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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:02,439 --> 00:00:05,799 30 years of democracy 2 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:14,480 November 1989. Victory Square, Bucharest 3 00:00:15,759 --> 00:00:18,839 Hey, boss! Look smart, they're filming you! 4 00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:21,039 Look over, he's filming you! Hold it up! 5 00:00:21,160 --> 00:00:23,079 Look smart, they're filming us! 6 00:00:23,679 --> 00:00:25,000 Lift it up! 7 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:30,160 Is it... 8 00:00:30,280 --> 00:00:31,760 That's it! Done! 9 00:00:53,039 --> 00:00:56,879 University Square, Bucharest 10 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:03,760 The 14th congress of the Romanian Communist Party 11 00:01:34,359 --> 00:01:38,359 ...the socio-economic development programme 12 00:01:39,159 --> 00:01:44,679 ....the entire activity of the party and even more determination 13 00:01:45,079 --> 00:01:52,039 ...for the programme that will forge a multilaterally developed socialist society 14 00:01:53,519 --> 00:01:58,000 ...Romania's independence and sovereignty. 15 00:01:59,799 --> 00:02:05,159 Hooray! Hooray! Hooray! 16 00:02:05,439 --> 00:02:10,159 Ceausescu PCR (Romanian Communist Party)! 17 00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:15,520 Long live Ceausescu, may Romania thrive! 18 00:02:16,120 --> 00:02:17,560 Long live Ceausescu! 19 00:02:17,759 --> 00:02:19,799 Hooray! Hooray! Hooray! 20 00:02:22,639 --> 00:02:25,799 One month later 21 00:02:38,759 --> 00:02:43,799 I believe that, for all of us, Ceausescu dying was something impossible, unbelievable. 22 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:46,760 I mean, we never imagined we'd ever escape. 23 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:50,280 Freedom! Freedom! Freedom! 24 00:02:50,599 --> 00:02:52,919 I really believe it was a rebirth, 25 00:02:52,960 --> 00:02:59,240 because, overnight, we stepped into a new world which had different rules. 26 00:02:59,439 --> 00:03:03,439 You could speak freely, you had hope. 27 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:05,560 Freedom! 28 00:03:06,199 --> 00:03:07,479 Ceausescu, the criminal! 29 00:03:07,599 --> 00:03:09,239 Ceausescu - kaput! 30 00:03:09,439 --> 00:03:13,680 History is sometimes a pot that boils over and blows the lid off. 31 00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:17,919 And, after 40 years of what we lived with, 32 00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:23,600 the idea that, for the first time in my life, I was a free man 33 00:03:23,800 --> 00:03:27,880 made me dizzy like I was drunk. The drunkenness of freedom. 34 00:03:28,319 --> 00:03:30,039 It was a sort of... 35 00:03:30,199 --> 00:03:33,879 A reaction to freedom, I mean... 36 00:03:35,479 --> 00:03:40,399 Finally, we can do anything. Without any worries, like some teenagers. 37 00:03:40,599 --> 00:03:43,799 Freedom! Freedom! 38 00:03:43,960 --> 00:03:46,879 There is a God! There is a God! 39 00:03:47,080 --> 00:03:52,080 There was an immense feeling of liberation 40 00:03:52,280 --> 00:03:55,800 and we all had this feeling that from this moment on 41 00:03:56,360 --> 00:04:01,040 we can do anything, we can tear down mountains, change everything. 42 00:04:01,319 --> 00:04:05,079 We were like kids who were not allowed to go to parties 43 00:04:05,199 --> 00:04:09,399 and the first party they go to, they get drunk and go crazy. 44 00:04:09,639 --> 00:04:12,919 That's kind of how we were after Ceausescu fell. 45 00:04:13,159 --> 00:04:20,360 During those days there was this feeling that, together, we were part of an ideal. 46 00:04:20,720 --> 00:04:22,600 Things are getting better and better. 47 00:04:23,040 --> 00:04:26,640 Let's rejoice, happy days are coming. 48 00:04:27,959 --> 00:04:29,919 After 45 years of communism, 49 00:04:30,199 --> 00:04:34,920 Romanians were discovering a feeling that many never experienced before: freedom. 50 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:35,680 Freedom! 51 00:04:35,959 --> 00:04:38,439 Freedom! Freedom! Freedom! 52 00:04:38,519 --> 00:04:44,279 Very few Romanians knew in 1990 what freedom means. 53 00:04:44,560 --> 00:04:50,240 How many in this country really knew that freedom is not something that can be given? 54 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:55,240 You either take it yourself, or you will never have it. 55 00:04:55,600 --> 00:05:00,080 The Romanian revolution was a great liberation, but it didn't solve everything overnight. 56 00:05:00,279 --> 00:05:04,519 In 1990, Romanians were setting off on a long journey during which they'd discover 57 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:07,480 just how difficult it is to build a democratic society. 58 00:05:07,879 --> 00:05:10,519 Freedom is a burden 59 00:05:10,759 --> 00:05:12,759 that many want to be rid of. 60 00:05:12,879 --> 00:05:15,560 Once they have it they don't know what to do with it. 61 00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:22,439 That was 1990. Romanians were saying: "There's just too much freedom!" 62 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:25,040 Too much freedom! 63 00:05:27,399 --> 00:05:31,319 Chapter 1 The burden of freedom 64 00:05:33,639 --> 00:05:34,439 We want... 65 00:05:34,519 --> 00:05:38,680 We want to be left alone, to live peacefully and to work. 66 00:05:38,920 --> 00:05:41,640 To have decent and honest jobs. 67 00:05:41,680 --> 00:05:43,840 Those who came from abroad should go back! 68 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:49,560 If these people come and buy the factories and start producing an excess, I'll tell you, 69 00:05:49,639 --> 00:05:54,399 we'll end up on the streets! That's what will become of us! Us, Romanians! 70 00:05:55,079 --> 00:05:58,120 The dawn of democracy found Romanians still in the streets, 71 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:03,160 gathered in city squares, discovering the joy of being able to speak freely. 72 00:06:03,720 --> 00:06:08,280 But doubt was born from these debates and freedom began to be a burden. 73 00:06:08,319 --> 00:06:12,839 I was working in a factory in the 90s, like everyone else, and I remember thinking... 74 00:06:12,959 --> 00:06:17,799 "What am I going to do?"? Will these factories keep running? Are they going to close?" 75 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:20,360 "Will my skills be in demand?" 76 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:23,879 And are they going to bring in Westerners to work in your institutions? 77 00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:26,400 They're not bringing anyone in. It's all machines now. 78 00:06:26,439 --> 00:06:29,439 If they want to keep you on, they will. If not, you're fired! 79 00:06:29,759 --> 00:06:33,199 You're fired! They'll fire you! 80 00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:37,639 They'll be on the French Riviera and you'll be a no-one! 81 00:06:38,439 --> 00:06:42,240 Overnight, all the landmarks were gone. 82 00:06:42,639 --> 00:06:45,639 And, of course, everyone was confused. 83 00:06:45,879 --> 00:06:50,480 Nature can't sustain a void and people need something to strive for 84 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:52,720 and someone needs to point them to it. 85 00:06:52,759 --> 00:06:54,560 What else could've come out of it? 86 00:06:54,720 --> 00:07:03,600 What could possibly come out of this vacuum, but the pseudo-landmark that was Ion Iliescu. 87 00:07:06,560 --> 00:07:13,759 We're determined to do everything we can to deliver on our commitments... 88 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:21,680 Ion Iliescu was the man who on Dec 22nd 1989 posed as the leader of the revolution, and assumed country leadership. 89 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:24,400 The country will be now known as 'Romania'! 90 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:30,040 Through the chaos and confusion at the time, people saw him as a saviour. 91 00:07:31,399 --> 00:07:34,000 ION ILIESCU WE TRUST HIM 92 00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:43,400 The entire country would wait for Ion Iliescu to come on TV 93 00:07:43,399 --> 00:07:48,879 and tell them what will happen with Romania. 94 00:07:49,120 --> 00:07:51,800 I'm open to all dialogue. 95 00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:58,240 And this was in essence Ion Iliescu's role: he provided society with the landmarks. 96 00:07:58,319 --> 00:08:01,800 I was 25 at the time of the revolution, and I liked him. 97 00:08:01,839 --> 00:08:06,639 because I felt he sounded sophisticated and educated. 98 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:11,560 The National Salvation Front, emerged from the Romanian Revolution in December 99 00:08:11,839 --> 00:08:18,000 and guarantees this country's freedom, peace, and security. 100 00:08:18,079 --> 00:08:23,800 And every worker in our factory was a FSN (National Salvation Front) and Iliescu die-hard , 101 00:08:23,879 --> 00:08:27,519 "he will defend us against the bourgeoisie who comes to take our jobs" 102 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:30,280 This was you'd hear everywhere. 103 00:08:30,519 --> 00:08:33,519 21st - 22nd, Iliescu was with us! 104 00:08:33,879 --> 00:08:38,679 After a revolution which claimed over a thousand deaths in the name of freedom from communism, 105 00:08:38,799 --> 00:08:42,559 people's fondness of Iliescu seemed incomprehensible. 106 00:08:42,720 --> 00:08:48,320 The man whose name they were chanting came from the frontline of the Communist Party. 107 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:53,720 Please prepare for the arrival of our country's flag! 108 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:58,960 Three colours I know in the world 109 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:02,560 Which I hold so dear and holy 110 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:13,920 He was someone capable of reshuffling the former communist structures 111 00:09:14,159 --> 00:09:20,600 in a way that they would resemble an original democracy, as he would call it, 112 00:09:20,799 --> 00:09:26,479 and he posed as a progressive figure, in relation to the party secretaries, 113 00:09:26,600 --> 00:09:29,399 or with Ceausescu and old-school communistists 114 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:36,879 He seemed the person to embody the Romanian society's ideal at the time: 115 00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:40,399 a Gorbachev-style reform of communism. 116 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:46,480 I received a call from Moscow, from president Gorbachev. 117 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:52,840 We agreed that relationships between our countries need to develop on a new, healthy foundation. 118 00:09:53,159 --> 00:09:57,000 FSN, FSN go back to USSR! 119 00:09:57,919 --> 00:10:02,439 There were, however, Romanians who wished the country would cut its communist ties for good 120 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:05,000 and implement a Western democracy. 121 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:09,040 Out with communism! Out with communism! Out with communism! 122 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:12,759 I was the school leader at the time, 123 00:10:13,320 --> 00:10:18,480 so I thought we would organise a protest to say: 124 00:10:18,879 --> 00:10:21,639 "Wait a minute, we want an actual change, 125 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:26,600 not a half-change, where people in charge are former communist party apparatchiks." 126 00:10:29,360 --> 00:10:32,680 Ceausescu, don't be sad, Iliescu's a communist! 127 00:10:32,879 --> 00:10:36,200 Ceausescu, don't be sad, Iliescu's a communist! 128 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:40,320 In the spring of 1990, those challenging Ion Iliescu's legitimacy 129 00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:43,600 started to gather every night in the Bucharest city centre. 130 00:10:43,639 --> 00:10:46,600 This gave birth to the "University Square" phenomenon. 131 00:10:46,759 --> 00:10:48,759 I went to bed with Ceausescu in charge 132 00:10:48,759 --> 00:10:50,759 When I woke up it was Iliescu 133 00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:54,120 And the fact their names rhyme is not a coincidence 134 00:10:54,720 --> 00:10:58,560 The purpose of this protest is to fight 135 00:10:58,679 --> 00:11:03,519 and oppose all forms of communism. 136 00:11:05,519 --> 00:11:13,720 No one asked for anything terrible like trials, death penalties and things like that. 137 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:21,280 The ask was simple: Those who built communism shouldn't be teaching us about living in a democracy. 138 00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:27,200 The 'Square' demanded: 139 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:33,879 First, members of Security (secret police) to be banned from politics. Sadly that never happened. 140 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:36,040 On this issue, the protesters were right. 141 00:11:36,080 --> 00:11:43,360 They also demanded that former communist officials shouldn't be frontbenchers. 142 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:48,720 And, of course, this was too a reasonable request. 143 00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:54,879 But in 1990, the demands from the 'Square' were ignored by the country's provisional leadership. 144 00:11:55,519 --> 00:12:01,720 There are those who take pity on the hooligans causing trouble in the city centre. 145 00:12:02,039 --> 00:12:06,159 The 'University Square phenomenon' highlighted the divide in Romanian society. 146 00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:10,840 Only months after marching united against a communist dictatorship, 147 00:12:10,919 --> 00:12:15,559 those in the square chanting 'Out with communism!' were now painted as hooligans. 148 00:12:15,639 --> 00:12:18,720 Yes, of course! I went to the square together with mum and dad. 149 00:12:18,759 --> 00:12:22,399 This, in fact, led to us falling out with my godparents. 150 00:12:22,639 --> 00:12:26,319 Because, every time we visited them, they'd say: You shouldn't be there, 151 00:12:26,440 --> 00:12:28,280 they're just bums and drug addicts. 152 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:31,080 There's sexual abominations and who knows what else... 153 00:12:31,159 --> 00:12:33,759 But we were in the square and knew what was going on. 154 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:37,200 It was staggering that a couple of intellectuals would say such things. 155 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:41,520 I remember my dad got upset and said: That's it, we're not going to visit them anymore. 156 00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:43,960 And we've never spoken to them since. 157 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:47,639 I'd rather be a bum than an apparatchik. 158 00:12:47,679 --> 00:12:51,519 I'd rather be dead than a communist! 159 00:12:51,600 --> 00:12:56,320 What upset a lot of people were those dreadful things you'd hear from University Square. 160 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:58,600 Like "I'd rather be dead than a communist" 161 00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:04,320 There were 4 million party members. Can you imagine? Every one of them was wondering: 162 00:13:04,399 --> 00:13:09,439 What's this? Do you mean to erase our whole lives? 163 00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:23,759 There were millions who in the 50s, 60s, and 70s, had gone through urbanization. 164 00:13:23,879 --> 00:13:27,720 They were taken haphazardly from villages and forced to work in factories. 165 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:31,440 They'd live in a flat for the first time in their lives. Had a fridge for the first time. 166 00:13:31,519 --> 00:13:34,319 Had a TV and a radio for the first time. 167 00:13:34,360 --> 00:13:37,720 And for most of them there was never anything else but communism. 168 00:13:37,759 --> 00:13:44,519 If you were 44 or younger, you knew nothing but communism for your whole life. 169 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:55,640 That was their life! That's where they lived and worked, accomplished things, had children. 170 00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:58,759 So that's what it was about. 171 00:14:02,519 --> 00:14:06,559 Chapter 2: "We won at the revolution, let's win at democracy" 172 00:14:07,879 --> 00:14:13,679 Dear viewers, in the next two hours, the guests in our studio 173 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:17,960 are the three presidential candidates, 174 00:14:18,519 --> 00:14:23,319 Radu Campeanu, Ion Iliescu, and Ion Ratiu. 175 00:14:23,879 --> 00:14:27,720 After spending the last few months, protesting and marching, 176 00:14:27,840 --> 00:14:30,639 the time came for Romanians to make a decision. 177 00:14:30,879 --> 00:14:36,399 On the 20th of May 1990, post-communist Romania was going to hold its first free election. 178 00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:40,680 Ion Iliescu and the National Salvation Front were competing with the historical parties 179 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:42,519 resurrected after the Revolution: 180 00:14:42,519 --> 00:14:45,720 The National Liberal Party, led by Radu Campeanu, 181 00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:50,000 And the National Peasants' Party, backing Ion Ratiu for president. 182 00:14:50,039 --> 00:14:54,559 Both returned to Romania at the beginning of 1990, after a long exile in the West 183 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:59,120 and convinced that Romanians wouldn't elect a former communist leader as president. 184 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:06,399 Mr. Iliescu acknowledges that the system he grew up in 185 00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:12,799 and which he served his entire life is a disaster and in need of radical change. 186 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:17,680 If we'd want to pursue a relationship with the East, I would vote for Mr. Iliescu 187 00:15:17,919 --> 00:15:23,159 But, if we wish to connect with the West, then Mr. Iliescu doesn't have the credibility 188 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:27,320 this country currently needs in order to become a democracy. 189 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:30,520 If you'll excuse me, I feel I must address some of your points. 190 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:34,879 I believe we shouldn't look towards East or West, but towards Romania first. 191 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:39,200 A Romanian democracy must be built with an understanding of the realities in Romania 192 00:15:39,240 --> 00:15:42,279 and not by copying foreign models. 193 00:15:42,559 --> 00:15:47,359 We've copied a foreign model before and it proved to be bankrupt. 194 00:15:47,399 --> 00:15:50,439 Therefore, we shouldn't look to foreign models for guidance... 195 00:15:50,759 --> 00:15:52,279 I want a free democracy! 196 00:15:52,360 --> 00:15:55,639 We, the workers, should be the owners of this nation's resources! 197 00:15:55,879 --> 00:15:59,120 50% Romanians, 50% foreigners! 198 00:15:59,279 --> 00:16:01,399 How can we allow foreigners as owners? 199 00:16:01,559 --> 00:16:03,039 Not, not to own. 200 00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:05,320 What are you going on about, boy? 201 00:16:05,399 --> 00:16:07,799 You're young, you have no idea what life is about. 202 00:16:07,879 --> 00:16:13,279 I'm 52 years old, I know what it means for an employer to come in and boss you around. 203 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:17,159 Let's not blindly copy from others! 204 00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:21,840 Servitude to the West isn't less dignified than servitude to the East. 205 00:16:22,200 --> 00:16:24,920 We don't need any kind of servitude. 206 00:16:24,919 --> 00:16:27,839 Ion Iliescu's message would easily relate with the public, 207 00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:32,480 while the speeches on democracy and Western values from Ratiu and Campeanu 208 00:16:32,519 --> 00:16:34,720 were met with an instinctive reluctance. 209 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:38,759 They're not our people, man. They didn't eat soy salami. 210 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:43,879 These messages spread really fast: they didn't eat soy salami like we did. They didn't suffer 211 00:16:44,440 --> 00:16:46,480 Please, listen up! 212 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:48,720 Please, listen up! 213 00:16:49,039 --> 00:16:50,480 Give him a megaphone! 214 00:16:51,039 --> 00:16:52,559 Get a second megaphone! 215 00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:53,960 We can hear you, we can hear you! 216 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:55,799 Ratiu: bowtie. 217 00:16:55,879 --> 00:16:58,200 No one wears a bowtie. He's not one of us. 218 00:16:58,559 --> 00:17:02,519 You don't show up in front of a poverty-stricken nation, 219 00:17:02,600 --> 00:17:08,279 a nation which lived through the most terrible events in its recent history, 220 00:17:08,480 --> 00:17:17,000 with a bowtie and an air of aristocracy which 90% of the population couldn't relate with. 221 00:17:17,680 --> 00:17:24,320 They kept me locked up for three hours at the Buzau Police Department, ready to lynch me! 222 00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:32,200 While trying to somehow explain that democracy means listening to an argument before disagreeing with it. 223 00:17:32,279 --> 00:17:37,599 The essence of democracy is this: 224 00:17:38,039 --> 00:17:45,839 I will fight until my dying breath for you to have the right to disagree with me. 225 00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:54,640 He was talking about very lofty ideals. But these could not be used to lead Romania in 1990. 226 00:17:54,759 --> 00:18:01,079 Romania in 1990 was a country where many were former members of the Communist Party, 227 00:18:01,119 --> 00:18:07,839 members of the secret police, people unable to carry the burden of freedom. 228 00:18:08,039 --> 00:18:13,599 And then there was Ratiu and his ideals. It wouldn't have worked. 229 00:18:13,680 --> 00:18:17,000 It wouldn't have worked because the majority of Romanians rejected 230 00:18:17,039 --> 00:18:19,599 anything unrelated to their communist past. 231 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:22,240 We don't agree with the ones that came from abroad! 232 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:24,640 They lived in capitalism and now they come to our country? 233 00:18:24,640 --> 00:18:27,480 It doesn't matter whether it's communism or capitalism. 234 00:18:27,519 --> 00:18:32,960 What matters is that we don't elect the ones who came from abroad, they should go back abroad! 235 00:18:33,039 --> 00:18:36,440 But not all historical parties leaders came from the West. 236 00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:39,200 Corneliu Coposu, president of the Peasants' Party 237 00:18:39,279 --> 00:18:43,480 came with the moral authority of having spent 17 years in communist prisons. 238 00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:45,519 But the country wasn't impressed. 239 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:52,480 In early 1990, thousands of workers stormed the Peasants' Party headquarters, ready to lynch Coposu. 240 00:18:53,759 --> 00:18:57,119 Ole, OIe. Get out, old man! 241 00:18:58,279 --> 00:19:02,240 I remember when I got the call from Corneliu Coposu 242 00:19:02,519 --> 00:19:08,519 and he said there's a risk of physical harm for the leaders of the Peasants' Party. 243 00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:11,240 I went there right away. 244 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:15,279 Leave the country! Leave the country! 245 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:17,519 We don't have the right to mistreat them! 246 00:19:18,759 --> 00:19:24,839 I went to the balcony and tried to address the crowds 247 00:19:25,240 --> 00:19:29,680 and then we heard that slogan: 'They didn't eat soy salami' 248 00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:34,559 and that's when I lost the plot, as they say. 249 00:19:35,079 --> 00:19:39,079 I said: Folks, the man you see next to me, Corneliu Coposu, 250 00:19:39,160 --> 00:19:43,600 spent 17 years in communist prisons. What are you talking about? 251 00:19:43,799 --> 00:19:47,599 He'd be lucky to get some bread and some water. 252 00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:50,320 He could only dream about soy salami! 253 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:58,680 Brothers, please understand, right now the whole world is watching us. 254 00:19:59,519 --> 00:20:04,160 We won at the Revolution! I beg you, let's win at democracy as well! 255 00:20:04,279 --> 00:20:08,599 Coposu escaped the anger of the crowd in an army's armored vehicle. 256 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:11,880 People were convinced they managed to remove a threat. 257 00:20:11,880 --> 00:20:17,320 Iliescu for president, not brainless Coposu! 258 00:20:18,319 --> 00:20:23,240 In this context, the result of the election on May 20th was a foregone conclusion. 259 00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:29,200 But the FSN nevertheless adopted a series of populist measures in efforts to secure their votes. 260 00:20:29,319 --> 00:20:33,639 What's the situation at the moment? How are pensions being paid? 261 00:20:33,759 --> 00:20:40,400 Pensions are paid based on the decisions of the FSN. 262 00:20:40,680 --> 00:20:45,960 At the agricultural cooperative in Botoroaga, they are paying out the pensions. 263 00:20:46,519 --> 00:20:48,839 Who wants to say a few words? 264 00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:53,200 It's clear that it's higher than it used to be. 265 00:20:53,640 --> 00:21:00,440 Before, one would get, depending on their job, around 120-130 lei, sometimes 200. 266 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:02,720 And now it's 500 lei upwards. 267 00:21:02,759 --> 00:21:04,079 - Did you get it? -Yes. 268 00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:05,039 Let's see it! 269 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:06,160 I have it here! 270 00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:08,160 Are those new or old banknotes? 271 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:10,080 They're good, that's what they are... 272 00:21:10,319 --> 00:21:14,759 Yes, it's true. You'd be able to get groceries, salaries went up. 273 00:21:15,279 --> 00:21:19,559 In essence, from an economics perspective, this amounts to bribing the population. 274 00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:23,559 To give them the false impression that they're living better. 275 00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:30,079 You've accused me of bribing the population, of providing them with some basic needs. 276 00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:36,359 But we should care about the living standards and about doing what's needed 277 00:21:36,599 --> 00:21:41,439 in these trying times. And about helping these people out as soon as possible, 278 00:21:41,519 --> 00:21:43,200 This is a serious matter. 279 00:21:43,359 --> 00:21:49,439 Ratiu and Campeanu were right to accuse Iliescu and Roman of bribing the population before the elections. 280 00:21:49,519 --> 00:21:51,720 And they bribed it with serious money. 281 00:21:52,440 --> 00:22:00,759 They paid back, to the entire population, the funds from the so-called 'social shares'. 282 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:05,920 These were some sort of share options offered by your employer. 283 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:12,400 Part of your salary would go towards buying these, on the promise you'd get a share of the profit. 284 00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:15,440 Whenever the enterprise would become profitable. 285 00:22:15,559 --> 00:22:18,759 Well, over the years, that money amounted to a nice payout. 286 00:22:18,839 --> 00:22:21,959 I think it was around 17 billion Lei (approx $120m in 1990) 287 00:22:22,079 --> 00:22:27,679 I was the last one to fight this and say: no, no, no! 288 00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:33,880 But the pressure to pay this out was unbearable. And none of it was right. 