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♪
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♪
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♪
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♪
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♪
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♪
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♪
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♪
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The chimpanzee infant left with
his mother is a thing, a lump.
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Taken away, he acquires
human psychological
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tests, performances which are
well-nigh unbelievable.
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Nim was born at the primate
center in Oklahoma
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and I went out there to get him.
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I had never been near that
many chimpanzees.
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It was frightening and intimidating.
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And I knew Dr. Lemon and his wife were
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watching me to see what kind
of a mother would I be.
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Carolyn, Mim's mother, was sitting
right there, holding Mim.
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and she knew what was going to
happen better than I did.
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She had had six of her previous babies
removed, apparently in the same way.
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♪
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♪
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When the time came to take Nym
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from his mother, she instantly
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took on this drama, this feeling
of something about to happen.
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Dr. Lemon shot her with
a tranquilizing gun.
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Then said quick we have to
get him before she falls
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over and falls on him She was
trying to protect him
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and cradle him So he raced
in and gotten him and
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Handed Nim to me and Go back, you
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know go back in the other space
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♪
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♪
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He was very dense, unlike a
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human baby that has fat.
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He was dense and hard.
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He didn't struggle.
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He didn't try to get away.
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He just screamed.
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As much as he may be screaming and
protesting, he's also clinging.
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He was attaching for dear life.
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♪
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♪
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♪
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Wouldn't it be exciting to communicate
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with a chimp and find out
what it was thinking?
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If they could be taught to articulate
what they were thinking
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about, this would be an incredible
expansion of human communication
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and possibly give us some insight into
how language, in fact, did evolve.
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And that's essentially why
I started Project M.
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I don't know what was in his
mind, but he just called.
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He was asking me to bring an
infant chimpanzee into my
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home, raise this infant as if he
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were a child, and see if
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he acquired language as a function
of being part of a family.
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Stephanie was a former
student of mine.
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She had a large family of her own children
and her husband's children.
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Was exceedingly empathic
and warm and a
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chimp could not have a
better better mother.
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I know nothing about chimpanzees
and I never actually sat
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down to study them as one could
have, as I should have
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perhaps, but my appetite and
my drive to have that
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intimate relationship with an animal was,
nothing would have stopped that.
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The fact that we could share
language with an animal
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seemed like a very radical
possibility at that time.
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It had been known for some
time that chimps
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aren't able to make the sounds
of human language.
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So why not teach him sign language?
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The real breakthrough would
be if, like human
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children, a chimpanzee could create
grammatical sentences.
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So without much preparation
and without really asking
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permission of my children, my husband,
I said, fine, I can do it.
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I even have the funds to do it with.
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We don't need to worry about money.
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And so it was launched.
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The experiment was launched.
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When Nim came to New York, he
was barely two weeks old.
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The idea was that he would be treated
in every way like a human infant.
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I had recently moved to a brownstone
on the Upper West Side with my
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three children and with my husband who
had four children, Weir Lafarge.
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Weir was a poet and a writer.
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He redefined himself, became what at
that time was called a rich hippie.
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new husband, new family, new house.
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And I brought Nim into that rather
turbulent situation.
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It just happened there was
no family discussion
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about should we shouldn't
it was just oh, we're
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having a chimp We're going
to teach a sign language
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And then the reality of it is
sort of hitting you that
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it's really, you know, it's
alive, it's not a doll,
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it's not a toy, it's not a
human, it's a chimp, and
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it's an amazing, sweet,
little, newborn
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baby, needy creature, so...
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I think I fell in love instantly.
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Nim didn't like Weir.
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And Weir didn't like him.
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Almost instantly I saw how complicated
this was going to be.
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I think Weir went along with it.
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It was clearly Stephanie sort of
saying, let's have a chimp.
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It was the 70s.
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I breastfed him for a
couple of months.
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It seemed completely natural.
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Everything was about treating
him like a human being.
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By the time I had Nim, of course, I
felt very comfortable with babies.
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I wasn't prepared at all for the wild
animal in him and the drive.
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By the time he was three months old,
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I think, and starting
to be ambulatory,
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just right there, nothing passive,
nothing passive ever.
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♪
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You know, I think he figured
that he could just
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get in between Weir and Stephanie,
um, on some level.
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And we're put his arm around
her and and Nim just you
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know Half asleep having a bottle,
you know Turn and bit.
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We are on the arm quite hard
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He didn't want Weir in the picture.
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He wanted Stephanie Alford,
you know, himself.
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Weir definitely felt excluded.
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Nim had just become part of my being.
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That was incompatible with the
role that I played as wife.
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Oh
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-Herb's coming.
-Herb's coming.
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Herb's coming.
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Herb's coming was a big deal.
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I would just go over and
visit, just to see
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what his state was and how
he was getting along.
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Herb was infinitely exciting.
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I admired his intellect and his goals
and his arrogance, all those things.
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That was something.
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that didn't sit right
with me about him.
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The people that I am the closest
to throughout my life are
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people that I have had some period
of sexual contact with.
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I don't think that the previous
sexual relationship
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between Herb and myself made
a difference to the project
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at all, other than it was part of
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the glue that allowed it to happen.
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Herb didn't come very much.
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He wasn't part of the caretaking
package at all.
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Young newborn chimps are always raised by
their mothers, not by their fathers.
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And I didn't see any way of trying to
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change, or any point in
trying to change that.
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♪
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For better or worse, I had never
regarded him as a child.
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I regarded him as an intelligent, personable
center of a scientific project.
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I had an implicit faith that
Nim would learn signs.
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We had to wait and see.
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How do they start teaching
the child to sign?
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Does the child just watch
and whatever?
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I don't know.
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I mean, it was a problem. We were
trying to teach this chimp sign
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language and nobody in the house really
was fluent in sign language.
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We would mold his hand into
the sign for drink,
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which is this, and then give
him the bottle to drink.
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♪
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It just happened.
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It was just amazing.
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And I thought, piece of cake.
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I was absolutely delighted.
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He picked up quite a few signs
after that rather quickly.
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Eat, Me, Nim were one of his
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first signs, Hug was another one.
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♪
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And it was as if, then,
okay, we're off now.
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We just gotta build up the vocabulary.
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As much as we were molding him,
we were molding these
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damn hands and all this stuff,
he was starting to mold us.
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He knew every dynamic that was
in the room instantly.
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He knew when you were
upset, whatever had
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happened in whatever, you know,
13-,-year-old's life.
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And he would come over, and
he would just come and sit
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with you and hug you and then
just kiss the tears away.
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It was amazing.
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Just unconditional.
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He was my lifeline, he was my
buddy, and he was bringing
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something out in me, a freedom to
defy expectation and authority.
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His greatest focus of defiance
was against Weir.
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He would, you know, kind
of pull books off the
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shelves, and Weir liked his
books a certain way.
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When he saw Weir coming,
he would really do it.
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It was very focused,
it was intentional.
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Fuck you, I'm touching these.
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It was a problem.
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Weir was so impotent.
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I mean, what could he do?
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He'd chase him around, drop that,
you know, blah, blah, blah.
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I mean, he won every time.
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♪
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Nim saw Herb as his next
adult male challenge.
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I mean, that is the life that
he's hardwired for, to take
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on increasingly powerful male
figures until he's the top.
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When Herb would come over expecting
to step in and have
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00:15:04,169 --> 00:15:08,610
control of Nim, and he couldn't
and didn't, we loved it.
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We loved it.
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I cornered them.
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I just went to pull him out of some
hiding place, and he bit me.
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Frankly, everybody in the family got a
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kick out of him doing just
what Herb hated.
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No one ever put him in
his place, and he
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just grew more and more
and more powerful.
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And that was exciting to me.
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We didn't have to try to control
him in any way, in fact
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00:15:44,940 --> 00:15:48,360
we enjoyed just letting him hang
out and see how it went.
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Stephanie, being the
kind of mother she
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was, was not very concerned
about discipline.
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It was sort of the hippie mentality,
and I think what
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00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:08,579
I would tell her would go in
one ear and out the other.
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Herb would have wanted a
schedule and structure
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00:16:17,860 --> 00:16:21,159
and charted progress and
notes and all of that.
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I didn't supply that, I
couldn't create that,
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and I don't think Nim would
have thrived in that.
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♪
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00:16:41,250 --> 00:16:43,000
♪
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I was taking classes at Columbia
University and there was a
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small sign that said research assistant
needed course credit granted.
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♪
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00:16:56,649 --> 00:17:02,009
a man opened the door and he
was completely breathless
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00:17:02,009 --> 00:17:05,789
he also he's one of those men
who was balding on the top
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00:17:05,789 --> 00:17:11,190
so he had his hair pasted down
but he was so upset and
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00:17:11,190 --> 00:17:14,190
disheveled that his hair was standing
straight up on one side
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00:17:16,849 --> 00:17:21,269
He explained it was a language
project and I
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immediately understood the
scientific relevance.
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NIM was going to test
the nature versus
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nurture hypotheses that were
prevailing in the time.
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It really was at the cusp of science.
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You know, some things are just
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immediately obvious about someone
from the beginning.
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00:17:42,449 --> 00:17:44,849
You know what kind of person you have.
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I think she was 18, if
I'm not mistaken.
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At the time, Nim was in Stephanie
LaFarge's house,
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and my first job was to basically
babysit, to go
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to the house and ostensibly
teach him sign language.
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She came out of nowhere as a...
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cute little thing from Ramapo.
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00:18:09,490 --> 00:18:12,210
When I got there, I was actually
really surprised.
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There was utter chaos.
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There was nothing.
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This was a scientific project.
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There were no journals.
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There were no logbooks.
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They didn't know who was covering
them, when they were going to be
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00:18:29,280 --> 00:18:32,740
covering them, who would be teaching them,
when they would be teaching them.
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00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:34,960
They didn't know what they
were going to teach them.
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She quickly felt her power.
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It was completely visible.
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You know, everybody had
to adapt to it.
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She wanted that mother role.
247
00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:51,860
This animal climbed the walls all
248
00:18:51,860 --> 00:18:52,980
♪
249
00:18:54,220 --> 00:18:56,980
ripped apart Stephanie's
house all day.
250
00:18:58,220 --> 00:19:03,540
The kinds of things she was exposing
them to were atypical.
251
00:19:06,900 --> 00:19:10,540
He loved driving fast
in cars, he loved
252
00:19:10,540 --> 00:19:14,140
motorcycles, he loved, you know,
virtually anything thrilling.
253
00:19:17,150 --> 00:19:21,070
He liked alcohol, you'd give him
a sip and he'd want more.
254
00:19:22,810 --> 00:19:26,090
We gave him puffs on a joint.
255
00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:31,000
♪
256
00:19:33,450 --> 00:19:35,410
We didn't have to treat
him like a child.
257
00:19:35,630 --> 00:19:39,230
We could expose him to the sensations
that we enjoyed.
258
00:19:41,750 --> 00:19:45,890
I had an instinctive sense that
something was very amiss
259
00:19:45,890 --> 00:19:49,289
here, that this is not the way
260
00:19:49,289 --> 00:19:51,910
you teach a child language
261
00:19:51,910 --> 00:19:57,250
or you interact with a child or
you teach anything language.
262
00:19:59,450 --> 00:20:04,990
When Nim began to discover my body, my
263
00:20:04,990 --> 00:20:07,170
nakedness, it'd be curious,
I mean, like a
264
00:20:07,170 --> 00:20:10,569
child, he was uninterested, and then
one day he was interested.
265
00:20:15,900 --> 00:20:19,880
I never felt sexually
engaged with him.
266
00:20:20,759 --> 00:20:25,120
There was a sensuality, but Nim
was a, you know, a preteen.
267
00:20:27,539 --> 00:20:31,599
Stephanie was a graduate student
in psychoanalysis.
268
00:20:31,919 --> 00:20:36,279
Her questions had to do with the
Oedipal Complex, and she
269
00:20:36,279 --> 00:20:39,359
was interested in Nim's masturbation
and how he masturbated.
270
00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:40,480
I couldn't believe it.
271
00:20:42,700 --> 00:20:46,080
I realized that I could not do what
272
00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,400
I call good science in
Stephanie's home.
273
00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:50,980
It just wasn't conducive to that.
274
00:20:52,380 --> 00:20:55,960
So I set up a classroom at Columbia.
275
00:20:58,039 --> 00:21:00,180
He's gonna take Nim to school.
276
00:21:00,819 --> 00:21:03,740
And I realize I'm starting
to lose my role
277
00:21:03,740 --> 00:21:06,779
as the person who knows the
best what he needs.
