All language subtitles for Enskilda samtal 1

The First Conversation

One Sunday afternoon at the end of June, 1925

Anna!

Anna!

Good morning Anna my pet.

Come and sit down for a bit.
You can't be in that much of a hurry.

I was just going to...

Just sit down... and we'll have a chat.

How are the children?

They're with mum in Dalarna.

I just came from there.

And Henrik?

He's been on the island for a week.
He's fine.

All on his own?

Yes... but I'll be going there tomorrow.

What about you, Uncle Jacob?

I'm here for a funeral.

I agreed to conduct the service.

It's nearly the end of my holidays.

I've had a "blessed summer"...
in the language of my trade.

I came from Dalarna yesterday
and went straight to the hairdresser.

It's a secret passion I indulge in
every now and then.

Yesterday I had dinner
with the Hasselroths...

They're old friends...

My friends.

Henrik didn't feel like coming to town,
even though he was invited, but...

Obviously because... they're MY friends.

I'm sorry, Uncle Jacob...

There are just so many things.

I'm sorry...

I'm not usually the crying type... but...

It's just that there are
so many things.

If there's something you want to
get off your chest...

No... I must get home.

Henrik'll phone at 4 o'clock...

If I don't answer, he'll get worried.

Would you like to join me
for coffee and a bite to eat?

That sounds very good...
Much better than dining alone.

Alright if I smoke, Anna?

Do you have time, Uncle Jacob?

The service is at 5.30...
Other than that...

And after that?

The whole evening...
for as long as you like.

Maybe I'm being stupid...
I don't know.

Anna, I performed your confirmation
and I'm your spiritual guide.

You can tell me anything you want...
or have to... tell me.

Alright then.

I'm an unfaithful wife.

I'm cheating on Henrik.

I'm seeing another man.

I feel a terrible angst...

It's not a matter of bad conscience
or anything like that... That'd be silly.

Just angst.

I don't know what to do anymore.

Another man.

He's much younger.

He's studying theology.

I should break up with him
for his sake, too... but...

But I can't do it.

I love him.

More than a year.

Yes, more than a year.

You know him, Uncle Jacob.

It's Tomas.

Mum was totally against
my marriage to Henrik.

After we married, she changed her mind...

and helped us all she could.

It took 2 years...

Then I realised my mother'd been right.

Everything was so innocent,
yet so treacherous.

I invited Tomas to come visit us
in Dalarna in the summer holidays.

You know... V�roms...
my parent's weekender.

So I invited him for midsummer.

Henrik and my girlfriend Gertrud
were supposed to be there, too.

But Henrik couldn't go...
he had to be at a conference.

I wanted to cancel Tomas...

But Henrik thought
he should come anyway.

We even joked about Gertrud
and Tomas as a possible match.

She'd make a good minister's wife.

So Tomas came.

I felt happy and free...

I'm babbling on about things
you must think unimportant.

But it was so innocent... AND treacherous.

We played with the children
and picked wild strawberries...

...ate boiled ham with fresh potatoes
and sour cream with ginger snaps.

In the evenings...

we played...

Gertrud has a beautiful voice...

Tomas... knows so much about music.

The three of us were
always together.

Tomas, Gertrud and me.

I was so happy.

I was so happy... can you understand that?

I became a bit reckless, because I...

I remember thinking...

"I'm in love with this boy. "

"I'm so in love it's ridiculous. "

I'm not ashamed of my love
but I keep it to myself.

Sometimes, I'd leave Tomas
and Gertrud alone.

I didn't mind.

I wanted them to get together.

Me, with all I'd been through...

I felt I could fly.

On one of Tomas' last days in V�roms

I came down from my room to set the table.

Suddenly he said...

I love you.

...that he was fond of me...

That he'd been fond of me...

Well, he said he he'd been "in love with me"

for the last two years.

I don't know what he said then...
I stopped listening.

It was so terrible and unreal.

I clearly remember thinking "Now it all goes
to hell... everything's ruined. "

"Why did he have to be so stupid?"

If you want to take communion,
do so, Anna.

If you live in grief,
if you are in trouble...

if you don't know what to do,
it could be of help to take communion

and entrust your sorrows
to the heart of God.

I know nothing about God's heart,
Uncle Jacob.

You don't have to know.

You'll find grace in the act itself.

It might ease your suffering.

I doubt it.

Do as you wish.

So, I'll see you at 8.

Wait.

Should I call Tomas?

Just to know about his mood...

Not to tell him about confessions

or pressure him so he'll feel
he has to console me.

I know won't find him home.

I'm sure he's gone
to the botanic gardens...

to the water-lily ponds

with the fragrance of
Chinese roses

and still water.

Or he'll be in the shadow of an elm,
reading a book for his exams.

Let us pray.

Almighty heavenly Father

we thank you with all our heart

for the comfort of your absolution
and forgiveness of our sins.

And we beseech Thee
that You, through Your Holy Spirit...

...so prepare us, that we,
in true repentance and faith...

...may receive the body and blood of
your son Jesus Christ, in the sacrament...

May you receive the blood of Christ...

May you receive the blood of Christ...

Lord Jesus Christ, whose body
and blood that you have received...

Bless you unto everlasting life. Amen.

May you go in the peace of the Lord.

