All language subtitles for Mind The Game S02E05.en-us.Dialog.Sdh

Jason, anything
you want us to hit

or you go back over, or do
you want us to close it up?

[Jason] I don't have anything.
Only question I have

is who decided to go with the
boy band look first,

-was it you or was it Dirk?
-[Lebron laughing]

[Lebron] The Backstreet Boys
look? The old NSYNC look?

[upbeat music]

Welcome back to Mind The Game.

Today, we got an opportunity

to sit down and talk
to LeBron virtually.

He's away with his family.

I'm here at home.

Some of our subsequent
conversations this summer

will be virtually,

so bear with us if there's
any technical issues

that we iron out along the way,

but hopefully we'll
be in person some,

but also definitely
virtual as we are today.

We got a great opportunity
to sit with LeBron,

talk to him about the
series he just played

versus the
Minnesota Timberwolves.

What he experienced,
what he faced,

what he thinks of the T Wolves.

Thought they were impressive
throughout the series.

We've seen a team here mature.

They made a big
trade last summer.

KAT going to New York,

and DiVincenzo and Julius
Randle going to the T Wolves.

And I think they've done
an amazing job this year,

finding an identity
with those new pieces.

Not easy to do.

So big shout out to their
staff and players

for how they've been able to
matriculate through the season.

Find this identity

and be an incredible team
when it counts the most.

And we'll also talk a little
bit about Anthony Edwards

and the leap he's made recently

from, you know, primarily
a scorer to a playmaker.

Lakers did a lot of
things in this series

to try to slow him down,
to try to take away his impact,

to keep him off their rim.

And he showed, I think, some
incredible growth and maturity,

moving the ball,
making simple passes,

playing with different paces,
changing gears,

a growth and maturity that,

you know, I think
we'd love to see

in all of our young
stars in this league.

So, great conversation
with LeBron today

looking back on the
series with the T Wolves.

Hope you guys enjoy.

[upbeat music]

-Mind the Game.
-Yes, sir. Back again, baby.

Back at it.

-Hey--
-Yeah.

first of all,
condolences, you know,

obviously, sad to see you
guys go out of the playoffs.

Yeah, man.

Before we dig into that though,

I think it's probably
appropriate that we

send a major congrats
shout out to Coach Pop.

Oh wow. Yeah, for sure.

There's no way we even
start this conversation

without even talking about Pop

and what he means for the game.

What he meant, obviously,
for just the NBA, San Antonio.

I mean, West Point.

I mean, all the
stops that he had.

I mean, you know, to
be able to cross paths.

I mean, we've crossed paths

with Coach Pop so
many times, you know,

and I had one opportunity
to actually play for him

in the Olympics in 2004,

and obviously going
against him three times

in the NBA finals.

And, I mean, what can you say?

I mean, you could say...

I mean, you talk
about the superlatives

when it comes to Coach Pop, man.

His list is, you know,
out of this world.

But I think what a lot
of people have found out,

if you ever got an
opportunity to encounter

a one-on-one with him,

or even just in crossing,

how great of a fucking
guy that guy is, man.

And it makes sense of how
unbelievable coach he was,

you know, because of
the person he was.

That's right.

I mean, you look at the
superlatives, as you say,

winning his coach
in NBA history,

five titles,

18-50 win seasons.

That's insane. Insane.

-Insane.
-170 playoff wins.

-Wow. Wow.
-170, right?

So, over two NBA seasons
in wins, in the playoffs.

What about playing for him?

Coach Pop had you at Team USA.

Tell us a little bit
about that experience.

Yeah, it's just,
you know, the admiration.

Like, for me, I was an
18-year-old kid, you know?

And, you know,
I got an opportunity to see it,

you know, when they won
a championship in '99,

and then when they won it again,
I believe in 2000...

2003 maybe?

So I had already had admiration,

you know, for Pop
and his San Antonio team.

And, you know,
I was on the team,

I was a young guy alongside,
you know, Carmelo Anthony.

We were young guys.

Dwayne Wade,
we were super young.

And, you know, to be a part of,

you know, that team...