278
00:21:07,680 --> 00:21:09,460
We had to get him in a
279
00:21:09,460 --> 00:21:13,759
context that was neutral,
calming, soothing.
280
00:21:17,500 --> 00:21:22,359
I just mapped out a teaching
plan for Nim, and I did it.
281
00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:28,340
She was so enthusiastic about
this that I made her,
282
00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:33,420
in a sense, the director of
education, the curriculum.
283
00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:37,059
I was feeling good about myself.
284
00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:38,920
Also, I was succeeding with Nim.
285
00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:40,799
I could see I was succeeding with Nim.
286
00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:42,100
I can see it.
287
00:21:42,180 --> 00:21:45,420
I can see that no one could
hold a candle to me.
288
00:21:46,440 --> 00:21:50,620
The only thing that mattered to him,
it became more and more tense.
289
00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:53,539
Words, words, words, words, words.
290
00:21:53,559 --> 00:21:54,940
Word order, word order, word order.
291
00:21:55,559 --> 00:21:57,460
He couldn't see anything else.
292
00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:01,420
Herb started seeing the signs
grow on that little graph.
293
00:22:01,799 --> 00:22:02,799
Every day.
294
00:22:03,140 --> 00:22:04,140
Every other day.
295
00:22:04,259 --> 00:22:05,259
Every three days.
296
00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:07,120
Laura taught him another sign.
297
00:22:08,019 --> 00:22:09,160
Laura taught him another sign.
298
00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:12,960
And I just went hell for leather.
299
00:22:15,700 --> 00:22:20,080
Them signing was just almost
exponentially increasing.
300
00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:21,700
I was very happy
301
00:22:23,740 --> 00:22:27,319
Words are a fucking nightmare when it
302
00:22:27,319 --> 00:22:31,900
comes to closeness often And
303
00:22:31,900 --> 00:22:34,279
here I was married to a poet working
304
00:22:34,279 --> 00:22:37,940
for a linguist You know, I was
305
00:22:37,940 --> 00:22:42,940
you know words were the became the
enemy She started restricting
306
00:22:43,359 --> 00:22:46,299
the times we can come in the house
307
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:50,539
She started throwing us out she
308
00:22:50,539 --> 00:22:56,220
apparently was You know encouraged to
believe that she was now the mother
309
00:22:58,809 --> 00:23:01,569
Stephanie began to threaten
to take Nim away from her.
310
00:23:05,250 --> 00:23:07,289
And Herb started panicking.
311
00:23:09,210 --> 00:23:13,509
I definitely initiated the move
out of Stephanie's house.
312
00:23:14,009 --> 00:23:16,250
I think she was initially
quite resistant to it,
313
00:23:16,990 --> 00:23:20,730
especially since she didn't know exactly
how Nim was going to end up.
314
00:23:21,230 --> 00:23:22,230
God had spoken.
315
00:23:22,470 --> 00:23:23,750
That's what had happened.
316
00:23:23,950 --> 00:23:24,950
That's what was going on.
317
00:23:25,250 --> 00:23:26,349
And we didn't have control.
318
00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:31,500
♪
319
00:23:34,249 --> 00:23:38,789
So, my separation from him
was just as abrupt, in
320
00:23:38,789 --> 00:23:43,669
a way, at that moment, as
his was from Carolyn's.
321
00:23:45,049 --> 00:23:49,409
I was, um, ostensibly
conscious, but I was
322
00:23:49,409 --> 00:23:50,569
♪
323
00:23:50,869 --> 00:23:55,269
I was as unaware and, you know,
324
00:23:56,009 --> 00:23:58,490
-in-charge and helpless as she was.
325
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:05,500
♪
326
00:24:06,049 --> 00:24:07,529
It was heartbreaking.
327
00:24:08,500 --> 00:24:13,000
♪
328
00:24:13,500 --> 00:24:14,500
saying goodbye.
329
00:24:15,500 --> 00:24:19,500
♪
330
00:24:19,500 --> 00:24:22,740
Part of me did not want
him to learn language.
331
00:24:25,849 --> 00:24:31,429
He was less with language than
he was as his unique self.
332
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:37,000
♪
333
00:24:37,250 --> 00:24:38,500
♪
334
00:24:50,450 --> 00:24:53,330
At that time, a very lucky
thing happened.
335
00:24:54,910 --> 00:24:59,690
I was aware that there was an estate
that Columbia owned in
336
00:24:59,690 --> 00:25:04,870
Riverdale, a very large estate that used
to be the home of the president.
337
00:25:06,450 --> 00:25:09,309
And I went to him with a
proposition that if he
338
00:25:09,309 --> 00:25:12,470
allowed me to raise the chimp there,
I would pay for the heat.
339
00:25:13,850 --> 00:25:14,930
And I said, sure.
340
00:25:15,500 --> 00:25:20,500
♪
341
00:25:20,750 --> 00:25:25,000
♪
342
00:25:25,700 --> 00:25:26,700
This was amazing.
343
00:25:27,660 --> 00:25:29,600
This was a fairytale.
344
00:25:31,650 --> 00:25:36,450
We got, it was a 28-acre
estate surrounded by
345
00:25:36,450 --> 00:25:41,750
lovely gardens and that allowed
me to put up NIMS
346
00:25:41,750 --> 00:25:45,330
teachers in magnificent surroundings
and not pay any rent.
347
00:25:46,970 --> 00:25:47,970
The wife is good.
348
00:25:50,099 --> 00:25:54,699
Nim got out of the car,
ran up to the front
349
00:25:54,699 --> 00:25:58,639
door, rolled down the hill,
and he was gone.
350
00:25:59,799 --> 00:26:01,379
He was free.
351
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:07,000
♪
352
00:26:07,250 --> 00:26:09,500
♪
353
00:26:09,650 --> 00:26:14,390
So there was no reaction at having taken
him out of Stephanie's house
354
00:26:16,570 --> 00:26:21,070
He was fine and it was like he
had been there his whole life
355
00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:27,000
♪
356
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:29,799
He certainly was a different
chimpanzee
357
00:26:29,799 --> 00:26:32,019
in this mansion than he
was with Stephanie.
358
00:26:32,819 --> 00:26:38,500
Um, so I sort of got into more, you
know, interacting with him.
359
00:26:42,329 --> 00:26:46,230
Herb's power as a professor, his
360
00:26:46,230 --> 00:26:49,970
age completely impacted me.
361
00:26:51,630 --> 00:26:52,809
He was my model.
362
00:26:54,210 --> 00:26:55,549
We really clicked together.
363
00:26:59,250 --> 00:27:04,890
I wanted so much to be
a part of his world.
364
00:27:05,190 --> 00:27:07,950
I wanted to be in that
world of academia.
365
00:27:10,500 --> 00:27:13,259
I had strong personal feelings
about Laura.
366
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:20,539
But I don't think that in any way
got in the way of our science.
367
00:27:21,500 --> 00:27:26,000
♪
368
00:27:29,950 --> 00:27:34,090
Some of the daily bodily
requirements that
369
00:27:34,090 --> 00:27:37,490
Nim had, had to be addressed
and very quickly.
370
00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:44,080
I eventually couldn't handle
the diapers anymore.
371
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:47,400
He was getting bigger and he was
eating more of our food.
372
00:27:47,840 --> 00:27:50,539
So, pragmatically, I had to
get him off those diapers.
373
00:27:52,750 --> 00:27:56,369
I watched his facial expressions
when he needed the potty
374
00:27:56,369 --> 00:28:00,210
and I began to see it and grab
him and bring him to the
375
00:28:00,210 --> 00:28:05,549
potty He did actually did use
the toilet correctly, but
376
00:28:05,549 --> 00:28:09,809
it was certainly not as Reliable
as what you'd see in a child
377
00:28:15,750 --> 00:28:20,089
The idea was that I would live
with Nim and I would
378
00:28:20,649 --> 00:28:23,309
train him for a certain period
of time in the house,
379
00:28:23,410 --> 00:28:26,450
but then I would bring him in every
day to Columbia University.
380
00:28:30,500 --> 00:28:35,799
This was an experiment to teach or see if
a chimpanzee can learn sign language.
381
00:28:37,549 --> 00:28:39,250
I just thought it was
really interesting,
382
00:28:39,470 --> 00:28:42,309
intellectually interesting,
interesting to
383
00:28:42,309 --> 00:28:45,869
understand how much chimpanzees are
like us and how much they're not.
384
00:28:46,500 --> 00:28:49,500
♪
385
00:28:49,549 --> 00:28:51,710
At that time, he was terribly cute and
386
00:28:51,710 --> 00:28:53,609
getting little photos in
New York Magazine.
387
00:28:55,230 --> 00:28:57,230
There was a daily lesson
plan, if you will.
388
00:28:57,389 --> 00:29:01,129
We were supposed to teach these
particular signs to Nim,
389
00:29:01,389 --> 00:29:05,829
and they were supposed to also teach
him everyday activities.
390
00:29:06,450 --> 00:29:09,470
Dress yourself, undress yourself,
this sort of thing.
391
00:29:11,169 --> 00:29:13,029
Like children, after they learn a few
392
00:29:13,029 --> 00:29:16,369
words, Nim has spontaneously
put signs together.
393
00:29:16,989 --> 00:29:21,389
In many instances, we allow
Nim to use his own signs
394
00:29:21,389 --> 00:29:24,409
that he almost invents, so long
as they're consistent.
395
00:29:24,549 --> 00:29:28,809
For example, this is the sign
for play that he invented.
396
00:29:29,069 --> 00:29:30,629
He's learning signs rapidly.
397
00:29:31,089 --> 00:29:32,569
They're going up, up, up, up, up.
398
00:29:33,269 --> 00:29:34,990
The project was literally humming.
399
00:29:35,690 --> 00:29:37,690
Everything was going very smoothly.
400
00:29:38,589 --> 00:29:41,649
I have a chimpanzee who
was making history.
401
00:29:42,629 --> 00:29:44,909
We did get a grant somewhere
in that time.
402
00:29:45,429 --> 00:29:49,190
The project had begun to enter
the media, so there
403
00:29:49,190 --> 00:29:52,250
was all this excitement and
hype about the project.
404
00:29:52,409 --> 00:29:53,409
We were thrilled.
405
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:58,000
♪
406
00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:00,920
We've probably all seen performing
chimpanzees on
407
00:30:00,920 --> 00:30:04,660
television or in circuses, but
Nim is no ordinary chimp.
408
00:30:05,460 --> 00:30:08,220
Since he was a few weeks
old, Nim has lived in a
409
00:30:08,220 --> 00:30:10,980
close association with a group
of scientists under
410
00:30:10,980 --> 00:30:13,840
the direction of Dr. Herbert Terrace
of Columbia University.
411
00:30:14,580 --> 00:30:17,900
They're performing a unique experiment
to try to determine
412
00:30:17,900 --> 00:30:21,940
whether apes can be taught to communicate
with humans using language.
413
00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:24,960
How big will he be when
he's full grown?
414
00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:26,539
Oh, he's going to be big.
415
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,340
He's going to be about five
feet tall, perhaps 150
416
00:30:29,340 --> 00:30:33,840
pounds, and supposedly five to six
times the strength of a man.
417
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:35,860
How are you going to be able
to handle him then?
418
00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:41,259
He had grown, I guess he was probably
something like that.
419
00:30:43,420 --> 00:30:47,120
And he, you know, if you had to hold
him, you really had to hold him.
420
00:30:47,639 --> 00:30:50,100
And he's gone from being
this meek little
421
00:30:50,100 --> 00:30:54,920
huggable toy to quite a robust
young chimpanzee.
422
00:30:55,500 --> 00:30:59,000
♪
423
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:02,100
His eye teeth were never
taken out, which means
424
00:31:02,100 --> 00:31:04,840
that he's got fangs, essentially,
sitting here.
425
00:31:05,279 --> 00:31:06,319
Extremely strong jaw.
426
00:31:07,039 --> 00:31:09,779
If you didn't assert dominance in some
427
00:31:09,779 --> 00:31:11,980
fashion, you were going to
be in trouble eventually.
428
00:31:14,900 --> 00:31:17,120
He could size somebody
up in two seconds,
429
00:31:18,180 --> 00:31:22,340
whether they were confident
or secretly unconfident.
430
00:31:22,940 --> 00:31:27,640
If I stood up too quickly,
if I accidentally showed
431
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:32,040
him my back too quickly, if I
had food and I wouldn't...
