RDS. 353 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:21,879 And the point is, by the time de Valera got 354 00:18:21,919 --> 00:18:24,120 to Richmond Barracks, there was a big queue ahead of him 355 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:27,519 for court-martials, and that delay probably saved his life. 356 00:18:28,919 --> 00:18:32,120 ♪ (poignant string music) 357 00:18:37,720 --> 00:18:41,319 So Liz, what happened here in 1916 changed Irish history. 358 00:18:41,360 --> 00:18:43,319 For Éamon de Valera, he's sentenced to death. 359 00:18:43,360 --> 00:18:45,919 Yeah. And he expects to die. Yeah, he does. 360 00:18:45,959 --> 00:18:47,919 He's court-martialled on the 8th of May. 361 00:18:48,199 --> 00:18:50,919 And that day is quite significant because that's the day 362 00:18:50,959 --> 00:18:52,440 that Michael Mallin, Éamonn Ceannt, 363 00:18:52,519 --> 00:18:54,839 Con Colbert and Seán Heuston are executed. 364 00:18:54,879 --> 00:18:57,319 So, you know, there was over 90 going to be executed. 365 00:18:57,800 --> 00:19:00,400 Those who are sentenced or were awaiting sentence 366 00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:01,440 are brought to Kilmainham. 367 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:05,160 But by this stage, you have pressure being put 368 00:19:05,199 --> 00:19:06,519 on the British government. 369 00:19:06,559 --> 00:19:08,680 The Prime Minister is starting to ask the questions 370 00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:11,080 of the military "Do we need to actually start executing?" 371 00:19:11,120 --> 00:19:12,480 But de Valera's sitting in a cell, 372 00:19:12,519 --> 00:19:13,919 like so many of them at that time, 373 00:19:13,959 --> 00:19:16,680 thinking tomorrow is the day. They're gonna come, 374 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:19,360 you know, first thing in the morning, that's gonna be me. 375 00:19:26,360 --> 00:19:28,559 And he fully expected to die the following day. 376 00:19:28,599 --> 00:19:32,040 But because you have such a radical shift in public opinion, 377 00:19:32,319 --> 00:19:36,120 from one of anger into one of sympathy, initially, not support, 378 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:38,800 but sympathy for the way the volunteers are being treated, 379 00:19:38,879 --> 00:19:41,519 Prime Minister Asquith is starting to ask the questions. 380 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:44,519 And it's not that as an American citizenship, 381 00:19:44,559 --> 00:19:45,760 is the thing that saves him. 382 00:19:45,800 --> 00:19:49,839 It's the fact that he is not seen as an important figure. 383 00:19:56,120 --> 00:19:59,519 It must have been a really traumatic time for him. 384 00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:02,839 He's sitting in his cell writing his last letter to his wife 385 00:20:02,879 --> 00:20:05,239 and his children, and never seeing them again. 386 00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:16,120 The feeling of anxiety... the fear... the sounds. 387 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:17,760 You're standing even here now. 388 00:20:18,120 --> 00:20:20,720 Every sound is magnified. 389 00:20:22,800 --> 00:20:23,839 The waiting game. 390 00:20:26,120 --> 00:20:27,360 What's gonna happen? 391 00:20:31,599 --> 00:20:36,720 The most important thing de Valera did in 1916 was simply to survive. 392 00:20:38,120 --> 00:20:40,839 As one of the few leaders of the Rising still alive, 393 00:20:40,879 --> 00:20:44,400 he was now a credible candidate to lead Irish Nationalism. 394 00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:57,720 In the aftermath of 1916, public opinion in Ireland 395 00:20:57,760 --> 00:20:59,159 shifted dramatically. 396 00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:02,960 Republican prisoners sentenced after the Rising were released, 397 00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:06,439 and Éamon de Valera rode a wave of enthusiasm to win 398 00:21:06,479 --> 00:21:08,159 the East Clare by-election. 399 00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:12,280 Seen as a unifying figure, he was chosen to lead Sinn Féin, 400 00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:13,839 and the party won a landslide 401 00:21:13,879 --> 00:21:16,680 in the December 1918 general election. 402 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:20,439 The following month, a breakaway Dáil met in Dublin. 403 00:21:20,799 --> 00:21:23,199 De Valera was absent, in prison again. 404 00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:27,239 A few days later, he escaped and made his way home, 405 00:21:27,280 --> 00:21:28,640 but he didn't stay for long. 406 00:21:29,280 --> 00:21:32,360 As political violence erupted around the country, 407 00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:35,239 he decided that the best way to help the battle 408 00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:38,280 was to bring the fight to the country of his birth. 409 00:21:42,159 --> 00:21:44,720 He crossed the Atlantic for the second time as a stowaway, 410 00:21:44,799 --> 00:21:46,239 hidden in the hold of the ship, 411 00:21:46,479 --> 00:21:48,919 where a rat ate a sandwich out of his pocket. 412 00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:52,119 He was so seasick, it was thought that he might die 413 00:21:52,159 --> 00:21:54,239 until he was revived with a drop of brandy. 414 00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:56,119 And when he arrived into the city of his birth, 415 00:21:56,159 --> 00:21:57,479 he had to be smuggled ashore. 416 00:21:57,519 --> 00:21:58,559 He was a fugitive. 417 00:21:59,199 --> 00:22:01,559 But all of that was about to change. 418 00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:03,919 We're here in a lovely, peaceful park 419 00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:05,199 in the middle of New York City. 420 00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:08,159 But if you were here in 1919, it would have been a different story. 421 00:22:08,199 --> 00:22:10,400 You're right. This was the site of de Valera's 422 00:22:10,439 --> 00:22:11,720 first rock and roll moment 423 00:22:11,760 --> 00:22:14,280 in the United States. At a packed Madison Square Garden, 424 00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:16,159 some 15,000 people 425 00:22:16,199 --> 00:22:18,239 were here to hear Éamon de Valera speak. 426 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:20,000 ♪ (upbeat jazz drums, crowd noise) 427 00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:23,799 ♪ (lively jazz music) 428 00:22:23,839 --> 00:22:25,479 This was De Valera's moment 429 00:22:25,519 --> 00:22:27,919 as the uncrowned king of Irish America. 