1 00:00:12,628 --> 00:00:17,628 Provided by explosiveskull https://twitter.com/kaboomskull 2 00:42:56,246 --> 00:42:59,849 One, two, three, four, five, six... 3 00:42:59,882 --> 00:43:01,183 Six feet away! 4 00:43:01,217 --> 00:43:02,885 Six feet away! 5 00:43:02,918 --> 00:43:05,121 Dad, can you come over here and visit? 6 00:43:11,460 --> 00:43:14,397 I don't really have happy dreams... 7 00:43:14,664 --> 00:43:16,099 Yeah. 8 00:43:16,132 --> 00:43:20,336 I have to fill out this paperwork for my kids. 9 00:43:20,369 --> 00:43:22,038 They want to medicate them. 10 00:43:22,070 --> 00:43:24,340 I alone am fighting for the well-being 11 00:43:24,373 --> 00:43:26,876 and the safety and security of my children. 12 00:43:26,909 --> 00:43:31,380 Then on top of that, I'm also doing my work for this job 13 00:43:31,414 --> 00:43:36,420 that I have just got, working with troubled youth. 14 00:43:37,052 --> 00:43:39,388 So the fight continues on. 15 00:43:41,356 --> 00:43:45,795 I started learning how to love at the age of 22 years old. 16 00:43:49,199 --> 00:43:51,268 Stop! You don't operate the phone! 17 00:43:51,300 --> 00:43:54,336 Hey, I gave Yay'veontay the task to operate the phone. 18 00:43:54,369 --> 00:43:56,239 So may you guys please allow him to do it? 19 00:43:56,271 --> 00:43:58,208 I'm gonna... 20 00:43:59,943 --> 00:44:03,413 Hey, one of you guys take the phone and go outside. 21 00:44:03,445 --> 00:44:04,480 Alright... 22 00:44:04,514 --> 00:44:05,349 Oww! 23 00:44:07,617 --> 00:44:10,420 You got your shoes on? 24 00:44:10,452 --> 00:44:11,387 Mhm! 25 00:44:11,420 --> 00:44:12,922 Alright. 26 00:44:12,956 --> 00:44:14,858 Go outside, like by the front door, and let's see 27 00:44:14,891 --> 00:44:16,927 how the reception is right there. 28 00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:18,427 I'm outside. 29 00:44:19,561 --> 00:44:21,531 Manieepoo! 30 00:44:21,965 --> 00:44:23,934 What's the deal, Mama? 31 00:44:24,166 --> 00:44:25,402 Nothing. 32 00:44:25,434 --> 00:44:28,905 The video works so much better with you outside. 33 00:44:29,405 --> 00:44:31,974 - Manieepoo? - Huh? 34 00:44:32,007 --> 00:44:35,611 Hey, Maniee, stay right there where the reception is good. 35 00:44:39,615 --> 00:44:41,150 Manieepoo? 36 00:44:46,489 --> 00:44:50,092 My three children were separated in all different foster homes. 37 00:44:50,126 --> 00:44:54,231 My children's mother and myself went through a hard break-up and 38 00:44:54,264 --> 00:44:57,634 we both could have conducted ourselves in a better fashion. 39 00:44:57,666 --> 00:44:59,268 And being that we didn't, 40 00:44:59,302 --> 00:45:01,872 it resulted in our children being taken from our custody 41 00:45:01,905 --> 00:45:05,542 by the Department of Children and Family Services. 42 00:45:08,077 --> 00:45:10,614 The current pandemic has not affected 43 00:45:10,646 --> 00:45:13,851 my current arrangements for visitation. 44 00:45:16,219 --> 00:45:18,088 Where are you? 45 00:45:18,121 --> 00:45:20,923 I'm not too far from you guys. 46 00:45:20,956 --> 00:45:22,592 Oh, can you come? 47 00:45:23,159 --> 00:45:24,427 Hmmm... 48 00:45:24,927 --> 00:45:27,864 If it's okay with your Auntie. 49 00:45:29,231 --> 00:45:31,601 I may be over there a little later. 50 00:45:32,068 --> 00:45:36,306 I am not able to come over there today but... 51 00:45:36,338 --> 00:45:38,607 Hey look, but on a more serious note, 52 00:45:38,641 --> 00:45:40,443 if you can, I really need you to pay attention 53 00:45:40,476 --> 00:45:42,311 to what I'm about to tell you. 54 00:45:42,344 --> 00:45:44,146 Wasn't there a shooting over there? 55 00:45:44,179 --> 00:45:46,148 Like yesterday or the night before last? 56 00:45:46,181 --> 00:45:48,450 If you're outside, right? And you hear gunshots, 57 00:45:48,483 --> 00:45:50,953 what are you supposed to do? 58 00:45:50,987 --> 00:45:52,588 - Look? - No... 59 00:45:52,621 --> 00:45:54,390 - Run? - No. 60 00:45:54,891 --> 00:45:57,961 - In back... under a car... - No. No. No. 61 00:45:57,994 --> 00:45:59,930 You get down, you prone out. 62 00:45:59,963 --> 00:46:02,265 You get as close to the earth as you can. 63 00:46:02,297 --> 00:46:04,199 You know why I'm telling you this, right? 64 00:46:04,233 --> 00:46:07,070 'Cause that dog right there, that dog. 65 00:46:07,436 --> 00:46:08,538 What? 66 00:46:08,570 --> 00:46:10,273 The dog! 67 00:46:10,306 --> 00:46:13,210 - You don't see that dog? - I don't want... 68 00:46:13,577 --> 00:46:15,645 Okay, lemme see the dog. 69 00:46:26,655 --> 00:46:28,991 If you had super powers, Mama, 70 00:46:29,025 --> 00:46:31,295 what super powers would you want? 71 00:46:32,094 --> 00:46:33,495 To fly! 72 00:46:33,528 --> 00:46:34,965 Woo! 73 00:46:35,498 --> 00:46:36,432 There we go! 74 00:46:36,465 --> 00:46:38,367 I wanna be extremely fast... 75 00:46:38,400 --> 00:46:40,536 I had a dream that I... 76 00:46:40,570 --> 00:46:44,074 I chose that I could just run to dad every... 77 00:46:44,574 --> 00:46:48,378 My visitation with my children is at least once a week, 78 00:46:48,411 --> 00:46:52,516 for whatever amount of hours the caretaker allows. 79 00:46:53,782 --> 00:46:55,351 For seven years, 80 00:46:55,385 --> 00:46:59,356 I have been fighting tooth and nail to regain custody. 81 00:46:59,755 --> 00:47:02,992 I feel like I'm incomplete. 82 00:47:03,726 --> 00:47:07,297 Sometimes, I get so deep into my depression 83 00:47:07,329 --> 00:47:09,032 that I just wanna be alone, 84 00:47:09,065 --> 00:47:11,067 I don't want to interact with people. 85 00:47:11,099 --> 00:47:12,668 It's a fight. 86 00:47:12,702 --> 00:47:14,037 Yeah, it's a fight. 87 00:47:14,070 --> 00:47:16,639 You know, the biggest fight of my life. 88 00:47:16,672 --> 00:47:18,440 Six feet away! 89 00:47:18,474 --> 00:47:20,744 One, two, three, four, five, six... 90 00:47:20,777 --> 00:47:23,278 Dad, when's the next time we go to court? 91 00:47:23,311 --> 00:47:25,714 We're supposed to go to court this month, 92 00:47:25,748 --> 00:47:28,550 but due to the Covid-19 pandemic, 93 00:47:28,583 --> 00:47:31,620 we was unable to go to court. 