432
00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:33,700
I didn't think to share it with him,
433
00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,240
he'd cross that threshold
and go into attack.
434
00:31:38,750 --> 00:31:40,890
You could tell that he was
getting an attitude.
435
00:31:41,490 --> 00:31:46,569
The hair would go up on his arms, and you
sort of get this look in his face.
436
00:31:47,569 --> 00:31:51,549
When he would bark, I'd feel
437
00:31:51,549 --> 00:31:54,009
it inside, the danger.
438
00:31:56,130 --> 00:32:02,130
He had to lunge, the contact, the
rip, the tear, and the release.
439
00:32:02,509 --> 00:32:03,710
And he had to draw blood.
440
00:32:06,950 --> 00:32:11,230
She did not tell me that
in an alarming manner.
441
00:32:11,490 --> 00:32:12,490
She was just reporting it.
442
00:32:13,490 --> 00:32:17,090
Maybe I was just too,
uh, looking ahead
443
00:32:17,090 --> 00:32:18,690
with blinkers and not wanting
to hear that.
444
00:32:19,069 --> 00:32:20,410
This is 37 stitches.
445
00:32:21,370 --> 00:32:24,930
Um, I had, uh, four here,
uh, nine here.
446
00:32:25,289 --> 00:32:27,930
This one, uh, sent me
into the hospital.
447
00:32:28,069 --> 00:32:30,990
This one actually was the most dangerous
one because he hit a tendon.
448
00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:44,000
♪
449
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:47,980
It's a lot of work to take
care of an animal that's
450
00:32:47,980 --> 00:32:50,180
not your species, who has that
kind of energy level.
451
00:32:50,779 --> 00:32:52,759
I probably didn't know the difference
between chimpanzees and
452
00:32:52,759 --> 00:32:57,319
monkeys, so I was as blind
and as ignorant
453
00:32:57,319 --> 00:32:59,099
and as naive as probably they came.
454
00:32:59,319 --> 00:33:00,559
I was on a quick learning curve.
455
00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:06,240
I have high energy and enthusiasm
for a goal.
456
00:33:07,160 --> 00:33:08,420
And he was my goal, apparently.
457
00:33:09,819 --> 00:33:11,359
Joyce was a great teacher.
458
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:12,880
She signed.
459
00:33:13,059 --> 00:33:15,980
She was completely dedicated
and motivated.
460
00:33:16,500 --> 00:33:18,019
She wanted to do this.
461
00:33:18,619 --> 00:33:19,660
This was fantastic.
462
00:33:22,450 --> 00:33:26,029
He bit me really hard, and I bit him
on the ear right then and there.
463
00:33:27,009 --> 00:33:29,509
And I said, that's over, you will never
bite me again, and he never did.
464
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:33,500
♪
465
00:33:33,549 --> 00:33:36,750
He did like a lot of
human body contact.
466
00:33:38,750 --> 00:33:42,009
Typically when we would leave the property,
he would be really attached to it.
467
00:33:44,599 --> 00:33:47,539
The world would scare him, so
he would always come close.
468
00:33:48,500 --> 00:33:52,500
♪
469
00:33:54,250 --> 00:33:57,069
Bill and I hung tight with them.
470
00:33:57,869 --> 00:34:01,089
We sort of hit it off on a lot
of our different thinking.
471
00:34:02,690 --> 00:34:03,890
She and I got together as a couple.
472
00:34:06,500 --> 00:34:10,159
It helped that we liked each
other and I think that that
473
00:34:10,159 --> 00:34:14,960
helped Nim's life because we enjoyed
each other's company so
474
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:18,440
we would do things together and we
would hang out as kind of a unit.
475
00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:24,000
♪
476
00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:25,980
Oh, he loves the cats.
477
00:34:27,720 --> 00:34:30,639
He was really, really tender
with the cat, and he'd hold
478
00:34:30,639 --> 00:34:33,840
it, and he just liked the feel,
the touch, something about it.
479
00:34:35,900 --> 00:34:39,280
He, like, would hold her and be,
like, and you could see him,
480
00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:42,059
like, shaking because he'd be, like,
so excited that he had her.
481
00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:46,039
Actually, like, kind of pushed her
down on the ground and then
482
00:34:46,039 --> 00:34:50,059
curled around her and just, like,
laid there, like, I'm in heaven.
483
00:34:58,500 --> 00:35:04,000
♪
484
00:35:06,300 --> 00:35:09,060
I would say that it was fairly
clear that there was
485
00:35:09,060 --> 00:35:12,680
something more going on than the project,
at least from his side.
486
00:35:14,849 --> 00:35:18,449
And I think we all felt it
and we kind of had I
487
00:35:18,449 --> 00:35:20,889
don't want to say resentment
But I was like, huh?
488
00:35:21,009 --> 00:35:25,289
She's what he sort of stopped
this Laura thing If someone
489
00:35:25,289 --> 00:35:30,429
showed me some attention, I thought
it meant that they cared for me
490
00:35:32,449 --> 00:35:33,849
He had power.
491
00:35:37,670 --> 00:35:41,050
I'm sure that, you know, unconsciously
I took advantage of that.
492
00:35:41,889 --> 00:35:46,429
If somebody admires you, why not?
493
00:35:49,130 --> 00:35:52,550
So, yeah, we very briefly
got involved and he
494
00:35:52,550 --> 00:35:56,369
very, very briefly and abruptly
got out of it.
495
00:35:58,650 --> 00:36:03,190
The entanglement completely affected
my decision to leave.
496
00:36:04,110 --> 00:36:07,250
It's the humans I wanted to
leave, not the chimp.
497
00:36:09,369 --> 00:36:10,809
Herb didn't want it to happen.
498
00:36:11,050 --> 00:36:15,570
He went into a very enthusiastic
mode of
499
00:36:15,570 --> 00:36:17,110
trying to convince me not to go.
500
00:36:17,570 --> 00:36:18,570
I wasn't panicked.
501
00:36:19,269 --> 00:36:21,289
I wasn't panicked that
the project was just
502
00:36:21,289 --> 00:36:23,389
going to grind to a halt
because Laura left.
503
00:36:24,670 --> 00:36:28,230
As I recall, Joyce and Bill pretty
much took care of that.
504
00:36:28,670 --> 00:36:32,849
So I didn't lose any crucial
aspect of the project.
505
00:36:33,500 --> 00:36:39,000
♪
506
00:36:39,150 --> 00:36:43,889
I started to go to get
the boxes to leave
507
00:36:44,250 --> 00:36:47,869
and Nim pulled loose from
the person's hand.
508
00:36:48,250 --> 00:36:51,250
He climbs to the second
floor of the house.
509
00:36:51,730 --> 00:36:54,889
Then he must have lunged 25 feet.
510
00:36:57,650 --> 00:37:03,870
He landed on me, he took my head, and
511
00:37:03,870 --> 00:37:07,090
he started pounding it
into the pavement.
512
00:37:09,449 --> 00:37:12,649
It took four males to get him off me.
513
00:37:13,500 --> 00:37:18,500
♪
514
00:37:18,750 --> 00:37:22,000
♪
515
00:37:22,349 --> 00:37:23,849
He wasn't my child.
516
00:37:24,650 --> 00:37:25,650
He wasn't my baby.
517
00:37:26,630 --> 00:37:31,750
You can't give human nurturing to
an animal that could kill you.
518
00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:43,500
♪
519
00:37:43,550 --> 00:37:49,210
One of the easy parts of the project
was to advertise for teachers.
520
00:37:50,310 --> 00:37:52,730
It's like, oh, this is nice.
521
00:37:53,550 --> 00:37:56,410
I didn't set out to have
women on the project,
522
00:37:56,550 --> 00:37:58,510
predominantly, but it certainly
turned out that way.
523
00:38:00,650 --> 00:38:03,250
You know, if that's the way it turned
out, that's the way it turned out.
524
00:38:03,490 --> 00:38:05,389
I was a trained interpreter
for the deaf.
525
00:38:06,230 --> 00:38:08,590
When I set my mind to something,
I get what I want.
526
00:38:10,750 --> 00:38:12,309
I kept saying, I want
to live here, when
527
00:38:12,309 --> 00:38:13,849
am I moving in, when do
I get to move in?
528
00:38:14,250 --> 00:38:15,789
And I would annoy her.
529
00:38:16,489 --> 00:38:18,070
And finally he let me move in.
530
00:38:20,110 --> 00:38:22,789
Probably as time went
on, it may become
531
00:38:22,789 --> 00:38:25,050
more difficult for women
to work with him.
532
00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:28,900
He was gonna take advantage
of the man.
533
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:31,880
He was big enough and strong
enough that he could I
534
00:38:33,460 --> 00:38:37,019
Mean it hurt his bites hurt
you felt when he bit your
535
00:38:37,019 --> 00:38:40,639
hand He got the nerve and you'd get
a running shock up your arm
536
00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:46,800
We had epic battles, though,
but we made up.
537
00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:50,800
You'd make that face and sign, sorry.
538
00:38:52,160 --> 00:38:54,000
I'd say, well, if I sign this,
you'll forgive me.
539
00:38:55,949 --> 00:38:58,049
I had a relationship with a chimpanzee
540
00:38:58,049 --> 00:39:00,049
and I had conversations
with another species.
541
00:39:04,009 --> 00:39:06,809
It's not just him signing that
was important to me, it
542
00:39:06,809 --> 00:39:10,369
was what he was thinking and
experiencing because we
543
00:39:10,369 --> 00:39:13,029
would talk when we would hang
out, you know, we would
544
00:39:13,029 --> 00:39:15,109
talk about the things we would see,
the things we would hear.
545
00:39:16,989 --> 00:39:20,149
As far as I'm concerned, our
classroom was the house
546
00:39:20,149 --> 00:39:22,269
and the yard and the field
trips that we would take.
547
00:39:23,000 --> 00:39:28,500
♪
548
00:39:31,190 --> 00:39:34,710
Science is a very objective
enterprise.
549
00:39:35,170 --> 00:39:38,309
You can't have personal anecdotes
of how I worked
550
00:39:38,309 --> 00:39:41,150
with Nimma Padilla-Field as
opposed to the classroom.
551
00:39:41,530 --> 00:39:44,190
That's just of no interest
to a scientist.
552
00:39:45,429 --> 00:39:48,550
Joyce did not see anything special
about the classroom.
553
00:39:49,130 --> 00:39:50,130
Hated it.
554
00:39:50,510 --> 00:39:52,170
Hated it. Hated it. He hated it.
555
00:39:52,269 --> 00:39:55,050
We hated it. That's not surprising,
because she didn't
556
00:39:55,050 --> 00:39:59,230
get the results in the classroom
that I was hoping for.
557
00:39:59,789 --> 00:40:01,489
Hey, do you know what time it is?
558
00:40:01,710 --> 00:40:04,150
Yeah. Going into a dungeon
of a classroom, which
559
00:40:04,150 --> 00:40:06,150
it really was, I mean,
the thing was 15 feet
560
00:40:06,150 --> 00:40:08,730
square, including the observation
booth and everything else.
561
00:40:09,969 --> 00:40:12,630
No windows, no place really
to have any activity.
562
00:40:13,010 --> 00:40:15,250
Trying to get Nim's attention
was a bit of a
563
00:40:15,250 --> 00:40:18,130
struggle, and he would have rather
been doing something else.
564
00:40:22,500 --> 00:40:23,699
Pay attention to me.
565
00:40:24,500 --> 00:40:27,500
♪
566
00:40:30,500 --> 00:40:33,619
So this is a sign for
dirty, so we used it
567
00:40:33,619 --> 00:40:36,519
for toilet for him because
it's a contact sign.
568
00:40:39,740 --> 00:40:41,760
He would jump through the
signs that I asked
569
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:43,519
him to jump through and
then he would have had
570
00:40:43,519 --> 00:40:46,160
enough and he would say I need
to go to the bathroom
571
00:40:49,300 --> 00:40:50,300
Bye.
572
00:40:52,900 --> 00:40:56,579
And that's when I knew,
you little bugger.
573
00:40:57,639 --> 00:41:00,340
You used that sign because
you knew it would
574
00:41:00,340 --> 00:41:02,740
make us leave there and
get us out of there.
575
00:41:03,500 --> 00:41:07,849
♪
576
00:41:07,849 --> 00:41:09,849
He was growing smarter and smarter.
577
00:41:11,349 --> 00:41:15,369
And smarter in the sense of recognizing
situations that he
578
00:41:15,369 --> 00:41:18,329
could take advantage of, when
he could get what he wanted.