289 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:36,559 They wanted to win the elections, right? 290 00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:42,039 So they paid all of it out. They would tell people: 'Just go to the cashier'. 291 00:22:42,279 --> 00:22:43,759 Cash in hand! 292 00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:47,680 I got some as well, it was a nice payout. 293 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:53,640 I remember a colleague, bearded, fat guy, who got his money from the cashier and said: 294 00:22:53,720 --> 00:22:55,759 'That's more like it!' 295 00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:58,000 That's more like it... 296 00:22:58,319 --> 00:23:03,119 That was the attitude at the time. And of course, people went to vote in droves. 297 00:23:03,319 --> 00:23:06,200 To vote Iliescu and Roman. 'Cause at least they gave us something' 298 00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:13,079 And such was the day of May 20th 1990, a day of patience and reflection, 299 00:23:13,279 --> 00:23:16,399 when the Romanians searched for their path to the future, 300 00:23:16,599 --> 00:23:22,359 a pursuit emphasised by the high turnout at the first free elections since World War II. 301 00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:30,039 15 million voters would elect the Senate, the Chamber of Deputies, and the president of Romania. 302 00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:33,640 I voted for Iliescu. In May 1990, I voted for Iliescu. 303 00:23:33,839 --> 00:23:39,919 Because I was thoroughly brainwashed by the FSN propaganda. 304 00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:41,200 I was a believer. 305 00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:53,000 I voted for Iliescu on a single argument: at that time, he was the only one able to deliver some stability. 306 00:23:53,240 --> 00:24:00,359 I never regretted this decision and, believe me, there was no other option. 307 00:24:00,559 --> 00:24:01,559 THE MAN WE NEED 308 00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:03,600 I believe Iliescu was inevitable. 309 00:24:03,759 --> 00:24:08,039 I think it was an awful solution for Romania, but it was an inevitable one. 310 00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:14,040 Mr. Ion Iliescu, who secured over 12 million votes, becoming the president elect, 311 00:24:14,279 --> 00:24:18,920 has outlined the issues facing the President, the Parliament, and the new Government. 312 00:24:19,160 --> 00:24:21,600 What did we do wrong then? 313 00:24:21,839 --> 00:24:23,799 We didn't do anything wrong. 314 00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:27,640 This was the natural course of our history. 315 00:24:27,799 --> 00:24:33,559 People who were in the system before the 90's had a lot of experience in running an organisation. 316 00:24:33,759 --> 00:24:41,319 The party machinery, the secret police, they had well defined structures. While the people, 317 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:45,680 the civil society in Romania, was nonexistent at the time. 318 00:24:46,799 --> 00:24:55,119 I pledge allegiance to the Romanian people, its ideals of liberty and prosperity. 319 00:24:56,519 --> 00:25:02,680 I pledge to uphold the laws of the country, to safeguard democracy. 320 00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:12,680 On June 13th 1990, weeks after Ion Iliescu became the first president of post-communist Romania, 321 00:25:13,200 --> 00:25:17,880 law enforcement brutally squashed the rest of the protests in University Square. 322 00:25:18,079 --> 00:25:19,679 Out with Iliescu! 323 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:21,880 Shame! They're killing people in the street! 324 00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:22,840 Shame! 325 00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:26,680 Incidents escalated, and Bucharest started to look like a war zone. 326 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:31,799 The violence on that day, when institutions were attacked with Molotov cocktails, 327 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:33,840 were never cleared up. 328 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:35,759 June 13th was a horrendous event. 329 00:25:36,079 --> 00:25:40,079 That was an attempt - I still believe to this day - of the former secrete police 330 00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:43,400 to reinstate itself in Romanian society. 331 00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:49,400 The idea was very simple: "we still need to be a lever of power". 332 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:53,240 Whether they were masterminded by the secret police or not, 333 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:57,920 the events on June 13th determined Iliescu to call the entire population to take the streets. 334 00:25:58,319 --> 00:26:02,960 We are dealing with a rebellion of a fascist nature. 335 00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:09,440 Therefore, we need a unity between all the conscious powers in the country, 336 00:26:09,920 --> 00:26:14,880 of the whole nation, to respond to these... 337 00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:19,920 The next morning, June 14th, 338 00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:24,440 tens of thousands of miners arrived in the Capital, responding to Ion Iliescu's call, 339 00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:27,680 but also because of the newly founded SRI (Romanian Intelligence Service) 340 00:26:27,880 --> 00:26:33,480 It's been proven, as I've noted in the SRI's report at the time, 341 00:26:33,559 --> 00:26:42,559 that, disappointingly, there were some intelligence officers, part of the SRI, 342 00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:51,960 who were involved in bringing the miners in. And causing a thing that should never have happened. 343 00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:56,919 Bringing in the miners was, in fact, their (the SRI officers') most important action. 344 00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:01,719 Because they planned it, we ended up with the miners here, 345 00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:06,759 which then led to the horrible events we've seen at the time. 346 00:27:11,559 --> 00:27:15,319 Very early in the morning of June 14th, 347 00:27:15,799 --> 00:27:19,000 we got the news that the miners were near Bucharest. 348 00:27:19,279 --> 00:27:24,480 We decided that Ion Iliescu would address them, as he was their man, so to speak. 349 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:29,440 And tell them "I know you came all this way, but there are no issues here." 350 00:27:29,599 --> 00:27:32,639 We'd give them a hot meal and they'd be on their way. 351 00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:35,519 Unfortunately, things got out of hand, as you know. 352 00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:40,600 Instead of sending them home, Ion Iliescu sent the miners to University Square. 353 00:27:40,599 --> 00:27:45,879 The miners, lead by Mr. Cozma, will advance towards University Square, 354 00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:49,040 which we wish for you to occupy. 355 00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:54,559 This is where scenes of unprecedented violence took place, images that would be seen worldwide 356 00:27:54,599 --> 00:27:58,719 and would label Romania as a nation declining into anarchy. 357 00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:02,480 Some people with some clubs 358 00:28:02,559 --> 00:28:06,159 bludgeoned some other people, law enforcement was in riot gear 359 00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:11,360 buses and the Home Office were set on fire. This wasn't what shocked the Western viewer though. 360 00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:13,600 They've seen their fair share of this. 361 00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:18,880 The novelty was that all of this was somehow a response to a call from the authorities. 362 00:28:19,039 --> 00:28:23,720 One part of the population was pitted against the other. 363 00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:29,839 Romania was closely followed at the time, it was all around the news. 364 00:28:29,839 --> 00:28:33,359 There were lots of freelance journalists in the country at the time 365 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:35,839 Naturally, Romania's image deteriorated. 366 00:28:35,839 --> 00:28:40,159 I was in Paris, right after these events, and I could've argued anything 367 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:45,720 I'm blue-eyed, I'm Romanian, I read Baudelaire. The response was always: 'Les Mineurs' (The Miners) 368 00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:49,560 Chapter 3 The school of piranhas 369 00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:50,560 What's your name? 370 00:28:50,559 --> 00:28:51,200 Cotarla Marian. 371 00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:51,839 What's that? 372 00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:53,000 Cotarla Marian. 373 00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:54,320 And do you go to school? 374 00:28:54,359 --> 00:28:54,759 Yes. 375 00:28:54,759 --> 00:28:55,279 Where? 376 00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:56,200 108. 377 00:28:56,359 --> 00:28:57,759 School number 108, right? 378 00:28:57,799 --> 00:28:58,839 What grade? 379 00:28:58,839 --> 00:28:59,639 Tenth grade. 380 00:28:59,799 --> 00:29:00,799 Where did you get these cigarettes? 381 00:29:00,799 --> 00:29:01,480 I bought them. 382 00:29:01,519 --> 00:29:02,359 Where from? 383 00:29:02,359 --> 00:29:03,359 Foreigners. 384 00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:05,120 You mean foreign citizens, right? 385 00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:05,960 How much did you pay? 386 00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:06,559 30. 387 00:29:06,799 --> 00:29:07,279 30? 388 00:29:07,359 --> 00:29:09,199 And here you sell them for 50-60 lei, right? 389 00:29:09,279 --> 00:29:10,079 No, 40. 390 00:29:10,279 --> 00:29:11,039 40, right? 391 00:29:11,119 --> 00:29:12,679 So that you can make a profit. 392 00:29:12,839 --> 00:29:13,720 Right? 393 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:17,440 After half a year of violence and uncertainty, 394 00:29:17,559 --> 00:29:20,279 Romanians were discovering the upsides of democracy. 395 00:29:20,359 --> 00:29:21,799 And the most daring of them 396 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,360 started testing the most basic forms of capitalism in the street. 397 00:29:25,519 --> 00:29:29,839 Dear viewers, we're looking at so-called trading (bisnita, meaning scalping) 398 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:31,960 a word that, someone told me jokingly, 399 00:29:32,119 --> 00:29:35,439 might come from the English word "business". 400 00:29:35,519 --> 00:29:39,160 I also went out on the boulevard, I'm not ashamed to admit it. 401 00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:41,920 I sold cigarettes, tickets, jeans. 402 00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:45,000 I did a bit of trading, so to speak. 403 00:29:45,400 --> 00:29:48,720 At that time it was called a scalping (bișniță) 404 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:50,680 How much did you pay for these? 405 00:29:50,759 --> 00:29:53,000 I bought them for 70 lei, so same price. 406 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:54,519 I got stuck with them and... 407 00:29:54,599 --> 00:29:55,959 And you sell them for 75? 408 00:29:56,079 --> 00:29:57,079 He asked me for 75. 409 00:29:57,160 --> 00:29:57,960 You know what? 410 00:29:57,960 --> 00:29:59,559 Yeah, I know, you asked me 75. 411 00:29:59,559 --> 00:30:00,519 Where do you work? 412 00:30:00,559 --> 00:30:02,319 Come on, this is a waste of time! 413 00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:06,080 It was inevitable! This was the emergence of capitalism. 414 00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:08,720 Things were being sold everywhere. Anything worked. 415 00:30:08,720 --> 00:30:11,519 No matter what you were selling, people would buy it. 416 00:30:11,640 --> 00:30:13,400 The problem was getting the goods. 417 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:17,040 The more stock you had and the more diversified, the more you'd sell. 418 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:19,000 I was making a bag of money. 419 00:30:19,119 --> 00:30:20,519 Yes, I had a lot of money. 420 00:30:20,519 --> 00:30:23,960 A lot of money even by today's standards, never mind back then. 421 00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:26,640 Because things were going well, to be honest. 422 00:30:27,519 --> 00:30:29,400 Smuggling. 423 00:30:29,799 --> 00:30:32,720 In 1990, more than half of business people 424 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:37,440 would go to places like Turkey and come back with truckloads of goods. 425 00:30:37,519 --> 00:30:41,680 They would buy cigarettes for 12 lei and they would then sell them for 100. 426 00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:45,480 They would buy jeans for $10 and then sell it for $100-200 in Romania. 427 00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:47,680 That was the business back then. 428 00:30:47,799 --> 00:30:53,240 You would see on our roads Dacia cars with the trunks full to the brim. 429 00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:55,839 With goods from Turkey. 430 00:30:57,039 --> 00:31:02,039 I was the Minister of Finance and Petre Roman was prime minister. 431 00:31:02,119 --> 00:31:04,959 I accompanied him on a visit to Turkey. 432 00:31:05,119 --> 00:31:10,279 Where, at that time, the president was an economist 433 00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:13,759 And in a discussion with him, he said: 434 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:18,680 "I've noticed a great deal of traffic 435 00:31:18,839 --> 00:31:21,919 from Romania to Turkey, from Turkey to Romania." 436 00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:28,640 "Some bring ball bearings to sell in Turkey. From Turkey they buy gold, silk." 437 00:31:28,799 --> 00:31:30,519 And I thought, "What do I do now?" 438 00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:34,160 "Should I strengthen border checks, enforce custom duty?" 439 00:31:34,599 --> 00:31:37,639 And we said: "Let them trade!" 440 00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:46,160 Who could resist that huge wave that started in Romania in the 90's? 441 00:31:46,160 --> 00:31:48,120 Absolutely no one! 442 00:31:49,079 --> 00:31:52,960 You can't get in the way of a people, my friend, no matter who you were. 443 00:31:54,799 --> 00:31:58,559 They brought that gold jewellery from Turkey, they called it "peas". 444 00:31:58,759 --> 00:32:00,839 Those chains and bracelets. 445 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:04,160 And I would sell them in the shop for a 50% margin. 446 00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:08,920 And, after about a year, I got a visit from Revenue and Customs. 447 00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:13,480 I got fined because I didn't have a license to sell it. I didn't know that I wasn't allowed to sell gold. 448 00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:15,960 Apparently I needed a license from BNR (National Bank of Romania). 449 00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:17,759 I'm not gonna lie, I kept selling for a few more years 450 00:32:17,759 --> 00:32:19,440 without any license, just as before. 451 00:32:19,720 --> 00:32:23,240 I was selling one kilogram of gold every three days. 452 00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:29,799 After the Revolution, in 1990, the beginning of 1990, 453 00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:32,279 we were like a school of piranhas. 454 00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:35,400 We would jump at anything that moves. 455 00:32:35,599 --> 00:32:38,359 No laws, no taxes, no duty, nothing. 456 00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:42,400 You should know that this scalping had a positive impact too. 457 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,960 Because it kept money moving in the economy. 458 00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:48,840 I did the smartest thing that anyone could do. 459 00:32:49,119 --> 00:32:53,000 I wasn't happy with opening just one shop, so I opened 174. 460 00:32:53,359 --> 00:32:54,599 Simple! 461 00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:59,720 I wasn't happy with smuggling a Dacia trunk, I smuggled 15-20 trucks a day. 462 00:32:59,960 --> 00:33:01,200 Simple! 463 00:33:01,599 --> 00:33:05,919 He was the first to open a shop in Bacău. He was from Roman by birth. 464 00:33:06,079 --> 00:33:10,679 He hired a venue in the centre of Bacau, and opened a shop, Royal Boutique. 465 00:33:10,799 --> 00:33:12,639 I remember what it was called. 466 00:33:12,839 --> 00:33:17,039 "Royal Boutique, the arbiter of elegance in Bacău" was the tagline. 467 00:33:17,200 --> 00:33:20,400 When they were restocking, people could kill for it: 468 00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:26,040 clothes, knitwear, slippers, purses, watches, gold, cigarettes, anything. 469 00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:30,120 It was a bazaar, basically, this Royal Boutique. 470 00:33:30,119 --> 00:33:32,359 There was nothing "royal" about it. 471 00:33:32,519 --> 00:33:37,240 I had only one thing in mind at the time: to make money. 472 00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:39,920 Nothing else! 473 00:33:47,079 --> 00:33:52,159 The merchants bringing goods from Turkey weren't the only ones to make money in the early 1990s. 474 00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:57,200 In communist Romania there was a small group of people who knew the rules of capitalism, 475 00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:01,200 and after the Revolution they exploited Romanians' naivety and consumerism. 476 00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:06,960 One of these people was George Pădure, who opened the first appliance store in Romania, Gepa. 477 00:34:07,039 --> 00:34:09,639 We had 40,000 items. 478 00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:12,240 I made a boom here. 479 00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:13,720 Crazy. 480 00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:17,280 VHS's and TVs sold really well. 481 00:34:17,559 --> 00:34:20,840 TVs, refrigerators, cars ... 482 00:34:21,119 --> 00:34:24,920 Everything that the Romanians lacked during communism. 483 00:34:25,039 --> 00:34:27,400 And the boom started. 484 00:34:31,199 --> 00:34:33,119 Those were happy times. 485 00:34:33,159 --> 00:34:37,119 There were times when, obviously, a lot of money was being made. 486 00:34:37,119 --> 00:34:41,799 Remember, there were margins of up to 6000%. 487 00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:43,960 Just so you know what we're talking about. 488 00:34:44,199 --> 00:34:45,759 Well, think about it now 489 00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:49,640 you buy that vase for 100 euros and sell it for 6000 euros. 490 00:34:49,679 --> 00:34:52,399 You didn't pay corporate tax, you didn't pay anything. 491 00:34:52,519 --> 00:34:55,000 That's a profit of 5900 euros in your pocket. 492 00:34:56,119 --> 00:35:01,239 Like George Pădure, in communism Viorel Catarama worked for a private company in the West. 493 00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:04,960 This was almost impossible without having some connection with the Security. 494 00:35:05,119 --> 00:35:08,480 I started living well since 1988 495 00:35:09,159 --> 00:35:15,039 when I became the employee and manager in Eastern Europe for Belco. 496 00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:19,920 We bought furniture from Eastern Europe to sell it in the Benelux. 497 00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:24,880 Mr. Viorel Catarama is among the few 498 00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:29,320 who, prior to '89, worked in foreign trade. 499 00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:36,639 They were the only people who had the list of foreign clients. 500 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:42,039 He used his contacts. So did most people in these kinds of jobs. 501 00:35:42,880 --> 00:35:50,200 Right after the Revolution, when the law was passed to allow private companies, 502 00:35:51,079 --> 00:35:58,679 quite a few of the people involved in foreign trade registered private companies, 503 00:35:58,679 --> 00:36:04,199 and took over the network of external customers 504 00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,199 who were now trading through these new companies. 505 00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:11,599 Viorel Catarama was one of those who used this method. 506 00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:17,880 Immediately after the Revolution, he left Belco and founded his own company, Elvila. 507 00:36:18,079 --> 00:36:21,920 After 1990, the company Belco became the client of Elvila. 508 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:26,760 And instead of buying furniture from Tehno Forest, it would buy furniture from Elvila. 509 00:36:27,159 --> 00:36:32,759 The company owned by a former foreign trade officer became the middleman between state-owned companies 510 00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:35,280 and foreign companies importing from Romania. 511 00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:39,599 On one side, they were dealing with the international contract. 512 00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:48,280 At the same time, they were handling the domestic contract and had full bargaining power with the domestic supplier. 513 00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:50,920 Which had no leverage whatsoever! 514 00:36:51,199 --> 00:36:56,960 Many who worked in foreign trade were Security officers, 515 00:36:57,079 --> 00:37:01,039 and they would pull the strings of export-import relationships. 516 00:37:01,159 --> 00:37:03,839 Yes, they were profiteers. It's true. 517 00:37:04,199 --> 00:37:07,480 There are many former Security officers 518 00:37:07,599 --> 00:37:11,119 who have become businessmen 519 00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:15,240 and who operated, 520 00:37:15,559 --> 00:37:21,159 in ways which indeed were threatening to the Romanian state. 521 00:37:21,519 --> 00:37:25,039 I never denied and I'll never deny that 522 00:37:25,199 --> 00:37:29,319 I've been labelled in certain ways for the past 25 years. 523 00:37:29,639 --> 00:37:34,079 Like being a Security officer. 524 00:37:34,320 --> 00:37:35,200 I don't deny it! 525 00:37:35,559 --> 00:37:39,360 I would only be denying what is a matter of record. 526 00:37:39,599 --> 00:37:42,440 Iliescu made a pact then with the Security. 527 00:37:42,679 --> 00:37:49,319 He brought them back in and opened the gates of business for them. 528 00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:55,400 I don't remember ever having contact with a Security officer. 529 00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:58,120 I might have, but without my knowledge. 530 00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:03,119 And I found out later that my boss, Dragoș Diaconescu, had ties to the Security. 531 00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:08,239 Colleagues, employees of the Chamber of Commerce, of the Argus Office. 532 00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:15,320 Look, I was in those 20, or 10 people, the 2%, or 0.2% that were not (part of Security). 533 00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:19,240 From businessmen to foreign trade officers, 534 00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:23,480 the first capitalists of the post-communists Romania exploited the circumstances 535 00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:25,440 and profitted hugely. 536 00:38:25,559 --> 00:38:32,599 It was the beginnings of certain types of wealth which now allows some individuals 537 00:38:32,599 --> 00:38:34,000 to look down on us. 538 00:38:34,199 --> 00:38:38,960 30 years later. Themselves, their family, their descendants. 539 00:38:39,199 --> 00:38:41,439 It was then, in 1990. 540 00:38:41,639 --> 00:38:44,079 I made a lot of money! 541 00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:46,599 It's just a fact. 542 00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:50,559 Money in the bag. Some in carrier bags, some in briefcases. 543 00:38:50,639 --> 00:38:51,960 There were many anomalies. 544 00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:53,760 But this was life, it was beautiful. 545 00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:54,840 It was a start. 546 00:38:54,960 --> 00:39:00,519 So money, profit making, co-financial economic indicators 547 00:39:00,639 --> 00:39:05,400 the business plan, the revenue and expenditure budget were secondary. 548 00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:07,320 We were young! 549 00:39:07,519 --> 00:39:09,119 Life was beautiful! 550 00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:11,760 At the end of 1990, 551 00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:14,120 I had a 4 room flat. 552 00:39:14,159 --> 00:39:15,559 Somewhere in Roman. 553 00:39:15,559 --> 00:39:18,519 I managed to furnish three rooms before the Revolution, 554 00:39:18,599 --> 00:39:21,119 the fourth room, the living room, wasn't furnished. 555 00:39:21,119 --> 00:39:23,279 At the end of 1990, 556 00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:26,680 I had in the unfurnished room $100 million in cash. 557 00:39:27,199 --> 00:39:29,480 I celebrated with my wife back then 558 00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:32,039 by drinking a bottle of champagne 559 00:39:32,039 --> 00:39:34,960 and making love on $100 million cash. 560 00:39:36,159 --> 00:39:39,839 Despite the increasing number of Romanians venturing into business, 561 00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:43,320 most of the population was still employed in factories and plants. 562 00:39:43,559 --> 00:39:48,759 But the desire to feel the benefits of democracy were just as great. 563 00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:55,719 There was a lot of pressure to have an extra non-working day a week (Saturday), like the West. 564 00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:59,079 People worked less, produced less, and still wanted higher wages. 565 00:39:59,079 --> 00:40:03,079 That's when I said: "We can't make a living if we don't work!" 566 00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:05,760 Petre Roman, yes, is right. 567 00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:08,000 After the Revolution, the workers said: 568 00:40:08,119 --> 00:40:09,920 "We are finally in charge now" 569 00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:11,840 "The dictatorship is over!" 570 00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:13,800 "And this is our factory, mister!" 571 00:40:13,960 --> 00:40:15,800 "We do what we want with it!" 572 00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:20,079 So we had months when 573 00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:24,039 the economy, the businesses were fending for themselves. 574 00:40:24,159 --> 00:40:26,079 I went to Tractor factory in Brasov. 575 00:40:26,639 --> 00:40:29,440 And people had some demands. 576 00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:33,039 And they were expecting me to give them 577 00:40:33,079 --> 00:40:35,400 some words of encouragement. 578 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:38,600 And then I said, "Fellows!" 579 00:40:38,679 --> 00:40:41,119 "Do you wanna know how we're doing?" 580 00:40:41,360 --> 00:40:43,559 "Look, I'll tell you how we're doing." 581 00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:46,120 I'll tell you exactly what I did. 582 00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:48,519 "This is how we're doing." 583 00:40:48,719 --> 00:40:51,319 And then I did this. 584 00:40:52,480 --> 00:40:54,320 "That's how we're doing." 585 00:40:54,320 --> 00:40:56,080 "Empty pockets." 