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Never give the jury a chance to think
that you're not devoted.
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Or the media. The fact that the jury
sequestered doesn't matter. Newspapers
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through, television too.
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They'll say he came to kill her that
night. We'll say he came to see her the
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of. They'll say he got scratched while
attacking her. We'll say she scratched
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him while making love.
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They'll say, where's the semen?
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We'll say, A, she took a bath.
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B, he wore a condom.
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Every red herring has to be covered.
They'll be running them up flagpoles, I
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guarantee it. What about the shoe?
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We'll see as we go.
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Hair, prints, fibers.
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Nothing we can't explain.
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We gotta take out the mother. Those
threats come in.
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Are you set on that?
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Yes, but don't figure to suppress.
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And if we don't suppress, figure the
mother to testify first.
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They might lead with DNA.
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I'm not leading off with the DNA. It'll
put the jury to sleep. We go with the
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victim's mother. She's ready.
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I've been over her testimony up and
down.
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How can I not testify? I'm not saying
you won't, but the decision doesn't have
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to be made yet. If they don't make their
case, we don't give them the chance to
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take wax at you.
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You set?
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I'm set.
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Bobby.
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Almost three months.
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You've never asked me if I'm innocent.
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I am.
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I am.
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Expedited transcripts every single day.
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All right, we're ready. You ready?
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Okay.
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That doctor cut off Cindy Mark's head.
Now we go after him.
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You're the same reporter who's been
calling. You don't think I know your
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Do you recognize my clip?
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Some of the expected juice has dripped
away, Janet. It seems D .A. Gamble and
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defense attorney Donald are no longer
romantic partners.
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Sources say other than trial
correspondence, communication has been
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between them.
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Figure the dialogue to heat up this
morning, though. The subject of the
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pretrial, whether or not Lorraine Marks
gets to testify about the threats.
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Dr. Winslow made to her daughter.
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It isn't just hearsay, it's totem pole.
It would be reversible error to allow
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it. Your Honor, these statements would
clearly be exempted from the hearsay
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rule. Clear to whom? Cindy Marks was in
an excited state when she said these
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things. We're not just dealing with
Cindy Marks' statements to her mother.
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dealing with supposed statements made by
my client to Cindy Marks. I don't care
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how excited she was when she was talking
to her mother. She was passing things
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on that he said to her. That's hearsay
too. His statements would be
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against... Come on, Helen. I know you
went to law school. I was there. I
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to that.
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All right. I've heard enough.
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The testimony of Mrs. Marks is
admissible.
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Opening statements after lunch.
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Adjourned.
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An extremely big win for the
prosecution, Jim.
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Absolutely. The victim's mother
establishes motive. The prosecution can
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prove the affair. That's not a problem.
But motive to kill?
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The threats to kill, that all comes from
Lorraine Marks, and she could be very
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tough for the defense to crack.
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I apologize.
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Not just because we're asking you to
take time out from your families and
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lives, but because we're asking you to
focus on the very worst human nature has
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to offer.
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Murder.
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This is a gruesome, sickening crime.
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He cut off her head.
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He chopped off her hands.
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And as we go through the facts of this
case, it will be difficult.
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It will be painful.
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Painful to face a reality that sometimes
underneath coats and ties and well
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-groomed appearances, there lie
murderers.
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There lies one here.
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Yes, there was sex and love.
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And passion.
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Jeffrey Winslow was having an affair
with the victim. Listen to the
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prosecution's case closely. All it will
prove is what I just told you. My client
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had an affair with Cindy Marks. That's
all they've got.
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Because that's all there is.
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Yes, somebody did kill her.
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But it wasn't Jeffrey Winslow.
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So this telephone conversation took
place when, ma 'am? Three days before
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was killed.
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She called you?
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No. I'd called her.
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And I saw that she was very upset. Did
she tell you why she was upset?
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She didn't want to discuss it.
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Cindy and I never really communicated
much on her private life, since I
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disapproved of it.
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So she never told you the cause of her
being upset?
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Eventually, she did.
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When I pressed her on it.
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She told me. She said her relationship
with Dr. Winslow was becoming ugly,
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volatile. She said she wanted to make
public their involvement, and he
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threatened her. He said if she tried to
expose the affair, that he would stop
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her. Did she say anything else, Mrs.
Marks? Yes.
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She said she was scared that he might
hurt her.
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Thank you, Mrs. Marks.
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You said she never liked to discuss her
private life with you.
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Yes. Might she go so far as to conceal
her personal life from you?
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She might.
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Given that your daughter might conceal
her personal life from you, is it
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possible that she was also seeing
somebody else in addition to my client
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would try to conceal that?
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I suppose it's possible.
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You see that man sitting there?
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Who is he?
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His name is Kenneth Fuller.
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He's Cindy's ex -husband.
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Could you describe your feelings for
him?
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Not good.
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Not good.
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Would it be fair to say that you dislike
him a lot?
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That would be fair. Your daughter knew
that?
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No uncertain terms.
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Suppose, Mrs. Marsh, just suppose your
daughter resumed the relationship with
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this man.
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Do you disapprove?
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Strongly. Strongly.
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Knowing that, is it possible Cindy would
want to hide that fact from you? Your
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Honor, I... Is it possible that Kenneth
Fuller was the one that was threatening
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her? She said in her hysteria, she just
blurted out my client's name. She wasn't
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hysterical. She was out of control,
ranting. No, she wasn't ranting. She was
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calm and collected. And she very clearly
said that it was that man who was
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threatening her.
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So she was calm and collected.
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Yes.
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Your Honor, at the time we now move to
strike the hearsay testimony of the
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witness, the excited utterance exception
no longer applies.
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Sidebar. I'm afraid not.
