Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated:
1
00:00:02,109 --> 00:00:05,410
I said this in a movie once:
2
00:00:05,412 --> 00:00:09,014
"Everyone knows the same truth,
3
00:00:09,016 --> 00:00:14,920
and our lives consist of
how we choose to distort it."
4
00:00:14,922 --> 00:00:18,323
I am kind of amazed at what
5
00:00:18,325 --> 00:00:21,793
Lawrence and Richard are doing
because they are walking
6
00:00:21,795 --> 00:00:25,397
into some pretty prickly
7
00:00:25,399 --> 00:00:27,799
arenas,
8
00:00:27,801 --> 00:00:32,604
and they have no armor,
other than
9
00:00:32,606 --> 00:00:35,107
their own mental faculties.
10
00:00:36,543 --> 00:00:39,545
I think what these two men
are doing out there,
11
00:00:39,547 --> 00:00:41,713
promoting a scientific
world view,
12
00:00:41,715 --> 00:00:45,117
is something of great value
13
00:00:45,119 --> 00:00:49,421
because it is part of
what humanity's all about...
14
00:00:49,423 --> 00:00:51,557
To be curious, to understand
15
00:00:51,559 --> 00:00:55,661
what is the real world
surrounding us.
16
00:00:55,663 --> 00:00:58,196
And this is what I love
about science, is that
17
00:00:58,198 --> 00:01:00,299
it's knowledge,
and knowledge is power,
18
00:01:00,301 --> 00:01:04,536
and it empowers you
and it frees you,
19
00:01:04,538 --> 00:01:06,772
because then you're not stuck,
20
00:01:06,774 --> 00:01:10,342
you're no longer stuck
where you've been or where
somebody else has been stuck.
21
00:01:10,344 --> 00:01:14,513
There are no scientific
authorities. There are
scientific experts.
22
00:01:14,515 --> 00:01:17,082
Richard knows a lot
about zoology; I know
a lot about physics.
23
00:01:17,084 --> 00:01:19,117
But there's no one whose views
24
00:01:19,119 --> 00:01:21,687
are not subject to question.
25
00:01:21,689 --> 00:01:25,390
Science just seeks
the truth without prejudice,
for better or worse.
26
00:01:25,392 --> 00:01:29,161
It doesn't say,
"should I find this out?"
It says, "can I?"
27
00:01:29,163 --> 00:01:32,397
And that's
They don't change the facts.
28
00:01:32,399 --> 00:01:36,101
Facts, if you're rational,
should change your beliefs.
29
00:01:36,103 --> 00:01:38,403
Throughout history,
new discoveries
30
00:01:38,405 --> 00:01:41,106
have challenged
existing beliefs.
31
00:01:41,108 --> 00:01:44,109
Religion is no exception.
32
00:01:44,111 --> 00:01:46,912
Religion is just like
any other topic
33
00:01:46,914 --> 00:01:49,181
and should not be
sacrosanct at all.
34
00:01:49,183 --> 00:01:51,683
You should be able
to discuss religion.
35
00:01:51,685 --> 00:01:53,418
Why not?
36
00:01:53,420 --> 00:01:55,754
I think religion
should be open to discussion.
37
00:01:55,756 --> 00:01:57,756
I think everything
should be. I think
38
00:01:57,758 --> 00:02:00,025
when you make things taboo,
39
00:02:00,027 --> 00:02:02,961
even when feel like
you're protecting it,
40
00:02:02,963 --> 00:02:05,297
it's not for the greater good.
41
00:02:05,299 --> 00:02:09,801
We cannot close down
a conversation
42
00:02:09,803 --> 00:02:11,637
about a set
43
00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:13,739
of beliefs that lead to actions
44
00:02:13,741 --> 00:02:17,242
which affect all of us.
45
00:02:17,244 --> 00:02:20,145
All this stuff I was
taught about evolution
46
00:02:20,147 --> 00:02:22,247
and big bang theory and all that
47
00:02:22,249 --> 00:02:25,584
is lies straight
from the pit of hell.
48
00:02:25,586 --> 00:02:29,087
This is the trouble
with ethics and morality
and the big questions
49
00:02:29,089 --> 00:02:32,024
and the fact that
religionists think they
own that conversation.
50
00:02:32,026 --> 00:02:35,594
Quite the contrary.
They kill that conversation.
51
00:02:35,596 --> 00:02:38,263
And I think we follow people
52
00:02:38,265 --> 00:02:41,299
who have courage, you know,
to think about things
53
00:02:41,301 --> 00:02:43,402
that we haven't
thought about before,
54
00:02:43,404 --> 00:02:45,437
and in these times,
55
00:02:45,439 --> 00:02:50,642
where intolerance
is kind of championed,
56
00:02:50,644 --> 00:02:52,944
I'm pretty impressed
57
00:02:52,946 --> 00:02:56,615
that someone is
taking on the quest.
58
00:02:56,617 --> 00:02:59,184
That's what I get
from these guys:
59
00:02:59,186 --> 00:03:05,023
The permission to
question everything.
60
00:03:16,969 --> 00:03:19,838
Richard, ten years ago,
I asked you the question
61
00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:23,709
in the popular writing
and speaking that
you do, which is,
62
00:03:23,711 --> 00:03:26,445
what's more important
in some sense
63
00:03:26,447 --> 00:03:29,514
if you had a choice,
which is to explain science
or destroy religion?
64
00:03:29,516 --> 00:03:31,316
Oh, I think that
they go together,
65
00:03:31,318 --> 00:03:33,752
because "destroy religion"
makes it sound negative.
66
00:03:33,754 --> 00:03:35,153
Yeah.
To me, it's positive.
67
00:03:35,155 --> 00:03:38,190
Science is wonderful.
Science is beautiful.
68
00:03:38,192 --> 00:03:42,661
And religion
is not wonderful.
It's not beautiful.
69
00:03:42,663 --> 00:03:45,897
It gets in the way.
There are all sorts of
other things wrong with it,
70
00:03:45,899 --> 00:03:49,201
but I mostly
care about truth,
the beauty of truth,
71
00:03:49,203 --> 00:03:52,070
the poetry of reality,
which is science,
72
00:03:52,072 --> 00:03:55,006
and the fact that religion,
as a scientific explanation...
73
00:03:55,008 --> 00:03:58,343
It is a competing
scientific explanation...
74
00:03:58,345 --> 00:04:00,946
It's so dull,
it's so boring,
it's so petty.
75
00:04:00,948 --> 00:04:03,381
It's wrong too.
And it's also
wrong, yes.
76
00:04:03,383 --> 00:04:06,985
Which I think
is a bit more...
more important, yeah.
77
00:04:06,987 --> 00:04:09,955
I think the same as you.
I want people to understand
78
00:04:09,957 --> 00:04:11,957
how the universe really works.
79
00:04:11,959 --> 00:04:14,059
As an aside, ultimately,
80
00:04:14,061 --> 00:04:17,395
is this other incompatibility
between science and religion
81
00:04:17,397 --> 00:04:20,766
that when empirical evidence
tells you something,
you have to accept it...
82
00:04:20,768 --> 00:04:24,703
When you give up that
by saying, "I can believe
this myth and fairy tale,"
83
00:04:24,705 --> 00:04:26,671
then it opens you up
to lots of other things.
84
00:04:26,673 --> 00:04:31,143
So it's not innocuous.
Inevitably, when you have
to deal with the real world.
85
00:04:31,145 --> 00:04:33,044
You inevitably make
bad decisions.
86
00:04:33,046 --> 00:04:35,280
If we can get people
to believe that,
87
00:04:35,282 --> 00:04:37,082
then it's easier...
88
00:04:37,084 --> 00:04:39,184
Or should be easier to convince
people that evolution is true
89
00:04:39,186 --> 00:04:40,852
because the evidence
is so strong.
90
00:04:40,854 --> 00:04:42,888
Once you tell them
the evidence for evolution,
91
00:04:42,890 --> 00:04:45,824
they say,
"oh, right, okay.
So much for God."
92
00:05:08,181 --> 00:05:12,017
Well, tonight Richard is in
Sydney while I'm in canberra,
93
00:05:12,019 --> 00:05:16,688
and he's going to debate
on a television program
called q and a
94
00:05:16,690 --> 00:05:20,792
the archbishop of Sydney,
95
00:05:20,794 --> 00:05:24,529
and I'm here in canberra
debating in a Muslim
debate initiative.
96
00:05:24,531 --> 00:05:26,631
We're both sort of launching out
97
00:05:26,633 --> 00:05:29,334
against the forces of evil
in different places,
98
00:05:29,336 --> 00:05:33,839
and that poetry was
to compelling to resist.
99
00:05:36,209 --> 00:05:39,110
As far as I can see,
this event has been advertised
100
00:05:39,112 --> 00:05:42,214
only in the Muslim community.
101
00:05:42,216 --> 00:05:44,716
Except for the few people
I've told about it,
102
00:05:44,718 --> 00:05:46,952
no one will know about it
except the Muslim community,
103
00:05:46,954 --> 00:05:48,587
so it'll be
an interesting audience.
104
00:05:53,092 --> 00:05:54,793
Oh, look over there.
105
00:05:54,795 --> 00:05:56,995
That's fascinating.
106
00:05:56,997 --> 00:05:59,497
That may be our audience
right there, by the way.
107
00:05:59,499 --> 00:06:00,632
That could be it.
108
00:06:02,702 --> 00:06:04,936
Hi, how ya doin'?
109
00:06:04,938 --> 00:06:07,873
- Nice to see you.
- Morning, Professor.
110
00:06:07,875 --> 00:06:09,541
- How are you?
- Hi.
111
00:06:09,543 --> 00:06:12,110
I'm the, uh...
uthman. Uthman badar.
Oh, okay.
112
00:06:12,112 --> 00:06:15,013
You're the other person
that's going to talk.
That's right.
113
00:06:15,015 --> 00:06:18,617
It's interesting...
I looked online and didn't
see any advertising for it.
114
00:06:18,619 --> 00:06:20,819
It'll be interesting
to see.
We'll see how that goes.
115
00:06:20,821 --> 00:06:23,455
But I have a rule... if there's
less than five people,
we just go for coffee.
116
00:06:23,457 --> 00:06:24,823
Does that sound good?
117
00:06:24,825 --> 00:06:28,827
I'm gonna sit in the back now
and read my Bible,
118
00:06:28,829 --> 00:06:30,729
which is...
119
00:06:30,731 --> 00:06:33,098
I just thought
I'd pick it up
for inspiration.
120
00:06:33,100 --> 00:06:35,033
Christopher always inspires me.
121
00:06:58,190 --> 00:07:00,792
Cardinal George pell is the
122
00:07:00,794 --> 00:07:03,295
most senior
Roman catholic
in Australia,
123
00:07:03,297 --> 00:07:05,430
he's the archbishop of Sydney,
124
00:07:05,432 --> 00:07:10,068
and I know rather
little else about him,
I'm afraid.
125
00:07:10,070 --> 00:07:14,706
And he is sometimes talked about
as a possible candidate
for pope.
126
00:07:19,845 --> 00:07:23,014
I have always refused to debate
religious fundamentalists.
127
00:07:23,016 --> 00:07:26,217
It is my understanding
that a cardinal of
the Roman catholic church
128
00:07:26,219 --> 00:07:28,186
is not a fundamentalist.
129
00:07:28,188 --> 00:07:30,355
If he is, I've made a mistake.
130
00:07:43,970 --> 00:07:47,706
We're very excited to have these
two gentlemen here this evening
131
00:07:47,708 --> 00:07:49,674
for this discussion.
132
00:07:49,676 --> 00:07:51,576
We know them already.
Please let us introduce
them properly
133
00:07:51,578 --> 00:07:53,111
and make them feel very welcome.
134
00:07:53,113 --> 00:07:55,046
Please help me welcome
135
00:07:55,048 --> 00:07:57,215
the author of the God delusion,
136
00:07:57,217 --> 00:08:00,785
the evolutionary biologist
Richard Dawkins.
137
00:08:07,360 --> 00:08:09,294
...the archbishop of Sydney,
please welcome
138
00:08:09,296 --> 00:08:12,030
cardinal George pell.
139
00:08:12,032 --> 00:08:15,166
Five, four, three...
140
00:08:22,808 --> 00:08:27,112
George pell,
do you accept that
humans evolved from apes?
141
00:08:27,114 --> 00:08:30,715
Yeah, probably.
From neanderthals, yes.
142
00:08:30,717 --> 00:08:32,917
From neanderthals?
143
00:08:32,919 --> 00:08:36,054
Probably.
Why from neanderthals?
144
00:08:36,056 --> 00:08:38,456
Who else would you suggest?
145
00:08:38,458 --> 00:08:41,393
Neanderthals were our cousins.
146
00:08:41,395 --> 00:08:43,328
We're not descended from them.
147
00:08:43,330 --> 00:08:45,230
These extant cousins?
148
00:08:45,232 --> 00:08:49,234
Where would I find
a neanderthal today
if they're my cousins?
149
00:08:49,236 --> 00:08:52,504
They're not extant.
They're extinct.
That's my point.
150
00:08:52,506 --> 00:08:56,608
Your point is that
because they're not...
151
00:08:56,610 --> 00:08:59,210
That because they're extant,
they can't be our cousins?
152
00:08:59,212 --> 00:09:02,680
I'm really am not much fussed.
153
00:09:02,682 --> 00:09:04,149
That's very clear.
154
00:09:04,151 --> 00:09:06,451
Ignoring the limitations
of science
155
00:09:06,453 --> 00:09:09,454
also leads to sloppy
and arbitrary science.
156
00:09:09,456 --> 00:09:13,658
A good example is the field
of quantum mechanics.
157
00:09:13,660 --> 00:09:17,028
The evidence of logic
derives from the evidence
of reality.
158
00:09:17,030 --> 00:09:21,800
Is it logical that I can be
in two places at once? No.
159
00:09:21,802 --> 00:09:24,102
But if I am an electron,
I certainly can be.
160
00:09:24,104 --> 00:09:27,138
Because while you refer
to quantum mechanics,
I actually understand it.
161
00:09:27,140 --> 00:09:29,607
Most evolutionary
biologists today
162
00:09:29,609 --> 00:09:32,977
don't believe that.
