1 00:00:06,867 --> 00:00:09,700 It's been four hours since David Koresh and his followers 2 00:00:09,833 --> 00:00:12,267 have refused to release themselves to the FBI 3 00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:15,100 following a bloody shootout with ATF. 4 00:00:15,233 --> 00:00:17,100 Now, details are scarce, but the question 5 00:00:17,233 --> 00:00:22,933 everyone seems to be asking, "Just when will they come out?" 6 00:00:23,067 --> 00:00:26,733 The federal agents came under heavy and sustained fire 7 00:00:26,867 --> 00:00:28,933 as they approached a ranch owned by... 8 00:00:29,067 --> 00:00:31,800 They're making us look like monsters. 9 00:00:31,933 --> 00:00:33,800 Calling us child abusers. 10 00:00:34,567 --> 00:00:37,500 Everyone's in the chapel wondering why we're not going out. 11 00:00:38,267 --> 00:00:39,800 I need you to talk to 'em. 12 00:00:39,933 --> 00:00:41,267 ...believed to have been collected 13 00:00:41,400 --> 00:00:43,233 by Branch Davidian cult members. 14 00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:49,900 Negotiations failed, Noesner. They reneged on their deal. 15 00:00:50,667 --> 00:00:53,133 Let me handle this. I can have the building cleared by lunch. 16 00:00:53,267 --> 00:00:55,967 Look. This isn't the first time in the history of negotiations 17 00:00:56,100 --> 00:00:58,900 that someone reneged on a deal, okay? 18 00:00:59,033 --> 00:01:02,200 Our primary objective has to be getting those kids out safely. 19 00:01:02,333 --> 00:01:03,700 Clearing the building comes second. 20 00:01:03,833 --> 00:01:05,167 They're screwing with us. 21 00:01:05,300 --> 00:01:07,367 Now's the time to apply more pressure. 22 00:01:07,500 --> 00:01:10,833 No, no, no. Let's not mistake getting even for getting what we want. 23 00:01:14,833 --> 00:01:16,800 "Trickle-flow-gush." That's my next strategy. 24 00:01:16,933 --> 00:01:20,533 If I can get a few people to trickle out, more will follow as it starts to flow 25 00:01:20,667 --> 00:01:23,767 and once Koresh sees enough people leave, he won't be the last in line. 26 00:01:24,667 --> 00:01:27,933 It would undermine his authority. He'll lead the rest of them out himself, 27 00:01:28,067 --> 00:01:30,300 and the whole thing will be over. 28 00:01:31,400 --> 00:01:33,367 I just need a little time. 29 00:01:33,500 --> 00:01:36,133 Okay. 30 00:01:38,167 --> 00:01:39,500 But... 31 00:01:40,533 --> 00:01:44,767 a little show of force might help get their attention. 32 00:01:45,733 --> 00:01:47,200 Okay. 33 00:01:47,967 --> 00:01:49,067 Over the years... 34 00:01:50,433 --> 00:01:52,633 you've looked to me to be your leader. 35 00:01:53,967 --> 00:01:56,233 To guide you on this journey. 36 00:01:57,367 --> 00:01:59,333 But I'm no leader. 37 00:01:59,467 --> 00:02:02,167 I'm a follower. Just like you. 38 00:02:04,067 --> 00:02:06,367 God has instructed me to stay here. 39 00:02:07,867 --> 00:02:10,367 And wait for His sign before I go out there. 40 00:02:12,300 --> 00:02:13,833 But I can't ask you to do the same. 41 00:02:15,867 --> 00:02:20,067 And whoever wants to leave, you're free to go. 42 00:02:20,133 --> 00:02:22,800 But those of thinking of going, 43 00:02:23,833 --> 00:02:25,767 I want you to ask yourself... 44 00:02:27,133 --> 00:02:30,600 why did you sacrifice all the comforts you had 45 00:02:30,733 --> 00:02:32,167 to come here? 46 00:02:33,233 --> 00:02:35,867 Know it or not, you came here to be tested. 47 00:02:37,433 --> 00:02:39,067 And this is a test. 48 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:43,300 This is our withering. 49 00:02:45,700 --> 00:02:48,133 Our time to prove through suffering... 50 00:02:48,900 --> 00:02:52,167 that we are worthy of the miracle that's to come. 51 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:02,267 The kingdom of heaven is coming. 52 00:03:04,233 --> 00:03:07,600 And those of us that pass this test 53 00:03:07,733 --> 00:03:09,833 will be the worthy. 54 00:03:11,433 --> 00:03:14,133 And those of us that fail this test... 55 00:03:16,533 --> 00:03:19,967 well... you're gonna have to answer to God. 56 00:03:20,900 --> 00:03:24,100 And I can't-- 57 00:03:24,867 --> 00:03:26,433 David! 58 00:04:07,067 --> 00:04:08,467 You're burning up. 59 00:04:10,967 --> 00:04:13,200 Uh, I'll get him some water. 60 00:04:46,833 --> 00:04:48,533 Which one's my dad? 61 00:05:03,367 --> 00:05:06,367 Hey. You probably shouldn't be in here. 62 00:05:06,500 --> 00:05:09,267 You know that old myrtle tree outside? 63 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:11,067 -The one out front? -Yeah. 64 00:05:11,200 --> 00:05:12,600 Mm-hmm. 65 00:05:15,133 --> 00:05:17,467 My dad and I planted it when I was five. 66 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:22,367 He loved that old tree. 67 00:05:24,567 --> 00:05:27,200 He always wanted to be buried next to it. 68 00:05:29,933 --> 00:05:31,633 And now, look. 69 00:05:31,767 --> 00:05:35,967 Instead, he's getting buried with buckets and shovels like... 70 00:05:36,100 --> 00:05:38,467 -like a piece of garbage. -Hey. 71 00:05:39,933 --> 00:05:42,100 Hey. 72 00:06:17,967 --> 00:06:20,133 Get back. Get back. 73 00:06:21,433 --> 00:06:23,967 You promised to stay off our land. 74 00:06:24,100 --> 00:06:26,467 Well, David made a promise, too. 75 00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:29,633 He gave us his word, after his message was played, he'd come out. 76 00:06:29,767 --> 00:06:33,667 He didn't come out. He-- he broke his promise. 77 00:06:34,933 --> 00:06:36,300 Could you put him on the phone? 78 00:06:36,433 --> 00:06:37,867 No. He doesn't want to talk to you right now. 79 00:06:38,633 --> 00:06:40,533 Look, Steve, my bosses are frustrated. 80 00:06:40,667 --> 00:06:42,600 They don't understand why you didn't come out. 81 00:06:42,733 --> 00:06:45,633 Look, I'm embarrassed about that, on a personal level. 82 00:06:45,767 --> 00:06:49,967 We were gonna come out, but... God told David that we needed to wait. 83 00:06:50,100 --> 00:06:53,233 -God told him? -Yeah, just like you guys 84 00:06:53,367 --> 00:06:56,900 follow a higher authority, we do too. 85 00:06:57,767 --> 00:06:59,100 Okay. So, what now? 86 00:07:00,233 --> 00:07:05,433 So, now, we wait for a sign from God to tell us to come out. 87 00:07:09,833 --> 00:07:11,533 Look... 88 00:07:12,433 --> 00:07:16,433 I know this all probably sounds funny to ya. 89 00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:19,067 But... 90 00:07:19,133 --> 00:07:22,767 what if there is a higher power than you or I, Gary? 91 00:07:23,867 --> 00:07:27,967 And that higher power, He speaks to David? 