579
00:41:19,500 --> 00:41:24,500
♪
580
00:41:24,750 --> 00:41:26,000
♪
581
00:41:28,659 --> 00:41:30,759
He was starting to discover himself.
582
00:41:31,939 --> 00:41:35,399
There was a big rock in the front yard,
and he used to like to bump it.
583
00:41:36,599 --> 00:41:37,599
I don't know.
584
00:41:37,659 --> 00:41:38,659
You're gonna hurt yourself.
585
00:41:38,739 --> 00:41:39,739
That's a rock.
586
00:41:39,859 --> 00:41:40,859
Like, look at himself.
587
00:41:41,119 --> 00:41:45,159
As this whole thing with the
physicality became, you
588
00:41:45,159 --> 00:41:47,799
know, an issue, he was much more
cautious, I think, about
589
00:41:47,799 --> 00:41:52,239
letting the cats around him and letting
him play with the cats.
590
00:41:55,029 --> 00:41:59,589
He would even try to not engage directly
in sexual relationships with
591
00:41:59,589 --> 00:42:04,250
the animals, but definitely to bring
them to him and to his penis area.
592
00:42:09,050 --> 00:42:12,570
And I just said, no, that's not
what they're there for.
593
00:42:19,570 --> 00:42:21,869
We realized, I think all
of us, that it was
594
00:42:21,869 --> 00:42:26,309
becoming increasingly difficult
to pursue the experiment.
595
00:42:27,570 --> 00:42:29,110
Nim was scratching hard, he was biting
596
00:42:29,110 --> 00:42:32,750
harder, biting more often,
biting more people.
597
00:42:34,469 --> 00:42:39,670
We hadn't mentioned the growing concern that
we had about how to deal with Nim.
598
00:42:41,789 --> 00:42:44,349
Dr. Terrace was pretty much
an absentee landlord.
599
00:42:45,170 --> 00:42:47,510
Herb was never alone
with Nim, and Herb
600
00:42:47,510 --> 00:42:49,110
never had to spend any kind
of time with Nim.
601
00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:53,559
Once in a while, you know,
photo shoots for him to
602
00:42:53,559 --> 00:42:55,820
either take photos or for him
to have photos taken of him.
603
00:42:59,910 --> 00:43:03,769
Yes, there were occasional
bites, I imagine they
604
00:43:04,369 --> 00:43:06,830
increased in frequency just because
Nim's getting older.
605
00:43:07,930 --> 00:43:09,870
In that sense, it was becoming
more chimp-like.
606
00:43:11,949 --> 00:43:15,069
But it didn't seem to be a cause
for alarm at that point.
607
00:43:17,300 --> 00:43:21,940
It was the end of July,
it was July 28th and
608
00:43:21,940 --> 00:43:25,440
Bill had him and we did
the-to-body transfer.
609
00:43:28,099 --> 00:43:32,019
I mean you're holding, you're holding
them and the other person
610
00:43:32,019 --> 00:43:35,500
comes up and you just kind of hand
the chimp to the other person.
611
00:43:35,739 --> 00:43:39,980
And I said come on and I got
the tether, you know,
612
00:43:40,199 --> 00:43:43,159
you've got the loop first and
I then tied it to my belt.
613
00:43:44,599 --> 00:43:48,480
Come here and he came over and
he put his arms around me.
614
00:43:50,150 --> 00:43:54,570
He just crunched my face
it just happened
615
00:43:57,400 --> 00:44:00,059
And I grabbed Nim and just dragged
him into the house.
616
00:44:01,900 --> 00:44:03,300
Sorry, sorry, sorry, no, no, no, no.
617
00:44:03,380 --> 00:44:06,960
And I passed that armor with that mirror,
and I saw all this blood.
618
00:44:07,300 --> 00:44:11,360
He had bit through my cheek, almost
to the inside of my mouth.
619
00:44:11,579 --> 00:44:14,460
It was folded over, so you
could see inside my face.
620
00:44:18,949 --> 00:44:21,849
I don't recall if she went
to the emergency
621
00:44:21,849 --> 00:44:24,049
room, but I think that something
like that happened.
622
00:44:26,599 --> 00:44:30,119
It was just it was just bad.
623
00:44:31,099 --> 00:44:33,360
I was probably worried
that you would sue
624
00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:37,599
me Or this would become a public.
625
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:40,699
This would become public
knowledge about how
626
00:44:42,739 --> 00:44:45,579
Life-threatening the project
might be they couldn't
627
00:44:45,579 --> 00:44:48,239
sew it because of the infection
and a risk of
628
00:44:48,239 --> 00:44:53,119
infection So I had an open gaping wound
on my face for three months
629
00:44:54,000 --> 00:44:59,000
♪
630
00:44:59,250 --> 00:45:02,000
♪
631
00:45:02,300 --> 00:45:04,260
And when I got out of the hospital, I
632
00:45:04,260 --> 00:45:07,220
said, you know, I I want
to see him he went.
633
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:10,160
Oh And he went to reach
for my face again.
634
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:11,400
Well, that's it.
635
00:45:11,519 --> 00:45:12,760
I don't need closure now.
636
00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:13,880
I'm out of here.
637
00:45:13,900 --> 00:45:14,900
I was
638
00:45:17,949 --> 00:45:20,149
I'm tenacious and I didn't
want to let go.
639
00:45:21,149 --> 00:45:22,829
Sort of like breaking up
with a bad boyfriend.
640
00:45:23,500 --> 00:45:28,500
♪
641
00:45:28,650 --> 00:45:32,869
I was sorry that it came
to that but you just
642
00:45:32,869 --> 00:45:36,570
don't know how NIM is going
to change and you just
643
00:45:36,570 --> 00:45:40,430
can't count on having outstanding
teachers all the time.
644
00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:45,500
♪
645
00:45:48,900 --> 00:45:53,160
I felt I was spreading
myself too thinly and
646
00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:57,860
experiencing too much stress and
not enough good results.
647
00:46:01,900 --> 00:46:04,960
Nobody keeps a chimp for
more than five years
648
00:46:05,340 --> 00:46:08,639
because at five years they
don't know their own
649
00:46:08,639 --> 00:46:10,840
strength and they can do a
lot of damage to people.
650
00:46:12,500 --> 00:46:16,500
♪
651
00:46:16,699 --> 00:46:20,539
He called us together and dropped
the bomb and said it's over.
652
00:46:24,099 --> 00:46:25,980
I was one very angry
653
00:46:32,650 --> 00:46:35,329
You don't say, we're not
doing this anymore.
654
00:46:36,269 --> 00:46:39,510
And because Herb had that
card to play, he
655
00:46:39,510 --> 00:46:40,889
played it because he was
in the power seat.
656
00:46:42,500 --> 00:46:45,500
♪
657
00:46:45,650 --> 00:46:50,930
I think I said there's no point of
this going on scientifically.
658
00:46:54,099 --> 00:46:57,219
I felt that NIMH had progressed
a lot and we
659
00:46:57,219 --> 00:46:59,079
hadn't had a chance to really
analyze our data.
660
00:46:59,839 --> 00:47:02,119
I just knew that we had reams of data.
661
00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:09,239
This whole mass of data that
needed to be organized
662
00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:13,059
and that was going to be a
long and tedious process.
663
00:47:13,900 --> 00:47:17,880
The fundamental question was, can
a chimpanzee create a sentence?
664
00:47:19,440 --> 00:47:22,619
I don't think I had any definitive
conclusion to that.
665
00:47:23,360 --> 00:47:24,360
We had to wait and see.
666
00:47:27,699 --> 00:47:30,939
It's kind of like, you know, you
get you're almost there and you
667
00:47:30,939 --> 00:47:33,239
feel like there's gonna
be a conclusion
668
00:47:33,239 --> 00:47:38,259
and It's like okay It's over
669
00:47:41,500 --> 00:47:45,900
I thought that the surroundings
in which he was born
670
00:47:46,460 --> 00:47:50,440
would provide the most psychological
support for them.
671
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:55,579
I felt the basic needs would
be taken care of.
672
00:47:59,199 --> 00:48:04,239
So, once I got the lemon to agree
to take it back, that was it.
673
00:48:16,699 --> 00:48:18,219
I hope he'll be okay.
674
00:48:19,299 --> 00:48:20,319
That's why I want to go with him.
675
00:48:21,019 --> 00:48:24,779
I hope that I'll be able to introduce
him to his new life,
676
00:48:25,279 --> 00:48:27,980
but still have an old part of his
life with him, namely me.
677
00:48:28,579 --> 00:48:31,679
And he can get used to it, and I can
fade out, and he'll be fine.
678
00:48:32,859 --> 00:48:36,559
It won't just be an abrupt break
between old and new.
679
00:48:38,500 --> 00:48:43,500
♪
680
00:48:43,750 --> 00:48:48,750
♪
681
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:54,000
♪
682
00:48:54,250 --> 00:48:56,500
♪
683
00:48:56,949 --> 00:48:59,069
and we'd getting him up
early one morning.
684
00:49:00,969 --> 00:49:02,329
He gets a shot and he's out.
685
00:49:10,460 --> 00:49:13,719
I chartered a plane and hired a pilot.
686
00:49:24,650 --> 00:49:27,329
and then was given tranquilizers
to reduce
687
00:49:27,329 --> 00:49:29,329
the possibility of his
getting out of hand.
688
00:49:33,150 --> 00:49:37,929
If he was tranquilized, he'd
be easy to control and not
689
00:49:37,929 --> 00:49:40,730
do any damage to the plane, which
could be quite dangerous.
690
00:49:42,510 --> 00:49:44,230
So that's how we get him to Oklahoma.
691
00:49:46,070 --> 00:49:48,469
It was just a nasty...
692
00:49:50,150 --> 00:49:51,410
Very deceitful.
693
00:49:56,750 --> 00:49:59,110
The question is what was going
to happen in Oklahoma,
694
00:50:00,409 --> 00:50:01,710
♪
695
00:50:01,710 --> 00:50:04,110
didn't have any sense of that
so that was my concern
696
00:50:05,000 --> 00:50:10,000
♪
697
00:50:10,250 --> 00:50:15,250
♪
698
00:50:15,500 --> 00:50:20,500
♪
699
00:50:20,750 --> 00:50:23,500
♪
700
00:50:24,000 --> 00:50:27,000
♪
701
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:37,119
Holy shit, was my first thought.
702
00:50:39,500 --> 00:50:43,559
And I think his reaction
was, holy shit, too.
703
00:50:44,380 --> 00:50:46,740
Like he knew we were,
he knew it was bad.
704
00:50:49,449 --> 00:50:53,909
And he'd never seen a chimp before
and he was holding on tight
705
00:50:59,849 --> 00:51:01,589
You look around, you
see cages, and you
706
00:51:01,589 --> 00:51:04,610
hear the sounds of a
lot of chimpanzees.
707
00:51:05,349 --> 00:51:07,589
Would I have envisioned
this when I started
708
00:51:07,589 --> 00:51:10,069
this project, that he ever
would end up there?
709
00:51:10,389 --> 00:51:11,389
No.
710
00:51:15,550 --> 00:51:20,769
It turned out to be a surprisingly more
primitive facility than I remembered.
711
00:51:23,430 --> 00:51:25,370
Because our cages were cages.
712
00:51:25,710 --> 00:51:27,269
They weren't just a room
with a locked door.
713
00:51:27,370 --> 00:51:28,370
They were cages.
714
00:51:28,970 --> 00:51:30,310
I mean, it looked like a prison.
715
00:51:30,670 --> 00:51:35,789
Really stark, ugly, dark, dank prison.
716
00:51:37,990 --> 00:51:40,990
They had a chain around their
neck with a lock.
717
00:51:43,660 --> 00:51:46,680
Should you get into a bad fight, you
718
00:51:46,680 --> 00:51:48,940
could grab the chain and
keep them off of you.
719
00:51:49,180 --> 00:51:50,360
It was like prison behavior.
720
00:51:50,620 --> 00:51:53,340
We had to put up an electric
fence around the island
721
00:51:53,340 --> 00:51:57,039
because we had had several
murders and two suicides.
722
00:51:58,140 --> 00:52:00,100
They'd just push them
out into the water.
723
00:52:00,720 --> 00:52:01,720
Chips can't swim.
724
00:52:02,060 --> 00:52:04,080
Dr. Lemon ran the place.
725
00:52:04,800 --> 00:52:06,900
I had an immediate horrible reaction.