430 00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:31,400 It really was Dev-mania because it wasn't just here. 431 00:22:31,439 --> 00:22:33,040 It was Fenway Park in Boston, 432 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:34,879 it was Wrigley Field in Chicago. 433 00:22:34,919 --> 00:22:36,360 Absolutely massive crowds. 434 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:38,400 He was a celebrity, as you would think of 435 00:22:38,439 --> 00:22:40,280 in the 21st-century term. 436 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:42,919 He lived at the Waldorf Astoria Hotel, 437 00:22:42,960 --> 00:22:45,600 which was the home for many queens and kings 438 00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:47,040 when they visited New York City. 439 00:22:47,080 --> 00:22:49,839 And his suite was known as the Irish White House. 440 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:53,280 Women were fainting in his presence, 441 00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:55,640 so he had almost like a sex symbol status. 442 00:22:59,799 --> 00:23:01,799 Some people accused him of shirking the War of Independence. 443 00:23:01,839 --> 00:23:02,839 Is that fair? 444 00:23:02,879 --> 00:23:05,080 Well, de Valera, perhaps more than any other politician 445 00:23:05,119 --> 00:23:07,360 in modern history, recognised that the Irish question 446 00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:09,159 was also an American question. 447 00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:15,439 He sought to incorporate the United States politically, 448 00:23:15,519 --> 00:23:17,879 in terms of publicity, and in terms of the Irish diaspora, 449 00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:20,720 into raging that war against the British state. 450 00:23:21,040 --> 00:23:23,879 De Valera toured the United States for about 18 months. 451 00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:26,839 He raised about $65 million in today's money 452 00:23:26,879 --> 00:23:28,400 for the nascent Irish Republic. 453 00:23:28,439 --> 00:23:30,600 And in some respects, De Valera's financial tour 454 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:32,680 of America was his success story. 455 00:23:32,799 --> 00:23:34,760 But it wasn't all sweetness and light with some members 456 00:23:34,799 --> 00:23:36,080 of the Irish-American community. 457 00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:38,040 De Valera really met his match here. 458 00:23:38,199 --> 00:23:41,119 Irish-Americans of long-standing, most notably John Devoy 459 00:23:41,159 --> 00:23:45,000 and Judge Daniel Cohalan, who had led Irish America for decades. 460 00:23:45,239 --> 00:23:47,919 America wasn't big enough for all of their egos. 461 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,159 It's an an Irish-American Civil War before an Irish Civil War. 462 00:23:52,439 --> 00:23:55,159 So what about the effect that America had on de Valera? 463 00:23:55,199 --> 00:23:57,320 'Cause I'm always conscious of the Arthur Griffith quote 464 00:23:57,360 --> 00:23:59,320 that he was a good man spoiled by America. 465 00:23:59,360 --> 00:24:01,600 De Valera met great adulation here on the streets 466 00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:03,640 of the United States, especially here in New York. 467 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:06,559 But he also met great tension and great push-back. 468 00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:09,080 And in some respects, his lesson learned from America 469 00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:10,680 was to control the narrative. 470 00:24:11,919 --> 00:24:15,400 The American education of Éamon de Valera will influence 471 00:24:15,439 --> 00:24:17,280 his political career for decades to come. 472 00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:23,320 By December 1920, De Valera had raised a ton of money. 473 00:24:23,360 --> 00:24:26,479 He'd set up his own organisation to control Irish America, 474 00:24:26,519 --> 00:24:29,519 and he'd put Ireland at the top of the news agenda, 475 00:24:29,799 --> 00:24:32,040 added to which he'd heard that there were peace moves 476 00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:33,280 afoot in Ireland. 477 00:24:33,479 --> 00:24:34,640 It was time to go home. 478 00:24:35,479 --> 00:24:38,360 By June 1921, the War of Independence 479 00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:39,960 was an effective stalemate. 480 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:42,360 Both sides were ready for a truce. 481 00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:45,439 So de Valera travelled to a face-to-face meeting 482 00:24:45,479 --> 00:24:47,239 with the British Prime Minister, 483 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:49,360 harbouring Irish hopes for liberty. 484 00:24:56,239 --> 00:24:58,919 De Valera came to London, the heart of the greatest empire 485 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:01,000 the world had ever known, to seek recognition 486 00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:03,879 of the Irish Republic, which it quickly became clear 487 00:25:03,919 --> 00:25:05,159 he wasn't going to get. 488 00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:09,519 David Lloyd George, the British Prime Minister, 489 00:25:09,559 --> 00:25:13,839 famously unscrupulous, famously wily, not to be trusted, 490 00:25:13,879 --> 00:25:15,680 and De Valera certainly didn't trust him. 491 00:25:16,159 --> 00:25:19,000 As far as the British were concerned, the Irish 492 00:25:19,040 --> 00:25:20,280 were part of the empire. 493 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:22,879 They owed allegiance to the Crown, to the King, 494 00:25:22,919 --> 00:25:26,320 and they simply couldn't imagine a situation where Ireland could 495 00:25:26,360 --> 00:25:27,960 become an independent Republic. 496 00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:30,040 It wasn't just about principle. 497 00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:33,280 It wasn't just about the position of the Crown in Irish life. 498 00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:35,839 There was also practical reasons for Britain to be concerned 499 00:25:35,879 --> 00:25:37,080 about Irish independence. 500 00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:39,199 If you look at a map of the British Isles or 501 00:25:39,239 --> 00:25:41,640 the Celtic Archipelago, as it's more properly known, 502 00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:45,559 you can see that Ireland is crucial to British security. 