The body of Christ,
which will be delivered...

Maria and I once had a dog.

I was an assistant minister at the time.

He was very smart.
Want some?

Just a drop.

He had incredible humour and affection.

He followed me everywhere...
even to mass.

He lay under the pulpit.

When I said "Amen" he got up

and walked sedately ahead of me
into the sacristy.

No one in the congregation
had any objection...

Just the bishop.

I asked him if the animal
could have a soul...

but he couldn't give me an answer.

I meant that if the dog had a soul
we were doing him a great injustice

by excluding him from
the liturgy and gospel.

The bishop said he didn't dare
take on such a responsibility.

So Jackie got to keep his walks to church.

I usually console myself with that when I feel
it's time for me to leave this world...

Maybe he's standing there, waiting
at the pearly gates...

...wagging his tail.

Most people believe that
Luther abolished confession.

But he didn't.

He introduced what he called
"private confessions."

But he didn't understand much
about human beings...

...that magnificent reformer.

It's hard...face to face
in the light of day.

It's better in the semi-darkness
of the confessionary...

...mumbling voices and the smell of incense.

I really wanted to go to communion,
but I stopped myself.

Shouldn't we go sit somewhere
more comfortable?

Let's go into the library.

You can sit in Henrik's armchair
and smoke a cigar.

- Henrik hardly ever smokes cigars.
- Really?

Dad was a very keen cigar-smoker.

Yes, Johan loved cigars.

Fine cigars and beautiful locomotives
were his passion.

I used to love sitting on his lap
while he smoked.

Have one.

Thank you. Actually, I'm not
such a big cigar smoker.

But this tastes great.

Much appreciated!

If you want to know...
this is how it happened.

Tomas and I were alone
in his room.

It was a cold January day
and it was getting dark.

I 'd just told him that I had
to return home to Stockholm,

and that it'd be a while before
we'd see each other again.

I'd put my coat on
and was ready to go.

And at that moment
I made my choice.

Made your choice?

He stood there,
shaking his head and said:

No...no...no...

Not that!

But...

I no longer had a choice.

I took his hand
and pulled him closer to me.

And he went down on his knees.

I had his head between my hands

and his face against my breast.

I started it with him,
you see Uncle Jacob.

And I had to comfort him.

He was inconsolable.

He felt he'd let me down...
and Henrik who's his friend.

I thought about remorse...
but I don't feel any.

I thought about guilt...and sin...

But it's only a word.

I raised a wall of things
forbidden between him and me.

But any chance I got to meet him...
the wall came down.

I think I should...

Yes...I know that I should...

No...

That's probably not true.

And then there's the children.

I've become nicer to the children...
and more patient.

I'm even nicer to Henrik, too.

I can be tender and
caring with him

And he's happier and less irritable.

Everything's been better since
I allowed myself to love Tomas.

He's also content...

and doesn't have attacks
of a guilty conscience any more.

We don't meet that often, but when I
visit my mother in Uppsala we get together.

I just want to ask you one thing.

If everything is as wonderful
as you say...

why did you start crying?

You caught me out.

I'd spent the afternoon with Tomas.

I hadn't seen him for more
than a month. Six weeks, I think.

I got so worked up...not unhappy,
but worked up.

I didn't see you sitting under the tree.

When you called out, I felt terrified
in a silly way...like I was caught out.

Yes...caught out.

When we were sitting talking...

...I got a feeling of...

I think I can guess what it was.

No you can't.

To be honest, I was scared.

So you started to cry.

I figured I'd be having all my happiness
replaced with unbelievable misery.

That was my first reaction.

I could hear myself confessing all...

and the tears just came.

I couldn't...

You could have blamed it on anything.

There's always something
to cry about.

I was looking at your big hands

And I thought...

If God had hands...

...which I don't think is the case...

...but if God had hands,
they'd look like yours.

Then I thought about that psalm...

"Lord, in this last hour I beg You

take my hand in Yours.

so that you...

From what you've told me,
I can see that

you really wanted
to confide in me...

Though you didn't think you could.

Isn't that always the way?

An enormous bliss...

A bliss so enormous
that it becomes unfathomable...

can call up every possible world
of darkness, torment and terror.

I got a taste of the pain
that waits behind pleasure.

If it wasn't God who gave me Tomas...

...then I'm very distant from God,
and that's alright.

I know that you'll think
I'm being extremely blasphemous.

It's not for you to say
what I think.

I remember the confirmation classes.

I remember you as the smartest.

During the discussions, you came up
with very pertinent questions.

I saw that you were
your classmates' friend.

I knew you came from
a loving family.

And I wondered what life had
in store for you.

After all, why have you told me?

If I dare think about it..

If I dare to think about it,
even for a moment...

I see we all have a threat
hanging over us...

So I feel more and more cornered.

The children, Henrik, Tomas and I
are all sliding closer to a catastrophe.

A life-threatening catastrophe
wouldn't you agree, Uncle Jacob?

A life-threatening catastrophe.

In the end, is there any way out?

And another question...
the one that scares me the most...

Do I really want a way out anyway?

Then I think about the children.

And it hurts me so much
that I throw those thoughts away.

They are almost unbearable.

Say what you will about Henrik,
but he's nice to the children.

A bit strict with the boys,
but full of affection for the little ones.

