All language subtitles for Signs.of.a.Psychopath.S06E08.An.Excuse.to.Kill.Somebody.1080p.AMZN.WEB-DL.DDP2.0.H.264-BurCyg_track3_[eng]

REPORTER: Prosecutors
say Kimberly Lynn Cates,

42, a nurse and mother,

died of wounds
to her head, torso,

arms, and legs.

Daughter, Jaimie,
an 11-year-old

sixth grader, remains
in intensive care,

her throat cut,
a leg broken.

There are reports
she managed to

call 911 after
the attack for help.

We just kept saying to
ourselves, "Why that,

you know, seemingly
unassuming home?"

[theme music playing]

MAN: The thing inside of me,
it's like...

the appetite --
it's like a wolf that's...

feeling the hunger.

REPORTER: New Hampshire State
Troopers have just arrested

four individuals suspected for

the brutal murder of
Kimberly Cates.

Her daughter, Jaimie, remains
in critical condition.

Police were allegedly tipped
off from multiple witnesses

reporting that
four teenagers

were heard bragging about
the murder to friends.

The suspects were identified
as Steven Spader,

Christopher Gribble,
Quinn Glover, and William Marks.

All four suspects are now in
custody of the New Hampshire

State Police
with charges pending.

Gribble's reaction
to investigators,

when he's questioned
about this brutal crime,

is inconsistent with how
a lot of typical teenage boys

and teenagers would react.

He's very calm,
he's very even in his tone.

But what he also is doing
is he's impression managing.

He's trying to push
a narrative on the investigators

about how he couldn't possibly

be someone that would do this,
and that he's this upstanding

member of society.

Individuals, when they want
to control the interview

or they want to manipulate
the person that's

interviewing them, they'll
dance around the question.

It is hypocritical,
because just a few minutes ago,

he said, you know,
"I'm chivalrous,"

implying, like, "I would
be helpful if I could."

But here we see him later in
the interview basically not

giving up any information,

being incredibly vague,
insincere, and just all around

not helpful.

He's almost challenging them.

"Prove that you have
anything on me.

Otherwise, you know,
I'm walking out of here."

What the detective is
starting to do is confront him,

and some of that is to see if
Gribble cracks.

He doesn't show any real
stress response.

He starts to laugh
almost sarcastically.

This is also
where we start to see

more and more of
those psychopathic traits

really emerge.

He's not expressing any stress
about what they know at all.

What we see is what
we would expect to see

with most teenagers --
he's scared, there's not a lot

of energy,
and he's somewhat defeated.

But what he is also
is cooperative.

The minute you have a crime
partner who's willing to talk,

you've got leverage, and most
significantly and obviously,

what they now have is
a witness.

You almost hear in Marks's
account of this

that he's still in disbelief

that his friends really didn't
have the same plan in mind.

It wasn't about robbing
these two people.

They wanted to kill.

It was maybe indulging in
and giving in on a fantasy

and an urge that they had both
had for some time.

He is saying, "I'm not
using being a sociopath as

an excuse,"

but he does disclose that
he had the bad childhood,

which I feel is an excuse
or some mitigation.

I think that he's also
just grandiose,

and he wants to show them
how smart he is.

Look, I have insight
into myself.

Here's who I am.

SAHNI:
What we know about Gribble

is in 2007, he had been
in trouble

for sexually harassing
and inappropriately

touching someone.

And in the process, his family
took him to see a therapist.

One of the things that emerged
was that he was off the scales

high and elevated in
the domain that we think of as

sociopathy or psychopathy.

Oftentimes in media,
we hear interchangeably

the term psychopath,
the term sociopath.

And it's important to realize
that for us as

forensic experts,
we talk about it as psychopathy,

but they are the same terms.

DET 2: Yeah.

GRIBBLE: Umm...

FOX: Gribble is almost, uh,
minimizing his culpability.

He's saying,
"I'm not like that.

"I'm a better guy.

I just kill, and I just
get it over with."

And it almost sounds like
he's trying to juxtapose himself

with a way worse person,

belittling the fact that
this was a gruesome,

horrific murder.

He's reliving it almost
like somebody would be

feeling joy when
they're retelling

about a family vacation.

He clearly enjoyed this,
despite the butchery

and just how sadistic
and inhumane this was,

and yet he's enjoying it.

And it's clear,
as he's telling investigators,

I imagine if we could watch
him as he's telling it,

he'd be smiling.

SAHNI: The fact that Gribble's
first thought is to go back to

the fantasy of
a horror movie

really speaks to the fact
that these guys do

not live in reality.

They have really fused what is
play-acting and made for TV

and movies and violence that
is contrived for entertainment

purposes to that being
their script.

Their way of navigating
the world is this script

that they have crafted.

These teenagers
can't wait to get home

and see whether
there's any buzz.

They follow the news closely,
they start talking to their

friends about what they did, and
that's where we really start to

see the ego and the self-focus
that this was a thrill kill.

What is important in
this explanation he gives

the detective is
while on the surface,

it sounds like there's
a little empathy for this

child victim, he then
very skillfully and sadly

turns this all back
to himself.

And that's where
we see the narcissism.

It's now about his own
traumatic experiences,

his life as he sees it.

TUSSEY: Individuals with
psychopathic traits do seek

stimulation, and they also
may get an adrenaline

rush from hurting other people,
or, you know,

they get a thrill and a rush
out of seeking opportunities

that benefit them.

Had Gribble
not gotten caught,

there are so many red flags
that this would be

a repeat offense,
that he could engage

in this type of
behavior again.

SAVOY: Um...

Marks and Glover were
attracted to Spader.

They weren't bothered
by the idea of doing

a home invasion.

They weren't concerned about
their future, and they had

a more antisocial outlook in
life -- where Gribble fits into

this is that Gribble and Spader
went back to childhood.

Their families went to church
together, but somehow, that

disturbed thinking of homicidal
urges was the nexus that may

have bonded Spader
with Gribble.

TUSSEY: Christopher Gribble
and Steven Spader seemed to be

like-minded in some ways,

very interested in looking out
for number one,

very interested in achieving
whatever they want to achieve,

however they need to do it,

robbing or hurting people
if they need to.

So it may be, you know,

in a sense that individuals
with similar psychopathic

traits sort of gravitate
toward one another.

SAHNI: Once we escalate to
trial, and we move forward,

Gribble makes claims
that he's insane.

What we see is this complete
failure to take responsibility

and a lack of willingness
to take responsibility

for his crime.

GRIBBLE: I wanted to get out
and have a real social life.

I wanted to torture
my mom to death.

I'd get to the point at night
where I just really wanted to

sneak in my dad's bedroom,

pull the gun out,
and shoot myself in the head,

because I just
wanted it to end.

MAN: You actually told
Dr. Drukteinis about a month ago

that the people in the jail have
no idea how dangerous you are.

No, they don't.

I smile,
because it's funny that all

the people in there have no idea
who they're messing with.

TUSSEY: So he's talking
about wanting the social life

that he was deprived of,

but it's another
indication of trying to

reject responsibility,
like this wasn't all me.

Look, I'm a product
of my environment.

I'm a product of
my upbringing.

You know, I think
this is performative.

I think he's enjoying
being on the stage,

so to speak,
of the courtroom.

WOMAN: I could go on for days
and days

and days about the depth of
your depravity.

But it is sufficient to say
that you belong in a cage.