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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:02:35,589 --> 00:02:39,158 - Never before has so much porn been watched, 2 00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:42,227 and yet the porn industry is in its death throes. 3 00:02:52,405 --> 00:02:54,306 - These sites have turned the industry 4 00:02:54,308 --> 00:02:55,474 upside down. 5 00:02:55,476 --> 00:02:56,808 They've swallowed up everything, 6 00:02:56,810 --> 00:02:58,944 absorbed everything, without mercy. 7 00:02:58,946 --> 00:03:01,713 - We knew that it was gonna, 8 00:03:01,715 --> 00:03:03,215 gonna kill the industry. 9 00:03:05,286 --> 00:03:07,286 - Production companies are shutting down 10 00:03:07,288 --> 00:03:10,222 one by one, and the first victims are women. 11 00:03:10,224 --> 00:03:12,724 Actresses are forced to take part in increasingly 12 00:03:12,726 --> 00:03:15,594 hardcore porn, for half as much money. 13 00:03:15,596 --> 00:03:17,763 - Many production believe that the harder you shoot-- 14 00:03:17,765 --> 00:03:18,931 - yes the harder the better. 15 00:03:18,933 --> 00:03:21,400 - The bigger you put inside. 16 00:03:21,402 --> 00:03:23,902 - Yeah, she's had a lot of cocks in her ass. 17 00:03:23,904 --> 00:03:26,205 Four cocks at the same time. 18 00:03:26,207 --> 00:03:27,639 - Just a handful of geeks, 19 00:03:27,641 --> 00:03:30,909 who came out of nowhere, have profited from this misery, 20 00:03:30,911 --> 00:03:33,445 earning unprecedented amounts of money. 21 00:03:33,447 --> 00:03:34,713 - How many users of pornhub-- 22 00:03:34,715 --> 00:03:36,215 - 16 million a day. 23 00:03:36,217 --> 00:03:37,449 - Wait a minute, who is this? 24 00:03:37,451 --> 00:03:41,653 - Turn over a month was roughly $40 million, us. 25 00:03:41,655 --> 00:03:42,721 - A month? - A month. 26 00:03:46,759 --> 00:03:48,760 - I don't believe anything that they say, 27 00:03:48,762 --> 00:03:51,730 having worked for them, because nothing makes sense. 28 00:03:51,732 --> 00:03:52,831 - Behind all of this 29 00:03:52,833 --> 00:03:54,666 are shady financial operations, 30 00:03:54,668 --> 00:03:57,436 an opaque business where the law of silence reigns. 31 00:03:57,438 --> 00:03:58,704 - In the last three years, 32 00:03:58,706 --> 00:04:01,940 I have had my life threatened maybe six times, 33 00:04:01,942 --> 00:04:05,410 so I carry a gun, just in case. 34 00:04:35,008 --> 00:04:39,011 - I made adult films for 17 years. 35 00:04:39,013 --> 00:04:41,880 I know this industry very well. 36 00:04:41,882 --> 00:04:45,384 A few years ago, I found out that my films 37 00:04:45,386 --> 00:04:48,387 were being shown for free without my consent, 38 00:04:48,389 --> 00:04:51,590 and that now, anyone can access them; 39 00:04:51,592 --> 00:04:54,526 neighbors, colleagues, children. 40 00:04:55,662 --> 00:04:59,064 The piracy of my films has affected my life far more 41 00:04:59,066 --> 00:05:01,900 than anyone might ever suspect. 42 00:05:03,836 --> 00:05:08,373 Since the mid-1990s, Budapest has been the undisputed 43 00:05:08,375 --> 00:05:10,575 European capital of porn. 44 00:05:11,577 --> 00:05:13,045 If we would find the victims 45 00:05:13,047 --> 00:05:17,816 of this great transformation anywhere, it would be here. 46 00:05:31,998 --> 00:05:32,931 - Hello. - Hi. 47 00:05:32,933 --> 00:05:34,399 - I'm Alina, nice to meet you. 48 00:05:34,401 --> 00:05:35,567 - Ovidie, nice to meet you. 49 00:05:35,569 --> 00:05:36,535 - Welcome. 50 00:05:46,346 --> 00:05:47,646 - Hello. 51 00:05:47,648 --> 00:05:48,914 Yes. 52 00:05:48,916 --> 00:05:49,848 Hello. - Hello. 53 00:05:49,850 --> 00:05:51,783 - Come, come inside. 54 00:05:52,952 --> 00:05:54,519 - Ovidie, nice to meet you. 55 00:05:54,521 --> 00:05:56,855 - Nice to meet you. 56 00:05:56,857 --> 00:05:59,458 - This is the main page of our website. 57 00:05:59,460 --> 00:06:02,594 Here you can find models who does hardcore shootings, 58 00:06:02,596 --> 00:06:05,764 so like, girl-girl, boy-girl, anal and more. 59 00:06:05,766 --> 00:06:07,466 So you have information here; 60 00:06:07,468 --> 00:06:10,802 name, age, place of residence, the breast, 61 00:06:10,804 --> 00:06:14,005 and all the stuff that productions need to know, 62 00:06:14,007 --> 00:06:16,842 and what she does, from soft to, 63 00:06:16,844 --> 00:06:18,577 to double anal or whatever. 64 00:06:19,913 --> 00:06:21,913 - How many girls do you have right now? 65 00:06:21,915 --> 00:06:24,049 - Right now? - Working right now? 66 00:06:24,051 --> 00:06:27,119 - Right now, this i don't know, I don't count. 67 00:06:27,121 --> 00:06:31,857 From our hardcore, it's i think around maybe 200, 68 00:06:31,859 --> 00:06:35,861 150, but it's always changing because 69 00:06:35,863 --> 00:06:39,531 some of them get pregnant, some of them get married, 70 00:06:39,533 --> 00:06:43,502 some of them just don't want to work in porn anymore. 71 00:06:43,504 --> 00:06:45,804 So we have, the girls are always changing, 72 00:06:45,806 --> 00:06:48,573 but we keep it up like I think. 73 00:06:50,443 --> 00:06:53,845 - So you started eight years ago. 74 00:06:53,847 --> 00:06:55,680 The tubes arrived, meanwhile. 75 00:06:56,617 --> 00:06:58,016 - It was sweet, sweet beginning. 76 00:06:58,018 --> 00:07:00,619 It was super nice business, everything was, 77 00:07:00,621 --> 00:07:03,922 everyone was cool, and the rates was higher, 78 00:07:03,924 --> 00:07:06,491 the business was, and all the girls was pretty 79 00:07:06,493 --> 00:07:08,827 because the rates was a bit higher. 80 00:07:08,829 --> 00:07:12,130 And then one moment, everything started falling down, 81 00:07:12,132 --> 00:07:15,600 crashing, productions began closing, after crisis. 82 00:07:15,602 --> 00:07:19,104 I think that half of the big productions were closed, 83 00:07:19,106 --> 00:07:20,939 the Americans stopped to come. 84 00:07:20,941 --> 00:07:23,809 - And the practices, did they change as well? 85 00:07:23,811 --> 00:07:26,211 - Oh yeah. - It's become more rough. 86 00:07:26,213 --> 00:07:29,815 It's become more, let's say, generally, 87 00:07:31,217 --> 00:07:32,150 humanity 88 00:07:34,053 --> 00:07:38,990 changes, so it has become more pervert, more dirty mind. 89 00:07:38,992 --> 00:07:41,960 - Do you think it's because of the tubes? 90 00:07:41,962 --> 00:07:46,164 - Yeah, because the porn become more accessible. 91 00:07:47,900 --> 00:07:52,204 Anyone now can open Internet and find anything they want, 92 00:07:52,206 --> 00:07:54,039 and when they watch this, they say, 93 00:07:54,041 --> 00:07:55,140 "okay, what's the next level? 94 00:07:55,142 --> 00:07:56,608 "What's the next step?" 95 00:07:56,610 --> 00:07:58,844 They always curious about, 96 00:07:58,846 --> 00:08:00,812 go deeper and deeper and deeper. 97 00:08:00,814 --> 00:08:02,214 People become crazy. 98 00:08:02,216 --> 00:08:05,150 Much crazier than before. 99 00:08:52,298 --> 00:08:57,068 - So today, very easy, it's only pussy sex today. 100 00:08:57,070 --> 00:08:59,137 We don't want to push too much, she is completely new, 101 00:08:59,139 --> 00:09:02,173 it's her second time she is with a boy out of me 102 00:09:02,175 --> 00:09:05,710 for the casting, but afterwards David, and now it's you. 103 00:09:05,712 --> 00:09:08,146 She is a super adorable person, she enjoys so much, 104 00:09:08,148 --> 00:09:09,714 she likes to be slapped on the ass. 105 00:09:09,716 --> 00:09:12,817 So do not hesitate to be very active, 106 00:09:12,819 --> 00:09:14,553 but not too much aggressive. 107 00:09:14,555 --> 00:09:15,320 And, 108 00:09:16,756 --> 00:09:18,757 do whatever you want in term of position, 109 00:09:18,759 --> 00:09:21,593 she enjoy very much, she do fantastic, fantastic, 110 00:09:21,595 --> 00:09:23,628 you will see, she is great. 111 00:09:23,630 --> 00:09:25,030 So I think you will have fun with her. 112 00:09:30,670 --> 00:09:33,805 Kisses, you put the hand under the dress, 113 00:09:33,807 --> 00:09:35,674 and you tickle the panties, okay? 114 00:09:35,676 --> 00:09:37,776 And we will begin with that. 115 00:09:37,778 --> 00:09:38,777 All right? 116 00:09:38,779 --> 00:09:39,744 Action. 117 00:12:27,147 --> 00:12:30,215 - The difference with previous generations 118 00:12:30,217 --> 00:12:34,152 is that today's actresses have grown up with porn. 119 00:12:34,154 --> 00:12:37,288 They've been subjected to and accepted practices 120 00:12:37,290 --> 00:12:40,225 that most producers would never before have dared 121 00:12:40,227 --> 00:12:41,826 to even propose. 122 00:12:43,028 --> 00:12:45,029 - We are having a model house here, 123 00:12:45,031 --> 00:12:49,434 in the city center, that is close to all locations. 