Don't believe what?
163
00:09:32,979 --> 00:09:34,813
They don't believe in
164
00:09:34,815 --> 00:09:39,117
this crude fundamentalist
version of random selection
that you propose.
165
00:09:39,119 --> 00:09:41,719
I do not propose it,
and I strongly deny
166
00:09:41,721 --> 00:09:43,955
that evolution is
random selection.
167
00:09:43,957 --> 00:09:47,826
This idea that we should
challenge our beliefs,
168
00:09:47,828 --> 00:09:50,428
I agree in some areas,
and this is the point
169
00:09:50,430 --> 00:09:53,231
I tried to touch upon
the difference between
science and religion...
170
00:09:53,233 --> 00:09:57,168
Only when you appreciate
the difference can you
ascertain whether
171
00:09:57,170 --> 00:09:59,637
different propositions
apply or not.
172
00:09:59,639 --> 00:10:01,940
Anything about higher truth,
morality, for example,
173
00:10:01,942 --> 00:10:04,676
do you want me to challenge
my belief every day
that murder is wrong?
174
00:10:04,678 --> 00:10:07,879
Well, if any of you
stopped believing in God,
I would ask you,
175
00:10:07,881 --> 00:10:10,982
would you go out tomorrow
and murder your neighbor?
176
00:10:10,984 --> 00:10:12,717
Well, some of you say yes.
177
00:10:12,719 --> 00:10:15,920
Evolution is
non-random selection.
178
00:10:15,922 --> 00:10:18,056
Oh, there's a purpose
to it, is there?
179
00:10:18,058 --> 00:10:19,524
No.
180
00:10:19,526 --> 00:10:21,426
But...
181
00:10:21,428 --> 00:10:23,561
Could you explain
what "non-random" means?
182
00:10:23,563 --> 00:10:27,198
Yes, of course I could.
That's my life's work.
183
00:10:28,702 --> 00:10:31,369
No idea should be
above ridicule.
184
00:10:31,371 --> 00:10:33,104
Ridicule is a very
important tool.
185
00:10:33,106 --> 00:10:35,940
And why should religion
not be subject to ridicule?
186
00:10:35,942 --> 00:10:38,676
If politics is subject
to ridicule, if science,
187
00:10:38,678 --> 00:10:42,147
if sex, if everything else
in the world is subject
to ridicule
188
00:10:42,149 --> 00:10:45,483
as a way of
illuminating reality,
why shouldn't religion?
189
00:10:45,485 --> 00:10:48,353
It's part of being human
190
00:10:48,355 --> 00:10:50,355
to ask why we exist.
191
00:10:50,357 --> 00:10:52,190
The question "why"
192
00:10:52,192 --> 00:10:55,660
is not necessarily
a question that
deserves to be answered.
193
00:10:55,662 --> 00:10:58,329
There are all
sorts of questions
that people can ask,
194
00:10:58,331 --> 00:11:00,632
like, "what is
the color of jealousy?"
195
00:11:00,634 --> 00:11:02,600
That's a silly question.
Exactly.
196
00:11:02,602 --> 00:11:04,502
"Why?" Is a silly question.
197
00:11:04,504 --> 00:11:07,205
You can ask, "what are
the factors that led
198
00:11:07,207 --> 00:11:09,240
to something coming
into existence?"
199
00:11:09,242 --> 00:11:11,176
That's a sensible question.
200
00:11:11,178 --> 00:11:14,312
But "what is the purpose
of the universe?"
201
00:11:14,314 --> 00:11:16,581
Is a silly question.
It has no meaning.
202
00:11:16,583 --> 00:11:19,751
And so I hope that every student
203
00:11:19,753 --> 00:11:21,920
who every goes
to university
at one point
204
00:11:21,922 --> 00:11:24,822
in their life
has the opportunity
to have something
205
00:11:24,824 --> 00:11:26,858
that is at the heart
of their being,
206
00:11:26,860 --> 00:11:28,993
something so central
to their being
that if they lose it,
207
00:11:28,995 --> 00:11:32,864
they won't feel that
they're human anymore,
to be proved wrong.
208
00:11:32,866 --> 00:11:35,934
Because that's the liberation
that science provides:
209
00:11:35,936 --> 00:11:37,635
The realization that
210
00:11:37,637 --> 00:11:39,904
to assume the truth,
to assume the answer
211
00:11:39,906 --> 00:11:43,508
before you ask the questions
leads you nowhere.
212
00:11:43,510 --> 00:11:47,045
We do have a scientific
understanding of why we're here,
213
00:11:47,047 --> 00:11:51,549
and we therefore have to
make up our own meaning to life.
214
00:11:51,551 --> 00:11:54,552
We have to stand up,
look the world
215
00:11:54,554 --> 00:11:57,255
in the face, face up to the fact
216
00:11:57,257 --> 00:12:00,091
that we are not going
to last forever,
we have to make
217
00:12:00,093 --> 00:12:03,428
the most of the short time
that we have on this planet,
218
00:12:03,430 --> 00:12:06,631
we have to make this planet
as good as we possibly can
219
00:12:06,633 --> 00:12:12,070
and try to leave it
a better place
than we found it.
220
00:12:12,072 --> 00:12:15,373
And if we live in a world
where certain things are not
subject to question,
221
00:12:15,375 --> 00:12:18,843
we live in a world
where thinking has stopped.
222
00:12:26,685 --> 00:12:29,587
Final results of
223
00:12:29,589 --> 00:12:34,359
With more than 20,00
of you voting, we have 76%
224
00:12:34,361 --> 00:12:36,928
saying "no, religious belief
225
00:12:36,930 --> 00:12:39,998
does not make the world
a better place."
226
00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:42,567
Please thank our special guests,
Professor Richard Dawkins
227
00:12:42,569 --> 00:12:44,402
and cardinal George pell.
228
00:13:27,746 --> 00:13:31,182
¶ Hey now, little speedy head ¶
229
00:13:31,184 --> 00:13:34,886
¶ the read on
the speed meter says ¶
230
00:13:34,888 --> 00:13:40,858
¶ you have to go to task
in the city ¶
231
00:13:40,860 --> 00:13:43,594
¶ where people drown
and people serve ¶
232
00:13:43,596 --> 00:13:47,832
¶ don't be shy
you just deserve ¶
233
00:13:47,834 --> 00:13:50,234
¶ it's only just ¶
234
00:13:50,236 --> 00:13:52,070
¶ light years to go ¶
235
00:13:52,072 --> 00:13:55,573
Well, I got
thoroughly fed up with
236
00:13:55,575 --> 00:13:58,443
b.B.C.-Type interviews,
237
00:13:58,445 --> 00:14:00,411
where you have a chairman
in the middle,
238
00:14:00,413 --> 00:14:04,115
and you get an interesting
conversation going on
between two...
239
00:14:04,117 --> 00:14:06,117
There might be five people
around the table,
240
00:14:06,119 --> 00:14:08,920
and "a" and "b" are having
an interesting conversation,
241
00:14:08,922 --> 00:14:12,156
and so the chairman suddenly
says, "and what do you think
about this, 'c'?"
242
00:14:12,158 --> 00:14:16,394
Totally breaking the flow,
spoiling the conversation,
243
00:14:16,396 --> 00:14:19,464
all in the interest of balance
and things like that,
and it occurred to me,
244
00:14:19,466 --> 00:14:23,935
"why on earth do we
bother with chairmen?
They're not necessary."
245
00:14:23,937 --> 00:14:26,938
Certainly, my recent encounter
with the archbishop
of canterbury
246
00:14:26,940 --> 00:14:29,006
in the sheldonian theatre
in Oxford,
247
00:14:29,008 --> 00:14:32,110
that was completely
ruined by the chairman,
who was a philosopher
248
00:14:32,112 --> 00:14:34,946
and felt it was his role
to clarify things,
249
00:14:34,948 --> 00:14:37,281
and of course,
that meant obscuring things.
250
00:14:37,283 --> 00:14:39,817
¶ We're closer now ¶
251
00:14:39,819 --> 00:14:43,221
¶ than light years to go ¶
252
00:14:43,223 --> 00:14:45,890
Yeah, I think it's...
I think conversations,
253
00:14:45,892 --> 00:14:48,159
and conversations
that aren't planned,
254
00:14:48,161 --> 00:14:50,962
are fascinating
for people to watch
and listen to.
255
00:14:50,964 --> 00:14:52,864
Yes.
256
00:14:52,866 --> 00:14:55,199
I think it works.
257
00:15:36,008 --> 00:15:38,209
We should probably go.
258
00:15:38,211 --> 00:15:39,644
Okay.
259
00:15:39,646 --> 00:15:42,213
So to fill it up...
To begin late...
260
00:15:42,215 --> 00:15:44,982
From my experience,
if it's really full,
it begins a little late.
261
00:15:44,984 --> 00:15:47,084
Usually three
or four minutes, yeah.
262
00:15:55,794 --> 00:15:58,930
Would you welcome these two
great scientists to the stage?
263
00:15:58,932 --> 00:16:01,732
Please join me...
Richard Dawkins
and Lawrence krauss.
264
00:16:28,093 --> 00:16:30,361
I think it's
appropriate
to begin...
265
00:16:30,363 --> 00:16:32,630
Did any of you see q and a?
266
00:16:40,305 --> 00:16:44,075
I was amazed...
cardinal pell,
who was on the program,
267
00:16:44,077 --> 00:16:47,612
manifestly didn't
understand evolution.
268
00:16:49,081 --> 00:16:50,882
Actually, he didn't
manifestly understand
anything,
269
00:16:50,884 --> 00:16:53,651
as far as I could see.
270
00:16:58,423 --> 00:17:00,992
Why don't you elaborate
a little bit about
that real problem?
271
00:17:00,994 --> 00:17:03,895
Because I think it's
a fascinating issue of,
272
00:17:03,897 --> 00:17:06,497
if speciation occurs,
if species change,
273
00:17:06,499 --> 00:17:08,533
was there a first person?
274
00:17:08,535 --> 00:17:10,334
At first sight, it seems obvious
275
00:17:10,336 --> 00:17:13,237
that there has to have
been a first person
276
00:17:13,239 --> 00:17:15,439
and there has to have
been a first rabbit
277
00:17:15,441 --> 00:17:17,275
and a first rhinoceros
and things.
278
00:17:17,277 --> 00:17:19,610
After all,
people are people,
aren't they?
279
00:17:19,612 --> 00:17:21,512
And their ancestors
were not people.
280
00:17:21,514 --> 00:17:25,016
If you go back
sufficiently far,
your ancestor was a fish.
281
00:17:25,018 --> 00:17:28,719
Mustn't there
have been a time
where, so to speak,
282
00:17:28,721 --> 00:17:33,658
the last homo erectus parents
gave birth to the first
homo sapiens' baby?
283
00:17:33,660 --> 00:17:36,027
And the answer is no.
284
00:17:36,029 --> 00:17:38,629
There never was a first person,
285
00:17:38,631 --> 00:17:41,799
there never was
a first rabbit
or first rhinoceros,
286
00:17:41,801 --> 00:17:46,103
because every organism ever born
287
00:17:46,105 --> 00:17:49,507
belonged to
the same species
as its parents.
288
00:17:49,509 --> 00:17:51,409
And yet because
it was so gradual
289
00:17:51,411 --> 00:17:53,144
and because it was so slow,
290
00:17:53,146 --> 00:17:56,781
not only was our
200 million great
grandparent a fish,
291
00:17:56,783 --> 00:17:58,783
but if you go back
further still,
292
00:17:58,785 --> 00:18:01,118
they were worms and so on.
293
00:18:01,120 --> 00:18:04,088
And one suggestion
that's been made
is that people
294
00:18:04,090 --> 00:18:06,424
really have difficulty
grasping the idea
295
00:18:06,426 --> 00:18:10,561
that animals turn
into other animals
so imperceptibly
296
00:18:10,563 --> 00:18:13,164
that you can hardly notice it.
297
00:18:13,166 --> 00:18:15,700
It's not actually
that paradoxical.
298
00:18:15,702 --> 00:18:18,002
It all happened
very, very gradually.
299
00:18:18,004 --> 00:18:20,705
And you can think
of parallels like
the fact that
300
00:18:20,707 --> 00:18:24,075
you can't see
the hour hand
on your watch moving.
301
00:18:24,077 --> 00:18:28,379
At some point,
we cease to think
of ourselves as middle-aged
302
00:18:28,381 --> 00:18:31,415
and we start to think
of ourselves as old.
303
00:18:31,417 --> 00:18:34,385
But nobody ever goes to bed
middle-aged and wakes up
304
00:18:34,387 --> 00:18:36,921
and says, "I'm old."
305
00:18:40,258 --> 00:18:42,793
We had a meeting at my institute
306
00:18:42,795 --> 00:18:44,929
where we were trying
to get at the origin
of life,
307
00:18:44,931 --> 00:18:48,766
and it's fascinating
to learn how much
closer we're getting.
308
00:18:48,768 --> 00:18:51,902
I don't know if you think
we'll get to the beginning
in your lifetime or my...
309
00:18:51,904 --> 00:18:56,374
Well, it's an exciting
thought, and I'm pretty
hopeful that we might.
310
00:18:56,376 --> 00:18:58,943
You'll never be able
to prove it for certain,
I suspect,
311
00:18:58,945 --> 00:19:01,112
but to come up with
a plausible theory
312
00:19:01,114 --> 00:19:03,748
that people say, "of course!
313
00:19:03,750 --> 00:19:05,983
That's so elegant
and so simple."
314
00:19:05,985 --> 00:19:09,687
Either it's true
or it ought to be true.
I mean, it could...
315
00:19:09,689 --> 00:19:12,089
I think the key point
is plausibility.
316
00:19:12,091 --> 00:19:14,725
It is amazing
and fascinating to me
317
00:19:14,727 --> 00:19:17,161
and worth celebrating
that the laws of physics
as we now understand them
318
00:19:17,163 --> 00:19:21,065
have given us
a plausible story
to answer questions.
319
00:19:21,067 --> 00:19:23,901
That's amazing. Which is,
how could something
arise from nothing?