586 00:40:56,519 --> 00:41:02,000 At the end of 1990, the gross domestic product collapsed by more than 10% 587 00:41:02,119 --> 00:41:05,719 The left overs from the communist regime were dwindling every month, 588 00:41:06,039 --> 00:41:09,440 and transitional measures to a market economy were inevitable. 589 00:41:09,639 --> 00:41:13,159 We needed to transform the super-centralized economy 590 00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:15,640 into a free economy, into a private economy. 591 00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:20,360 Basically, in Romania you had to start building. 592 00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:26,400 And to build, Romania needed foreign investments to modernize communist factories. 593 00:41:26,639 --> 00:41:28,799 Roman truck factory from Brașov 594 00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:32,840 was the first with a chance to get out of the deadlock of this period. 595 00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:36,120 The opportunity for the truck factory in Brașov was 596 00:41:36,599 --> 00:41:41,039 for a big player in the industry, like Mercedes, or Volvo, 597 00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:45,960 to come in and do what Renault did for Dacia. 598 00:41:46,119 --> 00:41:53,559 In april 1990, Werner Niefer, the General Director of Mercedes, came to me 599 00:41:54,519 --> 00:41:56,280 and said: "Mr. Prime Minister," 600 00:41:56,280 --> 00:42:01,240 "Look, Mercedes doesn't make buses or trucks outside Germany." 601 00:42:01,239 --> 00:42:04,319 "I'm ready to come and make them in Romania." 602 00:42:04,519 --> 00:42:07,000 And what did we do with it? 603 00:42:07,679 --> 00:42:10,639 "Our country's not for sale!" 604 00:42:11,519 --> 00:42:14,519 "Our country's not for sale!" 605 00:42:15,639 --> 00:42:19,000 "Don't let others come and privatize things, we know better! " 606 00:42:19,199 --> 00:42:25,199 Nationalism and the revival of these patriotic feelings had a direct effect. 607 00:42:25,360 --> 00:42:29,200 This is how some thinking patterns were created 608 00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:32,440 which later would be difficult to dislodge. 609 00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:34,039 "Our country's not for sale!" 610 00:42:34,760 --> 00:42:38,160 This slogan still works today. 611 00:42:38,679 --> 00:42:44,079 It was that wretched chant that destroyed these companies. 612 00:42:44,159 --> 00:42:45,879 They don't exist anymore! 613 00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:48,119 Our country's not for sale! 614 00:42:48,199 --> 00:42:52,480 But the chant wasn't coming from the workers protesting in the streets 615 00:42:52,519 --> 00:42:55,239 but from a group of experienced communist ideologues. 616 00:42:55,239 --> 00:43:00,159 Most notably, Alexandru Bârlădeanu, who was part of the Government since the 1950s. 617 00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:05,360 In 1990, he became head of the Senate and advisor to President Iliescu. 618 00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:09,960 Politically, this was a group of Marxists. 619 00:43:10,639 --> 00:43:14,920 That is, they didn't trust the market economy. As simple as that. 620 00:43:15,199 --> 00:43:18,480 It's easy to throw out phrases like 621 00:43:18,559 --> 00:43:20,599 'immediate privatization'. 622 00:43:20,800 --> 00:43:24,440 But we need to understand its social cost. 623 00:43:24,599 --> 00:43:29,319 Unfortunately, Iliescu was heavily influenced by this group. 624 00:43:29,800 --> 00:43:34,280 And then he had his own doubts, because he was himself 625 00:43:34,880 --> 00:43:38,119 a product of that era and regime, of that system. 626 00:43:38,559 --> 00:43:41,880 The issue of privatization and openness to foreign investors 627 00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:46,440 caused an irreparable rupture between President Iliescu and Prime Minister Roman. 628 00:43:46,639 --> 00:43:48,920 Before the second half of 1991, 629 00:43:49,039 --> 00:43:54,559 it became clear that two main characters of the Revolution couldn't lead the country together. 630 00:43:54,679 --> 00:43:58,239 In August 1991, I passed the Privatization Law. 631 00:43:58,239 --> 00:44:01,919 Bârlădeanu was the president of the Senate and from the FSN. 632 00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:04,039 The Roman Government was a FSN Government. 633 00:44:04,199 --> 00:44:07,079 The evening I passed this law, 634 00:44:07,079 --> 00:44:10,440 Bârlădeanu went and destroyed it on TV. 635 00:44:10,639 --> 00:44:14,480 Because this law already had provisions for privatization. 636 00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:19,039 One month after I passed the Privatization Law, the miners came. 637 00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:22,079 On September 25, 1991, 638 00:44:22,280 --> 00:44:25,960 over 10,000 miners from the Jiu Valley took over several trains 639 00:44:26,079 --> 00:44:30,840 and went to Bucharest to ask for higher wages and better working conditions. 640 00:44:30,840 --> 00:44:34,920 And will be granted a fixed amount, not subject to taxation! 641 00:44:36,840 --> 00:44:44,400 I was next to Miron Cozma, when he gave the order to attack the Government building. 642 00:44:48,079 --> 00:44:51,880 The law enforcement tasked with defending the building stepped aside 643 00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:54,160 and the miners plundered Victoria Palace. 644 00:44:54,199 --> 00:44:58,719 In Parliament, the resignation of Prime Minister Petre Roman is being announced. 645 00:44:58,719 --> 00:45:01,279 In a conversation with Mr. Iliescu, 646 00:45:01,400 --> 00:45:05,760 He confirmed that Mr. Petre Roman requested to withdraw. 647 00:45:05,800 --> 00:45:10,080 "The Prime Minister has resigned!" Which at that time was a blatant lie! 648 00:45:10,079 --> 00:45:15,480 A despicable political maneuver, meant to prevent the reform. Which it did. 649 00:45:15,559 --> 00:45:16,519 It really did. 650 00:45:16,599 --> 00:45:19,599 But the miners were not aware of the political maneuvers. 651 00:45:19,599 --> 00:45:20,960 Having absolute power, 652 00:45:20,960 --> 00:45:25,559 Miron Cozma's people decided that overthrowing the Government wasn't enough. 653 00:45:25,559 --> 00:45:27,719 Out with Iliescu! 654 00:45:28,360 --> 00:45:31,079 After they managed to overthrow the Government 655 00:45:31,519 --> 00:45:34,880 a large group of miners, probably uncontrolled, 656 00:45:35,239 --> 00:45:38,959 joined with disgruntled citizens and marched to besiege Cotroceni Palace. 657 00:45:38,960 --> 00:45:42,159 To get rid of Iliescu while they're at it, not just of Roman. 658 00:45:42,159 --> 00:45:44,719 And there, unlike the Romanian Government, 659 00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:48,559 which at that time didn't even have a fence, 660 00:45:48,639 --> 00:45:51,559 Cotroceni Palace had a tall wall. 661 00:45:51,559 --> 00:45:54,079 And then three characters appeared. 662 00:45:54,079 --> 00:45:55,880 Two with rifles 663 00:45:56,079 --> 00:45:58,840 and one who would hand them bullet rounds. 664 00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:01,960 They were shooting pellet shots. 665 00:46:05,039 --> 00:46:07,759 They fired straight into the crowd. 666 00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:12,360 A few minor injuries were reported. It was hard to kill anyone from that distance. 667 00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:16,480 And in 15 minutes the square was evacuated. They all ran off. 668 00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:18,880 After the danger was removed, 669 00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:21,760 Ion Iliescu sat down with the miner's representatives. 670 00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:26,440 ...In order to end this conflict and this degeneration of the protest. 671 00:46:26,559 --> 00:46:31,159 Miron Cozma discussed with the President of Romania from a position of power. 672 00:46:31,159 --> 00:46:35,759 We request for you to acknowledge the current issues, which we'll discuss shortly. 673 00:46:36,039 --> 00:46:39,920 Under the following conditions, we are willing to return home: 674 00:46:40,199 --> 00:46:44,279 The resignation of Prime Minister Petre Roman and the entire Government. 675 00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:46,360 When Miron Cozma arrived, 676 00:46:46,360 --> 00:46:50,680 he signed a pact, a kind of document with Ion Iliescu. 677 00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:54,519 Ion Iliescu, the elected president of Romania, 678 00:46:54,639 --> 00:46:58,839 and Miron Cozma, the head of the bandits, in lack of a better term. 679 00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:04,800 I'm sorry you have to bear the brunt of the actions of an arrogant and self-centered man. 680 00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:07,840 From that moment on, 681 00:47:07,840 --> 00:47:12,360 all the openness we had with the West was blocked. 682 00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:15,120 Helmut Kohl's first statement was: 683 00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:19,360 "At the moment, all relations with Romania are frozen" 684 00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:21,520 Ciao! We'll be back! 685 00:47:21,719 --> 00:47:23,679 We'll be back again! 686 00:47:25,159 --> 00:47:29,599 Chapter 4: The Stagnation 687 00:47:33,960 --> 00:47:36,559 After the Mineriad of 1991, 688 00:47:36,559 --> 00:47:40,440 the country is ruled by a coalition government led by Theodor Stolojan 689 00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:42,880 There is a way out of the transition period 690 00:47:42,920 --> 00:47:46,920 and this stage could take anywhere between ten, 691 00:47:46,960 --> 00:47:49,599 fifteen, maybe even twenty years. 692 00:47:49,800 --> 00:47:54,320 FSN, the party elected after the revolution, splits in two. 693 00:47:54,800 --> 00:47:58,200 The progressive wing, led by Petre Roman, keeps the "FSN" name, 694 00:47:58,280 --> 00:48:01,120 while the conservative wing, gathered around Ion Iliescu, 695 00:48:01,199 --> 00:48:04,639 founds a new party FDSN (the Democratic National Salvation Front) 696 00:48:05,079 --> 00:48:08,559 (chanting) Long live Iliescu, make Romania flourish! 697 00:48:08,760 --> 00:48:11,560 In the autumn of 1992 new elections are scheduled 698 00:48:11,599 --> 00:48:15,159 and Ion Iliescu starts as the favourite against Emil Constantinescu. 699 00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:18,680 On the first of October, between the two voting rounds, 700 00:48:18,679 --> 00:48:22,000 Michael Jackson arrives in Bucharest. 701 00:48:35,199 --> 00:48:39,480 Romanians show a preference for Western music, but not so much for Western politics. 702 00:48:39,480 --> 00:48:47,039 On the eleventh of October 1992, Ion Iliescu is elected president for the second time. 703 00:48:54,960 --> 00:48:59,840 The worst thing to happen to Romania during those years 704 00:48:59,840 --> 00:49:04,079 was Ion Iliescu's win in the 1992 elections. 705 00:49:04,199 --> 00:49:05,599 That was it. 706 00:49:05,639 --> 00:49:11,519 If Emil Constantinescu would have won in 1992, with the Democratic Convention, 707 00:49:11,599 --> 00:49:15,279 Romania would've moved forward four years . 708 00:49:15,280 --> 00:49:19,280 These were the years when we missed all our opportunities. 709 00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:23,000 Nicolae Vacaroiu was the prime minister of Romania during those years, 710 00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:27,920 an average economist who worked in the State Committee of Communist Planning for twenty years. 711 00:49:27,920 --> 00:49:32,039 Of course, my naming as prime minister took me by surprise. 712 00:49:32,360 --> 00:49:35,800 I didn't know Iliescu personally until then. 713 00:49:36,079 --> 00:49:39,319 He probably said, "Things are so bad that 714 00:49:39,320 --> 00:49:42,360 we need a man who knows the economy well 715 00:49:42,679 --> 00:49:45,519 who can save us and get us through the winter." 716 00:49:45,599 --> 00:49:49,679 His government went through the parliament with the support of the so-called "red four", 717 00:49:49,840 --> 00:49:54,960 a political bloc consisting of parties such as Gheorghe Funar's PUNR, Vadim Tudor's PRM 718 00:49:55,079 --> 00:49:58,799 and Ilie Verdeț's PSM, former prime minister during Ceausescu. 719 00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:02,000 They all had their origins in the Communist Party. 720 00:50:02,000 --> 00:50:03,079 That was it! 721 00:50:03,079 --> 00:50:05,279 The return to a way 722 00:50:05,400 --> 00:50:08,320 of running the economy centrally. 723 00:50:08,480 --> 00:50:10,800 Running a centralised economy meant 724 00:50:10,920 --> 00:50:14,320 retaining an industry that was in an advanced state of decay. 725 00:50:14,320 --> 00:50:17,320 However, no one wanted to accept this reality. 726 00:50:17,360 --> 00:50:19,320 What do you mean, close a factory? 727 00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:21,000 It was unheard of! 728 00:50:21,159 --> 00:50:24,679 "We need to build, to improve our products". 729 00:50:24,840 --> 00:50:28,400 You couldn't make any kind of improvements. Why? 730 00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:32,400 One thing that was true and which frightened Roman: 731 00:50:32,400 --> 00:50:35,440 the Romanian industry was a scrapheap. 732 00:50:35,760 --> 00:50:37,640 Yes, it was. Outdated. 733 00:50:39,519 --> 00:50:43,440 You know, we've inherited a fountain with no water 734 00:50:43,599 --> 00:50:46,559 as well as the lie that there's water in the fountain. 735 00:50:46,719 --> 00:50:51,559 Because Ceausescu had stopped all technology imports. 736 00:50:51,559 --> 00:50:56,920 Romania was one of the world's top manufacturers of oil equipment. 737 00:50:58,280 --> 00:51:02,320 Where did we lose touch with the industry? 738 00:51:02,840 --> 00:51:10,519 Right when electronics and the oil equipment industries merged. 739 00:51:10,840 --> 00:51:13,400 We kept using ... 740 00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:16,320 ...manual labour, 741 00:51:16,440 --> 00:51:26,000 while the West embraced this symbiosis and we, at that point, began to lag behind. 742 00:51:29,440 --> 00:51:30,000 Come! 743 00:51:31,079 --> 00:51:32,639 Be careful! 744 00:51:34,199 --> 00:51:36,439 Our working conditions ... 745 00:51:37,719 --> 00:51:41,359 ... I wouldn't be exaggerating if I'd compare them to 1900. 746 00:51:42,360 --> 00:51:43,000 Maybe worse. 747 00:51:43,320 --> 00:51:45,559 Because if we take a closer look... 748 00:51:46,280 --> 00:51:49,240 ...Looking at the past few years... So, thirty years ago, 749 00:51:49,239 --> 00:51:51,439 the machines were the same as they were... 750 00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:54,320 30 years ago, but now they're 30 years old. 751 00:51:55,440 --> 00:51:59,240 I don't know if I was clear enough. 752 00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:03,120 I was working at FEA, the Factory for Elements of Automation. 753 00:52:03,239 --> 00:52:05,439 It was on the Pipera platform. 754 00:52:05,440 --> 00:52:08,559 That was a factory built by the Japanese in the 1970s. 755 00:52:08,639 --> 00:52:10,759 Very modern at the time. 756 00:52:10,920 --> 00:52:14,039 I was working in a department called "Power supplies" 757 00:52:14,039 --> 00:52:19,759 We were making voltage-stabilising power supplies for the computers of that time. 758 00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:24,920 When the Japanese were running it, the workshop was making 25 power supplies a month 759 00:52:25,119 --> 00:52:27,319 25 of which worked. 760 00:52:27,800 --> 00:52:32,360 After the Japanese left and towards the late '80s, when I was there in '89, 761 00:52:32,440 --> 00:52:36,920 the workshop would make 100 sources a month, out of which 2 or 3 were working. 762 00:52:37,400 --> 00:52:43,800 This phenomenon describes the entire socialist economy: production for the sake of production. 763 00:52:44,079 --> 00:52:52,400 Production of equipment, tools, anything. Which, at best, were not in demand. 764 00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:56,120 And more commonly, they didn't even work. 765 00:52:56,719 --> 00:52:59,559 There were many products in Romania, 766 00:52:59,920 --> 00:53:04,960 where the cost to make them was higher than their market value. 767 00:53:05,320 --> 00:53:10,640 They were made, for example, to be exported. But you wouldn't export them to France or Germany. 768 00:53:10,719 --> 00:53:15,559 You would export them in the Comecon system (The Mutual Economic Aid Council). 769 00:53:15,559 --> 00:53:20,239 We would supply ball-bearings to Poland, and they'd supply us with lighters, for example. 770 00:53:20,239 --> 00:53:21,719 Even if we didn't need them. 771 00:53:21,719 --> 00:53:22,959 And that was Comecon. 772 00:53:22,960 --> 00:53:28,039 These things didn't work anymore after the socialist system collapsed. 773 00:53:28,320 --> 00:53:32,600 Comecon didn't exist anymore, the Russians weren't buying anymore. 774 00:53:32,599 --> 00:53:35,519 The other countries were becoming democracies. 775 00:53:35,599 --> 00:53:38,519 Clearly, such a system couldn't last forever. 776 00:53:38,920 --> 00:53:44,079 As long as it was designed not to make goods, but to make jobs. 777 00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:48,800 That was the band-aid that socialism put on these countries. 778 00:53:49,000 --> 00:53:52,239 The illusion of having a job and no problems whatsoever. 779 00:53:52,239 --> 00:53:56,279 For 4 years, the biggest concern for Ion Iliescu and the Văcăroiu government 780 00:53:56,280 --> 00:53:59,280 was to keep this band-aid, which sustained a great illusion: 781 00:53:59,480 --> 00:54:01,079 job security. 782 00:54:01,239 --> 00:54:03,919 Of course, the fundamental idea was: 783 00:54:04,039 --> 00:54:05,440 "Don't upset the workers!" 784 00:54:05,639 --> 00:54:08,679 That's how Iliescu saw it at the time, 785 00:54:08,920 --> 00:54:12,280 but as long as no one would buy those goods, 786 00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:17,159 the money came from the state budget or God knows where from. 787 00:54:17,320 --> 00:54:20,720 The money wasn't coming in the natural way: 788 00:54:20,719 --> 00:54:22,919 you sell some goods and get some money. 789 00:54:22,920 --> 00:54:26,159 Of course, companies making a loss were being subsidized. 790 00:54:26,559 --> 00:54:29,599 But not just one, many! Even the larger ones. 791 00:54:29,599 --> 00:54:32,960 Workers were going to work for nothing. That's the main point. 792 00:54:32,960 --> 00:54:34,519 People had this feeling: 793 00:54:34,519 --> 00:54:36,679 "We go in, we work and we make things." 794 00:54:36,679 --> 00:54:38,399 They were making to stock. 795 00:54:38,760 --> 00:54:42,400 Finished products were made, but nobody would buy them. 796 00:54:42,639 --> 00:54:45,279 That's not how it worked.. 797 00:54:45,920 --> 00:54:49,800 While I was prime minister, I didn't make anything to stock. 798 00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:52,920 When you start a process like this, 799 00:54:53,360 --> 00:54:57,440 you don't just close the factories overnight. 800 00:54:59,119 --> 00:55:02,839 Imagine I shut down the factories and fire 2 million people. 801 00:55:02,840 --> 00:55:06,120 How do you feed people if they're not productive? 802 00:55:06,159 --> 00:55:10,960 During those years, the Văcăroiu Government stimulated a supply which couldn't turn a profit. 803 00:55:11,480 --> 00:55:13,880 Often of questionable quality, 804 00:55:14,000 --> 00:55:16,920 the Romanian goods had another handicap. 805 00:55:17,320 --> 00:55:21,640 Even when it was competitive, it was warehoused, because there was no one to sell it. 806 00:55:21,679 --> 00:55:27,799 There was now another myth, another mental barrier to overcome: supply vs sale. 807 00:55:28,559 --> 00:55:30,400 We had good engineers. 808 00:55:30,519 --> 00:55:33,239 And that was it. They were good at making things. 809 00:55:33,239 --> 00:55:37,799 We didn't have people in marketing, in investments, 810 00:55:37,800 --> 00:55:41,080 we had no economists for sector analysis. 811 00:55:41,280 --> 00:55:43,280 We didn't have anything like that. 812 00:55:43,280 --> 00:55:45,400 Can you imagine the mental shift 813 00:55:45,519 --> 00:55:49,920 to accept the idea that sales are more important than production? 814 00:55:50,440 --> 00:55:56,000 Because, in fact, that's the revolutionary capitalist idea: 815 00:55:56,280 --> 00:56:00,840 I, the buyer, come to you, the manufacturer. 816 00:56:00,960 --> 00:56:03,720 You don't manufacture whatever you want! 817 00:56:03,920 --> 00:56:05,639 You manufacture what I ask you to! 818 00:56:05,639 --> 00:56:07,119 I come in and say: 819 00:56:07,480 --> 00:56:10,639 "Stop making those sandals because they don't sell! 820 00:56:10,920 --> 00:56:14,880 You're going to make red flip-flops, these are going to sell! " 821 00:56:14,880 --> 00:56:17,320 Something like that, in 1990, 822 00:56:17,639 --> 00:56:21,239 to accept the idea that sellers are more important 823 00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:27,599 than those who work hard, who make things, the ones who bend the matter? 824 00:56:27,760 --> 00:56:31,240 For this kind of idea, you could get beaten up. 825 00:56:31,840 --> 00:56:39,400 The leaders at the time didn't want to overcome these mental barriers. 826 00:56:39,880 --> 00:56:43,240 They left them there in order to help them stay in power. 827 00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:47,200 Let's not forget the difficult social situation we're in. 828 00:56:47,599 --> 00:56:50,199 Making this transition abruptly, 829 00:56:50,599 --> 00:56:53,199 sacrificing people's living conditions, 830 00:56:53,480 --> 00:56:58,599 using sacrificial curves, so to speak, for a large part of people, 831 00:56:58,719 --> 00:57:05,759 it's something we need to consider carefully and responsibily. 832 00:57:08,840 --> 00:57:12,760 The attempt of Iliescu and his regime, the Văcăroiu government 833 00:57:13,320 --> 00:57:17,160 and its famous stagnation, to keep these dinosaurs operating 834 00:57:18,519 --> 00:57:21,719 costed the Romanian people greatly. 835 00:57:22,320 --> 00:57:25,320 There was absolutely no stagnation. 836 00:57:25,800 --> 00:57:29,200 Everything was done by the book. 837 00:57:29,320 --> 00:57:33,120 Things are going, we'd say, well. 838 00:57:33,199 --> 00:57:37,199 The government does nothing but deliver on the plan that was agreed upon. 839 00:57:37,519 --> 00:57:40,159 And, of course, the rest ... 840 00:57:40,239 --> 00:57:46,359 The rest of Romania remained sad and gray, led without a strategy and avoided by foreign investors. 841 00:57:47,960 --> 00:57:54,440 Remember, for years, foreign investors were cautions about us. 842 00:57:54,960 --> 00:57:57,639 I mean, Romania was always a red flag. 843 00:57:57,800 --> 00:57:59,640 What's the red flag doing? 844 00:57:59,639 --> 00:58:03,239 "Well, the miners come in from time to time and they beat you up." 845 00:58:03,400 --> 00:58:10,000 There is still a lot of reluctance from foreign investors, for a variety of reasons. 846 00:58:10,159 --> 00:58:13,839 Please allow me to avoid elaborating on these reasons. 847 00:58:13,920 --> 00:58:17,519 I think you know them well and debated these at length. 848 00:58:17,840 --> 00:58:20,640 Why would they come here? To negotiate with whom? 849 00:58:20,960 --> 00:58:23,199 With Nicu Văcăroiu and Florin Georgescu? 850 00:58:23,880 --> 00:58:27,360 They were sitting like this on the Romanian factory: 851 00:58:27,639 --> 00:58:31,279 "Let's defend our Romanian assets with all our might!" 852 00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:34,039 Everyone from abroad 853 00:58:34,400 --> 00:58:36,880 were sending us all kinds of experts. 854 00:58:37,079 --> 00:58:41,279 And they even taught us what laws to create. 855 00:58:42,000 --> 00:58:43,639 Do you get me? 856 00:58:43,840 --> 00:58:47,160 They didn't necessarily do it 857 00:58:47,480 --> 00:58:49,800 to raise Romania to the top. Let's be serious! 858 00:58:50,599 --> 00:58:56,599 Their plan was to transform Romania into a retail market. 859 00:59:01,480 --> 00:59:08,119 Race horses, jockey, racecourse. Images familiar to the people of Ialomita. 860 00:59:08,480 --> 00:59:11,840 While foreign investors kept away from the Romanian capital, 861 00:59:12,000 --> 00:59:16,719 the scalpers of the transition graduated to the next level, posing as big businessmen. 862 00:59:17,000 --> 00:59:21,280 They exist because of the well-known company Hermes in Slobozia. 863 00:59:21,480 --> 00:59:27,440 Which, through its owner, Mr. Ilie Alexandru, approached with understanding, with passion 864 00:59:27,679 --> 00:59:30,319 this prince of the planes: the horse. 865 00:59:30,960 --> 00:59:37,960 Ilie Alexandru bet on the people's fascination 866 00:59:38,480 --> 00:59:43,400 with the West, with everything they missed out on during those years. 867 00:59:44,400 --> 00:59:46,440 In these images is brought together 868 00:59:46,559 --> 00:59:51,639 Hermes' desire to do something different, something unheard of. 869 00:59:51,760 --> 00:59:53,480 These were all thieves. 870 00:59:53,719 --> 01:00:00,119 Everything Ilie Alexander built was with the money he took from Bancorex 871 01:00:00,360 --> 01:00:02,640 which he had no plans to ever pay back. 872 01:00:03,079 --> 01:00:05,319 He borrowed some millions of dollars. 873 01:00:05,480 --> 01:00:07,719 and didn't pay a single penny back. 874 01:00:08,599 --> 01:00:12,319 That's how the largest Romanian bank at the time was robbed. 875 01:00:12,320 --> 01:00:15,360 Bancorex was the former Romanian Foreign Trade Bank, 876 01:00:15,360 --> 01:00:19,240 through which the communist state was running its international operations. 877 01:00:19,239 --> 01:00:22,319 In the 1990s, it reported losses of over two billion dollars, 878 01:00:22,320 --> 01:00:25,000 due to loans taken by people connected with the state. 879 01:00:25,239 --> 01:00:27,039 When they were asked: 880 01:00:27,159 --> 01:00:31,679 "Well, mister, you have to pay this money back or you'll be arrested" 881 01:00:31,760 --> 01:00:34,240 What would they reply? "I create jobs!" 882 01:00:34,519 --> 01:00:36,559 Everyone was saying: "I create jobs" 883 01:00:36,719 --> 01:00:41,119 I only find one thing important here: what I did in this country, 884 01:00:41,559 --> 01:00:43,880 the thousands of jobs we created 885 01:00:44,119 --> 01:00:46,039 are not there to benefit me. 886 01:00:47,000 --> 01:00:51,760 The problem, after all, is not that you earned a lot of money fast 887 01:00:52,079 --> 01:00:56,920 The problem is whether you can also keep the business alive after you got rich. 888 01:00:57,360 --> 01:00:58,559 Or develop it. 889 01:00:58,559 --> 01:01:00,480 Because, in the end, for the Romanian state 890 01:01:00,599 --> 01:01:03,119 it's important for the business to work, 891 01:01:03,280 --> 01:01:05,560 to pay salaries and taxes. 892 01:01:05,880 --> 01:01:10,000 The Iliescu regime encouraged the rise of these so-called cardboard millionaires. 893 01:01:10,000 --> 01:01:13,679 It allowed them to bankrupt banks, it enabled fraudulent privatizations 894 01:01:13,679 --> 01:01:15,839 and supplied them with favourable laws. 895 01:01:15,840 --> 01:01:18,400 Back then, they made targeted laws. 896 01:01:19,039 --> 01:01:23,960 Government orders for 2-3 months, for one or ten people. 897 01:01:24,599 --> 01:01:28,719 That's how we got the 72% tax for TVs. 898 01:01:29,159 --> 01:01:32,199 I would pay them, but that meant my price was doubling. 899 01:01:33,880 --> 01:01:36,720 Copos was selling for half the price. 900 01:01:36,960 --> 01:01:39,400 What was I going to do? I couldn't fight him 901 01:01:39,519 --> 01:01:41,199 The law said that: 902 01:01:41,679 --> 01:01:46,399 "...TVs supplied with an infrared remote control system". 903 01:01:46,800 --> 01:01:50,360 Copos would take out the remote and sell it separately. 904 01:01:50,719 --> 01:01:53,879 He'd tell you: "For the remote you have to go next door." 905 01:01:54,159 --> 01:01:57,119 He got a lot of help. 906 01:01:58,559 --> 01:02:01,759 It's true that through the laws that were passed 907 01:02:01,880 --> 01:02:08,400 We fought only for the development of local capital. 908 01:02:09,400 --> 01:02:12,920 So that we don't become the colony we are today! 909 01:02:13,920 --> 01:02:16,960 I remember very well that there were a couple of 910 01:02:16,960 --> 01:02:20,519 Government orders which lifted customs duties for 24 hours. 911 01:02:20,760 --> 01:02:26,280 Simply: "ball-bearings are exempt from custom duty between 27 and 28 August." 912 01:02:26,920 --> 01:02:30,960 The Government order would be published, 913 01:02:31,239 --> 01:02:35,439 the bearings would be loaded from the ships into trucks. 