124 00:12:49,436 --> 00:12:51,970 There is six sleeping places, 125 00:12:51,972 --> 00:12:53,838 and girl living all together and 126 00:12:53,840 --> 00:12:55,340 they are not like, really alone here, 127 00:12:55,342 --> 00:12:58,843 they can get everything they want and we are 24 hours online 128 00:12:58,845 --> 00:13:02,447 to help them with anything they need. 129 00:13:02,449 --> 00:13:04,149 - History of porn, they just need to 130 00:13:04,151 --> 00:13:05,150 watch all of these movies. 131 00:13:09,122 --> 00:13:11,356 Actually, it is including history for the last 132 00:13:11,358 --> 00:13:13,024 15 years of porn. 133 00:13:13,026 --> 00:13:16,828 It's Americans, Europeans, all nationalities, 134 00:13:16,830 --> 00:13:18,496 all type of porn. 135 00:13:18,498 --> 00:13:21,432 It's Rocco ravishes Prague 4. 136 00:13:21,434 --> 00:13:24,269 I think now it's 27 already or 137 00:13:24,271 --> 00:13:25,837 34 or something. 138 00:13:36,883 --> 00:13:40,218 - If the girls want to see, they have DVD. 139 00:13:40,220 --> 00:13:41,920 And time to watch. 140 00:14:12,518 --> 00:14:15,620 - Niki, she worked in this industry just for 141 00:14:15,622 --> 00:14:20,158 I don't know, for one month, maybe, a little bit less. 142 00:14:21,026 --> 00:14:25,063 And she arrived and most of the things in sex, 143 00:14:25,065 --> 00:14:26,631 she tried on the shootings, 144 00:14:26,633 --> 00:14:29,467 even such a simple thing like a cowgirl position, 145 00:14:29,469 --> 00:14:32,270 she had never tried it in her real life. 146 00:14:32,272 --> 00:14:35,173 Of course, first anal, she tried it on the set. 147 00:14:35,175 --> 00:14:38,576 First double penetration, she tried it on the set. 148 00:14:38,578 --> 00:14:40,378 - And she's been here only one month? 149 00:14:40,380 --> 00:14:41,446 - Yeah. 150 00:14:41,448 --> 00:14:44,415 - It happens often that some girls-- 151 00:14:44,417 --> 00:14:45,383 - try new things? 152 00:14:45,385 --> 00:14:47,118 - Try new things on the set? 153 00:14:47,120 --> 00:14:48,453 - Yeah. 154 00:14:48,455 --> 00:14:51,022 Not such simple things like a blow job for example, 155 00:14:51,024 --> 00:14:52,924 or some positions. 156 00:14:52,926 --> 00:14:54,392 Of course on special positions, 157 00:14:54,394 --> 00:14:57,595 we shoot in the porn movies like upside down or something. 158 00:14:59,132 --> 00:15:01,599 Normally we don't do in real life, they try here. 159 00:15:01,601 --> 00:15:03,935 But anal, pretty often it happens 160 00:15:03,937 --> 00:15:06,437 first time on the shootings. 161 00:16:17,276 --> 00:16:18,242 - Breakfast. 162 00:16:23,115 --> 00:16:26,451 - Only sweets for breakfast? 163 00:16:26,453 --> 00:16:29,153 - Because sweets give energy. 164 00:16:35,127 --> 00:16:36,294 Nothing food. 165 00:16:38,364 --> 00:16:39,597 Water and sweets. 166 00:16:39,599 --> 00:16:41,432 - Why? 167 00:16:41,434 --> 00:16:42,367 - Because 168 00:16:43,669 --> 00:16:44,635 anal sex, 169 00:16:46,138 --> 00:16:47,071 it's 170 00:16:48,674 --> 00:16:50,341 food 171 00:16:51,444 --> 00:16:55,113 and whoa, it's no good, no good. 172 00:16:55,115 --> 00:16:56,280 But I'm wash. 173 00:16:58,017 --> 00:16:59,117 It's normal. 174 00:17:44,630 --> 00:17:45,663 - Okay. 175 00:17:54,706 --> 00:17:59,277 - So you can, you can get white with this and this, 176 00:18:00,579 --> 00:18:01,512 and 177 00:18:02,781 --> 00:18:06,217 what about the shoes, it's here? 178 00:18:06,219 --> 00:18:07,418 Okay, perfect. 179 00:18:07,420 --> 00:18:08,286 Perfect. 180 00:18:08,288 --> 00:18:09,287 Okay. 181 00:19:12,918 --> 00:19:15,853 - Would you prefer, two cocks, or three cocks? 182 00:19:16,756 --> 00:19:17,889 - Five. 183 00:19:20,393 --> 00:19:21,359 - Shit... 184 00:19:22,728 --> 00:19:23,761 What about you? 185 00:19:23,763 --> 00:19:25,196 - No, I have-- 186 00:19:25,198 --> 00:19:26,364 - what, guys? 187 00:19:27,232 --> 00:19:29,567 What 188 00:19:29,569 --> 00:19:31,602 - you prefer one cock, two cocks? 189 00:19:31,604 --> 00:19:33,171 You like five? 190 00:19:33,173 --> 00:19:35,840 - I have three holes, so three-- 191 00:19:35,842 --> 00:19:36,874 - in one... 192 00:19:38,310 --> 00:19:42,413 - My pussy, my ass and my mouth, so it's-- 193 00:19:42,415 --> 00:19:43,314 - it's perfect. 194 00:19:43,316 --> 00:19:44,315 - Perfect! 195 00:19:47,253 --> 00:19:48,719 Hmm? - In my ass? 196 00:19:48,721 --> 00:19:50,555 - Yeah, she's had like a lot of cocks in her ass. 197 00:19:50,557 --> 00:19:51,489 - Four. 198 00:19:51,491 --> 00:19:53,491 - Four cocks at the same time. 199 00:19:53,493 --> 00:19:54,625 - Four in your ass? 200 00:19:54,627 --> 00:19:55,560 - Yes. 201 00:19:55,562 --> 00:19:56,861 - Yeah. 202 00:19:56,863 --> 00:19:59,430 It's enough, plus it's in your ass? 203 00:19:59,432 --> 00:20:01,966 - Really? - Show me your ass! 204 00:20:01,968 --> 00:20:04,335 Show me your ass! 205 00:20:04,337 --> 00:20:06,804 Because I have never have two in my ass. 206 00:20:06,806 --> 00:20:11,309 - But it's three cock. 207 00:20:12,477 --> 00:20:14,545 It's not, it's-- - okay. 208 00:20:15,547 --> 00:20:17,515 - It's not... 209 00:20:18,884 --> 00:20:21,419 - Five cocks, six cocks? 210 00:20:21,421 --> 00:20:23,888 I wonder what the next challenge will be. 211 00:20:23,890 --> 00:20:25,523 A hemorrhage? 212 00:20:25,525 --> 00:20:26,724 Death, maybe? 213 00:20:28,460 --> 00:20:31,229 The worst part is that the actresses' names 214 00:20:31,231 --> 00:20:34,265 hardly ever appear on these sites. 215 00:20:35,367 --> 00:20:37,935 They are reduced to a series of categories. 216 00:20:37,937 --> 00:20:40,304 They're like a Cannon fodder. 217 00:20:40,306 --> 00:20:42,673 One gaping hole amongst many. 218 00:20:45,678 --> 00:20:47,812 How can you empathize with these girls, 219 00:20:47,814 --> 00:20:50,648 if after all, they don't really exist? 220 00:21:12,971 --> 00:21:16,907 I haven't been in the Berlin fair for 15 years. 221 00:21:16,909 --> 00:21:20,378 Here too, things have really changed. 222 00:21:20,380 --> 00:21:24,315 It used to be the biggest event of its kind in Europe. 223 00:21:24,317 --> 00:21:27,551 Back then, adult film stars were worshiped, 224 00:21:27,553 --> 00:21:31,589 and producers would sign contracts non-stop. 225 00:21:31,591 --> 00:21:35,793 But today, at each stand, the gloom is palpable. 226 00:24:52,057 --> 00:24:55,593 - So how did it come to this? 227 00:24:56,862 --> 00:24:59,797 And if everything is available for free, 228 00:24:59,799 --> 00:25:01,932 who is making any money? 229 00:27:21,373 --> 00:27:25,943 - We launched youporn 26th of August, 2006. 230 00:27:27,646 --> 00:27:31,682 So we took it from very, very small traffic to 231 00:27:33,251 --> 00:27:36,887 the 26th busiest website in the world. 232 00:27:36,889 --> 00:27:41,358 - Did you imagine that it was going to become so, 233 00:27:41,360 --> 00:27:42,426 so huge? 234 00:27:42,428 --> 00:27:44,328 - Yes. 235 00:27:44,330 --> 00:27:49,199 We had round about 370 million visitors a month, 236 00:27:49,201 --> 00:27:51,669 used to come into youporn. 237 00:27:54,339 --> 00:27:57,808 - How did you get this idea of youporn? 238 00:27:57,810 --> 00:28:00,077 - Right, the very first, 239 00:28:00,079 --> 00:28:04,314 the first few weeks, it was a joke and then 240 00:28:04,316 --> 00:28:07,951 we kind of realized what we had on our hands. 241 00:28:07,953 --> 00:28:09,887 At that point, we realized the damage 242 00:28:09,889 --> 00:28:12,423 it was gonna inflict on the industry. 243 00:28:12,425 --> 00:28:14,324 So we made a decision 244 00:28:16,261 --> 00:28:19,163 to help content partners. 245 00:28:19,165 --> 00:28:20,864 Now, we were evil. 246 00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:24,401 We were reaching out to content partners, saying, 247 00:28:24,403 --> 00:28:26,804 "hey, we're from youporn, 248 00:28:26,806 --> 00:28:29,940 "we want you to license us your content. 249 00:28:29,942 --> 00:28:33,110 "We want to help you, we want to send our members, 250 00:28:33,112 --> 00:28:35,446 "our users, to your websites, 251 00:28:35,448 --> 00:28:38,816 "for you to convert them into memberships." 252 00:28:38,818 --> 00:28:41,051 And the general consensus from 253 00:28:41,053 --> 00:28:44,021 the whole of the industry was, "you've got to be kidding. 254 00:28:44,023 --> 00:28:48,792 "Why would someone that is viewing content for free 255 00:28:48,794 --> 00:28:51,261 "want to pay a membership?" 256 00:28:51,263 --> 00:28:55,999 But tube sites have been there for eight years. 257 00:28:56,001 --> 00:29:00,804 So, if you're an old school content producer, 258 00:29:00,806 --> 00:29:05,342 you would have already adapted to using the tube sites. 259 00:29:05,344 --> 00:29:07,478 Those that refuse to adapt, 260 00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:09,947 they're simply no longer in business. 261 00:29:19,924 --> 00:29:21,325 - J-t's right. 