320
00:19:23,903 --> 00:19:26,270
How could a complex
universe arise
321
00:19:26,272 --> 00:19:28,239
from a universe
in which there
was nothing?
322
00:19:28,241 --> 00:19:31,809
No particles,
and maybe not even
any space?
323
00:19:31,811 --> 00:19:33,811
And it's amazing to me
in cosmology now
324
00:19:33,813 --> 00:19:36,847
that we are beginning
to get back and realize
325
00:19:36,849 --> 00:19:39,016
that even something
as complex as
a whole universe
326
00:19:39,018 --> 00:19:41,552
could plausibly be created.
327
00:19:41,554 --> 00:19:43,554
But that's all we ever claim.
328
00:19:43,556 --> 00:19:47,024
And yet whenever
we claim that,
we are called strident.
329
00:19:47,026 --> 00:19:49,727
Do you notice that?
Yes, I do.
330
00:19:49,729 --> 00:19:53,197
It came up in
the q and a debate,
331
00:19:53,199 --> 00:19:56,000
and I tried to
332
00:19:56,002 --> 00:19:58,636
very briefly expound
Lawrence's thesis
333
00:19:58,638 --> 00:20:02,106
that you could get something
from literally nothing.
334
00:20:02,108 --> 00:20:05,576
The audience just laughed.
It was obviously
to them absurd.
335
00:20:05,578 --> 00:20:08,746
How could you possibly
get something from nothing?
336
00:20:08,748 --> 00:20:11,682
It does violate common sense.
337
00:20:11,684 --> 00:20:15,086
But as I said earlier
this evening, you can't
go by common sense.
338
00:20:15,088 --> 00:20:17,188
If we could do things
by common sense,
339
00:20:17,190 --> 00:20:20,224
we wouldn't need physicists.
340
00:20:21,394 --> 00:20:24,161
Common sense,
of course, comes from
341
00:20:24,163 --> 00:20:26,697
what was necessary
for our brains to survive
342
00:20:26,699 --> 00:20:30,101
in the pleistocene of Africa.
343
00:20:30,103 --> 00:20:32,870
So they had to know
how to catch a buffalo
344
00:20:32,872 --> 00:20:35,673
and how to find a water hole
and how to climb a tree
345
00:20:35,675 --> 00:20:37,842
when being pursued
by a lion or something.
346
00:20:37,844 --> 00:20:41,946
So our brains were never
shaped by natural selection
to understand
347
00:20:41,948 --> 00:20:44,982
either quantum mechanics...
The theory of the very small...
348
00:20:44,984 --> 00:20:49,353
Or relativity, the theory
of the very fast.
349
00:20:49,355 --> 00:20:53,724
And it's actually
an astonishing compliment
to the human brain
350
00:20:53,726 --> 00:20:57,762
that at least some humans
are capable of understanding.
351
00:20:57,764 --> 00:21:02,166
No, it is really remarkable
that we've been able to get
as far as we can.
352
00:21:02,168 --> 00:21:04,001
But you hit on another point.
353
00:21:04,003 --> 00:21:06,504
Our brains not only
didn't evolve to understand
354
00:21:06,506 --> 00:21:09,039
those aspects of the universe
that it couldn't experience
directly,
355
00:21:09,041 --> 00:21:13,477
but another aspect of the
universe it can't experience
directly is long time.
356
00:21:13,479 --> 00:21:15,012
Absolutely.
And I think that's
another reason
357
00:21:15,014 --> 00:21:17,648
why evolution is
such a hard concept.
358
00:21:17,650 --> 00:21:21,285
Because we can just see...
we have a slice
of 100 years or less.
359
00:21:21,287 --> 00:21:23,854
We can do seconds,
minutes, hours, days,
360
00:21:23,856 --> 00:21:25,990
years, centuries...
361
00:21:25,992 --> 00:21:28,192
Even millennia
we have trouble with.
362
00:21:28,194 --> 00:21:31,395
You cannot grasp
the immensity of time
363
00:21:31,397 --> 00:21:34,665
that is 100 million years.
Exactly.
364
00:21:34,667 --> 00:21:37,835
Thank you very much.
Thank you very, very much.
365
00:22:31,489 --> 00:22:35,459
¶ the walls abandon shape ¶
366
00:22:35,461 --> 00:22:37,995
¶ they got a cheshire cat grin ¶
367
00:22:37,997 --> 00:22:40,698
¶ all blurring into one ¶
368
00:22:40,700 --> 00:22:43,367
¶ this place is on a mission ¶
369
00:22:43,369 --> 00:22:46,570
A lot of people think
that just because there's a lot
we don't understand
370
00:22:46,572 --> 00:22:49,306
at the edge of science,
that everything we know is going
to go out the window,
371
00:22:49,308 --> 00:22:51,809
and that's not true.
Evolution happened.
372
00:22:51,811 --> 00:22:53,477
The big bang happened.
373
00:22:53,479 --> 00:22:55,079
If I take a ball and drop it,
it's going to fall.
374
00:22:55,081 --> 00:22:56,313
There are lots
of things we do know.
375
00:22:56,315 --> 00:22:57,548
For me, the only
solution I can see
376
00:22:57,550 --> 00:22:59,283
is to try and educate people.
377
00:22:59,285 --> 00:23:01,619
Because if you don't
have an informed public,
378
00:23:01,621 --> 00:23:03,754
that's the greatest
threat to democracy.
379
00:23:03,756 --> 00:23:06,857
So it's incumbent on scientists
to do a much better job,
380
00:23:06,859 --> 00:23:09,793
and then it's up to the public
to make the decision.
381
00:23:09,795 --> 00:23:12,363
They can decide that they
don't want to do anything
about global warming.
382
00:23:12,365 --> 00:23:16,867
But they should at least
be presented with the evidence
and understand the facts.
383
00:23:16,869 --> 00:23:21,005
Ladies and gentlemen,
the dynamic duo of science!
384
00:23:42,093 --> 00:23:44,895
¶ Before you run away from me ¶
385
00:23:44,897 --> 00:23:47,598
¶ before you're lost
between the notes ¶
386
00:23:47,600 --> 00:23:50,501
¶ the beat goes
round and round ¶
387
00:23:50,503 --> 00:23:54,071
¶ the beat
goes round and round ¶
388
00:23:54,073 --> 00:23:56,206
It's such a privilege
389
00:23:56,208 --> 00:23:59,944
to be alive in the 21st century
390
00:23:59,946 --> 00:24:02,947
and to look out at the stars,
391
00:24:02,949 --> 00:24:06,050
to look down a microscope,
to look down an electron
microscope,
392
00:24:06,052 --> 00:24:08,886
to look into a single cell
393
00:24:08,888 --> 00:24:11,855
and see the prodigious,
stupefying complexity
394
00:24:11,857 --> 00:24:14,591
of a single cell
and then realize
that there are
395
00:24:14,593 --> 00:24:17,127
trillions of those cells
in your body,
396
00:24:17,129 --> 00:24:20,764
all conspiring together
to produce a working machine
397
00:24:20,766 --> 00:24:23,367
which can walk and run
398
00:24:23,369 --> 00:24:26,770
and eat and have sex and think.
399
00:24:26,772 --> 00:24:31,041
What a privilege it is
for each of us
to have in our heads
400
00:24:31,043 --> 00:24:34,144
an organ which is capable of
401
00:24:34,146 --> 00:24:37,948
constructing a model
of the universe.
402
00:24:37,950 --> 00:24:42,486
It is sad that that model
will die when our brain dies,
403
00:24:42,488 --> 00:24:45,856
but my goodness,
what a privilege it is
before we do die.
404
00:24:45,858 --> 00:24:48,892
¶ Jigsaw's falling into place ¶
405
00:24:48,894 --> 00:24:51,862
¶ there is nothing to explain ¶
406
00:24:51,864 --> 00:24:54,865
¶ you eye each other
as you pass ¶
407
00:24:54,867 --> 00:24:58,202
¶ she looks back,
you look back ¶
408
00:24:58,204 --> 00:25:00,938
¶ not just once ¶
409
00:25:00,940 --> 00:25:03,907
¶ not just twice ¶
410
00:25:03,909 --> 00:25:06,577
¶ wish away the nightmare ¶
411
00:25:06,579 --> 00:25:09,513
¶ wish away the nightmare ¶
412
00:25:09,515 --> 00:25:13,250
¶ you got a light
you can feel it on your back ¶
413
00:25:13,252 --> 00:25:16,186
Welcome back,
everybody. My guest tonight,
414
00:25:16,188 --> 00:25:18,288
please welcome Lawrence krauss.
415
00:25:18,290 --> 00:25:21,325
Hey, Dr. krauss.
Thank you so much
for coming on.
416
00:25:21,327 --> 00:25:24,928
All right, sir.
417
00:25:24,930 --> 00:25:29,166
Why does what you're saying
have to be an attack on my God?
418
00:25:29,168 --> 00:25:30,934
It doesn't have
to be an attack...
but that's all you've done.
419
00:25:30,936 --> 00:25:33,637
You've attacked my God
for the last six minutes.
420
00:25:33,639 --> 00:25:36,306
No, you have.
All I've said is,
you don't need him.
421
00:25:36,308 --> 00:25:39,943
That's an attack.
We've changed our minds
about the universe.
422
00:25:39,945 --> 00:25:44,715
We've learned that the universe
is more remarkable than anything
we ever thought before,
423
00:25:44,717 --> 00:25:46,550
and in fact,
424
00:25:46,552 --> 00:25:48,652
changing your mind
and in fact being wrong
is wonderful.
425
00:25:48,654 --> 00:25:51,789
You should try it sometime.
It's really amazing.
426
00:25:51,791 --> 00:25:55,059
Hmm-mm.
It means that...
it means that...
427
00:25:55,061 --> 00:25:57,661
If there is no God, okay,
428
00:25:57,663 --> 00:26:00,197
if there is
no thing called "God,"
429
00:26:00,199 --> 00:26:03,467
if he is nothing,
can't something
come from him?
430
00:26:06,205 --> 00:26:08,672
Lawrence krauss,
thank you so much.
431
00:26:08,674 --> 00:26:11,642
¶ You can feel it on your back ¶
432
00:26:11,644 --> 00:26:14,645
¶ you can feel it on your back ¶
433
00:26:14,647 --> 00:26:17,981
¶ Jigsaw's falling ¶
434
00:26:17,983 --> 00:26:21,351
¶ into place ¶
435
00:26:50,215 --> 00:26:52,616
This makes my day.
436
00:26:52,618 --> 00:26:55,686
Miley Cyrus just tweeted
a picture of me
437
00:26:55,688 --> 00:26:58,689
along with my quote
about stars where I say,
438
00:26:58,691 --> 00:27:01,592
"forget Jesus. Stars died
so you could be born."
439
00:27:01,594 --> 00:27:03,927
And underneath,
she put the word, "beautiful."
440
00:27:03,929 --> 00:27:06,597
And she seems to have gotten
a lot of hate mail for that.
441
00:27:06,599 --> 00:27:10,000
I actually think they don't
understand this too, because,
442
00:27:10,002 --> 00:27:12,269
you know, they think
she's saying the quote
is beautiful,
443
00:27:12,271 --> 00:27:16,306
but clearly what she's saying
is that the picture
of me is beautiful.
444
00:27:29,255 --> 00:27:33,123
I think we both agree
that what people want to do
445
00:27:33,125 --> 00:27:38,195
is they want to believe,
to take that line
from the x-files...
446
00:27:40,966 --> 00:27:43,400
They want to believe
in believing,
and so most people
447
00:27:43,402 --> 00:27:45,736
of faith, I think,
in our society,
448
00:27:45,738 --> 00:27:48,906
naturally
pick and choose
from the doctrine
449
00:27:48,908 --> 00:27:51,208
those things they find
absolutely ridiculous
450
00:27:51,210 --> 00:27:52,809
and throw out.
Yeah.
451
00:27:52,811 --> 00:27:55,946
And the pope would say
that's not palatable.
452
00:27:55,948 --> 00:27:57,814
And I would tend
to agree with the pope.
453
00:27:57,816 --> 00:27:59,650
I think if you can't
believe some of this stuff
454
00:27:59,652 --> 00:28:01,885
and need to throw it out,
just forget the whole thing.
455
00:28:01,887 --> 00:28:04,021
Yeah.
456
00:28:05,957 --> 00:28:07,758
That would be my view,
457
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:09,893
and I suspect that, um,
458
00:28:09,895 --> 00:28:13,163
well, there are,
what, 535 members of
the U.S. congress,
459
00:28:13,165 --> 00:28:17,668
and one has said
that he doesn't believe
in a supreme being?
460
00:28:17,670 --> 00:28:20,370
That's statistically
not possible.
461
00:28:20,372 --> 00:28:22,673
I mean,
462
00:28:22,675 --> 00:28:27,878
a fair number of those members
of congress presumably have
had some sort of education.
463
00:28:30,682 --> 00:28:33,650
There have got to be
a very substantial number
464
00:28:33,652 --> 00:28:37,187
of atheistic members
of the United States congress,
465
00:28:37,189 --> 00:28:41,458
probably more than
a couple of hundred
would be my guess.
466
00:28:41,460 --> 00:28:43,460
And yet they cannot admit it,
467
00:28:43,462 --> 00:28:46,029
and so in order to get elected,
468
00:28:46,031 --> 00:28:50,067
you have got to lie
about your beliefs.
469
00:28:50,069 --> 00:28:52,703
I think that's right,
and I think it's good
to call them on it.
470
00:28:52,705 --> 00:28:54,972
I disagree with you
slightly, maybe because
471
00:28:54,974 --> 00:28:57,407
I've spent a lot more
time in this country.
472
00:28:57,409 --> 00:28:59,176
I would say,
473
00:28:59,178 --> 00:29:03,347
if people don't
hold their religion
on their sleeve,
474
00:29:03,349 --> 00:29:05,349
then it's not relevant to them,
475
00:29:05,351 --> 00:29:07,484
then it's not in
the public domain,
476
00:29:07,486 --> 00:29:09,286
and journalists
needn't ask
questions about it.