So am I to take the children
away from him?

No.

It's like there's some infernal time-bomb
ticking away.

Sometimes I hear it clearly
and get scared.

Even while I'm longing for him.

So that's the story, Uncle Jacob.

I haven't told this to anyone at all.

I don't know what I was expecting.

Maybe you could give me
some good advice...

a solution.

Or forgiveness for my sins.

Or at least some temporary relief.

If you're expecting an answer,
I don't have one.

If you want my compassion,
I must say I find it hard to express it.

Poor little Anna.

If you want my absolution,
I can't give it to you

for I don't think you repent at all.

But...

If you still want my advice...

I'll tell you a few things,
when you're ready to take me seriously.

I understand.

Everything I say will upset you.

I may be grateful.

I doubt it.

First off, you must completely
break off with your boyfriend.

Even though it may provide you
with great emotional satisfaction...

you have to put an end to it.

Thomas is committing a serious breach.
It may harm him for life.

If his indiscretion should come
to light, his future as a pastor

would probably be impossible.

You say that you love him,
and I believe you.

Being loved by someone like you
is a precious gift.

So I'm not saying
you should stop loving him.

What I'm saying is that you should
sever any connection with him...

And I mean ANY.

By doing this you'll be proving
your love to him.

And you must reveal everything...

...to your husband.

I couldn't do it.

You'll have to.

I'd do anything but tell him.

You have to.

I can't do it...it's impossible.

It's a matter of truth. You're
caught up in a web of lies.

The longer you live in it,
the more miserable your life will be.

I know that Henrik wouldn't cope with the truth.

It'd be better if I just disappeared.

Uncle Jacob...

Henrik is a man who can barely cope
with day-to-day life.

He's the weak and worrying type.

He's under a lot of pressure
in his job.

The truth would destroy him.

Our marriage doesn't work,
either spiritually or physically.

But there's a degree of friendship
that keeps us together.

That has worked for us for 12 years...
That friendship...and the children.

If I tell the truth now,
it'll create hell for us.

No, Uncle Jacob...no!

You simply must tell the truth, Anna.

Can't you see that hiding
the truth is very selfish of you?

And the truth just might help
Henrik mature to a better life.

"A better life!"...forgive me Uncle Jacob...

but Henrik isn't that sort of person.

He avoids conflict whenever he can.

If he loses control for a moment,
he either gets furious or ill.

He'll collapse.

THAT is the truth!

I know he's a good minister who's been
able to help a lot of people...

But underneath all that he's a
wretched little coward.

I just can't tell him the truth.

You must understand that I do understand...

But the truth is the only possibility.

But who'll help me
when all hell breaks loose?

Shall I turn to God...to you...
or to my mother?

What happens if Henrik throws me out
on the street...

Is nice Tomas going to say he'll look after
me and my children?

No...I'll never tell him the truth

I just don't believe in being so open.

I'm paying for my bad life with lies,
but it's worth it.

I think I'll keep my guilt to myself...

and not ask for help from anyone.

Neither God nor my family.

You speak as if you knew what
real guilt was. But you don't.

It's possible you'll put yourself and
your family through an ordeal...

but if you've chosen the truth,
it will make you strong.

Of course.

"The way of truth will make you strong."

Choose the way of truth...

and solve every insoluble problem.

I'll go now, Anna...

I understand your rejection
of what I've said.

And I don't ask you
to think the same way I do.

It was just my opinion.

Don't get angry.

Is it strange that I should defend myself?

Please feel free to be angry.

I speak to you out of my
well-ordered reality.

My own crises are hardly
relevant right now.

So relish your anger.

Just remember you're an
intelligent young woman.

I imagine that what I have said you've
been thinking yourself...for some time...

As it's the reality of the matter.

That's why I know...

Just forget your assumptions about
what Henrik might do, for a moment.

Thanks for your concern.

I'll pray for you tonight.

Turn on the light so that
I can see your face.

Look at me.

Yes, you ARE angry.

No.

You're angry and disappointed.
But what were you expecting?

I don't know.

I just wanted...

Anna, we all play so many roles.

Sometimes for fun...or else to be
what others expect of us.

Mostly, in order to protect ourselves.

So we gradually lose that part of ourselves
that is not in a role.

As I keep on acting, I get more and
more distant from myself.

So I can say that now...

...at this very moment...

I'm finally the real me.

Living with Henrik I was more and more
entangled in what you're calling roles.

When I'm with Tomas

I know I'm capable
of becoming a real person.

That's not what it is, Anna.
It's not.

I remember what you told me
the evening before your confirmation.

"I pray to God that I can
become useful."

You were certainly strong.

Yes, I know.

It was childish...because I was childish.

God listened to your prayer.

No...

We always receive what we ask of God...

but not in the way
that we expect it.

You don't believe that God
is concerned with your troubles?

No...

Have you stopped believing?

Do you believe in God,
Uncle Jacob?

A father up in the sky...a god of love?

A god with hands, a heart...
and all-seeing eyes.

Don't use the word "god".

Say "The Holy One".

There's holiness in everyone...
The holiness of man.

Everything else is added on...
window-dressing...show...deception.

There's no way of calculating
or capturing the holiness of man.

At the same time it's something
to hold on to...

...something very concrete...
until death.

