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[narrator] It's one of
the greatest alien abduction
stories of all time.
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In 1975, six men
in northeast Arizona
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witnessed their crew mate
kidnapped by a UFO.
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I hollered out,
"They got him!"
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[narrator]
But was Travis Walton
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really taken by aliens
or did his crewmates
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have something to do
with his disappearance?
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[John]
The sheriff kept telling me,
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"If you just tell us
where the body is?
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"If you just tell us
where the body is?
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We can all go home."
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[reporter 1] The six men
who reportedly eye witnessed
the incident
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have taken lie detector tests.
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[narrator] The story became
an international sensation,
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inspiring books,
and a Hollywood movie,
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and it ripped apart
a small town.
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This doesn't sound
like a true tale to me.
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[narrator] What happened
to Travis Walton
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that fateful night?
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What torture
was he subjected to?
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Forty five years later,
shocking new evidence
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Forty five years later,
shocking new evidence
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reveals the true story
behind...
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Fire in the Sky,
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the abduction
of Travis Walton.
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[dramatic music playing]
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[man 1] A.P.R.O.
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The Aerial Phenomena
Research Organization
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in Tucson, Arizona.
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They were seeing several
hundred reports of UFO
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sightings each year
from all over the world.
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But one of the most bizarre
reports came recently
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from A.P.R.O.'s own backyard,
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the town of
Snowflake, Arizona.
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[chainsaw buzzing]
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[narrator] The story
begins on an ordinary day.
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[narrator] The story
begins on an ordinary day.
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A seven men logging
crew packs up after hours
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of hard work
in the Apache-Sitgreaves
National Forest.
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[John] It was a typical
day of working hard
out there.
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We worked up until
the sun started going down.
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And by the time
we got all loaded up
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and ready to go,
it was getting fairly dark.
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[narrator]
The tight-knit crew begins
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the rough 30-mile drive back
home to Snowflake, Arizona.
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Foreman Mike Rogers
is behind the wheel
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when the men noticed
something strange.
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We hadn't gone very far.
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I mean, maybe
a quarter of a mile.
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The guys started seeing
a light through the trees.
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[Steve]
There was a bright light
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[Steve]
There was a bright light
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over to the right of us
and we couldn't really tell
what it was.
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[John] I first thought it
was the Moon.
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I turned, I looked over
the other way
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and there's the Moon,
you know?
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[narrator] Could it
be a hunter's campfire?
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An airplane crash?
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The answer
is even more terrifying.
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Right when you
come around that bend
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it just hits you all at once.
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It was just like a saucer
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just sat in the air,
not moving.
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It was, uh, softly glowing.
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Like from the inside out.
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[narrator] Twenty-two-year-old
Travis Walton
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in the passenger seat
startles everyone.
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Before Mike even stopped,
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Travis had, had the door
open and was getting out.
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[Mike] Travis took off
in a fairly brisk walk up
towards it.
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[Mike] Travis took off
in a fairly brisk walk up
towards it.
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And he stood there
for just a few seconds
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and this thing
started making noise.
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[eerie sound]
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It was shocking,
very shocking.
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I heard this noise,
I go, "Oh, crap."
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I felt this rumble, you know,
in the steering wheel.
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That spooked me.
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[indistinct shouting]
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We were yelling,
"Come on, get back in here!"
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Travis, come back!
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[John] We were all terrified.
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[John] We were all terrified.
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And all of the sudden,
this bluish light came out.
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The woods lit up
like a bluish green.
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It zapped him in the chest.
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He flies back
about 15 feet at least.
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His body
bounces off the ground.
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Mike turns on the pickup
and takes off.
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[Mike] There was blind panic.
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White knuckles.
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We went down the road
about a quarter of a mile...
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...then I hit the brakes.
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[tires screeching]
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[indistinct chatter]
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The guys in the truck
were saying,
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"What are you stopping for?
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That thing could be
chasing us," you know?
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And I said, "We left
Travis back there.
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So, we have to go back."
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That's when I became
hysterical, basically.
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Go back, right now.
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Go back, right now.
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You don't know what it was.
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We have
to go back and get him.
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While we were outside
of the truck we saw a flash.
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Now, I assumed
it was that craft.
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Just in a straight, just...
Like that.
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[Steve] Everybody got
their courage back
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till we saw it take off.
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[John] Couldn't leave
Travis out there.
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You just don't leave
a guy behind.
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[Mike] We went back...
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...very slow.
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Buddy!
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Travis!
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[John] We walked around
the perimeter
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looking in the bushes
and that, you know,
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to see if he had crawled off.
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-Travis.
-Travis!
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Travis!
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Travis!
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[John] But he was
nowhere to be found.
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That's when Mike,
he kinda fell down
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That's when Mike,
he kinda fell down
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to the ground
and kinda lost it.
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I broke down.
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I broke down because Travis
wasn't there.
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He was my best friend.
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[narrator]
Guilt-ridden, terrified
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and in way over their heads,
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and in way over their heads,
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the crew members decide to
call law enforcement for help.
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[Mike] We all got back
in the truck, and we left.
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And that was a very,
very emotional trip.
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All right, there's telephone.
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[Steve] There's this phone
at the sub station
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as we get coming off
the dirt road.
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We called
the sheriff's apartment.
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We called
the sheriff's apartment.
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[narrator] The first
officer arriving on scene
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is Navajo County sheriff's
deputy, Chuck Ellison.
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[Chuck Ellison] They were
obviously very upset.
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And I tried to get just
as close to each one of them
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as I could to see
if I could detect odors
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of marihuana, alcohol...
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I didn't detect any.
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[narrator]
Sensing something amiss,
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Ellison talks to each
member of the crew.
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Ellison talks to each
member of the crew.
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Starting with foreman
Mike Rogers.
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[John] Mike, he was
the boss, you know?
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He called the shots
and how things go,
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where you're gonna go,
you know, and all that.
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[narrator] The missing man,
Travis Walton,
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dated Mike's sister, Dana.
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Also in the crew is Mike's
brother-in-law John Goulette.
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John's the kind of person
who gets along with everybody.
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[John] I've known Travis
for a long, long time.
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I met him
when he was a teenager
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when I came up there
to stay with Katie and Mike.
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[narrator] Goulette
brought two other friends
onto the crew.
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Dwayne Smith and Allen Dalis.
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Allen Dalis was a...
Mike said, "the black sheep."
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here on the crew.
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[John] He was a character.
He was...
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You know, he had his run ins
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with the law and that,
you know.
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[narrator] Rounding up
the crew are 26-year-old
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Kenny Peterson
and 17-year-old's
Steve Pierce.
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I was the gofer, you know?
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'Cause I was the youngest.
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[narrator] When the frightened
crew members tell
Deputy Ellison
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that Travis was attacked
by a UFO,
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Ellison calls in his superior,
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Sheriff Marlin Gillespie.
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[Shelley Moore]
Marlin Gillespie
was my father.
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He was the sheriff
of Navajo County
for many years.
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He was the sheriff
of Navajo County
for many years.
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At the time
that the incident occurred
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they called my father out
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to involve him
and other deputies.
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[Steve] Sheriff Gillespie
showed up
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and we told him what happened,
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and he was looking around
for beer bottles and stuff,
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'cause he didn't really
believe our story.
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[Shelley] He thought
that these men saw something.
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That part he believed because
he said they were scared,
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but he wasn't sure
were they scared
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because of what they had done
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because of what they had done
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or were they really scared
because what they believed
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that Travis
had been taken by a UFO?
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[Steve] He looked at Mike,
he says,
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"You gotta go back
and I want two volunteers
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to come back with me.
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The other three, I want you
to go back to Snowflake
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and don't leave town."
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[narrator] Mike Rogers,
Allen Dalis
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and Kenny Peterson
lead the sheriff
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and his deputies to the site.
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There's no trace of Travis.
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Or the alleged craft.
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I could not see
a skid mark of any kind, like,
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as if some kind of aircraft
that touched on the ground.
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I could not see a footprint
of any kind.
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I couldn't detect any odors.
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I didn't see any burns,
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and I said, "Well,
we may as well leave
because he's not here."
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[narrator] Without industrial
lightning equipment
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[narrator] Without industrial
lightning equipment
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or a huge force of officers,
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the small-town sheriff's
hands are tied.
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He'll have to wait
until morning to launch
a search party
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to find out if Travis
Walton is injured,
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dead or is it possible
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that he was abducted
by aliens?
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[instrumental music playing]
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[narrator] Twenty-two-year-old
Travis Walton is missing.
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Travis' older brother, Don,
recalls the night
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that changed
his family's life forever.
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[Don] Mother came over
to my home about three o'clock
in the morning.
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Mama's pretty hysterical
when she got there.
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She kept repeating,
"They got him. They got him."
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I didn't know what to think.
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[narrator] Across town,
the other crewmen's families
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anxiously await the arrival
of their loved ones.
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[Angie] I was at Mike's
house because
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Mike's then wife, Katie,
and I were putting on a quilt.
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We were gonna make this big
ole quilt for a wedding,
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and Mike didn't come home
when he normally does.
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Once it's dark you can't saw
trees out in the woods.
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We were starting to get
kind of worried about him.
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00:12:54,447 --> 00:12:56,166
We were starting to get
kind of worried about him.
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Katie's younger brother
worked with Mike, too.
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John Goulette,
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00:13:01,767 --> 00:13:04,667
so she was worried
about him as well.
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[narrator] But when Mike
finally does make it home,
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his family's worries
only intensify.
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They started telling
us what was going on...
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00:13:14,166 --> 00:13:16,200
[dramatic music playing]
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That's when we found out
that it was Travis
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00:13:24,447 --> 00:13:25,266
That's when we found out
that it was Travis
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that was missing,
and my brother Mike
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looked like he had aged 20-30
years just in that day.
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00:13:34,266 --> 00:13:38,100
Mike felt this big, huge
weight on his shoulders.
247
00:13:38,166 --> 00:13:41,400
He felt
responsible for Travis.
248
00:13:41,467 --> 00:13:43,900
[narrator] Mike and Angie's
little sister, Dana,
249
00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:48,967
who dated Travis at the time,
can't believe what she hears.
250
00:13:48,967 --> 00:13:52,867
Was her boyfriend
attacked by an alien ship?
251
00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:56,867
They just
told me what happened.
252
00:13:56,967 --> 00:13:59,000
I think they said "UFO."
253
00:13:59,066 --> 00:14:03,500
And I was, you know, kind of
shocked about what happened.
254
00:14:03,567 --> 00:14:04,900
Like, it was hard to believe.