You know, obviously,
we didn't succeed

like we wanted to succeed,

but to be on a team with like
Allen Iverson and Tim Duncan,

you know, and Coach Pop,

you know, Larry Brown,

it was like another welcome,

you know, to what greatness
is all about, you know?

And, you know, to see where
Coach Pop have left this game,

you know, as far as him
patrolling the sidelines

for as long as he did,

and, you know, the amount of
wins that you just mentioned,

the amount of championships,
the amount of great players

that he's seen come through
the San Antonio franchise,

it's just been a
complete honor, man.

And for me to have a real
personal relationship with him,

that every time I
see him is like,

you know, just so much
respect, and so much honor,

and, you know, definitely
will be missed.

You know, definitely
will be missed.

But obviously, we know
health is most important,

but, you know, we cannot
shy away from the fact

of what he was able to
accomplish on those sidelines.

Yeah, I mean, just greatness.

You know,
organizational greatness.

You know, his role as a coach,
but also as a GM, or President,

or all the different
roles he's taken on there.

Yeah. Yeah.

You know, the type of program
organization they built.

And a big part of that DNA
is him and his personality,

-his standards.
-Yeah. Yep.

Not just what he demands
from players on the court,

but also the type of
people he tries to recruit

or develop,

or, you know, influence.

And you look at that
family tree,

how many coaches
around the league,

you know, Steve Kerr
obviously played for him.

Ime play and coached
with him and for him.

You know, it goes on and
on and on. Dozens of them.

-Dozens of them.
-But I think your point

about him being a
great man, you know?

He's still with
us and hopefully--

-Yeah.
-he's gonna have a big

impact going forward.

-His health can continue--
-Absolutely.

-to improve and-
-Yep.

But we just wanna take
this time to talk about,

you know,
his success and who he is.

One little story
that I always loved

is we played them
in the playoffs,

can't remember, conference
finals, semi-finals,

and me and Tony Parker
bumped heads.

I can't remember.

But I'm sure I was
bleeding as usual.

-[Lebron laughing]
-I was leaking blood.

It was my nose, right?
It was my nose.

And it was right down
the stretch of the game,

you know, last five, six
minutes of the game, I believe,

and trying to get
the blood to stop.

It's like right on
the crease of my nose.

And, you know, it's just like

really thin skin through
there so blood's flying out.

So I come in the game,
like I made a three.

It's bleeding, the refs,
"Get him out,"

come back in the games,
it's bleeding again.

Pop was over there, like,
"Just let him play."

-Right.
-"Just let him play," you know?

And so, they obviously
not gonna let me play

until you get better.

But like, I believed him
that he wanted me to play.

He's like, "I wanna beat them

-with their full compliment.
-Full strength.

We're here to win against
them with their best punch.

And so, I always admired the
type of human being he is.

The way he stood up for
what he believes in,

you know, human rights.

-Yeah, for sure.
-For people.

For people that
are underserved or,

you know, under advantaged.
And so...

I think you make a great point.

It's not just the
accolades as a coach

and an organizational leader.

It's the type of human being,
the way he did it.

I think he did such a
service to our community,

but also to our league,
you know, as an example for

how we wanna behave.

We're all gonna
have different ways

of doing things,
but he set a hell of an example

for what success looks like.

And the way you approach it.

Yeah, and you always
hear this term, culture.

You know, in our league,

does it have a good culture?

Does this franchise
have a great culture?

And I think
when you look at it,

if you can think
of one franchise

that the culture has
always been, you know,

the stability of that culture,

or this is how the
culture is gonna be ran,

you automatically think
about the San Antonio Spurs

and the one common, you know,

denominator is
been Pop, you know?

You could look at all the
players has come through there,

you know, when Pop became head
coach from Vinny Del Negro

to Avery Johnson,
to David Robinson,

to obviously then Tim Duncan,
then Manu, then Tony,

then all these guys, you know,

all the way down
to DeMar DeRozan

and all these guys.

-Kawhi, Wemby.
-Kawhi, Wemby.

All these guys
towards, you know,

but the one common denominator
has always been Pop.

And you think about culture

and what everybody's
trying to build now.

You hear Heat culture,

you hear all these other
franchises building a culture.