503 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:47,400 If Ireland was in hostile hands, 504 00:25:47,439 --> 00:25:50,040 Britain, militarily, was indefensible. 505 00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:52,799 ♪ (ominous music) 506 00:25:54,360 --> 00:25:57,760 Negotiations to reach a deal opened in London in October, 507 00:25:57,799 --> 00:26:01,040 but controversially, de Valera decided not to travel. 508 00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:04,199 Instead, five plenipotentiaries led by Arthur Griffith 509 00:26:04,239 --> 00:26:07,439 and Michael Collins would negotiate Ireland's future. 510 00:26:07,799 --> 00:26:10,400 WT Cosgrave said it was a team they were sending over, 511 00:26:10,439 --> 00:26:13,199 and they were leaving their best player in reserve. 512 00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:14,960 ♪ (tense music, gull crying) 513 00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:17,919 By definition, plenipotentiaries have the power 514 00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:19,799 to sign an agreement with a foreign government, 515 00:26:19,839 --> 00:26:21,879 but they were also given instructions by de Valera, 516 00:26:21,919 --> 00:26:24,519 secretly, that they had to refer back to Dublin 517 00:26:24,559 --> 00:26:25,839 before they signed anything. 518 00:26:27,839 --> 00:26:30,280 The British had some of the most seasoned 519 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:32,360 political negotiators on the scene. 520 00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:35,239 They'd just negotiated and signed the Versailles Treaty. 521 00:26:35,280 --> 00:26:38,680 The Irish, by comparison, were completely inexperienced. 522 00:26:39,839 --> 00:26:42,919 The plenipotentiaries were under incredible pressure. 523 00:26:43,199 --> 00:26:44,879 Lloyd George turned the screws 524 00:26:44,919 --> 00:26:46,919 right at the end of the negotiation. 525 00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:50,000 He said "If you don't sign, there will be war in Ireland 526 00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:51,559 and war within three days." 527 00:26:51,640 --> 00:26:54,839 So they felt they had no time to refer back to de Valera. 528 00:26:54,879 --> 00:26:55,879 They had to sign. 529 00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:58,760 One of the British delegates said 530 00:26:58,799 --> 00:27:00,760 "I am signing my political death warrant." 531 00:27:00,919 --> 00:27:04,320 Michael Collins said "I am signing my actual death warrant." 532 00:27:04,519 --> 00:27:05,559 And he was right. 533 00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:08,159 ♪ (sombre orchestral music) 534 00:27:10,879 --> 00:27:13,360 The plenipotentiaries came back from London 535 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:16,239 with the treaty signed, but it still had to be ratified. 536 00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:19,239 So after the Easter Rising, the War of Independence, 537 00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:22,839 the battle in London over the terms of a deal with Britain. 538 00:27:23,479 --> 00:27:27,960 It all came down to a war of words as the Dáil debated the Treaty. 539 00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:33,559 That debate took place at UCD's premises in Earlsfort Terrace... 540 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:35,960 ♪ (violins playing) ..now the National Concert Hall. 541 00:27:40,199 --> 00:27:43,760 De Valera saw his role as keeping everyone in harmony, 542 00:27:43,799 --> 00:27:45,680 but the Treaty that came back from London 543 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:47,680 introduced a discordant note. 544 00:27:53,479 --> 00:27:55,159 So Gretchen, we're here in the very room 545 00:27:55,199 --> 00:27:57,159 where the Treaty debates took place. 546 00:27:57,199 --> 00:27:59,919 And right from the start, they were emotional, 547 00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:02,439 they were divisive, they were really, really intense. 548 00:28:02,799 --> 00:28:05,040 Yes. I mean, from the get-go, 549 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:08,239 it was an extremely emotional situation. 550 00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,080 ♪ (orchestra plays dramatic opening phrase) 551 00:28:15,439 --> 00:28:17,439 The Treaty negotiations were about 552 00:28:17,479 --> 00:28:19,720 how far are you gonna go to 553 00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:21,280 fight for independence. Are you gonna go for 554 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:22,320 a republic at all costs? 555 00:28:22,360 --> 00:28:23,600 And certainly, Collins and Griffith 556 00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:24,760 weren't willing to do that. 557 00:28:24,799 --> 00:28:26,760 ♪ (orchestra plays dramatic music) 558 00:28:29,559 --> 00:28:31,720 Collins argued that the Treaty gave the freedom 559 00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:33,080 to achieve freedom. 560 00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:37,280 But Republican purists couldn't swallow 561 00:28:37,320 --> 00:28:39,000 the oath of allegiance to the King. 562 00:28:39,439 --> 00:28:42,400 De Valera, previously seen as a moderate, agreed. 563 00:28:42,799 --> 00:28:44,720 He wanted the Dáil to reject the Treaty 564 00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:46,559 and negotiate a better deal. 565 00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:48,760 But his once unassailable leadership 566 00:28:48,799 --> 00:28:50,000 was beginning to crumble. 567 00:28:50,199 --> 00:28:53,040 For so long, he had been able to rely on 568 00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:54,600 this deferential treatment. 569 00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:57,559 He'd been treated in America as 570 00:28:57,600 --> 00:28:59,799 the President of the Irish Republic. 571 00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:03,280 He didn't quite understand that by sending 572 00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:05,439 plenipotentiaries to thrash out the most 573 00:29:05,479 --> 00:29:09,600 difficult negotiations in the most terrifying circumstances, 574 00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:12,720 with war being threatened at every turn, 575 00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:14,879 his own authority was gonna be undermined. 576 00:29:15,519 --> 00:29:19,600 His gamble was that he could impose his own solution, 577 00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:24,119 impose his own compromise, and still have everybody behind him. 578 00:29:24,199 --> 00:29:27,199 It was a terrible, terrible mistake. 