What happens afterwards
is a mystery...

Only poets, musicians...and saints...

...have given us mirrors through which
we can get a glimpse...

...of the unknowable.

They have seen, known, understood...

Not completely...but through fragments...

I always find it comforting to think
of man's holiness...

and the mysterious immensities
that surround us.

Listen Anna...

I'm not speaking figuratively here...
this is the reality.

Inscribed in the holiness
of man is the truth.

No one can go against the truth without
causing harm to themselves or others.

No, I'll never be able to tell
what is known as the truth.

Never. That I'm sure of.

Second Conversation.

An evening in mid-August.
Some weeks after the first conversation.

It was such a nice day in town.

Let me help you with the bag...
we can both carry it.

It's actually easier for me
to carry it on my own.

Well, let me take the other one.

No, I need that to balance the other one.

As you wish.

It's the first time it's rained in 3 weeks.

It's been really dry here in Dalarna.

We've been saving water.

We only use it for cooking and drinks.

I'll take a wash in the lake.

After that I'll tell you about the children.

They have breakfast at home but are
out with their friends all day.

We don't fight about things like times
and keeping clean.

Ears don't get washed 'til Saturday.

The little one cut his bottom on a broken potty
and there was a bit of blood.

When are the children coming?

Mum's leaving Stockholm next week
with the kids.

It'll be in time for the little one's birthday.

That doesn't give you and me
much time together.

We'll be moving in together
on September 5.

That's what you were
in total agreement about.

Yes, I know.

I'll be preaching in town on September 1.

For healthy, tanned and happy children.

We have to be grateful to mum
for taking the children over the holidays.

Yes, of course.

We have to both be grateful, Henrik!

Yes, I'm grateful.

I'll go down to the pier and take a dip.

I'll go with you, so you don't drown!

It's really warm!

It really is warm.

Oh, it's lovely!

All I want now is a cup of tea!

Come on...we'll go up
and have a cup of tea.

It's been 5 long weeks...
and I've been missing for you.

I've missed the children too...

But you most of all.

But I'm not complaining.

It'd be ungrateful to complain
when you have it as good as me.

But I've been alone.

I don't mean to complain.

You've written such sweet letters
for me to read of an evening.

And at last you're here with me.

And best of all we've got several days
alone together

before the children come.

But just now...I don't want to.

No, Henrik...no!

What's the matter?

It's nothing...I just want
to be left in peace for a bit.

Haven't you had enough peace already?

I need some time to get used to it.

I don't want you standing over me
making demands.

That's a bit much...
I'm not demanding anything.

I DO NOT WANT TO!

Have I done something wrong?

No...

Sorry if I was stupid and clumsy.

Answer me, sweetheart...please!

You can't treat me like this!

Are you listening to me?

Just speak to me!

We have to speak with each other.

I'm going to sit on the veranda
and wait.

I'll wait however long it takes!

I want you to come out
and for us to talk together...

and for you to tell me
what is wrong!

So...

Now we can see each other
face-to-face.

Forgive me, Anna...

I was behaving like a child.
It's just that I was afraid.

Henrik, you need to listen to me.

I'm going to tell you something
that will hurt you a lot.

Now I really am afraid.

It's like this...

For some time now,
I've been with another man...

Say no more.

...who I love.

That you love...

Who I love more than any other
human being.

I live with him in every way...

With my senses,
with my heart.

Tell the truth, Anna.

This is the truth, Henrik.

Tomas and I were together today
before I came.

Tomas...?

I don't want to any more...I can't.

Who's Tomas?

You know him.

Tomas Egerman?

Yes, Tomas Egerman.

But he's still...just a student.

He's studying theology at Uppsala.

He'll graduate in about 2 years.

I'm sorry, Henrik.

I'm sorry.

There's really nothing else
I can say.

But when I think of how things
will be in the future...

I get angry.
I don't know why but...

...that's the way it is.

I'm trying to stay calm.

I don't want to hurt you, Henrik.

What is it you want most?

I'd rather stay on with you...

and look after our home
and our children.

Anything else is ridiculous...

...something unthinkable.

But let me hang on to a little freedom.

Just let me stay with Tomas
for a little while.

What's "a little while"?

I don't know. You asked
and I'm trying to answer.

So shall I find myself a lady to fill in,
during this unspecified time?

If you want to demand it,
I'm prepared to give up everything...

The children, the home, everything.

I'll just quietly vanish.

And the children?

Yes. The children, Henrik.

Maybe it would be best for me
not to be here...

...so they avoid getting caught up
in our difficulties.

We've always kept them
out of them, haven't we?

You poor thing...

You've got yourself in a mess.

I've prayed to God that I get sick

and have to go to hospital
and away from all this guilt, all this...

Don't you think there's some meaning
behind all that's happening to us...

That's causing us so much pain.

There've been so many times
I almost told you.

You're still my best friend,
despite all that's happened.

You're the only one
I could always talk to...

...so it's been very strange for me
to have to pretend...and play a role.

- Do you know what I mean?
- I do.

I thought that if I told you,
then between us, we...

I quite understand.

Then I saw how much work
you had to cope with.

all the responsibility for
so many people.

Then I felt that you couldn't
handle the truth about me...

...that it'd be very inconsiderate.

Yes...