262 00:29:21,327 --> 00:29:24,261 All the people I knew have disappeared. 263 00:29:24,263 --> 00:29:27,231 If it was only j-t that had come along, 264 00:29:27,233 --> 00:29:30,134 then perhaps they might have survived. 265 00:29:30,136 --> 00:29:32,236 But the worst was yet to come. 266 00:30:14,312 --> 00:30:18,081 With manwin, Fabian thylmann built the first multinational 267 00:30:18,083 --> 00:30:19,516 empire of sex. 268 00:30:19,518 --> 00:30:23,253 The majority of the world's porn videos are now hosted 269 00:30:23,255 --> 00:30:25,255 on websites that he owns. 270 00:30:33,097 --> 00:30:35,899 The only people interested in this unknown man 271 00:30:35,901 --> 00:30:38,235 are German journalists. 272 00:30:39,872 --> 00:30:42,005 They were the first to reveal the obscure nature 273 00:30:42,007 --> 00:30:43,173 of the company. 274 00:30:46,412 --> 00:30:47,311 Who is thylmann? 275 00:30:47,313 --> 00:30:49,112 What kind of guy is he? 276 00:30:49,114 --> 00:30:53,917 - He is certainly what you would call a geek. 277 00:30:53,919 --> 00:30:57,020 More of the technician kind of guy. 278 00:30:58,623 --> 00:31:01,925 Sort of the person that has never been at a porn shoot, 279 00:31:01,927 --> 00:31:05,262 and in a way, he was probably at that moment 280 00:31:05,264 --> 00:31:08,498 the right person for the distribution of porn 281 00:31:08,500 --> 00:31:10,367 in the 21st century. 282 00:31:14,906 --> 00:31:17,174 - Can you show me how, 283 00:31:17,176 --> 00:31:19,009 when it all started? 284 00:31:20,945 --> 00:31:24,248 - Yeah, well I mean, this is how it all started for us. 285 00:31:24,250 --> 00:31:26,984 So that's the front page of the paper 286 00:31:26,986 --> 00:31:30,287 that was published in September 2012, 287 00:31:30,289 --> 00:31:32,055 and it's basically 288 00:31:33,157 --> 00:31:36,393 the result of a long time of work 289 00:31:36,395 --> 00:31:39,329 because we started in January with our investigation. 290 00:31:39,331 --> 00:31:43,667 So it took us nine months in a way to get this thing done. 291 00:31:45,136 --> 00:31:47,004 All description, how it worked, 292 00:31:47,006 --> 00:31:49,273 when he bought what, everything. 293 00:31:49,275 --> 00:31:53,076 You've got also some documents that we could show 294 00:31:53,078 --> 00:31:57,281 that led us to quite a lot of questions. 295 00:31:57,283 --> 00:31:59,216 - Fabian, tell us about yourself, 296 00:31:59,218 --> 00:32:02,286 where you're from, how did you get on the Internet and, 297 00:32:02,288 --> 00:32:03,253 we want to know it all. 298 00:32:03,255 --> 00:32:04,554 - So, Fabian. 299 00:32:04,556 --> 00:32:09,293 I started online in '99, roughly, as a programmer. 300 00:32:09,295 --> 00:32:10,227 And I, 301 00:32:11,696 --> 00:32:14,464 I was very interested in high speed, high traffic websites, 302 00:32:14,466 --> 00:32:16,199 so complicated programming. 303 00:32:16,201 --> 00:32:18,201 So it's the stuff you would find 304 00:32:18,203 --> 00:32:21,939 at that time was porn, with a lot of traffic. 305 00:32:21,941 --> 00:32:26,343 So I started buying a couple of companies in Europe first. 306 00:32:26,345 --> 00:32:28,111 But the biggest coup really i did was 307 00:32:28,113 --> 00:32:30,047 buying a company in Canada, 308 00:32:30,049 --> 00:32:31,715 which was back then already one of the big players 309 00:32:31,717 --> 00:32:33,417 in the market. 310 00:32:33,419 --> 00:32:35,519 - Can we name, is compliancy, 311 00:32:35,521 --> 00:32:37,387 can we name of one of those sites? 312 00:32:37,389 --> 00:32:39,389 - This biggest one is pornhub.Com. 313 00:32:39,391 --> 00:32:40,657 - Pornhub, okay. - Yes. 314 00:32:40,659 --> 00:32:42,192 The second one which is bigger but more known-- 315 00:32:42,194 --> 00:32:43,427 - how many users does pornhub-- 316 00:32:43,429 --> 00:32:45,162 - 16 million a day. 317 00:32:45,164 --> 00:32:47,097 - 16 million daily active users? 318 00:32:47,099 --> 00:32:48,231 - Yes, active users, yes. 319 00:32:48,233 --> 00:32:49,566 About-- - very active. 320 00:32:49,568 --> 00:32:51,335 - Yes, very active. 321 00:32:52,438 --> 00:32:53,737 - Anyway, that's why we invited Fabian, 322 00:32:53,739 --> 00:32:56,974 so it's not only about the materials. 323 00:32:56,976 --> 00:32:58,075 - How old is he? 324 00:32:58,077 --> 00:33:00,277 - 36, 37 I think. 325 00:33:01,245 --> 00:33:03,080 - So he was quite young when he 326 00:33:03,082 --> 00:33:04,514 became the king of porn. 327 00:33:04,516 --> 00:33:08,118 - Well, I mean, that's sort of how our story started. 328 00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:10,020 Because we saw this, 329 00:33:11,556 --> 00:33:16,660 this video from this big porn conference in las Vegas. 330 00:33:16,662 --> 00:33:20,330 And it's a four part video, it's on YouTube, 331 00:33:20,332 --> 00:33:23,200 and there is suddenly coming this young German guy 332 00:33:23,202 --> 00:33:27,437 on the center stage, sitting down in his sweater and 333 00:33:27,439 --> 00:33:29,706 he was looking like a sort of 334 00:33:29,708 --> 00:33:32,342 cheap version of mark zuckerburg or something, yeah? 335 00:33:32,344 --> 00:33:33,710 And he sits down there 336 00:33:33,712 --> 00:33:37,080 in front of the American porn industry 337 00:33:37,082 --> 00:33:41,118 and he tells them his vision and how he's doing things. 338 00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:43,653 And it's like a nobody appearing, yeah? 339 00:33:43,655 --> 00:33:46,289 And for us, it was like, "wait a minute, who is this? 340 00:33:46,291 --> 00:33:49,793 "And why the hell are all the others listening to him? 341 00:33:49,795 --> 00:33:52,662 "What does he have to say?" 342 00:33:52,664 --> 00:33:57,567 - We had roughly 65 million people on our websites each day. 343 00:33:57,569 --> 00:33:59,102 Different ones. 344 00:33:59,104 --> 00:34:02,272 About 450 million people a month, different ones. 345 00:34:02,274 --> 00:34:04,207 - 450 million a month? 346 00:34:04,209 --> 00:34:06,643 I'm not sure if I'm mixing up numbers as usual, 347 00:34:06,645 --> 00:34:09,679 but that sounds like half the size of Facebook 348 00:34:09,681 --> 00:34:12,349 some time ago, right? 349 00:34:12,351 --> 00:34:16,720 - So, turnover a month was roughly $40 million, us. 350 00:34:17,755 --> 00:34:19,790 - A month? - A month. 351 00:34:19,792 --> 00:34:21,725 Yeah, I always think in months, I don't know why, 352 00:34:21,727 --> 00:34:25,195 everybody else does it in years, I don't know. 353 00:34:25,197 --> 00:34:26,096 And... 354 00:34:27,231 --> 00:34:29,132 - You grew so fast. - Yes, that's probably, 355 00:34:29,134 --> 00:34:31,201 it just kept changing so-- 356 00:34:31,203 --> 00:34:34,404 - well, the first thing that a reporter does is 357 00:34:34,406 --> 00:34:35,605 go into the archives, 358 00:34:35,607 --> 00:34:38,108 looking whatever has been published before. 359 00:34:38,110 --> 00:34:39,810 So we had a list with webpages, 360 00:34:39,812 --> 00:34:42,579 we had a list with company names, 361 00:34:42,581 --> 00:34:45,115 and then we started to pull for every company 362 00:34:45,117 --> 00:34:47,818 the record from the trade register. 363 00:34:47,820 --> 00:34:52,589 In the end, we had a network of about 35 or more companies 364 00:34:52,591 --> 00:34:55,392 that belonged to this empire of manwin 365 00:34:55,394 --> 00:34:57,561 that Mr. thylmann was running. 366 00:35:18,516 --> 00:35:20,150 We started to ask ourselves, 367 00:35:20,152 --> 00:35:23,787 why do you need companies in Cyprus, for example? 368 00:35:23,789 --> 00:35:25,489 Then the headquarter, 369 00:35:25,491 --> 00:35:27,457 the headquarter was in Luxembourg. 370 00:35:27,459 --> 00:35:30,360 So we asked ourselves, why is the headquarter in Luxembourg? 371 00:35:30,362 --> 00:35:34,764 And we went to Luxembourg and when we arrived there, 372 00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:39,269 I have actually photos that i can show if you like. 373 00:35:39,271 --> 00:35:41,872 Then, it's a building out of concrete and glass. 374 00:35:41,874 --> 00:35:45,242 We could look basically through the door in the office, 375 00:35:45,244 --> 00:35:46,877 and the office was entirely empty. 376 00:35:46,879 --> 00:35:50,480 There were a few pieces of furniture standing around-- 377 00:35:50,482 --> 00:35:52,315 - so this is the headquarter 378 00:35:52,317 --> 00:35:53,850 of the biggest porn company in the world? 379 00:35:53,852 --> 00:35:56,686 - This was, in 2012, the headquarter of 380 00:35:56,688 --> 00:35:59,422 the biggest porn company in the world. 381 00:35:59,424 --> 00:36:02,459 But the point is, in that building, we asked the neighbors 382 00:36:02,461 --> 00:36:06,163 and on the lower floor, there is a Chinese bank. 383 00:36:06,165 --> 00:36:07,497 And we asked the lady there and we said, 384 00:36:07,499 --> 00:36:10,233 "what is going on the fourth floor, where's manwin?" 