914 01:02:35,440 --> 01:02:38,400 And that's it! No customs duty. 915 01:02:38,400 --> 01:02:41,800 Then the duty was reinstated after 24 hours. 916 01:02:41,800 --> 01:02:45,560 Just long enough for that friend of the prime minister to solve a problem. 917 01:02:45,559 --> 01:02:48,039 People wouldn't even hear about these things. 918 01:02:48,039 --> 01:02:50,079 These things were done and that's it. 919 01:02:50,079 --> 01:02:53,440 They'd take - or split- the money, and the people knew nothing 920 01:02:53,760 --> 01:02:58,160 I knew the only way to develop my company was through investment. 921 01:02:58,480 --> 01:03:00,679 I decided to invest in transport. 922 01:03:01,039 --> 01:03:05,639 I bought 5 trucks from the Brasov Truck Factory. 923 01:03:05,920 --> 01:03:08,039 And because fortune favours the bold, 924 01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:12,760 the day after I bought them, their price has tripled. 925 01:03:13,039 --> 01:03:15,880 It became a problem when these people 926 01:03:15,920 --> 01:03:18,200 wanted to gain political influence. 927 01:03:18,559 --> 01:03:21,279 And to combine the two aspects. 928 01:03:21,440 --> 01:03:28,000 And this was the route of Dumitru Sechelariu, who in '96 became mayor. 929 01:03:28,920 --> 01:03:35,400 From the position of mayor, he began to serve, without any shame, his own financial interests. 930 01:03:35,840 --> 01:03:40,400 Dumitru Sechelariu, a businessman turned PDSR (former FDSN) party member and mayor, 931 01:03:40,639 --> 01:03:45,480 wasn't an exception, but a norm that would define Romanian politics in the coming decades. 932 01:03:45,599 --> 01:03:49,799 The ones who got rich during the transition were present in all parties. 933 01:03:49,800 --> 01:03:58,320 In the 90s, I went to Radu Campeanu and told him that I, citizen Viorel Catarama 934 01:03:58,719 --> 01:04:02,879 like the ideas he brings into public debate 935 01:04:02,880 --> 01:04:08,160 and I want to support the National Liberal Party financially. 936 01:04:08,440 --> 01:04:12,000 Without me getting involved in politics. I'd only provide some support. 937 01:04:12,000 --> 01:04:17,960 Viorel Catarama supported the party financially, and later became its vice president and part of the Government 938 01:04:18,239 --> 01:04:25,319 No law prevented me then to be a minister, general manager, and shareholder. 939 01:04:25,679 --> 01:04:26,799 In parallel 940 01:04:27,400 --> 01:04:32,480 The direct link between politics and business was becoming a norm. 941 01:04:33,320 --> 01:04:36,160 I became a PDSR member 942 01:04:36,159 --> 01:04:42,239 despite seeing my self a small businessman, who only wants to be a bigger businessman. 943 01:04:42,360 --> 01:04:47,200 I didn't see any issue with running these things in parallel 944 01:04:49,119 --> 01:04:51,639 The attitude was different then. 945 01:04:51,639 --> 01:04:54,960 I was only interested in how much I earn. 946 01:04:55,880 --> 01:05:00,240 And I don't think anyone was losing. Who was losing? 947 01:05:01,719 --> 01:05:05,759 In the new oligarchic Romania made up of politicians and businessmen, 948 01:05:05,760 --> 01:05:10,720 the ones losing were millions of Romanians, captive in the bankrupt industry of the 1990s. 949 01:05:10,719 --> 01:05:13,599 The illusion that was sold to the people was wearing out. 950 01:05:13,599 --> 01:05:15,480 Everything was a sign of collapse. 951 01:05:15,480 --> 01:05:19,760 Abandoned children, hyperinflation, endless strikes. 952 01:05:19,760 --> 01:05:22,120 Thieves! Thieves! 953 01:05:22,960 --> 01:05:25,679 It hurts us that in His light 954 01:05:26,000 --> 01:05:29,039 The earth holds a bad world 955 01:05:29,320 --> 01:05:34,080 In the mines, God is with us ... 956 01:05:34,079 --> 01:05:37,719 For more and more Romanians, survival became the main concern. 957 01:05:37,840 --> 01:05:42,640 My pension is the equivalent of four kilograms of salami. That's it. 958 01:05:43,239 --> 01:05:44,719 That's it 959 01:05:45,320 --> 01:05:47,400 I don't even know if it's enough for that. 960 01:05:47,599 --> 01:05:49,480 ... yes, I have just enough. 961 01:05:49,800 --> 01:05:53,480 But then I still have to pay for gas, electricity and maintenance. 962 01:05:54,719 --> 01:05:59,399 Some people were shuddering, frightened... 963 01:06:00,000 --> 01:06:04,840 Nobody cursed at me during that time and I went to all the protests. 964 01:06:05,519 --> 01:06:08,480 Huo! Huo! 965 01:06:09,360 --> 01:06:11,559 Thieves! Thieves! 966 01:06:11,880 --> 01:06:14,840 I remember, there were strike after strike after strike. 967 01:06:15,039 --> 01:06:17,880 And an inflation of 290% or something. 968 01:06:17,880 --> 01:06:19,559 It was incredible! 969 01:06:20,000 --> 01:06:21,960 We are starving! 970 01:06:22,400 --> 01:06:29,880 Thieves! Thieves! 971 01:06:39,400 --> 01:06:41,880 These were very difficult times for Romanians. 972 01:06:41,880 --> 01:06:43,960 It was terrible, yes, terrible. 973 01:06:44,320 --> 01:06:49,200 And with many collateral damages among regular people. 974 01:06:49,679 --> 01:06:53,839 With what you'd pay for a car in 1990, 975 01:06:53,840 --> 01:06:57,360 in 1995 you'd only buy a motorcycle, for example. 976 01:06:57,960 --> 01:07:04,760 And many lost their savings by not knowing about inflation, or mechanics of economy. 977 01:07:05,039 --> 01:07:07,800 They lost their life savings exactly like this. 978 01:07:08,239 --> 01:07:12,839 Besides inflation, the Romanians' savings were exposed to other dangers of the transition. 979 01:07:13,079 --> 01:07:16,400 Pyramid schemes, like the famous Caritas, 980 01:07:16,400 --> 01:07:21,200 harmed hundreds of thousands who believed the magic formula of getting rich quick. 981 01:07:21,199 --> 01:07:24,480 Deposit one million, wait a few weeks, get back eight million. 982 01:07:25,039 --> 01:07:29,480 At my age of 86, going on 87, I didn't have that much money. 983 01:07:30,199 --> 01:07:31,480 How much did you deposit here? 984 01:07:31,599 --> 01:07:34,000 Well how much ... about two million 985 01:07:37,840 --> 01:07:42,440 This combination of naivety, despair and poverty which reigned in Romania in those years 986 01:07:42,639 --> 01:07:45,920 reached its peak in the villages throughout the country. 987 01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:50,720 The abolition of the Cooperatives put peasants in a difficult situation. 988 01:07:50,719 --> 01:07:53,959 They got their lands back, but having no machinery to work with, 989 01:07:54,159 --> 01:07:56,799 they went backwards by 100 years. 990 01:07:57,679 --> 01:08:00,879 What do you work the land with? Do you have any tools? 991 01:08:01,039 --> 01:08:03,440 We don't have any! With the hoe, look! 992 01:08:03,440 --> 01:08:06,720 We have no tractor, no horse, we have nothing. 993 01:08:06,719 --> 01:08:09,119 This is how we struggle with the hoe all summer, dear. 994 01:08:09,360 --> 01:08:11,039 When did you sell the land? 995 01:08:11,159 --> 01:08:12,759 I sold a piece of land. 996 01:08:13,159 --> 01:08:15,359 How much did you get for it? 997 01:08:15,719 --> 01:08:18,079 About two and a half million. 998 01:08:18,600 --> 01:08:21,480 Money has devalued, what will you do next? 999 01:08:22,199 --> 01:08:26,319 We keep seling. I got the property title, we keep selling, there's no other option. 1000 01:08:26,439 --> 01:08:30,079 After working their whole lives in the communist collective farms, 1001 01:08:30,159 --> 01:08:32,920 The peasants woke up to some pitiable pensions. 1002 01:08:33,000 --> 01:08:36,159 I'm even embarassed to hand the pension to many people. 1003 01:08:36,319 --> 01:08:38,479 I feel sorry for them... 1004 01:08:39,079 --> 01:08:43,720 I take the pensions to some pensioners who get something like 40,000 - 50,000 lei 1005 01:08:43,920 --> 01:08:47,520 But when I go to the one with 4,000, I feel bad to even count that. 1006 01:08:47,680 --> 01:08:52,159 Because I'm used to counting 30-40,000 upwards, like with the others. 1007 01:08:52,159 --> 01:08:57,359 It pains me to give them 4,000 lei (approx 2 dollars in 1994) 1008 01:08:57,479 --> 01:09:00,519 The Romanian state seemed to have abandoned these people. 1009 01:09:00,800 --> 01:09:03,760 Only some random MP would write them the occasional poem. 1010 01:09:05,960 --> 01:09:07,319 Request. 1011 01:09:07,640 --> 01:09:09,400 We'd like, if possible 1012 01:09:09,520 --> 01:09:11,720 To ask of our new masters 1013 01:09:11,800 --> 01:09:13,680 To maybe pay us in instalments 1014 01:09:14,079 --> 01:09:16,079 the two-cent pension 1015 01:09:16,199 --> 01:09:18,119 The pension of the Romanian peasants. 1016 01:09:18,520 --> 01:09:20,600 You stole our land, 1017 01:09:20,920 --> 01:09:23,159 You tied our ankles and our hands 1018 01:09:23,359 --> 01:09:25,239 Cooperatives are all impoverished 1019 01:09:25,720 --> 01:09:28,199 All I've ever given is gone forever. 1020 01:09:28,680 --> 01:09:30,480 The lives of Romanian peasants 1021 01:09:30,640 --> 01:09:33,240 We have no bread, firewood and dishes 1022 01:09:33,359 --> 01:09:36,279 We're hungry and naked like dogs 1023 01:09:37,600 --> 01:09:40,360 Chapter 5 Towards Europe 1024 01:09:40,520 --> 01:09:43,880 Mister president, distinguished representatives. 1025 01:09:44,840 --> 01:09:49,760 The spectactulare evolutions in the area of Eastern Europe. 1026 01:09:49,840 --> 01:09:56,239 And the firm determination of Romania to have a market-oriented economy. 1027 01:09:56,760 --> 01:10:02,239 Needs the support of industrialised countries. 1028 01:10:02,479 --> 01:10:07,000 After 5 years of the economy collapsing, and with people barely making ends meet, 1029 01:10:07,119 --> 01:10:12,599 the leaders of post-revolution Romania are forced to accept the failures of the original democracy. 1030 01:10:12,800 --> 01:10:15,640 Those who urged Romanians not to sell their country 1031 01:10:15,880 --> 01:10:19,359 were now telling them that the only solution is looking to the West. 1032 01:10:19,680 --> 01:10:23,880 "Guys, we have Carpathians, Danube. We, the Romanians, can make it on our own" 1033 01:10:24,000 --> 01:10:25,560 Look, it doesn't work! 1034 01:10:25,560 --> 01:10:28,320 We have to work with Europe and others. 1035 01:10:28,479 --> 01:10:32,079 Are we heading towards the EU? Let's make a statement then. 1036 01:10:32,439 --> 01:10:35,039 On June 21, 1995, 1037 01:10:35,239 --> 01:10:39,359 representatives from all political parties, the unions, the Academy and the Church 1038 01:10:39,640 --> 01:10:42,400 took part in the signing of the Snagov declaration, 1039 01:10:42,560 --> 01:10:46,680 a document that united everyone towards a goal for the next decade: 1040 01:10:46,880 --> 01:10:49,680 Romania to join the EU. 1041 01:10:49,840 --> 01:10:52,159 Shall we start? Let me now, yeah? 1042 01:10:52,880 --> 01:10:56,520 I think today is an important political moment. 1043 01:10:56,680 --> 01:11:04,280 It's about expressing the unequivocal will of the parliamentary parties 1044 01:11:04,560 --> 01:11:08,880 to accept as a major objective ... 1045 01:11:09,439 --> 01:11:12,159 ..the integration into European structures. 1046 01:11:12,680 --> 01:11:15,079 A good, necessary step was taken. 1047 01:11:15,239 --> 01:11:17,519 The Great Romania Party always assumed 1048 01:11:17,800 --> 01:11:21,159 that Romania was in Europe even before the birth of Europe. 1049 01:11:21,560 --> 01:11:23,880 Do you think they just caught the EU fever? 1050 01:11:24,520 --> 01:11:27,960 Do you think they had Western values in mind? 1051 01:11:28,239 --> 01:11:31,719 Do you think they wanted economic regulation like the West? 1052 01:11:31,920 --> 01:11:32,720 No! 1053 01:11:33,000 --> 01:11:38,640 At that moment, our great friend, The Soviet Union had broken up 1054 01:11:38,920 --> 01:11:44,039 So we didn't have much to guide us and going it alone was impossible. 1055 01:11:45,399 --> 01:11:48,719 Basically, those in power looked at the global situation and said: 1056 01:11:48,800 --> 01:11:52,560 "Ok, we have to take this route, otherwise we'll have Ceausescu's fate." 1057 01:11:52,880 --> 01:11:57,840 That is: no food, serious economic issues and everything collapses again. 1058 01:11:58,159 --> 01:12:04,159 The Snagov meeting symbolized the departure from the original democracy, 1059 01:12:04,279 --> 01:12:11,119 which was masking a combination of democracy and dictatorship. 1060 01:12:14,680 --> 01:12:21,440 The suffering has passed, what matters is that the future provides something good for the country. 1061 01:12:22,640 --> 01:12:24,720 The rest is no longer important. 1062 01:12:24,960 --> 01:12:28,760 Also in 1995, a few months after the Snagov Declaration, 1063 01:12:28,920 --> 01:12:32,880 another event proved that Romanians began to understand their past mistakes. 1064 01:12:32,960 --> 01:12:35,800 An inexplicable phenomenon occurred. 1065 01:12:35,960 --> 01:12:38,159 Sometimes, things like these happen.. 1066 01:12:38,359 --> 01:12:43,039 The huge lines behind Corneliu Coposu's funeral. 1067 01:12:44,239 --> 01:12:45,920 A sort of a revelation. 1068 01:12:46,199 --> 01:12:50,079 It's like they went there to tell him: "Forgive us!" 1069 01:12:50,800 --> 01:12:52,920 That was the feeling: "Forgive us!" 1070 01:12:53,439 --> 01:12:56,279 Part of the Romanian democracy died. 1071 01:12:56,960 --> 01:13:00,800 It's a shame, it's a great shame. For us, but particularly for you. 1072 01:13:01,319 --> 01:13:05,439 He showed the kind of character that few would be able to after 50 years 1073 01:13:06,159 --> 01:13:08,319 of struggles and unhappiness. 1074 01:13:08,520 --> 01:13:13,480 Corneliu Coposu, the man who thousands of people tried to lynch in Bucharest in 1990, 1075 01:13:13,840 --> 01:13:18,239 became post-mortem, the symbol of morality in Romanian politics. 1076 01:13:28,640 --> 01:13:32,280 Through the disappointment that overwhelmed Romania during those years, 1077 01:13:32,439 --> 01:13:35,039 people were looking for hope to carry them forward. 1078 01:13:35,199 --> 01:13:39,319 The political opposition, civil society and a growing share of the population 1079 01:13:39,479 --> 01:13:43,599 began to believe in a word which for a long time seemed unacceptable: Change. 1080 01:13:44,279 --> 01:13:49,960 We need to put our finger on the wound. and find out where mistakes were made. 1081 01:13:50,199 --> 01:13:52,559 But also, who made mistakes. 1082 01:14:00,920 --> 01:14:04,640 The man who attracted all this energy was Emil Constantinescu, 1083 01:14:04,800 --> 01:14:10,520 a university professor who was going to to run for election in 1996 against Ion Iliescu. 1084 01:14:13,319 --> 01:14:16,319 In '96 the change came from 1085 01:14:16,439 --> 01:14:21,439 the alliance of the parties which represented an ideal. 1086 01:14:21,840 --> 01:14:26,039 I support and we support Mr. Emil Constantinescu. 1087 01:14:26,920 --> 01:14:30,720 I don't think Iliescu imagined that it would come to this, 1088 01:14:31,960 --> 01:14:35,159 but the moment I signed an agreement with Emil Constantinescu 1089 01:14:36,119 --> 01:14:38,479 and campaigned for Emil Constantinescu, 1090 01:14:38,920 --> 01:14:41,800 he understood that there was no way back. 1091 01:14:47,119 --> 01:14:49,760 Iliescu for president! 1092 01:14:52,520 --> 01:14:59,560 Somehow, Ion Iliescu didn't want to win those elections that badly. 1093 01:15:00,359 --> 01:15:03,159 As if he wasn't up for it anymore. 1094 01:15:04,079 --> 01:15:08,519 Out with Iliescu! 1095 01:15:09,079 --> 01:15:15,640 I understand the concerns, the dissatisfaction, disappointment of many people 1096 01:15:16,079 --> 01:15:21,039 regarding the difficult situation that the national economy is going through. 1097 01:15:21,840 --> 01:15:26,239 But we have to understand the context of this situation. 1098 01:15:26,920 --> 01:15:33,239 In 1989 a system that could not hold anymore collapsed, 1099 01:15:34,239 --> 01:15:38,079 both in Romania and throughout this area of Europe. 1100 01:15:43,000 --> 01:15:46,439 This idea was popular in PSD: 1101 01:15:46,880 --> 01:15:49,680 "We can't close factories! Because we can't" 1102 01:15:49,840 --> 01:15:55,400 "We're the Communist Party, the working class party, we can't close factories." 1103 01:15:55,840 --> 01:15:58,920 "Let's leave these guys in charge for a few years" 1104 01:15:59,760 --> 01:16:02,960 "They'll compromise themselves, people will curse them, right?" 1105 01:16:03,119 --> 01:16:05,640 "Let them close the factories." 1106 01:16:06,000 --> 01:16:10,119 The change was also encouraged by the head of the Romanian Intelligence Service. 1107 01:16:10,399 --> 01:16:14,920 A pillar of the Iliescu regime, Virgil Măgureanu announced he'd vote for change. 1108 01:16:15,039 --> 01:16:21,560 I was able to know if this should happen or not. Change, that is. 1109 01:16:22,479 --> 01:16:25,439 I was able and I did it. 1110 01:16:26,760 --> 01:16:29,239 The change occurred in November 1996. 1111 01:16:29,399 --> 01:16:31,799 It was a time when more and more Romanians 1112 01:16:31,880 --> 01:16:34,159 were aware that the country needs new leadership. 1113 01:16:34,439 --> 01:16:36,439 I will vote for Emil Constantinescu. 1114 01:16:36,760 --> 01:16:38,600 I vote for Emil Constantinescu. 1115 01:16:38,800 --> 01:16:42,720 I voted and will continue to vote for Mr. Emil Constantinescu, 1116 01:16:43,399 --> 01:16:45,599 because I trust him. 1117 01:16:47,319 --> 01:16:49,000 After the ballot box was opened, 1118 01:16:49,239 --> 01:16:51,760 Ion Iliescu had to acknowledge his defeat. 1119 01:16:52,000 --> 01:16:55,319 To fulfill their commitments and promises ... 1120 01:16:55,600 --> 01:16:58,079 Victory! Victory! 1121 01:16:58,399 --> 01:17:03,239 When the results were announced, people went out in the streets. 1122 01:17:16,079 --> 01:17:19,559 Hey, Iliescu is gone! 1123 01:17:21,000 --> 01:17:26,159 God was brought to life for us! God in the skies! 1124 01:17:29,000 --> 01:17:33,720 This was a turning point, because it was the first time in the history of Romania 1125 01:17:34,000 --> 01:17:37,880 when a head of state was changed through a vote. 1126 01:17:39,000 --> 01:17:41,600 Out with communism! Out with Iliescu! 1127 01:17:43,000 --> 01:17:46,359 I was told that the people were gathering in the University Square, 1128 01:17:46,439 --> 01:17:49,000 Spontaneously, no one called them there. 1129 01:17:49,399 --> 01:17:54,759 I walked around it, to not succumb to the enthusiasm of the crowd, 1130 01:17:55,279 --> 01:18:00,000 I went on the balcony, I didn't have a speech ready. 1131 01:18:05,880 --> 01:18:14,800 We're all here again to say that Romania will become a dignified, prosperous country 1132 01:18:15,760 --> 01:18:19,039 The free country that we all wanted! 1133 01:18:23,680 --> 01:18:30,480 That together we will prove that we're able to rebuild this country 1134 01:18:34,000 --> 01:18:37,560 And all this time, I felt a chill. 1135 01:18:38,960 --> 01:18:44,159 I realised that these people had immeasurable hope. 1136 01:18:56,039 --> 01:18:59,960 Soon it was winter and the hopes of Romanians were hit by reality. 1137 01:19:00,680 --> 01:19:04,280 The price of gas increased four times, and that of petrol doubled. 1138 01:19:06,000 --> 01:19:08,399 I'm holding it in my hand, what can I do? 1139 01:19:09,760 --> 01:19:11,800 And while people were panicking, 1140 01:19:11,960 --> 01:19:14,960 the new prime minister promised them everything would be fine. 1141 01:19:15,319 --> 01:19:18,880 Moving to another internal state of affairs, 1142 01:19:19,159 --> 01:19:21,479 the population's welfare, 1143 01:19:21,800 --> 01:19:25,440 Romania aligning with the global financial system... 1144 01:19:25,640 --> 01:19:30,560 The Democratic Convention won the election with the promise to bring into the public institutions 1145 01:19:30,760 --> 01:19:34,159 15,000 specialists able to reform the state from the ground up. 1146 01:19:34,399 --> 01:19:36,719 But, when forming a government, 1147 01:19:36,960 --> 01:19:40,640 it was difficult to identify a single specialist able to be prime minister. 1148 01:19:40,800 --> 01:19:43,640 That's how Victor Ciorbea came to lead of the Government, 1149 01:19:43,840 --> 01:19:47,239 a former union leader, recently elected as mayor of Bucharest. 1150 01:19:47,439 --> 01:19:51,039 The CDR (Romanian Democratic Convention), didn't have any truly prepared people. 1151 01:19:51,439 --> 01:19:54,960 They were unable to name a prime minister! They had to get Ciorbea, 1152 01:19:55,159 --> 01:19:57,559 who wasn't the best fit for this job anyway. 1153 01:19:57,880 --> 01:19:59,400 So that's true. 1154 01:20:00,039 --> 01:20:02,000 People really had hope at that time. 1155 01:20:02,199 --> 01:20:04,760 And believed the promises from those parties: 1156 01:20:04,840 --> 01:20:08,920 "15,000 specialists. We have 15,000 specialists ready to go!" 1157 01:20:09,680 --> 01:20:15,880 Some people in the media started to make jokes for weeks on end 1158 01:20:16,359 --> 01:20:20,759 that these specialists are Ciorbea, Ciorbea, Ciorbea and so on. 1159 01:20:21,399 --> 01:20:23,719 The idea of the 15,000 specialists 1160 01:20:23,960 --> 01:20:27,079 came spontaneously and it was real. 1161 01:20:27,800 --> 01:20:30,079 In all the counties in Romania, 1162 01:20:30,319 --> 01:20:33,880 people representing historical parties were at the forefront 1163 01:20:33,960 --> 01:20:36,760 There was a change everywhere in the country. 1164 01:20:37,319 --> 01:20:41,479 I remember the leader of the Peasants' Party in Bacau 1165 01:20:42,560 --> 01:20:46,160 Mr. Cornita, who had been a political prisoner. 1166 01:20:46,520 --> 01:20:51,000 A nice old man, with common sense, but clearly unremarkable. 1167 01:20:51,840 --> 01:20:57,199 How can I put this? I think it was one big party in all the institutions and ministries. 1168 01:20:58,560 --> 01:21:02,880 They were laughing their heads off, saying "This poor guy, let's set him up!" 1169 01:21:03,159 --> 01:21:09,039 I'll never forget, Ion Diaconescu, a star in the Peasant's Party, said something really stupid 1170 01:21:09,399 --> 01:21:13,119 It shocked me how much these people lived in the past. 1171 01:21:13,600 --> 01:21:19,160 He said: "We want to rename the Government to 'Council of Ministers'. That's what it was called back in my time" 1172 01:21:19,279 --> 01:21:21,399 Meaning the 1930s. 1173 01:21:21,760 --> 01:21:26,320 And he was told "You can't do that because in the Constitution it's called the Government." 1174 01:21:26,920 --> 01:21:28,480 Was this a priority? 1175 01:21:28,840 --> 01:21:33,159 But the biggest challenges for the CDR government were when they had to adopt 1176 01:21:33,359 --> 01:21:36,439 unpopular measures, postponed by the Iliescu regime. 1177 01:21:36,720 --> 01:21:40,600 That meant mainly closing the bankrupt state-owned enterprises. 1178 01:21:40,800 --> 01:21:47,440 It was well known that the economic and financial situation was very serious 1179 01:21:47,800 --> 01:21:52,680 and we knew we had to take some dramatic measures! 1180 01:21:53,159 --> 01:22:00,840 Structural reforms concerning engergy-intensive companies, who had huge losses. 1181 01:22:01,039 --> 01:22:04,039 The independent administrations... 1182 01:22:04,279 --> 01:22:06,519 None of this was done yet! 1183 01:22:07,039 --> 01:22:13,199 When the Ciorbea Government tried to close the first 15 companies, 1184 01:22:13,319 --> 01:22:16,439 the workers went to the street and said: "No way!" 1185 01:22:20,600 --> 01:22:22,440 Out with the Government! 1186 01:22:22,640 --> 01:22:30,119 It's a reality that, almost daily, we had protests, rallies, marches, strikes. 1187 01:22:35,560 --> 01:22:37,400 Victor Ciorbea resigned today, 1188 01:22:37,479 --> 01:22:41,319 after, for the past few months, he was challenged by his coalition partners. 1189 01:22:41,680 --> 01:22:46,640 I didn't delay the reform, or the privatization, but I had to start with the basics. 1190 01:22:46,840 --> 01:22:51,039 The one who set this change in motion was the Minister of Transport, Traian Basescu. 1191 01:22:51,199 --> 01:22:54,279 In an interview for a national newspaper, he accused Ciorbea 1192 01:22:54,439 --> 01:22:57,439 of being incompetent to implement a harsh, accurate and quick reform. 1193 01:22:57,680 --> 01:23:01,720 Apart from these issues, street protests demanded for the prime minister to resign. 1194 01:23:02,760 --> 01:23:10,239 They were all screaming, left, right, all televisions, radio stations, and so on: 1195 01:23:10,439 --> 01:23:13,079 "Ciorbea is to blame!" Ciorbea... 1196 01:23:13,560 --> 01:23:19,440 Maybe my attempt of being a different prime minister was premature. 1197 01:23:20,159 --> 01:23:21,840 That's how it was meant to be. 1198 01:23:22,039 --> 01:23:24,039 One year after winning the elections, 1199 01:23:24,199 --> 01:23:27,000 the Peasants' Party was again in a difficult position. 1200 01:23:27,079 --> 01:23:30,000 They needed another expert to be a prime minister. 1201 01:23:30,239 --> 01:23:32,000 They chose Radu Vasile, 1202 01:23:32,199 --> 01:23:37,359 a university professor who joked around when asked about reform forecasts. 1203 01:23:37,479 --> 01:23:40,759 So in August there will be a large eclipse... 1204 01:23:41,359 --> 01:23:44,319 And we hope, and I predict it will be on August 11th. 1205 01:23:44,560 --> 01:23:46,640 Come on, quit it with those questions! 1206 01:23:51,039 --> 01:23:53,840 He was utterly incompetent. 1207 01:23:54,600 --> 01:23:57,280 A nice man, but utterly incompetent. 1208 01:23:57,399 --> 01:24:01,000 He was teaching the history of the economy at the ASE (Academy of Economic Studies). 1209 01:24:01,119 --> 01:24:02,159 He was clueless! 1210 01:24:02,560 --> 01:24:04,039 I think so too. 1211 01:24:05,159 --> 01:24:07,800 God rest his soul, but I think so too. 1212 01:24:12,720 --> 01:24:15,680 He was a kind man, member of the Peasants' Party. 1213 01:24:16,079 --> 01:24:19,600 From the opposition, right? Against communism! 1214 01:24:20,000 --> 01:24:22,279 We finally have honest people, right? 1215 01:24:23,520 --> 01:24:25,760 I was going to interview him, 1216 01:24:25,960 --> 01:24:28,800 because we had serious issues with the economy, 1217 01:24:28,880 --> 01:24:30,640 And he was playing chess. 1218 01:24:30,640 --> 01:24:34,600 May he rest in peace, he played chess on the computer, in the Government office. 1219 01:24:35,039 --> 01:24:37,760 I'd say: "I have to ask you about this ..." 1220 01:24:38,000 --> 01:24:41,880 He'd say "Just a minute, I have a thing here..." 1221 01:24:42,000 --> 01:24:43,560 And he kept on playing chess. 1222 01:24:44,079 --> 01:24:46,000 It's true. 1223 01:24:46,399 --> 01:24:49,359 But it wasn't chess, it was computer games. 1224 01:24:52,279 --> 01:24:54,439 The man had no clue about economy. 1225 01:24:54,640 --> 01:25:01,240 Romania was in economic crisis, I showed him all the defining factors of a crisis, 1226 01:25:01,359 --> 01:25:04,439 looking at what was happening, with numbers, in the economy 1227 01:25:04,680 --> 01:25:07,480 and he'd refuse to acknowledge it. 1228 01:25:07,800 --> 01:25:10,360 He'd say: "No, sir, that's not true, actually!" 1229 01:25:10,560 --> 01:25:14,720 In this context, it's appropriate to show that slowing down of reforms, 1230 01:25:14,960 --> 01:25:18,600 in the second half of 1997, had the effect 1231 01:25:19,079 --> 01:25:23,920 of lowering the country's rating by Moody's, Standard & Poor's. 1232 01:25:24,119 --> 01:25:30,800 Romania was then on the verge of default. Because, under Radu Vasile, 1233 01:25:31,560 --> 01:25:35,280 it wasn't badly governed, it wasn't governed at all. 1234 01:25:35,720 --> 01:25:38,119 That was a critical moment 1235 01:25:38,439 --> 01:25:45,799 The Mineriad of 1999 happened on the backdrop of people's disillusionment. 1236 01:25:46,239 --> 01:25:50,760 Brothers, our patience has come to an end! 1237 01:25:57,520 --> 01:26:03,680 In January 1999, determined to ask for higher wages and to stop the closure of underperforming mines 1238 01:26:04,239 --> 01:26:07,960 15,000 miners went, once again, to Bucharest, led by Miron Cozma. 1239 01:26:08,079 --> 01:26:10,159 At the Cotroceni Palace 1240 01:26:10,279 --> 01:26:12,159 The owl sings 1241 01:26:12,359 --> 01:26:14,359 The goatee and his mates 1242 01:26:14,520 --> 01:26:16,320 Are in deep trouble! 1243 01:26:16,439 --> 01:26:20,839 In Costești, Vâlcea county, they were met by the Gendarmerie. 1244 01:26:21,479 --> 01:26:23,159 Go ahead! 1245 01:26:27,600 --> 01:26:32,320 Numerically superior, the miners broke law enforcement's wall and took hundreds of prisoners, 1246 01:26:32,560 --> 01:26:35,200 including the Vâlcea county prefect. 1247 01:26:38,000 --> 01:26:40,279 The President declared a state of emergency, 1248 01:26:40,399 --> 01:26:45,239 and a march was organized in Bucharest against the action of the miners and in defense of democracy. 1249 01:26:45,479 --> 01:26:47,679 The country was on the verge of civil war. 1250 01:26:47,800 --> 01:26:50,279 If the violence of the miners will continue, 1251 01:26:50,840 --> 01:26:54,119 Romania will have no future ahead. 