255
00:14:05,867 --> 00:14:07,100
But it was really scary,
256
00:14:07,166 --> 00:14:10,700
I was really worried
about Travis,
257
00:14:10,767 --> 00:14:12,867
but I could tell those guys
were telling the truth.
258
00:14:12,967 --> 00:14:14,700
They seemed very traumatized.
259
00:14:15,467 --> 00:14:17,500
It scares the hell out of you
260
00:14:17,567 --> 00:14:21,367
because your reality
just becomes so different.
261
00:14:21,367 --> 00:14:23,467
[dramatic music playing]
262
00:14:29,066 --> 00:14:31,100
[serene music playing]
263
00:14:35,967 --> 00:14:38,166
[narrator] As rays of early
morning sunlight
264
00:14:38,166 --> 00:14:40,567
stretch across
Navajo County, Arizona,
265
00:14:41,567 --> 00:14:43,767
the sleepy town of Snowflake
266
00:14:43,867 --> 00:14:47,867
awakens to an unearthly,
unsolved mystery.
267
00:14:49,500 --> 00:14:51,567
When we got up
the next morning, you know,
268
00:14:51,567 --> 00:14:54,447
my mother had let us know that
my father was investigating
269
00:14:54,447 --> 00:14:54,567
my mother had let us know that
my father was investigating
270
00:14:54,567 --> 00:14:56,200
something that had happened
271
00:14:56,266 --> 00:14:58,467
out in the woods and that
somebody had been abducted
272
00:14:58,767 --> 00:15:00,100
by a UFO.
273
00:15:01,266 --> 00:15:04,266
[narrator]
News of Travis Walton's
UFO abduction
274
00:15:04,266 --> 00:15:07,166
spreads like wildfire.
275
00:15:07,166 --> 00:15:09,166
I've always thought
there could be UFO,
276
00:15:09,266 --> 00:15:11,100
but, uh... That story's
kinda farfetched.
277
00:15:11,166 --> 00:15:12,166
We've seen 'em.
278
00:15:12,266 --> 00:15:13,667
-You've seen 'em?
-Yeah.
279
00:15:13,767 --> 00:15:17,867
This doesn't sound
like a true tale to me.
280
00:15:17,867 --> 00:15:21,367
[Tammy Mills] My father was
the deputy sheriff
in Navajo County.
281
00:15:21,467 --> 00:15:23,467
I remember my father
coming home
282
00:15:23,467 --> 00:15:24,447
and talking about it
and he was rolling his eyes,
283
00:15:24,447 --> 00:15:27,166
and talking about it
and he was rolling his eyes,
284
00:15:27,166 --> 00:15:29,667
like... Hmm.
285
00:15:29,667 --> 00:15:32,300
[Shelley] There was
a lot of skepticism.
286
00:15:32,367 --> 00:15:34,800
Most people were having
a hard time believing it.
287
00:15:36,100 --> 00:15:37,967
[John] It's a very
religious community.
288
00:15:39,300 --> 00:15:41,100
The elders
of the church and that,
289
00:15:41,166 --> 00:15:43,066
they were telling people,
"Hey, you know,
290
00:15:43,066 --> 00:15:44,700
this ain't true.
You all don't believe it."
291
00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:48,467
[Mike] My wife didn't know
whether to believe it
292
00:15:48,467 --> 00:15:50,000
or not, you know?
293
00:15:50,066 --> 00:15:51,567
She was skeptical, you know?
294
00:15:55,166 --> 00:15:57,266
[narrator] As the town
of Snowflake debates
295
00:15:57,266 --> 00:15:59,667
the existence of aliens
and UFOs,
296
00:16:00,266 --> 00:16:01,467
the rest of the world
297
00:16:01,567 --> 00:16:04,867
focusses their attention
on human space flight.
298
00:16:04,867 --> 00:16:07,567
[man 2 over radio] Moving out.
Clear the tower.
299
00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:11,300
[man 3 over radio]
Roger. Tower clear.
300
00:16:11,367 --> 00:16:15,467
[narrator]
Just seven years earlier,
Apollo 11 first landed humans
301
00:16:15,567 --> 00:16:19,467
on the Moon, and just
a few months earlier,
302
00:16:19,467 --> 00:16:22,567
in July of 1975,
303
00:16:22,667 --> 00:16:24,447
the decade's long space race
between the United States
304
00:16:24,447 --> 00:16:25,867
the decade's long space race
between the United States
305
00:16:25,867 --> 00:16:27,266
and the Soviet Union
306
00:16:27,367 --> 00:16:29,867
officially came
to a peaceful end.
307
00:16:32,700 --> 00:16:36,266
Proving that space
exploration could overcome
308
00:16:36,266 --> 00:16:40,600
such earth-bound conflicts
as politics and nationalism.
309
00:16:47,266 --> 00:16:50,266
Yet as mankind casts
its hopeful eyes
310
00:16:50,266 --> 00:16:54,447
to the sky, other mysteries
from deepest space emerge.
311
00:16:54,447 --> 00:16:55,100
to the sky, other mysteries
from deepest space emerge.
312
00:16:59,300 --> 00:17:02,567
Reports of UFO sightings
and alien abductions
313
00:17:02,567 --> 00:17:05,266
were on the rise
in the mid-1970s.
314
00:17:08,867 --> 00:17:13,567
1975 in particular was a,
uh, an active year for UFOs.
315
00:17:13,667 --> 00:17:15,900
Across the country
there were sightings,
316
00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:17,567
and we call this a flap.
317
00:17:17,567 --> 00:17:19,700
It's a period
of activity researchers,
318
00:17:19,767 --> 00:17:22,567
uh, look for patterns as to
why this particular location,
319
00:17:22,667 --> 00:17:24,100
why this time?
320
00:17:25,367 --> 00:17:28,300
[narrator] The state
of Arizona routinely ranks
321
00:17:28,367 --> 00:17:30,400
among the top areas
in the world
322
00:17:30,467 --> 00:17:32,767
for UFO-related events.
323
00:17:34,066 --> 00:17:36,500
[Ben Hansen] If you go back
to the summer of '47
324
00:17:36,567 --> 00:17:39,467
there's newspaper
articles of a craft
325
00:17:39,467 --> 00:17:41,667
similar to what was
described in Roswell
326
00:17:41,667 --> 00:17:44,367
that happened only weeks
or months before.
327
00:17:45,700 --> 00:17:48,867
Then you have 1952,
the Marana Air Force Base.
328
00:17:48,867 --> 00:17:51,200
A silvery disk
was reported hovering
329
00:17:51,266 --> 00:17:54,000
over the air force base
and when they scrambled jets
330
00:17:54,100 --> 00:17:54,447
to try and get to it,
it disappeared.
331
00:17:54,447 --> 00:17:56,000
to try and get to it,
it disappeared.
332
00:18:01,467 --> 00:18:03,467
[Bryce Zabel] The American
Southwest is home
333
00:18:03,467 --> 00:18:05,800
to all kinds
of military installations.
334
00:18:05,867 --> 00:18:08,400
It's where we created
the first nuclear bombs.
335
00:18:09,100 --> 00:18:10,600
[explosion]
336
00:18:11,567 --> 00:18:13,667
It's where Roswell happened.
337
00:18:13,667 --> 00:18:15,900
Why does all this
happen with UFOs?
338
00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:20,000
Because it's so important to
the United States government
339
00:18:20,100 --> 00:18:22,500
and to our military projection
of power,
340
00:18:22,567 --> 00:18:24,447
and so it would make sense
that if another intelligence
341
00:18:24,447 --> 00:18:26,367
and so it would make sense
that if another intelligence
342
00:18:26,367 --> 00:18:29,667
was here to find out
what makes humans tick,
343
00:18:29,667 --> 00:18:31,100
they might start there.
344
00:18:32,266 --> 00:18:35,567
[narrator] Is there something
in the Southwest territory
345
00:18:35,567 --> 00:18:39,500
that attracts
extra-planetary explorers?
346
00:18:42,567 --> 00:18:45,000
Authorities in Snowflake
don't believe claims
347
00:18:45,066 --> 00:18:48,867
that Travis Walton
was abducted by aliens.
348
00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:53,266
But with the loggers
whereabout unaccounted for,
349
00:18:53,266 --> 00:18:54,447
law enforcements
launches a massive manhunt.
350
00:18:54,447 --> 00:18:56,066
law enforcements
launches a massive manhunt.
351
00:18:57,767 --> 00:18:59,567
[Shelley] The sheriff's
department went up
352
00:18:59,567 --> 00:19:01,667
on the rim
to the Turkey Springs area
353
00:19:01,767 --> 00:19:04,700
where this incident
supposedly occurred.
354
00:19:04,767 --> 00:19:07,867
They had the sheriff's posse
out looking for him.
355
00:19:09,767 --> 00:19:12,300
[Angie] They had helicopters
and they had dogs.
356
00:19:13,367 --> 00:19:15,266
There's people just walking.
357
00:19:16,667 --> 00:19:18,667
They had all kinds of stuff
looking for him
358
00:19:18,767 --> 00:19:20,767
and they just looked
and looked and looked.
359
00:19:21,867 --> 00:19:23,867
[narrator] Travis' older
brother Don,
360
00:19:23,867 --> 00:19:24,447
a forest service employee,
joins the search party.
361
00:19:24,447 --> 00:19:27,767
a forest service employee,
joins the search party.
362
00:19:28,567 --> 00:19:29,967
It was a madhouse out there.
363
00:19:32,867 --> 00:19:35,266
There's probably
150-200 people
364
00:19:35,367 --> 00:19:37,567
out searching for Travis.
365
00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:40,100
[narrator]
The longer they look,
366
00:19:40,166 --> 00:19:43,367
the more law enforcement
and Travis' family
367
00:19:43,467 --> 00:19:46,100
become suspicious
of foul play.
368
00:19:48,300 --> 00:19:51,667
[Tammy] They were thinking
the crew got
369
00:19:51,667 --> 00:19:54,447
in some kind of a skirmish
and maybe killed Travis.
370
00:19:54,447 --> 00:19:54,967
in some kind of a skirmish
and maybe killed Travis.
371
00:19:56,400 --> 00:19:59,367
[Angie] Travis' family
was all looking at Mike,
372
00:19:59,367 --> 00:20:02,467
like, "Okay, Mike,
where's our Travis?"
373
00:20:04,300 --> 00:20:06,467
[Don] I thought maybe
a bad accident
374
00:20:06,467 --> 00:20:10,900
had happened where
the chainsaw may hit his body.