385 00:36:10,235 --> 00:36:11,835 And she said in this funny Chinese voice, 386 00:36:11,837 --> 00:36:14,171 "oh, there's nobody there. 387 00:36:14,173 --> 00:36:15,939 "Oh, there's nobody there." 388 00:36:15,941 --> 00:36:18,308 And it was weird, yeah? 389 00:36:18,310 --> 00:36:20,210 And those were all things where we said, 390 00:36:20,212 --> 00:36:22,512 "okay, it doesn't make sense, 391 00:36:22,514 --> 00:36:23,847 "it doesn't prove anything, 392 00:36:23,849 --> 00:36:27,450 "it doesn't show, okay, this must be tax evasion." 393 00:36:27,452 --> 00:36:31,655 For us, in the end, obviously as a German newspaper, 394 00:36:31,657 --> 00:36:34,224 we follow the German angle. 395 00:36:35,526 --> 00:36:38,361 There was one company in Hamburg, 396 00:36:38,363 --> 00:36:42,699 the manwin Germany company, that was very interesting to us. 397 00:36:43,868 --> 00:36:47,504 Because they run this website, my dirty hobby. 398 00:36:47,506 --> 00:36:51,408 The company said actually on their webpage here, 399 00:36:51,410 --> 00:36:53,610 "we are run from Cyprus." 400 00:36:54,579 --> 00:36:56,947 And even though we knew that the performers were 401 00:36:56,949 --> 00:37:00,617 living in Germany and were shooting their movies in Germany, 402 00:37:00,619 --> 00:37:04,588 the tax that was deducted was the cypiotic vat. 403 00:37:04,590 --> 00:37:07,557 It's really hard to judge if everything is going 404 00:37:07,559 --> 00:37:09,559 in a legal way there from the outside, 405 00:37:09,561 --> 00:37:12,996 but at that point, we had a lot of reasonable doubt. 406 00:37:17,301 --> 00:37:19,703 - I've heard of my dirty hobby. 407 00:37:19,705 --> 00:37:24,541 It's one of Germany's largest amateur porn sites. 408 00:37:24,543 --> 00:37:26,776 But what I didn't know is that it was one of 409 00:37:26,778 --> 00:37:29,579 Fabian thylmann's first businesses, 410 00:37:29,581 --> 00:37:32,916 and a cornerstone of his manwin empire. 411 00:39:24,762 --> 00:39:26,696 - Let's see. 412 00:39:27,565 --> 00:39:29,065 There, it's you. 413 00:39:29,067 --> 00:39:30,934 Naughty over forty. 414 00:39:33,604 --> 00:39:35,905 - I'm a German milf. 415 00:39:35,907 --> 00:39:38,041 - Do you have an idea of how many fans you have? 416 00:39:38,043 --> 00:39:41,611 - For my dirty hobby, over 15,000 fans. 417 00:39:43,147 --> 00:39:46,683 It's a very great fan base on my dirty hobby. 418 00:39:46,685 --> 00:39:48,418 - How many videos have you done? 419 00:39:48,420 --> 00:39:49,652 - 500. 420 00:39:49,654 --> 00:39:51,087 - 500? - Yes. 421 00:39:51,089 --> 00:39:54,023 - When you do a video, you have to upload it yourself? 422 00:39:54,025 --> 00:39:55,725 - Mmhmm. 423 00:39:55,727 --> 00:39:58,595 - When we start with the film, i give it to my dirty hobby. 424 00:39:58,597 --> 00:40:00,897 - Okay. - I can give the go, 425 00:40:02,433 --> 00:40:03,767 and then it's go online. 426 00:40:03,769 --> 00:40:05,068 - But they control it. 427 00:40:05,070 --> 00:40:07,470 - They control it, yes, really. 428 00:40:07,472 --> 00:40:11,775 But the marketing for these clips, it's our. 429 00:40:11,777 --> 00:40:15,111 - Is it inconvenient to ask you how many percent 430 00:40:15,113 --> 00:40:16,913 they take from your, 431 00:40:18,449 --> 00:40:19,883 from your income? 432 00:40:20,818 --> 00:40:22,452 - 78-- - 78%. 433 00:40:23,654 --> 00:40:24,988 - 78? 434 00:40:24,990 --> 00:40:26,489 - And-- - we get 435 00:40:28,159 --> 00:40:29,125 22%. 436 00:40:30,161 --> 00:40:31,194 - 22%. 437 00:40:32,763 --> 00:40:36,933 And then we must pay tax and other things from this 22%. 438 00:40:36,935 --> 00:40:38,201 It's not much. 439 00:40:39,603 --> 00:40:43,540 In my next life, I'm owner of a good website. 440 00:40:45,143 --> 00:40:46,109 Yeah. 441 00:41:13,037 --> 00:41:16,072 - Fabian thylmann may have had his first successes 442 00:41:16,074 --> 00:41:21,044 in Germany, but he made his fortune in the American market. 443 00:41:21,046 --> 00:41:24,047 And it's also there that he extended his monopoly 444 00:41:24,049 --> 00:41:26,249 over the entire industry. 445 00:41:32,490 --> 00:41:35,692 - I was under contract with a studio called 446 00:41:35,694 --> 00:41:38,194 digital playground from 447 00:41:38,196 --> 00:41:39,496 late 2007 to 448 00:41:41,532 --> 00:41:43,132 the middle of 2013. 449 00:41:44,134 --> 00:41:46,669 And then digital playground was purchased 450 00:41:46,671 --> 00:41:50,006 by a larger company called manwin, 451 00:41:50,008 --> 00:41:52,575 and they have a monopoly on 452 00:41:53,511 --> 00:41:56,212 the production studios in America. 453 00:41:56,214 --> 00:42:00,149 One of the first things that i noticed with the new owners 454 00:42:00,151 --> 00:42:04,988 was this complete lack of respect for the crew. 455 00:42:04,990 --> 00:42:09,125 And they put in extremely long hours sometimes, 456 00:42:09,127 --> 00:42:12,262 like especially in a large feature, 20 hour days. 457 00:42:13,565 --> 00:42:17,233 I was there at 6:00 am, shoot all day, 458 00:42:17,235 --> 00:42:21,538 leave set at two o'clock in the morning, 459 00:42:21,540 --> 00:42:25,174 go home, sleep for a couple hours, come back the next day. 460 00:42:25,176 --> 00:42:28,177 It was a capitalism machine to 461 00:42:28,179 --> 00:42:30,947 the detriment of any other concerns. 462 00:42:30,949 --> 00:42:33,750 You don't take care of your people. 463 00:42:33,752 --> 00:42:37,086 Which then, sure enough, they've repeated 464 00:42:37,088 --> 00:42:40,323 massive firings of the workers, 465 00:42:40,325 --> 00:42:42,058 and that's just it. 466 00:42:43,060 --> 00:42:44,027 Capitalism. 467 00:42:44,029 --> 00:42:44,961 Yay. 468 00:42:46,697 --> 00:42:47,997 - Have you ever met the board, 469 00:42:47,999 --> 00:42:51,100 someone like Fabian thylmann? 470 00:42:51,102 --> 00:42:53,102 Have you ever met him? 471 00:42:54,572 --> 00:42:55,672 - I met him. 472 00:42:56,340 --> 00:42:58,942 I don't necessarily believe 473 00:43:00,010 --> 00:43:03,346 that he ever owned the company, really. 474 00:43:06,650 --> 00:43:09,018 They're just fishy, all right? 475 00:43:09,020 --> 00:43:12,188 They're just a fishy, weird company. 476 00:43:13,791 --> 00:43:17,293 My fleshlight royalties, when the wire transfers come in, 477 00:43:17,295 --> 00:43:20,697 go through banks in places like South Africa, 478 00:43:20,699 --> 00:43:23,066 they have offices in Ireland. 479 00:43:23,068 --> 00:43:24,300 It's a bunch of, 480 00:43:24,302 --> 00:43:28,037 it's a bunch of men with Greek last names 481 00:43:28,039 --> 00:43:31,641 and thick Greek accents claiming to be quebecois. 482 00:43:31,643 --> 00:43:34,611 I just don't believe anything they say, 483 00:43:34,613 --> 00:43:37,780 having worked for them, because nothing makes sense. 484 00:43:48,759 --> 00:43:51,928 - I was investigating a load of online black markets, 485 00:43:51,930 --> 00:43:55,298 digital activism, anonymous, that kind of culture, 486 00:43:55,300 --> 00:43:57,834 that was mostly what I was writing about. 487 00:43:57,836 --> 00:43:59,702 And there were rumors, and actually, 488 00:43:59,704 --> 00:44:02,171 one company did, for all intents and purposes, 489 00:44:02,173 --> 00:44:05,274 own a complete monopoly on porn distribution online 490 00:44:05,276 --> 00:44:06,909 and no one really know about it. 491 00:44:06,911 --> 00:44:08,978 They have hundreds of tube sites. 492 00:44:08,980 --> 00:44:11,047 But pornhub was always their main one. 493 00:44:11,049 --> 00:44:13,650 I think it's the one they focused primarily on 494 00:44:13,652 --> 00:44:16,085 attracting to a female audience more, 495 00:44:16,087 --> 00:44:19,922 so they took a lot more of the aggressive, extreme, 496 00:44:19,924 --> 00:44:21,391 horrifying fetishes out of it 497 00:44:21,393 --> 00:44:23,026 and left in all the other ones. 498 00:44:23,028 --> 00:44:27,096 But also using pornhub as an advertising campaign online, 499 00:44:27,098 --> 00:44:31,267 billboards, Times Square, everywhere, just kind of 500 00:44:31,269 --> 00:44:33,169 recognizing that it's already popular, 501 00:44:33,171 --> 00:44:35,705 but for anyone out there who may not use pornhub 502 00:44:35,707 --> 00:44:37,840 or know of pornhub as their main go-to, 503 00:44:37,842 --> 00:44:40,109 just show that it's a legitimate business, 504 00:44:40,111 --> 00:44:42,178 because of course, if you can advertise in public, 505 00:44:42,180 --> 00:44:43,780 you must be legitimate. 