1252 01:26:55,159 --> 01:27:00,039 Jiu Valley, are you happy with this response, yes or no? 1253 01:27:00,119 --> 01:27:01,319 Noooo! 1254 01:27:01,560 --> 01:27:06,200 At that time, Emil Constantinescu was hated! 1255 01:27:06,720 --> 01:27:11,119 These people in government were detested, hated, by the vast majority of the population. 1256 01:27:11,520 --> 01:27:14,720 This is what Miron Cozma counted on 1257 01:27:14,920 --> 01:27:17,000 when he brought the miners to Bucharest. 1258 01:27:17,359 --> 01:27:21,199 Obviously, in agreement with the PRM (Greater Romania Party) of Vadim Tudor, 1259 01:27:21,279 --> 01:27:24,079 in agreement with the PSD (Social Democratic Party) 1260 01:27:24,880 --> 01:27:28,000 On behalf of the PRM group, senator Corneliu Vadim Tudor. 1261 01:27:28,800 --> 01:27:32,039 If in 1989 it was an anti-communist revolution, 1262 01:27:32,640 --> 01:27:36,240 in 1999 we are dealing with an anti-mafia revolution. 1263 01:27:36,359 --> 01:27:38,799 With the miners advancing towards Bucharest, 1264 01:27:38,920 --> 01:27:42,920 Prime Minister Radu Vasile gave up and made peace with Miron Cozma's people. 1265 01:27:42,960 --> 01:27:46,119 Hello. The talks have started five to six minutes ago 1266 01:27:46,199 --> 01:27:50,039 between the government delegates led by Prime Minister Radu Vasile 1267 01:27:50,199 --> 01:27:53,599 and the leaders of the miners at Cozia Monastery. 1268 01:27:53,720 --> 01:27:58,400 The Prime Minister essentially surrendered to a group which undermined the state. 1269 01:27:58,680 --> 01:28:00,320 And accepted all their claims. 1270 01:28:00,600 --> 01:28:02,200 The mines were no longer closed 1271 01:28:02,319 --> 01:28:05,599 and continued to operate at a loss for many years after that. 1272 01:28:06,920 --> 01:28:10,279 Now, looking towards West, 1273 01:28:10,880 --> 01:28:13,400 Romania reflects upon itself. 1274 01:28:14,399 --> 01:28:17,199 Romania rediscovers its identity. 1275 01:28:17,920 --> 01:28:19,800 Despite the huge domestic issues, 1276 01:28:19,960 --> 01:28:24,840 the CDR government and Emil Constantinescu's term left some positive things in history. 1277 01:28:25,079 --> 01:28:27,359 Following the 1996 elections, 1278 01:28:27,439 --> 01:28:31,319 Romania's foreign policy followed consistently two main objectives: 1279 01:28:31,560 --> 01:28:34,440 becoming a member of NATO and the EU. 1280 01:29:10,039 --> 01:29:13,039 It was ... "the Americans had finally come." 1281 01:29:13,199 --> 01:29:15,039 And I think it was Pro TV saying: 1282 01:29:15,319 --> 01:29:17,719 "Let's look towards the West every night!" 1283 01:29:17,840 --> 01:29:22,920 And the idea was: "We'll join NATO, because Clinton came here and said: Stay the course, stay the course!" 1284 01:29:23,159 --> 01:29:27,680 And people said: "Yeah, we want to join NATO and we'll do anything! NATO, NATO, NATO..." 1285 01:29:36,760 --> 01:29:38,560 Let's do it together! 1286 01:29:38,720 --> 01:29:40,720 Only together we can succeed! 1287 01:29:48,680 --> 01:29:52,280 Romania wanted to join NATO, but NATO was telling us we're not ready. 1288 01:29:52,399 --> 01:29:55,039 In 1997, at the Madrid Summit, 1289 01:29:55,239 --> 01:29:57,880 we were told there's still much progress to be made, 1290 01:29:58,000 --> 01:30:00,439 and the most important was reforming the Army. 1291 01:30:18,800 --> 01:30:21,159 Even so, history was on our side. 1292 01:30:21,359 --> 01:30:26,559 Dear compatriots, together with the Romanian Government and with the will of the people, 1293 01:30:26,840 --> 01:30:29,880 I follow with great care and natural concern 1294 01:30:30,079 --> 01:30:33,199 the evolution of the conflict in Kosovo. 1295 01:30:33,920 --> 01:30:39,520 In 1999, the war in Kosovo broke out and NATO reached out to Romania, as backwards as it was. 1296 01:30:40,159 --> 01:30:42,960 NATO's planes needed the approval of the Romanian state 1297 01:30:43,119 --> 01:30:45,599 to transit the airspace and reach former Yugoslavia. 1298 01:30:45,720 --> 01:30:50,640 I had to go to Parliament to be granted the flyover for NATO. 1299 01:30:51,000 --> 01:30:53,560 In reality, for the USA. 1300 01:30:53,800 --> 01:30:56,079 Emil Constantinescu did this 1301 01:30:56,760 --> 01:31:02,280 despite public opinion in Romania being pro-Serbia. 1302 01:31:03,119 --> 01:31:07,680 And because of that, in the fall of 1999, 1303 01:31:07,800 --> 01:31:10,119 Tony Blair came to Bucharest. 1304 01:31:15,159 --> 01:31:17,279 And then I said, "Tony, 1305 01:31:18,840 --> 01:31:22,319 thank you for coming, it's important for NATO, 1306 01:31:22,880 --> 01:31:25,720 but we in Romania have a saying: 1307 01:31:26,159 --> 01:31:30,119 if someone gives you a finger, you ask for their whole hand." 1308 01:31:30,520 --> 01:31:36,960 And I said "we know what NATO is now, this isn't our main issue anymore." 1309 01:31:37,119 --> 01:31:41,359 "Our key issue is becoming a member of the EU". 1310 01:31:41,720 --> 01:31:43,680 And he said, "Okay." 1311 01:32:00,800 --> 01:32:05,320 We joined the EU thanks to the people who died in Yugoslavia. 1312 01:32:05,920 --> 01:32:10,440 Until then, Iliescu had been toiling with Mitterrand, 1313 01:32:10,760 --> 01:32:14,440 talking to the socialists in his circles. 1314 01:32:14,640 --> 01:32:17,560 Nobody paid attention to us! They didn't even consider it! 1315 01:32:17,680 --> 01:32:20,800 The EU was even more difficult than NATO! 1316 01:32:21,000 --> 01:32:23,399 We had no support from anyone in the EU. 1317 01:32:23,960 --> 01:32:25,880 Absolutely no one! And Tony Blair came 1318 01:32:27,119 --> 01:32:33,239 and within a week, Romania was on its course to join the EU. 1319 01:32:33,319 --> 01:32:36,599 That's the real story of what happened. 1320 01:32:36,720 --> 01:32:39,280 We weren't allowed to join the EU 1321 01:32:39,560 --> 01:32:42,840 because we were beautiful, charming, faithful, 1322 01:32:43,000 --> 01:32:47,239 or because we had great politicians who got us there. 1323 01:32:48,520 --> 01:32:54,200 Chapter 6 Sleep peacefully! 1324 01:32:54,479 --> 01:32:58,039 I sold my flat and I deposited the cash just for the three months 1325 01:32:58,159 --> 01:33:00,319 and now I was supposed to get it back! 1326 01:33:00,560 --> 01:33:03,800 And when I wanted to withdraw the money, this happened. 1327 01:33:04,079 --> 01:33:08,720 At the beginning of 2000, Romania was facing yet another social and economic shock: 1328 01:33:08,800 --> 01:33:11,239 the collapse of the FNI (National Investment Fund). 1329 01:33:11,479 --> 01:33:14,879 My boy sold both the truck and the trailer. 1330 01:33:14,960 --> 01:33:16,480 He sold the cow and the calf. 1331 01:33:16,640 --> 01:33:18,600 So he could buy a tractor at some point. 1332 01:33:18,680 --> 01:33:20,880 I put it (the money) in there! There it is! 1333 01:33:21,399 --> 01:33:25,399 A nation of romantics. Full of dreams. 1334 01:33:27,000 --> 01:33:30,279 The FNI was the latest invention from a long series of scams 1335 01:33:30,359 --> 01:33:33,039 who lured Romanians in during the transition years. 1336 01:33:33,159 --> 01:33:36,359 The ads became more attractive, but the recipe was the same: 1337 01:33:36,680 --> 01:33:38,720 people deposited money in the Fund 1338 01:33:38,920 --> 01:33:42,680 and were expecting returns up to four times higher than any regular bank. 1339 01:33:42,960 --> 01:33:46,960 Sleep peacefully while FNI works for you. 1340 01:33:47,439 --> 01:33:51,639 The National Investment Fund. It's part of your life. 1341 01:33:51,960 --> 01:33:55,000 Behind this scheme was Sorin Ovidiu Vîntu 1342 01:33:55,079 --> 01:33:57,840 who, in the meantime, graduated from smuggling goods from Turkey 1343 01:33:57,920 --> 01:33:59,640 to much more complex operations. 1344 01:33:59,840 --> 01:34:01,480 Why did they call you in? 1345 01:34:01,840 --> 01:34:03,960 For the accusation of ... 1346 01:34:04,880 --> 01:34:06,760 ...money laundering. 1347 01:34:07,279 --> 01:34:09,439 As expected, the FNI collapsed. 1348 01:34:09,520 --> 01:34:13,120 Over 300,000 people realised that while they were sleeping peacefully, 1349 01:34:13,319 --> 01:34:14,759 their savings evaporated. 1350 01:34:14,960 --> 01:34:18,800 All they could do was take to the streets and shout their despair 1351 01:34:19,399 --> 01:34:23,279 Thieves! Thieves! 1352 01:34:23,680 --> 01:34:25,800 Damn you all! 1353 01:34:26,479 --> 01:34:28,639 You should all go to hell! 1354 01:34:30,760 --> 01:34:34,800 70% are retired and poor! 1355 01:34:37,159 --> 01:34:41,319 It took many years for Sorin Ovidiu Vîntu to pay for his actions. 1356 01:34:41,800 --> 01:34:45,400 In prison, he met people who lost money through the FNI. 1357 01:34:45,720 --> 01:34:47,560 Many.. 1358 01:34:48,880 --> 01:34:53,760 And I showed them how not to get scammed by institutions like mine. 1359 01:34:55,439 --> 01:34:59,439 The crash of the FNI occurred during the last six months of the CDR governance. 1360 01:34:59,640 --> 01:35:04,600 It was the final blow to the huge hopes Romanians had in 1996. 1361 01:35:05,159 --> 01:35:07,559 People didn't expect any miracles, 1362 01:35:07,840 --> 01:35:10,960 but they were expecting more... 1363 01:35:11,079 --> 01:35:12,720 honesty. 1364 01:35:13,199 --> 01:35:16,599 So people were very generous 1365 01:35:16,840 --> 01:35:19,920 with that coalition and trusted them with their vote, 1366 01:35:20,039 --> 01:35:22,519 but the coalition didn't know what to do with it. 1367 01:35:22,720 --> 01:35:25,720 The worst thing was the moral bankruptcy 1368 01:35:26,119 --> 01:35:29,000 of the opposition that came into power. 1369 01:35:29,079 --> 01:35:31,760 What do you mean? Why? What happened then? 1370 01:35:31,920 --> 01:35:33,560 I don't see where, 1371 01:35:33,960 --> 01:35:39,119 I would need to understand how my administration failed morally. 1372 01:35:39,479 --> 01:35:41,319 The FNI scandal. 1373 01:35:41,600 --> 01:35:45,640 At the heart of this scandal was a certain Camenco Petrovici, 1374 01:35:45,920 --> 01:35:49,680 head of CEC (building society), and member of the Peasants' Party. 1375 01:35:50,000 --> 01:35:55,319 That man made a deal with Vîntu that on those taglines with 1376 01:35:55,520 --> 01:36:01,560 "Sleep peacefully, FNI works for you", the CEC symbol would also appear. 1377 01:36:02,560 --> 01:36:04,000 CEC was a brand. 1378 01:36:04,199 --> 01:36:05,760 We want our money back! 1379 01:36:06,239 --> 01:36:09,159 The CEC guaranteed the payments. 1380 01:36:09,720 --> 01:36:14,640 Vîntu said: "You get the money, I'll get you a satisfactory profit." 1381 01:36:17,359 --> 01:36:20,519 And the CEC said: "Yes, that's fine, I'll guarantee this!" 1382 01:36:20,720 --> 01:36:25,119 That's what happened there: a state-owned bank became guarantor for a Ponzi Scheme. 1383 01:36:25,479 --> 01:36:28,839 And this was done by a member of the Peasants' Party. 1384 01:36:29,359 --> 01:36:33,639 That's one example, indeed. It was a... 1385 01:36:34,760 --> 01:36:37,800 ... an act signed by Prime Minister Radu Vasile. 1386 01:36:38,000 --> 01:36:40,720 It was a completely wrong thing to do. 1387 01:36:45,239 --> 01:36:48,719 The first decade of democracy ended in an atmosphere of despair. 1388 01:36:48,920 --> 01:36:52,480 The young people who made the Revolution happen were no longer young, 1389 01:36:52,560 --> 01:36:54,400 and there was nothing left of their passion. 1390 01:36:54,760 --> 01:36:57,320 There isn't a child who died in the revolution 1391 01:36:57,600 --> 01:37:00,440 who wouldn't say, "Mother, did I die in vain?" 1392 01:37:00,680 --> 01:37:03,440 They'd be turning in their graves. 1393 01:37:04,920 --> 01:37:11,079 I ask for forgiveness from all those who hoped they'd live better, 1394 01:37:11,800 --> 01:37:15,360 but continued to suffer. 1395 01:37:16,560 --> 01:37:18,320 Before the 2000 elections, 1396 01:37:18,439 --> 01:37:22,119 Emil Constantinescu announced that he won't be running for a second term 1397 01:37:22,279 --> 01:37:28,079 and opened the door to the most unpredictable electoral struggle after the Revolution. 1398 01:37:39,760 --> 01:37:42,680 The Romanians were once deceived, 1399 01:37:43,039 --> 01:37:45,439 but this won't work a second time, 1400 01:37:45,560 --> 01:37:49,760 this manoeuvring of those in power. 1401 01:37:50,119 --> 01:37:53,920 At the end of 2000, Ion Iliescu was back in full energy, 1402 01:37:54,039 --> 01:37:59,720 while the parties on the right proved incapable of building a coalition to support a candidate. 1403 01:38:01,199 --> 01:38:04,199 Me, Isarescu, Melescanu, Roman... 1404 01:38:05,600 --> 01:38:07,440 ...who else did I mention? 1405 01:38:07,640 --> 01:38:11,560 Me, Isarescu, Melescanu, Roman. Whatever. 1406 01:38:12,279 --> 01:38:16,960 And while some were counting their candidates, the voters' attention was focused somewhere else 1407 01:38:19,640 --> 01:38:22,800 Vadim, get the country out of trouble, Vadim! 1408 01:38:23,119 --> 01:38:26,880 Vadim! Vadim! 1409 01:38:27,760 --> 01:38:31,680 He had a nationalistic aggression that was out of the ordinary. 1410 01:38:32,119 --> 01:38:36,359 He would connect with all types of nationalist feelings. 1411 01:38:36,560 --> 01:38:38,560 WE LOVE YOU VADIM 1412 01:38:38,880 --> 01:38:45,680 And, for a people who lived 40 years in total political illiteracy, this was effective. 1413 01:38:46,560 --> 01:38:49,440 Come on man, not only I'm a communist, 1414 01:38:49,800 --> 01:38:53,159 I was born and raised in the communist spirit, for Christ's sake! 1415 01:38:53,359 --> 01:38:55,519 I had a home, I had everything. 1416 01:38:55,680 --> 01:38:57,760 Now I'm starving, fuck them! 1417 01:38:57,880 --> 01:39:00,920 After 10 years, people started to lose their patience. 1418 01:39:01,439 --> 01:39:05,199 And then they said, "Go on then, let's go with this guy" 1419 01:39:05,439 --> 01:39:07,399 "At least he's loud, determined." 1420 01:39:07,560 --> 01:39:09,960 People turned in 2000 towards determined people. 1421 01:39:10,279 --> 01:39:15,239 And Vadim seemed like someone who talks and points to this ...mafia! 1422 01:39:15,560 --> 01:39:18,520 The country was largely run by gangsters. 1423 01:39:18,680 --> 01:39:20,440 And I have the courage to say that. 1424 01:39:20,560 --> 01:39:25,320 They stole with impunity, with four hands, like a Rahmaninov concert. 1425 01:39:25,319 --> 01:39:28,239 They stole and moved the money abroad. 1426 01:39:28,920 --> 01:39:31,800 Vadim didn't just bring his own electorate, 1427 01:39:32,199 --> 01:39:36,000 but he also brought a lot of young voters 1428 01:39:36,279 --> 01:39:39,079 who said, "I'll vote for him because he's crazy!" 1429 01:39:39,560 --> 01:39:42,240 I confess that in 2000 I voted for Vadim 1430 01:39:42,479 --> 01:39:44,479 exactly on those considerations. 1431 01:39:44,760 --> 01:39:47,680 What were the reasons to vote for Corneliu Vadim Tudor? 1432 01:39:48,239 --> 01:39:50,559 His extremism. I appreciate it. 1433 01:39:51,119 --> 01:39:52,720 He's got guts. 1434 01:39:52,760 --> 01:39:54,840 I like the nationalist style. 1435 01:39:55,000 --> 01:39:58,840 Rather than having any relations with European countries, 1436 01:39:58,920 --> 01:40:01,480 to join the EU, 1437 01:40:02,199 --> 01:40:05,519 better to stay in Romania, to have our own salary. 1438 01:40:05,600 --> 01:40:06,800 He thinks like I do. 1439 01:40:06,920 --> 01:40:08,239 "I VOTED FOR HIM BECAUSE HE'S CRAZY" 1440 01:40:08,359 --> 01:40:12,880 Over three million Romanians used the the same logic and voted for Corneliu Vadim Tudor 1441 01:40:13,079 --> 01:40:15,479 who went to the second round with Ion Iliescu. 1442 01:40:15,720 --> 01:40:17,480 We're strong! 1443 01:40:18,760 --> 01:40:20,880 This is an earthquake! 1444 01:40:21,000 --> 01:40:23,119 For the whole world, not just for Romania! 1445 01:40:23,239 --> 01:40:25,239 Romania shocked the western world again. 1446 01:40:25,319 --> 01:40:28,599 A candidate full of communist nostalgia and with extremist speeches, 1447 01:40:28,680 --> 01:40:30,880 was one step away from becoming president. 1448 01:40:31,039 --> 01:40:34,880 Romania can only be run with a rifle! 1449 01:40:35,399 --> 01:40:37,599 He wanted machine guns on the stadiums, 1450 01:40:37,760 --> 01:40:41,119 "I'll execute them with machine guns on the stadium, no problem." 1451 01:40:41,279 --> 01:40:44,079 He was making lists, he made a list: 1452 01:40:44,239 --> 01:40:47,279 "people who will be shot as soon as we come into power." 1453 01:40:47,479 --> 01:40:49,479 More than a decade after the Revolution, 1454 01:40:49,680 --> 01:40:52,680 Romania was once again considering Ion Iliescu a saviour. 1455 01:40:52,920 --> 01:40:55,800 Iliescu is fair! 1456 01:40:56,319 --> 01:40:59,960 The press and civil society united against the danger of Vadim Tudor, 1457 01:41:00,079 --> 01:41:02,519 urging people to choose the lesser evil. 1458 01:41:03,000 --> 01:41:05,960 I welcome the gesture of solidarity 1459 01:41:06,439 --> 01:41:09,799 in the face of threats to democracy ... 1460 01:41:10,159 --> 01:41:14,159 Ion Iliescu won the elections by a landslide and became a president again. 1461 01:41:14,840 --> 01:41:18,279 It's time to reconcile. It's time to unite. 1462 01:41:25,319 --> 01:41:28,279 Four years followed in which Ion Iliescu took a step back 1463 01:41:28,399 --> 01:41:32,000 and watched over the rise of his political successor. 1464 01:41:38,640 --> 01:41:41,160 Adrian Nastase, the new Prime Minister of Romania, 1465 01:41:41,319 --> 01:41:44,239 came from the young wing of the communist structures 1466 01:41:44,439 --> 01:41:48,079 which, after the Revolution, joined the FSN and later Iliescu's PDSR. 1467 01:41:48,520 --> 01:41:50,880 He was seen as a man able to reform the party, 1468 01:41:51,039 --> 01:41:53,800 and in the early 2000s he took this role seriously. 1469 01:41:54,520 --> 01:41:57,600 He changed the name to PSD, surrounded himself with youth, 1470 01:41:57,640 --> 01:42:02,320 and set for his government objectives which suggested the party finally broke with the past. 1471 01:42:02,760 --> 01:42:06,159 The new PSD is the only force capable 1472 01:42:06,720 --> 01:42:08,840 of building the new Romania. 1473 01:42:09,399 --> 01:42:12,639 Determined steps were being taken towards NATO and the EU, 1474 01:42:13,079 --> 01:42:16,439 and foreign investors were encouraged to come to Romania. 1475 01:42:20,680 --> 01:42:25,640 The so-called cardboard capitalists, the first big investors 1476 01:42:25,960 --> 01:42:31,239 had proven incapable of managing anything beyond a family business. 1477 01:42:31,560 --> 01:42:35,640 And it was necessary to join the structures 1478 01:42:36,039 --> 01:42:40,279 of globalization, foreign investments, and so on. 1479 01:42:41,079 --> 01:42:46,399 Foreign investments also meant privatizing large state-owned companies, such as Petrom and Sidex Galați. 1480 01:42:46,720 --> 01:42:49,159 I'm glad that the privatization of Petrom 1481 01:42:49,319 --> 01:42:54,759 is not just a regular transaction of selling state assets. 1482 01:42:55,239 --> 01:43:00,439 It's very important to emphasize that this isn't just a stock sale, 1483 01:43:00,760 --> 01:43:04,840 today's contract is, firstly, a partnership 1484 01:43:05,399 --> 01:43:08,159 with a reliable investor. 1485 01:43:08,920 --> 01:43:13,440 Basically, Sidex had losses of a million dollars a day, 1486 01:43:14,039 --> 01:43:16,119 which represented unpaid wages. 1487 01:43:17,079 --> 01:43:20,159 Of course we could've kept doing that, but the EU said: 1488 01:43:20,359 --> 01:43:24,839 "Well, this is a subsidy, right? We can't agree with that." 1489 01:43:25,119 --> 01:43:28,199 Same with Petrom and so on. 1490 01:43:28,520 --> 01:43:32,800 Many complain because we privatized Petrom, 1491 01:43:33,039 --> 01:43:38,199 but when I privatized it, it had a debt of 30 billion lei. 1492 01:43:38,840 --> 01:43:42,640 Foreign investments weren't just about controversial privatizations. 1493 01:43:42,760 --> 01:43:46,600 On buildings in big cities, logos of western corporations start to appear. 1494 01:43:47,479 --> 01:43:49,000 In the early 2000s, 1495 01:43:49,079 --> 01:43:53,279 Romania sees it's first economic growth after the fall of communism. 1496 01:43:53,359 --> 01:43:58,719 The world saw Adrian Nastase as a guy who's in control. 1497 01:43:59,560 --> 01:44:02,600 And after the democratic government which was a total chaos 1498 01:44:02,800 --> 01:44:05,840 and when no one seemed to be in control of anything, 1499 01:44:06,199 --> 01:44:08,439 he became a landmark. 1500 01:44:08,600 --> 01:44:11,560 He stabilized the economy, inflation went down. 1501 01:44:12,039 --> 01:44:15,000 What was wrong, of course, 1502 01:44:15,399 --> 01:44:18,399 was the Nastase Government enabling the corruption. 1503 01:44:18,640 --> 01:44:24,119 In terms of the level of corruption the 90's now seemed fairy tales by the Brothers Grimm. 1504 01:44:24,439 --> 01:44:27,559 Someone, at one point, wanted to come and count my chickens, 1505 01:44:28,039 --> 01:44:31,079 I suggested, they'd better count my eggs (euphemism for testicles) 1506 01:44:32,239 --> 01:44:34,800 Under the Adrian Nastase government, 1507 01:44:34,840 --> 01:44:39,480 corruption became so visible that it couldn't be concealed anymore. And he knew it too. 1508 01:44:39,720 --> 01:44:44,920 The slogan "Năstase, Four Houses", it's when these things started ... 1509 01:44:46,279 --> 01:44:49,880 It's true that I owned four houses, but not at the same time. 1510 01:44:50,159 --> 01:44:56,359 Basically, no fraud or major issues were found. 1511 01:44:56,600 --> 01:45:03,960 They found issues with the PVC windows that I, presumably, received as a gift. 1512 01:45:04,119 --> 01:45:07,000 Electoral posters or hats. 1513 01:45:07,239 --> 01:45:11,039 Or Mitrea painting a flat or something. 1514 01:45:11,359 --> 01:45:13,759 These were different times, different attitudes. 1515 01:45:14,680 --> 01:45:18,079 I was leading the Prime Minister's Control Body. 1516 01:45:18,239 --> 01:45:20,439 In 2001-2004, 1517 01:45:21,119 --> 01:45:25,319 nobody really knew what integrity and transparency meant. 1518 01:45:25,479 --> 01:45:28,719 They all had companies, contracts, uncles, cousins. 1519 01:45:29,159 --> 01:45:31,239 There was a statement from Miron Mitrea, 1520 01:45:31,399 --> 01:45:37,239 who was looked into later on, because someone repaired his mother's house. 1521 01:45:37,800 --> 01:45:40,000 And Mitrea rightly said: 1522 01:45:40,159 --> 01:45:45,920 "At that time, not only it was legal for some company to repair your home for free" 1523 01:45:46,039 --> 01:45:49,439 "but all companies wanted to repair my mother's home." 1524 01:45:49,600 --> 01:45:51,960 That's when the local barons began to appear. 1525 01:45:52,239 --> 01:45:57,719 Mischie was a beacon of corruption. In Gorj, I think. 1526 01:45:57,880 --> 01:46:01,279 Why do you have this reputation? 1527 01:46:01,560 --> 01:46:06,000 Because, not by coincidence, many people start with Mischie when they talk about local barons. 1528 01:46:06,079 --> 01:46:07,439 Please explain that, honestly. 1529 01:46:07,600 --> 01:46:11,920 The explanation is clear: because, in Gorj County 1530 01:46:12,159 --> 01:46:16,279 I identified my activity with the activity of the whole county, 1531 01:46:16,399 --> 01:46:18,119 of the entire population. 1532 01:46:18,279 --> 01:46:20,079 Yes, nothing moves without Mischie! 1533 01:46:20,159 --> 01:46:22,920 No, it's not "nothing moves"! Stop referring to the past 1534 01:46:23,319 --> 01:46:26,279 It doesn't mean, that if you have authority, everyone needs to fall in line. 1535 01:46:27,239 --> 01:46:30,479 The PSD had a character like him all across Romania. 1536 01:46:30,960 --> 01:46:34,840 I have the honor and the pleasure to invite you to take a virtual tour 1537 01:46:35,039 --> 01:46:37,439 to introduce you to the county of Vrancea 1538 01:46:37,760 --> 01:46:39,800 so dear to me. 1539 01:46:40,279 --> 01:46:43,559 The barons ruled the counties and secured votes for the party. 1540 01:46:43,680 --> 01:46:47,400 In return, the party supplied them with protection from the Justice Dept. 1541 01:46:47,520 --> 01:46:53,360 It didn't exist back then, the idea that a politician can be tried or convicted. 1542 01:46:53,600 --> 01:46:58,440 I remember, the story then was that politics controls the justice system. 1543 01:46:59,399 --> 01:47:01,079 At the top of this system, 1544 01:47:01,359 --> 01:47:04,439 Adrian Nastase found himself with no apparent way forward. 1545 01:47:04,600 --> 01:47:06,800 He needed the local barons' influence, 1546 01:47:07,000 --> 01:47:10,039 but, at the same time, he committed to taking Romania into Europe. 1547 01:47:10,279 --> 01:47:12,359 So he found a Romanian solution. 1548 01:47:12,760 --> 01:47:15,199 Adrian Nastase tried to reconcile 1549 01:47:15,359 --> 01:47:18,199 two elements that are somewhat irreconcilable. 1550 01:47:18,520 --> 01:47:23,160 Externally all appeared in order, we have laws, institutions that function properly, 1551 01:47:23,279 --> 01:47:26,479 we have a separation of powers within the state, an independent justice system. 1552 01:47:26,720 --> 01:47:29,640 But, domesticaly, he was faking all these things, 1553 01:47:29,920 --> 01:47:33,079 either through the people he placed at the top of the system, 1554 01:47:33,479 --> 01:47:37,079 or through his design of legislation. 1555 01:47:37,760 --> 01:47:39,000 In the fall of 2002, 1556 01:47:39,199 --> 01:47:44,559 The Nastase Government seemed to not tolerate corruption and established a dedicated institution. 1557 01:47:44,800 --> 01:47:50,400 30 prosecutors, 170 Judicial Police officers and 45 specialists, 1558 01:47:50,560 --> 01:47:53,840 form the National Anticorruption Prosecutor's Office of Romania. 1559 01:47:54,159 --> 01:47:57,559 The NAP was set up at EU's request. 1560 01:47:57,680 --> 01:48:01,520 And Nastase accepted it and said: "Yes, we'll set it up." 1561 01:48:01,680 --> 01:48:05,760 But it had no substance and, worse, it had ulterior motives. 1562 01:48:06,039 --> 01:48:09,760 Of course, the West figured this out and said: 1563 01:48:10,479 --> 01:48:15,239 "Big fish aren't getting caught, they're still getting away with it!" 1564 01:48:15,960 --> 01:48:19,600 Yes, they really thought they could trick them. That's what Nastase did 1565 01:48:19,920 --> 01:48:25,359 He tried to give the appearance of a normal, functioning society, 1566 01:48:25,760 --> 01:48:29,119 but in fact, he damaged it as much as he could, 1567 01:48:29,520 --> 01:48:31,960 with the manoeuvres he was doing behind the scenes. 1568 01:48:32,159 --> 01:48:36,359 They say I didn't love NAP, I had no fondness towards it. 1569 01:48:36,520 --> 01:48:38,880 Let's be serious, these are jokes. 1570 01:48:39,000 --> 01:48:42,439 The NAP was built to hand out DPs (Don't Prosecute), 1571 01:48:42,680 --> 01:48:45,920 They blocked criminal prosecution for all the big fish. 1572 01:48:46,079 --> 01:48:52,199 We cannot, at this stage, deal with mid and large scale corruption 1573 01:48:52,359 --> 01:48:57,559 because this institution is already at capacity. 1574 01:48:57,920 --> 01:49:05,000 The institution was in early stages and I don't think we could've expected extraordinary results. 1575 01:49:06,239 --> 01:49:07,960 After four years at the head of the Government, 1576 01:49:08,079 --> 01:49:11,319 Adrian Nastase created the image of an almighty leader, 1577 01:49:11,439 --> 01:49:14,679 the man who decides everything, who everyone had to obey. 1578 01:49:14,920 --> 01:49:16,800 - Who's the goalkeeper? - It's me. 1579 01:49:17,439 --> 01:49:18,000 Florin! 1580 01:49:18,840 --> 01:49:22,440 Make sure you don't catch the ball! 1581 01:49:25,560 --> 01:49:27,720 Did you choose your corner? 1582 01:49:34,159 --> 01:49:37,000 With claps on demand and always surrounded by admirers, 1583 01:49:37,279 --> 01:49:40,960 Adrian Nastase paraded unchallenged around Romania during those years. 1584 01:49:41,279 --> 01:49:45,000 The next step in his political career was obvious and seemed within reach. 1585 01:49:45,159 --> 01:49:50,079 I'm absolutely convinced that I'll win the presidential election. 1586 01:49:53,600 --> 01:49:56,760 His path to Cotroceni seemed to be without obstacles. 1587 01:49:57,000 --> 01:49:59,760 Decimated after the failures of the Constantinescu period, 1588 01:49:59,920 --> 01:50:02,960 The opposition now rallied in a "Justice and Truth" coalition, 1589 01:50:03,039 --> 01:50:06,600 and was gambling everything on a candidate who seemed at the end of his rope. 1590 01:50:06,760 --> 01:50:12,400 It's an alliance that declared zero tolerance for corruption. 1591 01:50:13,279 --> 01:50:16,359 He was sick, he was depressed, I don't know for sure ... 1592 01:50:16,640 --> 01:50:20,160 But, he simply couldn't deliver a speech to the end. 1593 01:50:20,439 --> 01:50:24,159 How I ended up in this strange situation ... 1594 01:50:24,279 --> 01:50:30,679 At the end of 2002, I had a very difficult surgery during which I lost a kidney. 1595 01:50:30,840 --> 01:50:34,840 I had to go through recovery, I didn't really do it properly. 1596 01:50:35,119 --> 01:50:40,319 Then it was 2004, and I was in a state of exhaustion 1597 01:50:40,479 --> 01:50:43,559 both physically and mentally. 