477
00:29:09,288 --> 00:29:11,188
But if they do hold
their religion
on their sleeve,
478
00:29:11,190 --> 00:29:14,124
then it becomes
in the public domain,
and it becomes
479
00:29:14,126 --> 00:29:16,159
appropriate
for journalists
to bring it up.
480
00:29:16,161 --> 00:29:18,662
Because then it's an action.
They're saying, "elect me
481
00:29:18,664 --> 00:29:20,230
because I'm
a person of faith."
482
00:29:20,232 --> 00:29:22,666
But I'm coming back
483
00:29:22,668 --> 00:29:24,735
to the nub
of the question,
which is that,
484
00:29:24,737 --> 00:29:29,306
even if they don't take
any action based upon it...
485
00:29:29,308 --> 00:29:32,309
I mean, an extreme example,
486
00:29:32,311 --> 00:29:35,979
which I actually published
on a blog somewhere,
487
00:29:35,981 --> 00:29:39,249
was a hypothetical doctor
who doesn't believe
488
00:29:39,251 --> 00:29:41,318
in the sex theory
of reproduction,
489
00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:43,887
believes in
the stork theory of...
490
00:29:43,889 --> 00:29:46,290
Of reproduction.
491
00:29:46,292 --> 00:29:48,592
I thought I was pushing
to the limit.
492
00:29:48,594 --> 00:29:51,662
I assumed that everybody
would agree with me,
at least here,
493
00:29:51,664 --> 00:29:54,498
that you would not wish
to consult such a doctor.
494
00:29:54,500 --> 00:29:58,035
Not a bit of it.
I was kicked around the room.
495
00:29:58,037 --> 00:30:01,204
"The doctor's private beliefs
are his private beliefs.
496
00:30:01,206 --> 00:30:04,141
"They're no
business of yours.
So long as he can
497
00:30:04,143 --> 00:30:06,743
"take your appendix out
or whatever he has to do,
498
00:30:06,745 --> 00:30:09,546
"then it doesn't matter
that he doesn't
believe in sex,
499
00:30:09,548 --> 00:30:11,982
he believes in
the stork theory."
500
00:30:11,984 --> 00:30:14,017
That's where we're
disagreeing, because...
501
00:30:14,019 --> 00:30:17,654
Because the stork theory
is relevant to his career
as a doctor...
502
00:30:17,656 --> 00:30:19,823
Make him an eye doctor then.
503
00:30:19,825 --> 00:30:22,659
Then I'd have to say,
for a politician,
504
00:30:22,661 --> 00:30:25,796
I think there are
rights to privacy.
505
00:30:25,798 --> 00:30:29,032
I mean, I think
if someone believes
506
00:30:29,034 --> 00:30:31,568
that it's okay for them
to have sex with animals,
507
00:30:31,570 --> 00:30:35,339
I shouldn't ask that question
as long as they don't make it
a campaign platform.
508
00:30:35,341 --> 00:30:37,441
And-and-and...
509
00:30:37,443 --> 00:30:40,444
And so I happen to think
that there some a right
to privacy,
510
00:30:40,446 --> 00:30:44,281
in the sense that
if you don't wear it
on your sleeve.
511
00:30:44,283 --> 00:30:47,317
And these candidates
do wear it on their sleeve,
including Obama.
512
00:30:47,319 --> 00:30:50,087
And I think once
you bring that up,
513
00:30:50,089 --> 00:30:51,888
then it becomes fair game.
514
00:30:51,890 --> 00:30:53,890
Now, let's end with...
Because you pointed out
515
00:30:53,892 --> 00:30:56,126
that there's one
member of congress...
516
00:30:56,128 --> 00:30:58,128
And I didn't know
there were that many...
517
00:30:58,130 --> 00:31:01,264
Who argues that
he doesn't believe
in a supreme being.
518
00:31:01,266 --> 00:31:03,900
I just wrote an article
about a study
519
00:31:03,902 --> 00:31:06,203
that's been done
by a group
of psychologists
520
00:31:06,205 --> 00:31:08,438
in Canada
and the United States...
521
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:10,507
It's just
been published...
522
00:31:10,509 --> 00:31:14,978
That asks what groups
people distrust,
523
00:31:14,980 --> 00:31:17,214
and it turns out
524
00:31:17,216 --> 00:31:20,217
the group that is
distrusted the most
are atheists.
525
00:31:20,219 --> 00:31:24,121
Well, they're
not quite the most.
They're on par with rapists.
526
00:31:25,824 --> 00:31:29,626
And I wonder
if you could comment.
527
00:31:29,628 --> 00:31:33,563
Well, that seems to me
to be an adequate explanation
528
00:31:33,565 --> 00:31:36,767
for why so many members
of the United States congress
529
00:31:36,769 --> 00:31:39,202
are obviously lying
about their private beliefs.
530
00:31:39,204 --> 00:31:43,740
I mean, if you're
on a par with rapists...
531
00:31:43,742 --> 00:31:47,978
I suspect that we've already had
532
00:31:47,980 --> 00:31:51,615
in this country quite a number
of atheist presidents.
I suspect.
533
00:31:51,617 --> 00:31:55,318
It wouldn't surprise me
in the least if Kennedy
was an atheist.
534
00:31:55,320 --> 00:31:58,088
It wouldn't surprise me
if Clinton was an atheist.
535
00:31:58,090 --> 00:32:00,991
It wouldn't surprise me
if Obama's an atheist.
536
00:32:00,993 --> 00:32:05,295
But you cannot admit it
or you simply don't
get elected.
537
00:32:05,297 --> 00:32:08,865
I would like to start
a campaign for
538
00:32:08,867 --> 00:32:13,170
lame-duck presidents
and senators and people
to say, "okay,
539
00:32:13,172 --> 00:32:16,840
"I'm not standing
for election anymore.
540
00:32:16,842 --> 00:32:20,277
I'm an atheist.
I've been an atheist
all along."
541
00:32:50,975 --> 00:32:53,276
Yes.
542
00:32:57,648 --> 00:33:00,283
Yes, that's right.
543
00:33:04,021 --> 00:33:06,256
And here we've got
Darren waiting for you.
544
00:33:06,258 --> 00:33:08,825
Hi, how are you doing?
Hi, Lawrence. Darren.
How's it going?
545
00:33:08,827 --> 00:33:10,360
Hi, nice to see you.
546
00:33:10,362 --> 00:33:13,196
So if you want to have a seat...
547
00:33:22,540 --> 00:33:24,508
She said it's never
been so hard,
548
00:33:24,510 --> 00:33:26,977
never been
so challenging.
Oh, no.
549
00:33:42,026 --> 00:33:46,463
Okay, we're
heading out, eh?
Yes, let's go. Yep.
550
00:33:46,465 --> 00:33:48,265
We're set up.
551
00:33:48,267 --> 00:33:50,867
What do you know?
It looks like a real
place to interview.
552
00:33:50,869 --> 00:33:54,504
And so these mics work?
I don't have to wear one?
553
00:33:54,506 --> 00:33:56,106
That's right.
That's good.
554
00:33:56,108 --> 00:33:58,608
Ready in three, two...
555
00:34:01,613 --> 00:34:05,682
Lawrence krauss,
welcome to one plus one.
It's great to be here.
556
00:34:05,684 --> 00:34:07,484
Albert Einstein was once
quoted as saying,
557
00:34:07,486 --> 00:34:09,853
"if you can't explain it
to a six-year-old,
558
00:34:09,855 --> 00:34:11,855
you don't
understand it yourself."
559
00:34:11,857 --> 00:34:13,557
Your latest book,
a universe from nothing,
560
00:34:13,559 --> 00:34:15,692
deals with some
fairly weighty topics.
561
00:34:15,694 --> 00:34:17,994
How would you explain it
to a six-year-old
562
00:34:17,996 --> 00:34:20,096
that the universe
came from nothing?
563
00:34:20,098 --> 00:34:23,366
Oh, well, you...
564
00:34:23,368 --> 00:34:26,069
I see what you mean,
but it's very unjust.
565
00:34:26,071 --> 00:34:28,471
I mean, telling children
they're going to hell
566
00:34:28,473 --> 00:34:32,542
is surely by any
standards wicked.
I mean, that's just evil.
567
00:34:32,544 --> 00:34:35,211
But I am not
568
00:34:35,213 --> 00:34:37,714
doing anything remotely
comparable to that.
569
00:34:37,716 --> 00:34:40,483
What I'm doing
is telling children,
"think for yourself.
570
00:34:40,485 --> 00:34:42,519
Look for the evidence."
571
00:34:42,521 --> 00:34:45,855
I'm not saying, "this is
the way it is. You'd
better believe it or else."
572
00:34:45,857 --> 00:34:48,024
Well, it's funny,
because six-year-olds
573
00:34:48,026 --> 00:34:50,994
are a lot less biased
than adults often,
574
00:34:50,996 --> 00:34:53,229
and the neat thing is,
I'd probably tell them that
575
00:34:53,231 --> 00:34:55,365
nothing is not exactly
what they thought it was.
576
00:34:55,367 --> 00:34:58,134
It was a little bit different.
That the laws of physics
577
00:34:58,136 --> 00:35:01,104
tell you that even
empty space is much more
interesting than you thought.
578
00:35:01,106 --> 00:35:04,240
Empty space is a boiling,
bubbling brew of stuff
579
00:35:04,242 --> 00:35:07,344
that's popping
in and out of existence
every second.
580
00:35:07,346 --> 00:35:11,548
And what's more amazing
is that we've learned
that if you take
581
00:35:11,550 --> 00:35:14,084
just a bit of space
and get rid of
all the particles
582
00:35:14,086 --> 00:35:16,219
and all the radiation
and everything,
583
00:35:16,221 --> 00:35:19,723
that it still weighs something,
and we don't understand why.
584
00:35:19,725 --> 00:35:21,925
Lawrence krauss,
thanks for joining us
on one plus one.
585
00:35:21,927 --> 00:35:23,727
Thank you very much.
It's been a pleasure.
586
00:35:25,097 --> 00:35:27,230
Excellent.
Wonderful.
587
00:35:27,232 --> 00:35:30,433
Thank you very much.
Thanks a lot.
It was nice doing it.
588
00:35:30,435 --> 00:35:32,102
There's a dot.
589
00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:38,408
What a disgusting idea.
590
00:35:38,410 --> 00:35:40,877
I mean, the idea
that the only way to
forgive somebody
591
00:35:40,879 --> 00:35:42,779
is to have a scapegoat,
592
00:35:42,781 --> 00:35:45,281
to have your own son
tortured and killed
593
00:35:45,283 --> 00:35:47,283
because there's
no other way to forgive,
594
00:35:47,285 --> 00:35:50,553
the idea that
there can be
no forgiveness
595
00:35:50,555 --> 00:35:53,923
without bloodshed,
without punishment,
596
00:35:53,925 --> 00:35:57,394
is an ancient idea,
and it's a horrible one.
597
00:35:57,396 --> 00:36:00,864
In the particular case
of the doctrine
of original sin,
598
00:36:00,866 --> 00:36:03,833
the original sin
is suppose to have been
committed by Adam,
599
00:36:03,835 --> 00:36:05,669
who, as we now know,
never existed.
600
00:36:05,671 --> 00:36:08,672
So we now have
the preposterous idea
that Jesus was sacrificed,
601
00:36:08,674 --> 00:36:11,741
the scapegoat was sacrificed,
602
00:36:11,743 --> 00:36:14,778
for the sin of
a nonexistent forbear.
603
00:36:24,488 --> 00:36:28,024
That's the fellow who
finally let me in. He was
out having a phone call.
604
00:36:28,026 --> 00:36:30,794
Yes, yeah.
Hi, I'm Jenny.
How are you?
605
00:36:30,796 --> 00:36:34,564
Hi. Good. I'm glad
there's someone here
to actually do this.
606
00:36:34,566 --> 00:36:36,533
26 to 8:00.
607
00:36:36,535 --> 00:36:38,301
Hop over there, Lawrence.
There you go.
608
00:36:38,303 --> 00:36:40,136
It's good to see you again.
609
00:36:40,138 --> 00:36:41,938
It is 26 to 8:00
on 702.
610
00:36:41,940 --> 00:36:43,940
Lawrence krauss is our guest.
611
00:36:43,942 --> 00:36:46,576
His latest book is called
a universe from nothing.
612
00:36:46,578 --> 00:36:49,179
You're saying the universe
continues to get weirder.
Are there moments when
613
00:36:49,181 --> 00:36:52,148
we might break through
and things suddenly make
more sense for you?
614
00:36:52,150 --> 00:36:55,118
'Cause some of the stuff
you do really upsets
some people
615
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:57,620
and really inspires
other people to back
their own beliefs.
616
00:36:57,622 --> 00:37:01,224
Would you prefer that
it was just an esoteric,
academic discussion?
617
00:37:01,226 --> 00:37:03,460
No, it's not esoteric.
These are wonderful things.
618
00:37:03,462 --> 00:37:05,895
Everyone should be
talking about them.
619
00:37:05,897 --> 00:37:09,099
It's some of the most
beautiful ideas and discoveries
humans have ever made.
620
00:37:09,101 --> 00:37:11,601
And if it upsets people,
how can learning about
621
00:37:11,603 --> 00:37:13,803
how the universe
really works
upset people?
622
00:37:13,805 --> 00:37:15,605
And it is a shame that it does.
623
00:37:15,607 --> 00:37:18,641
Instead of being threatened
or having our faith threatened
624
00:37:18,643 --> 00:37:20,443
by the discoveries of science,
625
00:37:20,445 --> 00:37:23,179
we should realize
that we should
force our beliefs
626
00:37:23,181 --> 00:37:26,382
to conform to the evidence
of reality rather than
the other way around,
627
00:37:26,384 --> 00:37:29,719
and we should take joy
in the fact that
we are actually here
628
00:37:29,721 --> 00:37:32,489
in this random moment
able to even ask
those questions
629
00:37:32,491 --> 00:37:34,691
and get close enough
to the answers.
630
00:37:34,693 --> 00:37:36,926
We don't have
the ultimate answers.
I don't claim in the book
631
00:37:36,928 --> 00:37:38,828
that I have
the ultimate answers.