375
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:13,200
[John] I did the first day,
I went out there with them.
376
00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:17,767
They kinda split us up and had
us go in different routes.
377
00:20:17,767 --> 00:20:20,367
And each group had
a deputy sheriff.
378
00:20:20,467 --> 00:20:22,600
He kept telling me, you know,
"If you just tell us
379
00:20:22,667 --> 00:20:24,447
where the body is,
we can all go home."
380
00:20:24,447 --> 00:20:25,266
where the body is,
we can all go home."
381
00:20:26,767 --> 00:20:28,800
[narrator]
Although they reported Travis
382
00:20:28,867 --> 00:20:31,500
was captured by a UFO,
383
00:20:31,567 --> 00:20:35,967
the crew now realize they're
suspected of murder.
384
00:20:37,467 --> 00:20:39,867
[Chuck] As we started going
through these brush piles,
385
00:20:41,100 --> 00:20:42,800
I wanna know
if there's anything
386
00:20:42,867 --> 00:20:45,567
in those brush piles
that might resemble a body.
387
00:20:48,367 --> 00:20:51,367
Couldn't figure out
what would happen to him,
where he went, you know?
388
00:20:51,467 --> 00:20:53,300
We were all confused,
we couldn't figure out
389
00:20:53,367 --> 00:20:54,447
why we couldn't find a body.
390
00:20:54,447 --> 00:20:54,767
why we couldn't find a body.
391
00:20:57,300 --> 00:20:59,367
[narrator] Travis Walton
may have disappeared
392
00:20:59,467 --> 00:21:00,667
without a trace,
393
00:21:01,266 --> 00:21:02,567
but there is evidence
394
00:21:02,567 --> 00:21:07,166
that something very strange
happened in those woods.
395
00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:11,266
[Don] Region headquarters
in Albuquerque,
396
00:21:11,367 --> 00:21:13,467
they sent a man over
at the request
397
00:21:13,467 --> 00:21:16,767
of the sheriff's department
to bring a Geiger counter.
398
00:21:18,867 --> 00:21:23,467
Today I am the only
living person
399
00:21:24,567 --> 00:21:27,066
who saw the readings
on that Geiger counter.
400
00:21:28,667 --> 00:21:32,400
[narrator] Don claims
he witnessed the Geiger
counter needles spike.
401
00:21:34,100 --> 00:21:36,900
Indicating a high
level of radiation
402
00:21:37,000 --> 00:21:38,700
at the alleged UFO site.
403
00:21:43,500 --> 00:21:44,767
[Don] It was off scale.
404
00:21:45,867 --> 00:21:47,600
You could see
the difference in the...
405
00:21:47,667 --> 00:21:49,266
What the needle was showing.
406
00:21:50,667 --> 00:21:53,500
It would drop off after,
at 100 yards.
407
00:21:55,700 --> 00:21:58,200
That scared me.
That kind of radiation.
408
00:21:58,266 --> 00:22:00,400
[Geiger counter crackling]
409
00:22:03,166 --> 00:22:06,467
[narrator] Could high levels
of localize radiation
410
00:22:06,467 --> 00:22:09,467
be evidence of an alien craft?
411
00:22:13,300 --> 00:22:14,767
[instrumental music playing]
412
00:22:24,567 --> 00:22:26,567
[reporter 2] Wood cutters
said they were riding
413
00:22:26,667 --> 00:22:29,266
in this truck along
an isolated mountain road
414
00:22:29,367 --> 00:22:32,100
when suddenly a spaceship
hovered over them.
415
00:22:32,166 --> 00:22:34,567
This is what the spaceship
looked like according
416
00:22:34,667 --> 00:22:36,900
to one of the men
who drew this picture.
417
00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:40,266
Another of the men,
22-year-old Travis Walton
418
00:22:40,266 --> 00:22:41,867
reportedly got out
of the truck
419
00:22:41,867 --> 00:22:42,664
and approached the spaceship.
420
00:22:42,664 --> 00:22:43,367
and approached the spaceship.
421
00:22:45,700 --> 00:22:48,567
[narrator] As law enforcement
and volunteers scour
422
00:22:48,567 --> 00:22:52,467
the Sitgreaves National Forest
for a second day,
423
00:22:52,467 --> 00:22:56,266
the search for Travis Walton
and the sensational claim
424
00:22:56,266 --> 00:23:00,100
of his UFO abduction makes
headlines around the world.
425
00:23:02,567 --> 00:23:06,200
Media outlets descend upon
Walton's hometown
426
00:23:06,266 --> 00:23:07,700
of Snowflake, Arizona.
427
00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:11,567
Our town had never really had
any reporters at all,
428
00:23:11,567 --> 00:23:12,664
and then all of the sudden
there's like people
429
00:23:12,664 --> 00:23:13,500
and then all of the sudden
there's like people
430
00:23:13,567 --> 00:23:16,100
from all over the world,
all different countries.
431
00:23:16,166 --> 00:23:18,166
[Angie] It was just
the strangest thing
432
00:23:18,266 --> 00:23:20,767
that the word got out
that fast.
433
00:23:20,867 --> 00:23:24,100
I think there was even some
reporters from Japan.
434
00:23:24,166 --> 00:23:25,567
[reporters clamoring]
435
00:23:25,600 --> 00:23:28,266
[narrator]
The media hounds everyone
involved in the case.
436
00:23:29,266 --> 00:23:32,166
Including
Sheriff Marlin Gillespie.
437
00:23:32,166 --> 00:23:34,900
I just remember the phones
were ringing off the hook.
438
00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:37,667
[phone ringing]
439
00:23:37,767 --> 00:23:40,600
No one had pagers,
no one had cellphones
440
00:23:40,667 --> 00:23:42,664
and my father
couldn't take the phone
441
00:23:42,664 --> 00:23:42,700
and my father
couldn't take the phone
442
00:23:42,767 --> 00:23:44,600
off the hook because
he depended on that.
443
00:23:44,667 --> 00:23:46,367
They needed to get
ahold of them for work.
444
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:51,166
[narrator] But reporters
aren't the only
curious visitors
445
00:23:51,166 --> 00:23:53,000
to suddenly appear
in Snowflake.
446
00:23:53,100 --> 00:23:56,567
Mysterious out
of towners cramp up
447
00:23:56,567 --> 00:23:58,166
amongst the search parties.
448
00:24:00,867 --> 00:24:04,200
You always tell, back then,
a government car
449
00:24:04,266 --> 00:24:06,767
because it was just
a ugly color.
450
00:24:06,767 --> 00:24:10,100
And the rims always
matched the color of the car.
451
00:24:11,266 --> 00:24:12,664
There'd be two guys
sitting in there.
452
00:24:12,664 --> 00:24:13,100
There'd be two guys
sitting in there.
453
00:24:13,166 --> 00:24:15,600
Suits and sunglasses
just watching you.
454
00:24:15,667 --> 00:24:19,100
[Ben] Most people know the Men
in Black from pop culture
455
00:24:19,166 --> 00:24:21,667
but there have
been historically
456
00:24:21,667 --> 00:24:23,166
verified incidents
457
00:24:23,166 --> 00:24:25,367
where unidentified
government agents
458
00:24:25,367 --> 00:24:27,400
follow up on cases like this.
459
00:24:28,767 --> 00:24:30,467
[John] I take off
to go somewhere
460
00:24:30,567 --> 00:24:33,266
and by the time I got
to where I was gonna go
461
00:24:33,367 --> 00:24:35,166
they were already sitting
there waiting.
462
00:24:35,266 --> 00:24:37,266
You know?
I don't know how they knew
where I was going.
463
00:24:38,467 --> 00:24:40,667
[Bryce] People have suspected
over the years
464
00:24:40,767 --> 00:24:42,664
that among that crowd
of people that included
journalists
465
00:24:42,664 --> 00:24:44,100
that among that crowd
of people that included
journalists
466
00:24:44,166 --> 00:24:48,400
and UFO observers
were people from
the United States government
467
00:24:48,467 --> 00:24:50,600
who wanted to know
more about this case.
468
00:24:50,667 --> 00:24:52,367
And why would they
wanna know more about it?
469
00:24:52,367 --> 00:24:55,667
Because they knew UFOs were
real whether they admitted it
470
00:24:55,667 --> 00:24:58,667
to the public or not,
but, uh, they thought
471
00:24:58,767 --> 00:25:01,000
that the Travis Walton case
was a pretty good case.
472
00:25:01,066 --> 00:25:03,367
[intense music playing]
473
00:25:20,367 --> 00:25:24,200
[narrator] Travis has now
been missing for three days.
474
00:25:24,266 --> 00:25:29,100
His loved ones face
an agonizing lack of answers.
475
00:25:29,166 --> 00:25:31,900
[Dana] I think everybody
got more and more worried.
476
00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:35,600
Everybody was more
tense and scared
477
00:25:35,667 --> 00:25:37,200
the longer the time went by.
478
00:25:39,266 --> 00:25:41,767
[narrator] With every
passing hour the crew
479
00:25:41,867 --> 00:25:42,664
feels the crushing
pressure of suspicion.
480
00:25:42,664 --> 00:25:44,400
feels the crushing
pressure of suspicion.
481
00:25:45,567 --> 00:25:46,767
[Steve] I wasn't going out.
482
00:25:46,767 --> 00:25:48,367
I was hiding
at a girlfriend's house
483
00:25:48,367 --> 00:25:51,166
and staying away
from everybody.
484
00:25:51,266 --> 00:25:54,367
I'd say four out of five
people thought, you know,
485
00:25:54,367 --> 00:25:57,266
it was either a hoax or,
or was a murder or something.
486
00:25:58,300 --> 00:25:59,800
[narrator]
Even without a body,
487
00:25:59,867 --> 00:26:02,467
the sheriff's department
investigates the case
488
00:26:02,567 --> 00:26:03,900
as a homicide.
489
00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:08,667
It doesn't take long
to zero in on a suspect.
490
00:26:10,066 --> 00:26:12,367
Crew member Allen Dalis.
491
00:26:13,367 --> 00:26:15,300
[Steve] The cops,
they found out
492
00:26:15,367 --> 00:26:18,700
about a fight that Travis
and Allen Dalis was in.
493
00:26:21,367 --> 00:26:24,500
He'd fight anybody, and he
could get pretty ornery.
494
00:26:24,567 --> 00:26:26,100
He didn't
like Mike and Travis.
495
00:26:28,967 --> 00:26:31,367
[Don] I was pretty confident
in my head at that time
496
00:26:31,467 --> 00:26:34,000
that Allen
had something to do with this.