Inconsiderate to involve you
in something I had to solve myself.

Sometimes I'd suddenly think
"Now's the time"...

"I'll tell him everything,
no matter what."

Then I'd see your depression...

...how tired you were...

...and the longer time went by,
the harder it became.

Does anyone else know?

No.

Not even your mother?

No...how on earth
could I dare tell her?

No one else, Anna?

No.

Are you sure?

M�rta knows.

Oh...M�rta!?

What I'm going to tell you
will hurt you.

Maybe it's for the best
I know anyway.

I wanted to be together with Tomas.

I wanted us to have a few days
and nights alone together.

Tomas had many more doubts than me.
He wanted to, and then he didn't.

He was afraid.

He said it'd be deceitful.

I said that the deceit
was already a fact.

So I wrote to M�rta, who...

was spending some time
with her aunt in Norway.

I told her everything...
just as it was.

She wrote back and said we were welcome
to spend a few days there.

We could be on our own.

I understand.

I can see that you
want to understand...

...and I'm thankful for that.

Have you confided in anyone else?

Yes.

So?

Uncle Jacob.

So he knows.

He is our friend.
He's close to us both.

He conducted my confirmation.

He's my boss.

Will that matter?

No...maybe not.

I know he likes you...
you know that too.

I just bumped into him accidently.

We sat on a bench in the
churchyard and had a chat.

He asked me straight out
if something was bothering me

and I confessed to him.

What did he say?

He advised me to tell the truth,
that there was no other option.

He told me to break my
relationship with Tomas.

That it was my only option,
that it was my duty.

He said that I'd be sinning
against you if I didn't tell you.

He was quite severe.

Or maybe he just sounded
severe to you.

What had you expected?

I don't know.

I made my confession without
any particular aim, or hope.

I just had to do it.

I guess I knew what he would say.

But at the same time I was afraid.

- You were scared.
- Yes, I was scared.

I told him that telling the truth
could be catastrophic.

So he said that it was wrong
to underestimate you.

I can see now he was right.

I'm so grateful, Henrik.

You've helped me.

My own little sook
my own Henrik

Will Sofia really be working
as a deputy parish deaconess?

Oh, yes...she's a wonderful person.

But she has arthritis
and she's always tired.

Do you understand why she was selected?

Yes, I quite understand.

What I don't understand, is why
we eat off a dirty tablecloth.

I don't understand it.

A dirty tablecloth?

Yes, the tablecloth is stained.

I don't know how long it's been
like that...More than a week.

10 days probably.

I can't believe you didn't notice it.

You're usually fussy about stains.

Where are the stains...where?

I don't understand where you're heading, Henrik.
I just don't understand where!

It's not really important...

Certainly not for you, it seems.

You'll have a clean tablecloth tomorrow.
The subject is closed.

I'm very sorry if the tablecloth
stains have annoyed you...

...but we're in the country
and we have no guests.

It doesn't seem that simple to me.

Then tell me how things
seem to you.

It's very clear, Anna.

I just realized that you're
neglecting our home.

What are you saying?

Your neglecting our home.

Dust under the beds, dirty tablecloths...
Wilting flowers.

I've been away for six weeks.
I can't help that the plants...

And just why were you away
for six weeks?

Tell me the truth.

Tell me the truth, Anna!

I don't understand...

We made an agreement...

You didn't want to come to Dalarna
and stay with mum...

You preferred to stay here,
by the sea.

Have you forgotten that you were the one who
wanted the children and I to go to Dalarna.

And that we'd meet up here
at the beginning of August.

Have you forgotten?

I remember just how quickly
you accepted my suggestion.

I was thankful to you for
not making difficulties.

You were thankful because you
could meet your lover this way.

I did wonder about all those
little trips to Uppsala...

Now I know why!

I went to Uppsala three times
with mum to help her with some things.

Four times!...Four!

Four...it's true...four.

All giving you a great opportunity
to meet your lover.

Answer me, Anna. For God's sake,
let's be honest!

I implore you.

What do you want to know?

I already told you everything.

Details.

That's exactly what I want.

You owe me a detailed account
of your...

Your amorous affair
with that person.

And if I refuse?

I've got many ways to force you.
Have you thought about that?

You can keep the children.

So it'll be best for the both of us...

if you're as honest as possible.

I want you to answer my questions
with complete honesty.

Then I'll quietly evaluate your answers...

perhaps with the help of a legal expert...

and then decide on my next step.

Do you know what I mean?

Yes.

Do you have any comment?

I was just wondering where...

all your forgiveness and sympathy
had gone to.

Where's that understanding
you showed me on Sunday?

My comprehension can change.

I was paralysed by what you said.
Now I realize my duty.

Duty?

My duty to the children.

I can't leave the children.

They must come first.

Henrik...dearest...

Since you obviously, without
any hesitation whatsoever...

put your own pleasure
before everything else...

endangering your family...

I'm forced to take responsibility.

I can't tolerate broken glasses,
dirty tablecloths...

dead plants or torn curtains.

I can't tolerate the disintegration your
indecency has brought into our home.

Henrik, you can't...

Can't? can't? can't?...what?...
I have to!

I'll do whatever my duty
requires right now!

If it would be less unpleasant,
less embarrassing,

I can write my questions to you

and you will answer me
in a letter,

which, of course, will be treated
with suspicion.