632
00:37:38,830 --> 00:37:42,198
I talk about what's
plausible and the fact
that we're learning,
633
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:44,234
we're getting closer
and closer to even
634
00:37:44,236 --> 00:37:46,236
potentially answering
these ultimate questions
635
00:37:46,238 --> 00:37:48,238
is something that
we should all celebrate.
636
00:37:48,240 --> 00:37:50,406
People shouldn't be
threatened by science.
637
00:37:56,380 --> 00:38:00,216
Um, no,
I think that's fine.
Thank you very much.
638
00:38:00,218 --> 00:38:02,051
Well, it's been nice
talking to you.
639
00:38:02,053 --> 00:38:04,320
All right.
Bye, bye.
640
00:38:06,690 --> 00:38:09,659
Lawrence krauss,
as always, a pleasure
to speak with you.
641
00:38:09,661 --> 00:38:12,095
Same here. Thanks.
642
00:38:20,070 --> 00:38:23,640
This is the nicest thing
I've seen in any library
recently.
643
00:38:26,977 --> 00:38:29,012
Can I do that?
644
00:38:29,014 --> 00:38:32,048
Is that pooh over there?
I got to go...
645
00:39:23,167 --> 00:39:25,335
Professor Dawkins,
what do you see,
646
00:39:25,337 --> 00:39:27,971
or rather hope
for the future
of atheism
647
00:39:27,973 --> 00:39:29,973
in the public sphere?
648
00:39:29,975 --> 00:39:34,043
My hope for the future
of atheism is that it will
no longer be necessary.
649
00:39:34,045 --> 00:39:38,248
We don't call ourselves
"a-Thor-ists" and a-Zeus-ists"
650
00:39:38,250 --> 00:39:41,918
and "a-leprechaun-ists"
651
00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:43,920
because it's not necessary.
652
00:39:43,922 --> 00:39:45,722
And my hope is that
the day will come
653
00:39:45,724 --> 00:39:47,757
when it's simply
taken for granted
654
00:39:47,759 --> 00:39:50,827
that everybody doesn't
believe in yahweh
655
00:39:50,829 --> 00:39:53,563
any more than they believe
in Thor and Jupiter.
656
00:39:53,565 --> 00:39:57,433
I think there's some indication
657
00:39:57,435 --> 00:40:01,771
that the religious lobby
is getting increasingly
desperate
658
00:40:01,773 --> 00:40:04,807
and is increasing
the venom and the vitriol
659
00:40:04,809 --> 00:40:06,876
with which they fight back.
660
00:40:06,878 --> 00:40:10,580
And I think what we may
be seeing is the beginning
of the death throes.
661
00:40:10,582 --> 00:40:13,883
And when you see
a wounded animal
in its death throes,
662
00:40:13,885 --> 00:40:15,251
it tends to lash out.
663
00:40:35,706 --> 00:40:38,007
Listen, gentlemen,
664
00:40:38,009 --> 00:40:40,343
can you be quiet for one second?
665
00:40:40,345 --> 00:40:42,412
Nice to see all you
fine, strapping
666
00:40:42,414 --> 00:40:45,848
young gentlemen here
to protest for
your religion.
667
00:40:45,850 --> 00:40:48,985
But like I've been asking,
where are all of your women?
668
00:40:52,023 --> 00:40:55,825
Where are all the women?
Where are all the women?
669
00:40:55,827 --> 00:40:58,661
Where are all the women?
Where are all the women?
670
00:40:58,663 --> 00:41:02,665
Where are all the women?
Where are all the women?
671
00:41:04,134 --> 00:41:06,135
Infidels! Infidels!
672
00:41:06,137 --> 00:41:11,607
Infidels!
Infidels!
Infidels!
673
00:41:31,762 --> 00:41:35,765
¶ Follow me don't follow me ¶
674
00:41:35,767 --> 00:41:40,236
¶ I've got my spine
I've got my orange crush ¶
675
00:41:40,238 --> 00:41:43,006
¶ collar me don't collar me ¶
676
00:41:43,008 --> 00:41:47,610
¶ I've got my spine
I've got my orange crush ¶
677
00:41:47,612 --> 00:41:51,147
¶ we are agents of the free ¶
678
00:41:51,149 --> 00:41:55,885
¶ I've had my fun,
and now it's time to serve ¶
679
00:41:55,887 --> 00:41:59,422
¶ your conscience overseas ¶
680
00:41:59,424 --> 00:42:03,893
¶ coming in fast over me ¶
681
00:42:12,036 --> 00:42:15,405
this is a demonstration...
682
00:42:15,407 --> 00:42:17,473
It's not one that
excludes religious people.
683
00:42:17,475 --> 00:42:19,909
It's one that is inclusive
of all points of view.
684
00:42:29,386 --> 00:42:31,587
It's definitely exciting.
685
00:42:31,589 --> 00:42:34,390
It's definitely exciting,
and it re-enthuses you
686
00:42:34,392 --> 00:42:36,993
to go out and do your thing
687
00:42:36,995 --> 00:42:38,861
and stick to your guns.
688
00:42:38,863 --> 00:42:40,696
We've made so many
amazing friends.
689
00:42:40,698 --> 00:42:43,533
Fantastic people here.
¶ orange crush ¶
690
00:42:43,535 --> 00:42:45,568
¶ collar me, don't collar me ¶
691
00:42:45,570 --> 00:42:47,603
oh, I've talked to
all sorts of people.
692
00:42:47,605 --> 00:42:51,307
Sit down with someone,
and you get up a conversation
without any trouble.
693
00:42:51,309 --> 00:42:54,110
A friendlier sort
there may never be.
694
00:42:54,112 --> 00:42:56,879
¶ I've had my fun ¶
695
00:42:56,881 --> 00:42:59,682
¶ and now it's time to serve ¶
696
00:42:59,684 --> 00:43:02,718
¶ your conscience overseas ¶
697
00:43:02,720 --> 00:43:07,323
¶ coming in fast over me ¶
698
00:43:07,325 --> 00:43:11,060
There is a similarity...
My friend Richard Dawkins,
699
00:43:11,062 --> 00:43:13,262
who is here, was kind enough
to write the afterword
for the book,
700
00:43:13,264 --> 00:43:16,833
and he made a wonderful
comparison, which is that
there's some similarity.
701
00:43:16,835 --> 00:43:19,302
Before Darwin,
life was a miracle.
702
00:43:19,304 --> 00:43:22,772
You couldn't ask, "where
did the diversity of life
come from?" It was a miracle.
703
00:43:22,774 --> 00:43:25,141
It was designed.
What Darwin showed
704
00:43:25,143 --> 00:43:27,610
were very simple
laws of biology.
705
00:43:27,612 --> 00:43:30,146
Natural selection
and genetic mutation,
essentially,
706
00:43:30,148 --> 00:43:32,615
could produce all
the diversity of life,
707
00:43:32,617 --> 00:43:36,285
the complexity we now see,
from very simple beginnings
708
00:43:36,287 --> 00:43:38,721
with no miracle.
709
00:43:38,723 --> 00:43:41,824
Now, at the time he did it,
did it prove it? No.
710
00:43:41,826 --> 00:43:46,362
But it was plausible.
Now there's been
150 years of proof.
711
00:43:46,364 --> 00:43:50,299
Now we take it the next step.
Do we know how the first
forms of life started?
712
00:43:50,301 --> 00:43:51,801
Absolutely not.
713
00:43:51,803 --> 00:43:53,803
But it's certainly plausible
714
00:43:53,805 --> 00:43:57,073
that, given everything
we know about genetics,
biochemistry,
715
00:43:57,075 --> 00:44:00,376
that chemistry
by natural processes
can turn into biology.
716
00:44:00,378 --> 00:44:02,245
Do we know that? No.
But it's plausible.
717
00:44:02,247 --> 00:44:04,780
And that's worth celebrating...
That you don't need miracles.
718
00:44:04,782 --> 00:44:07,049
And the same is true
for the universe.
719
00:44:07,051 --> 00:44:10,153
We've taken from biology
to that fundamental question,
720
00:44:10,155 --> 00:44:13,689
which was the last bastion,
for many people, of God:
721
00:44:13,691 --> 00:44:16,792
"Why is there something
rather than nothing?
And said, "you don't need him."
722
00:44:16,794 --> 00:44:19,729
If this is the case,
and our universe
723
00:44:19,731 --> 00:44:22,832
just popped into existence
and space and time
724
00:44:22,834 --> 00:44:25,835
were created in our universe
the moment it came
into existence,
725
00:44:25,837 --> 00:44:27,970
along with the laws
of physics we measure,
726
00:44:27,972 --> 00:44:30,573
then there's an object,
if you want to call it that,
727
00:44:30,575 --> 00:44:32,608
that is greater
than our universe.
728
00:44:32,610 --> 00:44:34,610
We call it in physics now
the multiverse,
729
00:44:34,612 --> 00:44:36,712
in which case
there are many
possible universes.
730
00:44:36,714 --> 00:44:39,048
From a philosophical
perspective,
731
00:44:39,050 --> 00:44:41,317
people have a problem
with a universe that
had a beginning.
732
00:44:41,319 --> 00:44:44,053
'Cause they want
something eternal
733
00:44:44,055 --> 00:44:45,821
with no cause...
First cause,
734
00:44:45,823 --> 00:44:48,791
prime mover... you pick
your philosophy or theology.
735
00:44:48,793 --> 00:44:51,027
The point is that the multiverse
736
00:44:51,029 --> 00:44:53,396
now serves the role
of the prime mover.
737
00:44:53,398 --> 00:44:55,398
From a philosophical
perspective,
738
00:44:55,400 --> 00:44:57,099
it can be eternal.
739
00:44:57,101 --> 00:44:59,969
It could be eternal
and certainly beyond
our universe.
740
00:44:59,971 --> 00:45:03,139
But the thing I also want to
point out... I've debated with
Christian apologists often,
741
00:45:03,141 --> 00:45:06,842
and they say,
"you invented the multiverse
'cause you don't like God."
742
00:45:06,844 --> 00:45:10,279
Well, it's true
I don't like God.
743
00:45:10,281 --> 00:45:12,582
But the multiverse was proposed
744
00:45:12,584 --> 00:45:15,451
because the laws of physics
are driving us to it.
745
00:45:15,453 --> 00:45:18,721
I don't even like
the multiverse, but if nature
tells me that's the case,
746
00:45:18,723 --> 00:45:22,258
and the laws of physics
are accidental,
I've got to live with it.
747
00:45:22,260 --> 00:45:25,328
So, to conclude,
748
00:45:25,330 --> 00:45:28,264
I've told you today
the universe can
come from nothing.
749
00:45:28,266 --> 00:45:30,166
More importantly, I've told you
750
00:45:30,168 --> 00:45:33,302
that you were far more
insignificant than
you ever thought,
751
00:45:33,304 --> 00:45:38,341
and that's what I want you
to celebrate here today.
752
00:45:38,343 --> 00:45:40,176
But instead of taking...
753
00:45:40,178 --> 00:45:42,311
People say science takes away
spiritual fulfillment
754
00:45:42,313 --> 00:45:44,380
and wonder and awe
and happiness.
755
00:45:44,382 --> 00:45:48,217
You should be happier
because you're insignificant
and the future's miserable
756
00:45:48,219 --> 00:45:51,053
'cause you're here today
and you're endowed
757
00:45:51,055 --> 00:45:53,256
by evolution
with a conscience
and an intelligence
758
00:45:53,258 --> 00:45:55,291
and you can ask these questions.
759
00:45:55,293 --> 00:45:57,860
So instead of being depressed
and requiring meaning
760
00:45:57,862 --> 00:45:59,895
in the universe
beyond your own existence,
761
00:45:59,897 --> 00:46:01,897
you create your own meaning
762
00:46:01,899 --> 00:46:04,734
and enjoy your brief
moment in the sun.
Thank you very much.
763
00:46:13,043 --> 00:46:15,945
But the problem is that
most people, most of the time,
764
00:46:15,947 --> 00:46:19,615
are desperate to
believe ridiculous
765
00:46:19,617 --> 00:46:23,219
and divisive ideas for
patently emotional reasons.
766
00:46:23,221 --> 00:46:24,820
And while rarely explicit,
767
00:46:24,822 --> 00:46:26,922
what they're really
worried about is death.
768
00:46:26,924 --> 00:46:30,726
When we're arguing
about teaching evolution
in the schools,
769
00:46:30,728 --> 00:46:33,829
I would argue that
we are really
arguing about death.
770
00:46:33,831 --> 00:46:35,831
It seems to me
the only reason why
771
00:46:35,833 --> 00:46:38,401
any religious person
cares about evolution
772
00:46:38,403 --> 00:46:42,872
is because if their holy books
are wrong about our origins,
773
00:46:42,874 --> 00:46:46,108
they're very likely
wrong about our destiny
after death.
774
00:46:50,147 --> 00:46:52,682
Ex-muslims like me
775
00:46:52,684 --> 00:46:55,151
in Europe and in north America
776
00:46:55,153 --> 00:46:57,219
are growing in number.
777
00:46:57,221 --> 00:47:01,590
We give speeches,
we publish articles
and books,
778
00:47:01,592 --> 00:47:03,726
and we communicate
with one another.
779
00:47:03,728 --> 00:47:07,530
"Infidel"
was the epithet,
an insult
780
00:47:07,532 --> 00:47:09,799
that was thrown at me
over and over again
781
00:47:09,801 --> 00:47:12,802
by family and former
Muslim friends.
782
00:47:12,804 --> 00:47:16,205
It is a label that I now wear
783
00:47:16,207 --> 00:47:19,608
with pride and joy.
784
00:47:21,511 --> 00:47:23,713
We're in a brand-new
age for religions.
785
00:47:23,715 --> 00:47:26,982
For millennia, religions
did not have to worry
786
00:47:26,984 --> 00:47:30,252
about the flock
787
00:47:30,254 --> 00:47:31,987
acquiring lots of information
788
00:47:31,989 --> 00:47:34,156
about other religions
or about their own religion.
789
00:47:34,158 --> 00:47:38,594
These religions evolved
culturally in a world
790
00:47:38,596 --> 00:47:40,896
of easy-to-maintain
ignorance.