726
00:52:07,880 --> 00:52:09,360
He walked around with a cattle prod.
727
00:52:12,500 --> 00:52:17,320
I remember trying to push him away because
I knew what he was going to do.
728
00:52:18,179 --> 00:52:21,820
And he was screaming and holding
on to me very tightly.
729
00:52:22,820 --> 00:52:26,019
And the only reason he let go was
730
00:52:26,019 --> 00:52:28,760
because he got stabbed with
the electric prop.
731
00:52:34,349 --> 00:52:35,349
Come here, Mac.
732
00:52:35,369 --> 00:52:36,469
Mac, come here, Mac.
733
00:52:36,829 --> 00:52:38,529
Come here, come here.
734
00:52:39,110 --> 00:52:41,929
The reasoning behind the whole Mac-Nim
735
00:52:41,929 --> 00:52:45,469
interaction was that Mac
was not dangerous.
736
00:52:47,849 --> 00:52:51,190
He was small, so he was
737
00:52:51,609 --> 00:52:54,069
not an aggressive, dominant chimp.
738
00:52:54,309 --> 00:52:56,949
So he was the perfect one
for Nim to start with.
739
00:53:00,750 --> 00:53:01,869
-Oh, she's coming.
-Hey, do it.
740
00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:24,099
-See ya, man.
-See ya.
741
00:53:37,000 --> 00:53:38,360
-Hey, Mac.
-Uh-uh.
742
00:53:38,659 --> 00:53:39,659
Bah.
743
00:53:41,550 --> 00:53:42,550
Oh
744
00:53:48,300 --> 00:53:52,680
How did you expect Nim to react to his
first meeting with another champion?
745
00:53:53,700 --> 00:53:55,280
I think what happened was
that Nim was very
746
00:53:55,280 --> 00:53:58,620
apprehensive about Mac and
he took his time and
747
00:53:58,620 --> 00:54:02,019
then when he was ready, you know,
he and Mac got it off.
748
00:54:04,150 --> 00:54:07,630
I feel very good about this, because
I can leave now knowing
749
00:54:07,630 --> 00:54:12,650
that Nim has a friend, and he's
going to worry less about his
750
00:54:12,650 --> 00:54:15,530
human companions, and have at least
one other chimp to turn to.
751
00:54:24,349 --> 00:54:29,650
It was time to leave, and that's when
I took him and put him in the cage.
752
00:54:33,980 --> 00:54:37,980
Sure, I didn't want Joyce doing it, so I
just said, well, I'm gonna go do it.
753
00:54:37,980 --> 00:54:39,360
I didn't want Terrace doing it.
754
00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:43,639
Um, so... I just decided
I was gonna do it.
755
00:54:52,250 --> 00:54:56,550
You know we coaxed him down there
and then Because he trusted us.
756
00:54:56,949 --> 00:55:01,070
I just let him in there and took
the lead and tied it around the
757
00:55:01,070 --> 00:55:05,329
far end of the cage and Say goodbye
and walked out and shut the door
758
00:55:07,000 --> 00:55:12,000
♪
759
00:55:12,250 --> 00:55:17,250
♪
760
00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:22,920
He was sort of hooting and trying
to come after me because
761
00:55:22,920 --> 00:55:27,119
he didn't really know where he
was, but I just walked away.
762
00:55:29,349 --> 00:55:30,730
And that way it wasn't like an Iran.
763
00:55:31,500 --> 00:55:36,500
♪
764
00:55:36,750 --> 00:55:41,750
♪
765
00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:47,000
♪
766
00:55:47,250 --> 00:55:49,000
♪
767
00:55:49,099 --> 00:55:50,099
I did feel badly.
768
00:55:53,550 --> 00:55:56,570
I felt in a certain basic sense
that was not the right
769
00:55:56,570 --> 00:55:59,570
thing to do to somebody, you
know We've been part of
770
00:55:59,570 --> 00:56:02,890
my life for so many years And
that I was definitely
771
00:56:02,890 --> 00:56:07,610
doing Something that he somehow
would feel was unjust or wrong
772
00:56:08,500 --> 00:56:14,000
♪
773
00:56:14,199 --> 00:56:17,579
He had a little doll or something
that I think I left.
774
00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:23,000
♪
775
00:56:23,250 --> 00:56:24,500
♪
776
00:56:24,500 --> 00:56:29,199
I strongly believe that we made a commitment
to him, and we failed.
777
00:56:31,550 --> 00:56:37,269
We did a huge disservice to
that soul and shame on us
778
00:56:48,259 --> 00:56:51,039
Assumed, I guess, wrongly,
that Nim was gonna
779
00:56:51,039 --> 00:56:53,480
come back and he was gonna
be celebrated in the
780
00:56:53,480 --> 00:56:55,239
sense that he was gonna be
the Great Signing Chimp.
781
00:56:56,939 --> 00:56:58,599
No, exactly the opposite.
782
00:56:59,299 --> 00:57:00,460
Exactly the opposite.
783
00:57:03,079 --> 00:57:04,419
Nim in the cage.
784
00:57:04,719 --> 00:57:05,819
No special treatment.
785
00:57:06,019 --> 00:57:07,019
No yogurt.
786
00:57:07,019 --> 00:57:08,019
No granola.
787
00:57:08,079 --> 00:57:09,079
No...
788
00:57:09,079 --> 00:57:10,079
None of that.
789
00:57:10,359 --> 00:57:11,619
It's pretty traumatic for the chimp.
790
00:57:17,699 --> 00:57:21,119
They curl up and lay down.
791
00:57:21,919 --> 00:57:24,699
They lose interest in food,
they're just...
792
00:57:25,000 --> 00:57:28,500
♪
793
00:57:28,699 --> 00:57:31,859
It was a bad start with them,
and I the chimp is very
794
00:57:31,859 --> 00:57:36,179
upset And he just looks at me,
and he jumps and lunches me
795
00:57:36,179 --> 00:57:41,579
and bites through an artery right
in here I Did use a small shop?
796
00:57:45,300 --> 00:57:50,360
He had to grow up and not be a
single spoiled child anymore.
797
00:57:52,650 --> 00:57:58,190
So you gotta socialize, work on
his chimpanzee and manners.
798
00:57:58,500 --> 00:58:03,500
♪
799
00:58:03,750 --> 00:58:06,500
♪
800
00:58:06,960 --> 00:58:10,340
Everybody needs a job,
meaning and purpose.
801
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:15,000
♪
802
00:58:15,150 --> 00:58:17,990
Had them out, they would
help me in the big
803
00:58:17,990 --> 00:58:20,710
kitchen where we prepped
our food and did stuff.
804
00:58:20,829 --> 00:58:21,829
They'd sweep.
805
00:58:22,530 --> 00:58:24,289
Nim was an impulsive hand washer.
806
00:58:24,490 --> 00:58:25,510
He'd do dishes.
807
00:58:27,050 --> 00:58:28,769
Vanessa liked to dust.
808
00:58:29,990 --> 00:58:33,289
Little Mac liked to clean
cages and wear my boots.
809
00:58:38,220 --> 00:58:41,100
This was a special group of chimps,
you know, they weren't
810
00:58:41,100 --> 00:58:45,060
ordinary chimps, you know, they had the
capacity for higher consciousness.
811
00:59:07,739 --> 00:59:09,839
Terrence came back a year later.
812
00:59:11,819 --> 00:59:16,939
Herb arrived with still photographers
and cameras and that sort of thing.
813
00:59:18,439 --> 00:59:20,639
It was a shoot and it was
arranged as such.
814
00:59:23,449 --> 00:59:28,009
And there was no question that he was very
happy that he could see me again.
815
00:59:28,669 --> 00:59:31,569
There was no anger that, why
did you leave me here?
816
00:59:32,109 --> 00:59:35,689
It was just, hey, that's great,
I want to see him again.
817
00:59:37,369 --> 00:59:40,189
You could see that he was like, holy
shit, I'm going back to New York.
818
00:59:40,689 --> 00:59:41,689
It was like that.
819
00:59:42,189 --> 00:59:43,349
Like he was going to be rescued.
820
00:59:45,409 --> 00:59:47,909
It was kind of sad.
821
00:59:51,599 --> 00:59:52,920
I played with him.
822
00:59:53,159 --> 00:59:54,480
We got into games of signing.
823
00:59:55,119 --> 00:59:57,000
I remember I got him to sign hug.
824
00:59:57,440 --> 00:59:58,659
I got him to sign herb.
825
00:59:59,259 --> 01:00:01,179
In fact, I can get almost
any sign out of him.
826
01:00:01,380 --> 01:00:02,559
I didn't have to go through a drill.
827
01:00:04,639 --> 01:00:07,380
So it was a very entertaining,
comfortable afternoon.
828
01:00:08,039 --> 01:00:09,619
No bad behavior of any kind.
829
01:00:10,940 --> 01:00:16,839
At the end of the day, Lexetta's watch
gives me nimback and flies off.
830
01:00:18,519 --> 01:00:19,519
And it's gone.
831
01:00:20,879 --> 01:00:23,319
Next morning, he barely ate.
832
01:00:23,799 --> 01:00:26,579
He just started to crater.
833
01:00:29,349 --> 01:00:30,730
Herb never came back.
834
01:00:33,750 --> 01:00:36,449
I thought, I'm gonna become
Nim's friend, and
835
01:00:36,449 --> 01:00:38,889
I'm gonna hang with Nim, and
we'll see what happens.
836
01:00:40,730 --> 01:00:42,269
I mean, there wasn't
much I could do for
837
01:00:42,269 --> 01:00:44,349
him, in terms of the cage,
but get him out.
838
01:00:46,980 --> 01:00:48,119
Oh, you saw that, huh?
839
01:00:51,050 --> 01:00:52,050
See you later, Nan.
840
01:00:56,900 --> 01:01:00,720
We just liked each other right off,
and sometimes it's like that.
841
01:01:04,500 --> 01:01:09,500
♪
842
01:01:09,750 --> 01:01:12,000
♪
843
01:01:16,740 --> 01:01:17,780
chimps aren't humans.
844
01:01:19,260 --> 01:01:21,940
You have to kind of understand
chimps to be able
845
01:01:21,940 --> 01:01:24,740
to understand how to work with
them and be with them.
846
01:01:25,000 --> 01:01:29,500
♪
847
01:01:30,150 --> 01:01:33,250
I took him out on walks,
I didn't bring food, I
848
01:01:33,250 --> 01:01:36,369
didn't do the kind of things
that would interrupt
849
01:01:36,829 --> 01:01:39,630
the relationship or the building
of the relationship.
850
01:01:45,000 --> 01:01:47,400
you know he grows on you quick.
851
01:01:48,159 --> 01:01:49,579
He was so charming.
852
01:01:49,660 --> 01:01:51,300
I mean it didn't occur to me that
853
01:01:51,300 --> 01:01:53,900
animals had that kind of
personality like ours.
854
01:01:56,250 --> 01:01:58,570
And you had to be two of heart.
855
01:01:59,170 --> 01:02:00,989
You had to be two of heart.
856
01:02:01,469 --> 01:02:04,150
If you had dark places in
you, they'd know it.
857
01:02:04,190 --> 01:02:05,190
They wouldn't like it.
858
01:02:23,400 --> 01:02:25,619
Good morning. With us this
morning is Dr. Herbert
859
01:02:25,619 --> 01:02:28,440
Terras, a professor of psychology
at Columbia University.
860
01:02:28,900 --> 01:02:32,320
For several years, Dr. Terras was
in charge of an experiment where
861
01:02:32,320 --> 01:02:35,940
he and several other human beings
tried to teach a chimpanzee
862
01:02:35,940 --> 01:02:39,980
named Nim, the sign language of the
deaf, but now in a book just
863
01:02:39,980 --> 01:02:43,340
published, which is called Nim, you're
saying, Dr. Terras, that
864
01:02:43,340 --> 01:02:47,300
these experiments don't prove as much as
you had originally thought they did?
865
01:02:48,400 --> 01:02:50,320
I changed my mind about the data.
866
01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:56,500
♪
867
01:02:56,550 --> 01:03:00,110
I suddenly saw what the
key to this was.
868
01:03:01,930 --> 01:03:03,090
Nim was a brilliant beggar.
869
01:03:04,930 --> 01:03:10,690
He learned how to beg, and he
could work his teachers and
870
01:03:10,690 --> 01:03:14,269
always get what he wanted by moving
his hands in different ways.