92 00:07:29,233 --> 00:07:31,533 If there is a God in this universe, 93 00:07:31,667 --> 00:07:34,500 and you've got the laws of man and the laws of God, 94 00:07:34,633 --> 00:07:38,600 and that God that has led David his entire life 95 00:07:38,733 --> 00:07:41,233 says to him, "Wait." 96 00:07:42,533 --> 00:07:44,500 I mean, what is he supposed to do? 97 00:07:44,633 --> 00:07:46,267 Well, I have to be honest with you, Steve. 98 00:07:46,400 --> 00:07:48,433 I don't know how my bosses are gonna respond 99 00:07:48,567 --> 00:07:51,433 when I tell them we're waiting for a sign from God. 100 00:07:53,067 --> 00:07:56,067 You know, what I could really use is a sign of good faith. 101 00:07:57,433 --> 00:07:59,300 If David could send some of the people out. 102 00:07:59,433 --> 00:08:04,133 What, do you think we're hostages here? No one is a hostage here, Gary. 103 00:08:04,267 --> 00:08:07,667 Everyone is free to come and go as they please. 104 00:08:08,700 --> 00:08:10,367 Then why isn't anyone coming out? 105 00:08:10,500 --> 00:08:13,133 Because, right now, everyone feels safer in here 106 00:08:13,267 --> 00:08:15,333 than they do out there with you. 107 00:08:15,467 --> 00:08:18,233 And because once you get into this building, 108 00:08:18,367 --> 00:08:21,133 you're going to be able to mess with the evidence in any way that you want. 109 00:08:21,267 --> 00:08:23,800 And you can make up any story that you want, 110 00:08:23,933 --> 00:08:25,467 but if this building stands, 111 00:08:25,600 --> 00:08:28,200 and the reporters and the press get to see the evidence, 112 00:08:28,333 --> 00:08:32,300 then it is going to be clearly shown what happened here, what these men-- 113 00:08:32,433 --> 00:08:35,200 what your men came in here to do. 114 00:08:37,067 --> 00:08:39,833 -You want us to come out? -David, listen. You've gotta-- 115 00:08:39,967 --> 00:08:42,467 Then why are you bringing these tanks in here? 116 00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:45,933 Do you know what that tells me? 117 00:08:46,067 --> 00:08:47,633 That this is war. 118 00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:52,700 Why are you sending all these people in here, guns a-blazing? 119 00:08:52,833 --> 00:08:54,467 For war, Gary. 120 00:08:55,367 --> 00:08:57,333 And now, these tanks? 121 00:08:57,467 --> 00:08:59,367 And these guys surrounding us? 122 00:09:01,067 --> 00:09:06,300 You say you want us to come out, but it sure doesn't look like that to us. 123 00:09:07,767 --> 00:09:09,400 David, I-- 124 00:09:29,233 --> 00:09:30,867 "Personal level." 125 00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:33,867 "On a personal level." 126 00:09:34,933 --> 00:09:36,800 What'd we just learn from this conversation? 127 00:09:36,933 --> 00:09:39,400 That they'll do whatever this Koresh guy tells 'em. 128 00:09:39,533 --> 00:09:41,333 No, we already knew that. 129 00:09:42,100 --> 00:09:45,267 But Steve said that he was embarrassed about that "on a personal level." 130 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:47,300 He's separating himself from Koresh. 131 00:09:48,067 --> 00:09:49,733 -Saying he doesn't agree. -Huh. 132 00:09:50,500 --> 00:09:52,633 What can you tell me about this Steve Schneider? 133 00:09:52,767 --> 00:09:56,300 Uh, well, he was a professor of theology at the University of Hawaii. 134 00:09:56,433 --> 00:09:58,800 -Uh-huh. -He's originally from Wisconsin. 135 00:09:58,933 --> 00:10:01,200 He and his wife joined the group six years ago. 136 00:10:01,333 --> 00:10:04,400 He's their star recruiter. The group has nearly doubled since he joined. 137 00:10:04,533 --> 00:10:06,700 -Really? -Our informant says 138 00:10:06,833 --> 00:10:09,000 that he's the glue that keeps this place together. 139 00:10:09,133 --> 00:10:10,600 And get this. 140 00:10:10,733 --> 00:10:12,433 His wife, Judy, 141 00:10:12,567 --> 00:10:14,567 recently had a baby with Koresh. 142 00:10:14,700 --> 00:10:18,567 That can't be good for the relationship. 143 00:10:18,700 --> 00:10:19,700 Yeah. 144 00:10:22,833 --> 00:10:24,600 If Steve brought most of these people in, 145 00:10:24,733 --> 00:10:27,400 I would guess he feels responsible for their well-being. 146 00:10:27,533 --> 00:10:31,633 Right? Let's focus all our attention on him. 147 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:35,367 If we can break Steve away, this whole thing ends. 148 00:10:40,233 --> 00:10:42,633 David...? 149 00:10:43,433 --> 00:10:45,433 Can you hear me? 150 00:10:46,600 --> 00:10:48,700 I'd like to send some people out. 151 00:10:49,467 --> 00:10:51,867 Jaydean's kids are without a mother, 152 00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:56,867 and Margaret and Catherine, they're just-- 153 00:10:57,000 --> 00:10:58,400 they're just too old for this. 154 00:10:58,533 --> 00:11:00,567 We are running low on food. 155 00:11:01,367 --> 00:11:03,333 And our water supply is real bad. 156 00:11:05,367 --> 00:11:07,667 The less mouths to feed, the better. 157 00:11:13,467 --> 00:11:15,733 -Well, that's getting worse. -Yeah. 158 00:11:16,700 --> 00:11:17,700 Let me see. 159 00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:19,833 It hurts real bad. 160 00:11:20,800 --> 00:11:22,233 Ooh-whee. 161 00:11:23,500 --> 00:11:25,200 -Hey. -Hmm? 162 00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:29,800 -I'm thinking you should go. -Well, is David going? 163 00:11:30,833 --> 00:11:32,500 No. 164 00:11:34,633 --> 00:11:37,067 -Then I'm not going. -Look at your finger. 165 00:11:37,167 --> 00:11:41,600 If that infection spreads, you-- I mean, you could lose your hand. 166 00:11:41,733 --> 00:11:43,633 -I know. -You could lose your life. 167 00:11:43,767 --> 00:11:46,867 It hurts so bad, I can't sleep. 168 00:11:49,233 --> 00:11:50,400 Cut it off. 169 00:11:51,267 --> 00:11:52,267 What? 170 00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:53,333 I'm gonna lose it anyway, Steve. 171 00:11:53,467 --> 00:11:54,867 -Cut it off. -No! 172 00:11:55,900 --> 00:11:58,267 Has everyone around here lost their minds? 173 00:11:59,067 --> 00:12:01,867 Nobody's cutting your finger off! And I'm sending you outside 174 00:12:02,067 --> 00:12:03,633 -to get medical attention. -No, you're not! 175 00:12:03,767 --> 00:12:05,667 -Yes I am-- -No, you are not! 176 00:12:11,900 --> 00:12:14,833 I just got off the phone. They're sending four people out. 177 00:12:14,967 --> 00:12:18,067 -Two of 'em, kids. -That's a start. 178 00:12:18,167 --> 00:12:20,233 Four people seems hardly cause for celebration. 179 00:12:20,367 --> 00:12:23,900 Well, they're starting to trickle out. The strategy's working. 