579 00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:29,320 ♪ (orchestra plays dramatic music) 580 00:29:30,479 --> 00:29:33,199 Neither side paid much attention to partition because both 581 00:29:33,239 --> 00:29:35,519 wrongly assumed that a Boundary Commission 582 00:29:35,559 --> 00:29:37,600 would make Northern Ireland unviable. 583 00:29:38,559 --> 00:29:42,000 The debate was dominated by division over 584 00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:43,879 the Crown and the oath. 585 00:29:44,519 --> 00:29:46,080 Partition was the dog that didn't bark. 586 00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:48,600 ♪ (orchestra plays dramatic music) 587 00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:55,760 After a month of acrimonious debate, it was time for the Dáil 588 00:29:55,799 --> 00:29:58,439 to decide, and the result went against de Valera. 589 00:29:58,919 --> 00:30:01,360 His side lost by just seven votes. 590 00:30:02,400 --> 00:30:05,600 In the emotion of the moment, De Valera broke down in tears. 591 00:30:07,439 --> 00:30:10,680 He had expected to be able to control the plenipotentiaries. 592 00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:13,119 He had expected to win the vote in the cabinet. 593 00:30:13,320 --> 00:30:17,799 He had expected to win the vote in the Dáil, and he lost all of that. 594 00:30:17,839 --> 00:30:20,040 It must have been a shattering blow for him personally. 595 00:30:20,159 --> 00:30:23,239 It was, for the first time in a long, long time, 596 00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:25,799 an utterly humiliating experience. 597 00:30:25,839 --> 00:30:29,040 This was the issue that dogged de Valera throughout his life. 598 00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:34,640 ♪ (dramatic finish) 599 00:30:35,559 --> 00:30:36,919 (audience applauds) 600 00:30:39,879 --> 00:30:42,360 ♪ (sombre music) 601 00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:48,559 With the Dáil divided, the two sides 602 00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:50,360 took their case to the country. 603 00:30:51,519 --> 00:30:52,760 (wings flapping) 604 00:30:56,519 --> 00:30:58,960 As tempers rose and positions hardened, 605 00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:02,760 de Valera ramped up the rhetoric in his public speeches. 606 00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:07,680 Here in Thurles, on St. Patrick's Day, 1922, 607 00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:10,320 de Valera made the most infamous of his speeches 608 00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:11,879 during those tense months. 609 00:31:12,879 --> 00:31:14,960 He said that if the volunteers of the future 610 00:31:15,000 --> 00:31:17,119 wanted to complete the independence struggle, 611 00:31:17,159 --> 00:31:21,879 they'd have to do so over the dead bodies of their own countrymen. 612 00:31:22,080 --> 00:31:24,919 They would have to wade through Irish blood, he said, 613 00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:27,559 through the blood of the soldiers of the Irish government, 614 00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:30,239 and through perhaps the blood of some of the members 615 00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:33,080 of the government in order to get Irish freedom. 616 00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:34,919 He said it was a warning. 617 00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:37,720 His opponents, then and now, said it was incitement. 618 00:31:37,879 --> 00:31:40,239 Either way, it added fuel to the flames 619 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:42,080 that were about to consume the country. 620 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:46,360 As tensions rose, the people had their say 621 00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:48,119 in the June general election. 622 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:51,479 Michael Collins's energetic campaign won a majority 623 00:31:51,519 --> 00:31:53,080 to his side of the argument. 624 00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:59,080 De Valera's anti-Treaty Sinn Féin salvaged just 36 of the 128 seats. 625 00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:03,159 Just days later, Republicans in London assassinated 626 00:32:03,199 --> 00:32:06,360 leading Unionist Field Marshal Sir Henry Wilson. 627 00:32:06,799 --> 00:32:08,439 The British government demanded action 628 00:32:08,479 --> 00:32:10,360 against anti-Treaty Republicans 629 00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:12,960 who were occupying the Four Courts in Dublin. 630 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:14,040 (cannon fires) 631 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:17,239 Troops loyal to the provisional government shelled the rebels 632 00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:21,040 and a civil war that would claim almost 1,500 lives began. 633 00:32:21,199 --> 00:32:22,919 ♪ (sombre music) 634 00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:29,040 In the opening weeks, 635 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:32,720 anti-Treaty forces were quickly pushed out of urban areas 636 00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:34,640 and reverted to guerrilla fighting 637 00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:36,799 in the south-western corner of the country. 638 00:32:38,479 --> 00:32:41,640 The Civil War claimed many victims on both sides, 639 00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:44,400 many of them personally close to Éamon de Valera, 640 00:32:44,760 --> 00:32:48,600 and here on a remote roadway in West Cork, Michael Collins. 641 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:53,439 In a coincidence that would give rise to many conspiracy theories, 642 00:32:53,479 --> 00:32:57,239 de Valera himself was in this area just hours before. 643 00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:02,760 So we're sitting in the house that de Valera was in 644 00:33:02,799 --> 00:33:05,519 on the day Michael Collins was shot just 100 yards away. 645 00:33:05,640 --> 00:33:07,119 Not only are we sitting at the house, 646 00:33:07,159 --> 00:33:10,159 we're sitting at the table that Dev sat at 647 00:33:10,199 --> 00:33:12,439 here in Béal na Bláth 648 00:33:12,479 --> 00:33:14,080 on the day that Michael Collins was shot. 649 00:33:14,199 --> 00:33:15,839 ♪ (quiet, sombre music) 650 00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:22,119 When you come here and you look at the terrain, like... 651 00:33:22,159 --> 00:33:24,760 Yeah. It's so close. But how close did they actually come? 652 00:33:24,799 --> 00:33:27,439 Within 30 minutes of each other, the two men 653 00:33:27,479 --> 00:33:29,280 passed by the same crossroads. 