94 00:47:31,653 --> 00:47:34,690 So it can be next week, it can be next month, 95 00:47:34,724 --> 00:47:36,593 or it can be next year. 96 00:47:37,059 --> 00:47:39,429 I wanna be the judge. 97 00:47:39,762 --> 00:47:42,798 So, okay, if you wanna be the judge, that's magnificent. 98 00:47:42,831 --> 00:47:45,201 Families going through what we going through, 99 00:47:45,233 --> 00:47:46,436 you can be able to better assist them 100 00:47:46,469 --> 00:47:48,104 because you went through it, right? 101 00:47:48,137 --> 00:47:52,442 First I'm gonna work as a dentist for a little bit then 102 00:47:52,474 --> 00:47:56,045 I'm gonna quit it... and be a judge. 103 00:47:56,079 --> 00:47:59,082 Well, I feel like we should discuss that... 104 00:47:59,114 --> 00:48:02,418 - a little bit more... - Six feet away! 105 00:48:02,452 --> 00:48:04,587 Six feet away. 106 00:48:04,619 --> 00:48:07,156 I dream about my kids, yeah. 107 00:48:07,190 --> 00:48:09,425 And when I dream about my kids, it's just like... 108 00:48:09,458 --> 00:48:12,261 things as simple as having a meal together. 109 00:48:12,295 --> 00:48:13,829 You want some? 110 00:48:13,862 --> 00:48:15,464 Yeah, just gimme a bite. 111 00:48:17,766 --> 00:48:19,602 It's pepperoni. 112 00:48:20,769 --> 00:48:22,072 Conversations, 113 00:48:22,105 --> 00:48:23,505 being in the living room, 114 00:48:23,539 --> 00:48:24,841 watching TV... 115 00:48:24,873 --> 00:48:27,676 The things that a lot of people take for granted. 116 00:48:27,710 --> 00:48:29,778 Those are daydreams. 117 00:48:29,811 --> 00:48:31,780 Those aren't the physical dreams 118 00:48:31,813 --> 00:48:34,149 that I dream when I lay down at night, 119 00:48:34,182 --> 00:48:35,719 and try to sleep. 120 00:48:39,322 --> 00:48:42,125 I suffer from PTSD. 121 00:48:42,157 --> 00:48:45,295 My dreams is rooted in the hardships that 122 00:48:45,327 --> 00:48:48,498 God has blessed me so far to escape. 123 00:48:48,864 --> 00:48:51,100 Being homeless as a child, 124 00:48:51,134 --> 00:48:52,402 being beaten, 125 00:48:52,434 --> 00:48:54,637 being neglected, you know? 126 00:48:57,139 --> 00:48:59,208 Some nights I don't sleep. 127 00:49:00,376 --> 00:49:02,512 Hey, what's going on, Yay'veontay? 128 00:49:02,545 --> 00:49:04,646 Good, where you at? Why won't you come? 129 00:49:04,679 --> 00:49:08,550 You guys are my children, of course I'm gonna be there. 130 00:49:08,583 --> 00:49:09,551 What's up, Dad? 131 00:49:09,585 --> 00:49:11,753 What's going on, brother? 132 00:49:16,759 --> 00:49:18,795 You look real nice with your glasses. 133 00:49:18,827 --> 00:49:20,295 Why didn't you put your bow on? 134 00:49:20,329 --> 00:49:22,565 Why didn't you put it right here? 135 00:49:22,597 --> 00:49:24,333 Like that? 136 00:49:24,367 --> 00:49:26,202 Dang! I forgot about that... 137 00:49:26,235 --> 00:49:27,871 You forgot? Wait, come here! 138 00:49:27,903 --> 00:49:30,139 Can I take a picture of you? 139 00:49:35,143 --> 00:49:36,846 I'm happy that my children 140 00:49:36,878 --> 00:49:39,715 were finally able to be placed in the same residence, 141 00:49:39,748 --> 00:49:42,785 and placed in the care of family members. 142 00:49:43,652 --> 00:49:46,388 We're hopeful that, on the next court date, 143 00:49:46,422 --> 00:49:48,657 they're gonna liberalize my visits. 144 00:49:48,690 --> 00:49:50,459 I'll be able to go get my kids, 145 00:49:50,492 --> 00:49:51,760 and spend about 5 hours with them 146 00:49:51,793 --> 00:49:53,395 take 'em wherever I want to take 'em, 147 00:49:53,429 --> 00:49:56,833 and at the end of that 5 hours, drop them back off. 148 00:49:57,967 --> 00:49:59,369 Is you crying? 149 00:49:59,402 --> 00:50:00,403 Say no. 150 00:50:00,436 --> 00:50:02,238 - Cause you're a big man? - Yeah. 151 00:50:02,271 --> 00:50:03,806 Papa, is you a big man? 152 00:50:03,838 --> 00:50:05,875 Yes, y'all is. Then you got... 153 00:50:05,907 --> 00:50:06,875 Yay'veontay! 154 00:50:06,909 --> 00:50:09,311 Yay'veontay, right there, man! 155 00:50:09,878 --> 00:50:12,382 Say cheese. Don't cry, okay? 156 00:50:15,585 --> 00:50:17,320 Stop crying. 157 00:50:17,652 --> 00:50:18,887 Wipe your face. 158 00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:20,623 You're a big girl. 159 00:50:20,655 --> 00:50:23,326 Daddy gonna come back and see you, okay? 160 00:50:23,358 --> 00:50:24,860 Don't cry. 161 00:50:25,927 --> 00:50:27,763 You're gonna be alright. 162 00:50:28,130 --> 00:50:30,799 Sometimes, I'm not capable of physically 163 00:50:30,833 --> 00:50:32,568 reaching out and touching my kids, 164 00:50:32,601 --> 00:50:33,902 but spiritually, 165 00:50:33,936 --> 00:50:36,806 we're connected and they know their father is there. 166 00:50:36,838 --> 00:50:38,875 Periodically, I dream about my kids, 167 00:50:38,907 --> 00:50:40,376 us flying... 168 00:50:41,210 --> 00:50:45,948 We'll all be together, holding hands, flying, laughing... 169 00:50:45,981 --> 00:50:49,485 Swimming, without having to come up for air... 170 00:50:49,518 --> 00:50:52,422 Being able to be free, and defy the limitations 171 00:50:52,454 --> 00:50:54,590 that the physical put on us. 172 00:50:54,623 --> 00:50:56,792 These dreams bring me peace. 173 00:50:57,126 --> 00:50:59,796 Yeah, peace, peace. 174 00:51:02,498 --> 00:51:05,835 My love, my sunshine, my dear... 175 00:52:04,827 --> 00:52:06,496 Is this recording? No? 176 00:52:06,528 --> 00:52:07,931 Is this recording? 177 00:52:09,699 --> 00:52:11,067 Hi Laura... 178 00:52:11,099 --> 00:52:14,503 So you asked me to start sending memos about 179 00:52:14,536 --> 00:52:16,939 this ongoing investigation. 180 00:52:18,373 --> 00:52:19,875 Uhmm... 181 00:52:19,909 --> 00:52:20,977 So like this... 182 00:52:21,010 --> 00:52:22,845 We were watching the news about 183 00:52:22,878 --> 00:52:24,847 the spread of surveillance technology 184 00:52:24,880 --> 00:52:26,648 for Corona tracing. 185 00:52:26,681 --> 00:52:29,718 So, the way that kind of global viral emergency 186 00:52:29,751 --> 00:52:32,087 is used to roll out the surveillance projects 187 00:52:32,121 --> 00:52:34,691 in different parts of the world. 