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Members of the jury, I'll try to make
the lesson short. The fact that the
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made these alleged statements while calm
instead of agitated makes a big legal
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difference. Bottom line, they're no
longer admissible.
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That means there is no evidence before
you that a relationship was turning
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There is no evidence of any threat. As
far as you're concerned,
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those threats never happened.
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Helen, you told me she was prepped. You
said you went up and down with her. I
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did. He spun her. She's not a rocket
scientist.
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We're the ones who look stupid. The jury
still heard it. Legally, it may be
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excluded, but the jury still heard what
she said. I can't argue it in my closing
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argument now. There is a lot of DNA
scientific crap between now and the time
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that jury goes to deliberate.
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And I can't hammer those threats in my
closing argument now, can I?
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Miss Trott.
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It's an option. Since the trial's only a
day old, there's a chance we could
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still get it.
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And why would we want to do that?
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Because the jury did hear about the
threats, and it's a tough bell to
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And the next jury wouldn't hear about
them. Okay, then why not ask for a
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mistrial? Why not is because the
prosecution came out stumbling. First
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impressions count, and I think their
case is so circumstantial to begin with.
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say we keep going. If we let them start
over, we give them time to regroup.
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Plus, they could do more discovery.
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I'm with Lindsay.
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Who's next?
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Pathologist. Mine.
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You ready?
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Bobby, you walk around all day asking,
are you ready? Are you ready? Of course
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I'm ready. We are all ready.
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Okay.
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No mistrial.
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We keep going.
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Bobby, what's the matter?
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I don't know.
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Something just doesn't smell right.
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You made a determination that the
killing was the work of a copycat.
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Yes, upon doing the autopsy.
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How did the autopsy tell you this?
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Well, the victim was killed by trauma to
the head, though it was made to look
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like a stabbing, which would be
consistent with the poet.
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Also, we found that Miss Mark's wounds
were more clinical.
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What do you mean, clinical?
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Ligaments were incised individually.
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The person who did it cut through the
soft tissue.
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Meaning what?
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Meaning this likely was the work of a
doctor, perhaps a skilled surgeon.
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Settle.
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Anything else, doctor?
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Yes, though there was evidence of
intercourse.
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There was no bruising to suggest rape.
And what conclusions, if any, did you
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draw from this?
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That the victim consented to the
intercourse.
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I believe she knew the person who killed
her.
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Thank you, doctor.
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Did your written report ever say this
was the work of a surgeon?
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No. And you can't positively exclude the
poet, can you?
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No, but the evidence would suggest... Is
the poet still at large?
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Yes.
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You say that Cindy died from trauma to
the head. How exactly did you determine
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that?
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From the skull fracture on the left
temporal lobe. The head had been cut
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Yes. Anybody ever drop it on the floor?
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That wasn't the fracture I'm talking
about. Did you ever see anybody drop
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Cindy's head on the floor, doctor?
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The head inadvertently rolled off the
autopsy table.
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Hit the floor?
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That's not the trauma that caused her
death, counsel.
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I see.
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You say the absence of vaginal bruising
suggests consensual intercourse.
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Yes. Ever known a rape to occur with no
vaginal bruising? The probabilities are
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that... Does it ever happen? What
happened, doctor? Rape, no bruises, can
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happen? Yes. So it's entirely possible
that Cindy Marks was raped and murdered
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by a non -doctor. That's possible, am I
right? Possible, but not likely in my
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opinion. Yes, yes, your opinion, the
suspicion of yours that a surgeon did
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killing.
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When exactly did you come up with this?
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At the autopsy. At the autopsy. And did
you share it with the district attorney?
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Yes. When?
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Objection. Work product.
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Overruled. When did you tell the
district attorney about your suspicion
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killer was a surgeon?
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I told her around the time of the
autopsy. But you didn't write it down.
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No. Did she ask you not to write it
down?
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Objection. Was the suspicion hatched
between the both of you yesterday?
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Objection. I mean, with all the counsel.
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Approach.
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She has the duty to turn over all
inculpatory evidence. I did.
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Testimony that it was the work of a
surgeon. Tasty little tidbit to leave
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Anyone knew this witness was going to be
saying copycat? We didn't know he was
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going to be saying surgeon.
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All right.
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That testimony should be stricken. I
said all right. It's an unfair surprise
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we would have known. Counsel, this is my
courtroom.
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I don't like it, but I'm not striking
it. Your Honor. I've made my ruling step
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back.
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You get the hell out of my face.
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Hey, nice spring job, Helen.
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Don't you ever accuse me of hatching.
Oh, come on. You sat down and you know
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All right, let's save it for the picnic,
shall we? Hey, hey, we were here first.
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Mr. Donald, do you have any comments? No
comment, no comment.
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We can't not introduce the shoe print,
Helen. I want to hold it for rebuttal.
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For rebuttal, Winslow might not even
take the stand. I'll take that bet.
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Helen, we don't have the greatest case
here. Exactly. We don't have the
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case. We need to catch him in a lie.
Which we can't do if he doesn't testify.
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Scott.
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How are we doing?
240
00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:02,920
We can't lose this one, Helen.
241
00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:09,380
We need to put in the shoe.
242
00:14:12,900 --> 00:14:17,060
All right. DNA is next. We have nothing
to fear there. Let them talk.
243
00:14:17,500 --> 00:14:21,260
Nobody fidgets or looks worried. If
anything, look forward. Send a message
244
00:14:21,260 --> 00:14:22,400
the jury. This stuff doesn't matter.
245
00:14:24,180 --> 00:14:26,340
Does anyone here besides me think he did
it?
246
00:14:29,300 --> 00:14:34,460
I'm sorry, but does anyone here even
have a theory as to who else?
247
00:14:34,740 --> 00:14:36,280
Karen. What, Jeffrey, what?