506 00:44:43,782 --> 00:44:46,115 The natural conclusion, why would anyone think that 507 00:44:46,117 --> 00:44:50,687 an evil company could put a billboard anywhere in New York? 508 00:44:53,123 --> 00:44:55,291 All you need is hand 509 00:44:55,293 --> 00:44:56,926 ba ba da da da 510 00:44:56,928 --> 00:44:59,128 all you need is hand 511 00:44:59,130 --> 00:45:00,897 ba ba da da da 512 00:45:00,899 --> 00:45:04,300 all you need is hand, hand 513 00:45:04,302 --> 00:45:05,935 hand is all you need 514 00:45:05,937 --> 00:45:08,237 - one more time and go! 515 00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:10,707 All you need is hand 516 00:45:10,709 --> 00:45:12,208 ba ba da da da 517 00:45:12,210 --> 00:45:14,477 all you need is hand 518 00:45:14,479 --> 00:45:16,112 ba ba da da da 519 00:45:16,114 --> 00:45:20,116 all you need is hand, hand 520 00:45:20,118 --> 00:45:23,486 hand is all you need 521 00:45:30,194 --> 00:45:31,861 - the bigger they become, 522 00:45:31,863 --> 00:45:34,731 the more they can get away with. 523 00:45:34,733 --> 00:45:38,801 This is how our suffering became part of pop culture, 524 00:45:38,803 --> 00:45:43,072 with a little bit of cynicism, and a lot of lube. 525 00:45:43,074 --> 00:45:48,177 Worst of all, everyone is lapping it up, or seems to be. 526 00:45:48,179 --> 00:45:50,947 It seems that asking too many questions 527 00:45:50,949 --> 00:45:52,815 would kill the excitement of it all. 528 00:45:55,520 --> 00:45:56,819 - Why would anyone pay 529 00:45:56,821 --> 00:45:59,088 if you gave them something for free? 530 00:45:59,090 --> 00:46:02,258 Why would people choose to do the moral thing? 531 00:46:02,260 --> 00:46:05,161 I don't think people in their nature 532 00:46:05,163 --> 00:46:06,996 are altruistic all the time, 533 00:46:06,998 --> 00:46:08,397 especially when it's something that has 534 00:46:08,399 --> 00:46:11,033 the connotation of shame and secrecy. 535 00:46:11,035 --> 00:46:13,770 And we're not really comfortable with our erotica 536 00:46:13,772 --> 00:46:16,172 and our pornography in general. 537 00:46:16,174 --> 00:46:18,374 It's easy, it's available. 538 00:46:28,118 --> 00:46:30,787 - A lot of people don't even realize 539 00:46:30,789 --> 00:46:33,022 the videos that they're watching on those sites 540 00:46:33,024 --> 00:46:35,458 are probably not there with the permission of 541 00:46:35,460 --> 00:46:38,995 the studio that produced it, or the performers or anything. 542 00:46:38,997 --> 00:46:41,197 People just kind of disregard it, like, 543 00:46:41,199 --> 00:46:44,433 "who cares if they're getting ripped off?" 544 00:46:44,435 --> 00:46:47,336 People just don't have much sympathy for 545 00:46:47,338 --> 00:46:49,839 porn performers or studios. 546 00:46:51,375 --> 00:46:54,477 You know, in the 80s, you had the meese commission 547 00:46:54,479 --> 00:46:58,281 and you had anti-porn people, like Andrea dworkin, 548 00:46:58,283 --> 00:47:02,819 who were determined to put an end to all pornography. 549 00:47:04,555 --> 00:47:09,025 And those people sought to really destroy 550 00:47:09,027 --> 00:47:11,160 the adult entertainment industry. 551 00:47:11,162 --> 00:47:14,330 And they were unsuccessful in doing that. 552 00:47:14,332 --> 00:47:17,133 But then you have a company that comes along, 553 00:47:17,135 --> 00:47:21,003 owning these tube sites, who's done more damage 554 00:47:21,005 --> 00:47:24,173 to the adult industry than any politician 555 00:47:24,175 --> 00:47:27,844 or anti-porn person could have ever dreamed of doing. 556 00:47:27,846 --> 00:47:31,214 And instead of circling the wagons and putting up 557 00:47:31,216 --> 00:47:35,585 a unified front against them, we've invited them in. 558 00:47:35,587 --> 00:47:39,589 So, just so many people, in my opinion, have just sold out. 559 00:47:39,591 --> 00:47:42,191 They said, "well, I'll just take the money." 560 00:47:42,193 --> 00:47:46,229 And ethics, money talks and ethics walks. 561 00:47:46,231 --> 00:47:50,533 And it's very disheartening to some extent. 562 00:50:01,098 --> 00:50:03,199 - Since the beginning of the crisis, 563 00:50:03,201 --> 00:50:06,435 the porn industry has been facing a sharp increase 564 00:50:06,437 --> 00:50:09,538 in sexually transmitted diseases. 565 00:50:09,540 --> 00:50:12,108 Because they fear losing out on work, 566 00:50:12,110 --> 00:50:16,345 some actors falsify their medical tests. 567 00:50:16,347 --> 00:50:20,683 In 2012, a syphilis epidemic affected the whole industry. 568 00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:25,688 Ironically, during that same year, 569 00:50:25,690 --> 00:50:30,026 manwin financed a large campaign against measure b, 570 00:50:30,028 --> 00:50:32,328 a law that would make the use of condoms 571 00:50:32,330 --> 00:50:34,697 during filming obligatory. 572 00:50:35,565 --> 00:50:37,233 - Hi, I'm Tara Patrick. 573 00:50:37,235 --> 00:50:39,168 - And I'm Ron Jeremy. 574 00:50:39,170 --> 00:50:42,071 - A mandatory condom law will not 575 00:50:42,073 --> 00:50:44,440 make our work place any safer. 576 00:50:44,442 --> 00:50:48,644 But it will drive our $20 billion dollar industry 577 00:50:48,646 --> 00:50:51,614 and 10,000 jobs out of la county. 578 00:50:53,116 --> 00:50:55,718 - Vote no on measure b. 579 00:50:55,720 --> 00:50:58,621 And keep the adult business in California. 580 00:52:13,897 --> 00:52:15,164 - Sorry, you need some drink, 581 00:52:15,166 --> 00:52:17,800 otherwise this will never work. 582 00:52:19,769 --> 00:52:24,306 Ladies and gentlemen, I am very honored to be here tonight. 583 00:52:25,308 --> 00:52:28,744 Obviously, we have to find a way to stop 584 00:52:30,814 --> 00:52:33,649 harmful acts against people in the industry, 585 00:52:33,651 --> 00:52:36,252 which goes for both women and men. 586 00:52:36,254 --> 00:52:39,622 For me, this was very important in many, many ways, 587 00:52:39,624 --> 00:52:43,359 because I knew the way I ran the business. 588 00:52:44,261 --> 00:52:46,529 I, in my opinion at least, 589 00:52:46,531 --> 00:52:49,431 protected everyone as much as i could. 590 00:52:49,433 --> 00:52:50,633 So I do prefer 591 00:52:51,902 --> 00:52:53,769 people coming to my websites than going to others, 592 00:52:53,771 --> 00:52:55,671 which are much more, 593 00:52:57,340 --> 00:53:02,411 more underground so to speak, and do not control so much. 594 00:53:02,413 --> 00:53:03,479 Thank you. 595 00:53:18,261 --> 00:53:21,197 - Success proved to be fleeting. 596 00:53:21,199 --> 00:53:23,232 Game over for the king of porn. 597 00:53:51,261 --> 00:53:55,598 At least with Fabian thylmann, we had a name and a face. 598 00:53:55,600 --> 00:53:57,933 But since manwin became mindgeek, 599 00:53:57,935 --> 00:54:00,769 the picture is far less clear. 600 00:54:08,812 --> 00:54:12,248 But who's behind this company? 601 00:54:12,250 --> 00:54:12,982 - It's not clear. 602 00:54:12,984 --> 00:54:15,317 I mean we know at the beginning, 603 00:54:15,319 --> 00:54:17,686 the original company was called mansef, 604 00:54:17,688 --> 00:54:22,324 and that was Stefan manos and yuissem youssef, 605 00:54:22,326 --> 00:54:24,360 which was the man and the sef. 606 00:54:24,362 --> 00:54:28,664 And those were allegedly the original founders. 607 00:54:28,666 --> 00:54:33,035 And then, after a while, they changed their name to manwin. 608 00:54:33,937 --> 00:54:36,939 And at that point, they would not say whether or not 609 00:54:36,941 --> 00:54:40,309 the original owners were still involved or not. 610 00:54:40,311 --> 00:54:42,311 They said, "well it's under new ownership", 611 00:54:42,313 --> 00:54:43,412 but they wouldn't say who it was. 612 00:54:43,414 --> 00:54:46,448 And that's when Fabian thylmann became 613 00:54:46,450 --> 00:54:47,916 the face of the company. 614 00:54:47,918 --> 00:54:49,385 And even then, people were like, 615 00:54:49,387 --> 00:54:51,553 "is he really the owner of the company 616 00:54:51,555 --> 00:54:53,989 "or is he just kind of the front man for it?" 617 00:54:53,991 --> 00:54:56,058 It was still very unclear. 618 00:54:56,060 --> 00:54:59,628 And then a few years ago, they rebranded their name again 619 00:54:59,630 --> 00:55:02,765 to mindgeek, and they still won't say whether or not 620 00:55:02,767 --> 00:55:04,867 the original owners are involved. 621 00:55:04,869 --> 00:55:07,469 With other adult studios, you pretty much know 622 00:55:07,471 --> 00:55:09,338 who owns the company. 623 00:55:09,340 --> 00:55:12,441 But with these guys, nobody really knows 624 00:55:12,443 --> 00:55:14,777 who's behind everything. 625 00:55:14,779 --> 00:55:17,479 It's very kind of mysterious. 626 00:55:21,318 --> 00:55:23,986 - On the paper, Mr. thylmann was the owner and ceo, 627 00:55:23,988 --> 00:55:25,688 he was running the show. 628 00:55:25,690 --> 00:55:29,625 Now, obviously, there are other dependencies. 