And I think it started, man,

and you know, like you said,
the early 1990s,

you know, when Pop took over

and it's 2025, man.

Right?

It's 2025.

And I think, you know,
people try to

in all sports, you know,
in all sports,

you used to hear about
the New England Patriots,

with Belichick.

But I think it started
with Pop as well

and having that influence,
just being able,

this is how things
are gonna be ran.

No single person is
bigger than this culture

and what we're
trying to build here.

And I think that has a
lot to do with success.

Obviously, we've seen it.

Yeah, well, coming from
the both of us, you know,

we hope we see and hear a
lot more from Coach Pop.

Absolutely

Congrats on an
incredible career,

but hopefully his
influence will continue

to take an impact on our league

and our communities
for a long time.

Absolutely.
Shout out Coach Pop, man.

We'll miss you, brother.

Yes, sir.

[upbeat music]

First, how's the knee?

Oh, man, this is my
in my 22-year career,

-this is my first knee injury.
-Right.

You know, I've had the regular
tendonitis and patella,

all that stuff.

But this is the first
time I've ever had

like a sustained knee injury
where I had to like, okay,

you gotta get off your feet.

You know, you gotta kind
of be shelved for a minute.

And, you know, I knew as soon
as when the impact happened

with me and DiVincenzo,
you know, I felt it right away.

My knee locked up.

And that's why I kind of,
I stayed on the ground

for quite a minute
to see, you know,

if the knee would kind
of release a little bit.

But I knew right then
and there it was a pain

that I hadn't felt before.

And I think obviously,
when I was running back to close out

and he collided into me,
you know, my knee bent inward,

and that's the MCL
injury that I had.

So, you know, four to six weeks,

the docs told me.

I have four to six weeks now.

That's the benefit, that's
the benefit of not, you know,

going on in the postseason.

Obviously, I wish
I was still going,

but you know, unfortunately,
even if we would've won

game five at home, you know,

I would've probably
missed six and seven.

And even further.

But, you know, I have
some time though,

I have some time to get it right

and get back to full
strength as far as my knee.

It's definitely, it was a
pain that next morning, man,

you know, after I had told
the docs, I was like, listen,

you know, it feels it's
sore right now, yes.

And you know, this is
Wednesday night after the game

and I said, you know, if
I wake up Thursday morning

and it didn't feel any better
then you know, Friday morning,

let's get an MRI Friday morning.

Well, when I woke up
Thursday morning

and try to get out of bed,
I was like, "holy shit."

And I called doc right away.

I said,
"I can't wait till Friday.

I need to go today."

So I mean, that, that really
was it for your season.

Yeah. Yeah.
I mean, pretty much. Yeah.

Yeah, unfortunately.

Well, at least it's containable,

you know, it's a non-surgical
four to six weeks.

You get yourself right
in this wheelhouse

of trying to get some time off.

In that respect like,
what is your mindset right now?

Like, it's always weird,
like when I played, you know,

you add a new variable to
it, getting healthy now.

-Right. Right. Right.
-So you have a forced variable.

Right, right

When I was in your shoes,
you lose a series,

like you'd have these
different kind of thoughts.

One, sometimes you'd be,
you know, devastated.

Other times you'd
be over analytical.

Other times you just want space.

You know, my bandwidth is done,
I need to get away.

Like, where are you
right now, with the way

this kind of season was,
big season for you guys, right?

Like a big trade.

Trying to ram this team
together as quickly as possible.

Yeah, as quickly as possible.

Had a hell of a run
getting into the playoffs.

You know, styles make fights
and it was a tough matchup

for you guys,
but where's your mindset

before we talk about the series?

Like you just said, Steve,

you unravel all of those
emotions, you know,

and I've unraveled all of
them in a sense of like,

give me space, you know,
going back analytically

seeing if there was ways what
could I have done better,

what we could have done better,

thinking about the
individual matchups,

thinking about their
team versus our team.

Things where we could
have did better, you know,

and it all has entered my
mind since Wednesday night

when it was over with.

So, you know, I've had a
few days to kind of just,

each day has been something
different, you know?