188 00:52:38,527 --> 00:52:41,563 One company name was always there... 189 00:52:42,597 --> 00:52:44,500 NSO Group. 190 00:52:44,532 --> 00:52:46,935 So, we already wanted for a long time 191 00:52:46,969 --> 00:52:49,806 to start an investigation on the NSO 192 00:52:49,838 --> 00:52:52,607 because NSO software was used to target 193 00:52:52,641 --> 00:52:54,811 our colleagues and friends. 194 00:52:55,378 --> 00:52:59,082 We know that you know what it feels to be surveilled, 195 00:52:59,114 --> 00:53:02,584 that surveillance is not only a breach of privacy, 196 00:53:02,617 --> 00:53:03,952 that it is violence, 197 00:53:03,985 --> 00:53:06,021 that it does things to you, 198 00:53:06,054 --> 00:53:09,725 that things start to happen to you in the real world... 199 00:53:09,759 --> 00:53:11,094 And then it spreads across 200 00:53:11,126 --> 00:53:12,961 your network of friends, colleagues, 201 00:53:12,994 --> 00:53:15,597 and stakeholders or clients... 202 00:53:15,630 --> 00:53:19,101 And that being targeted feels like terror. 203 00:53:58,773 --> 00:54:01,076 If I'm an organization paying a lot of money 204 00:54:01,110 --> 00:54:02,812 for each targeting hack, 205 00:54:02,844 --> 00:54:05,080 the right thing is to target a person 206 00:54:05,114 --> 00:54:07,449 at the center of the network. 207 00:54:07,483 --> 00:54:11,454 Carmen is the head person of the matrix. 208 00:54:11,487 --> 00:54:14,757 So how can you imagine, Nathan, 209 00:54:14,789 --> 00:54:17,692 a way of visualizing something like that? 210 00:54:17,726 --> 00:54:19,061 Uhmm... 211 00:54:19,094 --> 00:54:22,597 There is a way to illustrate it through the events. 212 00:54:24,467 --> 00:54:27,603 Anything that's a sphere is an attack. 213 00:54:27,635 --> 00:54:29,137 It means that 214 00:54:29,170 --> 00:54:32,107 this person on the timeline has been directly targeted 215 00:54:32,141 --> 00:54:34,577 by that act of violence. 216 00:54:34,876 --> 00:54:36,913 So, it might be a digital act of violence 217 00:54:36,945 --> 00:54:38,547 or a physical act of violence, 218 00:54:38,581 --> 00:54:40,817 but it's a direct attack on that person. 219 00:54:42,851 --> 00:54:45,721 When Carmen was first targeted, 220 00:54:45,753 --> 00:54:47,489 if she clicked on that, 221 00:54:47,523 --> 00:54:49,192 it's quite possible they gained access 222 00:54:49,224 --> 00:54:50,893 to all the conversations she was having 223 00:54:50,925 --> 00:54:52,628 with all of the members of her team. 224 00:54:52,661 --> 00:54:55,097 So, from Carmen, and they attack everybody else. 225 00:54:55,130 --> 00:54:59,501 And then in 2016, that's when five subjects raid her office. 226 00:55:10,079 --> 00:55:11,714 Hola Carmen! 227 00:55:11,746 --> 00:55:14,082 I am the lead researcher 228 00:55:14,115 --> 00:55:17,119 on this project with Forensic Architecture. 229 00:55:17,519 --> 00:55:22,090 We're focusing specifically on the targeted digital violence of 230 00:55:22,123 --> 00:55:25,760 the Israeli cyber weapons manufacturer, NSO Group, 231 00:55:25,793 --> 00:55:28,931 and the use of Pegasus around the world. 232 00:55:28,963 --> 00:55:30,532 You are one of... 233 00:55:30,565 --> 00:55:32,667 the first persons that was documented 234 00:55:32,701 --> 00:55:34,135 by Citizen Lab as being 235 00:55:34,168 --> 00:55:37,473 targeted using Pegasus. 236 00:55:59,094 --> 00:56:01,597 Can you describe what you remember 237 00:56:01,630 --> 00:56:03,798 as the first message you received? 238 00:56:03,831 --> 00:56:05,134 The hacks? 239 00:56:59,989 --> 00:57:03,159 Hi Laura, I hope you're okay... 240 00:57:03,192 --> 00:57:06,161 So last night, I had horrible dreams. 241 00:57:06,195 --> 00:57:09,065 I dreamt that I was being interrogated, 242 00:57:09,097 --> 00:57:13,302 and I woke up with extreme anxiety and in cold sweats, 243 00:57:13,335 --> 00:57:16,237 and the first thought that came to my mind was, 244 00:57:16,271 --> 00:57:18,673 "Are we making a huge mistake?" 245 00:57:18,706 --> 00:57:20,775 I don't want to get too paranoid, 246 00:57:20,809 --> 00:57:22,345 but I'm also thinking at the same time 247 00:57:22,378 --> 00:57:24,713 that we've never had to come across 248 00:57:24,746 --> 00:57:27,182 a company like the NSO group 249 00:57:27,215 --> 00:57:29,085 They're very lawsuit happy, 250 00:57:29,117 --> 00:57:31,086 they go after people, they intimidate... 251 00:57:31,119 --> 00:57:33,355 Every single person we've spoken to so far, 252 00:57:33,389 --> 00:57:36,759 whether they're journalists, lawyers suing them, researchers, 253 00:57:36,791 --> 00:57:38,994 or people who've been targeted, they're all telling us 254 00:57:39,027 --> 00:57:41,997 this company tries to intimidate, to scare, 255 00:57:42,030 --> 00:57:43,231 to make your life hell, 256 00:57:43,264 --> 00:57:45,601 just so that you go away. 257 00:58:15,030 --> 00:58:17,867 As an Arab, we have interest in 258 00:58:17,900 --> 00:58:20,235 what is going on in the Arab world. 259 00:58:20,268 --> 00:58:23,271 So for us, it's like a personal matter 260 00:58:23,304 --> 00:58:25,940 as well as a legal matter. 261 00:58:25,974 --> 00:58:28,443 This is not the first time that we've been targeted 262 00:58:28,476 --> 00:58:30,011 or that we were under surveillance 263 00:58:30,045 --> 00:58:31,247 by the Indian state. 264 00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:33,215 A lot of my contacts, when I told them, 265 00:58:33,248 --> 00:58:34,784 look this is happening to me, 266 00:58:34,817 --> 00:58:37,219 They said, "We always presumed this would happen to you 267 00:58:37,251 --> 00:58:39,855 "so don't worry, we all prepared for it. 268 00:58:39,887 --> 00:58:42,424 "You must be doing something really wonderful 269 00:58:42,458 --> 00:58:44,193 "because the government's spending 270 00:58:44,226 --> 00:58:46,061 a lot of money on this." 271 00:58:47,061 --> 00:58:48,764 These are the phones. 272 00:58:50,798 --> 00:58:52,168 They're all active? 