248
00:14:38,400 --> 00:14:42,180
I know you have every right to doubt me.
Oh, you're wrong, Jeffrey. I don't
249
00:14:42,180 --> 00:14:46,330
doubt you for a second. Okay, so we have
some excitement here. Look, Karen...
250
00:14:46,330 --> 00:14:48,470
And don't you give me that devoted wife
pitch again.
251
00:14:50,650 --> 00:14:52,650
Karen, why don't you and I go take a
break?
252
00:15:01,590 --> 00:15:02,590
Great.
253
00:15:13,290 --> 00:15:15,070
We have to decide whether you're going
to testify.
254
00:15:17,450 --> 00:15:18,950
Do you think he killed her?
255
00:15:20,810 --> 00:15:21,950
No, of course not.
256
00:15:23,990 --> 00:15:26,150
I'm sorry. Sitting in that room today,
listening.
257
00:15:26,590 --> 00:15:28,610
Karen, I know. I can't do it.
258
00:15:30,510 --> 00:15:32,490
I can't play the adoring wife anymore.
259
00:15:32,990 --> 00:15:37,970
Ever since this happened, I've been
pretending that I stand by him, that
260
00:15:42,920 --> 00:15:48,960
I feel dirty walking in the room with
him, holding his hand.
261
00:15:51,140 --> 00:15:54,520
He betrayed me, and I can't pretend
anymore.
262
00:15:55,020 --> 00:15:56,200
Karen, listen to me.
263
00:15:56,780 --> 00:16:00,800
We have a murder trial, and we have a
marriage. And unfortunately, for the
264
00:16:00,800 --> 00:16:05,160
of the trial, we have to send a signal
that the marriage is okay. This tells
265
00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:06,160
jury something.
266
00:16:07,680 --> 00:16:09,820
If you believe that he's innocent,
267
00:16:11,699 --> 00:16:12,699
Murder -wise.
268
00:16:13,440 --> 00:16:17,700
Then you have to pretend marriage -wise
just for a little bit longer, Karen.
269
00:16:21,300 --> 00:16:22,300
Okay.
270
00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:24,920
Okay.
271
00:16:27,880 --> 00:16:30,220
They never actually checked out the
mother, at least not much.
272
00:16:30,580 --> 00:16:33,580
You really think that she could
decapitate her own daughter?
273
00:16:34,220 --> 00:16:36,220
No. But they didn't like each other.
274
00:16:37,340 --> 00:16:39,980
And, Bobby, now that the surgeon's done
everything, we might have to start
275
00:16:39,980 --> 00:16:41,140
suggesting other suspects.
276
00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:44,420
No, that's too dangerous. Burden's on
them. We don't offer anything we can't
277
00:16:44,420 --> 00:16:47,720
prove. Yeah, well, our consultants say
we have to respond to the threats, too.
278
00:16:47,820 --> 00:16:51,420
Admissible or not, they think it's a
problem. Which means Jeffrey would have
279
00:16:51,420 --> 00:16:53,600
testify, which is what I think Helen
wants.
280
00:16:57,380 --> 00:16:58,380
What?
281
00:17:08,300 --> 00:17:09,300
Right in front of our faces.
282
00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:14,359
I don't know what it is.
283
00:17:18,420 --> 00:17:21,480
As you can see, the nucleotides link up.
284
00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:24,819
We have an exact genetic matchup with
the defendant.
285
00:17:25,500 --> 00:17:27,460
And this was from skin samples?
286
00:17:27,700 --> 00:17:29,440
Found underneath her fingernails, yes.
287
00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:33,960
The hair samples found on the bed also
line up in matching sequences.
288
00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:37,540
Doctor, can you crunch all this for us?
289
00:17:38,670 --> 00:17:40,670
The defendant was in her apartment.
290
00:17:41,010 --> 00:17:43,650
But DNA can't establish that he killed
her.
291
00:17:44,050 --> 00:17:45,350
Only that he was there.
292
00:17:46,870 --> 00:17:49,910
Yes. It was a prior victim of the poet.
293
00:17:50,310 --> 00:17:55,390
And Dr. Knopfel, the defendant had
access to the autopsy report on this
294
00:17:55,950 --> 00:17:56,950
Yes, he did.
295
00:17:57,350 --> 00:18:01,570
Because it was a prior victim of the
poet, the autopsy report was faxed all
296
00:18:01,570 --> 00:18:05,090
your hospital, wasn't it? It was juicy
copy and a lot of people had it.
297
00:18:05,730 --> 00:18:06,730
Yes.
298
00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:11,800
Do the hospital phone records show any
outgoing call to Dr. Winslow's residence
299
00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:12,980
the evening of the murder?
300
00:18:13,300 --> 00:18:17,780
No. And if somebody did call him down to
the hospital, your phone records would
301
00:18:17,780 --> 00:18:18,960
indicate that? Yeah.
302
00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:22,040
Anybody in the hospital have personal
cell phones?
303
00:18:23,360 --> 00:18:24,360
Yes.
304
00:18:26,360 --> 00:18:27,860
Is that it, Ms. Gamble?
305
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:31,840
Put the shoe in now, Helen.
306
00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:34,000
If Winslow doesn't testify, they could
rest.
307
00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:36,480
Reasonable doubt. We have not made our
case.
308
00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:40,780
Prosecution would like to call one last
witness.
309
00:18:43,940 --> 00:18:44,940
Kenneth Fuller.
310
00:18:45,940 --> 00:18:49,660
Your Honor, this witness is not on their
list. He was included in a prior
311
00:18:49,660 --> 00:18:53,460
pretrial list. Which had 200 names on
it. Get up here, both of you.
312
00:18:58,160 --> 00:18:59,280
Technically, they have noticed.