And obviously I've come
to grips with it now,

you know, with it being quite
a few days after the fact

and watching a lot of
the other series now

and seeing how they unfold.

But yeah, you said it, man,

I've had all those emotions

to the point where
it's like, what the,

shit we entered the season well,

but like you said, when it
comes to the postseason, man,

matchups sometimes
doesn't determine

how well of a regular
season you had.

It's the matchups

and we ran into a
damn good matchup.

A team that's been battle
tested, a team that's hungry,

a team that a lot of youth,

but also experienced
at the same time.

And a team that's trying
to make the next step.

You know, they were a worthy
opponent, that's for sure.

How does kind of these
like media narratives

enter your frame of mind
at this time of year?

Like, for example,
because it's the Lakers,

because it's you and Luka,
it's all about

how did the Lakers
lose this series?

But really like
what happened here

is Minnesota's a hell of a team
and they won this series.

Yeah, yeah.

How do you deal
with some of that

when you try to
process all this?

For me, I've definitely
learned over the years

that teams win championships.

-Always.
-Always.

Always, teams always
win championships.

And yes, individuals get
a lot of the accolades

and the praise, but a
collective group, you know,

wins championships.

Now, you know,
you have your big guys

that make big plays at the end
of games, throughout the game

or whatever the case may be.

But ultimately, you know,
teams win championships.

And I understand that,

and it's never just
about me and Luca.

It was never just about,
you know, Anthony Edwards

and Julius Randle, you know,

it was always Minnesota
versus the Lakers.

And I understand that,

and I'm at a point in
my career now, where I...

I don't lose sleep
over that, like,

"Fuck, how did me
and Luka lose like--"

Right, I know, I know.

Well, there's eight
other guys on the floor.

-Yeah, yeah, yeah.
-You know, so--

-Of course.
-You know, so, I'm like, yeah.

It's always, you know,
it's the nature of the business.

-Yeah, sure.
-It's the nature of the business.

When you've played 22 years,
you've heard that you've,

-you've seen that before.
-Oh man, I've seen it.

But it is an interesting
talking point in general

is that like, you guys are
a developing roster.

You know, you traded for
a big generational piece.

But that doesn't mean
the roster is balanced.

[LeBron] Correct.

You don't have time,
once getting Luka

to make moves necessarily
that are gonna allow you

to kind of fulfill that roster.
Like a way Minnesota is,

like Minnesota could
trade pieces out,

but essentially, they're
a balanced roster.

You could say I'd rather
this guy than that guy,

-but they have the positions covered.
-Right.

Yeah, and the only thing they changed,

you know, in the off-season,
they brought in two guys.

They kind of lost a big piece.
Obviously KAT,

but brought in
Julius and DiVincenzo, you know,

and the other guys came back,
you know, so the experience

of being in the Western
Conference Finals last year,

you know, DiVincenzo has
played in big games, you know,

and those guys just learn
and continue to build.

They're regular season.

I don't think their regular
season gave them an...

It didn't give any of
us or the narrative that

how good of a team they
were actually were.

Yeah, for sure.

They were dealing
with injuries,

they were dealing with
trying to learn each other.

But, you know,
when the postseason comes

and you have that team
of collective group,

they have a strong eight
to nine guys, you know,

from their starting lineup
to Naz Reid, to DiVincenzo

to Nickeil Alexander-Walker.

And those guys, they come in

and they just play extremely hard so...

Yeah, from my perspective,
it's two things, I think,

that they had that you
guys are looking for.

One is an identity.
They formed one this year.

You guys are just trying
to figure yours out.

Yeah, yeah.

Like right, and those
collective experiences

of being there, looking at
each other when you're down 15

in game three or whatever,

and say, "We've been here,
we know what to do."

Instead, you're looking
at each other like,

"I've never been here with you.
How are you feeling?"

How am I, you know, that stuff,
those scars, those lessons.

So I think they built
an identity this year.

You know, I think the other
part of this was just speed.

Yeah.

They have foot speed
to defend, to attack.

You guys had positional size,
even though you'd play small

for the most part
in the playoffs.

You guys are 6'6" 6'10" across
the board, other than Gabe.