273 00:58:53,034 --> 00:58:54,103 All active. 274 00:58:54,135 --> 00:58:58,273 In Mexico, when you study journalism, 275 00:58:58,306 --> 00:59:00,208 you take for granted that 276 00:59:00,242 --> 00:59:02,812 the government is going to be after you. 277 00:59:02,844 --> 00:59:04,913 And we are the lucky ones 278 00:59:04,947 --> 00:59:07,950 because in so many regions in Mexico, 279 00:59:07,983 --> 00:59:10,286 they get a bullet, they don't get a message... 280 00:59:10,318 --> 00:59:11,853 They get a bullet. 281 00:59:36,778 --> 00:59:38,514 I'm not sure we can make the argument 282 00:59:38,547 --> 00:59:40,282 that what the NSO is enabling, 283 00:59:40,315 --> 00:59:42,952 in terms of operationalizing its surveillance 284 00:59:42,985 --> 00:59:44,186 into direct violence, 285 00:59:44,219 --> 00:59:46,456 is new territory, right? 286 00:59:47,123 --> 00:59:50,960 I mean the CIA and NSA do that all the time. 287 00:59:50,992 --> 00:59:53,429 What I think is new is that we can see the fingerprints 288 00:59:53,461 --> 00:59:54,896 and we can show it. 289 00:59:54,929 --> 00:59:57,232 I think that that points to something that 290 00:59:57,266 --> 00:59:59,300 I would say might be new territory, 291 00:59:59,333 --> 01:00:02,538 which is a private company manufacturing and selling 292 01:00:02,570 --> 01:00:05,474 nation state-level cyberweapons. 293 01:00:12,280 --> 01:00:15,784 There is something of a viral logic 294 01:00:15,818 --> 01:00:18,387 about this form of targeting 295 01:00:18,420 --> 01:00:22,291 in a way that it spreads between family members, 296 01:00:22,324 --> 01:00:26,228 but also the people that investigate those crimes. 297 01:00:26,260 --> 01:00:29,498 If we know that X activist was targeted on this date 298 01:00:29,530 --> 01:00:31,333 and then immediately following that, 299 01:00:31,365 --> 01:00:33,369 something physical happened... 300 01:00:33,402 --> 01:00:35,371 Like if one of those threads could be drawn 301 01:00:35,403 --> 01:00:36,905 through the database. 302 01:00:36,938 --> 01:00:40,009 This is the underlying logic of this investigation... 303 01:00:40,041 --> 01:00:43,244 Digital vs. physical violence. So let's start with that. 304 01:00:43,277 --> 01:00:45,413 Look at the same pattern, 305 01:00:45,447 --> 01:00:49,318 across in when and how does it happen in Mexico, 306 01:00:49,351 --> 01:00:53,823 when and how does this kind of relation happen in the UAE, 307 01:00:53,856 --> 01:00:56,225 when it happens in Rwanda, when it happens in India, 308 01:00:56,257 --> 01:00:58,059 if you have data about that, 309 01:00:58,092 --> 01:01:00,528 and find a way to move 310 01:01:00,561 --> 01:01:03,298 between one field of operation to the other. 311 01:01:03,699 --> 01:01:07,135 All the information is there, but this is now 312 01:01:07,168 --> 01:01:09,170 the mobilization of the data. 313 01:01:09,204 --> 01:01:11,273 It is not now about simply plotting 314 01:01:11,306 --> 01:01:13,375 because this material is being plotted, 315 01:01:13,407 --> 01:01:16,010 political events are there plotted on a timeline, 316 01:01:16,043 --> 01:01:18,047 there are physical events... 317 01:01:18,079 --> 01:01:20,882 It's now you have all the strings, 318 01:01:20,916 --> 01:01:23,318 and now you start playing music on them. 319 01:01:23,351 --> 01:01:25,954 You go like, "I'm just gonna use these notes." 320 01:01:25,987 --> 01:01:28,523 Ta, ta, ta, ta... is targeting. 321 01:01:31,626 --> 01:01:33,962 I'm gonna zoom in a little. 322 01:01:33,996 --> 01:01:35,931 So if we go into the front view, 323 01:01:35,963 --> 01:01:38,534 here we have the field of Mexico... 324 01:01:38,867 --> 01:01:42,505 So, from on top, it appears just as a line... 325 01:01:44,172 --> 01:01:47,543 collapsed into a single field. So this is Mexico. 326 01:01:47,909 --> 01:01:51,246 But then if we view it from the side, 327 01:01:51,280 --> 01:01:54,917 we see all of the targets, all the people who've been targeted 328 01:01:54,949 --> 01:01:58,019 by NSO software inside Mexico. 329 01:01:58,052 --> 01:02:00,455 So when we're seeing it in 3D, for example, 330 01:02:00,489 --> 01:02:05,126 we can see that some targets are operating in multiple fields, 331 01:02:05,159 --> 01:02:08,396 for example, Mazen and Citizen Lab operate 332 01:02:08,429 --> 01:02:11,532 in Mexico, Saudi Arabia and UAE. 333 01:02:11,565 --> 01:02:15,570 Our current database includes every event that we have 334 01:02:15,603 --> 01:02:18,940 which is an attack that's been performed using NSO software. 335 01:02:18,974 --> 01:02:20,676 And that database lists all the people 336 01:02:20,708 --> 01:02:22,911 that have been targeted by 337 01:02:22,945 --> 01:02:25,114 the state that has bought NSO software 338 01:02:25,146 --> 01:02:27,282 and is doing the targeting. 339 01:02:33,722 --> 01:02:36,225 I remember the moment when the project 340 01:02:36,257 --> 01:02:38,293 gained urgency in my mind, 341 01:02:38,327 --> 01:02:40,629 and that was with Fleming. 342 01:02:40,661 --> 01:02:45,934 This is NSO's first so-called "civilian product." 343 01:02:45,967 --> 01:02:49,538 It was described as a contact tracing tool to monitor both 344 01:02:49,570 --> 01:02:52,074 those who had caught Covid-19, 345 01:02:52,106 --> 01:02:56,210 but also those that they had come into contact with. 346 01:02:56,244 --> 01:03:00,516 It was reported that Fleming had been marketed to 347 01:03:00,548 --> 01:03:03,985 dozens of health ministries around the world. 348 01:03:05,619 --> 01:03:08,324 So, it was a set of alarm bells in my mind 349 01:03:08,356 --> 01:03:11,157 that the same cyber weapons manufacturer 350 01:03:11,159 --> 01:03:13,461 that had targeted former collaborators 351 01:03:13,494 --> 01:03:14,730 of Forensic Architecture, 352 01:03:14,762 --> 01:03:18,000 targeted my own personal friends and colleagues, 353 01:03:18,032 --> 01:03:20,601 and these are all human rights activists, 354 01:03:20,635 --> 01:03:23,539 researchers, lawyers, journalists... 