180 00:12:25,867 --> 00:12:28,300 Now, you think you can help me coordinate bringing 'em out? 181 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:32,500 Yeah, sure. 182 00:13:02,067 --> 00:13:05,400 Mama. 183 00:13:05,533 --> 00:13:07,533 Mama. Ma... 184 00:13:19,133 --> 00:13:20,567 Hey, there. 185 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:25,367 I'm Gary. What's your name? 186 00:13:27,300 --> 00:13:29,233 -Leona. -Leona? 187 00:13:29,367 --> 00:13:31,367 Such a pretty name. 188 00:13:33,333 --> 00:13:36,567 Hey, why don't we call your mom and tell her you're okay? 189 00:13:39,267 --> 00:13:42,667 -We can't call her. -Why not? 190 00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:45,533 Because you killed her. 191 00:14:02,533 --> 00:14:04,833 -Hey, Steve? -Yep? 192 00:14:06,233 --> 00:14:08,833 I was wondering if you could talk to the FBI about Perry. 193 00:14:08,967 --> 00:14:11,433 See if they'll let us bury his body outside. 194 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:14,700 I asked you to bury his body in the storm shelter. 195 00:14:14,833 --> 00:14:16,867 -I know. It's just-- Michelle. -Mm-hmm. 196 00:14:17,633 --> 00:14:20,567 I know it would mean a lot to her if we could bury him by the myrtle tree-- 197 00:14:20,700 --> 00:14:22,867 It's impossible. It's not gonna happen. 198 00:14:23,667 --> 00:14:25,967 Could you just ask? Please? 199 00:14:27,333 --> 00:14:29,233 I can try. 200 00:14:30,100 --> 00:14:32,200 All right, today, we got something a little different for y'all. 201 00:14:32,333 --> 00:14:35,600 Our guest today is a Dr. James Tabor, professor of-- what was it? 202 00:14:35,733 --> 00:14:38,067 I specialize in emergent religions. 203 00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:39,867 Emergent religions. 204 00:14:40,067 --> 00:14:43,433 Let's talk about your interest in this Branch Davidian cult. 205 00:14:43,567 --> 00:14:45,833 Yeah, I'm gonna stop you right there, Ron. 206 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:49,600 I would propose that there's no such thing as a cult. 207 00:14:49,733 --> 00:14:52,733 "Cult" is a judgment word used to talk about somebody else's 208 00:14:52,867 --> 00:14:54,667 tightly-knit religious group. 209 00:14:54,800 --> 00:14:57,833 Nobody in the world belongs to what they see as a cult. 210 00:14:57,967 --> 00:15:00,767 Yeah, but there are certain traits you think of 211 00:15:00,900 --> 00:15:03,500 - when you think of a cult. - That's true. 212 00:15:03,633 --> 00:15:07,800 The early Christians, by our definition, belonged to a cult. 213 00:15:07,933 --> 00:15:10,500 So you're saying Jesus was a cult leader? 214 00:15:11,267 --> 00:15:13,100 I wasn't saying it exactly like that, 215 00:15:13,233 --> 00:15:17,767 but by the common definition of "cult," yes. 216 00:15:17,900 --> 00:15:21,767 Oh, that got the phones ringing. You done it now, Dr. Tabor. 217 00:15:23,167 --> 00:15:27,633 Excuse me. My son is in Mt. Carmel, and I need to talk to him. 218 00:15:28,633 --> 00:15:30,500 How did you get past the barricade? 219 00:15:30,633 --> 00:15:34,233 Listen, I am not altogether sure how he got mixed up in all this mess, 220 00:15:34,367 --> 00:15:36,933 but I know if I could talk to him, if I could just speak to him, 221 00:15:37,067 --> 00:15:39,200 that I could get him to come out. 222 00:15:39,967 --> 00:15:41,467 I'm sorry, I can't let you do that. 223 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:43,133 -Why not? -Because I don't wanna give him 224 00:15:43,267 --> 00:15:46,400 or anyone in there the chance to tie up loose ends. 225 00:15:48,133 --> 00:15:50,567 You think that they're gonna kill themselves? 226 00:15:51,367 --> 00:15:52,600 Doesn't matter what I think. 227 00:15:53,367 --> 00:15:56,067 But I'm not gonna give them a chance to say goodbye either way. 228 00:15:56,200 --> 00:15:57,900 Please escort her back behind the checkpoint. 229 00:15:58,067 --> 00:16:00,067 I just wanna know if he's all right. 230 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:01,533 His name is David Thibodeau. 231 00:16:01,667 --> 00:16:03,433 The news reports aren't releasing any names. 232 00:16:03,567 --> 00:16:06,667 I'm sorry, ma'am. I don't have any more information at this time. 233 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:10,700 I just need to know if he's alive! Please! 234 00:16:14,267 --> 00:16:16,233 David, your fever's not breaking. 235 00:16:16,367 --> 00:16:19,467 I'm afraid you're going to die if we don't get you help. 236 00:16:24,067 --> 00:16:25,867 It's all part of God's plan. 237 00:16:26,067 --> 00:16:29,067 No. I just lost my father. I'm not gonna lose you, too. 238 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:37,900 - Hello? - Hello. Who's this? 239 00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:42,733 -Cyrus. -David's son. 240 00:16:42,867 --> 00:16:44,733 -Yeah. -Well, hello, Cyrus. 241 00:16:44,867 --> 00:16:46,900 Can you put your dad on the phone? 242 00:16:48,733 --> 00:16:50,967 Are you gonna kill me? 243 00:16:51,733 --> 00:16:55,833 No. No one's going to kill you. 244 00:16:56,600 --> 00:16:57,833 Cyrus? 245 00:16:58,633 --> 00:17:00,067 Thanks, buddy. 246 00:17:01,433 --> 00:17:03,067 Come here. 247 00:17:04,067 --> 00:17:05,267 Hello, this is Steve Schneider. 248 00:17:06,600 --> 00:17:09,233 Oh, hey, Steve. Just wanted to give you a quick call 249 00:17:09,367 --> 00:17:11,733 and let you know that everybody arrived safe. 250 00:17:11,867 --> 00:17:15,267 Good. Well, I hope that shows you what we're about. 251 00:17:16,067 --> 00:17:18,067 We wanna see this resolved peacefully. 252 00:17:18,133 --> 00:17:22,067 Of course. I can tell you're the voice of reason in there. 253 00:17:22,133 --> 00:17:25,567 I bet people count on you to make sure they're taken care of. 254 00:17:25,700 --> 00:17:27,700 I'm not sure that's true. 255 00:17:27,833 --> 00:17:31,400 Well, from what I hear, you're the reason the group's grown like it has. 256 00:17:31,533 --> 00:17:34,900 The reason that the group has grown is because of David's teaching, 257 00:17:35,067 --> 00:17:36,533 not because of anything I'm doing. 258 00:17:36,667 --> 00:17:38,067 I think you're being modest. 259 00:17:39,633 --> 00:17:41,533 Knowing everything you know now... 260 00:17:42,300 --> 00:17:45,467 are you happy you brought all those people in there? 261 00:17:46,233 --> 00:17:48,233 I'm not sure what you're driving at, Gary. 262 00:17:48,367 --> 00:17:52,733 Well, do you think David has everyone's best interest in mind? 263 00:17:57,633 --> 00:17:59,767 Yeah. I do. 264 00:17:59,900 --> 00:18:02,233 Because, forgive me for saying this, 265 00:18:02,367 --> 00:18:05,500 but I can't help but notice a trend that when God comes to talk 266 00:18:05,633 --> 00:18:07,667 to modern-day prophets, 267 00:18:08,433 --> 00:18:10,633 it seems one thing He always tells them to do 268 00:18:10,767 --> 00:18:13,367 is have sex with lots of young women. 