629 00:55:29,627 --> 00:55:31,460 There are people that gave him the money, 630 00:55:31,462 --> 00:55:33,729 people that we don't know. 631 00:55:34,864 --> 00:55:38,400 Then also what is weird is Mr. thylmann 632 00:55:38,402 --> 00:55:39,802 was sitting in Brussels, 633 00:55:39,804 --> 00:55:43,005 but the main headquarters with the most employees 634 00:55:43,007 --> 00:55:46,608 and still the same thing today, 635 00:55:46,610 --> 00:55:50,446 mindgeek is actually residing in Montreal in Canada. 636 00:55:50,448 --> 00:55:53,782 Now from Brussels to Canada is quite a distance, yeah? 637 00:55:53,784 --> 00:55:57,986 So and, I'm very certain that other managers in Canada, 638 00:55:57,988 --> 00:56:01,390 the same that bought manwin and renamed it mindgeek 639 00:56:01,392 --> 00:56:04,793 that they were very influential also in the days back then. 640 00:56:04,795 --> 00:56:08,597 To me, it's like, of course, the Canadians 641 00:56:08,599 --> 00:56:11,100 manage the show in that moment, you know? 642 00:56:18,041 --> 00:56:20,476 During the course of our investigation, 643 00:56:20,478 --> 00:56:24,813 we pulled up some trade register records in Cyprus. 644 00:56:25,982 --> 00:56:29,017 And there was a remark on a charge. 645 00:56:29,019 --> 00:56:32,721 And that was giving the number of 646 00:56:32,723 --> 00:56:35,624 $362 million us dollars, 647 00:56:35,626 --> 00:56:38,927 I think was the number that they gave there, 648 00:56:38,929 --> 00:56:43,031 so I assume that this was sort of the amount that he got 649 00:56:43,033 --> 00:56:46,034 to buy companies, other companies. 650 00:56:46,036 --> 00:56:49,972 - And where does this money come from? 651 00:56:49,974 --> 00:56:50,973 - Well, it's tough to say. 652 00:56:50,975 --> 00:56:52,574 We tried to follow the money. 653 00:56:52,576 --> 00:56:54,410 In the end we found 654 00:56:55,712 --> 00:56:58,614 two guys that were former Goldman sachs bankers 655 00:56:58,616 --> 00:57:00,883 in New York, wall street, 656 00:57:00,885 --> 00:57:02,785 who are now working on their own ticket. 657 00:57:02,787 --> 00:57:03,752 And, 658 00:57:04,888 --> 00:57:07,689 they were deeply involved with the, 659 00:57:07,691 --> 00:57:09,925 the moving of the money to Mr. thylmann. 660 00:57:09,927 --> 00:57:13,695 But, obviously, at some point, people are not telling you 661 00:57:13,697 --> 00:57:16,031 where the money is coming from anymore. 662 00:57:26,776 --> 00:57:29,912 - Two journalists, two German journalists from die welt, 663 00:57:29,914 --> 00:57:33,816 they say that some of the money from the loan 664 00:57:33,818 --> 00:57:36,852 came from wall street, which is right here. 665 00:57:36,854 --> 00:57:37,953 - Yes. 666 00:57:37,955 --> 00:57:40,522 - And from a hedge fund, but, i mean, 667 00:57:40,524 --> 00:57:43,892 no hedge fund never, ever invests money in porn. 668 00:57:43,894 --> 00:57:45,894 - Oh yeah, you would never, i mean, 669 00:57:45,896 --> 00:57:48,897 for the longest time, the only people who would finance porn 670 00:57:48,899 --> 00:57:51,800 back in the early days was like, the mob. 671 00:57:51,802 --> 00:57:55,571 You weren't getting a loan from the bank to shoot 672 00:57:55,573 --> 00:57:58,907 the next deep throat, that wasn't gonna happen. 673 00:57:58,909 --> 00:58:02,244 So, it's still that way to some extent. 674 00:58:02,246 --> 00:58:06,081 You see, to this day, performers get their bank accounts 675 00:58:06,083 --> 00:58:07,916 shut off from different banks, 676 00:58:07,918 --> 00:58:10,185 so there's still that kind of stigma. 677 00:58:10,187 --> 00:58:11,954 So I can't imagine, 678 00:58:13,656 --> 00:58:15,090 Goldman sachs saying, 679 00:58:15,092 --> 00:58:17,860 "here, take a bunch of money to shoot porn." 680 00:58:17,862 --> 00:58:19,228 So I mean, it's, 681 00:58:20,830 --> 00:58:23,599 it's mind-boggling, it's just crazy, 682 00:58:23,601 --> 00:58:27,002 would they really get money from a hedge fund for that, 683 00:58:27,004 --> 00:58:28,971 or was there something else involved? 684 00:58:28,973 --> 00:58:29,905 It's just, 685 00:58:31,140 --> 00:58:34,042 it's hard to wrap your mind around. 686 00:58:45,221 --> 00:58:48,790 - Advertising campaigns, wall street money, 687 00:58:48,792 --> 00:58:51,226 swanky offices in Canada, 688 00:58:51,228 --> 00:58:55,998 you could almost forget that their business is pornography. 689 00:58:56,000 --> 00:58:58,867 But if mindgeek seems so respectable, 690 00:58:58,869 --> 00:59:02,704 why then do so many people in the business fear it so much? 691 00:59:02,706 --> 00:59:05,173 - My experience was mostly a wall of silence. 692 00:59:05,175 --> 00:59:08,043 I probably could have spent weeks 693 00:59:08,045 --> 00:59:11,146 calling hundreds of more producers and performers and 694 00:59:11,148 --> 00:59:13,181 there were people who just didn't even know 695 00:59:13,183 --> 00:59:14,783 what mindgeek or manwin was, 696 00:59:14,785 --> 00:59:16,652 and the ones who'd been around for a while 697 00:59:16,654 --> 00:59:19,821 were much more hesitant to talk openly. 698 00:59:19,823 --> 00:59:22,024 And as more publications came out, 699 00:59:22,026 --> 00:59:26,061 you began to realize that many actors and producers 700 00:59:26,063 --> 00:59:29,031 that went out publicly to talk against mindgeek 701 00:59:29,033 --> 00:59:31,233 said that they were blacklisted as a result, 702 00:59:31,235 --> 00:59:33,802 that they were blacklisted in the industry, 703 00:59:33,804 --> 00:59:36,805 couldn't perform, couldn't get any deals. 704 00:59:36,807 --> 00:59:38,974 There was intimidation. 705 00:59:38,976 --> 00:59:42,044 You can look on several publications online where 706 00:59:42,046 --> 00:59:45,347 porn stars have talked openly about being threatened 707 00:59:45,349 --> 00:59:47,783 through legal documents or warnings, 708 00:59:47,785 --> 00:59:49,918 and many who have been outright blacklisted, 709 00:59:49,920 --> 00:59:52,721 who don't work anymore and who had to create their own 710 00:59:52,723 --> 00:59:55,924 independent brand, and very small boutique site, 711 00:59:55,926 --> 00:59:57,893 that they hoped people would come to. 712 00:59:57,895 --> 01:00:02,264 But as we know, 95 plus percent of porn viewers online 713 01:00:02,266 --> 01:00:03,799 go to tube sites. 714 01:00:03,801 --> 01:00:05,334 So the majority of the porn audience, 715 01:00:05,336 --> 01:00:07,002 if you want to get their attention, 716 01:00:07,004 --> 01:00:10,305 you have to work with mindgeek to some degree. 717 01:00:10,307 --> 01:00:12,941 So, it had this kind of 718 01:00:12,943 --> 01:00:16,278 cartel, mafia feel to it more than a business model. 719 01:00:19,049 --> 01:00:20,682 - The more I dig, 720 01:00:20,684 --> 01:00:24,653 the more complicated it all seems to become. 721 01:00:24,655 --> 01:00:29,024 The American authorities seem strangely uninterested. 722 01:00:30,159 --> 01:00:34,663 The only investigation dates back to 2009 in Atlanta. 723 01:00:36,299 --> 01:00:39,735 Maybe there, I will find some answers. 724 01:01:51,741 --> 01:01:56,078 - Yeah, I was afraid he was gonna run into that because, 725 01:01:56,080 --> 01:02:00,115 yeah, everybody will tell you about mindgeek 726 01:02:00,117 --> 01:02:03,318 until you ask them on the record. 727 01:02:03,320 --> 01:02:05,420 You know, when they actually have to say it 728 01:02:05,422 --> 01:02:06,822 in front of a camera, 729 01:02:06,824 --> 01:02:08,890 or say it with a tape recorder rolling, 730 01:02:08,892 --> 01:02:11,460 then they don't want to say anything because, yeah, 731 01:02:11,462 --> 01:02:14,429 they depend on mindgeek for work. 732 01:02:16,232 --> 01:02:18,800 - Mike knows the dirty secrets 733 01:02:18,802 --> 01:02:21,770 of the American porn industry. 734 01:02:21,772 --> 01:02:24,306 He was one of the first to be questioned 735 01:02:24,308 --> 01:02:27,309 by the secret services after the accounts 736 01:02:27,311 --> 01:02:29,745 in Atlanta were seized. 737 01:02:29,747 --> 01:02:34,116 - I got a tip from someone inside manwin who said, 738 01:02:35,785 --> 01:02:39,321 "look at fortress investment group." 739 01:02:39,323 --> 01:02:43,325 It turned out that fortress investment group 740 01:02:43,327 --> 01:02:46,762 bought a small piece of a larger loan 741 01:02:47,964 --> 01:02:51,099 that was made by cold back capital. 742 01:02:51,101 --> 01:02:55,403 So cold back capital loaned to manwin $350 million dollars. 743 01:02:57,106 --> 01:02:59,341 And manwin used that money 744 01:03:00,843 --> 01:03:03,011 to buy the digital playground, 745 01:03:03,013 --> 01:03:05,947 they used that money to buy babes.Com, 746 01:03:05,949 --> 01:03:08,550 they used that money to buy redtube. 747 01:03:08,552 --> 01:03:12,087 So you look at all these purchases they made, 748 01:03:12,089 --> 01:03:14,089 and most of them are failing. 