497
00:26:34,066 --> 00:26:36,166
I accused him
of killing Travis.
498
00:26:39,567 --> 00:26:41,266
[narrator] Authorities
turn up the heat
499
00:26:41,266 --> 00:26:42,664
on the remaining crew members.
500
00:26:42,664 --> 00:26:43,000
on the remaining crew members.
501
00:26:44,266 --> 00:26:46,266
[Tammy] I remember
my dad saying
502
00:26:46,367 --> 00:26:50,266
that Marlin Gillespie was
questioning the boys down
503
00:26:50,266 --> 00:26:52,100
saying, "Just admit,
you killed him.
504
00:26:52,166 --> 00:26:53,600
Just admit it."
505
00:26:53,667 --> 00:26:55,300
[Steve]
Flake pulls up and he says,
506
00:26:55,367 --> 00:26:57,000
"We know you didn't do
the killing,
507
00:26:57,066 --> 00:27:00,066
but we know for sure
that Allen Dalis killed Travis
508
00:27:00,066 --> 00:27:02,567
or Jon Goulette killed him."
509
00:27:02,667 --> 00:27:06,400
[John] Once I figured out
what they were doing
and what they thought,
510
00:27:06,467 --> 00:27:08,800
you know, I pretty much stayed
away from the cops, you know.
511
00:27:10,567 --> 00:27:12,166
[narrator]
The sheriff's department
512
00:27:12,166 --> 00:27:12,664
asks Mike Rogers
and the other crewmen
513
00:27:12,664 --> 00:27:14,100
asks Mike Rogers
and the other crewmen
514
00:27:14,166 --> 00:27:16,900
to submit
to a polygraph examination.
515
00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:22,967
Rogers jumps at the chance
to clear their names.
516
00:27:22,967 --> 00:27:25,400
We told him, you know,
"We'll take polygraph test.
517
00:27:25,467 --> 00:27:28,900
We'll... We'll take
sodium pentothal, hypnosis,
518
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:32,166
anything you can give us
because this thing
really happened
519
00:27:32,166 --> 00:27:35,400
and we don't like this
thing about you accusing us
of murder."
520
00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:44,367
[narrator]
The men are summoned
521
00:27:44,467 --> 00:27:46,800
to take polygraph tests
at the Navajo County
522
00:27:46,867 --> 00:27:48,767
courthouse in nearby Holbrook.
523
00:27:49,367 --> 00:27:51,200
It was scary, really scary
524
00:27:52,300 --> 00:27:54,900
to go into that courthouse.
525
00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:57,367
The courthouse and the jail
was the same building.
526
00:27:58,867 --> 00:28:03,000
[Steve] I was more scared
the day of the polygraph test
527
00:28:03,066 --> 00:28:05,767
than I was when I saw
Travis getting zapped.
528
00:28:06,900 --> 00:28:10,166
[John] I didn't know who
was gonna give us this test.
529
00:28:10,266 --> 00:28:12,467
I was thinking, "You know,
they could be setting us up.
530
00:28:12,467 --> 00:28:12,664
No matter what,
we're probably gonna fail this
531
00:28:12,664 --> 00:28:14,700
No matter what,
we're probably gonna fail this
532
00:28:14,767 --> 00:28:16,367
and we'll probably
gonna go to jail."
533
00:28:16,367 --> 00:28:19,100
When we went in there we
figured we weren't coming out.
534
00:28:22,667 --> 00:28:26,166
This polygraph test
went on all day long.
535
00:28:26,166 --> 00:28:27,767
Up until the evening.
536
00:28:29,867 --> 00:28:32,600
Because the test take
about two hours a piece.
537
00:28:33,867 --> 00:28:36,767
[narrator]
As part of the test,
the polygrapher asks
538
00:28:36,867 --> 00:28:40,300
each crewmen the same series
of questions three times.
539
00:28:41,567 --> 00:28:42,664
The first
three questions regard
540
00:28:42,664 --> 00:28:43,500
The first
three questions regard
541
00:28:43,567 --> 00:28:46,000
the alleged murder
of Travis Walton.
542
00:28:46,066 --> 00:28:48,300
The subject
of the final question
543
00:28:48,367 --> 00:28:50,266
is the UFO.
544
00:28:50,367 --> 00:28:52,467
[Mike] Once the test
got underway
545
00:28:52,467 --> 00:28:55,100
he started changing his
mind really quickly.
546
00:28:56,767 --> 00:28:59,000
By the time he had
tested all of us,
547
00:28:59,066 --> 00:29:01,066
he seemed to be a believer.
548
00:29:02,266 --> 00:29:03,867
[narrator]
Five of the six men passed
549
00:29:03,867 --> 00:29:05,967
the lie detector
test outright.
550
00:29:05,967 --> 00:29:12,066
Only Allen Dalis' test
comes back as inconclusive.
551
00:29:12,066 --> 00:29:12,664
Allen actually passed
the first two run throughs
of this test.
552
00:29:12,664 --> 00:29:16,367
Allen actually passed
the first two run throughs
of this test.
553
00:29:16,367 --> 00:29:19,266
It was inconclusive
because he pulled himself lose
554
00:29:19,266 --> 00:29:21,800
from a scene
in the last run through.
555
00:29:23,767 --> 00:29:25,967
[narrator] The results
of the polygraph
556
00:29:25,967 --> 00:29:29,166
stunned everyone
in the town of Snowflake.
557
00:29:29,166 --> 00:29:32,667
Perhaps none more so
than the polygrapher himself.
558
00:29:33,767 --> 00:29:35,867
I talked to him
after the test,
559
00:29:35,967 --> 00:29:41,066
and he indicated to me that...
That apparently he was wrong.
560
00:29:41,066 --> 00:29:42,664
Unofficially he said
that he believed
561
00:29:42,664 --> 00:29:44,300
Unofficially he said
that he believed
562
00:29:44,367 --> 00:29:47,100
that we had told the truth.
563
00:29:48,367 --> 00:29:50,700
[narrator] For five
excruciating days,
564
00:29:50,767 --> 00:29:53,867
Travis Walton
has been missing.
565
00:29:53,967 --> 00:29:55,867
The skeptical
sheriff's department
566
00:29:55,967 --> 00:29:58,266
is back to square one.
567
00:29:58,266 --> 00:30:01,100
If Travis Walton
hasn't been murdered
568
00:30:01,166 --> 00:30:04,367
and no one can find his body
in the woods,
569
00:30:05,266 --> 00:30:07,467
where could he be?
570
00:30:08,767 --> 00:30:10,767
[suspenseful music playing]
571
00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:19,266
Late that night, the phone
rings at Travis' sister's
home.
572
00:30:19,266 --> 00:30:21,700
[telephone ringing]
573
00:30:21,767 --> 00:30:24,867
His brother-in-law,
Grant, answers.
574
00:30:26,667 --> 00:30:28,467
[Grant]
I had come home from work.
575
00:30:29,066 --> 00:30:30,300
Phone rang
576
00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:33,467
and it was a voice
on the other side saying,
577
00:30:33,967 --> 00:30:35,300
"This is Travis.
578
00:30:36,667 --> 00:30:37,800
Come and get me."
579
00:30:41,166 --> 00:30:42,567
[suspenseful music playing]
580
00:30:52,100 --> 00:30:55,767
[narrator] Travis Walton has
been missing for five days.
581
00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:01,100
When Travis' brother-in-law,
Grant, answers a late-night
582
00:31:01,166 --> 00:31:04,100
phone call,
he assumes it's a prank.
583
00:31:04,166 --> 00:31:05,700
[Grant] And I said,
"Yeah, right."
584
00:31:05,767 --> 00:31:07,567
I get ready to hang up
he said,
585
00:31:07,567 --> 00:31:09,200
"No, no, no, no,
please don't hang up."
586
00:31:09,266 --> 00:31:10,638
And, so then
I started listening
587
00:31:10,638 --> 00:31:11,467
And, so then
I started listening
588
00:31:11,467 --> 00:31:13,867
and then
the conversation ended.
589
00:31:13,967 --> 00:31:17,567
I got my wife out of bed,
we went to her mother's place.
590
00:31:17,567 --> 00:31:20,667
His brother Duane
was there visiting.
591
00:31:20,667 --> 00:31:23,266
We got in the truck,
drove to Heber
592
00:31:23,266 --> 00:31:24,967
where he described
where he was.
593
00:31:28,667 --> 00:31:30,667
I must've passed out
'cause it seemed like almost
594
00:31:30,767 --> 00:31:34,567
immediately they were, um...
Headlights of the truck
595
00:31:34,667 --> 00:31:36,667
were shining
into the phone booth
596
00:31:37,867 --> 00:31:40,266
and my brother came
over there and lifted me up.
597
00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:43,567
And I was just hysterical.
598
00:31:45,266 --> 00:31:49,500
He sort of lifted me
into the truck
599
00:31:49,567 --> 00:31:53,066
and I was just breaking down,
just disintegrating.
600
00:31:55,700 --> 00:31:58,367
[narrator] In this rare
archival interview
601
00:31:58,467 --> 00:32:02,000
Travis recalls the events
leading up to the phone call.
602
00:32:30,900 --> 00:32:33,000
[narrator] Wandering
the road for what feels
603
00:32:33,100 --> 00:32:35,667
like hours, Travis recognizes
604
00:32:35,767 --> 00:32:38,667
the lights of Heber,
Arizona, in the distance.
605
00:32:41,967 --> 00:32:44,300
[Travis] I ran down
into the town
606
00:32:45,567 --> 00:32:46,967
and called my family.
607
00:32:47,667 --> 00:32:48,967
"Come and get me."
608
00:32:57,367 --> 00:32:59,467
[narrator] On the way back
to Snowflake,
609
00:32:59,467 --> 00:33:02,700
Travis struggles to piece
together his experience.
610
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:07,467
[Travis] One of the biggest
shocks I had to deal with
611
00:33:07,567 --> 00:33:09,500
when I was returned
was finding out
612
00:33:09,567 --> 00:33:10,638
that this brief period of time
613
00:33:10,638 --> 00:33:11,867
that this brief period of time
614
00:33:11,967 --> 00:33:14,700
had somehow taken
over five days.
615
00:33:16,500 --> 00:33:19,166
My brother, he asked me
to feel my face
616
00:33:19,266 --> 00:33:21,967
and I had a, had a...
You know, weeks growth.