355 01:03:23,572 --> 01:03:27,409 This same company is now offering its services 356 01:03:27,442 --> 01:03:31,512 to deal with private health details. 357 01:03:34,516 --> 01:03:38,721 When I first started working on these cases, 358 01:03:39,054 --> 01:03:41,757 it was clear that 359 01:03:41,789 --> 01:03:44,559 we're dealing with a company that 360 01:03:44,592 --> 01:03:47,596 does not have a lot of respect for human rights. 361 01:03:47,628 --> 01:03:51,032 Also if you look at the reporting about the company, 362 01:03:51,065 --> 01:03:52,634 the value of the company, 363 01:03:52,666 --> 01:03:54,569 the money that's involved, 364 01:03:54,603 --> 01:03:56,637 we're talking about hundreds of millions of dollars. 365 01:03:56,670 --> 01:03:58,773 Of course a lot of the people in Mexico 366 01:03:58,806 --> 01:04:01,676 that you represent have lost their jobs, 367 01:04:01,710 --> 01:04:04,612 they've had their offices broken into, 368 01:04:04,646 --> 01:04:06,782 they've had their partners killed. 369 01:04:06,815 --> 01:04:11,086 And so the state kills 43 students in Ayotzinapa, 370 01:04:11,119 --> 01:04:13,622 people report on it, they get hacked, 371 01:04:13,655 --> 01:04:16,725 then their lawyers get targeted, and so on. 372 01:04:16,757 --> 01:04:19,327 And so a lot of what we're seeing 373 01:04:19,360 --> 01:04:21,429 along the way is this escalation, 374 01:04:21,463 --> 01:04:24,099 this rise in the way that people are targeted. 375 01:04:24,132 --> 01:04:26,501 Not only they would gather information, 376 01:04:26,534 --> 01:04:29,105 but also they can send messages. 377 01:04:29,505 --> 01:04:35,577 So they can start managing your relationship with people 378 01:04:35,610 --> 01:04:39,213 by sending them all kind of information, 379 01:04:39,246 --> 01:04:42,116 messages that supposedly come from you. 380 01:04:42,150 --> 01:04:47,322 It's like somebody's sitting in your mind. 381 01:04:51,592 --> 01:04:54,596 The NSO group stands for the 3 persons 382 01:04:54,628 --> 01:04:57,331 who founded the company in 2010. 383 01:04:57,364 --> 01:05:00,468 Shalev Hulio is the S in NSO and 384 01:05:00,501 --> 01:05:02,603 perhaps the more well-known of the three. 385 01:05:02,637 --> 01:05:05,441 He's not exactly a technical wizard. 386 01:05:05,474 --> 01:05:08,376 He did not serve in Unit 8200, 387 01:05:08,409 --> 01:05:11,312 which is the intelligence unit in the Israeli Army. 388 01:05:11,346 --> 01:05:13,347 But Shalev Hulio did serve in the Israeli Army, 389 01:05:13,380 --> 01:05:14,583 and as a commander, 390 01:05:14,615 --> 01:05:16,652 he was involved in a series of operations 391 01:05:16,684 --> 01:05:18,519 in the occupied West Bank. 392 01:05:18,552 --> 01:05:20,822 One of his operations was during the height 393 01:05:20,856 --> 01:05:23,492 of the Second Intifada in 2002, 394 01:05:23,525 --> 01:05:26,394 which is Operation Defensive Shield. 395 01:05:26,427 --> 01:05:29,097 This extremely destructive operation 396 01:05:29,130 --> 01:05:31,432 involved sending soldiers 397 01:05:31,465 --> 01:05:34,869 straight through the walls of Palestinian homes, so 398 01:05:34,902 --> 01:05:36,605 instead of fighting their way 399 01:05:36,637 --> 01:05:38,306 through the alleyways of the camp, 400 01:05:38,340 --> 01:05:41,143 Israeli soldiers would smash their way 401 01:05:41,175 --> 01:05:43,545 through civilian homes to clear a path, 402 01:05:43,577 --> 01:05:46,681 blasting their way through the built environment, 403 01:05:46,715 --> 01:05:50,452 and mobilizing people's homes against their bodies. 404 01:05:58,726 --> 01:06:02,431 Do you currently...? Do you hold a security clearance right now? 405 01:06:02,463 --> 01:06:05,867 Nope, I've been this whistleblower guy in the past. 406 01:06:05,900 --> 01:06:09,370 My interests lie in helping to get 407 01:06:09,403 --> 01:06:11,806 whatever should be public, public. 408 01:06:12,474 --> 01:06:15,144 So you can think of me as a 409 01:06:15,177 --> 01:06:18,280 solutions executive with a software company. 410 01:06:18,313 --> 01:06:21,282 What it boiled down to was that we had access to the networks, 411 01:06:21,315 --> 01:06:23,651 and NSO was looking for access. 412 01:06:23,684 --> 01:06:25,853 So the access to the network would be... 413 01:06:25,887 --> 01:06:28,690 They would get a global title. 414 01:06:28,722 --> 01:06:30,592 They would have a piece of software into it 415 01:06:30,625 --> 01:06:31,659 that would have access 416 01:06:31,693 --> 01:06:33,829 to the live operator network. 417 01:06:34,195 --> 01:06:35,898 This was a conference call. 418 01:06:35,931 --> 01:06:39,367 They were very hesitant to share their names. 419 01:06:39,400 --> 01:06:41,702 I took their names and email addresses 420 01:06:41,735 --> 01:06:44,373 just in the event something bad were to happen. 421 01:06:44,672 --> 01:06:47,241 So I met with all these people... 422 01:06:47,275 --> 01:06:50,311 Omri, Eddy Shalev, Eran Gorev... 423 01:06:51,445 --> 01:06:52,714 Wow. 424 01:06:53,047 --> 01:06:56,284 There's a tremendous amount of value in that, 425 01:06:56,318 --> 01:06:59,488 to get access to operator signaling networks. 426 01:06:59,521 --> 01:07:01,524 It made me very uncomfortable. 427 01:07:02,757 --> 01:07:06,228 I did reach out to the FBI, multiple times... 428 01:07:06,260 --> 01:07:08,931 Do you know what happened with that information? 429 01:07:08,963 --> 01:07:12,668 I don't know, it was very silent after that. 430 01:07:13,501 --> 01:07:16,737 It's gonna take a second to process this. 431 01:07:16,771 --> 01:07:18,539 And are you in a position 432 01:07:18,572 --> 01:07:20,641 where you could provide access globally 433 01:07:20,675 --> 01:07:23,612 or just in the US or in what countries? 434 01:07:24,679 --> 01:07:25,681 Globally. 435 01:07:48,836 --> 01:07:50,706 Hey, it's me. 436 01:07:50,739 --> 01:07:53,375 So I'm having all these flashbacks. 437 01:07:53,407 --> 01:07:55,844 The first time Snowden contacted me, 438 01:07:55,876 --> 01:07:58,947 I was sitting here, I was in this room. 439 01:08:00,481 --> 01:08:03,252 There was a kind of demarcation 440 01:08:03,284 --> 01:08:06,520 of my life, before and after. 