269 00:18:14,300 --> 00:18:17,333 Well, that's a pretty cynical view of what we're doing here. 270 00:18:17,467 --> 00:18:19,967 I'm not sure I appreciate your tone with that one. 271 00:18:20,100 --> 00:18:23,333 -Then explain it to me. -I'm not stupid. 272 00:18:23,467 --> 00:18:27,167 I know you're trying to create dissent between me and David. 273 00:18:27,933 --> 00:18:30,133 You're right, I am. 'Cause you know what I think? 274 00:18:31,067 --> 00:18:33,300 I think David's dying, 275 00:18:33,433 --> 00:18:35,633 and I think he doesn't mind bringing all of you with him. 276 00:18:35,767 --> 00:18:37,700 You know, Gary, where you've got this all wrong, 277 00:18:37,833 --> 00:18:39,600 the thing that you're missing... 278 00:18:39,733 --> 00:18:41,300 is this is real. 279 00:18:41,433 --> 00:18:43,900 I do believe that David is the Lamb of God. 280 00:18:44,067 --> 00:18:46,067 Not because of any trick he's pulled, 281 00:18:46,200 --> 00:18:50,067 but because of what I have seen with my own two eyes. 282 00:18:50,167 --> 00:18:55,367 But he's lost his way, Steve. I think you can see it. 283 00:18:56,533 --> 00:19:01,467 For years, David has been prophesying exactly what is happening here. 284 00:19:01,600 --> 00:19:04,567 From the way you came in, to the tanks, the soldiers, everything. 285 00:19:04,700 --> 00:19:07,500 I can't figure out another explanation that makes any sense. 286 00:19:08,267 --> 00:19:11,800 For a minor weapons violation? All this? 287 00:19:11,933 --> 00:19:13,900 You think he's lost his way? 288 00:19:14,067 --> 00:19:18,233 Everything David has prophesied has come true. 289 00:19:32,300 --> 00:19:34,600 Hey, guys, stay away from the window. 290 00:19:34,733 --> 00:19:36,633 It's not safe. 291 00:19:42,633 --> 00:19:44,533 Why are they doing that? 292 00:19:44,667 --> 00:19:46,167 I don't know. 293 00:19:46,300 --> 00:19:48,200 Come on. Let's go. 294 00:19:49,233 --> 00:19:52,133 What's going on? 295 00:19:56,333 --> 00:19:58,433 What goes through people's heads, you know? 296 00:19:58,567 --> 00:20:01,767 I mean, these HRT guys, what makes grown men act like that? 297 00:20:01,900 --> 00:20:04,767 They're mooning kids, for God's sake. 298 00:20:04,900 --> 00:20:06,633 They're just built that way. 299 00:20:07,467 --> 00:20:10,767 The sad thing is, the Davidians can't tell us apart from them. 300 00:20:15,133 --> 00:20:17,133 I need you to get me a video camera. 301 00:20:18,867 --> 00:20:20,900 Ready? How's my hair? 302 00:20:21,033 --> 00:20:22,633 It's about as good as it's gonna get. 303 00:20:22,767 --> 00:20:24,567 Knock it off. 304 00:20:24,700 --> 00:20:26,233 All right. We're good. 305 00:20:27,633 --> 00:20:30,733 Hello. I'm Gary Noesner. 306 00:20:31,567 --> 00:20:33,267 The notorious. 307 00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:35,800 And... 308 00:20:35,933 --> 00:20:37,367 this is my family. 309 00:20:38,867 --> 00:20:40,533 Yeah, that's my wife, Carol, there, 310 00:20:40,667 --> 00:20:45,633 and my kids, Kelly, Katy, and Rusty, and I love 'em. 311 00:20:45,767 --> 00:20:48,300 I'm sure you love your kids the same way. 312 00:20:48,433 --> 00:20:52,033 And there is literally nothing I wouldn't do to keep my children safe. 313 00:20:53,533 --> 00:20:55,600 I'm sure we share that feeling. 314 00:20:57,733 --> 00:21:00,133 Now, any way you look at it, this is a bad situation, 315 00:21:00,267 --> 00:21:05,067 but I wanna make sure that your kids remain safe through it all. 316 00:21:05,933 --> 00:21:08,067 So, please... 317 00:21:08,967 --> 00:21:10,833 please work with me. 318 00:21:11,633 --> 00:21:12,800 Help me keep your kids safe. 319 00:21:19,333 --> 00:21:20,433 Rachel? 320 00:21:24,933 --> 00:21:27,300 Hey, I got a weird question. 321 00:21:27,433 --> 00:21:28,733 Y'know, I... 322 00:21:30,700 --> 00:21:34,067 Uh... I'm not producing any milk. 323 00:21:35,367 --> 00:21:39,067 And... I was wondering if you had some to spare for Mayanah. 324 00:21:39,167 --> 00:21:42,900 I'm having the same problem. All the mothers are. 325 00:21:43,700 --> 00:21:47,133 -You are? -Yeah. Sorry. 326 00:21:47,267 --> 00:21:50,633 Oh, God. 327 00:21:50,767 --> 00:21:52,767 All right. 328 00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:57,067 Shh, shh, shh... 329 00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:02,967 This universe is mine. 330 00:22:03,100 --> 00:22:04,267 I can't believe Koresh likes this. 331 00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:06,067 I am God here! 332 00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:08,800 Jesus. 333 00:22:09,867 --> 00:22:11,933 -I don't get this movie. -Mm. 334 00:22:12,067 --> 00:22:14,333 I can't say it makes my top 10 list either. 335 00:22:14,467 --> 00:22:16,933 You're wrong. You need to be led-- 336 00:22:17,067 --> 00:22:18,100 Ready? 337 00:22:18,233 --> 00:22:20,167 Yeah. 338 00:22:20,933 --> 00:22:23,100 -Hello? -Hey, Gary, it's Steve. 339 00:22:23,233 --> 00:22:27,067 Um, we just wanted to say thanks for sending the videotape. 340 00:22:27,167 --> 00:22:28,633 We understand what you're trying to do, 341 00:22:28,767 --> 00:22:31,267 and we really appreciate you making that effort. 342 00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:33,900 I just wanted you to know that there's some people out here 343 00:22:34,067 --> 00:22:36,133 who care about what happens to you, that's all. 344 00:22:36,267 --> 00:22:38,067 Yeah. Um... 345 00:22:38,200 --> 00:22:41,233 I do have one small problem, 346 00:22:41,367 --> 00:22:44,067 and I could really use your help. 347 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:46,233 - What kinda problem? - So... 348 00:22:46,367 --> 00:22:48,400 I guess because of the stress of all this, 349 00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:54,300 the mothers who are nursing have... have stopped lactating. 350 00:22:54,433 --> 00:22:57,867 So... we need milk. 351 00:22:58,067 --> 00:23:00,833 For the babies. Could you send some in? 352 00:23:01,600 --> 00:23:05,067 -Let me talk to my bosses. -Okay. Thanks, Gary. 353 00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:06,500 You bet. 354 00:23:09,733 --> 00:23:13,433 No, I'm not throwing them a picnic on national TV. 355 00:23:13,567 --> 00:23:15,867 They want milk, they can come out and get it. 356 00:23:16,067 --> 00:23:20,467 Look. Usually the people I negotiate with are backed into a corner. 357 00:23:20,600 --> 00:23:23,933 They need something. And that's what gives me leverage. 