617
00:33:21,967 --> 00:33:25,300
I was... It really took
my mind just to reel at that
618
00:33:25,367 --> 00:33:28,000
because as far as I knew
it was the same night.
619
00:33:29,867 --> 00:33:32,667
I was trying to describe
what I'd experienced,
620
00:33:32,667 --> 00:33:34,767
but I was just
making it worst.
621
00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:39,367
And he finally said,
"Don't try to talk right now."
622
00:33:39,367 --> 00:33:40,638
He talked about how scared
the family had been.
623
00:33:40,638 --> 00:33:42,867
He talked about how scared
the family had been.
624
00:33:45,066 --> 00:33:47,767
[narrator] For Travis' family,
the past week
625
00:33:47,767 --> 00:33:50,500
has been
an emotional roller coaster.
626
00:33:50,567 --> 00:33:52,000
[Grant]
Everybody was relieved,
627
00:33:52,066 --> 00:33:54,867
but they were still kind
of in a shock mode.
628
00:33:54,867 --> 00:33:58,767
It didn't affect me as much
as it did my wife,
629
00:33:58,767 --> 00:34:03,467
and she still doesn't
wanna be bothered with it.
630
00:34:03,567 --> 00:34:05,767
[Angie] When Travis came back
631
00:34:05,867 --> 00:34:08,367
we were all so relieved.
632
00:34:09,166 --> 00:34:10,638
At the same time
the story was so hard
633
00:34:10,638 --> 00:34:13,400
At the same time
the story was so hard
634
00:34:13,467 --> 00:34:17,600
to fit in to your realm
of reality, you know?
635
00:34:21,266 --> 00:34:26,800
[narrator] Even decades later,
the trauma of those five days
636
00:34:26,867 --> 00:34:31,200
still weighs heavy on Travis
and his now wife Dana.
637
00:34:33,266 --> 00:34:35,266
[Dana] I was really,
really worried,
638
00:34:35,266 --> 00:34:38,166
and scared that you...
What happened to you,
639
00:34:38,266 --> 00:34:40,638
I didn't know
if you'd ever be returned.
640
00:34:40,638 --> 00:34:40,667
I didn't know
if you'd ever be returned.
641
00:34:41,967 --> 00:34:44,200
Specially the more days
went by,
642
00:34:44,266 --> 00:34:46,266
gets more and more scary.
643
00:34:47,266 --> 00:34:48,367
Well...
644
00:34:48,367 --> 00:34:50,600
[Travis] Did you ever
think for a minute
645
00:34:50,667 --> 00:34:53,500
that maybe the guys
or Mike or something
646
00:34:53,567 --> 00:34:56,467
-were covering up
a killing, a murder?
-No.
647
00:34:56,567 --> 00:34:58,300
No, I never thought that.
648
00:35:00,300 --> 00:35:01,500
Yep.
649
00:35:01,567 --> 00:35:05,266
I even went out to the window,
and I looked up on the sky
650
00:35:05,367 --> 00:35:08,400
and I said, "Will you please
bring Travis back?"
651
00:35:08,467 --> 00:35:09,900
[sobbing]
652
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:22,400
-I'm sorry.
-That must've hurt you.
653
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:36,867
[narrator] With Travis
in such a fragile state,
654
00:35:36,867 --> 00:35:39,767
his brother Duane
is determined to protect him
655
00:35:39,767 --> 00:35:40,638
from any intense
scrutiny by the media
656
00:35:40,638 --> 00:35:42,100
from any intense
scrutiny by the media
657
00:35:42,166 --> 00:35:43,700
or law enforcement.
658
00:35:46,100 --> 00:35:48,266
Desperate for assistance,
he reaches out
659
00:35:48,266 --> 00:35:51,066
to the Aerial Phenomena
Research Organization
660
00:35:51,066 --> 00:35:52,367
or A.P.R.O.
661
00:35:52,367 --> 00:35:55,400
A Tucson based
UFO investigative group.
662
00:35:57,767 --> 00:36:01,400
[Ben] Jim and Coral Lorenzen
really assembled A.P.R.O.
663
00:36:01,467 --> 00:36:03,867
with the key focus
of having a credible
664
00:36:03,967 --> 00:36:07,500
and scientific,
unbiased perspective.
665
00:36:07,567 --> 00:36:09,967
That's why they brought in
medical doctors,
666
00:36:09,967 --> 00:36:10,638
they brought in, uh,
scientists that were respected
667
00:36:10,638 --> 00:36:12,867
they brought in, uh,
scientists that were respected
668
00:36:12,867 --> 00:36:15,567
in their fields
and consulted with them
669
00:36:15,667 --> 00:36:16,800
whenever they did a case.
670
00:36:18,066 --> 00:36:20,467
[Travis] My brother Duane,
he had contacted
671
00:36:20,567 --> 00:36:22,100
Jim Lorenzen, the head
672
00:36:22,166 --> 00:36:25,467
of the Aerial Phenomena
Research Organization
673
00:36:25,467 --> 00:36:28,000
who had a couple
of medical doctors
674
00:36:28,066 --> 00:36:29,967
in their Phoenix membership
675
00:36:29,967 --> 00:36:32,367
who agreed to do
an examination.
676
00:36:34,467 --> 00:36:35,967
[narrator]
In the dead of night,
677
00:36:35,967 --> 00:36:39,467
Duane Walton secretly sneaks
Travis out of Snowflake.
678
00:36:40,667 --> 00:36:44,100
A.P.R.O. arranged for Travis
to go to a hotel in Phoenix.
679
00:36:44,166 --> 00:36:46,967
He checked in
under an assumed name
680
00:36:46,967 --> 00:36:49,100
and then they sent over
two A.P.R.O.
681
00:36:49,166 --> 00:36:50,767
affiliated medical doctors.
682
00:36:52,266 --> 00:36:53,767
[Don]
They didn't want any leaks
683
00:36:54,600 --> 00:36:56,800
of what was happening
with Travis
684
00:36:56,867 --> 00:36:59,166
with his, uh,
medical condition,
685
00:36:59,266 --> 00:37:01,200
and, and all the testing.
686
00:37:03,266 --> 00:37:05,567
[narrator] Before medical
tests are performed,
687
00:37:05,567 --> 00:37:08,166
Travis tell the physicians
what he remembered
688
00:37:08,266 --> 00:37:10,638
from the night
of November 5th, 1975,
689
00:37:10,638 --> 00:37:11,900
from the night
of November 5th, 1975,
690
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:15,100
starting with the moment
he exited the truck.
691
00:37:20,500 --> 00:37:23,500
[Travis] It just was kind
of a... A sort of an impulse.
692
00:37:23,567 --> 00:37:25,000
Seeing this object there...
693
00:37:27,300 --> 00:37:28,867
For some reason
I just kind of assumed
694
00:37:28,967 --> 00:37:31,800
that it was gonna take off
before I got very far.
695
00:37:33,300 --> 00:37:37,200
We could hear a real low
rumbling sort of a sound.
696
00:37:40,166 --> 00:37:40,638
Pounding, you know, like
a heartbeat sort of a thing.
697
00:37:40,638 --> 00:37:43,066
Pounding, you know, like
a heartbeat sort of a thing.
698
00:37:44,867 --> 00:37:47,900
And then some real
high frequency
sorts of sounds.
699
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:49,967
Very hard to describe
these sounds.
700
00:37:53,367 --> 00:37:56,266
The closer I got,
it suddenly got louder,
701
00:37:58,100 --> 00:37:59,767
and it started to move.
702
00:38:01,567 --> 00:38:05,367
I was startled and out of fear
I just jumped for cover.
703
00:38:10,500 --> 00:38:10,638
Then I was figuring out,
"Boy, I've really got myself
704
00:38:10,638 --> 00:38:13,767
Then I was figuring out,
"Boy, I've really got myself
705
00:38:13,867 --> 00:38:15,100
in a bad situation here."
706
00:38:16,567 --> 00:38:19,767
I stood up with the idea
of running back to the truck,
707
00:38:19,767 --> 00:38:22,000
but as soon as I raised up,
708
00:38:22,066 --> 00:38:25,066
that's when I felt
this stunning force.
709
00:38:34,300 --> 00:38:36,667
[narrator] The next thing
Travis remembers
710
00:38:36,667 --> 00:38:40,638
is waking up on the side
of the road five days later.
711
00:38:40,638 --> 00:38:41,467
is waking up on the side
of the road five days later.
712
00:38:44,467 --> 00:38:47,266
To make sense of
the missing time in between,
713
00:38:47,367 --> 00:38:49,867
Travis agrees
to undergo a controversial
714
00:38:49,867 --> 00:38:52,700
technique called
regressive hypnosis.
715
00:38:52,767 --> 00:38:55,667
Regressive hypnosis
has been used, uh,
716
00:38:55,667 --> 00:38:58,166
popularly since
the Betty and Barney Hill
717
00:38:58,266 --> 00:38:59,967
abduction in 1961.
718
00:39:00,700 --> 00:39:02,100
Tapes of Betty and Barney
719
00:39:02,166 --> 00:39:04,800
while abducted are still
chilling even today.
720
00:39:10,867 --> 00:39:12,767
Oh. Oh!
721
00:39:19,467 --> 00:39:22,000
[narrator] An hypnosis session
is scheduled with A.P.R.O.'s
722
00:39:22,066 --> 00:39:24,600
director of research,
Dr. James Harder.
723
00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:29,100
In the meantime,
Travis' doctors perform
724
00:39:29,166 --> 00:39:30,367
a battery of tests.
725
00:39:35,066 --> 00:39:37,867
[Travis] Blood and urine
samples were taken
726
00:39:37,967 --> 00:39:40,638
that were put through
the county medical examiners
727
00:39:40,638 --> 00:39:41,367
that were put through
the county medical examiners
728
00:39:41,467 --> 00:39:45,000
drug screen that's
extremely good at detecting
729
00:39:45,066 --> 00:39:48,467
traces of drugs of
which there were none.
730
00:39:49,967 --> 00:39:53,266
[narrator] Despite
A.P.R.O.'s and the family's
best efforts,
731
00:39:53,266 --> 00:39:57,667
Travis' reappearance does not
remain secret for long.
732
00:39:57,667 --> 00:40:01,500
The operator who
patched Travis through to call
733
00:40:01,567 --> 00:40:05,166
his sister's house
listened in on the call.
734
00:40:05,266 --> 00:40:08,166
Remember, this is 1975,
where they actually did have
735
00:40:08,266 --> 00:40:10,100
operators who patched
people through.