441 01:08:06,554 --> 01:08:07,855 Those I could trust, 442 01:08:07,889 --> 01:08:10,359 and then people who enter my life after, 443 01:08:10,391 --> 01:08:12,961 who are always in question, right? 444 01:08:12,993 --> 01:08:14,496 Uhmm... 445 01:08:14,529 --> 01:08:16,665 And even the people you knew before 446 01:08:16,698 --> 01:08:18,601 can always be flipped. 447 01:08:21,636 --> 01:08:22,972 And so... 448 01:08:23,838 --> 01:08:27,009 Listening to people tell this story 449 01:08:27,042 --> 01:08:29,411 about this kind of surveillance... 450 01:08:29,444 --> 01:08:32,748 It just hits home, right? It's super unnerving. 451 01:08:37,985 --> 01:08:40,721 I escaped from my country under 452 01:08:40,755 --> 01:08:43,292 the risk of being arrested. 453 01:08:43,958 --> 01:08:48,663 The field that I'm focusing on, it's a very sensitive field. 454 01:08:48,697 --> 01:08:54,735 I'm trying to record the violations of human rights, 455 01:08:54,769 --> 01:08:57,972 how they treat prisoners, detainees, 456 01:08:58,006 --> 01:09:00,008 if they were tortured... 457 01:09:00,041 --> 01:09:03,744 And my father, he is one of the detainees so 458 01:09:03,778 --> 01:09:07,849 I want to speak about him, and raise his case. 459 01:09:07,881 --> 01:09:11,519 And I'm his daughter, I have to do something. 460 01:09:11,552 --> 01:09:12,854 I have to tell you, 461 01:09:12,886 --> 01:09:15,323 as you're talking I'm trying to... 462 01:09:15,356 --> 01:09:17,826 Laura has definitely her experiences 463 01:09:17,859 --> 01:09:20,796 with being targeted and surveilled. 464 01:09:20,828 --> 01:09:25,599 My experiences with state violence are... 465 01:09:25,632 --> 01:09:28,069 have so far been more physical. 466 01:09:28,103 --> 01:09:31,340 In my family, we left Iran when we were young, 467 01:09:31,372 --> 01:09:34,608 and I'm just thinking that we left for political reasons, 468 01:09:34,641 --> 01:09:36,778 my parents were both political prisoners, 469 01:09:36,810 --> 01:09:39,680 and when we came here, we continued our politics... 470 01:09:39,713 --> 01:09:41,716 We would go to protest every week 471 01:09:41,750 --> 01:09:44,552 with other Iranian, Afghan... 472 01:09:44,586 --> 01:09:47,422 Kurdish refugees. 473 01:09:47,454 --> 01:09:48,989 My mother was part of the 474 01:09:49,023 --> 01:09:51,659 International Federation of Iranian Refugees, 475 01:09:51,693 --> 01:09:55,063 and she did it here because she was away from Iran. 476 01:09:55,095 --> 01:09:57,565 If she were to do that today, 477 01:09:57,599 --> 01:09:59,900 the Islamic Republic would be able to 478 01:09:59,934 --> 01:10:03,070 reach out and touch her, so to speak, 479 01:10:03,104 --> 01:10:05,474 in the way that your home government 480 01:10:05,506 --> 01:10:07,541 is reaching out and touching you. 481 01:10:07,574 --> 01:10:12,447 It's a completely different ball game for activists, 482 01:10:12,479 --> 01:10:16,351 and especially activists coming from places where... 483 01:10:17,286 --> 01:10:21,489 There is much more of a physical cost in resisting. 484 01:11:03,664 --> 01:11:05,533 The link between digital violence 485 01:11:05,567 --> 01:11:06,902 and physical violence 486 01:11:06,935 --> 01:11:09,571 becomes the most clear when we look at the cases 487 01:11:09,604 --> 01:11:11,507 from Saudi Arabia. 488 01:11:18,846 --> 01:11:20,849 He's writing articles, he's doing columns, 489 01:11:20,881 --> 01:11:22,116 he's giving talks. 490 01:11:22,149 --> 01:11:25,453 Then Omar Abdulazziz and Khashoggi communicate, 491 01:11:25,487 --> 01:11:26,788 and right after that, 492 01:11:26,820 --> 01:11:28,789 Abdulazziz gets targeted digitally. 493 01:11:28,823 --> 01:11:32,160 They communicated almost on a daily basis. 494 01:11:32,193 --> 01:11:34,930 That means that all the messages 495 01:11:34,962 --> 01:11:37,698 that they exchanged were there to be hacked 496 01:11:37,731 --> 01:11:40,502 because they were all saved on the WhatsApp account. 497 01:11:40,534 --> 01:11:44,872 That was a treasure that the government of Saudi Arabia found 498 01:11:44,905 --> 01:11:49,610 because they just discovered the nature of the relationship 499 01:11:50,645 --> 01:11:53,615 between two big dissidents. 500 01:11:55,149 --> 01:11:57,486 One month before they killed him, 501 01:11:57,519 --> 01:12:00,789 he sent me a private message on Twitter 502 01:12:01,456 --> 01:12:04,827 when I was attacked by Saudi bots and trolls. 503 01:12:05,493 --> 01:12:08,929 He told me, "Ghada, block them, 504 01:12:08,962 --> 01:12:11,832 "ignore them, and don't get upset. 505 01:12:11,865 --> 01:12:14,002 "Just block them like I do." 506 01:12:16,570 --> 01:12:19,173 And every day, the more we discovered 507 01:12:19,207 --> 01:12:21,576 what happened to him and how he was... 508 01:12:21,609 --> 01:12:24,846 how he went in, how they told him to sit down, 509 01:12:24,878 --> 01:12:27,248 how they came with the saw, 510 01:12:27,282 --> 01:12:30,752 how... when they started to... 511 01:12:35,256 --> 01:12:39,094 When he couldn't breathe, and then, you know, I was... 512 01:12:39,793 --> 01:12:43,164 The details, you know, it was so... 513 01:12:43,698 --> 01:12:48,170 I don't know how to describe it actually, it's a nightmare. 514 01:12:51,338 --> 01:12:55,143 My heart starts beating and I say, "God, please... 515 01:12:55,542 --> 01:12:59,046 "Let it be quickly, let me read something 516 01:12:59,079 --> 01:13:00,881 "that says he didn't suffer." 517 01:13:00,914 --> 01:13:04,719 He didn't have time to realize that he was killed 518 01:13:04,752 --> 01:13:08,724 by his own government, by his own people. 519 01:13:14,729 --> 01:13:19,067 This assassination was empowered with Israeli software, 520 01:13:19,100 --> 01:13:22,337 and since then, Saudi Arabia hasn't paid a price 521 01:13:22,369 --> 01:13:25,073 because of its alliances with America, 522 01:13:25,105 --> 01:13:28,076 its investments in Europe, and so on. 523 01:13:28,109 --> 01:13:33,014 So it's really the dispensability of our lives. 