871
01:03:14,890 --> 01:03:17,550
And most of the time, he moved
his hands in the ways that
872
01:03:17,550 --> 01:03:22,410
the teacher suggested, and the
motive of his signing was
873
01:03:22,410 --> 01:03:27,410
not to say, What a nice cat you have
over there, but I want it.
874
01:03:28,490 --> 01:03:31,510
When the experiments were over,
you returned Nim to the
875
01:03:31,510 --> 01:03:34,230
primate colony where he was born,
and a year after that,
876
01:03:34,310 --> 01:03:36,850
you went back for a visit, and
we came along with a camera.
877
01:03:38,230 --> 01:03:40,330
You and he are talking in sign
language here, right?
878
01:03:40,330 --> 01:03:42,490
Right. And here we have
it in slow motion.
879
01:03:42,550 --> 01:03:43,550
What's Nim saying?
880
01:03:44,289 --> 01:03:46,990
He's saying, Give Nim banana.
881
01:03:48,410 --> 01:03:51,830
Why is it that you're saying that he
can't speak like a human being?
882
01:03:51,830 --> 01:03:55,590
Well, a string of signs is not
necessarily a sentence.
883
01:03:57,370 --> 01:04:01,390
You can learn a list of words
by rote, and that
884
01:04:01,390 --> 01:04:02,950
says nothing about your ability
to use a grammar.
885
01:04:03,510 --> 01:04:06,530
Aren't you very disappointed that you spent
all this time and all this money?
886
01:04:07,210 --> 01:04:10,050
Well, it would have been very electrifying
news, almost like
887
01:04:10,050 --> 01:04:12,470
communicating with a creature
from out of space if I could
888
01:04:12,869 --> 01:04:17,650
show that another organism could use
language the way humans have.
889
01:04:17,789 --> 01:04:19,030
-But it didn't work.
-It didn't work.
890
01:04:19,269 --> 01:04:20,530
Thank you very much, Dr. Terrison.
891
01:04:21,090 --> 01:04:23,170
I hope somebody can still
talk to Nim and Annie.
892
01:04:38,849 --> 01:04:40,730
I didn't care about the language
893
01:04:40,730 --> 01:04:42,849
argument after a while, it
didn't matter to me.
894
01:04:44,900 --> 01:04:48,599
He might not have had sentences
or grammar, but there's no
895
01:04:48,599 --> 01:04:51,720
question that there was communication
going on, and I saw it clearly.
896
01:04:59,699 --> 01:05:02,759
He talked about the trees, the
berries that he found.
897
01:05:07,699 --> 01:05:09,279
He liked to play.
898
01:05:09,639 --> 01:05:10,899
Favorite song, play.
899
01:05:16,900 --> 01:05:18,920
Ha, ha, ha, ha!
900
01:05:20,900 --> 01:05:23,320
Holy shit, he doesn't know
which one to grab.
901
01:05:26,449 --> 01:05:29,189
He knew what pop was, or
hash, or whatever.
902
01:05:32,050 --> 01:05:35,090
And, uh, he wanted to smoke a joint.
903
01:05:38,759 --> 01:05:39,759
stone,
904
01:05:41,359 --> 01:05:42,359
smoke.
905
01:05:43,219 --> 01:05:44,219
Now.
906
01:05:44,500 --> 01:05:47,480
When we went out on walks with
Nim, Nim was one of us.
907
01:05:47,739 --> 01:05:49,460
If we smoked a joint,
he smoked it with
908
01:05:49,460 --> 01:05:51,319
us, in a circle, and we
handed it to him.
909
01:05:54,910 --> 01:05:56,210
Chimps are like us.
910
01:05:56,350 --> 01:05:58,230
They're hedonistic. They like
to do pleasurable things.
911
01:05:58,350 --> 01:06:02,470
They like to, you know, they like to
have fun and hell, who doesn't?
912
01:06:08,199 --> 01:06:11,419
And there's something
in marijuana that...
913
01:06:13,000 --> 01:06:14,260
They weren't aggressive.
914
01:06:15,320 --> 01:06:18,039
You talk less, you do
different things.
915
01:06:18,460 --> 01:06:19,460
You enjoy each other.
916
01:06:22,750 --> 01:06:28,050
Lily and Nim lived together
in the pig barn.
917
01:06:30,699 --> 01:06:32,559
Both of them didn't have many chimp
918
01:06:32,559 --> 01:06:36,799
friends, and then they became friends.
919
01:06:37,500 --> 01:06:42,449
♪
920
01:06:42,449 --> 01:06:46,189
They were seen copulating
and we think Nim
921
01:06:46,189 --> 01:06:48,389
might have been the father
of Lily's baby.
922
01:06:49,000 --> 01:06:54,000
♪
923
01:06:54,250 --> 01:06:59,250
♪
924
01:07:02,500 --> 01:07:03,780
The best time of my life.
925
01:07:03,960 --> 01:07:06,480
I still say that I've never
had such a good time
926
01:07:06,480 --> 01:07:09,539
except maybe at a Grateful
Dead show Pretty close.
927
01:07:10,320 --> 01:07:13,219
I don't even know which one
I actually being with Nim.
928
01:07:13,300 --> 01:07:16,019
I'd rather be with Nim than
Jerry And that's for me.
929
01:07:16,099 --> 01:07:17,460
That's that's saying something
930
01:07:20,949 --> 01:07:22,689
-That's real?
-Yeah, yeah, yeah.
931
01:07:22,989 --> 01:07:23,989
That's a banana?
932
01:07:26,199 --> 01:07:27,199
You want to eat the shit?
933
01:07:29,599 --> 01:07:30,599
That's a shoe.
934
01:07:30,619 --> 01:07:31,619
This is a bear shoe.
935
01:07:43,099 --> 01:07:46,420
And that's when Mahoney
started showing up.
936
01:07:48,739 --> 01:07:52,860
He was standing around, looking
at chimps and writing in his
937
01:07:52,860 --> 01:07:57,579
pad and whatever, and when someone,
when I found out who he
938
01:07:57,579 --> 01:08:01,079
was, and I'm sure it didn't take long
for me to figure it out, I was...
939
01:08:01,619 --> 01:08:04,460
Obviously, he was checking out
the chimps for the lab.
940
01:08:04,880 --> 01:08:09,039
LEMSIP is best known by its
acronym,-I-P, which is
941
01:08:09,039 --> 01:08:13,559
Laboratory for Experimental Medicine
and Surgery in Primates.
942
01:08:13,799 --> 01:08:17,559
He represented the devil to me.
943
01:08:17,739 --> 01:08:21,859
Most of the work that we did with the
chimpanzees, for example, was
944
01:08:24,420 --> 01:08:29,539
testing various candidate
vaccines for,
945
01:08:29,640 --> 01:08:34,000
like, Hepatitis B, Hepatitis
C, HIV, AIDS.
946
01:08:34,000 --> 01:08:39,640
I think it's very difficult
to fund the kinds of
947
01:08:39,640 --> 01:08:43,059
research that I happen to be
very much interested in.
948
01:08:43,159 --> 01:08:46,239
It's been difficult to fund social
research in general.
949
01:08:47,819 --> 01:08:52,180
We heard about Dr. Lemon's problems,
which were financial.
950
01:08:54,559 --> 01:08:56,779
It was finally arranged that, yes, we
951
01:08:56,779 --> 01:08:59,279
would take a very large
part of their colony.
952
01:09:02,449 --> 01:09:05,090
I thought Lemon was trying
to scare the university.
953
01:09:05,769 --> 01:09:10,250
I thought they would go, Oh, gosh, you
can't just hold a medical lab.
954
01:09:10,369 --> 01:09:11,369
We've got to do something.
955
01:09:11,569 --> 01:09:13,389
I thought the community
would rise itself up.
956
01:09:13,849 --> 01:09:17,529
Bob and I tried so hard
with public appeal for
957
01:09:17,529 --> 01:09:21,710
something for the chimps, and
there was no response.
958
01:09:22,409 --> 01:09:25,869
And then shortly after that, the
chimps were indeed sold.
959
01:09:26,500 --> 01:09:31,000
♪
960
01:09:34,000 --> 01:09:36,699
Of the chimps that are being
sent off to the lab today,
961
01:09:37,039 --> 01:09:39,439
how many of them were subjects
of the signing research?
962
01:09:40,239 --> 01:09:45,539
Only one was restricted
to signing research.
963
01:09:45,680 --> 01:09:46,680
This is NIMM.
964
01:09:54,100 --> 01:09:57,079
As a chimp you've got no way of knowing
what's happening to you.
965
01:09:57,140 --> 01:10:00,060
You're just suddenly cut off from
seeing everything outside
966
01:10:02,980 --> 01:10:06,840
Suddenly after a day and a half
of constant driving you
967
01:10:06,840 --> 01:10:09,340
you get out the other end and you're
in another sort of room
968
01:10:27,149 --> 01:10:30,509
I wouldn't say they were
jumping with joy
969
01:10:32,069 --> 01:10:33,849
to find themselves in a new place.
970
01:10:43,399 --> 01:10:48,179
Come on, come on, one more
time, one more time.
971
01:10:57,050 --> 01:10:59,750
I took on the role of being
the one who chose
972
01:11:00,850 --> 01:11:03,810
which animals would go into
which types of study.
973
01:11:05,949 --> 01:11:07,710
And I hated it
974
01:11:17,800 --> 01:11:19,539
You want to go away with Spike?
975
01:11:19,579 --> 01:11:20,579
Tulip?
976
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:26,100
These animals will be used on hepatitis
vaccine safety tests.
977
01:11:26,659 --> 01:11:32,300
It is a federal law that before
a new batch of vaccine can be
978
01:11:32,300 --> 01:11:36,680
released on the American market, it
must be tested for chimpanzees.
979
01:11:37,440 --> 01:11:41,239
There's no way, in all honesty,
there's no way you can
980
01:11:41,239 --> 01:11:45,560
carry out research on animals
and for it to be humane.
981
01:11:45,560 --> 01:11:49,880
It can't be humane because you
already put them in a cage.
982
01:11:50,680 --> 01:11:54,159
That was already the first step and
from there on it's downhill.
983
01:12:01,000 --> 01:12:04,140
We realized that certain
of the Oklahoma chimps
984
01:12:04,620 --> 01:12:08,699
could use sign language and were
trying to sign with us.
985
01:12:09,079 --> 01:12:12,880
What we did was we wrote down
on sheets of paper, which we
986
01:12:12,880 --> 01:12:17,260
posted all over the place on doors
and walls and everywhere we
987
01:12:17,260 --> 01:12:22,460
could find, of certain signs and
it was hoped that as time went
988
01:12:22,460 --> 01:12:27,800
by, everyone would pick up at least
a certain amount of sign language.
989
01:12:33,630 --> 01:12:38,510
I didn't see Nim as special
990
01:12:38,510 --> 01:12:40,350
above anyone else in the
991
01:12:40,350 --> 01:12:44,050
group because they were all going
through the same thing.
992
01:12:52,000 --> 01:12:57,000
♪
993
01:12:57,250 --> 01:12:59,500
♪
994
01:13:00,000 --> 01:13:05,000
♪
995
01:13:05,250 --> 01:13:10,250
♪
996
01:13:10,500 --> 01:13:13,500
♪
997
01:13:13,949 --> 01:13:19,010
I made a big, big stink about
it in every way I could.
998
01:13:19,130 --> 01:13:20,130
I called the press.
999
01:13:20,529 --> 01:13:23,449
We bitched as much as we could.
1000
01:13:24,000 --> 01:13:29,000
♪
1001
01:13:29,250 --> 01:13:32,500
♪
1002
01:13:32,699 --> 01:13:37,139
The student, Bob Ingersoll,
he used to hound me every
1003
01:13:37,139 --> 01:13:40,559
chance he got and I would start
to get really annoyed.
1004
01:13:41,599 --> 01:13:45,939
And then it dawned on me that he
was the only one who cared.
1005
01:13:48,420 --> 01:13:51,619
Nobody, nobody except
the press helped us.
1006
01:13:51,779 --> 01:13:53,179
Is there anything that
you would consider
1007
01:13:53,179 --> 01:13:55,619
doing to prevent what is
going to happen to him?
1008
01:13:56,059 --> 01:14:01,859
Unfortunately, there's nothing I can
do because legally Nim is not mine.
1009
01:14:01,859 --> 01:14:05,559
Nim was loaned to me for the
duration of my project.
1010
01:14:05,859 --> 01:14:07,720
That project ran out of funds.