So, you know, you have the size,

you tried, obviously, as you did in the
regular season to a lot of success.

Kind of zone up,
get up in the gaps,

try to take the primary
ball handler outta the game.

But when they
have that quickness

-and Ant, he's so explosive.
-[LeBron] He's improved, man.

-[Steve] And he's improved the playmaking.
-Exactly.

He's improved so much
with his playmaking

and you've seen him
make the jump, you know,

just from last
year's playoff run

all the way to just one,
just one playoff, you know,

series right there.

He was super patient, you know,

even when we were
getting up in the gaps

and sometimes
we would double him,

sometimes we would smoke,

sometimes we would
be in the gaps,

just trying to make him think.
And we did.

There was a--

he had one quote where
he was like,

"Their defense is confusing
and making me think."

And he figured it out, you
know, so I commend him, man.

He just grew
throughout our series

that I think is gonna
benefit him throughout,

you know, the rest of this run.

But yeah, 100%.

And your guys' strategy
felt like for me,

whether you are in a soft
blitz or just in the gaps,

you were leaving guys in
the corner coming high,

loading to the ball, trying
to bait him into those passes

that maybe he's not sure
the guy's gonna get a look

or he's gotta throw it over
hands trying to confuse him.

And I think to your point,
he did a lot of things

better this year than
he has in the past.

He slowed down.

-[LeBron] Yeah, yep.
-He changed paces.

He would drive,
and he would hesitate slightly

instead of just all one speed.

Yeah.

To give him a chance to see is he coming,
is he not coming?

Where's this pass?
Where's my window?

Do I have a layup or do
I need to get off it?

He also, I think,
sometimes got into a crowd

and instead of making
a difficult pass,

he made simple passes.

Which in the past,
he wasn't as willing to make,

that's a huge step.

A simple one, get off and allow
your teammate to have a closeout,

you know,
or a two-on-one, right?

Like that's the way to bust
the way you guys were trying

-to load to him.
-[LeBron] Yeah, yeah.

Tricky, because the
foot speed piece.

And I'd love to hear how you guys
approached it,

even when you tried to
double him a little bit,

guys were reluctant to
run and double him

'cause he's so explosive.
So he had the time.

Make the time to look
around and pick his spot.

Yeah.
And that's why we changed pitches.

We wanted to
change pitches on him

as much as possible 'cause

you don't ever give one
player, no great players,

one steady diet of the
same thing, you know?

But, you know, even when
you try to double 'em,

his ability to
race double teams,

to split double teams,
to get creative.

And he's still strong, too,

so it's not like he's a frail guy
where you can double him

and be more, be super aggressive
with him and get him on.

He's definitely,
he's learned over the time,

but he's strong.

He has low center of gravity.
He has a great handle.

He can shoot the
ball extremely well.

And you know, to add on to
what we said a couple times

before in some of
our older episodes

about believing
in your teammates,

making them feel even better
than what they are as well.

And he's trusting his
teammates to make plays.

I think, you know, that's a...

Man, listen, we gotta give
'em Minnesota their flowers.

-That's a damn good team, man.
-A very good team.

I'm looking forward to seeing
their next matchup, you know?

Either between, you know,
Golden State or Houston.

Yeah, for sure.

There was a clip of you
telling Ant after the game,

-take the next step.
-Yeah.

Y'all take the next step now.

Tell me, like in your words,

as somebody that
you have played with

on the USAB stuff and the
Olympics, gold medal together.

Obviously, there's
some mentorship.

Like what did that moment
mean to you when you say that

to a young player that
you've shared the floor with?

You know, I think that moment
for me, is like, you know,

understanding and recognizing
the next generation

and someone who can
do it and be great

and be great for a long
time in our league.

That's what our game is about,

being able to pass it
down to the next generation

and they can continue
to do great things.

And for me, being out there,

in my 22nd season, playing
against a young, up-and-coming,

you know, superstar in the flesh,
you know,

in Anthony Edwards
and watching him

in the postseason last year,
make those steps

to get to the Western
Conference Finals

and fall short to Dallas,
you know,

and then have a full summer
with him in the Olympic team.