I understand.

I was here alone,
missing my family.

I was happy knowing that you
and the children were having a nice time...

That the children were well.

I told you in a letter
to keep your chin up...

to get a good rest...

to enjoy yourself...

that we'd see each other soon,
and that we're in God's hands.

What is it you want to know?

Were you naked when you were
together with that person?

You heard me!

I heard you...but I thought
I must be dreaming.

Were you naked?...

Were you both naked?

Yes! We were both naked!

That's interesting...

...seeing you don't enjoy
being naked together with me.

That's true!

How many times
did you sleep with him?

I don't know.

I'm sure you do, but you're
ashamed to tell me.

I'd say between 15 and 20 times.

And how many times did you come
straight from his bed to mine?

I don't know.
I tried to avoid it happening.

But I did feel, that if
it was as brief as possible,

it would be better to submit...
to avoid a scene.

That's love?

Yes, maybe THAT is love.

And how long has this indecency
been going on?

If by that you mean my loving
relationship with Tomas...

...it's been going on a bit more
than a year.

Last Midsummer, Gertrud
and Tomas came to V�roms.

You were supposed to join us later
and I was alone with the kids.

They came...

We celebrated Midsummer Night together.

We used to go for long walks in the woods.

One day, Gertrud had a sore throat
and stayed home.

Tomas and I walked together...to Djuptj�rn.

There's an old chalet there.

I ASKED him to sleep with me...
I talked him into it!

But you didn't get pregnant.

No.

How come?

After my last delivery problems,
I can't get pregnant any more.

Why did you tell me
I had to do it safely?

You made me do it safely.
Why did you lie to me?

I lied to you because

the thought of having your seed
inside my body was unbearable!

- But not his?
- No.

Not his!

Well, well...

Now I understand why you've been...

so careless with the house
this last year.

The chipped glasses...
the dirty tablecloths...

It's completely the opposite!

I had such a bad conscience, I worked
twice as hard for you and the kids.

I did everything I could...
everything I could think of.

You can accuse me of worse things...
but not of neglecting our home.

Nor for my attention...
nor for my parish work.

But you had a bad conscience.

Yes...that too.

Mostly because I loved all of you...
including you.

I wanted to hurt you
as little as possible.

What do you two talk about?

Now I'm confused.

What do you talk about?
Or do you just fornicate non-stop?

Don't talk to me like that!
It's humiliating!

Then answer me!

I don't know! He asks himself if
God will punish us!

And?

And...

I thought I could experience the joy of love
just once in my life.

Now I don't know anymore.

I begged God to punish me
instead of Tomas.

So you outbid each other...

You outbid each other
in religious eroticism.

I'm going to throw up!

Drink this.

It'll make you feel better.

Do you still need to be sick?

Do you want to come inside?

I'll sit down with you.

Lie down on the sofa.

We won't do any more talking.

Let's not make things worse.

You comfortable with the blanket
and cushion like that?

I'll just sit here quietly...

I think it's raining.

I'll shut the veranda door.

The Third Conversation

One day, eleven months after the agreement
between the spouses, Henrik suffered a breakdown,
diagnosed as "over-exertion and weak nervous system".

Henry is kept in hospital for over a year.

Convalescence brings Henrik to a rest home
in Dalarna. Anna goes with him. Her mother
takes over care of the children and the house.

After 6 weeks, Henrik and Anna
intend to return to home and work.

Anna's mother has asked for a meeting with
her daughter, at Miss Nylander's guest house, because
there's animosity between Henrik and his mother-in-law.

It's a spring afternoon in 1927.

Hello, mum.

I haven't much time.

Henrik's train gets in at 5
and I need to be at home.

What did Prof. Thorling say?

Your husband's doctor
listened very attentively.

He'd read your letter carefully...

but he didn't want to say anything
until he'd spoken to Henrik.

Wasn't there something he could say?

The professor is a skilled doctor.

You can't expect him to stay
on our case forever.

Besides, he was very positive
about one thing.

Henrik can't be admitted to hospital
against his will.

Involuntary treatment is only allowed
in very specific cases.

So something has to happen first?

He pointed out that there's no evidence
of Henrik being mentally ill.

What about the injuries?

The injuries?

Mine...the children's!

Don't those injuries count?

Come and sit down
so we can talk sensibly.

Mum...just how long am I supposed
to put up with this?

Sit down.

Things are hard now, mum.

They're hard now...since you're lying.

I've just found out that you've been
in a relationship with a young man for 2 years.

I know who it is...

I know the family.

I won't say the name.

How did you find out?

That doesn't really matter.

18 months ago you told Henrik everything.

That was when things got hard for you.

A year later he had a breakdown
because of stress.

Isn't that right?

Yes.

Are you still hanging on
to your marriage?

Yes, I'm "hanging on" to my marriage.

Henry wants to continue the marriage.

He wants to get back to his work.

He really wants to try.

Yes.

You seem to be hating
the idea of continuing...

Planning to break for good?

Yes

Does the plan include getting Henrik
declared mentally ill...being locked up...

so you can appear guilt-free
to the world?

Yes.

You used me in your plan.

You lied and got me to help you.

That was the only way out.

I shan't comment on your behaviour.