654 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:34,479 Collins is going further west, and Éamon de Valera comes 655 00:33:34,519 --> 00:33:37,919 from a safe house three or four miles away, neither man knowing 656 00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:41,280 that they had come to the exact same location on the same day. 657 00:33:41,519 --> 00:33:42,960 And what was he doing here? 658 00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:45,199 Well, I think it's fair to say that he was here looking to see 659 00:33:45,239 --> 00:33:47,320 could the war be brought to a conclusion? 660 00:33:47,720 --> 00:33:50,360 This was a room where there was a big meeting planned between 661 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:51,879 brigade and divisional officers. 662 00:33:51,919 --> 00:33:53,159 That's what Dev was doing here. 663 00:33:53,199 --> 00:33:56,559 So de Valera is fairly peripheral then in the Civil War, is he? 664 00:33:56,720 --> 00:33:59,879 Control of the military operations are Liam Lynch's. 665 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:08,080 Even in a local setting, even at Béal na Bláth 666 00:34:08,119 --> 00:34:09,119 and at this ambush, 667 00:34:09,159 --> 00:34:11,839 Éamon de Valera has no real say as to whether 668 00:34:11,879 --> 00:34:13,159 an ambush occurs here. 669 00:34:13,199 --> 00:34:15,280 That's not his role at this juncture. 670 00:34:17,879 --> 00:34:21,159 From what we can gather, de Valera is not in favour of the ambush? 671 00:34:21,199 --> 00:34:22,199 No. 672 00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:23,720 ♪ (sombre music, bird squawks) 673 00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:26,799 His general opinion seems to have been 674 00:34:26,839 --> 00:34:28,559 that if something would happen to Collins, 675 00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:31,000 that he might just be replaced by a weaker man. 676 00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:33,080 So despite what you might be led to believe 677 00:34:33,119 --> 00:34:34,960 by some cinematic representations, 678 00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:36,600 Dev actually had nothing to do with it. 679 00:34:36,640 --> 00:34:39,720 Dev had nothing to do with Michael Collins being shot. 680 00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:42,080 There's no Alan Rickman crying behind a haystack here. 681 00:34:42,119 --> 00:34:45,199 And yet a lot of people are still determined to put 682 00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:46,640 the responsibility for the Civil War 683 00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:48,559 on Éamon de Valera's shoulders. Is that fair? 684 00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:50,559 I think it's fair to say that Éamon de Valera 685 00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:52,479 helped strike the match of the Civil War. 686 00:34:52,519 --> 00:34:55,559 But then the actual activities that occur in the Civil War, 687 00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:57,760 I think it's very questionable to the degree to which he has 688 00:34:57,799 --> 00:35:00,519 a lasting amount of control over that, a major amount of control. 689 00:35:04,879 --> 00:35:08,879 So after Collins's death, you get this series of events, 690 00:35:08,919 --> 00:35:11,360 a spiral of events that just add to the bitterness that 691 00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:12,400 lasts for generations. 692 00:35:12,519 --> 00:35:14,439 It's in the aftermath, a place like Béal na Bláth , 693 00:35:14,479 --> 00:35:16,559 that we're seeing these tit-for-tat executions. 694 00:35:16,919 --> 00:35:19,680 These really are one of the major reasons that it's left such 695 00:35:19,720 --> 00:35:22,159 a lasting legacy of kind of sourness, if you like, 696 00:35:22,199 --> 00:35:23,799 in relation to what occurred. 697 00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:27,680 It was an ugly time, as all civil wars are. 698 00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:32,720 Because of the scars left by the Civil War, 699 00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:35,720 de Valera could never again be the undisputed leader 700 00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:37,080 of Irish Nationalism. 701 00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:41,199 Yet, he went on to dominate Irish politics for 50 years. 702 00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:02,400 After the Civil War, Éamon de Valera spent a year in jail, 703 00:36:02,439 --> 00:36:05,360 much of it in solitary confinement, 704 00:36:08,879 --> 00:36:11,239 giving him plenty of time to think. 705 00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:19,000 Meanwhile, outside these prison walls, Sinn Féin was becoming 706 00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:21,040 more attached to abstentionism, 707 00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:24,119 the refusal to enter the Dáil under any circumstances, 708 00:36:24,159 --> 00:36:27,199 which meant that even when de Valera was finally released 709 00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:29,439 from prison, his room to manoeuvre, politically, 710 00:36:29,479 --> 00:36:31,000 was still restricted. 711 00:36:31,320 --> 00:36:33,320 ♪ (urgent orchestral music, crowd noise) 712 00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:40,199 As far as De Valera was concerned, it was a question of tactics 713 00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:41,320 rather than principle. 714 00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:44,720 But the Republican purists in the party refused to consider 715 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,400 entering Leinster House under any circumstances, whatever. 716 00:36:47,600 --> 00:36:50,799 As far as they were concerned, it was a partitionist parliament, 717 00:36:50,839 --> 00:36:54,320 and the problem for de Valera was, that means, in effect, 718 00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:56,199 that there's no political path forward. 719 00:36:57,119 --> 00:36:59,799 The issue came to a crunch at a special Sinn Féin Ard Fheis, 720 00:36:59,839 --> 00:37:02,360 de Valera lost in his attempt to get the party 721 00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:04,360 to change policy, and he walked out. 722 00:37:06,280 --> 00:37:10,040 In May 1926, he established a new party, Fianna Fáil, 723 00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:12,080 a more pragmatic political entity. 