313
00:18:59,540 --> 00:19:01,240
This is a revised list.
314
00:19:01,610 --> 00:19:05,130
As an officer of this court, I will
state right now that nothing I ask this
315
00:19:05,130 --> 00:19:08,170
witness will constitute unfair surprise.
The testimony could be worthless. It
316
00:19:08,170 --> 00:19:08,989
might bother.
317
00:19:08,990 --> 00:19:11,330
Because I'm playing a hunch, I'm
entitled to do that.
318
00:19:11,670 --> 00:19:16,490
All right, I'll see where it goes. If
you want to adjourn after the prepared
319
00:19:16,490 --> 00:19:19,130
cross, I'll give it to you. Stop your
whining.
320
00:19:22,470 --> 00:19:23,470
Mr. Fuller.
321
00:19:27,760 --> 00:19:31,240
We've already learned a little bit about
you from your ex -mother -in -law. You
322
00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:34,060
had a bad marriage with Cindy Marks. You
could say that.
323
00:19:34,660 --> 00:19:39,040
Forgive me for saying this, sir, but you
seem like a scary guy.
324
00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:43,720
Objection! Sustained. Is that where
you're going? He looks scary?
325
00:19:44,620 --> 00:19:45,620
Actually, yes.
326
00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:50,080
Mr. Fuller, you've been in this
courtroom every day of the trial.
327
00:19:50,460 --> 00:19:51,760
Anybody ask you to come?
328
00:19:52,260 --> 00:19:53,260
Objection!
329
00:19:53,660 --> 00:19:56,560
Overruled. Anybody perhaps pay you to be
sitting here?
330
00:19:56,960 --> 00:19:58,000
Objection, work product.
331
00:19:58,580 --> 00:20:01,000
Work product? Your Honor, she is going
fishing.
332
00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:04,720
She's trying to get a communications
between the witness and my office. It's
333
00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:06,060
work product and it's inadmissible.
334
00:20:06,300 --> 00:20:08,000
I think I'd like to ask myself.
335
00:20:10,540 --> 00:20:13,480
Has anyone paid you to come here, Mr.
Fuller?
336
00:20:16,140 --> 00:20:19,840
You're under oath, sir. Has anyone paid
you to come to this courtroom?
337
00:20:22,300 --> 00:20:23,300
Mr. Berluti.
338
00:20:24,780 --> 00:20:25,780
Him.
339
00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:29,580
How much?
340
00:20:31,700 --> 00:20:32,760
$5 ,000.
341
00:20:37,060 --> 00:20:39,600
And were you given any special
instructions?
342
00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:41,440
Just sit here.
343
00:20:42,140 --> 00:20:43,700
It looked like I could have killed her.
344
00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:51,240
I have a legal right.
345
00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:54,840
Like hell you do. We all have our paid
consultants sitting out there, paid to
346
00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:58,840
sit in the room. Are you kidding? No,
I'm not kidding, Helen. Well, you should
347
00:20:58,840 --> 00:21:04,200
be. Paying that man to sit there as a
flame -red herring, it's the equivalent
348
00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:06,720
putting in false evidence. I mean, call
him to the stand.
349
00:21:07,940 --> 00:21:13,540
What has happened to you? Look, I'm
doing what I have to do to defend my
350
00:21:14,060 --> 00:21:17,680
I haven't broken any laws here, and I
demand that you instruct that jury that
351
00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:21,300
haven't. Well, I'm not going to do that.
Well, then basically you just condemn
352
00:21:21,300 --> 00:21:24,960
me in front of them. And I'd do it
again, and I'd love to do it more
353
00:21:25,380 --> 00:21:27,280
But I don't want to hand you a mistrial.
354
00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:32,140
That little trick was despicable. Oh,
and you don't think that she does that?
355
00:21:32,260 --> 00:21:33,260
I'm talking now.
356
00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:39,640
You're right. Technically, you get to
slide by, but barely, Bobby.
357
00:21:45,390 --> 00:21:48,130
You told her. I didn't tell her. Why
don't you just pluck that out of the
358
00:21:48,230 --> 00:21:51,430
Lindsay? She's smart, Bobby. Oh, please.
Don't you go accusing him. Oh, thank
359
00:21:51,430 --> 00:21:56,610
you, Rebecca. You want to take over the
case now? It was stupid. You had the
360
00:21:56,610 --> 00:21:59,910
case won and you know you did. And now
that jury isn't going to trust a thing
361
00:21:59,910 --> 00:22:01,430
you say. And why should they? All right.
362
00:22:02,370 --> 00:22:05,570
Let's not turn on each other. The case
hasn't gotten any better and the burden
363
00:22:05,570 --> 00:22:06,570
is on them.
364
00:22:06,710 --> 00:22:10,450
Well, we certainly can't rest on that
note. No, we can't. We got to put on a
365
00:22:10,450 --> 00:22:11,450
defense.
366
00:22:11,750 --> 00:22:12,750
Is Karen ready?
367
00:22:13,970 --> 00:22:14,970
Yeah.
368
00:22:18,190 --> 00:22:20,390
Do you remember what time your husband
left the house?
369
00:22:21,010 --> 00:22:22,370
A few minutes past ten.
370
00:22:22,570 --> 00:22:23,570
And when he returned?
371
00:22:24,010 --> 00:22:25,850
Around midnight. I was still awake.
372
00:22:26,190 --> 00:22:28,470
Can you please describe his demeanor for
the court?
373
00:22:28,710 --> 00:22:29,710
It was normal.
374
00:22:30,150 --> 00:22:33,610
He complained that the page was
unnecessary, that I could have waited
375
00:22:33,610 --> 00:22:34,930
morning. But he was calm?
376
00:22:35,330 --> 00:22:36,730
Yes. His usual self?