791
00:47:40,898 --> 00:47:43,399
But the new transparency
of information brought about
792
00:47:43,401 --> 00:47:46,869
by technology, cell phones,
the Internet and all the rest
793
00:47:46,871 --> 00:47:49,238
is the first
really drastic change
794
00:47:49,240 --> 00:47:52,875
in the epistemological
environment that religions
795
00:47:52,877 --> 00:47:55,211
have had to face
in several millennia.
796
00:47:55,213 --> 00:47:57,480
Thanks for your attention.
797
00:48:02,152 --> 00:48:05,087
To many, he's known
as an evolutionary biologist.
798
00:48:05,089 --> 00:48:07,523
He's a champion
of science and reason.
799
00:48:07,525 --> 00:48:10,493
He's convinced
many around the world
that it's more than okay
800
00:48:10,495 --> 00:48:11,994
to come out as an atheist.
801
00:48:11,996 --> 00:48:14,063
Please welcome to the stage
802
00:48:14,065 --> 00:48:15,965
our final speaker of day two
803
00:48:15,967 --> 00:48:19,602
of the global
atheists convention,
Richard Dawkins.
804
00:48:28,745 --> 00:48:32,782
I want to take back
"intelligent design."
805
00:48:32,784 --> 00:48:37,219
I want to take back
other hijacked words.
806
00:48:37,221 --> 00:48:39,855
Just as the feminists
have rallied around
the phrase
807
00:48:39,857 --> 00:48:41,791
"take back the night,"
808
00:48:41,793 --> 00:48:44,427
maybe we should take back
"intelligent design"
809
00:48:44,429 --> 00:48:46,429
in the true sense of the word.
810
00:48:46,431 --> 00:48:48,464
Let's take back morality,
811
00:48:48,466 --> 00:48:50,933
let's redesign our morality,
812
00:48:50,935 --> 00:48:53,836
rather than
trying to read
what's right and wrong
813
00:48:53,838 --> 00:48:56,138
in a 3,000-year-old book.
814
00:48:56,140 --> 00:49:00,910
Religion has hijacked
morality for centuries.
815
00:49:00,912 --> 00:49:03,712
Let's take it back
and intelligently design it.
816
00:49:03,714 --> 00:49:06,248
Let's intelligently
design our lives,
817
00:49:06,250 --> 00:49:10,186
rather than be dictated to
by priests and mullahs.
818
00:49:10,188 --> 00:49:12,721
Let's intelligently
design our future
819
00:49:12,723 --> 00:49:14,857
using the gift of foresight,
820
00:49:14,859 --> 00:49:18,494
something that
never existed
before brains...
821
00:49:18,496 --> 00:49:23,299
And for practical purposes,
that means human brains...
evolved.
822
00:49:23,301 --> 00:49:26,202
The ability to design
823
00:49:26,204 --> 00:49:29,738
is one of the crowning
glories of our species.
824
00:49:29,740 --> 00:49:31,507
Bridges, planes, buildings,
825
00:49:31,509 --> 00:49:33,676
all sorts of
ingenious contraptions.
826
00:49:33,678 --> 00:49:36,879
The essence of design
in this true sense
of the word
827
00:49:36,881 --> 00:49:39,215
is deliberate foresight.
828
00:49:39,217 --> 00:49:41,984
Human designers can
look into the future
829
00:49:41,986 --> 00:49:44,086
and see the possible mistakes,
830
00:49:44,088 --> 00:49:46,121
see the possible pitfalls,
831
00:49:46,123 --> 00:49:48,290
try things out
in imagination...
832
00:49:48,292 --> 00:49:51,126
Above all, look
into the future,
which is something
833
00:49:51,128 --> 00:49:54,129
natural selection cannot do.
834
00:49:54,131 --> 00:49:56,665
This is one of the major
misunderstandings
of evolution.
835
00:49:56,667 --> 00:49:58,367
People are so used to the idea
836
00:49:58,369 --> 00:50:02,037
that natural selection
produces apparently
good design
837
00:50:02,039 --> 00:50:05,441
that they think that
natural selection
must be capable
838
00:50:05,443 --> 00:50:09,278
of peering
into the future,
of taking steps
839
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:12,982
to stop the species
going extinct,
for example.
840
00:50:12,984 --> 00:50:15,818
Never happens.
It cannot happen.
841
00:50:15,820 --> 00:50:18,420
Nature cannot plan
for the future;
842
00:50:18,422 --> 00:50:20,222
the human brain can.
843
00:50:20,224 --> 00:50:22,525
We can look at trends
in the present
844
00:50:22,527 --> 00:50:24,960
and extrapolate into the future.
845
00:50:24,962 --> 00:50:27,429
We can foresee
possible scenarios
846
00:50:27,431 --> 00:50:29,865
that might lead to
our species going extinct
847
00:50:29,867 --> 00:50:32,535
and take steps to avoid it.
848
00:50:32,537 --> 00:50:34,036
Thank you very much.
849
00:50:43,114 --> 00:50:47,349
How many people do you have
to kill to be a murderer?
850
00:50:47,351 --> 00:50:49,318
Just one.
Just one.
851
00:50:49,320 --> 00:50:52,221
How many lies do you have to
tell to be a liar? Just one.
852
00:50:52,223 --> 00:50:55,157
You fucking suck!
853
00:50:55,159 --> 00:50:56,892
The Bible says...
854
00:50:56,894 --> 00:51:00,396
The Bible says,
"you shall not take the name
of the lord in vain."
855
00:51:02,633 --> 00:51:07,169
What I find humorous
is you will not curse
Allah or Mohammad,
856
00:51:07,171 --> 00:51:10,105
but Jesus is in every one
of your conversations.
857
00:51:12,810 --> 00:51:16,645
Science means knowledge?
858
00:51:16,647 --> 00:51:19,081
When you take the name
of my savior Jesus Christ
in vain,
859
00:51:19,083 --> 00:51:21,016
you do it with
an inherent knowledge,
860
00:51:21,018 --> 00:51:23,953
an intuitive knowledge,
that it is wrong,
861
00:51:23,955 --> 00:51:26,589
that it is born
out of your sinful heart.
862
00:51:26,591 --> 00:51:30,326
My friends, what I'm saying
is you're not just atheists,
863
00:51:30,328 --> 00:51:31,827
you're liars.
864
00:51:52,515 --> 00:51:54,383
Whoo!
865
00:52:32,255 --> 00:52:34,690
I guess the best part
of communicating
866
00:52:34,692 --> 00:52:36,425
is the excitement.
867
00:52:36,427 --> 00:52:39,628
Science turns us on.
Science is fun.
Science excites us.
868
00:52:39,630 --> 00:52:42,998
You can't communicate
unless you're excited,
but on the other hand,
869
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:45,634
I feel it's so
fascinating for me
870
00:52:45,636 --> 00:52:47,536
that I want to tell
people about it.
871
00:52:47,538 --> 00:52:49,338
Carl sagan said,
872
00:52:49,340 --> 00:52:51,607
"when you're in love,
you want to tell the world."
873
00:52:51,609 --> 00:52:55,778
I'm in love with science,
and I have to tell the world.
874
00:52:58,715 --> 00:53:01,150
But we mustn't run away
with the idea that
science is just fun.
875
00:53:01,152 --> 00:53:03,686
Science is hard.
Yeah.
876
00:53:03,688 --> 00:53:06,922
And so it's not fun
in the sense that
it's just sort of...
877
00:53:06,924 --> 00:53:10,826
Easy, and you can
laze around doing it.
It is hard.
878
00:53:10,828 --> 00:53:12,461
It's hard work.
But it's worth it.
879
00:53:35,085 --> 00:53:37,419
Something I didn't know...
I don't know if you knew...
880
00:53:37,421 --> 00:53:41,623
That the royal society
St. Andrew.
881
00:53:41,625 --> 00:53:43,959
St. Andrew?
Yeah.
882
00:53:43,961 --> 00:53:45,994
Why not doubting Thomas?
883
00:53:45,996 --> 00:53:48,230
He'd be the proper
patron Saint of science.
That'd be perfect.
884
00:53:48,232 --> 00:53:50,566
Doubting Thomas,
because that's what
it's all about.
885
00:53:52,602 --> 00:53:55,838
For me, this is the legacy
of modern civilization.
886
00:53:55,840 --> 00:53:59,842
This is what it's all about,
and this is a legacy
887
00:53:59,844 --> 00:54:01,810
that's worth preserving
888
00:54:01,812 --> 00:54:04,913
and sharing more broadly,
and it's under attack.
889
00:54:04,915 --> 00:54:08,350
Yes, I see the history
of science, modern science,
890
00:54:08,352 --> 00:54:10,753
as weaning off
the wisdom of old books
891
00:54:10,755 --> 00:54:15,924
and onto the wisdom
of observation and experiment.
892
00:54:15,926 --> 00:54:18,994
There's a lovely story about
893
00:54:18,996 --> 00:54:20,929
Galileo being
visited by somebody,
894
00:54:20,931 --> 00:54:25,434
and Galileo showed this person
something through his telescope,
895
00:54:25,436 --> 00:54:28,537
and it contradicted
what he thought before,
896
00:54:28,539 --> 00:54:31,173
and eventually he said,
"Mr. Galileo, your demonstration
897
00:54:31,175 --> 00:54:33,809
"is so convincing,
that were it not
898
00:54:33,811 --> 00:54:36,044
"that Aristotle
positively states
the contrary,
899
00:54:36,046 --> 00:54:37,513
I would believe you."
900
00:54:37,515 --> 00:54:39,948
He was actually looking
through a telescope.
901
00:55:01,604 --> 00:55:03,705
It's surprising in some sense
902
00:55:03,707 --> 00:55:07,075
that we're talked about
as being arrogant for
somehow saying
903
00:55:07,077 --> 00:55:09,244
we create our own importance,
904
00:55:09,246 --> 00:55:11,713
that our knowledge
and our understanding
905
00:55:11,715 --> 00:55:14,416
and the way we live our lives
is what makes our importance.
906
00:55:14,418 --> 00:55:18,220
People don't seem to recognize
that a universe that's
created for us
907
00:55:18,222 --> 00:55:20,022
is a little more arrogant.
908
00:55:20,024 --> 00:55:22,324
Incredibly arrogant, yes.
909
00:55:22,326 --> 00:55:26,161
And for me,
that's the most powerful
910
00:55:26,163 --> 00:55:28,964
and enlivening thing
is the fact that more
911
00:55:28,966 --> 00:55:31,166
unimportant we become,
the more powerful
912
00:55:31,168 --> 00:55:35,370
is the importance of science
for pointing out that
913
00:55:35,372 --> 00:55:38,173
the universe exists
whether we like it or not.
914
00:55:38,175 --> 00:55:41,610
That cosmic humility
is the exact opposite of what
we're often accused of.
915
00:55:41,612 --> 00:55:43,412
Science is responsible
916
00:55:43,414 --> 00:55:46,715
for the justified
humility of humanity,
917
00:55:46,717 --> 00:55:49,184
which is a new thing.
918
00:56:04,267 --> 00:56:07,069
Richard, I remember vividly
919
00:56:07,071 --> 00:56:10,539
the very first time
we had a discussion
that we disagreed.
920
00:56:10,541 --> 00:56:13,542
I argued to you
that I thought that
921
00:56:13,544 --> 00:56:16,178
if you were trying
to convince people
of your point,
922
00:56:16,180 --> 00:56:19,982
the first thing you shouldn't
say is, "everything you
believe is wrong,
923
00:56:19,984 --> 00:56:22,017
and you're really stupid,"
924
00:56:22,019 --> 00:56:25,721
and it's better
to try and sort of
go where they are.
925
00:56:25,723 --> 00:56:29,191
Yeah, I mean, I think
926
00:56:29,193 --> 00:56:32,828
I myself have been
convinced of somebody
telling me,
927
00:56:32,830 --> 00:56:34,396
"everything you believe
is rubbish."
928
00:56:34,398 --> 00:56:37,532
As a student,
I was very
persuaded by
929
00:56:37,534 --> 00:56:41,370
that old
French theologian,
teilhard de chardin,
930
00:56:41,372 --> 00:56:43,705
who wrote a book called
the phenomenon of man,
931
00:56:43,707 --> 00:56:45,607
which is...
932
00:56:45,609 --> 00:56:47,309
Pretentious gibberish,
933
00:56:47,311 --> 00:56:50,445
but it fooled me
when I was a student.
934
00:56:50,447 --> 00:56:52,648
And then I read Peter medawar's
935
00:56:52,650 --> 00:56:55,884
brilliant review
of the book, which is
936
00:56:55,886 --> 00:57:00,355
almost certainly the best
negative book review
ever written.
937
00:57:00,357 --> 00:57:02,758
And I was completely
turned around by that,
938
00:57:02,760 --> 00:57:06,128
even though you might think
I'd have pushed back
939
00:57:06,130 --> 00:57:09,698
and said, "wait a minute.
You're insulting
my intelligence."
940
00:57:09,700 --> 00:57:12,200
Well, yes, maybe you are
insulting my intelligence.
941
00:57:12,202 --> 00:57:14,536
I deserve to have
my intelligence insulted.
942
00:57:14,538 --> 00:57:16,838
People get...
In fact, there's a lot of...
943
00:57:16,840 --> 00:57:20,475
There's a lot of research
that says pedagogically,
944
00:57:20,477 --> 00:57:22,811
the only way you can
really get people
to learn
945
00:57:22,813 --> 00:57:26,415
is by confronting
their own misconceptions
and using them.
946
00:57:26,417 --> 00:57:28,917
I use it in physics
all the time.
947
00:57:28,919 --> 00:57:30,886
Kids learn stuff on...
948
00:57:30,888 --> 00:57:33,989
You write stuff on
the blackboard, it goes in
one ear and out the other,
949
00:57:33,991 --> 00:57:36,792
but if you confront
a belief they have
and show them immediately
950
00:57:36,794 --> 00:57:40,295
that they can see
for themselves it's crazy,
then they remember it.
951
00:57:40,297 --> 00:57:41,863
Yes.
952
00:57:47,637 --> 00:57:50,973
This weekend, the "reason" rally
took over the national mall
953
00:57:50,975 --> 00:57:52,941
here in Washington, D.C.