724 00:37:12,600 --> 00:37:14,879 They completely supplant Sinn Féin, 725 00:37:14,919 --> 00:37:18,199 and de Valera engages in a bit of street theatre. 726 00:37:18,239 --> 00:37:20,960 He marches at the head of all the Fianna Fáil TDs 727 00:37:21,000 --> 00:37:22,559 up to the gates of Leinster House, 728 00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:24,159 demands to be admitted, 729 00:37:24,199 --> 00:37:26,239 de Valera says "We will not take the oath," 730 00:37:26,280 --> 00:37:27,320 and they're kicked out. 731 00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:30,080 So they march all the way back across to their offices 732 00:37:30,119 --> 00:37:31,879 over on the northside, 733 00:37:31,919 --> 00:37:34,479 and it looks like he's digging his heels in. 734 00:37:37,239 --> 00:37:39,360 And then Kevin O'Higgins is assassinated. 735 00:37:44,199 --> 00:37:46,000 The murder of the Minister for Justice 736 00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:48,040 in broad daylight shocked the country, 737 00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:49,400 and gave the Free State government 738 00:37:49,439 --> 00:37:51,080 the opportunity to crack down 739 00:37:51,119 --> 00:37:52,960 on its most strident critics. 740 00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:54,080 (church bell rings) 741 00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:56,600 New laws required election candidates 742 00:37:56,640 --> 00:37:58,320 to commit to taking the oath. 743 00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:03,760 The policy of abstentionism had run out of road. 744 00:38:05,879 --> 00:38:08,960 And really, in the end, there was only one choice to make. 745 00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:13,159 De Valera had fought a civil war against the Treaty settlement 746 00:38:13,199 --> 00:38:16,159 and the oath which symbolised it, but now he came face to face 747 00:38:16,199 --> 00:38:19,080 with the bitter truth - in order to get rid of the oath, 748 00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:20,839 he was going to have to take it. 749 00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:25,960 ♪ (poignant orchestral music) 750 00:38:36,119 --> 00:38:39,360 So, Peter, every TD has to sign the book. 751 00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:40,760 Correct. 752 00:38:40,799 --> 00:38:44,080 And we have books for each Dáil going back to 1919. 753 00:38:44,600 --> 00:38:47,199 This is the roll book for the fifth Dáil, 754 00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:51,879 and if we open the book, we come to the page where 755 00:38:51,919 --> 00:38:54,119 Éamon de Valera signed the roll. 756 00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:56,919 Wow. And that's his signature just there. 757 00:38:56,960 --> 00:38:59,519 Yeah. You can see it's in quite large handwriting. 758 00:38:59,720 --> 00:39:02,559 It's hugely interesting, hugely historical, because 759 00:39:02,600 --> 00:39:04,199 it was of huge significance. 760 00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:12,760 Above the signature, you will more importantly see 761 00:39:12,799 --> 00:39:15,479 the oath that he was swearing at that time, 762 00:39:15,519 --> 00:39:17,199 and that's what caused all the problems. 763 00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:19,040 This is what caused the Civil War, right? 764 00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:21,640 Essentially. In effect, yeah. Yeah. 765 00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:24,640 It's really interesting what he did. 766 00:39:24,680 --> 00:39:27,439 He took a Bible that was on the table. 767 00:39:27,720 --> 00:39:31,159 He picks it up... Yeah. Leaves it over by the door... 768 00:39:31,479 --> 00:39:35,960 He covers up the text of the oath and said "I am signing no oath. 769 00:39:36,199 --> 00:39:39,159 I am merely signing the roll to gain admittance to the Dáil" 770 00:39:39,199 --> 00:39:40,239 and he signed his name. 771 00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:45,320 It's bigger than the normal, because we can actually see 772 00:39:45,439 --> 00:39:48,040 in the subsequent Dáil, after the following election, 773 00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:52,680 he signs in his usual very neat handwriting. 774 00:39:54,519 --> 00:39:57,280 I think it probably shows that he's under a fair amount 775 00:39:57,320 --> 00:39:58,799 of emotional stress. I do. 776 00:39:58,839 --> 00:40:01,680 I think it does highlight the stress of the moment, and also 777 00:40:01,720 --> 00:40:03,680 the significance of the moment for him. 778 00:40:06,280 --> 00:40:09,559 The other interesting thing, Peter, is that in 1922, 779 00:40:09,600 --> 00:40:11,239 when the oath was first taken, 780 00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:14,239 it's taken in the Dáil chamber, and they have to actually 781 00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:17,199 stand up and read out the text. Yeah. 782 00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:19,919 Whereas here, you're just signing your name in a book. 783 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:22,760 Yeah, so I suppose you can see the progression away 784 00:40:22,799 --> 00:40:24,159 from the oath at that stage. 785 00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:26,640 They were doing it in the privacy of the clerk's office. 786 00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:28,720 Okay, so if you said it was an empty formula, 787 00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:30,799 you might have a point. I think you would. 788 00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:33,280 And the other interesting thing is that de Valera, 789 00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:35,559 when he signed his name, he told the clerk 790 00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:37,799 "One day I will have this book burnt." 791 00:40:37,839 --> 00:40:39,320 Thankfully, he didn't. 792 00:40:43,559 --> 00:40:45,680 ♪ (calm music) 793 00:40:52,119 --> 00:40:55,519 Now that de Valera and Fianna Fáil were inside the system, 794 00:40:55,559 --> 00:40:58,159 it was only a matter of time before they took power 795 00:40:58,199 --> 00:40:59,320 in the Free State. 796 00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:03,360 The new movement took root all over the country, 797 00:41:03,400 --> 00:41:06,199 helped in no small part by de Valera's new project, 798 00:41:06,239 --> 00:41:07,479 The Irish Press, 799 00:41:07,519 --> 00:41:11,680 the newspaper he regarded as crucial to his political success. 