1011
01:14:09,500 --> 01:14:14,000
♪
1012
01:14:14,000 --> 01:14:18,960
Somebody at the Boston Globe told me to
read the front page story on that day.
1013
01:14:19,699 --> 01:14:23,600
He said, I think you'd be interested
and I know you take unusual cases.
1014
01:14:26,350 --> 01:14:29,950
As a human being, I thought
it was a kind of esoteric,
1015
01:14:30,210 --> 01:14:32,890
unique form of animal cruelty,
all the worse for that.
1016
01:14:33,270 --> 01:14:36,230
And as a lawyer, I thought it
was just plain illegal.
1017
01:14:36,730 --> 01:14:40,390
If the facts are, as I'm being told,
that this young chimp was
1018
01:14:40,390 --> 01:14:45,390
brought up from infancy in a human family,
you can't stick him into a
1019
01:14:45,390 --> 01:14:49,150
little cage in some horrible medical lab
and use him for medical experiments.
1020
01:14:49,570 --> 01:14:50,990
It's per se animal cruelty.
1021
01:14:52,789 --> 01:14:54,730
Early on, I decided this.
1022
01:14:55,690 --> 01:15:00,110
If this animal has been deliberately
brought up from
1023
01:15:00,530 --> 01:15:04,490
infanthood to think of himself
as human, then if I'm
1024
01:15:04,490 --> 01:15:07,550
going to represent him, I have to
treat him like a human client.
1025
01:15:08,570 --> 01:15:09,670
Give him his day in court.
1026
01:15:12,429 --> 01:15:16,670
Henry and I, Mr. Herman, were in communication
pretty much every day.
1027
01:15:18,630 --> 01:15:20,829
He used a really cool
strategy, actually.
1028
01:15:20,970 --> 01:15:23,569
He said, hey, this chimp
can speak for himself.
1029
01:15:23,829 --> 01:15:25,229
Let's bring him into court
and let him talk.
1030
01:15:25,529 --> 01:15:30,609
What I had ready as a trial exhibit
was a steel cage and a
1031
01:15:30,609 --> 01:15:33,649
couple of strong guys with a pole
ready to carry it into court,
1032
01:15:33,929 --> 01:15:37,590
and I was gonna get Nim to go into a
frenzy and signal out, out, out.
1033
01:15:38,210 --> 01:15:41,949
And I believe the judge said
something to the effect
1034
01:15:41,949 --> 01:15:44,529
that I'm not letting a fucking
chimpanzee come in here
1035
01:15:44,529 --> 01:15:48,389
and make a mockery of my courtroom
or something to that effect.
1036
01:15:48,470 --> 01:15:49,970
And that's when I said
I'm gonna bring in
1037
01:15:49,970 --> 01:15:52,590
effect a habeas corpus petition
on behalf of Chimp.
1038
01:15:52,750 --> 01:15:53,750
Bring him to court.
1039
01:15:58,100 --> 01:16:01,480
Our opponents were pig-headed,
but they weren't stupid.
1040
01:16:02,400 --> 01:16:05,720
They realized that win, lose,
or draw, once I got into
1041
01:16:05,720 --> 01:16:08,360
court, they'd be losing, because
even if the judge
1042
01:16:08,360 --> 01:16:11,400
refused to hear them, the media attention
would have been devastated.
1043
01:16:12,980 --> 01:16:16,360
And the dean of the medical
faculty said, That's it.
1044
01:16:16,640 --> 01:16:17,820
Get that chimp out of here.
1045
01:16:24,659 --> 01:16:28,439
Before anything could happen,
swooping down
1046
01:16:29,800 --> 01:16:34,099
like in some Wagnerian drama,
comes Cleveland Amory.
1047
01:16:38,500 --> 01:16:43,020
I want this to be a place where
those animals that have
1048
01:16:43,020 --> 01:16:47,279
been abused, that have been
misused, will finally and
1049
01:16:47,740 --> 01:16:51,880
forever have a place that they never
will have to fear again.
1050
01:16:54,720 --> 01:16:58,900
Mr. Amory had, up until then,
perhaps a well-deserved
1051
01:16:58,900 --> 01:17:01,380
reputation for doing important
work for animal rights.
1052
01:17:02,760 --> 01:17:06,680
And he just went and buys the chimp,
takes him to his black
1053
01:17:06,680 --> 01:17:10,880
horse ranch, or whatever it was called,
and says, I am saving Nim.
1054
01:17:11,480 --> 01:17:13,500
Lead Len Amory to the rescue again.
1055
01:17:13,940 --> 01:17:16,900
Nim will live here for the
rest of his natural life.
1056
01:17:19,000 --> 01:17:23,380
Here my story ends, my troubles
are over, and I am at home.
1057
01:17:24,880 --> 01:17:26,960
And that's what it says as you drive
into Black Beauty Ranch.
1058
01:17:28,979 --> 01:17:31,479
He was the only animal we ever
bought, and we didn't
1059
01:17:31,479 --> 01:17:34,699
know a thing about chimpanzees,
but we just thought it
1060
01:17:34,699 --> 01:17:37,539
was better, what we could do was
better than where he was.
1061
01:17:39,949 --> 01:17:43,210
It was never meant to be a
home for caged animals.
1062
01:17:45,010 --> 01:17:48,670
It is really a home for abused
and abandoned equine animals.
1063
01:17:48,989 --> 01:17:50,189
That's animals just with hooves.
1064
01:17:52,000 --> 01:17:55,500
♪
1065
01:17:55,550 --> 01:17:59,310
We were aghast that he would
just pick up this chimp,
1066
01:17:59,989 --> 01:18:02,310
transport him to a horse ranch
somewhere in the middle of
1067
01:18:02,310 --> 01:18:06,750
nowhere, and there was nobody there who
knew how to take care of a chimp.
1068
01:18:09,399 --> 01:18:12,599
We brought him to Black Beauty
and built a house for him.
1069
01:18:14,989 --> 01:18:18,269
It was a big kind of a square
place and it had a
1070
01:18:18,269 --> 01:18:20,449
porch outside so that he
could go outside and he
1071
01:18:20,449 --> 01:18:22,989
had all sorts of toys to play
with, but it was solitary.
1072
01:18:35,310 --> 01:18:38,130
Chimps are social animals,
and you can't just put
1073
01:18:38,130 --> 01:18:41,649
one chimp in a box and expect
everything to be cool.
1074
01:18:44,000 --> 01:18:49,500
♪
1075
01:18:49,750 --> 01:18:52,710
Some of the time was sitting
like this in the
1076
01:18:52,710 --> 01:18:55,489
corner and you just thought
what is he thinking?
1077
01:18:55,529 --> 01:18:56,529
What is he missing?
1078
01:18:56,529 --> 01:18:58,250
What can we do? Will
you please be sure
1079
01:18:58,250 --> 01:19:00,170
to stop off here in the
nation's capital?
1080
01:19:01,069 --> 01:19:04,829
We had a TV down and then he broke
that and then we put one
1081
01:19:04,829 --> 01:19:09,529
up in the ceiling and he found
a way to get there Well,
1082
01:19:09,609 --> 01:19:12,010
okay, you don't get a television if
that's gonna be your attitude
1083
01:19:15,449 --> 01:19:17,929
I wrote letters to Cleveland,
bitching at him
1084
01:19:17,929 --> 01:19:22,510
about how leaving Nim there alone
was virtually torture.
1085
01:19:32,399 --> 01:19:34,220
Not only did they not
care what I thought,
1086
01:19:34,699 --> 01:19:37,420
they wanted me as far away
from them as possible.
1087
01:19:38,439 --> 01:19:40,359
And they wanted to make
that pretty clear.
1088
01:19:41,020 --> 01:19:42,340
And they did make that pretty clear.
1089
01:19:42,720 --> 01:19:44,460
You know, if you come here,
you'll be arrested.
1090
01:19:52,000 --> 01:19:56,500
♪
1091
01:19:59,980 --> 01:20:03,220
I felt it, you know, and I just
1092
01:20:03,220 --> 01:20:06,620
wanted to, like, I don't know, I...
1093
01:20:08,500 --> 01:20:13,500
♪
1094
01:20:13,750 --> 01:20:18,750
♪
1095
01:20:21,449 --> 01:20:23,389
He got out a number of times.
1096
01:20:25,029 --> 01:20:27,569
What he wanted to do was
go in the ranch house.
1097
01:20:28,869 --> 01:20:32,069
Be in the ranch house, be with
people, sleep in a bed.
1098
01:20:33,229 --> 01:20:35,029
We had a bed for him in his house.
1099
01:20:35,109 --> 01:20:36,630
We never slept in the
bed in his house.
1100
01:20:38,800 --> 01:20:41,420
One time when he came in
the house, there was a
1101
01:20:41,420 --> 01:20:43,539
little white poodle thing
and just barked and
1102
01:20:43,539 --> 01:20:46,779
barked and barked at this Chimpanzee
coming through the door.
1103
01:20:47,140 --> 01:20:51,119
He just picked it up and swung up against
the wall He meant to shut the dog up.
1104
01:20:51,460 --> 01:20:54,720
But of course he killed the dog There
was another time when he went
1105
01:20:54,720 --> 01:20:56,579
in the house and he picked up a chair
and threw it through the window
1106
01:20:59,500 --> 01:21:03,000
♪
1107
01:21:03,250 --> 01:21:05,909
This this is a very miserable
chimpanzee, you know
1108
01:21:08,349 --> 01:21:10,189
He'd had such a checkered
life and he'd
1109
01:21:10,189 --> 01:21:11,889
gone from here to here to
here to here to here.
1110
01:21:13,590 --> 01:21:14,590
They should be left.
1111
01:21:14,609 --> 01:21:16,670
They should not be taken away from
their mothers in the first place.
1112
01:21:28,000 --> 01:21:29,939
I knew that Nim was there.
1113
01:21:30,180 --> 01:21:32,720
I didn't know anything about the
quality of his life there.
1114
01:21:32,979 --> 01:21:35,140
I heard good things and
bad things and so on.
1115
01:21:35,840 --> 01:21:37,539
And I thought, why not go?
1116
01:21:40,100 --> 01:21:43,440
So we all flew out to
Texas, we go to the
1117
01:21:43,440 --> 01:21:45,380
ranch, we meet the people
taking care of him.
1118
01:21:46,160 --> 01:21:48,900
He was alone, he was the
only chimp there.
1119
01:21:55,399 --> 01:21:58,099
I happened to be looking at him
when Stephanie got out of
1120
01:21:58,099 --> 01:22:01,960
the car and he saw her and he recognized
her right away and
1121
01:22:02,559 --> 01:22:07,359
The look on his face was just oh
now you come now you come now.
1122
01:22:07,460 --> 01:22:09,059
I've been through all this
and now you come
1123
01:22:13,600 --> 01:22:18,920
He definitely recognized us whether
he was happy to see us.
1124
01:22:19,100 --> 01:22:20,100
I don't know
1125
01:22:22,750 --> 01:22:27,350
He wasn't particularly attractive to me
now that he was an adult chimpanzee.
1126
01:22:27,409 --> 01:22:30,430
I didn't have a, oh, isn't he beautiful
or anything like that.
1127
01:22:30,489 --> 01:22:33,069
He was, he was, I didn't know him.
1128
01:22:35,029 --> 01:22:40,010
My mother decides that she wants
to go into the enclosure with
1129
01:22:40,010 --> 01:22:45,250
him, which didn't, which happened sort
of, I'm going to go in with him.
1130
01:22:46,670 --> 01:22:49,470
We said to her, he doesn't
look like he's going to
1131
01:22:49,470 --> 01:22:52,270
welcome you, so maybe you shouldn't
go into his facility.
1132
01:22:53,750 --> 01:22:54,750
I was curious.
1133
01:22:54,890 --> 01:22:56,369
Is he going to sign? What's
going to happen?
1134
01:22:56,489 --> 01:22:57,489
What's it going to be like?
1135
01:22:57,750 --> 01:22:59,430
Stephanie, please don't go in there.
1136
01:22:59,590 --> 01:23:01,010
He's not in a good mood.
1137
01:23:01,149 --> 01:23:03,470
You know, you can tell he's
not in a good mood.
1138
01:23:06,149 --> 01:23:08,469
I opened the gate and walked in.
1139
01:23:09,269 --> 01:23:12,229
And then went up to the,
like, first and a
1140
01:23:12,229 --> 01:23:14,549
half story, something like
that, pretty high up.