377
00:22:37,210 --> 00:22:41,410
Yes. Mrs. Winslow, can you tell us how
long it takes to get from Weston to Math
378
00:22:41,410 --> 00:22:42,670
General where your husband works?
379
00:22:43,020 --> 00:22:47,320
At that hour, you can make it in about
35 minutes. So he would need an hour and
380
00:22:47,320 --> 00:22:48,320
10 minutes travel time?
381
00:22:48,580 --> 00:22:49,580
Right.
382
00:22:52,860 --> 00:22:56,240
Mrs. Winslow, are you angry at your
husband?
383
00:22:57,820 --> 00:23:01,280
I don't know if anger is a strong enough
word.
384
00:23:04,340 --> 00:23:05,400
Do I love him?
385
00:23:07,060 --> 00:23:08,060
Yes.
386
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:10,420
But do I also hate him?
387
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:21,660
But despite your angry feelings, here
today you sit testifying on his behalf.
388
00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:24,640
I've slept by that man's side for 12
years.
389
00:23:26,420 --> 00:23:28,580
I know him as well as I know myself.
390
00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:34,640
It is inconceivable that he could have
committed what he's been accused of.
391
00:23:34,900 --> 00:23:36,160
You seem pretty sure.
392
00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:41,560
Whatever is false, he is not a murderer.
393
00:23:53,450 --> 00:23:56,510
Say you know him. You didn't know he was
having an affair, though, did you?
394
00:23:57,510 --> 00:23:58,510
No.
395
00:23:58,710 --> 00:24:01,790
So he is able to conceal certain truths
from you, isn't he?
396
00:24:02,170 --> 00:24:03,690
He didn't kill that woman.
397
00:24:04,150 --> 00:24:07,110
Who is this person sitting in the second
row by the aisle?
398
00:24:07,490 --> 00:24:09,070
Beverly Walton. She's my neighbor.
399
00:24:09,270 --> 00:24:12,670
The day of your husband's arrest, did
you tell her you thought your husband
400
00:24:12,670 --> 00:24:13,790
kill Cindy Marks?
401
00:24:15,650 --> 00:24:20,670
Did you tell Beverly Walton you thought
your husband did murder Cindy Marks?
402
00:24:22,990 --> 00:24:25,550
I was still in shock over the affair.
403
00:24:26,010 --> 00:24:30,050
I was speaking out of hurt and anger.
You did say that.
404
00:24:30,350 --> 00:24:34,190
I was lashing out. I didn't mean you...
You sit here today saying it's
405
00:24:34,190 --> 00:24:38,390
inconceivable for your husband to commit
murder, and yet to this woman you said
406
00:24:38,390 --> 00:24:40,290
he probably did commit murder.
407
00:24:40,510 --> 00:24:42,110
I don't think he killed her.
408
00:24:42,750 --> 00:24:43,950
There was a context.
409
00:24:44,230 --> 00:24:45,450
There was a tongue then.
410
00:24:45,910 --> 00:24:47,030
Objection. Sustained.
411
00:24:47,550 --> 00:24:50,470
Mrs. Winslow, you also testified to
timeline.
412
00:24:50,970 --> 00:24:51,970
Two hours.
413
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:54,220
10 to midnight hour commute.
414
00:24:54,860 --> 00:24:58,480
Do you remember speaking with me and
Detective McCrew the day after the
415
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:04,780
Yes. Did you not tell us then that your
husband returned home around 1 a .m.? I
416
00:25:04,780 --> 00:25:05,599
was wrong.
417
00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:06,600
It was 12.
418
00:25:06,740 --> 00:25:09,360
You were wrong the day after you said 1.
419
00:25:10,300 --> 00:25:13,160
But three months later at trial, your
memory is fresher.
420
00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:17,360
I didn't remember saying that.
421
00:25:18,820 --> 00:25:20,240
I didn't remember.
422
00:25:20,970 --> 00:25:24,410
All right, let's not panic. We still got
a long way to go. Let's not panic?
423
00:25:25,090 --> 00:25:30,090
My own wife shouts out to somebody, he
did it, let's not panic? Come on,
424
00:25:30,090 --> 00:25:31,090
Jeffrey.
425
00:25:32,430 --> 00:25:33,430
Did you kill her?
426
00:25:34,470 --> 00:25:36,530
You did, didn't you? You killed her.
427
00:25:36,950 --> 00:25:40,070
You retain everything, Karen.
428
00:25:40,870 --> 00:25:44,950
You wouldn't forget saying he did it to
Beverly? You wouldn't forget saying
429
00:25:44,950 --> 00:25:46,290
about 1 a .m.?
430
00:25:48,709 --> 00:25:50,450
Maybe you did know about the affair.
431
00:25:51,110 --> 00:25:53,630
What a perfect revenge that would be,
wouldn't it?
432
00:25:53,970 --> 00:25:56,590
Are you out of your mind? Maybe I am!
433
00:25:57,650 --> 00:26:01,430
All of this, pretending to be by my
side, and then you get up there on the
434
00:26:01,430 --> 00:26:01,910
and...
435
00:26:01,910 --> 00:26:10,310
Now,
436
00:26:10,310 --> 00:26:15,990
maybe you... Maybe you went up there
knowing full well that the DA would kick
437
00:26:15,990 --> 00:26:17,350
you to pieces on cross.
438
00:26:19,129 --> 00:26:20,270
Perfect, Karen.
439
00:26:20,590 --> 00:26:21,590
Perfect.
440
00:26:22,990 --> 00:26:23,990
Oh.
441
00:26:24,430 --> 00:26:26,910
Oh, I get it.
442
00:26:28,390 --> 00:26:32,810
I'm supposed to think, wow, for him to
accuse me, he really must be innocent.