524 01:13:33,046 --> 01:13:35,783 That's something that became very clear. 525 01:14:00,707 --> 01:14:02,676 Officially on the record, 526 01:14:02,710 --> 01:14:06,146 NSO isn't allowed to operate in the United States. 527 01:14:06,180 --> 01:14:09,117 But it's attempted to enter American markets 528 01:14:09,149 --> 01:14:11,118 for the sale of its hacking software 529 01:14:11,152 --> 01:14:13,989 at least a couple of times that we know about. 530 01:14:14,021 --> 01:14:17,859 In 2016, they reached out to the San Diego Police Department 531 01:14:17,891 --> 01:14:21,028 to sell a version of Pegasus called Phantom. 532 01:14:43,016 --> 01:14:47,021 The brochure for Phantom boasts that it can intercept calls, 533 01:14:47,055 --> 01:14:48,823 do location tracking, 534 01:14:48,855 --> 01:14:50,658 access a person's messages, 535 01:14:50,692 --> 01:14:52,793 their browsing history, their social networks, 536 01:14:52,827 --> 01:14:54,329 their contact lists. 537 01:14:54,362 --> 01:14:57,699 So, we now know there is an appetite from the U.S. police 538 01:14:57,731 --> 01:14:59,768 for these kinds of tools. 539 01:15:00,368 --> 01:15:02,337 But in the context of a pandemic, 540 01:15:02,369 --> 01:15:04,972 where we are seeing rising inequality, 541 01:15:05,006 --> 01:15:08,076 in a context where communities are protesting en masse 542 01:15:08,109 --> 01:15:09,811 against racialized policing, 543 01:15:09,844 --> 01:15:11,913 it's extremely fucking scary 544 01:15:11,945 --> 01:15:14,215 to think of what incredible damage 545 01:15:14,247 --> 01:15:16,784 tools like Pegasus and Phantom 546 01:15:16,818 --> 01:15:19,887 can do in the hands of law enforcement. 547 01:33:37,884 --> 01:33:39,420 Dear Clyde, 548 01:33:39,787 --> 01:33:42,122 Your brother didn't make it. 549 01:33:42,154 --> 01:33:44,291 I don't have all the details, 550 01:33:44,323 --> 01:33:47,226 but I wanted you to hear it from me first. 551 01:33:47,260 --> 01:33:49,496 The Lord's been looking out for me, 552 01:33:49,529 --> 01:33:51,932 and I guess He saw it fit to let me know. 553 01:33:51,965 --> 01:33:56,302 He's called my sweet boy, your brother, to His side. 554 01:33:56,336 --> 01:33:58,438 As you know, he was doing poorly, 555 01:33:58,470 --> 01:34:00,306 but I'd hoped he'd hang in there until 556 01:34:00,340 --> 01:34:02,208 I made it back to fetch him. 557 01:34:02,242 --> 01:34:04,845 I guess it wasn't meant to be. 558 01:34:04,877 --> 01:34:06,445 I'll be... 559 01:34:20,393 --> 01:34:22,296 I'll be hitting the road in the morning 560 01:34:22,328 --> 01:34:24,297 to see him one last time 561 01:34:24,331 --> 01:34:25,932 before they bury him. 562 01:34:30,002 --> 01:34:33,072 I will let you know what I find out. 563 01:34:33,640 --> 01:34:35,476 Love, Dad. 564 01:34:40,881 --> 01:34:42,249 Dear Clyde, 565 01:34:43,216 --> 01:34:45,386 I saw your brother today. 566 01:34:45,685 --> 01:34:47,887 They had him set up in the church, 567 01:34:47,921 --> 01:34:50,090 him and all the rest of the dead. 568 01:34:50,590 --> 01:34:54,094 They wouldn't let me through the door for fear of catching it 569 01:34:54,127 --> 01:34:57,298 but I could see him from the threshold. 570 01:34:58,230 --> 01:35:00,099 So tiny. 571 01:35:00,934 --> 01:35:03,436 Just like he always was. 572 01:35:05,070 --> 01:35:08,041 They didn't tell me they were Presbyterians. 573 01:35:08,341 --> 01:35:11,143 I don't know how I feel about that. 574 01:35:11,176 --> 01:35:13,279 I don't know how I feel about them being the ones 575 01:35:13,313 --> 01:35:15,015 to bury him neither. 576 01:35:15,047 --> 01:35:16,916 But they say they can't release any of them bodies 577 01:35:16,949 --> 01:35:18,452 that don't have kin, 578 01:35:18,484 --> 01:35:21,954 be they Baptists, or Catholic or Buddhists even. 579 01:35:23,489 --> 01:35:25,626 Those are the rules. 580 01:35:27,627 --> 01:35:30,431 It was strange being back in a church. 581 01:35:31,297 --> 01:35:33,500 I didn't feel unwelcome. 582 01:35:33,533 --> 01:35:36,103 Nor did they cast an untowards eye at me 583 01:35:36,136 --> 01:35:37,938 when they heard my name. 584 01:35:37,970 --> 01:35:40,373 Maybe they don't know who I am. 585 01:35:40,407 --> 01:35:42,909 Wouldn't that be something? 586 01:35:43,710 --> 01:35:45,979 Or maybe they're just being kind. 587 01:35:49,716 --> 01:35:52,286 I haven't led the best life... 588 01:35:52,719 --> 01:35:55,055 I know you know this, 589 01:35:55,087 --> 01:35:58,358 but I hope some day we can talk about it. 590 01:35:59,158 --> 01:36:02,695 I hope you can find it in your heart to forgive me. 591 01:36:02,729 --> 01:36:06,367 Or, if not that, then to understand me. 592 01:36:06,966 --> 01:36:11,070 And think of me with something that isn't disappointment. 593 01:36:13,539 --> 01:36:15,708 A fellow just walked through here with his face 594 01:36:15,742 --> 01:36:17,476 all cut to pieces. 595 01:36:17,510 --> 01:36:20,079 I wonder what his story is. 596 01:36:20,546 --> 01:36:22,548 I look at the world sometimes and 597 01:36:22,582 --> 01:36:25,953 think it a wonder that I still recognize it. 598 01:36:27,186 --> 01:36:30,222 I wonder if I'd recognize you. 599 01:36:31,423 --> 01:36:33,726 I would call you if I had your number. 600 01:36:33,760 --> 01:36:35,162 But... 601 01:36:35,194 --> 01:36:38,498 Long silences are best endured in person. 602 01:36:38,899 --> 01:36:42,469 And I imagine, you and I, we'd have plenty of those. 603 01:36:42,969 --> 01:36:46,506 If you want to write, you can do so in care of 604 01:36:46,538 --> 01:36:49,208 the St. James Presbyterian Church... 605 01:36:49,242 --> 01:36:51,043 in Mildred. 606 01:36:51,077 --> 01:36:52,612 That's where your brother is. 607 01:36:52,645 --> 01:36:55,315 And that's where you'll be able to find me, 608 01:36:55,347 --> 01:36:57,717 at least until he's good and buried. 609 01:36:59,386 --> 01:37:01,455 Please do write. 610 01:37:01,488 --> 01:37:03,023 Let me know you got this. 611 01:37:03,055 --> 01:37:06,158 Please leave your message... 