1141
01:23:15,609 --> 01:23:18,170
And I realized how much
danger I was in.
1142
01:23:22,699 --> 01:23:27,359
He came down, and then it was a blur.
1143
01:23:29,149 --> 01:23:32,189
Grabbed her by the ankle and
he starts dragging her
1144
01:23:32,189 --> 01:23:34,689
running back and forth literally
like a rag doll
1145
01:23:34,689 --> 01:23:36,929
just pulling her back forth I
think he's gonna kill her.
1146
01:23:37,210 --> 01:23:39,049
He was gonna swing her against
the wall and then swing her
1147
01:23:39,049 --> 01:23:41,750
against the wall again There was nothing
loving about he was furious
1148
01:23:45,250 --> 01:23:47,090
I remember being in discussions about
1149
01:23:47,090 --> 01:23:49,729
getting the gun or not getting
the gun, yeah.
1150
01:23:50,890 --> 01:23:51,930
So they got a gun.
1151
01:23:57,500 --> 01:23:59,380
No, he's not gonna kill her.
1152
01:23:59,500 --> 01:24:01,140
He's just really pissed off
1153
01:24:03,319 --> 01:24:07,079
Things dissipate and he sort of
wandered off and I was able to
1154
01:24:07,079 --> 01:24:10,340
get out of door I have no idea how
long the whole thing lasted
1155
01:24:11,819 --> 01:24:16,939
The fact that he didn't kill her
meant a lot because he could
1156
01:24:16,939 --> 01:24:20,619
have And he would have been dead because
they would have shot him
1157
01:24:21,000 --> 01:24:24,500
♪
1158
01:24:24,550 --> 01:24:29,310
I had abandoned him and he
had managed to grow up
1159
01:24:29,310 --> 01:24:33,210
and I had walked back in as if
I had not abandoned him.
1160
01:24:33,869 --> 01:24:37,810
And he said, no, this is
my space, I'm going to
1161
01:24:37,810 --> 01:24:40,829
put you in your place, but I'm
not going to hurt you.
1162
01:24:49,199 --> 01:24:53,380
We had done so much damage,
removing him
1163
01:24:53,380 --> 01:24:56,159
from what his life should have been.
1164
01:24:56,619 --> 01:25:01,359
We exploited his human-like nature without
regard to his chimpanzee nature.
1165
01:25:02,300 --> 01:25:04,679
We were co-opting him right
from the beginning.
1166
01:25:05,639 --> 01:25:06,760
It was wrong.
1167
01:25:40,949 --> 01:25:44,069
About a year after Nim was
sold to the fund they
1168
01:25:44,069 --> 01:25:47,510
purchased a female chimpanzee
to be with him Around
1169
01:25:47,510 --> 01:25:50,769
ten years after that I heard
she was in failing health.
1170
01:25:50,989 --> 01:25:55,569
I was worried that Nim was gonna
be on his own again That same
1171
01:25:55,569 --> 01:25:58,489
time I was told that a new guy had
taken over the ranch and his
1172
01:25:58,489 --> 01:26:02,550
name was Chris Byrne And so I approached
Chris about visiting Nim
1173
01:26:08,699 --> 01:26:12,739
And once I met Chris,
I was really, really
1174
01:26:12,739 --> 01:26:15,199
reassured that things were going
to be much better for Nim.
1175
01:26:16,380 --> 01:26:17,380
Look, Nim.
1176
01:26:17,579 --> 01:26:18,579
Somebody's come to see you.
1177
01:26:19,220 --> 01:26:20,479
Oh, he's got his tackles up.
1178
01:26:22,939 --> 01:26:24,119
-Hey, it's okay.
-Hi, Nam.
1179
01:26:24,199 --> 01:26:25,199
What's up, bud?
1180
01:26:25,399 --> 01:26:27,460
Nam. He's gonna do a couple of
minutes of this for you.
1181
01:26:27,519 --> 01:26:28,519
Oh, that's okay.
1182
01:26:28,680 --> 01:26:29,680
Nam!
1183
01:26:29,680 --> 01:26:30,680
What's up, bud?
1184
01:26:34,399 --> 01:26:35,399
Yeah, I know, buddy.
1185
01:26:35,420 --> 01:26:36,420
Who am I?
1186
01:26:36,420 --> 01:26:37,420
Who am I?
1187
01:26:37,599 --> 01:26:38,599
Hey, who are you?
1188
01:26:42,500 --> 01:26:43,579
Play, play.
1189
01:27:00,050 --> 01:27:01,050
Oh, damn it.
1190
01:27:12,050 --> 01:27:16,850
I said to Chris, I have a way
to help you and I know I
1191
01:27:16,850 --> 01:27:20,810
can help you to get out of the
chimps So let's work together
1192
01:27:24,950 --> 01:27:25,950
Things are improving.
1193
01:27:26,170 --> 01:27:27,409
Things are way improving.
1194
01:27:28,750 --> 01:27:30,050
It's taken a while, though.
1195
01:27:30,449 --> 01:27:31,489
It's taken a long time.
1196
01:27:32,150 --> 01:27:33,150
I've had many easy moments.
1197
01:27:34,250 --> 01:27:39,869
On August the 10th, 1995,
the dean of NYU Medical
1198
01:27:39,869 --> 01:27:42,890
Center announced that the
Clemson would be closed.
1199
01:27:44,409 --> 01:27:47,750
And I thought, I'm gonna
try and save as many of
1200
01:27:47,750 --> 01:27:52,890
the chimps as I can, but in a
very quiet way, secretly.
1201
01:27:54,289 --> 01:27:55,289
Hey, Lulu.
1202
01:27:55,369 --> 01:27:56,369
What's up, girl?
1203
01:27:56,369 --> 01:27:57,369
How you doing?
1204
01:27:57,489 --> 01:28:00,980
That's where Bob came in through
the secret network.
1205
01:28:01,650 --> 01:28:02,650
What's up, Nim?
1206
01:28:02,909 --> 01:28:04,070
Who is this over here?
1207
01:28:04,750 --> 01:28:06,130
Who is this over here, Nim?
1208
01:28:06,210 --> 01:28:07,210
Who is it?
1209
01:28:07,789 --> 01:28:09,470
This is gonna be your new roommate.
1210
01:28:13,149 --> 01:28:14,149
I love you.
1211
01:28:15,899 --> 01:28:17,379
so I can get you down to work.
1212
01:28:21,289 --> 01:28:22,289
Okay, we'll do it.
1213
01:28:28,550 --> 01:28:29,829
How do you think, Midge?
1214
01:28:30,110 --> 01:28:32,190
I told you it would be nice, didn't I?
1215
01:28:32,510 --> 01:28:36,610
Jim Mahoney moved literally
50, 60 chimps.
1216
01:28:38,090 --> 01:28:42,029
And we did indeed get two chimps from
1217
01:28:42,029 --> 01:28:44,789
Lemsep through Mahoney to
Black Beauty Ranch.
1218
01:28:45,930 --> 01:28:49,449
Midge was a youngish adult male
1219
01:28:50,409 --> 01:28:53,570
and Lulu was very gentle.
1220
01:28:57,500 --> 01:29:02,020
Lulu immediately went to her
defense, and Nim came over.
1221
01:29:03,319 --> 01:29:04,800
Very good, Lulu.
1222
01:29:05,000 --> 01:29:06,000
She's so good.
1223
01:29:06,380 --> 01:29:07,399
Yeah, you're a friend, Lulu.
1224
01:29:07,439 --> 01:29:11,220
I think Mitch and Lulu really
helped him out enormously.
1225
01:29:16,300 --> 01:29:18,100
-What?
-Now you're making noises for it.
1226
01:29:18,300 --> 01:29:19,380
What's the name of this?
1227
01:29:19,420 --> 01:29:20,420
Hey, I'm Nims.
1228
01:29:20,579 --> 01:29:21,940
-Nims what?
-What?
-Soda pop?
1229
01:29:22,079 --> 01:29:25,560
I'm not... Things were as good
as could be expected
1230
01:29:25,560 --> 01:29:29,820
based on everything you know
that had gone on previous.
1231
01:29:29,980 --> 01:29:31,520
Oh, yeah, that's so good, Nim.
1232
01:29:31,579 --> 01:29:32,579
Isn't it good?
1233
01:29:32,579 --> 01:29:37,500
It wasn't exactly perfect, but
it was pretty damn good.
1234
01:29:40,000 --> 01:29:45,000
♪
1235
01:29:45,250 --> 01:29:49,500
♪
1236
01:29:52,100 --> 01:29:55,060
Chimps are truly wonderful animals,
1237
01:29:57,100 --> 01:29:59,660
they're very forgiving the
vast majority of them.
1238
01:30:00,500 --> 01:30:03,500
♪
1239
01:30:05,260 --> 01:30:06,260
they'll forgive you.
1240
01:30:12,000 --> 01:30:17,000
♪
1241
01:30:17,250 --> 01:30:22,250
♪
1242
01:30:22,500 --> 01:30:27,500
♪
1243
01:30:27,750 --> 01:30:32,750
♪
1244
01:30:33,000 --> 01:30:38,000
♪
1245
01:30:38,250 --> 01:30:43,250
♪
1246
01:30:43,500 --> 01:30:48,000
♪
1247
01:30:51,000 --> 01:30:56,000
♪
1248
01:30:56,250 --> 01:31:01,250
♪
1249
01:31:01,500 --> 01:31:06,500
♪
1250
01:31:06,750 --> 01:31:11,750
♪
1251
01:31:12,000 --> 01:31:16,500
♪
1252
01:31:17,500 --> 01:31:22,000
♪
1253
01:31:23,000 --> 01:31:28,000
♪
1254
01:31:28,250 --> 01:31:33,250
♪
1255
01:31:33,500 --> 01:31:38,500
♪
1256
01:31:38,750 --> 01:31:43,750
♪
1257
01:31:44,000 --> 01:31:49,000
♪
1258
01:31:49,250 --> 01:31:54,250
♪
1259
01:31:54,500 --> 01:31:59,500
♪
1260
01:31:59,750 --> 01:32:04,750
♪
1261
01:32:05,000 --> 01:32:10,000
♪
1262
01:32:10,250 --> 01:32:15,250
♪
1263
01:32:15,500 --> 01:32:20,500
♪
1264
01:32:20,750 --> 01:32:25,750
♪
1265
01:32:26,000 --> 01:32:31,000
♪
1266
01:32:31,250 --> 01:32:36,250
♪
1267
01:32:36,500 --> 01:32:41,500
♪
1268
01:32:41,750 --> 01:32:46,750
♪
1269
01:32:47,000 --> 01:32:52,000
♪
1270
01:32:52,250 --> 01:32:57,250
♪
1271
01:32:57,500 --> 01:33:02,500
♪
1272
01:33:02,750 --> 01:33:07,750
♪
1273
01:33:08,000 --> 01:33:13,000
♪
1274
01:33:13,250 --> 01:33:18,250
♪
1275
01:33:18,500 --> 01:33:23,500
♪
1276
01:33:23,750 --> 01:33:28,750
♪
1277
01:33:29,000 --> 01:33:32,500
♪
1278
01:33:33,000 --> 01:33:38,000
♪
1279
01:33:38,250 --> 01:33:43,250
♪
1280
01:33:43,500 --> 01:33:48,500
♪
1281
01:33:48,750 --> 01:33:53,750
♪
1282
01:33:54,000 --> 01:33:59,000
♪
1283
01:33:59,250 --> 01:34:04,250
♪
1284
01:34:04,500 --> 01:34:09,500
♪
1285
01:34:09,750 --> 01:34:14,750
♪
1286
01:34:15,000 --> 01:34:20,000
♪
1287
01:34:20,250 --> 01:34:25,250
♪
1288
01:34:25,500 --> 01:34:30,500
♪
1289
01:34:30,750 --> 01:34:35,750
♪
1290
01:34:36,000 --> 01:34:41,000
♪
1291
01:34:41,250 --> 01:34:46,250
♪
1292
01:34:46,500 --> 01:34:51,500
♪
1293
01:34:51,750 --> 01:34:56,750
♪
1294
01:34:57,000 --> 01:35:02,000
♪
1295
01:35:02,250 --> 01:35:07,250
♪
1296
01:35:07,500 --> 01:35:12,500
♪
1297
01:35:12,750 --> 01:35:17,750
♪
1298
01:35:18,000 --> 01:35:23,000
♪
1299
01:35:23,250 --> 01:35:28,250
♪
1300
01:35:28,500 --> 01:35:31,500
♪
97166
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