1598 01:50:44,119 --> 01:50:48,399 Unfortunately, my journey in the presidential race ends here. 1599 01:50:48,800 --> 01:50:53,199 My health prevents me from pursuing this further. 1600 01:50:53,680 --> 01:50:56,640 The start of the campaign was only a few weeks away, 1601 01:50:57,000 --> 01:51:00,640 and, suddenly, the presidential elections became unpredictable. 1602 01:51:02,000 --> 01:51:07,279 To replace Stolojan, enters a character more gifted for the demands of an election campaign. 1603 01:51:07,560 --> 01:51:08,760 Dear Stolo ... 1604 01:51:26,119 --> 01:51:33,640 Of course, this was all an act, so well played, that he fooled everyone 1605 01:51:34,319 --> 01:51:35,439 "Dear Stolo... 1606 01:51:36,800 --> 01:51:37,800 Thank you!" 1607 01:51:38,000 --> 01:51:40,000 That's it, "Dear Stolo." 1608 01:51:41,199 --> 01:51:45,239 Yes, yes, with tears, wiping them with the back of the palm ... tricks! 1609 01:51:45,479 --> 01:51:49,599 If your spirit will stay with us, 1610 01:51:50,119 --> 01:51:53,359 The Alliance will win. 1611 01:51:53,960 --> 01:51:55,000 Thank you! 1612 01:51:55,159 --> 01:52:03,199 A politician who can be such a good actor is very difficult to stop. 1613 01:52:10,119 --> 01:52:11,880 We were dismayed. 1614 01:52:12,479 --> 01:52:14,559 "Wow, Traian Basescu is crying? What..." 1615 01:52:14,720 --> 01:52:19,640 I think it was the first time when he was emotional in public. 1616 01:52:19,880 --> 01:52:22,840 I believe those tears were sincere. 1617 01:52:23,039 --> 01:52:25,840 Basescu is an emotional guy. He cried several times. 1618 01:52:26,279 --> 01:52:28,599 Especially when reciting his own poetry. 1619 01:52:28,800 --> 01:52:31,760 He's a kind of an... 1620 01:52:32,079 --> 01:52:33,920 ... emotional thug. 1621 01:52:34,279 --> 01:52:38,599 And so I think those tears, were a bit stimulated for effect, 1622 01:52:39,159 --> 01:52:41,880 but I think, for the most part, they were honest. 1623 01:52:42,279 --> 01:52:44,719 Yes, he's a sensitive man. 1624 01:52:45,319 --> 01:52:50,119 He's been through a lot in his life, but he had a moment when... 1625 01:52:51,439 --> 01:52:57,879 Look, I also tear up sometimes... I don't know... 1626 01:53:00,039 --> 01:53:04,600 I don't remember exactly, but, during one of those tear-jerker movies... 1627 01:53:05,399 --> 01:53:08,239 You felt like you were about to cry... 1628 01:53:08,439 --> 01:53:11,439 Ah, Love Story, right? Love Story ... 1629 01:53:18,439 --> 01:53:23,359 I felt embarrassed when I saw that, in fact, he didn't have any health issues, 1630 01:53:23,720 --> 01:53:29,079 because I gave him a call then, after the episode with Basescu's tears, 1631 01:53:29,960 --> 01:53:37,159 and I was genuinely concerned, I thought he had cancer, he has to go abroad for treatment. 1632 01:53:37,640 --> 01:53:39,920 From a human perspective, I felt sorry for him. 1633 01:53:40,159 --> 01:53:45,079 Then I realized that it was just a television show 1634 01:53:45,439 --> 01:53:48,279 and that made me sad about him. 1635 01:53:48,520 --> 01:53:53,560 I regret that I am forced to see, once again, 1636 01:53:54,039 --> 01:53:58,960 how low Traian Basescu can go to achieve his political aim. 1637 01:53:59,399 --> 01:54:01,199 From being a definite winner, 1638 01:54:01,279 --> 01:54:05,399 Adrian Nastase found himself in a competition with unknown rules. 1639 01:54:05,720 --> 01:54:08,119 A campaign of fighting to the death followed. 1640 01:54:08,399 --> 01:54:11,000 Romania, wake up! 1641 01:54:11,199 --> 01:54:13,960 Nobody does anything, And we're living in poverty now 1642 01:54:14,399 --> 01:54:17,239 Traian Basescu! 1643 01:54:18,039 --> 01:54:23,239 President of the Social Democratic Party, Mr. Adrian Nastase! 1644 01:54:26,520 --> 01:54:30,360 The bunny Traian is wandering through the country and shouts: 1645 01:54:30,720 --> 01:54:33,800 "Where's the bear so I can eat his ears?" 1646 01:54:35,479 --> 01:54:40,119 I'll take this bunny by the ears and I'll slam him to the ground. 1647 01:54:41,039 --> 01:54:43,800 Burn the corrupt and the liars with your vote! 1648 01:54:43,920 --> 01:54:45,880 Adrian Nastase, my heart! 1649 01:54:46,199 --> 01:54:49,119 He has good judgement and does everything well. 1650 01:54:49,239 --> 01:54:51,000 I only trust him and no one else. 1651 01:54:51,119 --> 01:54:54,960 He has beauty and a power given by God to lead the people. 1652 01:54:55,079 --> 01:54:58,279 My hope is bound to Traian Basescu's nomination. 1653 01:54:58,560 --> 01:55:01,200 Basescu is a man who really cares about people, 1654 01:55:01,319 --> 01:55:04,079 and people feel it and love him, in return. 1655 01:55:04,199 --> 01:55:09,920 The confidence he inspires makes many see him as chosen, a saviour, and to say: 1656 01:55:10,000 --> 01:55:13,319 To me, he is like a knight of justice. 1657 01:55:13,800 --> 01:55:16,360 I don't know, he simply inspires trust. 1658 01:55:16,920 --> 01:55:19,000 Live well! 1659 01:55:19,640 --> 01:55:26,320 I was campaigning with him and I noticed the impact he had on people. 1660 01:55:26,880 --> 01:55:29,000 I got rid of the mafia! 1661 01:55:30,159 --> 01:55:34,960 I had other ideas about what it means to be a leader. 1662 01:55:35,399 --> 01:55:40,479 Of course, I was criticised for not being out in the streets, to shake hands with people. 1663 01:55:41,199 --> 01:55:43,920 During the campaign, I did that too. 1664 01:55:44,119 --> 01:55:47,239 But I think that a leader, firstly, has to be in the office, 1665 01:55:47,359 --> 01:55:50,559 go to the command posts, to build. 1666 01:55:56,920 --> 01:55:58,680 But people said: 1667 01:55:58,760 --> 01:56:01,480 "Well, he is very arrogant, very arrogant!" 1668 01:56:01,680 --> 01:56:04,800 Or to be voted by the people 1669 01:56:05,039 --> 01:56:06,960 you have to be empathetic, 1670 01:56:07,119 --> 01:56:10,199 you need leadership skills and be able to talk to people. 1671 01:56:10,439 --> 01:56:13,199 How could you go and kiss old women? 1672 01:56:13,640 --> 01:56:16,600 To be relatable, to promise things?! 1673 01:56:16,680 --> 01:56:18,440 Nastase was stiff, uptight. 1674 01:56:18,720 --> 01:56:20,680 Do you know what Basescu was? 1675 01:56:21,000 --> 01:56:23,520 He was the wise guy of the 80's. 1676 01:56:23,880 --> 01:56:25,960 In the '80s, there were these wise guys 1677 01:56:26,359 --> 01:56:29,399 who were part of the system, 1678 01:56:29,800 --> 01:56:32,720 but were not party apparatchiks. 1679 01:56:33,039 --> 01:56:37,680 These were usually Security collaborators who knew what was going on. 1680 01:56:38,359 --> 01:56:43,880 More "liberal" guys, with quotation marks, who had a bit of foreign currency and so on. 1681 01:56:44,079 --> 01:56:49,559 That's why Basescu was much more versatile than Adrian Nastase. 1682 01:56:53,199 --> 01:56:55,000 You don't do autographs, do you? 1683 01:56:55,159 --> 01:56:57,479 Yes, ma'am, I do, but they're useless. 1684 01:56:59,279 --> 01:57:00,920 If that's how I feel like ... 1685 01:57:01,239 --> 01:57:03,279 Basescu had human defects: 1686 01:57:03,399 --> 01:57:06,239 he liked to drink, he liked women, 1687 01:57:06,560 --> 01:57:09,440 he'd talk to people in their own language. 1688 01:57:10,159 --> 01:57:13,239 There are urban legends he got into a fight in a market. 1689 01:57:13,760 --> 01:57:17,920 That's it, Romanians wanted a president like that. What could I do, contradict them? 1690 01:57:18,199 --> 01:57:24,639 Basescu was the man who could infuriate Nastase. 1691 01:57:24,840 --> 01:57:26,319 I couldn't. 1692 01:57:26,680 --> 01:57:30,039 My dialogue with Nastase would've been something like: 1693 01:57:30,479 --> 01:57:35,119 "You promised you'd build 100 km of highway and you didn't, right?" 1694 01:57:35,680 --> 01:57:38,280 And isn't it how it should be? 1695 01:57:38,439 --> 01:57:41,399 Was it better to fool around and...? 1696 01:57:42,000 --> 01:57:42,640 Go! 1697 01:57:42,760 --> 01:57:44,760 Live well! 1698 01:57:45,199 --> 01:57:46,159 Exceptional! 1699 01:57:46,319 --> 01:57:48,759 OK, I told you I'm smart? 1700 01:57:49,840 --> 01:57:56,640 At one point, Basescu was on a talk show. 1701 01:57:57,359 --> 01:58:01,159 And the host asks him: "What are you going to do to Nastase if you win?" 1702 01:58:01,279 --> 01:58:05,239 Basescu replied:"I'll catch him and I'll slam his head against the walls!" 1703 01:58:05,279 --> 01:58:08,920 Which Romania the next day found really funny. 1704 01:58:10,399 --> 01:58:13,199 He had this thing I didn't have. 1705 01:58:13,319 --> 01:58:16,079 If I were to say that, it would've sounded terrible. 1706 01:58:16,199 --> 01:58:20,199 And he was saying: "I will impale him in Victoria Square! I'll slam him around!" 1707 01:58:20,439 --> 01:58:24,319 Some empty words with no substance. 1708 01:58:24,520 --> 01:58:26,920 But they were working! 1709 01:58:27,239 --> 01:58:32,559 A wretched system that destroys the political opponents of the Power, 1710 01:58:33,319 --> 01:58:36,039 Well, guys, you won't destroy me! 1711 01:58:36,319 --> 01:58:40,000 In Victory Square with spikes, after November 28th! 1712 01:58:40,640 --> 01:58:43,119 The last fight between Nastase and Basescu 1713 01:58:43,199 --> 01:58:45,760 was the debate before the second round of elections. 1714 01:58:46,159 --> 01:58:49,000 Basescu proved once again the most versatile politician, 1715 01:58:49,079 --> 01:58:51,479 when discussing the most sensitive issue at the time. 1716 01:58:51,680 --> 01:58:54,039 We both have a big problem. 1717 01:58:54,560 --> 01:58:57,560 On my word of honor, let's discuss this honestly. 1718 01:58:58,000 --> 01:59:04,319 How cursed can this nation be, that in the end, 1719 01:59:05,039 --> 01:59:09,239 it has to choose between two former communists? 1720 01:59:09,680 --> 01:59:11,960 Between Adrian Năstase and Băsescu. 1721 01:59:12,199 --> 01:59:16,599 In 15 years, there wasn't one person who came from this world instead. 1722 01:59:16,720 --> 01:59:22,240 Who wasn't tainted by communism, or tained in some way. 1723 01:59:23,600 --> 01:59:26,039 What kind of curse could this be? 1724 01:59:26,479 --> 01:59:29,439 On my word, I feel sorry. 1725 01:59:30,279 --> 01:59:32,479 That was a sketch. 1726 01:59:32,760 --> 01:59:37,440 Mr. Basescu's main concern before this show 1727 01:59:38,439 --> 01:59:40,839 was to find the silver bullet. 1728 01:59:41,079 --> 01:59:44,279 and he thought that this would be the silver bullet, right? 1729 01:59:45,600 --> 01:59:48,680 Those cheap theatrics, right? 1730 01:59:48,920 --> 01:59:51,640 Of a stale countryside 1731 01:59:52,520 --> 01:59:54,760 "Can you imagine Adrian 1732 01:59:54,960 --> 01:59:58,800 how cursed this nation has to be to have to choose ..." 1733 01:59:59,000 --> 02:00:02,239 As in, he had this dilemma, he was wondering. 1734 02:00:03,039 --> 02:00:06,840 In front of the people, he was torn by this question. 1735 02:00:06,920 --> 02:00:10,480 He couldn't care less about he people and communism and all that. 1736 02:00:10,640 --> 02:00:14,000 But he thought: "Let's see how I can make this difficult for him?" 1737 02:00:14,239 --> 02:00:17,960 And then I sometimes looked 1738 02:00:18,720 --> 02:00:22,880 in the mirror. I look at myself, and say: 1739 02:00:23,159 --> 02:00:27,399 "Do you respect the Romanian people, Basescu?", I was wondering. 1740 02:00:28,159 --> 02:00:30,119 I say, "I do!" 1741 02:00:30,279 --> 02:00:34,880 "I look in the mirror, dear Adrian, and I wonder, sometimes ...", you know? 1742 02:00:35,680 --> 02:00:38,960 Almost like a character from cheap play. 1743 02:00:39,279 --> 02:00:43,199 It was like we were living in this theatre production. 1744 02:00:43,560 --> 02:00:46,039 A two-cent rhetoric, a circus. 1745 02:00:46,199 --> 02:00:49,399 The drama is that 1746 02:00:49,520 --> 02:00:54,200 we're not allowed to have the same mindset after 1747 02:00:54,960 --> 02:00:58,399 15 years since communism no longer exists in Romania. 1748 02:00:58,479 --> 02:00:59,239 I hope... 1749 02:00:59,319 --> 02:01:02,319 And you convince me every day 1750 02:01:02,479 --> 02:01:07,519 that you're unable to understand that these institutions need to be independent. 1751 02:01:07,680 --> 02:01:12,600 Nastase showed his from the old generation, uptight, rigid. 1752 02:01:12,880 --> 02:01:16,720 He couldn't handle the situation. 1753 02:01:17,159 --> 02:01:20,079 So that's where he lost, he clearly lost. 1754 02:01:20,439 --> 02:01:24,239 I admit I didn't consider it to be very important because 1755 02:01:24,520 --> 02:01:26,560 of course, I could've easily replied: 1756 02:01:26,760 --> 02:01:30,760 I was a party member, one of the four million, 1757 02:01:31,000 --> 02:01:33,479 while you were actually a party apparatchik. 1758 02:01:33,680 --> 02:01:39,480 Because, basically, you got your title with Elena Ceaușescu's signature in Antwerp. 1759 02:01:39,880 --> 02:01:44,600 Some would say it wasn't a choice between a party member 1760 02:01:44,840 --> 02:01:49,119 and an apparatchik. They'd say that he was also a member of the Security... 1761 02:01:49,399 --> 02:01:54,479 "Dear Petrov", as some call Basescu today. 1762 02:02:01,840 --> 02:02:03,920 Perfect equality. 1763 02:02:04,279 --> 02:02:08,599 The two candidates, in the second round of the presidential elections 1764 02:02:09,039 --> 02:02:12,039 cannot be delimited, with the current estimates. 1765 02:02:12,199 --> 02:02:15,760 It's a result for 7pm, 1766 02:02:16,159 --> 02:02:22,199 and the polling stations are filled with the Alliance's young constituents. 1767 02:02:22,560 --> 02:02:26,560 Adrian, you don't even know how small you start to look! 1768 02:02:30,680 --> 02:02:32,880 On the evening of December 12, 2004, 1769 02:02:33,000 --> 02:02:35,640 Traian Basescu became the president of Romania. 1770 02:02:35,840 --> 02:02:37,720 The result was so surprising, 1771 02:02:37,880 --> 02:02:41,359 that Adrian Nastase couldn't avoid the ridicule of a big celebration 1772 02:02:41,479 --> 02:02:43,879 which the party had prepared long before. 1773 02:02:54,960 --> 02:02:58,960 Nastase! Nastase! 1774 02:03:01,039 --> 02:03:03,600 Thank you for being together with us! 1775 02:03:03,800 --> 02:03:05,880 I'm sure we will win! 1776 02:03:06,119 --> 02:03:07,559 Victory! 1777 02:03:12,199 --> 02:03:15,079 Victory! Victory! 1778 02:03:15,359 --> 02:03:19,359 Nastase! Nastase! 1779 02:03:19,840 --> 02:03:24,000 All this time, the centre of the capital was occupied by Traian Basescu's supporters. 1780 02:03:24,119 --> 02:03:27,239 After another eight years, Romanians took to the streets again, 1781 02:03:27,359 --> 02:03:29,319 putting all their hopes in one man. 1782 02:03:31,279 --> 02:03:32,239 Basescu! 1783 02:03:36,399 --> 02:03:42,839 Silviu Brucan said we needed 20 years to reach democracy. 1784 02:03:45,079 --> 02:03:51,279 You, with your vote, shortened the term to 15 years. 1785 02:03:52,920 --> 02:03:58,199 Romania reached democracy 5 years earlier! 1786 02:04:02,800 --> 02:04:04,760 Live well! 1787 02:04:06,239 --> 02:04:10,920 Chapter 7 Basescu 1788 02:04:17,800 --> 02:04:21,520 I swear to use all my power and abilities 1789 02:04:21,720 --> 02:04:26,199 for the spiritual and material prosperity of the Romanian people... 1790 02:04:26,399 --> 02:04:31,839 On December 20th, 2004, Traian Basescu was formally accepting the highest title in the Romanian state. 1791 02:04:32,000 --> 02:04:34,359 He was the first post-revolution president 1792 02:04:34,560 --> 02:04:37,440 to win the election on a promise of a better life, 1793 02:04:37,560 --> 02:04:39,920 and a country where the laws will be the same for all, 1794 02:04:40,119 --> 02:04:43,439 from the regular citizen to politicians and businessmen. 1795 02:04:43,560 --> 02:04:46,520 Basescu was, suddenly, a traitor, 1796 02:04:46,800 --> 02:04:49,159 in relation to the world which he came from. 1797 02:04:49,319 --> 02:04:54,519 He betrayed his colleagues at FSN and the previous party. 1798 02:04:54,880 --> 02:04:56,039 And what did he do? 1799 02:04:56,520 --> 02:04:59,480 He noticed that the focus of the public opinion was 1800 02:04:59,600 --> 02:05:03,079 the fight against corruption that became a blah-blah for everyone. 1801 02:05:03,239 --> 02:05:06,439 But to him that meant this: 1802 02:05:06,920 --> 02:05:14,000 the birth of a justice system that could attack, legally speaking, anyone who stepped outside the law. 1803 02:05:14,920 --> 02:05:18,039 The fight against corruption 1804 02:05:18,399 --> 02:05:22,799 must be fought by the justice system, which must be depoliticized immediately. 1805 02:05:23,319 --> 02:05:26,960 He won the election with this speech, so he had to deliver something. 1806 02:05:27,680 --> 02:05:31,360 It was Traian Basescu's main concern at the beginning of his term. 1807 02:05:31,479 --> 02:05:34,119 At the first meeting of the Supreme Council for Defense, 1808 02:05:34,199 --> 02:05:37,119 corruption was declared a national security issue. 1809 02:05:37,399 --> 02:05:42,719 At the same time, Basescu would overstep his duties and choose the new Minister of Justice himself. 1810 02:05:43,039 --> 02:05:45,960 The proposal to be the Minister of Justice 1811 02:05:46,119 --> 02:05:49,199 found me doing the dishes on Christmas day. 1812 02:05:49,279 --> 02:05:52,199 My mother cooked and I was doing the dishes. 1813 02:05:52,520 --> 02:05:54,680 "Hello, this is Traian Basescu." 1814 02:05:55,119 --> 02:05:57,960 I never spoke to him before, we didn't know each other. 1815 02:05:58,199 --> 02:06:02,359 The argument that convinced me was the following: 1816 02:06:02,920 --> 02:06:07,000 a man from a political party will never be able to 1817 02:06:07,199 --> 02:06:12,039 to reform the justice system properly and fight against political corruption. 1818 02:06:12,199 --> 02:06:17,159 Because, in the meantime, party members helped each other out. 1819 02:06:17,439 --> 02:06:19,719 They could say, "But we made you a minister, 1820 02:06:19,880 --> 02:06:22,640 so why am I or them being investigated?" 1821 02:06:22,760 --> 02:06:25,760 And they'd interfere with the investigations. 1822 02:06:25,960 --> 02:06:29,680 It was best to be someone who knew no one in the party. 1823 02:06:30,039 --> 02:06:32,880 After being appointed, Monica Macovei was given the freedom 1824 02:06:33,039 --> 02:06:35,600 to bring in new people to manage the most important prosecution office. 1825 02:06:35,720 --> 02:06:39,199 Daniel Morar was promoted to the lead of the National Anticorruption Prosecutor's Office, 1826 02:06:39,399 --> 02:06:42,599 and Laura Codruța Kovesi became General Prosecutor of Romania. 1827 02:06:42,800 --> 02:06:46,680 It was a message that a wind of change was blowing through the justice system. 1828 02:06:46,920 --> 02:06:52,560 In essence, it gave some magistrates the freedom to act as experts, 1829 02:06:52,640 --> 02:06:57,400 to stop being under political pressure, as they had been until 2004. 1830 02:06:57,479 --> 02:07:02,479 When everyone knew that you wouldn't open a lawsuit without the party approving it. 1831 02:07:03,079 --> 02:07:05,760 DNA began the prosecution against George Copos, 1832 02:07:05,840 --> 02:07:08,319 the general director of the Lottery, Nicolae Cristea, 1833 02:07:08,399 --> 02:07:11,359 and one of the Ana Electronics shareholders, Rosa Giglio Giuseppe. 1834 02:07:11,479 --> 02:07:13,879 The three are suspected of tax evasion and official misconduct. 1835 02:07:13,960 --> 02:07:19,920 Prosecutors have begun a criminal investigation against the then-Deputy Prime Minister, George Copos. 1836 02:07:20,279 --> 02:07:26,920 And, coincidentally, the day when DNA announced it would begin to prosecute him 1837 02:07:27,239 --> 02:07:32,159 was when I went to see a play in the afternoon. 1838 02:07:32,520 --> 02:07:38,760 I've set up my phone to silent and, when I got out of there, after two hours, 1839 02:07:39,279 --> 02:07:41,639 I think I had about 50 missed calls. 1840 02:07:44,079 --> 02:07:45,479 It was crazy! 1841 02:07:45,600 --> 02:07:50,480 I didn't imagine it would generate such an interest at such an early stage. 1842 02:07:50,800 --> 02:07:54,440 After all, it was the beginning of the investigations against a man, it didn't mean much... 1843 02:07:55,039 --> 02:07:58,880 He wasn't arrested, tried or convicted. 1844 02:07:59,159 --> 02:08:03,039 But in the end, it became obvious why there was this kind of interest: 1845 02:08:03,119 --> 02:08:05,760 he was the Deputy Prime Minister, 1846 02:08:06,000 --> 02:08:10,800 and this kind of thing hadn't happened in Romania before then. 1847 02:08:11,000 --> 02:08:14,199 Well, the phone calls were from... everyone. 1848 02:08:14,479 --> 02:08:20,359 And the Government meeting was about to start. When I entered the room, everyone was looking at me very doubtful. 1849 02:08:20,640 --> 02:08:22,320 Their eyes said: 1850 02:08:22,840 --> 02:08:24,720 "We have our Minister of Justice 1851 02:08:25,640 --> 02:08:28,320 in our own government and we're being investigated?" 1852 02:08:28,359 --> 02:08:30,519 That's what their looks said. 1853 02:08:31,640 --> 02:08:34,119 It's something that never happened before. 1854 02:08:34,319 --> 02:08:38,679 Tariceanu says: "Monica, I thought we're going after the opposition!" 1855 02:08:38,840 --> 02:08:41,159 "That we're going after the opposition ..." 1856 02:08:41,399 --> 02:08:43,679 And I said, "We don't go after anyone! 1857 02:08:43,800 --> 02:08:46,640 Prosecutors investigate based on evidence." 1858 02:08:46,760 --> 02:08:51,800 Copos was shouting at me over the table that he'll never speak to me again 1859 02:08:51,920 --> 02:08:53,359 I said "Okay." 1860 02:08:53,560 --> 02:08:55,800 If they find anything illegal, they should prosecute, 1861 02:08:55,920 --> 02:08:57,840 if not, they should apologize. 1862 02:08:58,319 --> 02:09:02,519 Personally, I don't feel startled, I have no fear and no doubt 1863 02:09:02,720 --> 02:09:05,039 regarding the outcome of the investigations. 1864 02:09:05,159 --> 02:09:06,840 Tariceanu, however, said: 1865 02:09:07,119 --> 02:09:11,439 "It's unacceptable for a member of the government to be investigated and for me not to be informed." 1866 02:09:11,760 --> 02:09:18,840 "So you need to find a channel through which I can find out in advance." 1867 02:09:19,479 --> 02:09:22,199 And then I said, "You won't find out in advance!" 1868 02:09:23,279 --> 02:09:29,239 It was a small statement of independence for the beginning of DNA. 1869 02:09:30,000 --> 02:09:33,680 It does something that politicians know nothing about. 1870 02:09:35,039 --> 02:09:37,479 But the game was not just about politicians. 1871 02:09:37,920 --> 02:09:40,520 There were also the big businessmen behind them, 1872 02:09:40,720 --> 02:09:45,039 controversial characters such as: Dinu Patriciu, Sorin Ovidiu Vîntu and Dan Voiculescu. 1873 02:09:45,159 --> 02:09:46,960 Madam Prosecutor, do you hear me? 1874 02:09:47,159 --> 02:09:49,079 Madam Minister Macovei is here with us. 1875 02:09:49,159 --> 02:09:51,199 No, I was talking to the prosecutor Macovei. 1876 02:09:51,600 --> 02:09:53,440 She's listening,we're hearing you well.. 1877 02:09:53,520 --> 02:09:54,600 You hear me, yes? 1878 02:09:54,720 --> 02:09:58,280 Madam Prosecutor, where is all this hypocrisy coming from, 1879 02:09:58,439 --> 02:10:00,639 all this acting? 1880 02:10:01,039 --> 02:10:04,319 Like you're some innocent girl, with no sins, 1881 02:10:04,760 --> 02:10:10,840 nothing is out of place, you're all clean, you and President Basescu. 1882 02:10:11,119 --> 02:10:15,680 We, the oligarchs, are bastards, are evil. 1883 02:10:16,000 --> 02:10:20,800 immaterial of how much we've done for Romania, objectively. 1884 02:10:21,159 --> 02:10:26,079 Where is the justice reform that you keep mentioning? 1885 02:10:27,079 --> 02:10:29,119 Madam Prosecutor Ceausescu. 1886 02:10:29,560 --> 02:10:34,560 Mr. Voiculescu, Mrs. Macovei is my guest and she said she feels insulted. 1887 02:10:34,720 --> 02:10:38,159 Well done to you, Mrs. Gabi Firea, with your guests and everything... 1888 02:10:38,319 --> 02:10:39,920 It's OK, I can handle this. 1889 02:10:40,319 --> 02:10:41,920 Handle it, Mrs. Macovei! 1890 02:10:42,079 --> 02:10:43,680 And you should stop the acting 1891 02:10:43,800 --> 02:10:45,760 because the people of Romania are not stupid. 1892 02:10:45,880 --> 02:10:48,520 Owning the most influential newspapers and television channels, 1893 02:10:48,680 --> 02:10:53,200 the transition oligarchs reacted harshly to Basescu's anti-corruption offensive. 1894 02:10:53,680 --> 02:10:56,680 They all knew that a free justice system would, sooner or later, 1895 02:10:56,920 --> 02:10:59,199 investigate how they gained their assets. 1896 02:10:59,319 --> 02:11:03,679 I think it already reached some of them. Patriciu was already targeted. 1897 02:11:04,600 --> 02:11:09,240 It was in 2005 when Tariceanu wrote the note: "Traian, see if you can do something about this." 1898 02:11:09,600 --> 02:11:13,280 The ICA case investigation already begun for Voiculescu, 1899 02:11:13,439 --> 02:11:18,159 Vîntu also had enough going on to be afraid of getting caught. 1900 02:11:18,840 --> 02:11:22,319 They were afraid, I think, not so much of Basescu instigating prosecutors against them, 1901 02:11:22,399 --> 02:11:24,719 but that Basescu wasn't interfering with the prosecutors. 1902 02:11:24,760 --> 02:11:28,800 Or would control them on a very small scale, strictly in regards to people around him. 1903 02:11:28,800 --> 02:11:31,960 And that he'd leave everyone else out in the cold, at the mercy of the prosecutors. 1904 02:11:32,399 --> 02:11:37,319 The hatred he aroused in the political class was enormous. 1905 02:11:37,800 --> 02:11:41,520 and Basescu became the number one enemy 1906 02:11:41,680 --> 02:11:45,560 of the coalition between businessmen and politicians. 1907 02:11:45,760 --> 02:11:51,280 On April 19, 2007, the Parliament voted for Traian Basescu to be suspended. 1908 02:11:51,600 --> 02:11:56,480 The initiators of this decision were the ones most troubled by the idea of anti-corruption. 1909 02:11:56,560 --> 02:11:58,760 At least one of them, Dan Voiculescu, 1910 02:11:59,039 --> 02:12:03,239 presided over the commission that investigated Basescu 1911 02:12:03,479 --> 02:12:05,719 and his numerous violations of the Constitution. 1912 02:12:05,960 --> 02:12:11,439 Voiculescu didn't even hide that he was the initiator of that suspension. 1913 02:12:11,960 --> 02:12:16,000 Traian Băsescu violated the Romanian Constitution 1914 02:12:18,479 --> 02:12:21,799 and Traian Basescu is involved 1915 02:12:23,319 --> 02:12:25,679 in criminal acts. 1916 02:12:26,640 --> 02:12:28,960 One of us will lose 1917 02:12:29,319 --> 02:12:31,479 and that won't be me. 1918 02:12:31,600 --> 02:12:34,120 Basescu! Basescu! 1919 02:12:34,520 --> 02:12:38,280 At the 2007 referendum, Traian Basescu had the citizens on his side. 1920 02:12:38,439 --> 02:12:44,919 74% of Romanians voted against the suspension and Basescu returned to Cotroceni. 1921 02:12:45,279 --> 02:12:49,679 A term in which the president consistently pursued the great themes of his voters, 1922 02:12:49,880 --> 02:12:53,159 even when it forced him to turn against the system which he came from. 1923 02:12:53,399 --> 02:12:57,039 I found in this document the reasons why 1924 02:12:57,239 --> 02:12:59,279 I can condemn the communist regime. 1925 02:12:59,560 --> 02:13:03,200 In December 2006, based on a report created by a group of historians, 1926 02:13:03,399 --> 02:13:07,439 Traian Basescu condemned the communist regime in a special session of Parliament. 1927 02:13:08,119 --> 02:13:11,439 It was a moment that proved that the ghosts of the past were still haunting us. 1928 02:13:11,800 --> 02:13:16,800 What happened in 2007, when he read in Parliament 1929 02:13:17,479 --> 02:13:21,599 the speech which condemned communism, was staggering. 1930 02:13:21,720 --> 02:13:23,240 I was in the room. 1931 02:13:24,279 --> 02:13:30,719 They're threatening to throw us from the balcony! 1932 02:13:31,600 --> 02:13:36,400 In that room, a howl of beasts broke out. 1933 02:13:36,800 --> 02:13:38,880 They brought in their supporters, 1934 02:13:39,159 --> 02:13:41,920 Vadim Tudor was holding protest signs, 1935 02:13:42,239 --> 02:13:46,719 howling, everyone was shouting. 1936 02:13:46,720 --> 02:13:51,880 This is not GDS (Group for Social Dialogue)! This is the Parliament! Who are you, you pig? 1937 02:13:51,880 --> 02:13:54,279 How dare you talk to me like that? 1938 02:13:55,199 --> 02:13:59,720 Please help us! 1939 02:14:01,199 --> 02:14:05,720 Ceausescu was big compared to you, you are just some poor... 1940 02:14:05,720 --> 02:14:08,199 What are you talking about? 1941 02:14:09,359 --> 02:14:11,599 We're not afraid of three nobodies! 1942 02:14:11,840 --> 02:14:18,119 The communist regime in Romania was illegal and criminal! 1943 02:14:19,239 --> 02:14:20,599 Can I continue ... 1944 02:14:21,079 --> 02:14:22,359 You tramp! 1945 02:14:22,439 --> 02:14:25,799 Someone touched on the taboo issue - 1946 02:14:25,920 --> 02:14:31,079 how can they condemn something which themselves represented and still represent? 