736
00:40:11,266 --> 00:40:13,867
She recognized the name
as he tried to make this,
737
00:40:13,867 --> 00:40:16,600
uh, collect call
from Travis Walton,
738
00:40:16,667 --> 00:40:18,100
that this was big news.
739
00:40:18,767 --> 00:40:20,400
So she takes that information
740
00:40:20,467 --> 00:40:23,066
and leaks it
to the sheriff's office.
741
00:40:23,066 --> 00:40:25,467
[Shelley] His family was fully
aware that there had been
742
00:40:25,567 --> 00:40:28,000
an ensuing search for Travis,
743
00:40:28,066 --> 00:40:31,367
and yet they chose not to let
the law enforcement community,
744
00:40:31,467 --> 00:40:34,066
um, know
that he had been found.
745
00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:36,967
[narrator]
Travis' family feels he is
746
00:40:36,967 --> 00:40:39,500
too emotionally unstable
to face questioning
747
00:40:39,567 --> 00:40:40,638
from the sheriff's department.
748
00:40:40,638 --> 00:40:41,000
from the sheriff's department.
749
00:40:41,066 --> 00:40:43,900
For the first few days
after his return,
750
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:48,100
Travis' brother Duane acts
as the family's spokesperson.
751
00:40:48,166 --> 00:40:50,567
[reporter 3] Obviously, Duane,
you know your own brother
752
00:40:50,567 --> 00:40:51,800
probably better
than anybody else.
753
00:40:51,867 --> 00:40:53,400
Do you believe the story?
754
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:56,066
I've never seen him
play a practical joke
in his adult life.
755
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:01,767
[narrator] The veracious media
runs with the story.
756
00:41:01,867 --> 00:41:04,800
Before long,
it's international news.
757
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:07,700
Well, now the story
that has been hitting
758
00:41:07,767 --> 00:41:09,767
the headlines all over
the United States
759
00:41:09,767 --> 00:41:10,638
is the one we told you
about last week,
760
00:41:10,638 --> 00:41:11,367
is the one we told you
about last week,
761
00:41:11,467 --> 00:41:13,500
of the man who disappeared
after seeing
762
00:41:13,567 --> 00:41:16,000
what his friends
thought was a flying saucer.
763
00:41:16,066 --> 00:41:18,166
After a five days search
by police,
764
00:41:18,166 --> 00:41:21,467
Travis Walton has turned up
unharmed and he says
765
00:41:21,567 --> 00:41:24,567
that he was taken aboard
a spaceship but the police,
766
00:41:24,567 --> 00:41:26,900
of course, no way
of checking his story.
767
00:41:28,567 --> 00:41:30,166
[narrator] As law enforcement
768
00:41:30,166 --> 00:41:34,200
and journalists scramble
hear the story firsthand,
769
00:41:34,266 --> 00:41:38,867
Travis remains sequestered
in a Phoenix hotel room
770
00:41:38,867 --> 00:41:40,638
reliving his experience
of abject horror.
771
00:41:40,638 --> 00:41:44,066
reliving his experience
of abject horror.
772
00:41:47,166 --> 00:41:48,567
[dramatic music playing]
773
00:42:01,266 --> 00:42:04,033
[narrator]
On November 14th, 1975,
774
00:42:04,100 --> 00:42:07,266
four days after his return,
Travis Walton
775
00:42:07,266 --> 00:42:08,934
meets with Dr. James Harder
776
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:11,667
at the Aerial Phenomena
Research Organization
777
00:42:11,767 --> 00:42:13,266
in a Phoenix hotel room.
778
00:42:14,667 --> 00:42:16,567
Surrounded by his loved ones,
779
00:42:16,567 --> 00:42:16,670
Dana and his brother Duane,
Travis prepares to go undergo
780
00:42:16,670 --> 00:42:20,166
Dana and his brother Duane,
Travis prepares to go undergo
781
00:42:20,233 --> 00:42:23,967
a technique called
regressive hypnosis
782
00:42:24,033 --> 00:42:28,100
to help him face
his most petrifying memories.
783
00:42:50,934 --> 00:42:52,934
[fan squeaking]
784
00:42:55,734 --> 00:42:58,867
[narrator]
Physically, Travis is sitting
on the hotel room sofa...
785
00:43:02,166 --> 00:43:05,667
...but mentally, Dr. Harder
takes him back to the moment
786
00:43:05,767 --> 00:43:08,467
he was abducted
on board the alien ship
787
00:43:13,066 --> 00:43:16,670
and the next terrifying
five days of missing time.
788
00:43:16,670 --> 00:43:18,467
and the next terrifying
five days of missing time.
789
00:43:18,567 --> 00:43:22,233
Visualize just what's
in front of you there.
790
00:43:24,166 --> 00:43:26,667
Tell me what it is
that your eyes see.
791
00:43:34,166 --> 00:43:36,166
[Travis] I was laying
on my back.
792
00:43:37,567 --> 00:43:39,266
I came to slowly...
793
00:43:40,667 --> 00:43:42,967
At first I thought
I was in a hospital.
794
00:43:44,266 --> 00:43:46,670
I felt like there was
something seriously wrong.
795
00:43:46,670 --> 00:43:47,133
I felt like there was
something seriously wrong.
796
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:51,600
There was a light above me.
797
00:43:51,667 --> 00:43:54,667
It wasn't so bright I couldn't
look at it, but it sort of,
798
00:43:54,734 --> 00:43:58,467
uh, interfered with seeing
other things around me.
799
00:44:00,266 --> 00:44:03,767
But I was looking around
to see where I was.
800
00:44:06,667 --> 00:44:09,367
It was a very small space,
801
00:44:09,467 --> 00:44:12,967
but there was something lying
on my chest.
802
00:44:14,467 --> 00:44:16,670
There seem to be,
you know, some kind of, uh,
803
00:44:16,670 --> 00:44:17,033
There seem to be,
you know, some kind of, uh,
804
00:44:17,100 --> 00:44:18,500
light coming from it.
805
00:44:20,300 --> 00:44:24,667
When I looked beyond
the edge of that, I saw faces,
806
00:44:24,734 --> 00:44:28,033
but it was so blurry
that I kind of assumed
807
00:44:28,100 --> 00:44:32,066
it was like, uh, doctors
wearing, uh, surgical masks.
808
00:44:33,066 --> 00:44:35,033
It was only a matter
of seconds
809
00:44:35,100 --> 00:44:38,600
before I realized that these
weren't human doctors.
810
00:44:39,834 --> 00:44:41,367
This was an alien face.
811
00:44:45,400 --> 00:44:46,670
They were about five
foot tall, no hair,
812
00:44:46,670 --> 00:44:48,367
They were about five
foot tall, no hair,
813
00:44:48,834 --> 00:44:50,600
very white skin,
814
00:44:50,667 --> 00:44:53,867
small features
except for large eyes.
815
00:44:55,867 --> 00:44:58,266
[narrator] The beings
Travis encounters,
816
00:44:58,266 --> 00:45:00,400
they're a striking resemblance
817
00:45:00,467 --> 00:45:05,266
to grey aliens reported in
other UFO abduction stories.
818
00:45:06,166 --> 00:45:08,834
Greys are the most
common description
819
00:45:08,834 --> 00:45:11,467
of some of these others
that have been visiting us.
820
00:45:12,734 --> 00:45:14,867
Three and a half
to four feet tall,
821
00:45:14,934 --> 00:45:16,467
big black eyes,
822
00:45:16,567 --> 00:45:16,670
larger heads,
not much of a nose,
823
00:45:16,670 --> 00:45:18,567
larger heads,
not much of a nose,
824
00:45:18,667 --> 00:45:20,066
not much of a mouth.
825
00:45:20,133 --> 00:45:23,066
Spindly little things,
that's what he saw.
826
00:45:26,967 --> 00:45:30,166
[narrator] To Travis,
this strange appearance
827
00:45:30,233 --> 00:45:34,567
and blank expressions
are unnerving.
828
00:45:34,567 --> 00:45:38,567
[Travis] The feeling of pain,
the feeling of suffocation,
829
00:45:38,667 --> 00:45:42,166
at the same time
they expressed no emotion
830
00:45:42,266 --> 00:45:43,266
to their face.
831
00:45:43,266 --> 00:45:44,467
It seemed threatening.
832
00:45:45,300 --> 00:45:46,670
I just freaked out
at that point.
833
00:45:46,670 --> 00:45:47,367
I just freaked out
at that point.
834
00:45:49,367 --> 00:45:51,600
And jumped off
of the table there.
835
00:45:53,266 --> 00:45:56,467
And when I did,
this device fell off.
836
00:45:57,767 --> 00:46:01,467
[narrator] Travis' survival
instincts kick in full force.
837
00:46:01,567 --> 00:46:03,266
[Travis] It was were just
fight or flight
838
00:46:04,166 --> 00:46:06,967
and I grabbed, um, rod or tube
839
00:46:07,033 --> 00:46:09,600
and just started swinging
to the air.
840
00:46:11,467 --> 00:46:14,367
The only opening in
the room was beyond them.
841
00:46:17,667 --> 00:46:19,467
[narrator] Suddenly
and without warning,
842
00:46:19,467 --> 00:46:21,500
the aliens change course.
843
00:46:23,066 --> 00:46:24,367
[Travis] They left the room.
844
00:46:25,233 --> 00:46:26,467
I was afraid they'd come back,
845
00:46:26,567 --> 00:46:31,233
so I left there, uh,
looking for a way out.
846
00:46:38,667 --> 00:46:42,867
The whole craft was lit up
in a way that I would consider
847
00:46:42,934 --> 00:46:46,467
to be pretty, pretty dim by,
you know, human standards.
848
00:46:48,567 --> 00:46:53,133
I felt like there was an
insufficient amount of air.
849
00:46:53,133 --> 00:46:55,667
Like I couldn't get enough
air just breathing.
850
00:46:55,767 --> 00:46:57,867
Air was thin but humid.
851
00:46:59,033 --> 00:47:01,367
[narrator] Struggling to see
and desperate for air,
852
00:47:02,367 --> 00:47:04,367
Travis comes
across another door.
853
00:47:05,667 --> 00:47:09,000
The room appears to be empty
except for a single chair.
854
00:47:10,133 --> 00:47:13,467
As Travis approaches,
he notices the light
855
00:47:13,567 --> 00:47:15,367
in the room shift.
856
00:47:17,066 --> 00:47:19,400
[Travis] There was some
kind of a projection
857
00:47:19,467 --> 00:47:21,767
or some kind
of a viewing thing
858
00:47:21,834 --> 00:47:24,266
in this room where you could
see a map of stars.