443
00:26:34,730 --> 00:26:38,090
Is that what you want me to think? Is
that what this little tantrum is about?
444
00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:46,020
Trial has been suspended for the rest of
the day, but tomorrow will be the day
445
00:26:46,020 --> 00:26:47,780
everyone has been salivating for.
446
00:26:47,980 --> 00:26:51,500
Jeffrey Winslow is scheduled to climb
into that witness chair.
447
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:00,060
Where is he? With Jimmy and Eugene.
448
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:01,320
Mock testimony.
449
00:27:01,660 --> 00:27:04,060
Bobby, have we even thought about a
plea? A plea?
450
00:27:04,340 --> 00:27:11,140
They still haven't made their case.
Why... Becky. You
451
00:27:11,140 --> 00:27:13,040
probably have the most distance. Where's
your head?
452
00:27:15,120 --> 00:27:18,420
Beyond a reasonable doubt, I don't know.
But I definitely think the guy did it.
453
00:27:19,140 --> 00:27:21,720
Maybe we should just throw out a feeler,
see if there's anything to even
454
00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:22,720
consider.
455
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:28,600
Not a chance.
456
00:27:28,740 --> 00:27:31,900
Helen, you haven't even come close to
satisfying burden of truth. Then why are
457
00:27:31,900 --> 00:27:33,700
you here? Because the stakes are so
high.
458
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:37,580
Murder, too, is the best you get. That's
automatic life. Why would we even think
459
00:27:37,580 --> 00:27:40,680
about that? He chopped her into pieces.
What are you looking for, a battery?
460
00:27:40,780 --> 00:27:42,160
Should we just write him a little
speeding ticket?
461
00:27:42,460 --> 00:27:44,200
This is more about beating me, isn't it?
462
00:27:44,540 --> 00:27:45,540
Beating you is extra.
463
00:27:46,380 --> 00:27:48,620
Helen, maybe you're not seeing straight.
464
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:51,340
You haven't done so great on the
elements here. You have to know that.
465
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:52,720
Then I'll lose.
466
00:27:59,260 --> 00:28:01,180
I know Helen Gamble well enough.
467
00:28:01,660 --> 00:28:04,920
She's got another card in her hand. Only
you can know what it is.
468
00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:08,180
I don't. You screw me, you screw
yourself.
469
00:28:08,860 --> 00:28:11,960
If I'm going to save you from life in
prison, tell me what I don't know,
470
00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:13,520
I guarantee you, she knows.
471
00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:16,840
Tell me now!
472
00:28:22,380 --> 00:28:26,920
I went there that night.
473
00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:33,380
I made love to her in the afternoon, and
I went back at night to see her.
474
00:28:34,940 --> 00:28:38,820
And I saw her like that.
475
00:28:39,060 --> 00:28:40,060
Like what?
476
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:42,040
Dead.
477
00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:44,160
All cut up.
478
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:46,960
Her head.
479
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:50,680
I saw it.
480
00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:57,720
But I didn't do it, Bobby. I didn't.
What did you do then?
481
00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:00,080
I just left.
482
00:29:01,160 --> 00:29:02,160
I went home.
483
00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:04,400
I was afraid.
484
00:29:05,260 --> 00:29:09,220
I thought that if I called the police,
the affair would be on the front page.
485
00:29:09,340 --> 00:29:11,220
Eugene, Jimmy. Bobby, I...
486
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:17,920
He was there the night of the murder.
Helen knows it. How she knows it has to
487
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:20,860
in those discovery documents. Otherwise,
she'd be guaranteeing a mistrial.
488
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,640
I don't understand. If she knew he was
there that night, why didn't she put it
489
00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:26,660
into evidence? She didn't want us to be
able to explain it. She was counting on
490
00:29:26,660 --> 00:29:30,060
you taking the stand and saying you
weren't there that night under oath.
491
00:29:30,980 --> 00:29:33,980
Then she springs what she's got in
rebuttal. She's caught you in a lie and
492
00:29:33,980 --> 00:29:36,720
you're dead. I don't know, man. That's a
little dicey.
493
00:29:49,500 --> 00:29:55,220
What? In the DNA discovery, she turned
over hair, blood, prints, hand, and
494
00:29:55,940 --> 00:29:57,640
Turned to the supplemental discovery.
495
00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:02,520
Blood on floor. You stepped in blood.
That's what she's got.
496
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:06,960
Footprints. So technically she's covered
with the discovery rules. But she
497
00:30:06,960 --> 00:30:07,960
played hard to ball.
498
00:30:07,980 --> 00:30:09,620
They did take my shoes when they
searched.
499
00:30:09,940 --> 00:30:11,920
Okay, okay. We play this straight.
500
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:15,980
We just defuse her cannon before she
ever gets to shoot it. Come on, we'll go
501
00:30:15,980 --> 00:30:16,980
over your testimony on the way.
502
00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:18,320
Let's go.
503
00:30:34,030 --> 00:30:35,030
We made love.
504
00:30:35,130 --> 00:30:36,130
Then I went home.
505
00:30:36,470 --> 00:30:37,890
In the middle of the afternoon?
506
00:30:38,210 --> 00:30:39,210
Yes.
507
00:30:39,770 --> 00:30:42,590
And that's why you had these scratches
on your back?
508
00:30:42,810 --> 00:30:48,850
Yes. Now, Doctor, I need to ask the
question everybody in this room is
509
00:30:49,950 --> 00:30:52,990
Did you kill Cindy Marks?
510
00:30:53,270 --> 00:30:55,290
No, I didn't.
511
00:30:56,210 --> 00:31:00,150
I... This isn't easy to say in front of
my wife.