358 00:23:24,067 --> 00:23:27,600 But these people, they just want us to go away. 359 00:23:27,733 --> 00:23:30,433 The only way I've been able to motivate them is with goodwill. 360 00:23:30,567 --> 00:23:34,233 But now, their babies need milk, and we can give it to them. 361 00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:38,333 This is something we can build on. We can use this. 362 00:23:39,900 --> 00:23:42,800 So, Steve, I talked to my bosses, 363 00:23:42,933 --> 00:23:44,433 and they're gonna give you the milk. 364 00:23:44,567 --> 00:23:46,367 Aw, Gary. 365 00:23:46,500 --> 00:23:48,900 Thank you. I really appreciate that. 366 00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:53,333 But there's one condition. You're gonna have to send some kids out. 367 00:23:56,067 --> 00:24:00,233 Wait. Um... let me just make sure I'm hearing you correctly. 368 00:24:01,067 --> 00:24:03,433 Um, you want us to trade... 369 00:24:04,733 --> 00:24:05,900 our kids for the milk? 370 00:24:06,667 --> 00:24:08,833 I wouldn't really put it like that. I'm just saying that-- 371 00:24:08,967 --> 00:24:11,533 Look, I don't wanna point out the obvious, but if we send out our kids, 372 00:24:11,667 --> 00:24:13,167 then we won't need the milk, will we? 373 00:24:13,300 --> 00:24:14,200 Steve? 374 00:24:14,333 --> 00:24:16,867 -Yeah? -May I? 375 00:24:17,900 --> 00:24:20,333 Um, yeah. David wants to talk to you. 376 00:24:21,100 --> 00:24:22,900 Yeah, how much milk we talking here, Gary? 377 00:24:23,067 --> 00:24:24,633 -David-- -Two quarts per kid? Three? 378 00:24:24,767 --> 00:24:27,667 I mean, some kids gotta be worth more than others. 379 00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:32,400 Cyrus, my son, he's eight, but he can fix any car engine you put in front of him. 380 00:24:32,533 --> 00:24:36,233 That's gotta be worth, what, at least three quarts and a milkshake? 381 00:24:37,067 --> 00:24:38,167 You people. 382 00:24:42,700 --> 00:24:44,700 You shouldn't have done that. 383 00:24:44,833 --> 00:24:46,333 You know we have to work with them. 384 00:24:47,467 --> 00:24:48,333 Yeah, well... 385 00:24:48,467 --> 00:24:50,867 good luck with that, Steve. 386 00:25:08,567 --> 00:25:12,267 Rachel? This is how I'd like to ration out the food and water. 387 00:25:13,067 --> 00:25:14,267 Can you take care of that? 388 00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:16,300 No one's gonna be happy with this. 389 00:25:16,433 --> 00:25:19,100 Well, if they don't like it, they're welcome to leave. 390 00:25:20,767 --> 00:25:23,967 Steve. Steve, did you get any news about the milk? 391 00:25:24,100 --> 00:25:28,500 Yeah. I'm-- I'm-- I'm working on it. I promise. 392 00:25:28,633 --> 00:25:30,433 Hey, Steve, have you had a chance to talk to the FBI about Perry? 393 00:25:30,567 --> 00:25:34,267 Look, Thibs, just bury the body like I asked you. Okay? 394 00:25:40,133 --> 00:25:42,067 - You get bacon on yours? - Yeah. 395 00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:45,933 Oh. I shoulda gotten bacon on mine. 396 00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:50,867 You know, that's how we stopped the Clarksville prison riot. 397 00:25:51,067 --> 00:25:52,833 -With bacon? -Oh, yeah. 398 00:25:53,900 --> 00:25:57,067 It was after day eight, and we took a bunch of bacon 399 00:25:57,200 --> 00:25:59,367 and threw it on some coals. 400 00:25:59,500 --> 00:26:02,467 The prisoners smelled it and were instantly overcome with hunger. 401 00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:05,767 And I told them, if they came out, they could eat as much as them want. 402 00:26:07,100 --> 00:26:10,467 Never underestimate what a hungry man will do for bacon. 403 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:12,333 Shame the Davidians don't eat pork. 404 00:26:12,467 --> 00:26:14,067 It is. 405 00:26:16,267 --> 00:26:18,267 We've got movement outside the compound. 406 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:20,200 - All agents to their posts. -Shit. 407 00:26:20,333 --> 00:26:22,067 Prepare to fire on command. 408 00:26:25,300 --> 00:26:27,233 -It's Steve. -Steve! What's going on? 409 00:26:27,367 --> 00:26:29,533 Tactical says someone exited the compound. 410 00:26:30,500 --> 00:26:31,433 Shit! 411 00:26:37,833 --> 00:26:39,733 It's Thibodeau. He's unarmed! 412 00:26:39,867 --> 00:26:42,567 He's just trying to bury a body. Please don't shoot him! 413 00:26:42,700 --> 00:26:43,800 Okay, hang on, Steve. 414 00:26:43,933 --> 00:26:45,767 -Where's Decker? -I don't know. 415 00:26:47,100 --> 00:26:49,467 Copy sniper one, sniper one, you got the loop. 416 00:26:55,433 --> 00:26:58,233 - Steve! - Get out of my way! 417 00:26:59,467 --> 00:27:01,733 Thibs! You gotta get back in here! 418 00:27:09,367 --> 00:27:10,867 Tell your man to stand down! 419 00:27:11,067 --> 00:27:13,333 This is a tactical decision. It's not your call, Gary. 420 00:27:13,467 --> 00:27:15,367 No, no. He's just trying to bury a body. 421 00:27:15,500 --> 00:27:17,200 And I'm telling you, you don't know what he's burying. 422 00:27:17,333 --> 00:27:18,667 That could be a bomb, for all we know. 423 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:20,433 Damn it, I'm telling you, the kid's unarmed. 424 00:27:20,567 --> 00:27:22,067 And I'm telling you, you don't know that, Gary. 425 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:24,500 Now, I can't have people strolling outside, 426 00:27:24,633 --> 00:27:26,833 walking around, looking at our positions on things. 427 00:27:26,967 --> 00:27:29,133 The kid is trying to bury one of his dead, Mitch. 428 00:27:29,267 --> 00:27:33,300 They let the ATF take their wounded away. Show 'em the same respect. 429 00:27:33,433 --> 00:27:36,900 They lost my respect when they started killing federal agents, Gary. 430 00:27:37,067 --> 00:27:39,333 All right, all right. You want another Ruby Ridge on your hands? 431 00:27:39,467 --> 00:27:41,167 -Yeah. -Go ahead, shoot that boy. 432 00:27:41,300 --> 00:27:42,833 But just remember, the ATF's not gonna be around 433 00:27:42,967 --> 00:27:45,200 -to take the blame this time! -I don't give a shit! 434 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:51,733 Requesting permission to take the shot. Over. 435 00:27:53,100 --> 00:27:55,400 I have the target in my view. 436 00:27:59,067 --> 00:28:03,467 Repeat, requesting permission to take the shot. Over. 437 00:28:09,267 --> 00:28:10,600 Stand down. 438 00:28:34,833 --> 00:28:36,300 Thank you. Good morning, everyone. 439 00:28:37,067 --> 00:28:41,800 A few days ago, the FBI learned that the Branch Davidians ran out of milk. 440 00:28:42,567 --> 00:28:44,467 And they are no longer able to feed their children. 