And seeing how great
he was, just listening

and just soaking in
everything from myself,

from myself to KD to Steph.

You know, you could just see

he was just like a little
kid in a candy store.

-Enthusiasm for him.
-Yeah, like super energetic and happy

and just like, super, like,
he was just grateful

that he was in that
opportunity to be there.

And for me to just like, you know,

tell him to take the
next step, like,

it doesn't always mean, okay,
Western Conference Finals

and now, you gotta be in the finals.

It's like, take the next step
and just you as a person,

you as a player, continue to
get better, better, and better.

You know, your time's
gonna come. Whatever.

I can't decide when
that's gonna be.

Sometimes we have no control
over when that next step

as far as going to the finals and winning.

We're not always have
the opportunity to do that,

but like we do have control
over making the next step

in our own individual journey.

Yeah.

And I think
that's what it was about.

Because I love seeing that, man.
I love seeing--

I love seeing Jayson Tatum
take that next step.

You know, I love seeing,
you know-- Now I see Ant,

you know, taking that next step.

It's a proud feeling for me
as a player,

been in the league for so long.

You admire it when you see
someone's putting the time in.

-Yeah.
-And they're improving.

Like you said, for Ant to
have that type of openness

and attitude around USAB, you
know, coming in with like,

this is a great opportunity.

Like immediately, it's
gonna give you excitement

for his journey because he
wants to learn, you can tell.

But I think that,
you know, that buy-in

of continually
improving, you know,

someone like he can
rely on his athleticism.

But to take the
next step, you know,

he's gotta be a great teammate
and be coachable.

He's gotta make his teammates
believe he's bought in.

I think you could
see that, you know,

there's always been a
little chatter around Rudy

or around Randle,
and I thought they both were

laser focused, simplified
their games, were efficient.

And that's a lot of it comes
from the head of the snake

is he willing to make
the simple play, pass,

make his teammates better.

Rudy had a great game

and he deserves
all the credit in the world.

But his opportunities
came from the pressure

Ant puts on the defense.

-Yeah, absolutely.
-You know?

Everything that Rudy
did in that game five

came because Ant
approached the game

the way he did those
first four games.

Now all the eyes was
on Ant, you know?

And everything was
game-planned around Ant.

And Rudy was the
beneficiary of that moment.

And you know, and
also like, you know,

when you have a guy
like Ant who's growing,

and making that change,

and you can see him
developing more and more,

it makes guys want
to come there too.

Like, you know,
you have to think long-term, too,

when it comes to
like free agency and

How you continue to get
better too as a team

is being able to
get small pieces.

When you're a good team

that's trying to
become a great team,

it's literally one or two
pieces like in the off-season

that if you acquire, that
makes the jump for you.

And, you know, Ant has that...

He has that bravado and that
flare and that "It Factor,"

you know, that guys
wanna play alongside that.

Because it's energetic,
it's fun, and he competes.

-And he competes.
-For sure.

We gotta give credit
to their coaches,

they've done a great job.

Oh, for sure.
Yeah, for sure.

They've developed those
guys, Ant as well.

It's a symbiotic
relationship, right?

Coaches develop,
players gotta buy in.

-Yeah.
-And they've both done that.

And I could
read between the lines,

Rudy was asked,
Ant didn't shoot the ball well,

and his comment was,
"He made the right plays.

We don't care if he
makes or misses."

To me, that's an
organizational language.

That's the film sessions.

-Yeah.
-In meetings.

Like, "Ant make the right plays,
make the right decisions."

And his growth from last year
to this year in that way.

So I give credit to
the whole organization,

especially that coaching staff

for helping that
team matriculate.

Yeah.

How far do you
think they can go?

Wow, I personally think...

I'm looking
at the competition

and the rest of the field,
which is a lot of great teams left.

But I could see them

for sure getting into the
Western Conference Finals,

if not the Finals.

-I think obviously, health is wealth.
-Sure.

-Always.
-in the postseason.

But I think if they...
They have all the makeups,

they have shooting,
toughness, size,

they have foot speed,
play-making experience.

-Defensive versatility.
-They have defensive versatility,

which you need in
the postseason.