512
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:08,280
love cindy i could never do anything to
hurt her well you have to admit that
513
00:31:08,280 --> 00:31:12,140
it's it's a little coincidental that she
was killed on the same day that you
514
00:31:12,140 --> 00:31:16,240
were there i'm afraid it's a little more
incriminating than that mr donald i'm
515
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:22,780
ashamed to say this because i didn't
report it but uh ashamed to say what i
516
00:31:22,780 --> 00:31:29,760
back to the house that night you went
back there yes i walked
517
00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:30,760
in
518
00:31:33,550 --> 00:31:34,550
She was dead.
519
00:31:36,930 --> 00:31:40,010
There was blood everywhere.
520
00:31:41,310 --> 00:31:42,830
We were having an affair.
521
00:31:43,430 --> 00:31:47,390
I was afraid of the implications and the
publicity, so I panicked and I went
522
00:31:47,390 --> 00:31:48,390
home.
523
00:31:49,130 --> 00:31:52,530
But I swear, I didn't kill her.
524
00:31:53,390 --> 00:31:54,390
I didn't.
525
00:31:57,590 --> 00:31:58,610
Thank you, Doctor.
526
00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:25,400
Voluntary manslaughter, eight years.
527
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:26,840
Take it or leave it.
528
00:32:26,960 --> 00:32:29,040
Too late, Helen. I can still win that.
529
00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:32,760
You know, it was a nice try burying the
shoe prints you thought you'd get him in
530
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:35,360
a lie. I guess that's what happens when
you play dirty.
531
00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:41,160
Oh, I play dirty? You pay the ex
-husband. You imply false evidence. You
532
00:32:41,160 --> 00:32:45,280
probably quote that piece of poetry we
just heard. Go away and get your eyes on
533
00:32:45,280 --> 00:32:47,500
everything they say about you. You're
sleazy.
534
00:33:01,399 --> 00:33:02,399
Voluntary manslaughter.
535
00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:03,640
Take it or leave it.
536
00:33:19,620 --> 00:33:20,840
You got a shot, Helen.
537
00:33:22,180 --> 00:33:24,360
You cross -examined well.
538
00:33:25,100 --> 00:33:26,100
You got a shot.
539
00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:28,900
Now isn't the time to collapse.
540
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:30,400
I'm not about to collapse.
541
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:39,200
Who called you from the hospital that
night?
542
00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:42,360
Nobody. You never got a call to go to
the hospital?
543
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:47,080
I told my wife I did, but I was really
going to see Cindy. You lied to your
544
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:48,100
wife? Yes.
545
00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:51,660
You'd been lying to your wife for a year
about this affair?
546
00:33:52,140 --> 00:33:53,140
That's true.
547
00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:57,540
A person who lies is a liar. Would you
agree with that?
548
00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:00,020
I lied about some things.
549
00:34:00,340 --> 00:34:02,500
So by your own admission, you would be a
liar?
550
00:34:03,860 --> 00:34:04,860
Yes.
551
00:34:05,770 --> 00:34:10,530
Did you ever threaten to kill Cindy
Marks? No, I did not. Are you a liar,
552
00:34:10,650 --> 00:34:11,989
Winslow? Objection.
553
00:34:12,389 --> 00:34:17,170
Disdain. If Cindy Marks were to say she
feared physical danger from you, would
554
00:34:17,170 --> 00:34:18,129
she be a liar?
555
00:34:18,130 --> 00:34:19,310
She would certainly be mistaken.
556
00:34:19,570 --> 00:34:24,310
If Cindy Marks were to say she feared
physical danger from you, then three
557
00:34:24,310 --> 00:34:27,690
later turned up decapitated, that would
only be a little coincidence.
558
00:34:28,630 --> 00:34:32,250
Objection. There's no evidence of any
threats or any statements by Cindy Marks
559
00:34:32,250 --> 00:34:33,250
concerning threats.
560
00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:37,659
The objection is sustained. I don't want
to hear any more mention of threats,
561
00:34:38,100 --> 00:34:39,159
Ms. Gamble.
562
00:34:39,679 --> 00:34:42,440
You stated you loved Cindy Marks. Yes.
563
00:34:42,699 --> 00:34:44,260
You two were emotionally involved.
564
00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:46,159
Yes, I suppose so.
565
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:51,020
Upon discovering her dead and
dismembered body, you simply returned
566
00:34:51,020 --> 00:34:52,020
that your testimony?
567
00:34:52,060 --> 00:34:54,659
Yes. You never called the police.
568
00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:56,120
I explained that.
569
00:34:57,620 --> 00:35:00,320
And that doesn't mean that I wasn't
horrified by her death.
570
00:35:00,620 --> 00:35:02,180
You ever share your horror with anyone?
571
00:35:03,550 --> 00:35:07,770
No. The next day, what did you do?
572
00:35:09,030 --> 00:35:10,110
I went to work.
573
00:35:10,630 --> 00:35:12,650
Did you have a nice day at work, Doctor?
574
00:35:15,170 --> 00:35:21,830
After discovering the mutilated body of
someone you loved, when you decided not
575
00:35:21,830 --> 00:35:27,730
to notify the police, was it because you
were afraid of being implicated in the
576
00:35:27,730 --> 00:35:30,210
affair or implicated in her death?
577
00:35:30,610 --> 00:35:31,750
I suppose both.
578
00:35:32,590 --> 00:35:37,970
In your medical training, you did a
rotation in psychiatry. A long time ago.
579
00:35:37,970 --> 00:35:43,470
me ask you, in your experience, when a
person at a crime scene chooses to run
580
00:35:43,470 --> 00:35:47,910
from that crime scene, would that be
more an indication of innocence or of
581
00:35:47,910 --> 00:35:50,990
guilt? I am innocent.
582
00:35:51,450 --> 00:35:53,390
Are you a liar, Dr. Winslow?
583
00:35:54,030 --> 00:35:55,030
Objection!