800 00:41:13,239 --> 00:41:17,080 In the 1932 general election, Fianna Fáil overtook 801 00:41:17,119 --> 00:41:19,080 Cumann na nGaedheal for the first time. 802 00:41:19,119 --> 00:41:23,519 It would remain the biggest party for the next eight decades. 803 00:41:27,879 --> 00:41:30,720 (de Valera) The programme of Fianna Fáil 804 00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:33,439 has now been definitely adopted 805 00:41:33,479 --> 00:41:36,320 as the national policy of the Irish people. 806 00:41:36,879 --> 00:41:43,559 Ireland united, Ireland free, Ireland self-supporting 807 00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:46,119 and self-reliant, 808 00:41:46,159 --> 00:41:49,280 Ireland speaking her own tongue, 809 00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:53,040 and through it giving to the world her ancient treasures 810 00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:55,320 of Christian Gaelic culture. 811 00:41:56,439 --> 00:42:01,479 These are the ideals to which enthusiastic young Ireland 812 00:42:01,559 --> 00:42:04,080 is now devoting its energy. 813 00:42:04,119 --> 00:42:06,040 ♪ (emotional orchestral music, slide projector clicking) 814 00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:30,040 It had taken him 50 years, but the boy from Manhattan 815 00:42:30,080 --> 00:42:32,239 had finally made it big in Ireland. 816 00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:36,760 ♪ (dramatic orchestral music) 817 00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:41,040 (gulls crying) 818 00:42:42,439 --> 00:42:44,919 Our history has shaped every inch 819 00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:49,119 of the nation in which we live, and shaped the lives and values 820 00:42:49,159 --> 00:42:51,919 of every one of us who call ourselves citizens. 821 00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:56,159 So what do the people of Ireland today think of the man 822 00:42:56,199 --> 00:42:59,680 whose fingerprints are all over our revolutionary period, 823 00:42:59,720 --> 00:43:03,080 and our first half century of independence? 824 00:43:03,119 --> 00:43:04,720 (applause) 825 00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:10,280 Good evening, and you're very welcome to St. Patrick's Hall 826 00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:12,479 here in historic Dublin Castle. 827 00:43:12,519 --> 00:43:14,439 And you may be wondering, why are we here? 828 00:43:14,600 --> 00:43:17,559 Well, we're here to consider the life and the legacy 829 00:43:17,600 --> 00:43:21,559 of the most consequential figure in 20th century Ireland. 830 00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:24,159 Big claim to make, but I think there's no doubt 831 00:43:24,479 --> 00:43:27,080 that Éamon de Valera made a massive impact on Ireland 832 00:43:27,119 --> 00:43:29,600 during his extraordinarily long career. 833 00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:32,479 It was in St. Patrick's Hall that Éamon de Valera 834 00:43:32,519 --> 00:43:34,519 was inaugurated as President of Ireland, 835 00:43:34,559 --> 00:43:37,680 and it was also here, in 1975, 836 00:43:37,720 --> 00:43:40,239 that he lay in state before his funeral. 837 00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:41,640 It was in this room... 838 00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:42,680 (boom) 839 00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:49,640 ..that tens of thousands of people filed past the coffin 840 00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:53,119 of the man who was viewed either as a demigod, 841 00:43:54,119 --> 00:43:56,320 or as the devil incarnate. 842 00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:01,519 I was 22 when he died, and 843 00:44:01,559 --> 00:44:03,159 I would have walked around 844 00:44:03,199 --> 00:44:05,720 the coffin like I saw this evening, 845 00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:08,400 de Valera and his people at the time. 846 00:44:08,439 --> 00:44:12,519 So it was a generosity, trying to help the whole nation. 847 00:44:13,199 --> 00:44:18,159 The energy was always just to try and find employment for people. 848 00:44:18,199 --> 00:44:20,479 That's part of the de Valera legacy 849 00:44:20,519 --> 00:44:22,239 and part of the Fianna Fáil party, 850 00:44:22,280 --> 00:44:24,600 which I am proud to be a member. 851 00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:30,519 So if my da wants to wind me up and watch me go on a rant, 852 00:44:30,559 --> 00:44:31,919 all he had to say to me 853 00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:35,159 was that de Valera was a lovely man, and I'd be off. 854 00:44:35,479 --> 00:44:38,119 I remember we were attending a funeral in Whitefriar Street, 855 00:44:38,159 --> 00:44:40,439 and as we were walking through the main entrance, 856 00:44:40,479 --> 00:44:41,839 my dad told me to bless myself. 857 00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:44,559 I did so without looking, without hesitation. 858 00:44:44,839 --> 00:44:47,479 My dad burst out laughing, which I thought was strange 859 00:44:47,600 --> 00:44:49,360 until I looked up at the picture. 860 00:44:49,760 --> 00:44:52,159 To my horror, it was in fact, de Valera. 861 00:44:52,199 --> 00:44:53,360 (laughter) 862 00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:57,040 De Valera, who my nanny refers to as a god, 863 00:44:57,080 --> 00:44:58,760 (laughs) or her family did. 864 00:44:59,559 --> 00:45:04,360 To hold him up to such a high regard means that he is devoid 865 00:45:04,400 --> 00:45:08,119 of criticism, and so to criticise is to create controversy. 866 00:45:08,159 --> 00:45:10,360 To me, and as a young person in Ireland today, 867 00:45:10,479 --> 00:45:13,040 who's looking at the poverty we're still in and looking at all 868 00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:15,280 the issues we're still in, and there's still the leftover 869 00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:17,159 legacy of the Catholic Church in Ireland, 870 00:45:17,600 --> 00:45:20,799 I have to think of that, and I have to use that to frame 871 00:45:20,839 --> 00:45:22,280 how I think of de Valera. 872 00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:25,680 Until we take that radical position that goes against Dev, 873 00:45:25,720 --> 00:45:28,080 heaven forbid, then I think we'll still be having 874 00:45:28,119 --> 00:45:29,799 this same conversation in 50 years' time. 875 00:45:30,000 --> 00:45:32,600 ♪ (quiet orchestral music) 876 00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:50,280 Acutely conscious, though we all are, 877 00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:54,720 of the misery and desolation in which the greater part 878 00:45:54,760 --> 00:45:59,960 of the world is plunged, let us turn aside for a moment 879 00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:04,199 to that ideal Ireland that we would have. 880 00:46:05,360 --> 00:46:09,799 As an immigrant, the fact that he was born outside Ireland 881 00:46:09,839 --> 00:46:15,439 from an immigrant father, this man was born half Irish, 882 00:46:15,799 --> 00:46:20,760 but he became full Irish in his actions and his beliefs. 