954
00:57:52,943 --> 00:57:55,644
Billed as the largest gathering
of the secular movement
in world history,
955
00:57:55,646 --> 00:58:01,016
national mall parks service
estimated that over 30,000
people were in attendance.
956
00:58:01,018 --> 00:58:03,318
And despite the rain,
the participants
waited for hours
957
00:58:03,320 --> 00:58:05,520
to see speakers
like Lawrence krauss,
958
00:58:05,522 --> 00:58:07,622
Richard Dawkins,
Adam savage,
so we have to ask
959
00:58:07,624 --> 00:58:09,858
what the largest gathering
in history of atheists,
960
00:58:09,860 --> 00:58:12,461
humanists, secularists,
free thinkers, skeptics...
961
00:58:12,463 --> 00:58:14,663
What does it really mean?
962
00:58:27,543 --> 00:58:30,479
Hi, I'm David silverman,
president of American atheists,
963
00:58:30,481 --> 00:58:33,281
and I would like to
welcome you all to this,
964
00:58:33,283 --> 00:58:36,852
the largest atheist gathering
in world history.
965
00:58:40,390 --> 00:58:43,425
But I don't believe in God.
I have two proofs
966
00:58:43,427 --> 00:58:45,761
for not believing in God...
first of all, God,
if you're there,
967
00:58:45,763 --> 00:58:48,497
we're here in Washington.
Come down now.
968
00:58:50,266 --> 00:58:52,968
If you're there,
this is a pretty good time.
969
00:58:52,970 --> 00:58:55,971
I'm sure fox news
would love it.
Just come down, say hello.
970
00:58:55,973 --> 00:58:59,374
We are the people
who believe in this life.
971
00:58:59,376 --> 00:59:01,977
We are the people
who believe in morality.
972
00:59:01,979 --> 00:59:05,547
If you are doing something
for reward or punishment,
973
00:59:05,549 --> 00:59:08,383
you do not have morality.
974
00:59:08,385 --> 00:59:10,619
Let's make it
so they're as embarrassed
975
00:59:10,621 --> 00:59:12,687
to say something bad
about atheists
976
00:59:12,689 --> 00:59:15,724
as they are to say
something bad about mormons.
977
00:59:17,093 --> 00:59:18,627
Mormon.
978
00:59:20,296 --> 00:59:22,831
Mormon.
979
00:59:22,833 --> 00:59:25,367
¶ Thank you, God,
for fixing the cataracts ¶
980
00:59:25,369 --> 00:59:27,536
¶ of Sam's mom ¶
981
00:59:27,538 --> 00:59:29,871
¶ I didn't realize
that it was so simple ¶
982
00:59:29,873 --> 00:59:32,607
¶ but you showed a great example
of just how it can be done ¶
983
00:59:32,609 --> 00:59:34,643
¶ they only need to pray
in a particular spot ¶
984
00:59:34,645 --> 00:59:37,012
¶ to a particular version
of a particular God ¶
985
00:59:37,014 --> 00:59:39,581
¶ and if you pull that off
without a hitch ¶
986
00:59:39,583 --> 00:59:43,919
¶ he will fix one eye of one
middle-class white bitch ¶
987
00:59:43,921 --> 00:59:48,090
they are ruled by fear.
988
00:59:48,092 --> 00:59:52,661
That's not my style,
and it's not yours either.
989
00:59:53,996 --> 00:59:57,566
Folks, it's certainly time
that we all grew up.
990
00:59:57,568 --> 01:00:01,036
Instead of forging ahead
into the 14th century,
991
01:00:01,038 --> 01:00:04,139
we should be embracing
the 21st by writing fini
992
01:00:04,141 --> 01:00:07,509
to the belief
in the bigoted,
capricious, cruel,
993
01:00:07,511 --> 01:00:10,345
deceitful, genocidal,
homophobic,
994
01:00:10,347 --> 01:00:12,347
misogynistic, racist,
995
01:00:12,349 --> 01:00:14,382
vindictive and violent bully.
996
01:00:18,588 --> 01:00:21,756
Ladies and gentlemen, thank you.
997
01:00:30,233 --> 01:00:34,503
Folks, Professor
Richard Dawkins.
998
01:00:51,120 --> 01:00:54,089
Richard! Richard!
Richard! Richard!
999
01:01:04,500 --> 01:01:08,870
What a magnificent,
inspiring sight.
1000
01:01:08,872 --> 01:01:12,774
I was expecting great things,
even in fine weather.
1001
01:01:12,776 --> 01:01:14,943
In the rain, look at this.
1002
01:01:14,945 --> 01:01:19,080
This is the most
incredible sight I can
remember ever seeing.
1003
01:01:25,655 --> 01:01:30,025
How is it necessary
to have a rally
1004
01:01:30,027 --> 01:01:33,028
for reason?
1005
01:01:33,030 --> 01:01:36,865
How could anyone rally
1006
01:01:36,867 --> 01:01:38,533
against reason?
1007
01:01:38,535 --> 01:01:41,169
I am often accused of
1008
01:01:41,171 --> 01:01:46,408
expressing contempt
and despising
religious people.
1009
01:01:46,410 --> 01:01:49,377
I don't despise
religious people;
1010
01:01:49,379 --> 01:01:52,614
I despise what they stand for.
1011
01:01:52,616 --> 01:01:55,183
There are too many
people in this country
1012
01:01:55,185 --> 01:01:58,286
who have been cowed into fear
1013
01:01:58,288 --> 01:02:00,789
of coming out as atheists
1014
01:02:00,791 --> 01:02:03,925
or secularists or agnostics.
1015
01:02:03,927 --> 01:02:07,295
We are far more numerous
than anybody realizes.
1016
01:02:11,400 --> 01:02:13,902
What I want to
suggest you do when
you meet somebody
1017
01:02:13,904 --> 01:02:16,705
who claims to be
religious, ask them,
1018
01:02:16,707 --> 01:02:18,807
"do you really believe
1019
01:02:18,809 --> 01:02:21,843
"that when a priest
blesses a wafer,
1020
01:02:21,845 --> 01:02:24,779
"it turns into
the body of Christ?
1021
01:02:24,781 --> 01:02:27,882
Are you seriously telling me
you believe that?"
1022
01:02:29,485 --> 01:02:31,353
Don't fall for the convention
1023
01:02:31,355 --> 01:02:35,523
that we're all too polite
to talk about religion.
1024
01:02:35,525 --> 01:02:37,792
Religion is not off the table.
1025
01:02:37,794 --> 01:02:40,095
Religion is not off limits.
1026
01:02:40,097 --> 01:02:42,998
Religion makes
specific claims
about the universe
1027
01:02:43,000 --> 01:02:45,433
which need to be substantiated
1028
01:02:45,435 --> 01:02:48,937
and need to be challenged
and, if necessary,
1029
01:02:48,939 --> 01:02:52,140
need to be ridiculed
with contempt.
1030
01:02:52,142 --> 01:02:54,075
Thank you very much.
1031
01:03:07,223 --> 01:03:08,890
Lawrence?
Yes, yeah?
1032
01:03:08,892 --> 01:03:10,992
Do you mind
if we get a picture?
No problem.
1033
01:03:14,397 --> 01:03:16,731
Hi.
It is so good
to meet you.
1034
01:03:16,733 --> 01:03:19,601
Can I get a picture
of you real quick?
Sure, yeah.
1035
01:03:19,603 --> 01:03:21,736
I seen you on the TV.
Yeah.
1036
01:03:21,738 --> 01:03:23,772
Hey, Dr. krauss.
Hi.
1037
01:03:23,774 --> 01:03:26,007
Could I shake
your hand too?
Sure.
1038
01:03:26,009 --> 01:03:28,009
Can I shake
your hand really quick?
1039
01:03:28,011 --> 01:03:31,413
Your universe of nothing
speech started my road
to atheism.
1040
01:03:31,415 --> 01:03:33,048
Hi, how are you.
1041
01:03:33,050 --> 01:03:35,450
I'm Kenny hibb
from Tulsa, Oklahoma.
1042
01:03:35,452 --> 01:03:37,819
Oh, okay.
1043
01:03:37,821 --> 01:03:40,188
Went back to school for science.
1044
01:03:40,190 --> 01:03:41,890
I'm a big fan.
1045
01:03:41,892 --> 01:03:44,659
It's not like a pancake.
It's like the space...
1046
01:03:44,661 --> 01:03:47,595
With the x-y axis,
just remain perpendicular.
1047
01:03:47,597 --> 01:03:50,065
And light travels
in a straight line.
Oh, okay.
1048
01:03:50,067 --> 01:03:52,834
Hi, everybody
out there on the mall.
1049
01:03:52,836 --> 01:03:55,437
It's a great honor to be
addressing the reason rally.
1050
01:03:55,439 --> 01:03:57,839
And when you look at
the who's who lists
throughout history
1051
01:03:57,841 --> 01:03:59,741
of people who were either
declared atheists
1052
01:03:59,743 --> 01:04:03,712
or who voiced publicly
their opinion that
religion was bullshit,
1053
01:04:03,714 --> 01:04:07,582
you can feel a swell of pride
as you stand out there
on the mall today.
1054
01:04:07,584 --> 01:04:09,417
Let's let everybody know
1055
01:04:09,419 --> 01:04:12,187
that they can come out of
the closet if they're afraid to,
1056
01:04:12,189 --> 01:04:14,723
because we're here
to support them
and embrace them
1057
01:04:14,725 --> 01:04:16,958
because this is
an amazing community
of people
1058
01:04:16,960 --> 01:04:19,928
who are non-believers,
and I think it's wrong
1059
01:04:19,930 --> 01:04:22,764
that the religious right
and various belief systems
1060
01:04:22,766 --> 01:04:26,334
have gotten a monopoly
on morality and patriotism.
1061
01:04:26,336 --> 01:04:29,938
We are Americans,
and we're moral
and righteous Americans,
1062
01:04:29,940 --> 01:04:31,740
and we don't need
a God to prove it.
1063
01:04:31,742 --> 01:04:33,742
Come on out and join us.
1064
01:04:33,744 --> 01:04:37,746
I have concluded, through
careful, empirical analysis
1065
01:04:37,748 --> 01:04:40,348
and much thought that somebody
is looking out for me,
1066
01:04:40,350 --> 01:04:42,684
keeping track of what
I think about things,
1067
01:04:42,686 --> 01:04:44,619
forgiving me
when I do less
than I ought,
1068
01:04:44,621 --> 01:04:47,889
giving me strength
to shoot for more than
I think I'm capable of.
1069
01:04:47,891 --> 01:04:51,726
I believe they know everything
that I do and think,
and they still love me,
1070
01:04:51,728 --> 01:04:54,429
and I've concluded,
after careful consideration,
1071
01:04:54,431 --> 01:04:57,365
that this person
keeping score is me.
1072
01:05:01,971 --> 01:05:04,072
Immanuel kant was asked,
"what is the enlightenment?"
1073
01:05:04,074 --> 01:05:09,611
"Dare to know."
1074
01:05:11,180 --> 01:05:13,748
The age of reason, then
was an age when humanity
1075
01:05:13,750 --> 01:05:15,683
was born again,
1076
01:05:15,685 --> 01:05:17,485
not from original sin
1077
01:05:17,487 --> 01:05:21,389
but from original ignorance
and dependence on authority.
1078
01:05:21,391 --> 01:05:23,591
Never again!
1079
01:05:24,927 --> 01:05:27,061
Folks, you're in for a treat.
1080
01:05:27,063 --> 01:05:29,564
The author of
the New York times bestseller
1081
01:05:29,566 --> 01:05:31,466
a universe from nothing,
1082
01:05:34,004 --> 01:05:37,439
Please welcome physicist
Dr. Lawrence krauss!
1083
01:05:46,882 --> 01:05:49,083
As was just pointed out,
a few years ago,
1084
01:05:49,085 --> 01:05:52,620
my friend Richard Dawkins
asked me to give a talk
at a meeting
1085
01:05:52,622 --> 01:05:55,256
called the universefrom nothing,
so I did.
1086
01:05:55,258 --> 01:05:59,627
Today I want to
talk about something
that's equally plausible
1087
01:05:59,629 --> 01:06:01,729
but much more tragic:
1088
01:06:01,731 --> 01:06:04,432
How to get nothing
from something.
1089
01:06:04,434 --> 01:06:07,902
It's happened
a number of times
in human history.
1090
01:06:07,904 --> 01:06:10,472
It happened during
the medieval era,
1091
01:06:10,474 --> 01:06:12,707
when religious dogma
1092
01:06:12,709 --> 01:06:15,777
erased the enlightenment
of the greeks.
1093
01:06:15,779 --> 01:06:20,548
Measuring the circumference
of the earth, all of that,
was forgotten.
1094
01:06:20,550 --> 01:06:23,485
It happened in the arabic world
1095
01:06:23,487 --> 01:06:26,921
in the 11th century,
when what was then
the center
1096
01:06:26,923 --> 01:06:30,492
of culture
and mathematics became
1097
01:06:30,494 --> 01:06:34,496
an economic and intellectual
backwater because of
islamic fundamentalism.
1098
01:06:34,498 --> 01:06:37,365
And it can happen today.
1099
01:06:37,367 --> 01:06:39,868
But the 21st century
1100
01:06:39,870 --> 01:06:43,037
is placing challenges
on us like we've never had:
1101
01:06:43,039 --> 01:06:46,274
Global climate change,
overpopulation,
1102
01:06:46,276 --> 01:06:48,476
the energy crisis,
1103
01:06:48,478 --> 01:06:51,212
the need, finally, to educate
1104
01:06:51,214 --> 01:06:54,716
and stop the subjugation
of women around the world.
1105
01:06:58,187 --> 01:07:00,688
Einstein said
67-odd years ago,
1106
01:07:00,690 --> 01:07:03,691
after we exploded
the first atomic weapon
1107
01:07:03,693 --> 01:07:07,195
that everything has changed,
save the way we think.
1108
01:07:07,197 --> 01:07:10,498
And unless we change
the way we think,
1109
01:07:10,500 --> 01:07:15,036
and unless we're willing
to revere open-questioning
discussion
1110
01:07:15,038 --> 01:07:17,472
and a public policy
based on reality,
1111
01:07:17,474 --> 01:07:22,610
we can take this wonderful
world we have now in many ways
1112
01:07:22,612 --> 01:07:24,412
and turn something into nothing,
1113
01:07:24,414 --> 01:07:26,915
and we all
have to make sure
that doesn't happen.