1947 02:14:37,640 --> 02:14:39,119 Leaving Communism behind, 1948 02:14:39,199 --> 02:14:43,319 on January 1st, 2007, Romania becomes officially a member of the EU. 1949 02:14:45,159 --> 02:14:48,399 Welcome to the EU! Welcome home 1950 02:14:49,359 --> 02:14:50,199 6 ... 1951 02:14:50,479 --> 02:14:51,199 5... 1952 02:14:51,760 --> 02:14:52,239 4... 1953 02:14:52,760 --> 02:14:53,239 1... 1954 02:14:53,800 --> 02:14:54,680 0! 1955 02:15:00,119 --> 02:15:05,359 In the main cities, the EU membership is celebrated in the streets, with music and high hopes. 1956 02:15:05,840 --> 02:15:08,680 A better world, more money! 1957 02:15:09,319 --> 02:15:12,799 Let alcohol get cheaper for my friend, Giani. 1958 02:15:12,960 --> 02:15:17,560 We congratulate the EU for being very understanding with us and for helping us a lot. 1959 02:15:17,960 --> 02:15:20,680 It will be a bit worse and then it will be a lot better! 1960 02:15:21,840 --> 02:15:26,400 Europe, you are mine! 1961 02:15:31,479 --> 02:15:38,439 We're trying to run a small farm, goats and cows. 1962 02:15:39,840 --> 02:15:43,880 Now that we're in the EU we hope we can get some funding. 1963 02:15:45,119 --> 02:15:50,439 So we can develop this as much as possible. 1964 02:15:50,960 --> 02:15:54,239 In rural areas, the peasants began to dream of European funds, 1965 02:15:54,520 --> 02:15:57,120 but they learned that EU membership also brought complex issues. 1966 02:15:58,800 --> 02:16:01,840 If they want us to do it as the EU wants, 1967 02:16:02,000 --> 02:16:05,520 they will ask us to milk a cow in a white suit, 1968 02:16:05,800 --> 02:16:08,360 like a doctor entering an operating theatre! 1969 02:16:08,840 --> 02:16:12,480 There's no such thing on the field! You can't do something like that! 1970 02:16:12,720 --> 02:16:17,800 The European community is not this bottomless bag, where we can open our mouths and keep eating. 1971 02:16:18,159 --> 02:16:21,399 On the contrary: it comes with high demands, 1972 02:16:21,640 --> 02:16:24,960 it requires work, discipline and order. 1973 02:16:25,399 --> 02:16:29,839 There won't be any better living conditions. Gas, electricity, they're all expensive. 1974 02:16:29,960 --> 02:16:31,960 We are living hand to mouth. 1975 02:16:32,360 --> 02:16:37,200 In the Brussels meetings, Romania was praised for the progress it made to join the EU. 1976 02:16:37,520 --> 02:16:42,560 It had new institutions, better laws, was fighting corruption and connecting to Western markets. 1977 02:16:42,719 --> 02:16:45,959 But we entered Europe with a problem as big as the continent. 1978 02:16:46,079 --> 02:16:49,959 Much of the country was submerged in underdevelopment. 1979 02:16:57,000 --> 02:17:00,200 But these issues remained far removed from the political agenda. 1980 02:17:00,440 --> 02:17:06,079 The 2009 elections focused on the battle between Traian Basescu and the moguls who wanted to defeat him. 1981 02:17:06,239 --> 02:17:09,319 The fate of the elections was not decided by policy, 1982 02:17:09,399 --> 02:17:13,279 but by a visit the PSD candidate made to Sorin Ovidiu Vîntu. 1983 02:17:16,239 --> 02:17:19,440 I don't like Mr. Vîntu either and it seems that neither do you. 1984 02:17:19,520 --> 02:17:21,440 You didn't like him last night? 1985 02:17:21,479 --> 02:17:23,479 And, taking into account ... 1986 02:17:23,559 --> 02:17:27,920 Mr. Geoană, did you not enjoy your meeting with Mr. Vîntu last night? 1987 02:17:28,879 --> 02:17:34,159 Last night, when he learned that Mr. Popa Nicolae, his FNI partner, was arrested? 1988 02:17:34,319 --> 02:17:36,520 Did he call you for an emergency? 1989 02:17:36,760 --> 02:17:38,000 Mr. Basescu ... 1990 02:17:38,239 --> 02:17:39,959 Did he call you for an emergency? 1991 02:17:40,600 --> 02:17:41,680 Mr. Geoana ... 1992 02:17:41,840 --> 02:17:43,239 Mr. Traian Basescu, please ... 1993 02:17:43,399 --> 02:17:48,440 So what happened between me and Geoana, why he came over, is between me and Geoana 1994 02:17:48,639 --> 02:17:49,959 It's not for the public. 1995 02:17:50,159 --> 02:17:54,119 I considered that, for me, as a citizen, Mr. Basescu is a threat. 1996 02:17:54,360 --> 02:17:56,720 I, the citizen, not Sorin Ovidiu Vîntu! 1997 02:17:57,000 --> 02:18:00,799 That's why, with everything I had, I entered a fight against Basescu. 1998 02:18:00,879 --> 02:18:02,439 He defeated me. That's it. 1999 02:18:02,680 --> 02:18:05,280 Mihaela, my love, thank you! 2000 02:18:05,639 --> 02:18:12,959 The results in round two were so close that Mircea Geoană believed, for one night, to be the president of Romania. 2001 02:18:13,959 --> 02:18:16,879 It's a beautiful night for Romanian democracy! 2002 02:18:16,959 --> 02:18:20,479 What do you feel at the moment, Mr. President? 2003 02:18:21,280 --> 02:18:23,120 I can't believe it. 2004 02:18:23,680 --> 02:18:26,559 What could I feel? Joy and a kind of relief. 2005 02:18:26,879 --> 02:18:30,839 Towards morning, it turned out that Traian Basescu was ahead by a few tens of thousands of votes 2006 02:18:30,840 --> 02:18:33,120 and was going to rule Romania for the next five years. 2007 02:18:33,280 --> 02:18:39,800 I want to summarize the result of these elections: 2008 02:18:40,159 --> 02:18:42,119 We won! 2009 02:18:42,520 --> 02:18:45,600 Instead of knocking him down, the moguls served him his main campaign issue. 2010 02:18:45,799 --> 02:18:48,439 It was the second time when Basescu won the elections 2011 02:18:48,639 --> 02:18:51,760 by exploiting the greatest frustration of the post-revolution society: 2012 02:18:51,959 --> 02:18:54,599 the enormous degree of corruption. 2013 02:18:55,159 --> 02:18:59,879 His second term at Cotroceni meant a DNA that revved its engines further. 2014 02:19:06,120 --> 02:19:10,120 The DNA removed many corrupt people from the system, for years in a row. 2015 02:19:10,479 --> 02:19:11,719 And it was expected to. 2016 02:19:11,879 --> 02:19:15,559 There are people who can't justify their income at all 2017 02:19:15,879 --> 02:19:19,839 and their whole lives were part of the system, with access to public funds. 2018 02:19:20,159 --> 02:19:23,719 And they can't possibly justify their standard of living. 2019 02:19:24,399 --> 02:19:27,920 Properties, cars, holidays, their income. 2020 02:19:28,520 --> 02:19:31,000 Sweetheart, no one made their fortune honestly. 2021 02:19:31,159 --> 02:19:32,159 That's clear. 2022 02:19:32,799 --> 02:19:36,599 It's a reality, unfortunately for Romania. 2023 02:19:37,040 --> 02:19:39,920 Do you think you can make a fortune of one hundred million euros? 2024 02:19:40,120 --> 02:19:43,000 In any country, in just a few years, starting from nothing? 2025 02:19:43,159 --> 02:19:47,760 If your name's Bill Gates or you discover the cure for cancer, OK, you can, but otherwise you can't. 2026 02:19:47,879 --> 02:19:51,159 And then, yes, people interested in current affairs, they feel 2027 02:19:51,239 --> 02:19:55,440 that there's an injustice here, that these guys are corrupt, they steal from us. 2028 02:19:55,559 --> 02:19:57,479 Is anyone ever going sort this out?! 2029 02:19:57,799 --> 02:20:02,639 The politician became so callous that someone had to stop this. 2030 02:20:03,000 --> 02:20:09,200 DNA ended up doing this and began to seize in droves the products of Romanian corruption. 2031 02:20:09,799 --> 02:20:13,039 People who seemed unassailable, intangible. 2032 02:20:13,680 --> 02:20:17,920 There was a period when these people were frightened. 2033 02:20:18,440 --> 02:20:20,960 And fear is good, it keeps thieves at bay. 2034 02:20:21,639 --> 02:20:22,760 And I told them: 2035 02:20:23,000 --> 02:20:25,840 "Be careful! I can't see what all of you are doing!" 2036 02:20:26,520 --> 02:20:30,239 And if DNA catches you, you can't come to me for help 2037 02:20:30,520 --> 02:20:31,800 because I can't do anything about it." 2038 02:20:32,959 --> 02:20:34,000 Fear was good. 2039 02:20:34,239 --> 02:20:34,760 He is! 2040 02:20:35,200 --> 02:20:41,960 In 2012, former prime minister Adrian Nastase was the first of many politicians convicted of corruption. 2041 02:20:42,280 --> 02:20:45,360 Unable to accept the guilt and humiliation of imprisonment, 2042 02:20:45,600 --> 02:20:47,200 Nastase resorted to an extreme gesture. 2043 02:20:47,280 --> 02:20:51,480 Former Prime Minister Adrian Nastase will go into surgery this morning. Doctors say his condition is stable. 2044 02:20:51,719 --> 02:20:55,079 He tried to kill himself when the police tried to take him into custody. 2045 02:20:55,159 --> 02:21:02,399 I was under a lot of stress and, above all, the humiliation that these actions entailed. 2046 02:21:02,879 --> 02:21:07,279 I've been to the Supreme Court 200 times. 2047 02:21:09,200 --> 02:21:17,600 But I don't even want to remember. Maybe I became stronger and wiser after these experiences 2048 02:21:18,280 --> 02:21:24,800 I realised what's important in life, I realised what family actually means 2049 02:21:24,879 --> 02:21:26,839 This type of discourse became unanimous 2050 02:21:26,959 --> 02:21:30,439 among politicians and businessmen that went to jail for corruption. 2051 02:21:30,600 --> 02:21:36,600 They all claimed innocence, and prison was portrayed as an exercise in dignity against great injustices. 2052 02:21:36,840 --> 02:21:40,799 I couldn't believe these things were happening, but then I said, "Well, this is life!" 2053 02:21:40,959 --> 02:21:45,039 I was trying to think: "Well, where did I go wrong? What did I do wrong?" 2054 02:21:45,559 --> 02:21:47,719 Because I have a pretty good opinion of myself. 2055 02:21:47,920 --> 02:21:49,440 Let justice take its turn... 2056 02:21:49,559 --> 02:21:53,199 Did you take the 20% commission they are referring to? 2057 02:21:53,639 --> 02:21:55,039 Look at me! 2058 02:21:56,399 --> 02:21:58,719 After 15 years, someone comes in and arrests me, saying it's because of some bribe. 2059 02:21:59,200 --> 02:22:00,640 God forbid! 2060 02:22:00,799 --> 02:22:03,399 The former head of the NKVD used to say: 2061 02:22:03,680 --> 02:22:10,680 "Nobody's innocent, there are just people we didn't look into diligently enough." 2062 02:22:13,120 --> 02:22:18,240 And, indeed, this is what the DNA does: it sets on a certain target and then ... 2063 02:22:18,719 --> 02:22:20,079 Well, don't you see? Look here! 2064 02:22:20,079 --> 02:22:21,479 You saw this coming! 2065 02:22:22,360 --> 02:22:23,640 Why did they accuse you of? 2066 02:22:23,639 --> 02:22:24,799 That I took ... 2067 02:22:25,200 --> 02:22:34,159 They were political trophies. Remember the way they reported those convictions to Brussels. 2068 02:22:35,200 --> 02:22:37,680 The self-victimization of those ending up in the DNA cross hairs 2069 02:22:37,760 --> 02:22:41,479 was also enabled by the media spectacle which accompanied the wave of lawsuits. 2070 02:22:41,559 --> 02:22:45,119 Transcripts and information about future arrests appeared in the media 2071 02:22:45,239 --> 02:22:48,760 and gave the impression that prosecutors are contributing to this spectacle. 2072 02:22:48,879 --> 02:22:53,199 Let's be honest, some get picked up by the DNA without us knowing about it, 2073 02:22:53,399 --> 02:22:58,879 while others, you knew they'll end up at DNA before that man would wake up in the morning. 2074 02:22:59,040 --> 02:23:02,240 In the cold light of day, justice seemed to stop being completely blind. 2075 02:23:02,399 --> 02:23:05,520 Because, occasionally, it would keep an eye on people's expectations. 2076 02:23:05,799 --> 02:23:07,439 You gave them the satisfaction, yes? 2077 02:23:07,440 --> 02:23:12,520 "Look, we caught the big corrupt ones." Blood, blood, circus, bread, blood, blood ... 2078 02:23:13,000 --> 02:23:16,079 You have to admit that this strategy paid off. 2079 02:23:16,280 --> 02:23:20,680 We were excited to see politicians on TV, with handcuffs on ... 2080 02:23:20,879 --> 02:23:22,959 The thieves are free, Becali is arrested! 2081 02:23:23,520 --> 02:23:29,159 It would've been nice to be without handcuffs, and the TV stations there, and so on. 2082 02:23:29,559 --> 02:23:31,879 But you know what, 2083 02:23:32,319 --> 02:23:35,119 I'm human in the end, not a machinery, 2084 02:23:35,239 --> 02:23:38,319 a computer that analyzes things for you. 2085 02:23:38,920 --> 02:23:42,239 I liked seeing those people in handcuffs, you know? 2086 02:23:42,440 --> 02:23:45,480 After, for so many years, 2087 02:23:45,799 --> 02:23:49,840 as a journalist, I wrote, I investigated, 2088 02:23:50,120 --> 02:23:54,960 I knew and I know very well how sinister these individuals were. 2089 02:23:55,079 --> 02:23:59,440 And for years, I haven't seen a single one of them taken into custody. 2090 02:24:00,159 --> 02:24:02,520 They were arrogant. They were mocking us. 2091 02:24:02,799 --> 02:24:05,279 Everything was in vain, you showed them documents: "Look!" 2092 02:24:05,479 --> 02:24:10,680 I remember sending one of our journalists from Adevărul (The Truth) to the Government. 2093 02:24:10,959 --> 02:24:14,119 There was one, Petre something, Minister of Commerce, 2094 02:24:14,719 --> 02:24:21,799 and he had, while Minister of Commerce, about 14 companies in his name. 2095 02:24:22,239 --> 02:24:28,159 Which he would manage while doing his job as a minister. 2096 02:24:28,360 --> 02:24:33,200 And I sent the man from Adevărul there, with a printed sheet 2097 02:24:33,399 --> 02:24:38,440 and said: these are Petre's companies from the Ministry of Agriculture 2098 02:24:38,879 --> 02:24:41,799 Commerce or Agriculture, wherever he was! 2099 02:24:41,799 --> 02:24:43,759 And, the result? Nothing! 2100 02:24:44,040 --> 02:24:46,720 The man remained in office. "Eh, so what?" 2101 02:24:47,000 --> 02:24:49,799 You see? We accumulated a lot of frustration. 2102 02:24:50,079 --> 02:24:52,920 Speaking from a human perspective, as a journalist. 2103 02:24:53,159 --> 02:24:56,479 So I didn't feel sorry for any of those guys that I saw in handcuffs. 2104 02:24:59,520 --> 02:25:01,920 Pushed from behind by these frustrations accumulated in society, 2105 02:25:02,520 --> 02:25:05,520 DNA had moments when it seemed to be losing its sense of purpose 2106 02:25:05,680 --> 02:25:10,399 and sees justice as a contest in which it must exceed previous performances. 2107 02:25:10,959 --> 02:25:17,639 There were sent to court five times more ministers and MPs than two years ago. 2108 02:25:18,680 --> 02:25:25,360 A prime minister, five ministers, 16 deputies and five senators. 2109 02:25:26,000 --> 02:25:31,000 Laura Codruța Kovesi led the National Anticorruption Directorate between 2013 and 2018. 2110 02:25:31,120 --> 02:25:34,760 She refused to appear in this documentary, arguing that she doesn't want to be associated 2111 02:25:34,920 --> 02:25:36,600 with the people she investigated. 2112 02:25:36,719 --> 02:25:39,760 The results of DNA during her leadership are undeniable 2113 02:25:39,879 --> 02:25:42,279 and have been recognized internationally. 2114 02:25:42,399 --> 02:25:47,159 But she also led the institution in a vulnerable area, meeting privately with politicians, 2115 02:25:47,239 --> 02:25:50,199 businessmen and heads of secret services. 2116 02:25:50,200 --> 02:25:54,720 With the passage of time, people came to look at the DNA with more skepticism 2117 02:25:55,000 --> 02:25:57,280 and to see more clearly the strengths and weaknesses of the institution. 2118 02:25:58,079 --> 02:26:02,159 You see, this DNA approach is not entirely ethical, either. 2119 02:26:02,639 --> 02:26:08,519 Because Udrea and Mircea Băsescu were not taken into custody 2120 02:26:08,840 --> 02:26:11,280 when Traian Basescu was at the peak of his power. No! 2121 02:26:11,399 --> 02:26:15,799 They were taken in when they were declining, when they were coming to an end. 2122 02:26:16,319 --> 02:26:20,479 When this fight against corruption got too close to him: 2123 02:26:20,920 --> 02:26:23,399 "Eh, this anti-corruption fight ... let's not ... 2124 02:26:23,520 --> 02:26:26,600 ... excesses, abuses, let's ... however, be more ... 2125 02:26:26,719 --> 02:26:28,799 do we want to destroy everything?! " 2126 02:26:28,920 --> 02:26:30,680 We know this kind of speech. 2127 02:26:30,760 --> 02:26:33,559 Why? Because his darling had been taken away, 2128 02:26:33,840 --> 02:26:36,680 Mrs. Udrea, with Paris and so on. 2129 02:26:36,760 --> 02:26:44,319 You see, Traian Basescu's quote: "how cursed can we be to have these kinds of politicians." 2130 02:26:45,200 --> 02:26:49,240 What happened to him after that is another story, 2131 02:26:49,319 --> 02:26:55,000 because the same man who spoke about the great themes of Western democracy 2132 02:26:55,360 --> 02:27:01,720 began to talk about the others as a sort of anti-Basescu agenda. 2133 02:27:02,040 --> 02:27:06,800 Honestly, if anyone believes Basescu is an anti-corruption fighter, they are very naive! 2134 02:27:07,000 --> 02:27:10,719 For Băsescu, corruption was any business he's not involved in. 2135 02:27:11,040 --> 02:27:14,120 Through his gang, he tried to slip, and do, 2136 02:27:14,280 --> 02:27:19,000 to an extent, what everyone else did before him. 2137 02:27:19,440 --> 02:27:22,800 I still have a great disappointment that after 2138 02:27:23,040 --> 02:27:28,040 you talk about this mafia Petrache-Bittner-Cocoș, 2139 02:27:28,600 --> 02:27:33,920 you see the wife of Mr. Cocoș become an adviser to the president. 2140 02:27:34,120 --> 02:27:38,720 In his second term, when Traian Basescu gradually gave up on his role of anti-corruption hero, 2141 02:27:38,840 --> 02:27:42,399 people started to remember all the defects they had overlooked him. 2142 02:27:42,520 --> 02:27:45,840 He surrounded himself with dubious characters to whom he offered protection, 2143 02:27:45,959 --> 02:27:50,439 He pushed his daughter into politics, although she wasn't fit for it. 2144 02:27:50,680 --> 02:27:52,000 I voted for myself. 2145 02:27:52,440 --> 02:27:55,200 But above all, Traian Basescu many times behaved 2146 02:27:55,559 --> 02:27:58,959 not as a president, but as a baron who can break any rule. 2147 02:27:59,959 --> 02:28:05,599 He gets drunk as a skunk, and then gets behind the wheel. 2148 02:28:06,280 --> 02:28:10,520 People were shocked: "Ooh, our president is drinking and driving ?! 2149 02:28:11,040 --> 02:28:13,240 And he said, "No, there was water in the glass." 2150 02:28:13,319 --> 02:28:14,119 OK ... 2151 02:28:14,840 --> 02:28:17,719 Well, you voted for him! You knew how he is! 2152 02:28:20,200 --> 02:28:22,320 It's much worse to be tolerant 2153 02:28:22,520 --> 02:28:27,520 with the man you believe in than to be intolerant with your enemy. 2154 02:28:27,639 --> 02:28:30,279 People stopped being tolerant of Traian Basescu 2155 02:28:30,399 --> 02:28:33,279 when his decisions touched their pockets. 2156 02:28:33,399 --> 02:28:36,399 Reducing the fund for salaries 2157 02:28:38,079 --> 02:28:43,479 for all public sector employees in Romania by 25%. 2158 02:28:43,920 --> 02:28:46,079 Huoooo! 2159 02:28:49,440 --> 02:28:51,000 We predict 2160 02:28:51,920 --> 02:28:53,600 a decrease 2161 02:28:54,200 --> 02:28:56,560 of pensions by 15% ... 2162 02:28:56,680 --> 02:28:58,880 We voted for you and you betrayed us! 2163 02:28:58,959 --> 02:29:00,399 Out with Basescu! Out with Basescu! 2164 02:29:00,760 --> 02:29:03,319 After the protests caused by the income cuts, 2165 02:29:03,440 --> 02:29:06,960 a new wave followed in 2012 against Basescu 2166 02:29:06,959 --> 02:29:08,759 and the government led by Emil Boc. 2167 02:29:09,120 --> 02:29:12,360 We need new ones! So we can at least have some hope ... 2168 02:29:12,360 --> 02:29:13,560 Damn it! 2169 02:29:14,360 --> 02:29:16,840 Out with the dictator! Out with the dictator! 2170 02:29:17,120 --> 02:29:21,920 We have nothing to eat, we have nothing to put on the table, the children left the country, 2171 02:29:22,079 --> 02:29:24,000 you can't live anymore! 2172 02:29:35,040 --> 02:29:36,400 Romania, wake up! 2173 02:29:36,799 --> 02:29:40,519 The protests are not without effect: without political and popular support 2174 02:29:40,559 --> 02:29:44,439 Traian Basescu is forced to appoint a prime minister from the opposition, Victor Ponta. 2175 02:29:44,639 --> 02:29:49,159 I want to say to the pensioners, I want to say to the redundant, 2176 02:29:49,520 --> 02:29:52,239 I want to say to the poor and disenfranchised, 2177 02:29:52,559 --> 02:29:56,920 that fighting poverty is a priority for the Romanian Government. 2178 02:29:57,200 --> 02:30:01,600 But before fighting poverty, PSD fought to defeat Basescu for good. 2179 02:30:01,840 --> 02:30:06,200 In the summer of 2012, the president was suspended again, politicians were against him, 2180 02:30:06,360 --> 02:30:10,440 but he kept his seat because the electoral threshold of 50% wasn't reached. 2181 02:30:13,040 --> 02:30:17,120 I believe that the honest thing for Traian Băsescu to do was to resign. 2182 02:30:17,360 --> 02:30:21,360 Because seven and a half million people voted against you. 2183 02:30:21,479 --> 02:30:24,439 And, yes, they're not 50% of the electoral rolls, 2184 02:30:24,719 --> 02:30:29,399 but they're seven and a half million people who voted and said you had to leave. 2185 02:30:29,840 --> 02:30:31,479 What right do you have to stay? 2186 02:30:31,479 --> 02:30:34,119 Basescu remained in Cotroceni until the last day of his term, 2187 02:30:34,319 --> 02:30:36,159 ending ten years of presidency 2188 02:30:36,319 --> 02:30:39,600 in which he wasted almost any hope that millions of Romanians had 2189 02:30:39,600 --> 02:30:42,360 and which they trusted him with in early 2000s. 2190 02:30:42,479 --> 02:30:46,479 The former president didn't accept our invite to appear in this documentary, 2191 02:30:46,479 --> 02:30:51,279 leaving unanswered many questions and accusations that marked his two terms. 2192 02:30:54,120 --> 02:30:57,840 Chapter 8 Freedom is no longer a burden 2193 02:31:13,000 --> 02:31:16,079 By exploiting people's anger against Traian Basescu, 2194 02:31:16,280 --> 02:31:19,000 PSD is, once again, the most powerful political party in Romania. 2195 02:31:19,360 --> 02:31:21,440 In 2012 they took over the government, 2196 02:31:21,719 --> 02:31:25,079 and in 2014 they were preparing to win the presidential elections. 2197 02:31:25,319 --> 02:31:29,399 The party's strength was still the network of barons from Nastase's term 2198 02:31:29,520 --> 02:31:34,479 many harassed by Basescu's anti-corruption agenda, and fed up with EU regulation. 2199 02:31:34,799 --> 02:31:38,639 Their frustration pushed the party towards an increasingly nationalist ideology 2200 02:31:38,760 --> 02:31:41,800 at the centre of which they placed a young man, Victor Ponta. 2201 02:31:49,719 --> 02:31:54,439 This is my country and my Romanian nation, 2202 02:31:54,719 --> 02:31:57,319 And this is where I'd like to die, 2203 02:31:57,600 --> 02:32:01,479 This is where I want to live, together with you! 2204 02:32:01,680 --> 02:32:02,399 Victory! 2205 02:32:05,239 --> 02:32:07,239 Where are the tall oaks 2206 02:32:10,479 --> 02:32:15,760 The presidential campaign was launched in a megalomaniac event on the National Arena. 2207 02:32:15,879 --> 02:32:18,759 on the day when Ponta was celebrating his 42nd birthday. 2208 02:32:22,399 --> 02:32:24,680 Of course it was a mistake. 2209 02:32:24,920 --> 02:32:27,040 A very big one, of course! 2210 02:32:28,200 --> 02:32:32,079 Because we, the people on the stadium, all 70,000 of us, were very happy 2211 02:32:32,159 --> 02:32:34,719 while outside seven million were cursing at us. 2212 02:32:34,840 --> 02:32:38,639 Do you do politics for the 70,000 on the stadium or for those outside? 2213 02:32:38,959 --> 02:32:40,639 It was a big mistake, obviously! 2214 02:32:41,280 --> 02:32:44,440 We are many because we are good, 2215 02:32:44,920 --> 02:32:48,319 but we are good, my dear, because we are united. 2216 02:32:48,600 --> 02:32:50,840 Dragnea told me: "Let's show strength! 2217 02:32:50,959 --> 02:32:55,679 Let's show how strong we are, that only we can fill the stadium, and so on" 2218 02:32:56,079 --> 02:32:58,159 Victor Ponta managed to upset the people. 2219 02:32:58,399 --> 02:33:01,000 Because it annoyed them for a long time 2220 02:33:01,440 --> 02:33:06,880 with lies and arrogance and then he did that monstrous thing 2221 02:33:07,120 --> 02:33:10,520 on the National Arena and people got very angry. 2222 02:33:10,760 --> 02:33:14,159 See? The sun is coming out on our street! 2223 02:33:14,280 --> 02:33:15,000 It is! 2224 02:33:15,120 --> 02:33:20,200 With such a deployment of resources, Victor Ponta was the great favorite of the presidential election. 2225 02:33:20,360 --> 02:33:23,680 His main contender had no experience in top politics 2226 02:33:23,879 --> 02:33:27,519 and had spent the last 12 years in a town hall. 2227 02:33:27,840 --> 02:33:29,639 I'll call you after lunch, okay? 2228 02:33:30,079 --> 02:33:31,479 OK, good. 2229 02:33:32,399 --> 02:33:35,600 Klaus Iohannis was a candidate from the National Liberal Party, 2230 02:33:35,760 --> 02:33:38,120 with the promise of a Romania heading towards normality. 2231 02:33:38,319 --> 02:33:41,279 Only the job done right delivers lasting results. 2232 02:33:41,360 --> 02:33:48,520 If you think the same, let's discover together a different Romania, a normal Romania. 2233 02:33:48,760 --> 02:33:51,719 Iohannis didn't run a spectacular election campaign, 2234 02:33:51,799 --> 02:33:56,599 but he took advantage of Romanians most persistent attitude: voting for the lesser evil. 2235 02:33:56,719 --> 02:34:00,279 Let's see what the Romanians say and I ask you, dear Romanians: 2236 02:34:01,840 --> 02:34:06,840 Are your lives better since Mr. Ponta became our prime minister? 2237 02:34:08,760 --> 02:34:14,399 I think the Romanians answered to this legitimate question of Mr. Iohannis 2238 02:34:15,040 --> 02:34:20,040 on November 2, when four million Romanians voted me for president, 2239 02:34:20,159 --> 02:34:21,680 If their lives weren't better... 2240 02:34:21,840 --> 02:34:26,360 Those who voted for you, I saw them on social networks last night, 2241 02:34:26,479 --> 02:34:31,279 they said, "He's a terribly weak candidate, but we'd rather vote for him than Ponta." 2242 02:34:33,040 --> 02:34:35,520 It was a vote against me, of course, because ... 2243 02:34:35,799 --> 02:34:38,559 How many votes did he get in the first round? 2.8 million, right? 2244 02:34:39,399 --> 02:34:42,840 So, 2.8 million people liked Klaus Iohannis and voted for him. 2245 02:34:43,120 --> 02:34:44,880 After the second round, he got 6 million votes 2246 02:34:44,879 --> 02:34:47,679 Obviously, the rest of the votes are votes against me. 2247 02:34:47,840 --> 02:34:54,920 Because of the barons, because "Don't let PSD take everything!", because Ponta is arrogant. 2248 02:34:55,040 --> 02:34:59,800 And especially because Ponta neglected something all politicians neglected until then. 2249 02:35:00,120 --> 02:35:02,680 Are you leaving the country for the first time? 2250 02:35:02,879 --> 02:35:07,439 Yes, it's the first time I leave the country for work. I just finished school. 2251 02:35:08,000 --> 02:35:10,959 During the years when politicians pursued only their interests 2252 02:35:11,079 --> 02:35:13,200 and failed to modernise Romania, 2253 02:35:13,440 --> 02:35:16,040 millions of people, resignedly, had left the country. 2254 02:35:20,120 --> 02:35:24,240 The migration to Western Europe began in the late 1990s. 2255 02:35:24,319 --> 02:35:27,799 Firs, the men left to save some money and then come back home. 2256 02:35:28,239 --> 02:35:31,559 They got used to it, and after a while, they brought their families and friends. 2257 02:35:31,680 --> 02:35:38,120 We, Romanians aged 40-50, had a hard time in Romania: 2258 02:35:38,200 --> 02:35:41,000 the end of Ceausescu, the beginning of democracy. 2259 02:35:41,479 --> 02:35:47,319 We had a hard time in Romania, we have a hard time here, yet we hope things will get better. 2260 02:35:47,879 --> 02:35:51,159 There is almost no Romanian who, in the initial stage, 2261 02:35:52,159 --> 02:35:54,799 didn't find this very, very difficult. 2262 02:35:55,280 --> 02:35:58,680 No one leaves his country because they're doing too well. 2263 02:35:58,920 --> 02:36:02,639 Most leave because they are worried about the future of their children. 2264 02:36:03,520 --> 02:36:07,600 I think it will be a new lifestyle 2265 02:36:08,120 --> 02:36:13,000 and if I have children, even though they'll be half Spanish, I still feel Romanian. 2266 02:36:13,479 --> 02:36:16,719 Every year, the number of those who left was growing. 2267 02:36:17,000 --> 02:36:21,760 Beyond the borders, a parallel Romania appeared, made up of millions of people. 2268 02:36:21,879 --> 02:36:25,920 We're happy, we integrated very well in this society, in Spain. 2269 02:36:26,079 --> 02:36:28,639 I spoke with tens of thousands of people from all the countries: 2270 02:36:29,000 --> 02:36:31,239 Spain, Italy, France, 2271 02:36:31,600 --> 02:36:34,720 I was in Ireland, in the UK. 2272 02:36:35,360 --> 02:36:38,120 Do you know what most of them would say? 2273 02:36:38,799 --> 02:36:40,519 "The state has betrayed us. 2274 02:36:40,719 --> 02:36:42,959 The Romanian state has betrayed us." 2275 02:36:43,159 --> 02:36:44,799 A terrible thing to hear. 2276 02:36:45,239 --> 02:36:46,959 Terrible ... 