749 01:03:14,091 --> 01:03:18,126 I cannot think of one legal business 750 01:03:18,128 --> 01:03:21,863 that is making money, that mindgeek owns. 751 01:03:21,865 --> 01:03:24,466 The important thing to remember here 752 01:03:24,468 --> 01:03:27,068 is what mindgeek is selling. 753 01:03:28,237 --> 01:03:31,807 They're selling traffic, okay? 754 01:03:31,809 --> 01:03:33,875 And they are selling it 755 01:03:35,311 --> 01:03:37,979 to other mindgeek companies. 756 01:03:39,282 --> 01:03:42,217 And they sell it to other mindgeek companies, 757 01:03:42,219 --> 01:03:45,120 and they sell it to other mindgeek companies. 758 01:03:45,122 --> 01:03:47,122 And what is traffic? 759 01:03:47,124 --> 01:03:48,223 It's nothing. 760 01:03:48,225 --> 01:03:50,592 There's no inventory of traffic. 761 01:03:50,594 --> 01:03:54,396 I can't call up a parts supplier and say, 762 01:03:54,398 --> 01:03:55,864 "hey, I need more traffic, 763 01:03:55,866 --> 01:03:59,835 "so you have to send me a million widgets." 764 01:03:59,837 --> 01:04:03,371 They can create traffic anytime, for free. 765 01:04:05,007 --> 01:04:09,077 There is no inventory, so it's very difficult to track. 766 01:04:09,079 --> 01:04:13,415 It appears that their primary industry is not pornography, 767 01:04:14,951 --> 01:04:16,918 but moving money 768 01:04:16,920 --> 01:04:21,423 from country to country to country to country. 769 01:04:21,425 --> 01:04:25,126 What we call in America money laundering. 770 01:04:26,362 --> 01:04:28,363 Can I prove that? 771 01:04:28,365 --> 01:04:29,497 No. 772 01:04:29,499 --> 01:04:31,266 That is my opinion. 773 01:04:32,201 --> 01:04:34,269 But it is well-founded. 774 01:04:36,639 --> 01:04:39,140 - In the end, the judicial inquiries 775 01:04:39,142 --> 01:04:43,278 remain in limbo, and some have been settled out of court. 776 01:04:43,280 --> 01:04:45,881 Even in Atlanta, despite the allegations 777 01:04:45,883 --> 01:04:49,417 of money laundering, the only penalty was a fine. 778 01:04:49,419 --> 01:04:52,888 The empire appears to be untouchable. 779 01:04:53,890 --> 01:04:56,191 Has he ever tried to contact you? 780 01:04:56,193 --> 01:04:58,660 - They have contacted me many times. 781 01:04:58,662 --> 01:05:02,430 Even Fabian thylmann contacted me, 782 01:05:02,432 --> 01:05:06,968 and he was going to buy advertising on mikesouth.Com. 783 01:05:07,603 --> 01:05:11,239 And he offered me a lot of money. 784 01:05:11,241 --> 01:05:12,641 But I understood 785 01:05:14,210 --> 01:05:18,113 it was not really advertising he was trying to buy, 786 01:05:18,115 --> 01:05:20,415 it was my silence. 787 01:05:20,417 --> 01:05:24,686 In the last three years, i have had my life threatened 788 01:05:24,688 --> 01:05:26,688 five, maybe six times. 789 01:05:26,690 --> 01:05:29,057 - And do you know who it is? 790 01:05:29,059 --> 01:05:29,925 - No. 791 01:05:29,927 --> 01:05:31,092 - No? - No. 792 01:05:31,094 --> 01:05:32,961 - It's anonymous. - They are anonymous. 793 01:05:32,963 --> 01:05:35,030 - Okay. - And, you know, 794 01:05:36,232 --> 01:05:38,366 if they call me on the telephone and say, 795 01:05:38,368 --> 01:05:40,168 "I'm going to kill you", 796 01:05:40,170 --> 01:05:42,103 or if they send me an email and say, 797 01:05:42,105 --> 01:05:44,205 "I'm going to kill you", 798 01:05:45,107 --> 01:05:48,176 that doesn't concern me very much. 799 01:05:48,178 --> 01:05:52,480 But the last time, they left a box on my front door. 800 01:05:53,950 --> 01:05:58,086 It had a toy fire truck and a fire extinguisher 801 01:05:59,188 --> 01:06:02,390 and a book of matches and a card that said, 802 01:06:02,392 --> 01:06:05,360 "I'm sorry your house burned down." 803 01:06:05,362 --> 01:06:07,696 To me, that is a direct threat. 804 01:06:07,698 --> 01:06:10,966 And so I carry a gun wherever i go. 805 01:06:12,702 --> 01:06:16,371 Honestly, I would hope that i never have 806 01:06:16,373 --> 01:06:18,606 to draw my gun on someone. 807 01:06:20,343 --> 01:06:22,210 I hope that never happens. 808 01:06:22,212 --> 01:06:25,380 But if it does happen, I will do it. 809 01:06:40,529 --> 01:06:42,664 - Throughout my investigation, 810 01:06:42,666 --> 01:06:45,500 I heard some wild rumors. 811 01:06:45,502 --> 01:06:49,237 Mafias across the world seemed to be implicated, 812 01:06:49,239 --> 01:06:53,041 in south America, the middle east, eastern Europe, 813 01:06:53,043 --> 01:06:54,242 and even Asia. 814 01:06:55,644 --> 01:06:59,481 I'm not sure if we will ever get to the bottom of it all. 815 01:07:01,450 --> 01:07:04,586 Ultimately, today's porn industry is all about 816 01:07:04,588 --> 01:07:08,523 big Internet companies that generate billions of hits 817 01:07:08,525 --> 01:07:11,326 that have no connection with the workforce 818 01:07:11,328 --> 01:07:14,295 at the end of the production line. 819 01:07:23,305 --> 01:07:25,573 Tube sites are not the only websites 820 01:07:25,575 --> 01:07:28,543 that took advantage of the Internet. 821 01:07:28,545 --> 01:07:31,446 Another lucrative venture is the live cam, 822 01:07:31,448 --> 01:07:33,748 a kind of peep show 2.0. 823 01:07:33,750 --> 01:07:36,818 It's one of the premium offers to which the video sites 824 01:07:36,820 --> 01:07:39,354 try to redirect consumers. 825 01:07:39,356 --> 01:07:40,321 - Hello. 826 01:07:41,624 --> 01:07:43,725 - Welcome in my room. 827 01:07:43,727 --> 01:07:46,661 - The girls perform for consumers for a price, 828 01:07:46,663 --> 01:07:49,831 and the it platforms connect the two. 829 01:07:49,833 --> 01:07:54,335 Even porn has not escaped the uber-ization of work. 830 01:08:19,562 --> 01:08:22,430 The market leader is live Jasmin, 831 01:08:22,432 --> 01:08:24,866 also one of mindgeek's main customers 832 01:08:24,868 --> 01:08:27,635 in terms of advertising space. 833 01:08:29,538 --> 01:08:33,341 But live Jasmin is more transparent than mindgeek, 834 01:08:33,343 --> 01:08:37,645 and they agreed to open their doors to me. 835 01:08:37,647 --> 01:08:41,149 - This is the product development department. 836 01:08:41,151 --> 01:08:44,619 These are the guys who are actually working on 837 01:08:44,621 --> 01:08:46,254 the development of live Jasmin 838 01:08:46,256 --> 01:08:48,423 and our live streaming products. 839 01:08:48,425 --> 01:08:51,493 So this is the finance department here. 840 01:08:51,495 --> 01:08:55,196 Here we have the legal department, hr, 841 01:08:55,198 --> 01:08:57,799 office management, vr department. 842 01:08:57,801 --> 01:09:00,835 - How many employees are working here in Luxembourg? 843 01:09:00,837 --> 01:09:02,770 - Around 200. 844 01:09:02,772 --> 01:09:04,772 200, and most of them, 845 01:09:06,275 --> 01:09:08,543 more than half of them are developers. 846 01:09:08,545 --> 01:09:11,913 For example, here are the guys who are developing 847 01:09:11,915 --> 01:09:14,149 the platform for the models. 848 01:09:14,151 --> 01:09:16,684 - It's funny because it doesn't look like 849 01:09:16,686 --> 01:09:18,586 an adult company at all. 850 01:09:18,588 --> 01:09:19,754 - No, it's not. 851 01:09:19,756 --> 01:09:21,556 It could be a bank because we have all the, 852 01:09:21,558 --> 01:09:25,226 all the roles and all the activities and 853 01:09:25,228 --> 01:09:27,729 staff that's needed for a bank. 854 01:09:27,731 --> 01:09:29,931 It's a well-structured big company 855 01:09:29,933 --> 01:09:33,368 that stands behind this business. 856 01:09:33,370 --> 01:09:37,705 So this why we don't consider ourselves as adult company 857 01:09:37,707 --> 01:09:39,374 because we are it company. 858 01:09:39,376 --> 01:09:41,843 We are company which is responsible 859 01:09:41,845 --> 01:09:43,444 for development of the platform. 860 01:09:43,446 --> 01:09:44,946 We give the platform 861 01:09:44,948 --> 01:09:47,348 and we give them to the members and models, 862 01:09:47,350 --> 01:09:48,883 and they can meet on the platform. 863 01:09:48,885 --> 01:09:51,352 - In fact, you never meet the girls? 864 01:09:51,354 --> 01:09:52,554 It's very-- - not really, no. 865 01:09:52,556 --> 01:09:55,423 Physically we don't meet the girls because 866 01:09:55,425 --> 01:09:57,392 they are the other side of the world, 867 01:09:57,394 --> 01:09:59,327 and we just give them a platform. 868 01:09:59,329 --> 01:10:03,498 - How many cam girls are working for live Jasmin? 869 01:10:03,500 --> 01:10:07,202 - Well, that's, that's a tricky question because 870 01:10:07,204 --> 01:10:10,772 they are, lots of models come and leave. 871 01:10:10,774 --> 01:10:14,876 I mean, we have registered around two million models 872 01:10:14,878 --> 01:10:17,745 who are registered for the website. 873 01:10:17,747 --> 01:10:19,981 But I mean, I would say, actively, 874 01:10:19,983 --> 01:10:23,218 there are around 50,000 who are active currently 875 01:10:23,220 --> 01:10:24,752 on the website, that they have account 876 01:10:24,754 --> 01:10:26,688 and they come online. 