441 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:46,267 Nice of them to tell the truth for once. 442 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:48,133 Numerous attempts have been made by the FBI 443 00:28:48,267 --> 00:28:50,500 to deliver milk for their babies, 444 00:28:50,633 --> 00:28:52,100 but they have all been refused. 445 00:28:52,933 --> 00:28:57,300 It seems they are using their own children as pawns in this thing. 446 00:28:58,100 --> 00:29:00,267 David Koresh... 447 00:29:01,067 --> 00:29:03,267 let us bring milk to those children. 448 00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:06,600 Pawns, Gary? We're using our kids as pawns? 449 00:29:06,733 --> 00:29:09,067 -Is that what you think? -No, it's not. 450 00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:10,900 Then why are they saying that on TV? 451 00:29:11,667 --> 00:29:13,467 -I don't know. -Your boss said 452 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:15,633 they have made attempts to deliver milk. 453 00:29:15,767 --> 00:29:18,233 Now, when did that happen? Because we've been here the entire time, 454 00:29:18,367 --> 00:29:20,533 and I don't recall anyone knocking on our door! 455 00:29:21,533 --> 00:29:24,700 Steve, look. I wanna get you that milk. That's the God's honest truth. 456 00:29:24,833 --> 00:29:27,467 But you're gonna have to let out some of the kids in return. 457 00:29:27,600 --> 00:29:29,900 I'm sorry, Gary. That's not gonna happen. 458 00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:38,900 With cult leader David Koresh 459 00:29:39,067 --> 00:29:41,067 becoming less involved in direct negotiations, 460 00:29:41,167 --> 00:29:44,533 authorities suspect his wounds may be getting worse. 461 00:29:44,667 --> 00:29:48,767 Agents told cult members that those not charged with serious offenses 462 00:29:48,900 --> 00:29:51,533 eventually will be allowed to return to the compound 463 00:29:51,667 --> 00:29:54,067 once it's cleared of the crime scene. 464 00:29:54,133 --> 00:29:57,167 -Sheriff Harwell? -Yeah? 465 00:29:57,300 --> 00:30:00,167 I'm Gary Noesner, Head Negotiator, FBI. 466 00:30:01,033 --> 00:30:03,433 Mm. Can I help you? 467 00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:06,733 You mind? 468 00:30:09,067 --> 00:30:10,467 Well... 469 00:30:11,233 --> 00:30:15,667 when I can't get a guy to trust me, I try and find someone he will trust. 470 00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:19,167 And David Koresh trusts you. 471 00:30:19,933 --> 00:30:20,833 Mm. 472 00:30:23,067 --> 00:30:24,533 I could really use your help. 473 00:30:37,567 --> 00:30:41,867 - This is David. - David, it's Sheriff Harwell. 474 00:30:44,333 --> 00:30:45,633 Hey, Jack. 475 00:30:46,867 --> 00:30:49,200 Sure is nice to hear a friendly voice. 476 00:30:49,333 --> 00:30:52,633 David, I came down here today 477 00:30:52,767 --> 00:30:55,367 because I wanna make sure that those babies get the milk they need. 478 00:30:56,133 --> 00:31:00,300 Well, they said on the news it was us refusing to make this happen, Jack. 479 00:31:01,333 --> 00:31:02,667 It's just-- 480 00:31:04,233 --> 00:31:07,067 these are our children they're asking us to give up. 481 00:31:07,133 --> 00:31:08,700 I understand, but... 482 00:31:08,833 --> 00:31:12,133 it might not be the worst thing to get the babies fed, 483 00:31:12,267 --> 00:31:16,067 and at the same time, get some of your other kids out of harm's way. 484 00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:19,933 -You know what I'm saying? -Yeah, I do. 485 00:31:20,067 --> 00:31:23,967 Good. Now, David, how much milk do you think you need? 486 00:31:26,067 --> 00:31:28,700 -Six gallons will do. -All right. 487 00:31:29,467 --> 00:31:31,500 Now, David, I'm gonna get ya the six gallons, 488 00:31:31,633 --> 00:31:35,067 but you gotta keep a level head in this while we try to resolve this thing. 489 00:31:35,767 --> 00:31:38,633 Thank you, Jack. You're a good man. 490 00:31:40,267 --> 00:31:43,233 Look, I just don't think we should make it so easy on 'em. 491 00:31:43,367 --> 00:31:45,300 Jesus. You think we made it easy on 'em? 492 00:31:45,433 --> 00:31:48,067 They agreed to send their kids out, for Christ's sake. 493 00:31:48,167 --> 00:31:51,100 Right now, the only card we have to play is creating goodwill. 494 00:31:51,233 --> 00:31:54,800 No, it's not. That's your only card, Gary. 495 00:31:57,067 --> 00:31:59,333 Look, the people they're sending out won't talk. 496 00:31:59,467 --> 00:32:01,967 And we have no idea what's going on in there-- 497 00:32:02,100 --> 00:32:03,400 what they're planning to do. 498 00:32:03,533 --> 00:32:05,367 All right. What's your point, Noesner? 499 00:32:05,500 --> 00:32:08,633 If we send the milk in and bug it somehow... 500 00:32:08,767 --> 00:32:10,500 we'll have ears inside. 501 00:32:11,967 --> 00:32:16,533 That'll help me with negotiations, and Mitch, tactically. 502 00:32:27,067 --> 00:32:27,900 Do it. 503 00:32:49,500 --> 00:32:51,367 -Judy, you need-- -Shh. 504 00:32:51,500 --> 00:32:53,100 Just got her to sleep. 505 00:32:53,233 --> 00:32:54,533 What's going on? 506 00:32:55,467 --> 00:32:57,233 -Are there more people going? -Yeah. 507 00:32:58,067 --> 00:32:59,733 And I want you and Mayanah to be two of 'em. 508 00:32:59,867 --> 00:33:01,967 No. I already told you, Steve. I can't go-- 509 00:33:02,100 --> 00:33:04,433 Well, this is not about you anymore. This is about Mayanah. 510 00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:08,167 You asked me to look out for her like she was my own. 511 00:33:08,300 --> 00:33:11,267 Well, that's what I'm doing. This is what that looks like. 512 00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:13,067 I don't trust the people out there, though, Steve. 513 00:33:13,167 --> 00:33:14,667 I don't trust them. 514 00:33:17,067 --> 00:33:17,967 I know. 515 00:33:18,933 --> 00:33:22,567 What about you? I can't leave you. 516 00:33:24,333 --> 00:33:25,567 I should stay. 517 00:33:30,967 --> 00:33:33,733 It's the right thing to do. 518 00:33:34,567 --> 00:33:38,067 Hey, Luke. I'm gonna miss that inquisitive mind. 519 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:41,767 I want you to take care of your mama. All right, give me a hug. 520 00:33:42,833 --> 00:33:44,600 Okay. 521 00:33:56,967 --> 00:33:58,133 All right. 522 00:33:59,133 --> 00:34:01,900 What are Judy and Mayanah doing in the hallway? 523 00:34:02,067 --> 00:34:03,433 'Cause they're leaving. 524 00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:07,467 Six gallons. Bugs are in the crate. 