584
00:36:08,540 --> 00:36:10,340
exactly where we started.
585
00:36:11,060 --> 00:36:15,420
He had an affair with her and he was at
the scene the night of her death.
586
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:18,280
That's all they've established, period.
587
00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:21,040
Do they have a fingerprint on the murder
weapon?
588
00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:23,300
They don't even have the weapon.
589
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:26,180
Do they have a credible eyewitness?
590
00:36:27,340 --> 00:36:30,520
They don't have any eyewitnesses.
591
00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:31,920
Where's the case?
592
00:36:32,260 --> 00:36:35,580
He didn't seem upset enough the day
after that he went to work?
593
00:36:36,880 --> 00:36:37,880
Where's the
594
00:36:39,490 --> 00:36:44,630
He had an affair with the victim and he
was in her apartment.
595
00:36:45,270 --> 00:36:47,810
That's their case in its entirety.
596
00:36:48,650 --> 00:36:53,050
Now, you want to believe that Jeffrey
Winslow is guilty?
597
00:36:55,010 --> 00:36:58,210
I suppose you could.
598
00:36:59,630 --> 00:37:03,050
But beyond reasonable doubt?
599
00:37:05,130 --> 00:37:09,210
And let's not forget, despite the
district attorney's great efforts to
600
00:37:09,210 --> 00:37:13,910
Jeffrey Winslow as a liar, he didn't
have to tell you he went back there that
601
00:37:13,910 --> 00:37:14,910
night.
602
00:37:15,310 --> 00:37:16,810
Prosecution never told you that.
603
00:37:18,970 --> 00:37:19,970
Jeffrey did.
604
00:37:23,390 --> 00:37:24,390
Jeffrey did.
605
00:37:28,070 --> 00:37:30,470
Because he was under.
606
00:37:35,950 --> 00:37:40,910
And under oath, he told you another
truth.
607
00:37:43,990 --> 00:37:45,250
He didn't.
608
00:38:06,440 --> 00:38:08,160
The evidence points to a surgeon.
609
00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:11,180
Possible it wasn't? Sure, but likely.
610
00:38:11,900 --> 00:38:14,400
The evidence points to consensual sex.
611
00:38:15,260 --> 00:38:19,020
Possible it was rape with no bruising?
Sure, but likely.
612
00:38:20,220 --> 00:38:23,460
The evidence proves he was there that
night.
613
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:26,300
Possible he just happened to walk in
after?
614
00:38:26,780 --> 00:38:28,740
Sure, but likely.
615
00:38:29,520 --> 00:38:35,060
The victim was killed the same way a
woman showed up dead in his hospital
616
00:38:35,060 --> 00:38:37,140
he got to read the autopsy report.
617
00:38:38,380 --> 00:38:39,980
Possible that's just a coincidence?
618
00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:42,600
Sure.
619
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:44,400
But likely?
620
00:38:46,380 --> 00:38:48,720
They've got a lot of possibilities.
621
00:38:49,060 --> 00:38:53,820
And in each and every instance, they're
asking you to accept the most unlikely
622
00:38:53,820 --> 00:38:54,820
of explanations.
623
00:38:55,380 --> 00:38:56,380
How's this?
624
00:38:57,900 --> 00:39:02,500
He knows there's a serial killer who
decapitates and severs hands.
625
00:39:02,940 --> 00:39:08,560
And yet, according to his testimony,
when he walked in that room and saw
626
00:39:08,560 --> 00:39:14,340
Marks decapitated with severed hands,
his very first instinct was, oh no, they
627
00:39:14,340 --> 00:39:15,600
might think I did this.
628
00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:19,000
Isn't that a little odd?
629
00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:24,200
Wouldn't the natural reaction be, it's
obvious who did this?
630
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:25,660
It's the poet?
631
00:39:26,760 --> 00:39:30,160
And wouldn't he assume that the police
officers would say the same?
632
00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:35,840
Is it possible to believe what Jeffrey
Winslow is telling you?
633
00:39:36,620 --> 00:39:37,620
Sure.
634
00:39:38,900 --> 00:39:45,580
But remember, his very own wife, as
635
00:39:45,580 --> 00:39:49,700
devoted as she was in that witness
chair, she told her neighbor.
636
00:40:08,779 --> 00:40:10,320
Thank you.
637
00:40:43,280 --> 00:40:44,920
The defendant will please rise.
638
00:40:52,340 --> 00:40:54,940
Mr. Foreman, please read out your
verdict.
639
00:40:58,140 --> 00:40:59,720
Commonwealth v. Winslow.
640
00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:05,540
On the charge of murder in the first
degree, we, the jury, find the
641
00:41:05,640 --> 00:41:07,320
Jeffrey Winslow, guilty.
642
00:41:18,830 --> 00:41:19,830
Settle down.
643
00:41:21,490 --> 00:41:24,550
I'll ask each person in this room to
stay silent.
644
00:41:26,250 --> 00:41:28,230
Your Honor, I want the jury polled.
645
00:41:28,730 --> 00:41:29,730
Very well.
646
00:41:30,350 --> 00:41:35,010
Members of the jury, you will each now
stand and declare your individual vote.
647
00:41:35,410 --> 00:41:38,370
Let's start left to right, back row
first.
648
00:41:39,370 --> 00:41:40,370
Guilty.
649
00:41:43,290 --> 00:41:44,290
Guilty.
650
00:41:45,990 --> 00:41:46,990
Guilty.
651
00:41:48,230 --> 00:41:51,750
Guilty Guilty
652
00:41:51,750 --> 00:41:58,590
Guilty Guilty
653
00:41:58,590 --> 00:42:02,590
Guilty
654
00:42:02,590 --> 00:42:06,190
Guilty
54208
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