883 00:46:20,919 --> 00:46:23,000 Saint Patrick came to our ancestors 884 00:46:23,040 --> 00:46:27,479 1,500 years ago, promising happiness here, 885 00:46:27,519 --> 00:46:29,439 as well as happiness hereafter. 886 00:46:29,799 --> 00:46:33,600 Having children who are Irish, born and raised here, 887 00:46:33,640 --> 00:46:37,280 of immigrant background, it was for me a testimony 888 00:46:37,320 --> 00:46:41,119 that a national identity can be forged not only because of 889 00:46:41,159 --> 00:46:43,439 your place of birth, but also because of your actions. 890 00:46:43,760 --> 00:46:46,439 It was the idea of such an Ireland - 891 00:46:46,479 --> 00:46:51,159 happy, vigorous, spiritual - 892 00:46:51,199 --> 00:46:53,919 that fired the imagination of our poets; 893 00:46:55,159 --> 00:46:58,600 and that made successive generations of patriotic men 894 00:46:58,640 --> 00:47:01,360 give their lives that they may win 895 00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:05,640 religious and political liberty; and that will urge men in our own 896 00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:08,720 and future generations to die, if need be. 897 00:47:10,040 --> 00:47:11,040 It was a civil war. 898 00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:12,559 His actions caused a lot of 899 00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:15,680 Irish deaths, a lot of needless war, 900 00:47:15,720 --> 00:47:18,439 and needless brutality, and it fractured, 901 00:47:18,479 --> 00:47:19,879 it splintered our culture. 902 00:47:19,919 --> 00:47:23,559 He was a man defined by hyper-traditionalism. 903 00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:27,199 He was a man who did not have enough empathy for certain groups 904 00:47:27,239 --> 00:47:29,400 in Ireland, and a man whose actions 905 00:47:29,439 --> 00:47:34,479 led a lot of people into despair, and levels of desolation. 906 00:47:34,720 --> 00:47:36,960 ..our contribution to humanity. 907 00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:38,919 In my memory, it was always there. 908 00:47:39,439 --> 00:47:41,720 Even when I was a teeny child, about five or six, 909 00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:43,080 like, there was God, 910 00:47:43,119 --> 00:47:45,320 there was the Church, there was school, 911 00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:46,400 there was Dev. 912 00:47:46,439 --> 00:47:49,000 My father Tom was a Fianna Fáil County councillor. 913 00:47:49,199 --> 00:47:52,360 His devotion to De Valera was, well, embarrassing. 914 00:47:52,519 --> 00:47:54,600 He was a great statesman. 915 00:47:54,799 --> 00:47:58,600 When we were gaining our independence and becoming a free, 916 00:47:58,640 --> 00:48:00,799 self-respecting country, that he, 917 00:48:00,839 --> 00:48:02,640 if you just take it even as a symbol, 918 00:48:02,680 --> 00:48:04,799 was a very, very good person to represent. 919 00:48:04,839 --> 00:48:07,960 He was very, very clever and politically very pragmatic, 920 00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:09,519 though very, very flawed. 921 00:48:09,640 --> 00:48:13,680 Dev, as the only surviving leader of the 1916 Rising, 922 00:48:13,839 --> 00:48:16,400 then went on to reject a Dáil vote 923 00:48:16,439 --> 00:48:19,199 accepting the Treaty and rejecting the results 924 00:48:19,239 --> 00:48:21,760 of the June 1922 general election, 925 00:48:21,839 --> 00:48:24,159 hardly the stance of a democrat. 926 00:48:24,640 --> 00:48:26,799 He had a now kind of unacknowledged charisma. 927 00:48:26,839 --> 00:48:29,000 He had an ability to manipulate and manoeuvre the media 928 00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:30,720 and his public image that is Machiavellian, 929 00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:31,799 that is modern, really. 930 00:48:32,839 --> 00:48:36,720 His capacity to bend expectation to his will and bring the public 931 00:48:36,760 --> 00:48:39,519 with him was absolutely superb, but he kind of used 932 00:48:39,559 --> 00:48:42,239 that skillset to, more often than not, 933 00:48:42,280 --> 00:48:44,280 bring the Irish people on the wrong road. 934 00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:46,119 (applause) 935 00:48:48,040 --> 00:48:50,439 It wasn't all his fault, but he was the leader, 936 00:48:50,479 --> 00:48:52,439 and if you're the leader, you get the blame. 937 00:48:55,559 --> 00:49:00,360 Between 1932 and 1959, when he was elected President, 938 00:49:00,479 --> 00:49:02,960 Éamon de Valera, dominated Dáil Éireann. 939 00:49:03,600 --> 00:49:06,760 And the Fianna Fáil party he founded remained 940 00:49:06,799 --> 00:49:10,000 the most popular political force of the 20th century. 941 00:49:10,799 --> 00:49:13,960 De Valera himself spent 21 years of his career 942 00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:18,040 as head of government, a record that will surely never broken. 943 00:49:18,119 --> 00:49:21,720 But after a rise punctuated by demoralising defeats 944 00:49:21,760 --> 00:49:26,519 and compelling comebacks, how does his rule stand the test of time? 945 00:49:27,040 --> 00:49:29,839 It's a time still of embedded patriarchy. 946 00:49:30,439 --> 00:49:33,159 He was absolutely defining Irishness as something that was 947 00:49:33,199 --> 00:49:34,720 not beholden to the Crown. 948 00:49:35,159 --> 00:49:37,479 We were desperately, desperately poor. 949 00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:40,320 The economic war had a devastating impact. 950 00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:42,680 There isn't really anything you can say to defend 951 00:49:42,720 --> 00:49:45,159 going to pay condolences on the death of Adolf Hitler. 952 00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:46,960 The Magdalen laundries, 953 00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:49,040 if you said that there was slavery in de Valera's Ireland, 954 00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:51,159 most people would go "No, look, that's a terrible thing to say," 955 00:49:51,199 --> 00:49:52,239 but it's just true. 956 00:49:55,280 --> 00:49:57,119 ♪ (dramatic orchestral music) 957 00:50:35,919 --> 00:50:37,960 Subtitles: RTÉ 2025 79126

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