525 00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:09,500 Need a vest? 526 00:34:10,700 --> 00:34:12,667 They don't wanna shoot me. 527 00:34:14,100 --> 00:34:15,800 All right. 528 00:34:19,633 --> 00:34:21,600 Is that everyone? 529 00:34:25,433 --> 00:34:28,767 Um, Dave, I'd like you to send out... 530 00:34:29,533 --> 00:34:31,333 Judy and Mayanah. 531 00:34:33,200 --> 00:34:34,433 No. 532 00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:36,600 I can't do that. 533 00:34:39,067 --> 00:34:40,633 Okay. 534 00:34:43,567 --> 00:34:45,900 You know, I've never asked you for anything. 535 00:34:48,667 --> 00:34:52,667 In all the years I've known you, everything I have done has been for you. 536 00:34:54,067 --> 00:34:58,500 Please, David. I'm asking you this one thing. 537 00:35:00,067 --> 00:35:01,900 And I'll talk to Judy. 538 00:35:02,067 --> 00:35:04,833 She can just tell them that-- that Mayanah is my daughter. 539 00:35:09,567 --> 00:35:11,133 But, Steve... 540 00:35:12,233 --> 00:35:14,767 she's not your daughter. 541 00:35:14,900 --> 00:35:16,633 She's mine. 542 00:35:22,900 --> 00:35:24,800 Right. 543 00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:26,767 Right. 544 00:35:31,567 --> 00:35:32,767 I wanna stay with you. 545 00:35:32,900 --> 00:35:34,800 Oh, I wanna stay with you, too, baby. 546 00:35:34,933 --> 00:35:36,800 - But God wants me to stay here. - Mommy...? 547 00:35:36,933 --> 00:35:40,700 And I need to keep you safe, okay? 548 00:35:49,767 --> 00:35:52,067 You're the greatest gift God ever gave me. 549 00:36:14,700 --> 00:36:16,200 Let's go. 550 00:36:25,733 --> 00:36:28,900 Hey, guys. Right up here. 551 00:36:29,667 --> 00:36:31,500 You got it? Come here. 552 00:36:31,633 --> 00:36:35,633 Come here, buddy. Come here. Come here. Let's go. Come on with me. 553 00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:38,867 How many guns you think they're pointing at us right now? 554 00:36:39,667 --> 00:36:42,467 I bet a lot. 555 00:36:59,600 --> 00:37:04,300 -Steve, hi. Wayne, Gary Noesner. -Hey. 556 00:37:05,100 --> 00:37:07,533 - Hi. - Yeah, I've seen your video. 557 00:37:08,567 --> 00:37:10,933 But I'm sure I'm much better-looking in person, right? 558 00:37:11,067 --> 00:37:14,300 Let's just say that you got a pretty good face for radio. 559 00:37:16,533 --> 00:37:17,433 Could we just get this over with? 560 00:37:17,567 --> 00:37:19,200 Yeah, sure. I'm sorry. 561 00:37:19,333 --> 00:37:21,600 Steve, can I talk to you for a minute, just you and I? 562 00:37:22,433 --> 00:37:24,267 Yeah. It's okay. 563 00:37:30,167 --> 00:37:33,267 You need to know your people are in a lot more danger than you think. 564 00:37:35,867 --> 00:37:38,467 And in my experience, the longer these situations go on, 565 00:37:38,600 --> 00:37:40,833 the more erratic people's behavior gets. 566 00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:43,567 Yeah, we're seeing that on our side, too. 567 00:37:43,700 --> 00:37:45,233 Uh-huh. 568 00:37:47,267 --> 00:37:49,867 -Can I ask you something, Steve? -Yeah. 569 00:37:50,800 --> 00:37:52,567 Whose child is Mayanah? 570 00:37:56,167 --> 00:37:58,267 We've all made a lot of sacrifices to be here. 571 00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:02,400 -She's David's child, isn't she? -I made a choice. 572 00:38:02,533 --> 00:38:04,200 Judy made a choice. 573 00:38:06,900 --> 00:38:09,300 How is she, Judy? I heard she was shot. 574 00:38:10,833 --> 00:38:12,567 -She's fine. -She's fine? 575 00:38:12,700 --> 00:38:15,567 She has a bullet in her, and her baby needs milk, but she's fine? 576 00:38:15,700 --> 00:38:18,267 She's still in there. Why is that? 577 00:38:19,233 --> 00:38:20,667 Because we made a decision together-- 578 00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:22,867 No. No, I think 579 00:38:23,067 --> 00:38:24,933 David was the one who made that decision, not you. 580 00:38:25,067 --> 00:38:27,067 I think if it were up to you, 581 00:38:27,133 --> 00:38:30,167 Judy would be in that vehicle right now, with Mayanah. 582 00:38:32,600 --> 00:38:33,867 Am I wrong? 583 00:38:36,500 --> 00:38:38,333 Now, look, Steve, the thing you gotta realize 584 00:38:38,467 --> 00:38:41,800 is that you do have the power to make your own decisions. 585 00:38:42,767 --> 00:38:46,867 Decisions for you, for Judy, for Mayanah, for everyone in there 586 00:38:47,067 --> 00:38:50,600 who is waiting for someone to find the courage to lead them out. 587 00:38:54,700 --> 00:38:56,400 You know, it's funny... I can't tell you 588 00:38:56,533 --> 00:38:58,567 how many times I wanted to leave this place. 589 00:38:59,333 --> 00:39:03,133 And all the fire ants and the dust storms... 590 00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:06,067 and David. 591 00:39:06,833 --> 00:39:09,967 Oh, you're right. David's horrible. 592 00:39:10,967 --> 00:39:13,167 Self-centered, rude. 593 00:39:14,133 --> 00:39:18,233 I wish that God would have chosen 594 00:39:18,367 --> 00:39:23,633 any other person on the earth to speak through instead of him. 595 00:39:24,867 --> 00:39:26,533 But you know what? 596 00:39:27,300 --> 00:39:28,900 Despite everything you're saying, 597 00:39:29,667 --> 00:39:33,167 no one's explained to me what we did to deserve all this. 598 00:39:35,367 --> 00:39:38,300 You know, you have the power to end this, too. 599 00:39:39,267 --> 00:39:40,933 How's that? 600 00:39:43,067 --> 00:39:44,800 You could just leave. 601 00:39:48,533 --> 00:39:50,300 We weren't bothering anybody. 602 00:39:58,700 --> 00:40:00,067 Yeah, I know. 603 00:40:04,067 --> 00:40:05,633 Thanks for the milk. 604 00:40:19,633 --> 00:40:22,100 All right. We're rolling. 605 00:40:23,333 --> 00:40:24,533 Okay. 606 00:40:26,167 --> 00:40:28,533 Say whatever you wanna say. 607 00:40:31,133 --> 00:40:32,633 Well... 608 00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:38,867 I just wanna say thanks a lot for killing my dad. 609 00:40:41,000 --> 00:40:42,967 My dad's name was Perry Jones. 610 00:40:44,033 --> 00:40:46,033 He was an unarmed man. 611 00:40:47,333 --> 00:40:48,700 And... 612 00:40:50,867 --> 00:40:53,700 you just shot him through the door, so... 613 00:40:56,200 --> 00:40:57,233 thanks a lot. 614 00:41:04,200 --> 00:41:07,333 -And thanks for the milk. -Yeah, thanks for the milk. 615 00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:24,900 Wow. 616 00:41:25,667 --> 00:41:27,133 Is it bleeding again? 617 00:41:27,267 --> 00:41:30,600 - It's all over the pillow. - Well... 618 00:41:30,733 --> 00:41:33,667 it ain't nothing for a tough guy like me. 619 00:41:36,833 --> 00:41:40,867 A lot of beliefs people have may seem abnormal or strange to other people, 620 00:41:41,067 --> 00:41:43,367 but that doesn't mean it's not right, though. 