2277 02:36:47,159 --> 02:36:51,280 But, you see, this sentence sums up all of their pain. 2278 02:36:51,760 --> 02:36:55,719 I know many of them are very unhappy. 2279 02:36:57,239 --> 02:37:00,159 Because you can't really break this tie. 2280 02:37:00,680 --> 02:37:03,319 You can't just get rid of 2281 02:37:04,200 --> 02:37:06,240 a good chunk of your life. 2282 02:37:06,639 --> 02:37:11,840 Your childhood, your adolescence, it's impossible not to mean anything to you. 2283 02:37:12,079 --> 02:37:18,719 The smell of lime on your street, the dust on the street where you played etc. 2284 02:37:22,600 --> 02:37:27,319 In reality, Romanians that left never forgot the dust on the street where they grew up. 2285 02:37:27,440 --> 02:37:30,760 They went home at least on holidays, they sent billions of euros back 2286 02:37:30,840 --> 02:37:33,880 and sometimes they even contributed to changes of attitudes. 2287 02:37:34,319 --> 02:37:39,199 These people went West, travelled, have seen another side to the world. 2288 02:37:39,399 --> 02:37:42,680 These people are much harder to fool. 2289 02:37:42,840 --> 02:37:48,559 Because they are free, they are in touch with Western institutions, 2290 02:37:49,399 --> 02:37:53,159 they learn this idea that you have rights, 2291 02:37:53,479 --> 02:37:56,119 that you need to claim your rights. 2292 02:37:56,399 --> 02:37:59,840 And they're not something given by the state, but something which is yours. 2293 02:38:00,200 --> 02:38:04,960 These are people much harder to fool when they come here, to Romania. 2294 02:38:05,040 --> 02:38:07,560 They still have relatives in the country, 2295 02:38:08,879 --> 02:38:14,000 they send money to the people back home. And we know that, as you inject cash in a country, 2296 02:38:14,079 --> 02:38:16,760 there's an increase in awareness of liberties. 2297 02:38:17,040 --> 02:38:21,680 So, the emigrants contribute with money, and the values they acquire there 2298 02:38:21,840 --> 02:38:25,200 which they communicate to their relatives when they return. 2299 02:38:25,280 --> 02:38:27,600 And they ask the remaining families: 2300 02:38:27,799 --> 02:38:29,959 "Are you still poor? Still with these guys? 2301 02:38:30,200 --> 02:38:32,920 You still have nothing? Still no sewage? 2302 02:38:33,159 --> 02:38:35,799 Still no pavements yet? Roads, highways? 2303 02:38:35,959 --> 02:38:39,399 I came by train, mom. How can you vote with these people, mom?" 2304 02:38:39,520 --> 02:38:46,040 And these are very honest agents of electoral influence 2305 02:38:46,319 --> 02:38:53,719 who are very credible, who talk from their direct experience of living and working in the West. 2306 02:38:54,079 --> 02:38:58,559 My younger friends, who are, at the moment, in England or France, 2307 02:38:58,879 --> 02:39:01,719 they are glued to what's happening here. 2308 02:39:01,959 --> 02:39:06,159 Very few of them say: "I left, I closed that door, I'm not interested anymore!" 2309 02:39:06,479 --> 02:39:08,039 They have two homelands. 2310 02:39:08,280 --> 02:39:11,400 We want to vote! We want to vote! 2311 02:39:12,079 --> 02:39:14,159 The 2014 presidential elections 2312 02:39:14,280 --> 02:39:18,480 was when the Romanians abroad showed they didn't break away from their country. 2313 02:39:18,600 --> 02:39:21,680 Hundreds of thousands of people stormed the polling stations, 2314 02:39:21,680 --> 02:39:25,239 while the Government, led by Victor Ponta, was overwhelmed by the situation. 2315 02:39:25,319 --> 02:39:28,440 As you can see, there are many in the queue. 2316 02:39:28,520 --> 02:39:32,640 Here at the Romanian Consulate in Madrid, the queue is about 100 meters long. 2317 02:39:33,120 --> 02:39:37,560 The poor logistics for the elections abroad and the thousands of Romanias who couldn't vote 2318 02:39:37,639 --> 02:39:41,639 created a wave of revolt in the country which changed the fate of the elections. 2319 02:39:41,799 --> 02:39:47,000 In 2014, it was a second wave of what I called the "enchanted wind". 2320 02:39:47,200 --> 02:39:48,920 I couldn't believe it. 2321 02:39:49,120 --> 02:39:51,560 I think the hurricane effect 2322 02:39:51,799 --> 02:39:57,239 was due to Romanians from abroad calling relatives back home, telling them not to vote for Ponta. 2323 02:39:57,440 --> 02:39:59,840 I think that's the only logical explanation 2324 02:39:59,959 --> 02:40:03,679 for the reverse of the trend between the first round and the second round. 2325 02:40:04,200 --> 02:40:09,400 Huge anger when you're being fooled and you're not allowed to vote. 2326 02:40:09,479 --> 02:40:12,199 You don't play with that. They played and they lost. 2327 02:40:12,399 --> 02:40:19,039 Johannis! Johannis! 2328 02:40:19,239 --> 02:40:22,319 The electorate gave us a very strong message yesterday 2329 02:40:22,600 --> 02:40:25,760 and I think we must have the decency 2330 02:40:25,959 --> 02:40:29,759 and the wisdom to keep silent, for a while, all of us. 2331 02:40:30,040 --> 02:40:34,040 The silence didn't last, and politicians quickly forgot the electorate's message. 2332 02:40:34,120 --> 02:40:35,960 Victor Ponta remained a prime minister, 2333 02:40:36,079 --> 02:40:39,959 just as arrogant and surrounded by the same characters and their attitude of "masters". 2334 02:40:40,079 --> 02:40:42,840 Of these, Deputy Prime Minister Gabriel Oprea stood out, 2335 02:40:42,959 --> 02:40:48,199 accused of misusing the motorcade and of having caused the death of a young policeman. 2336 02:40:48,280 --> 02:40:51,280 People went to the streets angry with the politicians' abuse. 2337 02:40:51,520 --> 02:40:54,600 Ten days later, on October 30, 2015, 2338 02:40:54,680 --> 02:40:57,040 the fire at the "Colectiv" club breaks out. 2339 02:40:57,120 --> 02:41:01,079 Remove the cars! Fire, fire in the Pioneer factory! 2340 02:41:01,319 --> 02:41:02,760 Where, on what street? 2341 02:41:03,280 --> 02:41:06,079 Tăbăcarilor 7 street, fire in the Pionierul factory. 2342 02:41:06,159 --> 02:41:07,520 Tăbăcarilor 7? 2343 02:41:07,840 --> 02:41:09,399 Tăbăcarilor 7, yes, yes! 2344 02:41:09,479 --> 02:41:11,119 Tăbăcarilor 7, okay? 2345 02:41:11,280 --> 02:41:12,440 Tăbăcarilor 7! 2346 02:41:13,639 --> 02:41:17,439 For one night, Romania stood still, shocked by the size of the tragedy. 2347 02:41:17,600 --> 02:41:20,960 27 dead and over 100 wounded and hospitalized. 2348 02:41:21,200 --> 02:41:24,200 Authorities declare that the situation is under control. 2349 02:41:24,239 --> 02:41:28,879 We really don't need anything right now, our doctors can handle the situation. 2350 02:41:28,959 --> 02:41:36,199 We've received offers for help from France, Germany, and others. 2351 02:41:36,319 --> 02:41:38,680 Will you accept further help ...? 2352 02:41:39,000 --> 02:41:41,360 For now, we are doing very well. 2353 02:41:41,600 --> 02:41:45,520 In the following days, further information revealed the exact opposite. 2354 02:41:45,760 --> 02:41:48,200 Hospitals didn't have enough burn units, 2355 02:41:48,440 --> 02:41:50,560 the wounded would die because of hospital infections 2356 02:41:50,879 --> 02:41:54,599 and the club where the tragedy took place operated without a fire permit, 2357 02:41:54,639 --> 02:41:56,639 and the tacit approval of the authorities. 2358 02:41:56,680 --> 02:42:01,880 "We have all the facilities to keep them here. We have everything set up! " 2359 02:42:02,360 --> 02:42:05,360 All the politicians have this on their conscience. 2360 02:42:05,520 --> 02:42:10,399 And then the stake is not to change the consciousness of the villain. 2361 02:42:10,680 --> 02:42:12,399 That's a lost battle. 2362 02:42:12,760 --> 02:42:15,920 But to awaken the consciousness of those around them 2363 02:42:16,239 --> 02:42:22,000 and say they're enabling them by cohabiting in these decision-making roles. 2364 02:42:24,719 --> 02:42:29,559 "Colectiv" made Romanians more aware than ever about how bankrupt the Romanian state is 2365 02:42:29,680 --> 02:42:33,360 and the direct effects that corruption has on everyone's life. 2366 02:42:33,559 --> 02:42:36,760 Tens of thousands of people took to the streets. 2367 02:42:37,079 --> 02:42:40,079 WE WANT TO BE INFORMED NOT MANIPULATED 2368 02:42:49,399 --> 02:42:53,760 This is what "Colectiv" has proven: "They are killing us! We can't do this anymore" 2369 02:42:54,079 --> 02:42:58,799 Until "Colectiv", people still believed that they can fend for themselves 2370 02:42:59,319 --> 02:43:04,719 "Ah, it's fine, they steal, we mind our own lives 2371 02:43:05,040 --> 02:43:08,200 We're fine. We do well in school, we work in a corporate, 2372 02:43:08,479 --> 02:43:13,840 maybe we get a job abroad, we can insulate ourselves from the villains, from the corruption." 2373 02:43:14,200 --> 02:43:17,200 Colectiv proved that we cannot insulate ourselves. 2374 02:43:17,360 --> 02:43:23,480 And the situation is so serious, that you can die burning alive, like a rat 2375 02:43:24,200 --> 02:43:29,800 because some bastards didn't check and didn't apply the law! 2376 02:43:30,639 --> 02:43:33,519 Out with Ponta! 2377 02:43:35,079 --> 02:43:38,920 It was real anger. And legitimate, after all. 2378 02:43:39,239 --> 02:43:41,760 When you see the young people who died. 2379 02:43:42,079 --> 02:43:49,520 I'm ready to take this step that an important part of society is expecting 2380 02:43:49,840 --> 02:43:54,280 and, obviously, starting today, I resign as a Prime Minister, and implicitly, 2381 02:43:54,559 --> 02:43:55,959 from the Government of Romania. 2382 02:43:56,040 --> 02:44:00,000 I spoke with a few people, getting advice about this. 2383 02:44:00,239 --> 02:44:02,879 People very close to me and whom I trust. 2384 02:44:03,000 --> 02:44:05,239 And I said, "I think I should go." 2385 02:44:05,719 --> 02:44:07,599 Not one of them said: 2386 02:44:07,719 --> 02:44:11,399 "No, stay there, it's fine, they're paid to say these things..." 2387 02:44:11,520 --> 02:44:13,040 Not one of them said that. 2388 02:44:13,079 --> 02:44:18,680 Everyone said: "Yes, it looks serious. I don't know if you should leave, but this is how it looks." 2389 02:44:19,239 --> 02:44:23,199 Be afraid! The people will rise! 2390 02:44:24,360 --> 02:44:26,880 The fire at the Colectiv club changed Romania. 2391 02:44:26,959 --> 02:44:29,239 The death of the 64 people 2392 02:44:29,280 --> 02:44:33,200 awakened the consciousness of a society starting to acknowledge the burden of freedom. 2393 02:44:33,399 --> 02:44:37,039 From then on, the protests become a weapon in the fight for state reform, 2394 02:44:37,159 --> 02:44:41,159 and Romanians take to the streets not for tangible things, but for ideals. 2395 02:44:41,440 --> 02:44:43,680 At the time of Colectiv I felt that too. 2396 02:44:43,799 --> 02:44:50,000 I felt that those people went out in the street thinking 2397 02:44:50,280 --> 02:44:55,320 "Whatever happens, we're doing this because we can't stand it anymore!" 2398 02:44:55,479 --> 02:44:58,479 That was a moral gesture, I said that at the time. 2399 02:44:58,840 --> 02:45:05,200 These people didn't go out to ask for higher salaries and pensions, 2400 02:45:05,360 --> 02:45:07,800 or for some other kind of benefit. 2401 02:45:08,159 --> 02:45:14,600 No, they went out for an issue that you can't see, touch or smell, 2402 02:45:15,000 --> 02:45:18,079 it was for a moral, a spiritual issue. 2403 02:45:34,840 --> 02:45:37,719 Dare to believe in Romania too! 2404 02:45:37,760 --> 02:45:39,920 My message to all Romanians today 2405 02:45:40,120 --> 02:45:43,440 is that it's better for all when we're united. 2406 02:45:43,799 --> 02:45:45,719 Let's dare to believe in Romania, 2407 02:45:45,840 --> 02:45:49,680 in the strength that everyone has inside them to make his country better. 2408 02:45:50,159 --> 02:45:52,760 I have faith and I'm sure we'll succeed. 2409 02:45:52,799 --> 02:45:55,479 Happy Birthday Romania! Happy Birthday Romanians! 2410 02:45:55,760 --> 02:45:58,680 After a year in which Romania was led by a government of technocrats, 2411 02:45:58,920 --> 02:46:03,280 The PSD won the parliamentary elections of 2016 and returned to power. 2412 02:46:03,440 --> 02:46:07,360 Liviu Dragnea, the new party leader, came from the faction of local barons, 2413 02:46:07,440 --> 02:46:10,319 he had an active sentence and several ongoing prosecutions. 2414 02:46:10,399 --> 02:46:13,119 The new Government's first concern was an Emergency Ordinance 2415 02:46:13,200 --> 02:46:15,520 to help rid Dragnea of his troubles with the law. 2416 02:46:15,799 --> 02:46:19,119 The ordinance was approved in a meeting which finished close to midnight. 2417 02:46:19,479 --> 02:46:23,239 Why did you choose to do this now, in the evening? 2418 02:46:23,319 --> 02:46:26,000 The timing is set by the Government. Next question! 2419 02:46:26,399 --> 02:46:32,359 Does the Leader of your party, Mr. Liviu Dragnea, benefit from this change? 2420 02:46:32,479 --> 02:46:33,439 No changes made ... 2421 02:46:33,520 --> 02:46:37,200 The change is irrelevant, I asked you if he benefits from it. 2422 02:46:37,360 --> 02:46:38,200 Not... 2423 02:46:38,239 --> 02:46:40,239 How not to benefit since ...? 2424 02:46:40,440 --> 02:46:45,239 You might have information from a government file I don't have specifics from the file. 2425 02:46:45,440 --> 02:46:46,640 They're public. 2426 02:46:46,959 --> 02:46:49,000 I wasn't interested in this data. 2427 02:46:49,879 --> 02:46:50,799 Tramps! 2428 02:46:51,760 --> 02:46:55,559 Thieves! Thieves! 2429 02:46:59,840 --> 02:47:01,120 Next question, if you have one. 2430 02:47:01,280 --> 02:47:04,079 If you were accused, now that it's not possible anymore, right? 2431 02:47:04,200 --> 02:47:05,400 Do you have another question? 2432 02:47:06,319 --> 02:47:07,680 You wouldn't answer, right? 2433 02:47:07,840 --> 02:47:09,479 I answered you, ma'am. Next question, if you have one. 2434 02:47:09,639 --> 02:47:12,359 You didn't answer me, yes or no? It's a simple, closed question, yes or no? 2435 02:47:12,520 --> 02:47:14,239 I answered, ma'am, next question, if you have one. 2436 02:47:14,360 --> 02:47:15,079 Yes or no? 2437 02:47:15,559 --> 02:47:16,239 I answered you ... 2438 02:47:17,879 --> 02:47:19,439 Thieves! Thieves! 2439 02:47:19,520 --> 02:47:20,520 Sir, I've asked you ... 2440 02:47:21,079 --> 02:47:25,319 OK, so we crossed the street illegally, but do you know what they did in there? 2441 02:47:25,440 --> 02:47:27,360 Go and stop them in the middle of the street instead. 2442 02:47:27,479 --> 02:47:31,000 Thieves! Thieves! 2443 02:47:31,319 --> 02:47:32,319 Next question. 2444 02:47:33,159 --> 02:47:34,000 Thank you! 2445 02:47:34,520 --> 02:47:35,720 Thank you! Goodbye! 2446 02:47:36,200 --> 02:47:39,880 Come on! Come on! Come on! 2447 02:47:54,600 --> 02:48:00,479 Thieves! Thieves! 2448 02:48:17,719 --> 02:48:20,039 Florin Iordache is the "Next question" guy. 2449 02:48:20,120 --> 02:48:22,480 With his cheek: "Next question! Next question!" 2450 02:48:22,520 --> 02:48:28,800 That guy, by himself, kept thousands of people in the Victory Square for days in a row. 2451 02:48:28,959 --> 02:48:31,839 And you see him... He's your servant. 2452 02:48:32,520 --> 02:48:36,600 He's a minister, "Minister" comes from Latin and it means 2453 02:48:37,440 --> 02:48:40,800 "Subordinate, underling, servant", that's what "minister" means. 2454 02:48:41,120 --> 02:48:44,960 He's a minister, he's paid from the money that you worked for. 2455 02:48:45,079 --> 02:48:48,239 Tomorrow night we'll be a hundred thousand and we'll crush them. 2456 02:48:48,440 --> 02:48:50,159 And if you're here, it'll be bad. 2457 02:48:50,200 --> 02:48:51,760 Calm down, please. 2458 02:48:52,399 --> 02:48:57,959 Pray that won't have to work tomorrow, because tomorrow we will crush them. 2459 02:48:58,399 --> 02:49:01,840 The following evenings, hundreds of thousands of Romanians took to the streets 2460 02:49:02,159 --> 02:49:05,959 And not just in Bucharest, but across the country. 2461 02:49:08,799 --> 02:49:13,599 These were the biggest protests in post-revolution Romania, and ended in a victory. 2462 02:49:13,760 --> 02:49:16,760 After a week, the government repealed the emergency ordinance. 2463 02:49:16,840 --> 02:49:20,159 A war of attrition began between the street and the politicians 2464 02:49:20,360 --> 02:49:24,360 who kept trying to change the laws, but with more subtle methods. 2465 02:49:24,600 --> 02:49:27,079 Romanians reacted with unwavering perseverance 2466 02:49:27,200 --> 02:49:29,320 and went out as many times as it was needed. 2467 02:49:29,479 --> 02:49:32,840 Indeed, we've evolved from this perspective. 2468 02:49:32,959 --> 02:49:42,519 There are now in Romania, many more people than in 1990, who take their freedom seriously. 2469 02:49:42,879 --> 02:49:45,639 What does that mean? 2470 02:49:45,639 --> 02:49:52,479 It means an inner strength to go out on the street of your own accord, 2471 02:49:52,639 --> 02:49:56,439 without being manipulated or paid by anyone. 2472 02:49:56,879 --> 02:49:59,719 The fact that, on an issue as abstract as Justice, 2473 02:49:59,840 --> 02:50:03,120 or the laws of justice, Criminal Code, Criminal Procedure Code, 2474 02:50:03,280 --> 02:50:06,280 people reacted and understood exactly what this is about, 2475 02:50:06,520 --> 02:50:12,840 and so many came out it's an extremely surprising, beneficial maturing. 2476 02:50:12,920 --> 02:50:14,960 Belated, in fairness, 2477 02:50:15,079 --> 02:50:18,239 but probably it couldn't have been otherwise. 2478 02:50:18,479 --> 02:50:23,119 The political class became too stiff, 2479 02:50:23,520 --> 02:50:28,239 deluded that it's simply there and no one can take its place. 2480 02:50:29,159 --> 02:50:31,520 Relying on the attitude that 2481 02:50:32,079 --> 02:50:35,680 serious people mind their own business and don't go into politics. 2482 02:50:35,879 --> 02:50:41,159 And we see in politics people who haven't achieved much in their career. 2483 02:50:42,239 --> 02:50:46,559 There are many, many people who don't have a profession 2484 02:50:46,600 --> 02:50:48,880 and that's why they got into politics. 2485 02:50:48,879 --> 02:50:53,519 That was the backup career of the little losers of Romania, not the big losers. 2486 02:50:53,719 --> 02:50:56,559 The big losers are tragic figures, like Dostoievski. These are little losers. 2487 02:50:56,719 --> 02:51:00,079 What do you think makes you a fit for this seat at Victoria Palace? 2488 02:51:00,399 --> 02:51:04,079 My colleagues, and the president of the party made statements in this regard. 2489 02:51:04,319 --> 02:51:07,760 What makes her a fit? Viorica Dancila is a civilized woman, 2490 02:51:08,040 --> 02:51:11,560 a non-conflictual woman. 2491 02:51:14,000 --> 02:51:16,559 She's very communicative. 2492 02:51:16,920 --> 02:51:21,280 Liviu Dragnea transformed the fostering of mediocrity into an ideology. 2493 02:51:21,479 --> 02:51:25,639 He appointed people without any experience in the highest seats in the state. 2494 02:51:25,879 --> 02:51:30,399 I will do everything I can to develop the Romanian economy. 2495 02:51:30,760 --> 02:51:33,360 And began to defy Western values. 2496 02:51:33,920 --> 02:51:35,960 We joined the EU, very well. 2497 02:51:36,040 --> 02:51:39,440 But we shouldn't be forced to eat all that processed food. 2498 02:51:39,840 --> 02:51:41,799 Why should we be forced to? 2499 02:51:41,799 --> 02:51:44,039 Don't we have good enough wheat? 2500 02:51:44,319 --> 02:51:45,319 And be what? 2501 02:51:46,159 --> 02:51:49,479 Maybe tenants in our own country, and possibly slaves. 2502 02:51:49,959 --> 02:51:53,079 He antagonised the EU. 2503 02:51:53,479 --> 02:51:57,920 A narrative emerged that to me, even though I was younger during communism 2504 02:51:58,040 --> 02:52:01,680 It reminded me of things like: how dangerous foreigners are, 2505 02:52:01,879 --> 02:52:04,119 how dangerous multinationals are, 2506 02:52:04,280 --> 02:52:06,760 how the EU exploits us. 2507 02:52:07,040 --> 02:52:14,120 Nationalism will always be a weapon you can use to erase your own political blunders. 2508 02:52:14,559 --> 02:52:19,639 The more incompetent a regime is, the more probable it is to find an external enemy. 2509 02:52:38,799 --> 02:52:41,879 In the spring of 2019, with an open case awaiting sentencing 2510 02:52:41,959 --> 02:52:44,119 and a round of elections approaching, 2511 02:52:44,120 --> 02:52:49,560 Liviu Dragnea played everything on a campaign with huge rallies, aggressive speeches 2512 02:52:49,559 --> 02:52:51,959 and music from the late Ceausism period. 2513 02:52:57,399 --> 02:53:00,559 What broke out now with Dragnea is not out of the blue. 2514 02:53:01,120 --> 02:53:09,360 No! Nationalist extremism has been around all along in the PSD and in Romanian society. 2515 02:53:09,479 --> 02:53:13,399 It was just biding its time. 2516 02:53:13,559 --> 02:53:19,000 Like a disease that waits for certain moment of weakness of the immune system. 2517 02:53:19,200 --> 02:53:20,680 And that's why it broke out. 2518 02:53:20,719 --> 02:53:22,920 The weakness that Liviu Dragnea exploited 2519 02:53:23,040 --> 02:53:28,400 was the fear of change in the old generation, who lived a good part of their lives in communism. 2520 02:53:29,120 --> 02:53:32,040 Any change comes with fear. 2521 02:53:32,799 --> 02:53:35,519 And it comes with fear especially for seniors. 2522 02:53:35,799 --> 02:53:39,799 They have a natural fear that you can't criticise them for, 2523 02:53:40,000 --> 02:53:42,399 and which we're not addressing either 2524 02:53:42,559 --> 02:53:47,680 They're getting older, so they think: "OK, is there going to be any stability? 2525 02:53:47,680 --> 02:53:49,360 What about my pension, my everyday life?" 2526 02:53:49,520 --> 02:53:54,960 They're no longer active, and can't just change their jobs, or do something else. 2527 02:53:55,159 --> 02:53:57,719 And when we talk about change 2528 02:53:58,000 --> 02:54:02,280 we have to be mindful and say to those who aren't very excited about change 2529 02:54:02,440 --> 02:54:06,480 that there is room for everyone and that no one will be left behind. 2530 02:54:07,360 --> 02:54:12,600 If grandchildren would tell grandparents: "Look, I see your perspective and your fear, 2531 02:54:12,840 --> 02:54:16,159 but modern Romania means this, and if you care about me, 2532 02:54:16,600 --> 02:54:19,600 then be with me for modern Romania, not against it " 2533 02:54:19,799 --> 02:54:22,840 There would be a much stronger bond between the generations. 2534 02:54:22,959 --> 02:54:24,639 Why did you come here? 2535 02:54:24,719 --> 02:54:26,519 I work for people like you. 2536 02:54:26,639 --> 02:54:27,799 That I want justice! 2537 02:54:27,920 --> 02:54:32,520 What justice? That man you support, does the worst kinds of injustice! 2538 02:54:32,559 --> 02:54:33,600 How's that? 2539 02:54:34,000 --> 02:54:35,920 I wouldn't believe that! 2540 02:54:36,079 --> 02:54:37,360 How could you not believe it? 2541 02:54:37,440 --> 02:54:38,760 I wouldn't believe it! 2542 02:54:59,399 --> 02:55:02,479 From here I greet all the children of Moldova, 2543 02:55:02,879 --> 02:55:05,239 her sons and grandsons, 2544 02:55:05,440 --> 02:55:08,760 that have taught us for centuries 2545 02:55:09,440 --> 02:55:11,560 what the homeland means! 2546 02:55:12,159 --> 02:55:15,559 We all need a homeland! 2547 02:55:16,040 --> 02:55:18,200 It was a bending of reality. 2548 02:55:18,559 --> 02:55:23,279 Many interpretations and analyses claim that history doesn't go backwards. 2549 02:55:23,360 --> 02:55:25,960 Yes, you control the levers of power, but what are you going to do? 2550 02:55:26,079 --> 02:55:28,840 For how long can you govern against society? 2551 02:55:29,000 --> 02:55:31,360 Each one of those protests has created 2552 02:55:31,479 --> 02:55:34,680 even more resistance from people who see what's going on, 2553 02:55:34,760 --> 02:55:36,440 you can't lie to them, you can't lie to them anymore. 2554 02:55:37,079 --> 02:55:41,879 They saw, they reacted! We had spontaneous, non-violent protests 2555 02:55:42,040 --> 02:55:45,600 with each of these rallies. 2556 02:55:45,760 --> 02:55:51,719 And, after the PSD supporters were evacuated from the square, because they needed a lift home, 2557 02:55:51,799 --> 02:55:54,599 those squares have been re-occupied. 2558 02:55:55,479 --> 02:56:04,399 *Romanian birthday song but with years in jail instead of years of happy life* 2559 02:56:05,120 --> 02:56:10,240 Rallies, anti-European speeches and the nationalist brew spilled onto the people 2560 02:56:10,600 --> 02:56:13,200 proved to be insufficient after all. 2561 02:56:13,639 --> 02:56:18,159 Romanians rejected this kind of leadership, not just with their protests, but also with their vote. 2562 02:56:18,319 --> 02:56:22,479 PSD recorded in 2019, at the EU Parliament and Presidential elections, 2563 02:56:22,680 --> 02:56:25,239 the worst results in its history. 2564 02:56:25,799 --> 02:56:28,920 It's a lesson that goes beyond dislike of a particular party. 2565 02:56:29,840 --> 02:56:31,840 30 years after the fall of communism, 2566 02:56:31,920 --> 02:56:37,200 Romania states that it doesn't accept to be ruled with the methods of the past anymore. 2567 02:56:38,159 --> 02:56:40,879 My child, who voted this year, 2568 02:56:41,239 --> 02:56:45,719 voted fully aware of who he's voting for, researching, collecting information. 2569 02:56:46,639 --> 02:56:48,479 He voted differently. 2570 02:56:49,319 --> 02:56:57,879 And he has very high standards for those he voted for, and I like that a lot. 2571 02:56:58,840 --> 02:57:01,639 There will be a time, in Romania, 2572 02:57:01,760 --> 02:57:06,559 of a revolt of a new generation who has different expectations to mine. 2573 02:57:06,760 --> 02:57:09,719 My parents wanted to have food, right? 2574 02:57:09,879 --> 02:57:11,159 We had food. 2575 02:57:11,280 --> 02:57:15,840 Then we wanted to have a car, a home and holidays abroad. 2576 02:57:16,600 --> 02:57:22,079 For my children, having a car, a house and trips abroad is not an objective, they have them already. 2577 02:57:22,239 --> 02:57:27,799 They have other goals: contribute to society, gain respect, public office, personal career. 2578 02:57:28,719 --> 02:57:30,439 Last time I was in England, 2579 02:57:31,000 --> 02:57:35,280 I went with a Romanian Uber driver who was there only because his boy was studying 2580 02:57:35,520 --> 02:57:37,720 for a political science degree. 2581 02:57:37,920 --> 02:57:40,799 And he said that the boy was studying political science 2582 02:57:41,040 --> 02:57:44,000 with a plan to come back to Romania and go into politics. 2583 02:57:44,200 --> 02:57:46,880 And I find that beautiful. 2584 02:57:48,040 --> 02:57:50,600 Something has changed. 2585 02:57:51,520 --> 02:57:54,280 Something has changed in Romanian society. 2586 02:57:54,639 --> 02:58:01,879 There were high expectations in Romania, indeed, very high. 2587 02:58:01,959 --> 02:58:04,279 But if you look back in time, 2588 02:58:05,959 --> 02:58:11,839 it's impossible not to notice, however, that Romania has transformed dramatically. 2589 02:58:19,440 --> 02:58:23,680 What, do you want me to be optimistic at my age? 2590 02:58:24,799 --> 02:58:26,359 To allow myself that? 2591 02:58:26,719 --> 02:58:31,519 What can I say? I dare, reluctantly, to hope 2592 02:58:31,959 --> 02:58:37,559 that, finally, I won't be living in the Socialist Republic of Romania anymore. 2593 02:58:39,520 --> 02:58:41,840 UNIVERSITY SQUARE DECEMBER 2019 2594 02:58:41,920 --> 02:58:44,600 TO THE HEROES OF THE ROMANIAN REVOLUTION 2595 02:58:46,319 --> 02:58:50,119 My parents lived through communism and told me some things ... 2596 02:58:50,440 --> 02:58:53,960 They told me they weren't allowed to talk, they had taboo topics, 2597 02:58:53,959 --> 02:58:57,079 not just in the family, but in general, on the street ... 2598 02:58:57,559 --> 02:59:02,479 That everything was rationed. And for us it's very strange now 2599 02:59:02,639 --> 02:59:07,920 to imagine someone only having a certain ration of bread or milk or ... 2600 02:59:08,680 --> 02:59:11,479 It wasn't for nothing ... it changed. 2601 02:59:12,040 --> 02:59:15,400 It changed the fact that we are free to choose what we want to do, 2602 02:59:15,559 --> 02:59:18,199 which is very important, especially for your career. 2603 02:59:18,639 --> 02:59:22,639 We have many more opportunities, like this here, for me to present my ideas. 2604 02:59:22,920 --> 02:59:27,239 Before '89 no one would've asked me what my opinion was. 2605 02:59:27,559 --> 02:59:33,199 I can't imagine how I could be restricted from talking about what's going on. 2606 02:59:33,799 --> 02:59:38,959 For us it was like this forever. Free, entitled and believing we can do anything we want. 2607 02:59:39,159 --> 02:59:41,840 But back then it was completely different. 2608 02:59:42,040 --> 02:59:45,960 There are a few people who say that during communism it was better, but ... 2609 02:59:47,440 --> 02:59:50,280 No, it's not true. 238221

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