And those guys, they play
extremely hard, you know?

And they have a, like you said,

you gotta give credit to
the coaching staff, too.

They are putting those guys

in the right position
to be successful.

So I think
they have an opportunity.

If at least the Western Conference Finals,

if not, then the Finals.

-I mean...
-Yeah.

-They have the makeup for that.
-Yeah.

Yeah, it's gonna be
some exciting series.

You know, I obviously think OKC's
been outstanding this year.

Oh, absolutely.

That's a great series.

We got a game seven--

-Oh man.
-Taping today on a Sunday.

Warriors-Rockets,
which has been a fascinating series.

Yeah.

You know, and the next rounds
even gonna be, you know, incredible.

[jazzy music]

I gotta ask this.

22nd season playing an entire
half in the playoff game.

-[LeBron laughing]
-How'd it feel?

-You've done that before.
-I've done it before.

-You did it before.
-Yeah.

How'd you feel?

-I felt in the moment.
-Yeah.

You know, I wasn't tired.

You know, I wasn't
at looking for a sub.

I wasn't...

-If it came, cool--
-Sure.

I would've accepted it.

But we had an opportunity
to tie the series at two to two,

-you know, on the road--
-Yeah.

versus a great team.

And the coaches rolled the dice,
and we rolled with it.

-Yep.
-You know?

And we just didn't,
we didn't make enough plays.

But I mean, I didn't leave...

I left that game extremely tired

and extremely like, "Whew, shit"

because it was a
postseason game.

Not because I played
the whole second half.

You know, I was tired as hell
because I gave my whole body,

my body, my mind, my soul
to the game for 48 minutes.

-I was extremely tired.
-Yeah.

But it wasn't because,
"Oh, well, I played, you know,

24 straight minutes
in the second half."

No. You know, we had an opportunity
and we didn't counter it.

Yeah.
You know, I totally agree.

I mean, I think, yeah, aside
from like anyone's critique

of shorting the bench to
zero in the second half,

like you gotta push buttons,
you gotta try things, right?

Like you can lose, or the
coaches have a feeling

of what's going on,
where the team's at,

where the desperation is.

The reality is they're a more complete
roster at this stage of the story.

So for you guys to win,

you have to play above
your level always.

You have to make
shots at a high clip.

You have to be taking
care of the basketball.

-Not giving up. Just didn't happen.
-Yeah.

And that's what we talked about.

You're right, Steve, we talked about that,
like the possession game.

We lost the possession
game in the series.

And the possession game came
down to offensive rebounds,

turnovers, you know, loose balls.

Like, they're a more
complete team than we were.

You know, we had
our opportunities.

And when you have
your opportunities,

you can't have a
high turnover game

and allowing them to
get fast break points.

You can't guard as hard
as we was guarding

and then give up two or three
straight offensive rebounds.

You just can't.
You can't do that.

-Which happened multiple times.
-Which happened multiple times.

You have to be able to
control the controllables.

And for the series,
we didn't do that.

And that resulted
even more of a reason

why we weren't able
to extend the series.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, it's always funny
though that the narratives

and, yeah, I mean, would it
have made a big difference

to put Gabe in for a minute
here or there or whatever?

Like, but you
know, we overreact.

-For sure.
-We overreact.

Coaches, they make an
in-the-moment decision.

Mm-hmm.

And we always like to say,

"Well, punish people when it
didn't work" at the same time.

You know, you lose that game

and there's another
problem, right?

That's part of being a coach
is you gotta be brave,

you gotta make
decisions on the fly

sometimes they're right,
sometimes wrong.

And by the way,
none of us question.

None of us questioned
JJ and the coaching staff

for what happened.

Obviously, you know,
Gabe and Vando

are guys that have given us
so many great minutes.

They definitely felt a way
because they're competitors.

Shit, we all feel
like we could get in

and make a moment happen.

But it wasn't a decision,
which JJ told us,

It wasn't a decision
that was based on

guys not being
able to do the job.

It was just decision based
on the feeling of the game

and the momentum of the game.

And none of us...

None of us looked at him--
or the coaching staff in anyway

for the decision that he made.