877 01:10:36,465 --> 01:10:40,368 - Far from Luxembourg and its business districts, 878 01:10:40,370 --> 01:10:44,339 thousands of workers struggle to make a living. 879 01:10:44,341 --> 01:10:45,840 Here in timisoara, 880 01:10:46,842 --> 01:10:49,944 I get the feeling that a new form of exploitation 881 01:10:49,946 --> 01:10:52,780 of sex workers has developed. 882 01:11:23,312 --> 01:11:25,513 - I'm 25. 883 01:11:25,515 --> 01:11:27,882 I was working as a waitress 884 01:11:28,951 --> 01:11:30,418 in restaurants. 885 01:11:32,054 --> 01:11:34,055 It was pretty hard and 886 01:11:35,524 --> 01:11:40,028 I wasn't earning as much money as I wished to, 887 01:11:40,030 --> 01:11:41,496 because I have plans. 888 01:11:41,498 --> 01:11:43,898 I want to finish university. 889 01:11:45,334 --> 01:11:46,567 And my mother, 890 01:11:47,603 --> 01:11:50,938 it's gone in another country for work. 891 01:11:51,807 --> 01:11:54,008 So I'm staying alone and, 892 01:11:55,577 --> 01:11:57,845 and I have to pay for all. 893 01:11:59,348 --> 01:12:00,782 So... 894 01:12:17,733 --> 01:12:22,337 - Romanians, we produce 50% of all incomes in the world. 895 01:12:23,939 --> 01:12:28,076 Half from this industry is produced by Romanians. 896 01:12:28,078 --> 01:12:31,679 From my opinion, I think that there are active models, 897 01:12:31,681 --> 01:12:33,014 at least 10,000, 898 01:12:34,516 --> 01:12:35,550 in Romania. 899 01:12:52,935 --> 01:12:55,136 - I'm from arad. 900 01:12:55,138 --> 01:12:57,805 It's near from timisoara. 901 01:12:57,807 --> 01:12:59,941 I have four sisters more 902 01:13:01,443 --> 01:13:03,578 and one little brother. 903 01:13:03,580 --> 01:13:07,915 My mother is cooking in a big restaurant, 904 01:13:07,917 --> 01:13:09,584 and my father, I don't know. 905 01:13:10,687 --> 01:13:13,654 I saw him only one time in my life. 906 01:13:16,558 --> 01:13:18,793 I think I will do this job 907 01:13:19,995 --> 01:13:21,996 until I reach my goal. 908 01:13:24,032 --> 01:13:27,402 And I open a little business for me. 909 01:13:28,637 --> 01:13:31,439 And, 'til I have a family. 910 01:13:31,441 --> 01:13:34,442 Guys, if you want, there is more. 911 01:13:35,144 --> 01:13:36,978 You want a bit more? 912 01:13:39,181 --> 01:13:42,617 - From here, they are not so wealthy. 913 01:13:44,153 --> 01:13:47,455 They are coming from poor families. 914 01:13:48,090 --> 01:13:51,692 And they are struggling to build a future. 915 01:13:51,694 --> 01:13:53,594 - My life is like this. 916 01:13:53,596 --> 01:13:55,530 I work, I sleep. 917 01:13:55,532 --> 01:13:56,731 I work, I sleep. 918 01:13:56,733 --> 01:13:59,033 I don't do nothing. 919 01:13:59,035 --> 01:14:01,602 - How many hours per day do you work? 920 01:14:01,604 --> 01:14:03,104 - Eight, nine, 10. 921 01:14:05,107 --> 01:14:06,073 - Any you told me that 922 01:14:06,075 --> 01:14:08,876 some girls are from Colombia? 923 01:14:08,878 --> 01:14:10,545 - Yeah. 924 01:14:10,547 --> 01:14:14,615 Colombia is the next country competing with Romania with 925 01:14:14,617 --> 01:14:16,951 numbers of webcam orders. 926 01:14:16,953 --> 01:14:18,152 - Colombia. 927 01:14:18,154 --> 01:14:20,521 - Yeah. - Why Colombia? 928 01:14:22,158 --> 01:14:26,127 - Because I think they are poor also. 929 01:14:26,129 --> 01:14:27,962 - But, this is this life. 930 01:14:27,964 --> 01:14:31,132 We have to fight for have something. 931 01:14:34,470 --> 01:14:38,873 We can't have all the things without, make something. 932 01:14:49,585 --> 01:14:53,221 - The platforms take on average of 60 to 70% share 933 01:14:53,223 --> 01:14:55,056 of what the customers pay. 934 01:14:55,058 --> 01:14:59,660 For a girl working in a studio, her fees are even halved. 935 01:15:05,701 --> 01:15:07,935 But users always beg for free shows 936 01:15:07,937 --> 01:15:10,738 and the girls waste their time. 937 01:15:11,807 --> 01:15:15,042 Sometimes the camgirls go home at the end of the day 938 01:15:15,044 --> 01:15:17,879 having earned no money at all. 939 01:15:27,923 --> 01:15:32,760 - We figured out that every day, maybe 200 or 300 people 940 01:15:32,762 --> 01:15:35,897 at least visit their chatrooms. 941 01:15:35,899 --> 01:15:36,931 Figure out, 942 01:15:39,234 --> 01:15:42,069 customers that are entering and said, "you are a bitch", 943 01:15:42,071 --> 01:15:44,639 or said bad things to them. 944 01:15:45,307 --> 01:15:49,710 And also the hardest part outside here it's that 945 01:15:50,846 --> 01:15:53,548 they renounce their social life. 946 01:15:53,550 --> 01:15:55,917 So for my opinion, 947 01:15:55,919 --> 01:15:58,553 it's a job that takes 948 01:15:58,555 --> 01:16:00,755 from one year to five year maximum. 949 01:16:00,757 --> 01:16:03,324 - How much do they earn per month? 950 01:16:03,326 --> 01:16:04,559 The average? 951 01:16:04,561 --> 01:16:05,993 - Average, around 952 01:16:08,096 --> 01:16:09,830 $1,400 us dollars. 953 01:16:10,732 --> 01:16:11,732 The average. 954 01:16:21,743 --> 01:16:24,345 - What's the turnover of live Jasmin? 955 01:16:24,347 --> 01:16:27,748 - It's, I can tell approximate number, 956 01:16:27,750 --> 01:16:31,152 it's around $305 million a year. 957 01:16:31,154 --> 01:16:34,155 We have our incomes growing year by year. 958 01:16:34,157 --> 01:16:38,125 We can grow, we usually grow our incomes, 959 01:16:38,127 --> 01:16:41,829 it depends on the year but more than 10% every year. 960 01:16:41,831 --> 01:16:43,698 Sometimes even more. 961 01:16:43,700 --> 01:16:45,666 - And why are you in Luxembourg? 962 01:16:45,668 --> 01:16:48,703 - Well, there were several reasons for Luxembourg that time. 963 01:16:48,705 --> 01:16:50,905 The obvious reason would be to say that yeah, 964 01:16:50,907 --> 01:16:52,807 it's for the tax reasons but 965 01:16:52,809 --> 01:16:54,208 we are always focusing on having 966 01:16:54,210 --> 01:16:56,077 the best people working with us. 967 01:16:56,079 --> 01:16:58,879 The best people, especially in technology. 968 01:16:58,881 --> 01:16:59,847 And, 969 01:17:01,149 --> 01:17:04,885 in terms of having an attractive environment for people, 970 01:17:04,887 --> 01:17:08,689 worldwide, I think Luxembourg is a good place. 971 01:17:08,691 --> 01:17:11,359 I think we are really happy to be here and 972 01:17:11,361 --> 01:17:13,294 we want to stay here. 973 01:17:38,420 --> 01:17:41,355 - So, smitty, I want you to remove your clothes 974 01:17:41,357 --> 01:17:43,290 and down on your knees, 975 01:17:43,292 --> 01:17:46,861 that you are positioned in front of me. 976 01:17:46,863 --> 01:17:49,864 Great, very good, my boy. 977 01:17:49,866 --> 01:17:51,298 You like my boots? 978 01:17:51,300 --> 01:17:52,233 Leather. 979 01:17:55,337 --> 01:17:57,271 Clean my dirty soles. 980 01:17:59,775 --> 01:18:01,042 Lick my heels. 981 01:18:02,778 --> 01:18:04,378 Very well. 982 01:18:04,380 --> 01:18:08,883 Now, I want you to put the plastic bag in your hand, 983 01:18:09,951 --> 01:18:12,453 and then around your neck. 984 01:18:12,455 --> 01:18:14,722 Use that tape. 985 01:18:14,724 --> 01:18:16,824 You will have no air. 986 01:18:16,826 --> 01:18:17,792 So do it. 987 01:18:19,194 --> 01:18:23,264 And how I promise you, i will show you my ass. 988 01:18:31,140 --> 01:18:33,874 - In principle, it's a private exchange 989 01:18:33,876 --> 01:18:35,876 between consenting adults. 990 01:18:35,878 --> 01:18:39,914 But if problems arise, who is responsible? 991 01:18:39,916 --> 01:18:40,948 - You see? 992 01:18:40,950 --> 01:18:43,217 What do you think about her? 993 01:18:43,219 --> 01:18:44,318 You like it? 994 01:18:45,987 --> 01:18:49,790 She can do very dirty things in private like 995 01:18:49,792 --> 01:18:52,259 eating poo and drinking pee. 996 01:18:52,261 --> 01:18:56,197 Most of the Chinese girl are submissive ones. 997 01:18:57,265 --> 01:19:01,335 It's asking just 50 credits for natural squirt, 998 01:19:03,105 --> 01:19:06,173 including blow job, that's almost nothing, 999 01:19:06,175 --> 01:19:07,942 less than one dollar. 1000 01:19:07,944 --> 01:19:11,946 So it's, in my opinion, selling herself very, 1001 01:19:13,248 --> 01:19:14,281 very cheap. 1002 01:19:15,817 --> 01:19:18,285 - With the arrival of the sex multinationals, 1003 01:19:18,287 --> 01:19:21,822 what we knew as porn has given way to a sector subject 1004 01:19:21,824 --> 01:19:25,459 to the same rules of an ultra-liberal world. 1005 01:19:25,461 --> 01:19:29,230 An unrestrained capitalism, a scorched-earth policy, 1006 01:19:29,232 --> 01:19:32,133 a complete disregard for workers. 1007 01:19:32,135 --> 01:19:33,901 When you think about it, 1008 01:19:33,903 --> 01:19:37,371 mindgeek is a little like the monsanto of porn. 71954

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