612 01:37:06,192 --> 01:37:08,494 Love, Dad. 613 01:37:14,801 --> 01:37:17,337 Clyde, I took him. 614 01:37:21,207 --> 01:37:23,276 I couldn't let them do it. 615 01:37:23,309 --> 01:37:25,145 It just wasn't right. 616 01:37:25,578 --> 01:37:27,614 I didn't make a fuss about it. 617 01:37:27,646 --> 01:37:30,350 I stole into the rectory at night, 618 01:37:30,382 --> 01:37:32,586 took his body in my arms, 619 01:37:32,886 --> 01:37:35,322 and bore him out of there. 620 01:37:35,354 --> 01:37:37,690 I was going to drive him back to Texas because 621 01:37:37,724 --> 01:37:40,260 I wanted to bury him next to your Ma. 622 01:37:40,760 --> 01:37:43,329 But before I even got to the border, 623 01:37:43,363 --> 01:37:46,432 that poor boy started to turn foul. 624 01:37:47,500 --> 01:37:51,505 I wrapped him in his sheet and found a good spot for him... 625 01:37:52,372 --> 01:37:54,375 where he'd be safe. 626 01:37:55,141 --> 01:37:59,445 It's too late for me now, but I got this notion that, 627 01:37:59,479 --> 01:38:01,782 you might finish what I started. 628 01:38:02,414 --> 01:38:05,418 It wouldn't be hard to find him if you knew where to look, 629 01:38:05,452 --> 01:38:07,654 so I drew you this map. 630 01:38:07,686 --> 01:38:10,157 Take the highway west out of Dallas, 631 01:38:10,189 --> 01:38:12,158 until you get to Neta Road. 632 01:38:12,192 --> 01:38:13,393 Go north. 633 01:38:13,426 --> 01:38:15,462 When you get to the church on your left, 634 01:38:15,494 --> 01:38:18,297 look for the old wagon path on the right. 635 01:38:18,331 --> 01:38:20,766 And take that until you get to the river. 636 01:38:20,800 --> 01:38:23,270 Stop when you get to the end of it. 637 01:38:23,302 --> 01:38:25,204 Thirteen paces from the river, 638 01:38:25,238 --> 01:38:29,142 between the two tallest elms is where I buried him. 639 01:38:29,175 --> 01:38:32,645 Deep enough that the coyotes won't find him. 640 01:38:32,679 --> 01:38:36,416 But not so deep that you'll have to dig for long. 641 01:38:39,219 --> 01:38:40,686 If you were to fetch him, 642 01:38:40,720 --> 01:38:43,490 and take him back to where he belongs, 643 01:38:44,023 --> 01:38:46,159 I could rest easy. 644 01:38:46,192 --> 01:38:49,362 I could say I've done all I need to do in this world. 645 01:38:49,395 --> 01:38:51,598 But don't do it for me. 646 01:38:52,064 --> 01:38:54,400 He loved you so. 647 01:38:55,534 --> 01:38:57,636 And even now, 648 01:38:57,670 --> 01:38:59,672 under all that dirt, 649 01:39:00,506 --> 01:39:03,342 I know he doesn't want to be alone. 650 01:39:05,478 --> 01:39:08,481 I trust these letters are making their way to you. 651 01:39:08,814 --> 01:39:11,884 I trust you've been hearing what people say about me, too. 652 01:39:11,917 --> 01:39:15,421 But I hope you know there's more to me than that. 653 01:39:15,721 --> 01:39:19,725 I think back often to the last time we were all together. 654 01:39:19,759 --> 01:39:22,529 You and me and your brother. 655 01:39:22,828 --> 01:39:24,630 And your Ma... 656 01:39:24,663 --> 01:39:27,533 in that little house in Medford. 657 01:39:28,534 --> 01:39:33,340 Even back then, I was failing every step I took. 658 01:39:34,573 --> 01:39:38,111 But with you two, I got things right. 659 01:39:39,578 --> 01:39:40,880 Clyde. 660 01:39:41,247 --> 01:39:43,483 I won't write again. 661 01:39:44,617 --> 01:39:46,753 But know that I love you. 662 01:39:47,654 --> 01:39:49,590 I surely do. 663 01:41:29,622 --> 01:41:31,858 Dear Clyde... 664 01:41:33,893 --> 01:41:37,230 Daddy said you'd be coming. 665 01:41:39,564 --> 01:41:42,668 He said you'd be coming to get me. 666 01:41:43,903 --> 01:41:46,472 I can hear you digging. 667 01:41:47,873 --> 01:41:50,909 I can hear you getting closer. 668 01:41:50,943 --> 01:41:52,279 And... 669 01:41:52,679 --> 01:41:55,582 I wish I could tell you to stop. 670 01:41:58,551 --> 01:42:01,755 I wish I could tell you I'm happy. 671 01:42:01,787 --> 01:42:04,857 And that I just want to go on resting. 672 01:42:06,725 --> 01:42:09,295 But I guess I can't. 673 01:42:10,896 --> 01:42:13,399 'Cause there you are. 674 01:42:17,904 --> 01:42:19,940 And I don't know... 675 01:42:22,574 --> 01:42:25,345 You look different than I remember. 676 01:42:28,680 --> 01:42:31,484 I wonder what happened to you. 677 01:42:35,454 --> 01:42:38,658 I wonder what the world looks like now. 678 01:42:46,399 --> 01:42:48,868 I guess you'll tell me what's changed, 679 01:42:48,900 --> 01:42:51,505 and what I missed out on. 680 01:42:53,538 --> 01:42:56,376 I didn't much like things the way they were 681 01:42:56,408 --> 01:42:58,478 when Daddy was around. 682 01:42:58,511 --> 01:43:00,847 But maybe that was because of him. 683 01:43:06,652 --> 01:43:09,823 Or maybe that was just everyone. 684 01:43:14,025 --> 01:43:16,528 All of the people I thought were good 685 01:43:16,561 --> 01:43:18,698 turned out to be bad. 686 01:43:19,198 --> 01:43:21,867 And I just want to sleep... 687 01:43:21,900 --> 01:43:24,770 so that I wouldn't have to see them. 688 01:43:26,005 --> 01:43:29,109 Except, I remember this one lady... 689 01:43:29,509 --> 01:43:33,479 She would take me to the window and let me look out. 690 01:43:33,512 --> 01:43:35,948 And there were birds in the sky. 691 01:43:36,248 --> 01:43:38,784 And even though it hurt so bad, 692 01:43:38,818 --> 01:43:40,954 she would look at me and say, 693 01:43:40,987 --> 01:43:44,591 "Well, at least it's a beautiful day." 694 01:43:45,725 --> 01:43:48,495 "At least it's a beautiful day." 695 01:43:48,927 --> 01:43:51,064 But I don't know if it was. 696 01:43:52,131 --> 01:43:54,768 I don't know if it ever was. 697 01:43:55,167 --> 01:43:58,572 I don't know if it ever will be again. 698 01:44:01,440 --> 01:44:02,675 Will it? 699 01:44:08,847 --> 01:44:12,851 But she would go on smiling all the same. 700 01:44:12,885 --> 01:44:16,655 And we'd sit and look out the window. 701 01:44:16,956 --> 01:44:19,426 And watch it get dark. 702 01:56:16,769 --> 01:56:21,769 Provided by explosiveskull https://twitter.com/kaboomskull