1114
01:07:26,917 --> 01:07:29,183
Thank you very much.
1115
01:07:37,660 --> 01:07:40,461
Dr. Lawrence krauss!
1116
01:07:46,402 --> 01:07:50,371
¶ It's almost like I may bend ¶
1117
01:07:50,373 --> 01:07:54,108
¶ and break ¶
1118
01:07:54,110 --> 01:08:00,348
¶ and it's more
than I can take ¶
1119
01:08:02,084 --> 01:08:06,087
¶ and it's almost like
I may bend ¶
1120
01:08:06,089 --> 01:08:10,124
¶ and break ¶
1121
01:08:10,126 --> 01:08:15,897
¶ and it's more
than I can take ¶
1122
01:08:18,100 --> 01:08:22,737
¶ and it's almost like
I may bend ¶
1123
01:08:22,739 --> 01:08:26,240
¶ and break ¶
1124
01:08:26,242 --> 01:08:31,446
¶ and it's more
than I can take ¶
1125
01:08:34,116 --> 01:08:37,986
¶ and it's almost like
I may bend ¶
1126
01:08:37,988 --> 01:08:42,090
¶ and break ¶
1127
01:08:42,092 --> 01:08:47,128
¶ and it's more
than I can take ¶
1128
01:08:50,199 --> 01:08:54,035
¶ and it's almost like
I may bend ¶
1129
01:08:54,037 --> 01:08:57,972
¶ and break ¶
1130
01:09:06,682 --> 01:09:10,785
I do see a problem
that you can't live a life
1131
01:09:10,787 --> 01:09:14,389
based on delusion.
1132
01:09:14,391 --> 01:09:17,792
You can't hold out reality
all the time
1133
01:09:17,794 --> 01:09:20,161
and just exist in a fake world.
1134
01:09:20,163 --> 01:09:24,165
You've got to constantly
not only be challenging
1135
01:09:24,167 --> 01:09:26,567
your own beliefs
but be willing to
1136
01:09:26,569 --> 01:09:30,271
say that you have been
wrong and misinformed
1137
01:09:30,273 --> 01:09:33,775
for your whole life
and change your views.
1138
01:09:33,777 --> 01:09:37,945
Otherwise, you know,
it's a mindless existence.
1139
01:09:37,947 --> 01:09:40,748
And that's not to say they don't
have the right to believe.
1140
01:09:40,750 --> 01:09:44,452
I believe everyone has
the right to believe anything.
1141
01:09:44,454 --> 01:09:47,288
They have the right
to believe anything,
1142
01:09:47,290 --> 01:09:49,991
but I have the right to find
that belief ridiculous.
1143
01:09:49,993 --> 01:09:53,294
I've had people on
Twitter say things like,
1144
01:09:53,296 --> 01:09:55,697
"everyone has the right
to their own opinion,
1145
01:09:55,699 --> 01:09:58,900
so just keep quiet
about your atheism."
1146
01:09:58,902 --> 01:10:01,569
Brilliant.
There it is.
1147
01:10:01,571 --> 01:10:05,106
There, you've
summed it up for me.
Well done.
1148
01:10:06,408 --> 01:10:09,644
I did a courtroom
scene on a show,
1149
01:10:09,646 --> 01:10:12,880
and I look at the judge,
and right above his head
1150
01:10:12,882 --> 01:10:14,816
it says,
"in God we trust."
1151
01:10:14,818 --> 01:10:19,320
I mean, this should've
hit me before being
on the good wife.
1152
01:10:19,322 --> 01:10:21,923
But I just can't believe it.
1153
01:10:21,925 --> 01:10:25,760
I just can't believe
that in 2012,
1154
01:10:25,762 --> 01:10:27,729
that's in our courts system.
1155
01:10:27,731 --> 01:10:32,500
These notions aren't
shared by everyone
in America.
1156
01:10:32,502 --> 01:10:37,305
With religion,
the stories have been
told over centuries,
1157
01:10:37,307 --> 01:10:41,576
and science is always
telling a new story.
1158
01:10:41,578 --> 01:10:45,046
And I think that that's
what's hard for people
1159
01:10:45,048 --> 01:10:48,015
who hold religion as the truth
1160
01:10:48,017 --> 01:10:50,251
to understand that
1161
01:10:50,253 --> 01:10:52,286
science is something
that's broader.
1162
01:10:52,288 --> 01:10:55,323
It doesn't start
6,000 years ago,
1163
01:10:55,325 --> 01:10:58,726
it starts four or five
billion years ago,
1164
01:10:58,728 --> 01:11:00,795
and that is a really...
1165
01:11:00,797 --> 01:11:03,264
There's a lot more
information in there,
in the book.
1166
01:11:03,266 --> 01:11:06,801
If we had a book,
it'd be a lot thicker.
1167
01:11:06,803 --> 01:11:09,337
And of course,
we have seen backlash
1168
01:11:09,339 --> 01:11:14,175
against scientific
understanding
of reality.
1169
01:11:14,177 --> 01:11:16,177
We have seen it
in many religions,
1170
01:11:16,179 --> 01:11:18,045
not only in the United States.
1171
01:11:18,047 --> 01:11:21,983
So I believe
there's a great value
1172
01:11:21,985 --> 01:11:24,852
in promoting this kind of work.
1173
01:11:24,854 --> 01:11:28,256
People who like science
are all drawn to it
for the same reason:
1174
01:11:28,258 --> 01:11:30,525
It explains the physical world.
1175
01:11:30,527 --> 01:11:32,126
"What is this stuff?"
1176
01:11:32,128 --> 01:11:34,462
Is it the last word
1177
01:11:34,464 --> 01:11:37,932
on what reality is
and what the physical
world is?
1178
01:11:37,934 --> 01:11:40,001
I don't know,
1179
01:11:40,003 --> 01:11:42,336
but if it's not the last word,
1180
01:11:42,338 --> 01:11:44,539
it's at least the best word.
1181
01:11:44,541 --> 01:11:46,974
In our increasingly
complex scientific
1182
01:11:46,976 --> 01:11:49,510
civilization,
1183
01:11:49,512 --> 01:11:53,648
many policy issuesrequire scientificknowledge.
1184
01:11:53,650 --> 01:11:57,251
How then can the publicexercise Democraticcontrol
1185
01:11:57,253 --> 01:12:00,154
if it doesn't
understand science?
1186
01:12:00,156 --> 01:12:02,590
I think it's very
important to advance
1187
01:12:02,592 --> 01:12:05,259
the pro-science view
in the modern world.
1188
01:12:05,261 --> 01:12:09,931
What could be bad
about advancing
1189
01:12:09,933 --> 01:12:12,967
knowledge and enlightenment?
1190
01:12:12,969 --> 01:12:14,969
It can only be a good thing.
1191
01:12:14,971 --> 01:12:17,772
If you don't get
that there's some
objective place
1192
01:12:17,774 --> 01:12:20,107
from which
we can all start,
which we call science,
1193
01:12:20,109 --> 01:12:23,578
a place where we get
rid of our biases and get
back to what we can observe,
1194
01:12:23,580 --> 01:12:26,080
if you don't think
that's the best
place to start
1195
01:12:26,082 --> 01:12:28,049
these conversations from,
1196
01:12:28,051 --> 01:12:31,052
then where do you
start them from?
1197
01:12:31,054 --> 01:12:33,654
You have to start from,
"well, my evidence shows
1198
01:12:33,656 --> 01:12:35,990
"that gay people
are just like me and
they love each other"
1199
01:12:35,992 --> 01:12:37,758
or that women are smart.
1200
01:12:37,760 --> 01:12:40,628
The magic book kills discussion.
1201
01:12:40,630 --> 01:12:44,298
I went to Israel
for the first time
the summer before last.
1202
01:12:44,300 --> 01:12:48,169
But people always say,
"oh, you go to Israel,
you're gonna be changed forever.
1203
01:12:48,171 --> 01:12:50,538
You're gonna feel
so connected."
1204
01:12:50,540 --> 01:12:53,541
And I just...
I didn't feel
that at all.
1205
01:12:53,543 --> 01:12:56,077
I went...
It just was so...
1206
01:12:56,079 --> 01:12:58,646
When I saw
the Western wall,
especially,
1207
01:12:58,648 --> 01:13:01,449
and that this much room
was for the men
1208
01:13:01,451 --> 01:13:03,551
and this much room
was for the women,
1209
01:13:03,553 --> 01:13:06,254
and they said,
"cover your shins
and cover this up
1210
01:13:06,256 --> 01:13:08,256
or people will throw
rocks at you,"
1211
01:13:08,258 --> 01:13:11,959
and I just felt like
"You!"
1212
01:13:11,961 --> 01:13:14,695
All I felt was
"You."
1213
01:13:14,697 --> 01:13:16,530
I didn't feel
connected to anything
1214
01:13:16,532 --> 01:13:18,866
because it wasn't
including me
as an equal.
1215
01:13:18,868 --> 01:13:21,636
It's the rules.
It's the arbitrary rules.
1216
01:13:21,638 --> 01:13:23,271
He gave you free will.
1217
01:13:23,273 --> 01:13:25,573
Well, then, why is he
sending me to hell
for using it?
1218
01:13:25,575 --> 01:13:28,910
He moves in mysterious ways.
1219
01:13:28,912 --> 01:13:30,711
I mean, "moves in
mysterious ways"...
1220
01:13:30,713 --> 01:13:33,814
That is the philosophical
equivalent of going...
running away.
1221
01:13:33,816 --> 01:13:37,585
You know?
It's strange, "moves
in mysterious ways."
1222
01:13:37,587 --> 01:13:40,454
What's the difference
between a random God
and no God at all?
1223
01:13:40,456 --> 01:13:43,124
That's what I'd say.
1224
01:13:43,126 --> 01:13:46,260
I think people
don't really believe
the myths they invent.
1225
01:13:46,262 --> 01:13:49,563
I've been to many
funerals in which
1226
01:13:49,565 --> 01:13:52,333
the priest has spoken
of an afterlife,
1227
01:13:52,335 --> 01:13:54,468
and even the people
who are there
1228
01:13:54,470 --> 01:13:56,804
are sobbing profusely.
1229
01:13:56,806 --> 01:13:58,639
They don't really think
they're gonna meet
1230
01:13:58,641 --> 01:14:00,775
their loved one
in five years' time.
1231
01:14:00,777 --> 01:14:02,810
If, on the other hand,
you stood on the quayside
1232
01:14:02,812 --> 01:14:05,079
and watched the queen Mary
set off for New York,
1233
01:14:05,081 --> 01:14:07,581
the people on the
quayside are not crying
because they know
1234
01:14:07,583 --> 01:14:10,418
they're going to see
those people again
fairly soon.
1235
01:14:10,420 --> 01:14:13,854
A funeral is
fundamentally different,
yet it should be the same.
1236
01:14:13,856 --> 01:14:16,490
I think myths are like a drug.
1237
01:14:16,492 --> 01:14:19,026
I think a lot of people
would rather just
1238
01:14:19,028 --> 01:14:21,028
take the myth pill
1239
01:14:21,030 --> 01:14:24,198
that makes them feel
nice and cozy and warm
1240
01:14:24,200 --> 01:14:26,767
and fuzzy and okay
with everything
1241
01:14:26,769 --> 01:14:29,570
rather than have to
look at the reality
1242
01:14:29,572 --> 01:14:33,908
of what the world
actually is
because it's so big.
1243
01:14:33,910 --> 01:14:37,578
But then I think
what's so great
about the world
1244
01:14:37,580 --> 01:14:40,581
being so big
or the universe
being so big
1245
01:14:40,583 --> 01:14:43,684
is that it's so big,
and that is so cool.
1246
01:14:43,686 --> 01:14:47,822
Early christians
were called atheists
by the romans
1247
01:14:47,824 --> 01:14:49,824
'cause they didn't
believe in all the gods.
1248
01:14:49,826 --> 01:14:53,661
I love that.
That's what atheism
is, really.
1249
01:14:53,663 --> 01:14:56,630
It's the belief
in one less God
than you.
1250
01:14:56,632 --> 01:14:59,533
The whole forward movement of
1251
01:14:59,535 --> 01:15:01,736
trying to do this thing,
give the people
the opportunity
1252
01:15:01,738 --> 01:15:04,105
to be educated to a point
where they don't have to
1253
01:15:04,107 --> 01:15:06,374
lean on stuff that's
probably not there
1254
01:15:06,376 --> 01:15:08,576
is a worthy cause.
1255
01:15:08,578 --> 01:15:11,912
You have to be able
to offer someone
alternatives
1256
01:15:11,914 --> 01:15:14,015
to the way they view the world,
1257
01:15:14,017 --> 01:15:16,017
or how can they learn something?
1258
01:15:16,019 --> 01:15:18,019
You can't keep teaching someone
1259
01:15:18,021 --> 01:15:20,755
something they already know.
1260
01:15:20,757 --> 01:15:25,159
If you are so attached
to your belief system
that you stop listening
1261
01:15:25,161 --> 01:15:28,496
out of fear of that
being challenged
1262
01:15:28,498 --> 01:15:31,365
or shaken,
1263
01:15:31,367 --> 01:15:33,434
you're dead.
1264
01:15:33,436 --> 01:15:36,270
Most scientists are
not up for this game
1265
01:15:36,272 --> 01:15:38,272
of taking on these things
1266
01:15:38,274 --> 01:15:40,641
and having it become a forum,
1267
01:15:40,643 --> 01:15:44,645
but once you start
to step up in front
of doubters,
1268
01:15:44,647 --> 01:15:47,715
it becomes this idea of really,
1269
01:15:47,717 --> 01:15:51,318
can you change
people's minds
from this debate,
1270
01:15:51,320 --> 01:15:54,455
or are you just, like,
taking rocks
1271
01:15:54,457 --> 01:15:57,291
and bashing
each other's
brains out?
105382
Can't find what you're looking for?
Get subtitles in any language from opensubtitles.com, and translate them here.