621 00:41:44,367 --> 00:41:48,400 God speaks to me. I have a message to present. 622 00:41:49,167 --> 00:41:50,900 And you may not believe that. 623 00:41:51,967 --> 00:41:54,100 If you don't believe that, then believe this, 624 00:41:54,233 --> 00:41:56,933 irrespective of God speaking to me. 625 00:42:00,400 --> 00:42:02,100 See this here? 626 00:42:03,067 --> 00:42:07,333 This is my family. May not be like your family. 627 00:42:08,167 --> 00:42:10,200 But you come pointing guns 628 00:42:10,333 --> 00:42:13,733 in the direction of my wives and my kids? 629 00:42:14,500 --> 00:42:19,733 Damn it, I will meet you at the door any time. 630 00:42:22,333 --> 00:42:24,900 I'm sorry some of you guys got shot. 631 00:42:25,967 --> 00:42:27,700 But, hey... 632 00:42:29,967 --> 00:42:32,867 God'll have to sort that out, won't He? 633 00:42:38,100 --> 00:42:40,200 You still think you can reason with this guy? 634 00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:53,100 What are you gonna do with that? 635 00:42:56,400 --> 00:43:00,267 Can't let this get out. Makes him look too normal. 636 00:43:24,067 --> 00:43:26,067 Your boy's alive. 637 00:43:28,733 --> 00:43:31,933 Thank you. Thank you. 638 00:43:39,500 --> 00:43:40,933 Okay. 639 00:43:44,467 --> 00:43:50,567 -I wanted to thank you, Steve. -For what? 640 00:43:51,333 --> 00:43:53,933 Taking care of everyone when I was down. 641 00:43:55,733 --> 00:43:57,233 And for not leaving. 642 00:43:58,100 --> 00:44:00,833 I know you've been having your doubts. 643 00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:02,900 I understand. 644 00:44:03,933 --> 00:44:08,100 Heck... I've had my own, too. 645 00:44:18,167 --> 00:44:20,967 -You need something? -Yeah. 646 00:44:22,700 --> 00:44:25,167 Glass of milk would be nice. 647 00:44:27,533 --> 00:44:31,433 -No, that's for the kids, David. -I know it is, 648 00:44:31,567 --> 00:44:34,133 but I just escaped death by the grace of God, 649 00:44:34,267 --> 00:44:37,667 and to be honest with you, milk would do us good. 650 00:44:37,800 --> 00:44:39,167 No one'll know, Steve. 651 00:44:39,300 --> 00:44:40,833 Glass of milk, I have to admit, 652 00:44:40,967 --> 00:44:42,167 would be pretty good right about now. 653 00:44:42,300 --> 00:44:44,367 That's a yes. 654 00:44:45,133 --> 00:44:47,433 Gonna be the best glass of milk we've ever had. 655 00:44:55,667 --> 00:45:00,333 They don't give a shit about those kids. When are you gonna see it? 656 00:45:01,300 --> 00:45:02,767 I see it. 657 00:45:02,900 --> 00:45:05,633 The only thing people like this respond to is pressure. 658 00:45:05,767 --> 00:45:08,467 Does it feel like they have any pressure on them to you? 659 00:45:09,233 --> 00:45:12,767 -They sure don't. -We been here, what, eight days? 660 00:45:12,900 --> 00:45:16,200 The only thing we have to show for it is, what, 19 people? 661 00:45:17,233 --> 00:45:19,567 We keep up at this rate, we'll be here till Christmas. 662 00:45:22,133 --> 00:45:23,833 You been letting Gary do his thing. 663 00:45:24,600 --> 00:45:27,100 How 'bout you let me do a little of mine? 664 00:45:29,167 --> 00:45:33,100 And Bubba might say, "But ain't they messin' with young girls in there?" 665 00:45:33,233 --> 00:45:35,233 And I got this to say to Bubba. 666 00:45:36,533 --> 00:45:40,500 The ATF has no jurisdiction in matters of young girls. 667 00:45:40,633 --> 00:45:44,567 Or sex, or polygamy, or anything else they're talking about. 668 00:45:44,700 --> 00:45:46,933 It's none of their damn business. 669 00:45:47,067 --> 00:45:48,633 Their business... 670 00:45:48,767 --> 00:45:53,200 is alcohol, tobacco, and firearms. Period. 671 00:45:54,367 --> 00:45:58,367 And yes, David Koresh did marry his wife when she was 14. 672 00:45:58,500 --> 00:46:00,333 And you might have feelings about that, 673 00:46:00,467 --> 00:46:02,367 just like I have feelings about that myself. 674 00:46:02,500 --> 00:46:05,433 I have a daughter. I find the idea reprehensible. 675 00:46:05,567 --> 00:46:08,067 But according to Texas law, 676 00:46:08,133 --> 00:46:12,900 it is legal to marry a 14-year-old if her parents give consent. 677 00:46:13,667 --> 00:46:16,500 Which, again, I am not saying is right. 678 00:46:17,267 --> 00:46:19,133 But I am saying, if you have a problem with it, 679 00:46:19,267 --> 00:46:22,100 your problem is actually with Texas law. 680 00:46:23,067 --> 00:46:24,067 Not David Koresh. 681 00:46:26,400 --> 00:46:28,733 The Branch Davidians have hung a sheet outside the window 682 00:46:28,867 --> 00:46:30,367 saying they want the press. 683 00:46:30,500 --> 00:46:33,133 Reporters have their own take on the sign. 684 00:46:33,267 --> 00:46:35,767 God help us, we are the press! 685 00:46:35,900 --> 00:46:38,667 ...siege against the Branch Davidians in Waco, Texas. 686 00:46:38,800 --> 00:46:40,933 And raise similar questions about the-- 687 00:46:41,067 --> 00:46:43,833 I just don't understand why they won't let us talk to them. 688 00:46:43,967 --> 00:46:45,633 Ma'am, if your son were here right-- 689 00:46:45,767 --> 00:46:47,200 No, no. Go back. 690 00:46:47,333 --> 00:46:49,233 ...web surrounded this house... 691 00:46:49,367 --> 00:46:50,900 What would you want to tell him? 692 00:46:51,067 --> 00:46:52,600 If you want to look in the camera and speak to him, 693 00:46:52,733 --> 00:46:53,667 what would you want to say to him? 694 00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:54,967 Do you know her? 695 00:46:55,733 --> 00:46:57,433 That's my mom. 696 00:46:57,567 --> 00:47:00,067 Dave, honey... 697 00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:05,367 I know the last time you were home, I didn't listen very well. 698 00:47:06,133 --> 00:47:09,633 I-- I got my issues with the Bible and stuff. 699 00:47:10,400 --> 00:47:12,867 And I know that you got a group in there 700 00:47:13,067 --> 00:47:16,100 that you really care about, and they're like family. 701 00:47:17,967 --> 00:47:21,500 But I'm your family. And you're the only family I've got. 702 00:47:21,633 --> 00:47:25,800 And if anything ever happened to you, I don't know what I'd do. 703 00:47:27,333 --> 00:47:29,300 Thank you. 704 00:47:29,433 --> 00:47:31,900 Dave, please? Come out. 705 00:47:32,067 --> 00:47:36,067 And I promise I'm gonna be a better listener, okay? 706 00:47:37,533 --> 00:47:40,067 I promise I'm gonna be a better mother. 707 00:47:42,067 --> 00:47:44,400 So, please, just come on out. 708 00:47:45,633 --> 00:47:47,933 Thank you. Thank you so much. 709 00:47:49,900 --> 00:47:53,067 - Everyone stay calm. - What happened?