859
00:47:27,166 --> 00:47:29,734
The points of lights
that came through it
860
00:47:29,734 --> 00:47:34,767
were not real visible
until I got near the chair.
861
00:47:34,867 --> 00:47:37,567
Away from the chair
the walls didn't seem
862
00:47:37,567 --> 00:47:39,867
to have those points
of lights so much.
863
00:47:41,100 --> 00:47:43,767
[narrator] Could it be
some kind of control room?
864
00:47:44,767 --> 00:47:46,670
Travis looks
for any means of escape.
865
00:47:46,670 --> 00:47:47,734
Travis looks
for any means of escape.
866
00:47:47,734 --> 00:47:50,767
[Travis] On the arm of
the chair was a screen
867
00:47:50,834 --> 00:47:55,133
and some colored spots,
uh, I took to be buttons.
868
00:47:56,266 --> 00:47:58,033
I was just thinking
these buttons
869
00:47:58,100 --> 00:48:00,834
might open one of these
doorway looking things.
870
00:48:01,567 --> 00:48:04,967
Foolishly assuming that a door
871
00:48:05,033 --> 00:48:07,467
would just be opened
to the air,
872
00:48:07,567 --> 00:48:09,367
and I could drop
to the ground, you know?
873
00:48:09,467 --> 00:48:11,233
Fifteen-20 feet.
874
00:48:11,233 --> 00:48:14,066
I could handle that
just to get out of there.
875
00:48:15,266 --> 00:48:16,670
[narrator]
The buttons have no effect.
876
00:48:16,670 --> 00:48:17,767
[narrator]
The buttons have no effect.
877
00:48:17,834 --> 00:48:20,667
Travis has no choice but
to look for another way out.
878
00:48:21,867 --> 00:48:25,767
Just then he notices,
he's not alone.
879
00:48:28,166 --> 00:48:31,367
The form looks oddly familiar.
880
00:48:32,300 --> 00:48:35,133
Could it be human?
881
00:48:39,066 --> 00:48:41,266
In a Phoenix hotel room,
882
00:48:41,333 --> 00:48:44,934
Travis Walton's loved ones
sit in stunned silence
883
00:48:45,000 --> 00:48:47,533
as he recounts
the traumatic nightmare
884
00:48:47,533 --> 00:48:50,767
of being trapped aboard a UFO.
885
00:48:54,533 --> 00:48:55,934
I didn't actually
hear the story
886
00:48:56,000 --> 00:48:58,433
until he was put
under hypnosis,
887
00:48:58,433 --> 00:49:00,233
and I was in the room
with him when...
888
00:49:00,233 --> 00:49:02,867
So when he told
the story it was really...
889
00:49:02,934 --> 00:49:06,934
Shocking, it was scary to me,
what he had to go through.
890
00:49:10,734 --> 00:49:13,266
[narrator] After trying
in vain to open a doorway
891
00:49:13,333 --> 00:49:14,667
or escape hatch,
892
00:49:14,767 --> 00:49:17,867
Travis has no choice
but to return to the corridor
893
00:49:17,934 --> 00:49:20,767
and search
for another means of escape,
894
00:49:20,834 --> 00:49:25,567
only this time,
there's something or someone
895
00:49:25,634 --> 00:49:27,667
blocking his way.
896
00:49:27,767 --> 00:49:31,100
[Travis] There was
a what I took to be
a human being.
897
00:49:32,634 --> 00:49:36,166
I immediately just assume
this was air force, NASA,
898
00:49:36,233 --> 00:49:37,047
somebody, you know,
there to intervene
899
00:49:37,047 --> 00:49:39,100
somebody, you know,
there to intervene
900
00:49:39,166 --> 00:49:42,166
and, uh, take me away
from these creatures.
901
00:49:45,667 --> 00:49:48,367
[narrator] In a rare,
archival interview,
902
00:49:48,433 --> 00:49:51,667
Travis describes
his encounter with the being.
903
00:49:52,767 --> 00:49:55,834
This was a...
A human-looking person.
904
00:49:56,867 --> 00:49:59,967
They'd pass in a crowd
as an individual.
905
00:50:02,033 --> 00:50:05,467
He was bigger than me,
taller, and more muscular.
906
00:50:05,533 --> 00:50:07,047
Very large individual.
907
00:50:07,047 --> 00:50:07,433
Very large individual.
908
00:50:07,433 --> 00:50:12,467
I went up and, uh,
tried to talk to this guy
909
00:50:13,266 --> 00:50:15,667
and, uh, he didn't answer me.
910
00:50:17,133 --> 00:50:19,166
When I started
yelling questions,
911
00:50:19,233 --> 00:50:21,066
trying to tell him,
"What are these things?
912
00:50:21,133 --> 00:50:22,634
Where am I?" You know,
913
00:50:22,634 --> 00:50:23,767
"Get me out of here."
914
00:50:23,834 --> 00:50:26,066
All those kind of things,
he didn't really seem to,
915
00:50:26,133 --> 00:50:28,100
uh, be responding
to anything I was saying.
916
00:50:29,867 --> 00:50:32,333
[narrator] Instead,
the suited stranger
917
00:50:32,333 --> 00:50:34,100
takes Travis by the arm
918
00:50:34,166 --> 00:50:37,047
and escorts him further down
the corridor.
919
00:50:37,047 --> 00:50:37,767
and escorts him further down
the corridor.
920
00:50:37,867 --> 00:50:39,967
[Travis] I went down
the hallway with him,
921
00:50:40,033 --> 00:50:43,934
very dimly lit,
but lit from above.
922
00:50:45,166 --> 00:50:47,133
When we came to a door,
923
00:50:48,266 --> 00:50:50,767
I did not see
this human-looking individual
924
00:50:50,867 --> 00:50:53,367
do anything to make
the door open, but it did.
925
00:50:54,467 --> 00:50:57,333
[narrator] Travis
and his enigmatic escort
926
00:50:57,333 --> 00:51:01,567
entered what appears to be
some kind of an air lock.
927
00:51:01,634 --> 00:51:05,667
We went into
a little booth-like section
of the hallway.
928
00:51:09,266 --> 00:51:11,333
[narrator]
Then, Travis is overcome
929
00:51:11,333 --> 00:51:13,767
by a sudden shift
in the environment.
930
00:51:15,033 --> 00:51:16,867
[Travis] I could feel
that the air
931
00:51:16,934 --> 00:51:18,433
coming in was cooler.
932
00:51:19,233 --> 00:51:21,533
I could breathe better,
933
00:51:21,533 --> 00:51:25,533
and that the outside light
was so much brighter
by comparison.
934
00:51:29,567 --> 00:51:31,467
[narrator] Travis
describes being ushered
935
00:51:31,567 --> 00:51:34,000
from something
like an alien aircraft hanger
936
00:51:34,066 --> 00:51:36,967
in the seldom
seen BBC documentary.
937
00:51:40,100 --> 00:51:42,266
[Travis] He let me out
of this craft,
938
00:51:42,367 --> 00:51:45,433
which appeared to be
parked inside of a,
939
00:51:45,433 --> 00:51:48,266
a larger building,
or a larger craft.
940
00:51:48,367 --> 00:51:49,667
He just took me
right out of there
941
00:51:50,533 --> 00:51:52,333
down a hallway to a room
942
00:51:52,333 --> 00:51:54,767
where there were some other
people who looked like him.
943
00:51:57,000 --> 00:52:00,433
[narrator] These two beings
are not wearing helmets,
944
00:52:00,433 --> 00:52:02,166
giving Travis a clear look
945
00:52:02,266 --> 00:52:07,047
at what ufologists refer
to as "Nordic aliens."
946
00:52:07,047 --> 00:52:07,266
at what ufologists refer
to as "Nordic aliens."
947
00:52:07,367 --> 00:52:12,266
Tall, human-like figures,
Scandinavian in appearance.
948
00:52:13,667 --> 00:52:15,934
In the pantheon
of aliens that keep getting
949
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:17,367
described by people
who have had
950
00:52:17,433 --> 00:52:20,834
abduction experiences you have
primarily the greys...
951
00:52:24,767 --> 00:52:26,734
...but you also have something
called the Nordic.
952
00:52:26,734 --> 00:52:30,133
The Nordic has come
to represent basically
953
00:52:30,133 --> 00:52:33,033
a human-looking alien.
954
00:52:33,100 --> 00:52:37,047
In Travis' case, the Nordic
he saw was about six feet
two inches tall,
955
00:52:37,047 --> 00:52:38,467
In Travis' case, the Nordic
he saw was about six feet
two inches tall,
956
00:52:38,567 --> 00:52:42,000
kind of brownish,
blondish hair.
957
00:52:42,066 --> 00:52:45,734
Basically, like a Caucasian.
Could've been from Sweden.
958
00:52:49,367 --> 00:52:51,867
[narrator] Travis' attention
quickly shifts
959
00:52:51,967 --> 00:52:55,100
to an examination table
in the center of the room.
960
00:52:56,233 --> 00:52:58,567
The mysterious being
in the space suit
961
00:52:59,266 --> 00:53:00,667
pushes him toward it.
962
00:53:01,734 --> 00:53:03,467
[Travis] He seemed to be
trying to get me
963
00:53:03,533 --> 00:53:05,367
to get on the table
964
00:53:05,433 --> 00:53:07,047
and I was very much
resisting that.
965
00:53:07,047 --> 00:53:07,767
and I was very much
resisting that.
966
00:53:07,867 --> 00:53:12,233
I became alarmed that he was
not answering my questions.
967
00:53:12,233 --> 00:53:14,233
I was obviously terrified
and asking,
968
00:53:14,233 --> 00:53:16,033
"Where are you taking me?
What's this all about?"
969
00:53:17,166 --> 00:53:19,667
[narrator] Travis fights
with all his might,
970
00:53:19,734 --> 00:53:22,634
but the Nordics step in
and overpower him
971
00:53:22,634 --> 00:53:24,567
with superhuman strength.
972
00:53:26,166 --> 00:53:28,667
[Travis] Very frightening,
I was fighting back
973
00:53:28,734 --> 00:53:30,867
immediately,
no longer cooperating.
974
00:53:30,967 --> 00:53:34,066
I thought I was pretty
strong in those days,
975
00:53:34,133 --> 00:53:37,047
but they didn't have too much
trouble getting me down
on the table.
976
00:53:37,047 --> 00:53:37,066
but they didn't have too much
trouble getting me down
on the table.