In the end, we're all responsible
for our own actions.

That's what you always say.

You...my mother...you've never loved me.

I went my own way...but according
to your directions.

When I followed your directions,
but then forgot them...

you dismissed me, and didn't
want to see me.

I loved and admired you in vain.

That's how it was then...and now.

I love you...in vain.

There she sits...my little girl...
my child.

I should reach out and touch her.
That'd be easy.

I should take her in my arms.
That'd be easy.

In just a second.

We should get really close to each other.
Her pain is my pain.

Why do I sit here motionless...

looking at her with the eyes of a stranger?

Why do I become hard...
and raise barriers?

Why can't I get close?

She went astray.

I'm petrified.

You've always gone your own way.

You've never listened.

You've turned away, shut me out.

I've been left powerless and furious.

Is it some sort of retribution?

Is there some satisfaction in this,
seeing her unhappiness?

No, no satisfaction...

...but no closeness either.

This is quite unreal...

Here in a strange room,
near a strange fireplace.

Strange feelings coming
from nowhere ...

Whereabouts am I?

What's happening to us?

With mum , with Tomas, with Henrik,
with the children...

With the children...

Whereabouts am I?

And love...shabby and defiled...
more like pain.

I'd like to be...

...thought of as indestructible.

I'm an illness without cure...

and so I weep

without tears.

I'll go back to Uppsala
on the 7 o'clock train.

You go home to Henrik
and the children.

When will you have dinner?

At six.

At six o'clock, when Henrik gets home?

So we can't keep each other for long.

I just want to discuss
some urgent basics...

...if you can give me
a few more minutes.

I've searched high and low for your
address book, without success.

Are you sure Henrik didn't take it?

I don't know.

I've called the laundry to keep the service
to the end of the month.

Ellen won't be at your place
any longer. Ellen's leaving.

I reduced the length of Evy's leave,
so now she's on her way home.

The children are happy.

But Ellen's not staying.

Partly because she's tired, partly because
her home leave has been postponed twice.

She's happy to be back with me
in the peace and quiet of Uppsala.

It's best that Evy knows what's going on
from the beginning....

...since she'll be staying with the family.

You also have Maj to help you.

She's a clever girl you can trust.

But Ellen has left.

You don't really need 3 help.

No.

Before I came here I went to
that shop on R�strand

and ordered six sandwich plates...

in the same pattern as the good ones.

They'll be delivered next week.

Thanks.

Your bill receipts are in this folder.

It's all entered in the household book

There are 3 crowns owing.

Thanks.

There are letters from Henrik to me
here, which you may read.

You were wondering how I found out.

Thanks.

Then there's the utensils...

I've left the large silver spoon
to be cleaned and repaired.

It'll be ready in a month.

If it's not done now,
it never will be.

They assured me it will
come up like new.

Anna!

Come over here.

What do you want to say?

Nothing.

Just that we must stay friends.

I'm still your friend.

Really. I'm so grateful...

...for everything you've done
during these difficult times.

It was stupid of me not to have
told you about Tomas before.

It was stupid.

Especially since I should have realised
Henrik would tell you.

It's obvious...

...since telling you has hurt us both.

It probably suited him
for many reasons.

My God, how I hate him!

I hate him....and I would love him to be dead.

He follows me like I was a wounded animal.

He says that he loves me
and would never leave me...

...that he can put up with
my being with Tomas.

At the same time he searches my drawers,
reads my letters...

...listens when I'm on the 'phone.

So he stares at me with that soppy look
that I hate...

..and speaks in that quiet voice...

He even rummages in my books.

On top of it all, he even
went through my prayer book.

He can be something from hell!

But that's not the worst.

The worst are our sleepless nights.

He comes in to me at 1 o'clock
in the morning...

After he's taken some
strong sleeping pills.

He says he's wracked with anxiety.

He lies writhing on the floor
or sits in a chair gaping...

...as though he's about to either
scream or throw up.

It's so awful...so awful that I get
the urge to laugh.

What if he's putting on an act?

If he just wants to scare me
into contrition and compassion.

I do what I can to calm him down,
...I tell him to calm down.

Sometimes he wants to lie down in my bed.

And I think...

...if this is what my life is to be...

Turn on the gas...or slash my wrists.

Then in September when
he had his breakdown...

That Sunday...

Then he wouldn't speak to me.

He refused.

I was told by the hospital
that he couldn't cope with seeing me

or speaking with me.

I was very scared...

...that he'd commit suicide
and that it would be all my fault.

I felt sick with guilt.

Then I became furious.

I put all that aside and thought
how good it would be

not to have that man
who'd been driving me crazy

since the last summer
when I told him.

Then things quietened down for a while.

I knew he was quite happy in
hospital. He had the doctors, friends...

I was starting to settle down
with the children.

Things were nice for us...
nice and quiet.

The kids were calmer too...
no more nail-biting or sleep problems.

Then the letters began.

First a few a week,
then almost every day.

At first they were just reports...
what he'd done, who'd been to see him...

what the doctors said...
how he was feeling.

Little by little, the letters
got more personal.

He began saying he wanted
to move from Stockholm

and find a place up north.

He began talking about our future.

His tone was forgiving...

...Full of tender concern
for me and children.

He missed us.

I spoke with the doctor about them.