And shit, it was our fault
that we didn't come through.

And that's part of
making that decision

is knowing your
guys have the maturity

and team-first attitude

to be upset because
they're competitors.

But at the same time be like,
"I'll be ready for the next game."

That's a part of a
winning mentality in a group.

Yeah, absolutely.

So what's...

How are you gonna
fill this gap of,

you know, taking
care of this knee?

[laughing]

You got a little space,
a little rest and recovery.

I know you don't
like to sit still.

No, I don't like to sit still.

How are you gonna
fill your time here?

Well, man, obviously number
one is to get back healthy.

I'll be able to do some small stuff
within the next week or two

just to get the mobility back
into the knee and things of that nature.

You know, my youngest son
is headed off to college soon.

So, you know,
that's another bird out the nest.

A very emotional moment
coming up for Bryce,

going off to Tucson
to be an Arizona Wildcat.

But my daughter is
heavily in volleyball,

so I'll be in a lot
of gyms this summer

as she's with her
travel league team--

-That's great.
-out in California.

She, you know, they go all over.

They've been to Reno, Nevada,

they're going to Las Vegas,
they play all over California.

So to spend a lot
of time with her

and then, take some
vacation time with the family.

Some of the times that
you lose, you know,

obviously, when you're in the
eight-nine month season.

And see what this
next, you know,

what the next
journey looks like.

You know, I haven't
had the conversation

with the family yet, as
far as me going forward,

or whatever the case may be.

But we'll see what happens.

Yeah, it's good for
you to get some space.

I've done the volleyball thing.

My wife played in college

and I have a
daughter playing D3,

so I've been in all those gyms,

all those tournaments in
Vegas and all that stuff.

-Those are fun times, man.
-Yeah.

-So enjoy that.
-Yeah, I'm looking forward to that.

I heard, listen, I heard
you got a new thing.

-You wanna speak about that?
-Oh, you know me.

Congratulations to you.

Well, this is, you know,

you got me rolling here
in this media space, so.

-[LeBron laughing]
-Gonna be on Prime Video

doing NBA games next
year and studio work.

-Thank you, appreciate it.
-Yes, sir.

Excited.

Great team over there.

Taylor Rooks, Dirk, my
buddy, BG, UD, a few others.

It's gonna be an exciting
project, you know,

to create a new show and a
new way of covering the game,

hopefully with new voices.

-Yeah, yeah.
-Definitely excited.

So you're getting me
the early reps here.

Listen, I got you, man.
I got you, man.

Listen, I cracked a smile
and laughed a little bit

when the news broke and
I seen Dirk tweet out,

"Now I gotta carry this guy."

Now I gotta carry this guy again
like I did all those years ago.

-[Steve] Yeah.
-[LeBron laughing]

I stayed quiet about that.

I paid for every breakfast,
lunch, and dinner for six years.

-But, you know.
-[LeBron laughing]

-Oh man.
-That's just a part of the gig.

That's a part of the gig, right

You gotta take the
youngster, you know,

let him become a man
under your tutelage.

And then what does he do?
He shits on you.

[laughing]

Oh man, that's funny.

[jazzy music]

Jason, anything you want us
to hit or you go back over,

or do you want us to close it out?

[Jason] No, I don't have anything.

I guess the only
question I have is,

who decided to go with
the boy band look first?

-Was it you or was it Dirk?
-[LeBron laughing]

The old Backstreet Boys look?

-The old NSYNC look?
-[Steve] Well, my brother and I,

right before I got
traded to Dallas,

we, for whatever reason,
bleached our whole head like blonde.

So, of course, when I got traded,

it was like a month or two in,
or whatever, six weeks later,

so it had almost grown out.

So I had like the frosted tips.

And you know, sometimes
you don't recognize

how bad that's gonna look one day.
You know what I mean?

You're just like,
"What's the big deal?

I'll just rock up
there like this."

Then Dirk had like the bowl cut

-with the Jordan one hoop earring.
-[LeBron] Yeah, yeah.

I had the frosted tips.

Man, just history is...

History always reminds us.

[LeBron laughing]

Mind The Game.
Mind The Game.