He advised me to be
accommodating.

So I started replying to his letters.

Briefly at first, then gradually
with tender white lies.

Things went quite well.

He was open over Christmas.

He was on stronger,
more suppressing medication.

He was tired, but friendly.

We almost had a normal Christmas.

It was like being in a creepy play,
but it went alright.

The day before...

...he was due to go back to hospital...

...it all collapsed into disaster...

...a hopelessly terrible disaster.

I keep picturing that afternoon
with the children.

It was like living a nightmare.

Henrik and I and the children
had an early Sunday dinner.

Dag is sitting on Henrik's right.

He grimaces, takes his glass
of water and drinks it down...

...like Pastor Konradsen
drinks his schnapps...

...which usually gets a bit of
friendly laughter.

This time things went haywire.

He gets water down his windpipe...
coughs and drops the glass.

There are bits of glass and water
all over the table.

Henrik reacts to loud sounds.

He tells the boy sharply
to be more careful...

and clean up the mess.

The boy didn't say anything...

but picked up a spoon
and banged it down on his plate.

Henrik went crazy and told him
to leave the table.

Dag sits quietly for a moment...

Then he says very quietly...

"Fine!...then I don't have to
see my father anymore."

"That's what we'd all like."

"What do the rest of you think?"
asked Henrik...also quietly.

"Everyone thinks it's great
you're going back to hospital."

Dag goes from the table and into the library,
slamming the door hard.

There's a terrible scene.

Henrik goes after Dag...
into the library.

We sit at the table as if
we'd been turned to stone.

We hear horrible screams.

He's knocking the boy senseless
with a carpet-beater.

The screams die down and
I go into the library.

He's lying prostrate on the floor, quite still.

The boy is all bloody and battered.

Large pieces of skin...

No, I can't talk about that.

So Henrik went back to hospital.

We neither spoke nor wrote
to each other.

I suppressed my fear of the future,
and grabbed at any happiness I could.

I saw Tomas whenever I could.

That wasn't all that often...

It didn't amount to much...
it was so unreal...

or were the hours with Tomas the reality
and the other unreal?

I can't tell.

All of a sudden, Henrik wanted me
to visit him.

In March...you know all about it.

So we also went to Solg�rden.

Henry was considered "healthy".
The medication would be reduced...

...and he should resume
a normal life with me.

You know all that.

But you don't know how it went
at the convalescent home.

I couldn't reveal it as he was
checking my correspondence.

Towards the staff and the matron
he was amiable and harmonious...

...seemed healthy and happy.

It was frightening to see his duplicity...
it meant the future would be so confusing.

He can seem happy and healthy,
amiable and likeable...

and loveable.

It's so confusing.

And I remember my own duplicity
and compulsion.

Think how it'd be if I allowed myself
to have a breakdown.

If I started screaming
and throwing fits....

Why should Henrik...?

Is he...
Is he really sick?

Or is he so sick that
he'll never be well again?

Does he really think he's sick?

...or is it all just a game to
keep me under his thumb?

He'll charm the professor,
seem to be happy and healthy...

..and keen to get back to work.

That's just the way it is, mum.
There's no sign of improvement.

I try and try and the days go by.

But where does it get me?

Is there some hidden key to life
I don't know about?

Or shall I always be punished?

Shall I be forgiven? Or...

...is the punishment eternal?

Shall the children be punished for MY crime?

Or shall MY punishment be
the children's suffering?

I am just so far out
in the darkness.

If there is a God, I find myself
at an infinite distance from that God.

So...

Therefore I shall go on seeing Tomas.

I can see that he's frightened.

He fell in love with a good-natured,
motherly woman...

...Who listened to his thoughts
and his music.

He was so trusting and guileless.

It's almost comical...the ageing
lustful woman clinging fast.

He wants to get rid of me,
but doesn't dare to look me in the eye.

He doesn't dare get rid of me
even though I beg him...

"Please Tomas, let me go...leave me!"

"I don't want to ruin your life."

That's what I say...

but it's all lies.

I'm not honest with him either.

I want to shout every banality...

Don't leave me....I'll give up everything.

Everything...the children, my home...

...just take me with you...
just let me be with YOU.

That's the truth.

But it's not the whole truth...

because I'm so ridiculously critical.

Tomas is a nice boy...

full of joy, warmth and emotion...

But he gets sentimental, saying silly things
I have to pretend not to hear...

So I think "How could he and I ever..."

It would never work out.

He really is a bit...

He's not always truthful...
and I can always tell when.

But I don't want to embarrass him...
so the game goes on.

Sometimes I wonder...

I wonder...if I am real...

Right now.

At this very moment.

As if truth itself goes numb
and disappears...

Not to be spoken about.

I'm so confused, mum.

I talk and talk...

But mostly I'm just tired and frightened.

Telephone...in the hall.

I left the number with Evy.

I won't be a minute.

Hello, yes, it's me.

Shall I call for a taxi?

No, thanks anyway,
but it's not necessary.

Henrik's come home earlier
than I was expecting.

You've only been in town...

Go home and act surprised.

You'll have to come with me.

No, I wouldn't like that.

I've no desire to see Henrik.

It wasn't anything.

What should I do?

Go right now, Anna.

My little girl...
watch out for yourself.

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