977
00:53:44,433 --> 00:53:46,166
They put this mask
over my face,
978
00:53:46,266 --> 00:53:48,233
it's kind of like
an oxygen mask.
979
00:53:48,233 --> 00:53:50,000
There was no hose
connected to it,
980
00:53:50,066 --> 00:53:51,266
they put it over my face
981
00:53:51,333 --> 00:53:53,834
and that was the last thing
I knew, I just blacked out.
982
00:54:02,667 --> 00:54:05,266
Next thing
I remember was waking up
983
00:54:06,467 --> 00:54:07,047
outside, cold air
984
00:54:07,047 --> 00:54:08,367
outside, cold air
985
00:54:09,767 --> 00:54:11,266
coming into my clothes.
986
00:54:19,667 --> 00:54:21,433
[narrator] In a Phoenix
hotel room,
987
00:54:21,433 --> 00:54:23,467
Travis awakens from a trance,
988
00:54:24,734 --> 00:54:28,467
after recounting his harrowing
alien abduction experience.
989
00:54:29,867 --> 00:54:33,433
And to his loved ones,
it's clear
990
00:54:33,433 --> 00:54:36,567
Travis will never be the same.
991
00:54:36,634 --> 00:54:37,047
[Dana] He seemed
really different.
992
00:54:37,047 --> 00:54:38,867
[Dana] He seemed
really different.
993
00:54:38,967 --> 00:54:43,166
He seemed traumatized,
he seemed kind of scared.
994
00:54:43,233 --> 00:54:45,166
I felt sorry for him in a way,
995
00:54:45,233 --> 00:54:48,266
like I wanted to help him,
but I felt helpless.
996
00:54:48,333 --> 00:54:50,634
Like, I couldn't do
anything for him.
997
00:54:50,634 --> 00:54:53,333
[narrator] But a trauma
of alien contact
998
00:54:53,333 --> 00:54:55,166
was just the beginning.
999
00:54:55,233 --> 00:54:58,734
Travis' story would spark
a firestorm of debate
1000
00:54:58,734 --> 00:55:00,967
and speculation that ignites
1001
00:55:01,033 --> 00:55:05,767
the town of Snowflake
and engulfs the entire world.
1002
00:55:10,867 --> 00:55:12,433
[dramatic music playing]
1003
00:55:18,266 --> 00:55:19,867
After a strenuous battery
1004
00:55:19,967 --> 00:55:22,667
of medical tests
and regressive hypnotherapy
1005
00:55:22,734 --> 00:55:28,467
in Phoenix, Travis Walton
returns home to Snowflake.
1006
00:55:31,533 --> 00:55:34,667
[Don] When I saw Travis
the next time, he was...
1007
00:55:35,266 --> 00:55:37,367
He was skinny.
1008
00:55:37,433 --> 00:55:40,573
But the relief and the joy
that I saw on our mother
1009
00:55:40,573 --> 00:55:42,233
But the relief and the joy
that I saw on our mother
1010
00:55:43,166 --> 00:55:44,367
was awesome.
1011
00:55:44,433 --> 00:55:46,166
How she just stood there
and cried.
1012
00:55:47,367 --> 00:55:49,467
And my mother didn't cry
about anything.
1013
00:55:50,367 --> 00:55:52,567
But over that
she certainly did.
1014
00:55:52,667 --> 00:55:56,667
We thought we had lost
a family member.
1015
00:56:00,867 --> 00:56:02,166
[narrator] The media frenzy,
1016
00:56:02,233 --> 00:56:04,100
sparked by
the abduction story,
1017
00:56:04,166 --> 00:56:07,133
only intensifies as
Travis re-emerges.
1018
00:56:08,100 --> 00:56:10,573
[Don] Oh, it was a circus.
1019
00:56:10,573 --> 00:56:11,867
[Don] Oh, it was a circus.
1020
00:56:11,934 --> 00:56:14,934
Mother didn't have a fence
around our front yard.
1021
00:56:15,000 --> 00:56:17,367
There was probably
100 people out there.
1022
00:56:17,433 --> 00:56:19,767
Reporters, all kinds
of cameras.
1023
00:56:20,867 --> 00:56:22,166
[narrator]
In an effort to keep
1024
00:56:22,266 --> 00:56:26,667
the camera hounds at bay,
a still traumatized Travis
1025
00:56:26,767 --> 00:56:29,367
reluctantly grants
his first interviews.
1026
00:56:32,667 --> 00:56:34,367
[Barbara Frum]
Mr. Walton, how are you?
1027
00:56:34,467 --> 00:56:35,767
[Travis] I'm feeling
a lot better.
1028
00:56:36,467 --> 00:56:38,166
[Barbara] Where were you?
1029
00:56:38,233 --> 00:56:39,667
[Travis] I don't know.
[chuckles softly]
1030
00:56:42,133 --> 00:56:43,867
[interviewer] Did you tried
to communicate with them?
1031
00:56:43,967 --> 00:56:46,767
Well, I tried
to communicate with them
1032
00:56:46,867 --> 00:56:48,100
but there was no answer.
1033
00:56:48,166 --> 00:56:50,066
They never talked to me
or anything.
1034
00:56:51,433 --> 00:56:53,000
[narrator]
The unwanted scrutiny
1035
00:56:53,066 --> 00:56:55,166
pushes the town's people
to the brink.
1036
00:56:56,634 --> 00:56:59,767
[Shelley] I thought
the media attention
was insane.
1037
00:56:59,834 --> 00:57:01,667
There was
so much interest in it,
1038
00:57:01,734 --> 00:57:04,433
and at the time I just
remember thinking to myself,
1039
00:57:04,433 --> 00:57:07,533
"How can these people
really believe this story?"
You know.
1040
00:57:07,533 --> 00:57:09,000
Kinda skeptical.
1041
00:57:09,066 --> 00:57:10,573
You know, seeing is believing,
and I don't see nothing.
1042
00:57:10,573 --> 00:57:12,166
You know, seeing is believing,
and I don't see nothing.
1043
00:57:12,266 --> 00:57:16,166
It was the talk
of the town for a long time,
1044
00:57:16,266 --> 00:57:19,467
and I think there were people
that believed in UFOs
1045
00:57:19,533 --> 00:57:23,767
and people that felt that
people that believed in UFOs
were crazy.
1046
00:57:26,867 --> 00:57:28,567
I didn't know
if I went to a bar
1047
00:57:28,634 --> 00:57:30,533
if somebody's gonna
buy me a beer or,
1048
00:57:30,533 --> 00:57:32,367
or take
a punch at me, you now.
1049
00:57:32,433 --> 00:57:34,033
[narrator]
New rumors circulate
1050
00:57:34,100 --> 00:57:36,033
that this was all a hoax.
1051
00:57:36,967 --> 00:57:39,867
The crew,
once suspected of murder,
1052
00:57:39,934 --> 00:57:40,573
now find themselves
scrutinized alongside
Travis' family,
1053
00:57:40,573 --> 00:57:44,166
now find themselves
scrutinized alongside
Travis' family,
1054
00:57:44,266 --> 00:57:47,667
accused of pulling off
a massive con.
1055
00:57:50,767 --> 00:57:52,467
[Steve] You couldn't
walk through town
1056
00:57:52,533 --> 00:57:54,100
without people looking at you.
1057
00:57:54,166 --> 00:57:57,000
When he came back they thought
it was a big ole joke.
1058
00:57:59,667 --> 00:58:02,133
[John] Ten days after that
happened I left the area.
1059
00:58:02,867 --> 00:58:05,367
Went somewhere where
nobody knew me
1060
00:58:05,467 --> 00:58:08,266
and didn't know my involvement
in that and never told a soul.
1061
00:58:09,467 --> 00:58:10,573
[Don] It was tough.
1062
00:58:10,573 --> 00:58:10,734
[Don] It was tough.
1063
00:58:11,667 --> 00:58:14,367
I think people looked at us
in a way
1064
00:58:14,467 --> 00:58:17,667
that we were
putting on a show.
1065
00:58:20,734 --> 00:58:22,567
[narrator] Chief among
the skeptics
1066
00:58:22,667 --> 00:58:26,767
is a man who would become
Travis Walton's nemesis.
1067
00:58:26,834 --> 00:58:30,767
The king of UFO debunkers,
Phillip Klass.
1068
00:58:31,767 --> 00:58:33,533
[Ben] Phillip Klass
is probably
1069
00:58:33,533 --> 00:58:38,100
the most well-renowned
UFO skeptic, uh,
1070
00:58:38,166 --> 00:58:40,573
debunker, uh,
maybe of all history.
1071
00:58:40,573 --> 00:58:41,667
debunker, uh,
maybe of all history.
1072
00:58:41,767 --> 00:58:44,033
He had devoted
a great deal of time
1073
00:58:44,100 --> 00:58:46,667
and as a matter of fact had
written books ridiculing
1074
00:58:46,767 --> 00:58:50,133
the idea that UFOs should be
considered serious at all.
1075
00:58:51,100 --> 00:58:54,634
In my opinion,
the belief in UFOs
1076
00:58:54,634 --> 00:58:57,767
will persist as long as there
are people on this earth,
1077
00:58:58,467 --> 00:59:00,233
uh, but it is a myth.
1078
00:59:01,867 --> 00:59:06,734
[Bryce] Now, Phillip Klass
was a very bright man,
a journalist.
1079
00:59:06,734 --> 00:59:10,433
He just didn't buy
the Travis Walton story.
1080
00:59:10,433 --> 00:59:10,573
He thought these guys
made it up,
1081
00:59:10,573 --> 00:59:12,867
He thought these guys
made it up,
1082
00:59:12,934 --> 00:59:16,233
and he set out to prove
that anyway that he could.
1083
00:59:16,233 --> 00:59:18,100
[narrator] Klass does
extensive research
1084
00:59:18,166 --> 00:59:21,433
into the Walton story
and claims the crew
1085
00:59:21,433 --> 00:59:25,000
led by Mike Rogers
concocted the UFO scheme
1086
00:59:25,066 --> 00:59:27,667
to get out of their
logging contract.
1087
00:59:27,767 --> 00:59:31,567
We had completed
probably over 80%
of the contract,
1088
00:59:31,634 --> 00:59:34,767
but we were also nearing
the completion deadline
1089
00:59:34,867 --> 00:59:36,734
on the contract.
1090
00:59:36,734 --> 00:59:39,000
[Angie] And they wanted to
get it done before the snow
1091
00:59:39,066 --> 00:59:40,573
started coming because
this was in November.
1092
00:59:40,573 --> 00:59:41,867
started coming because
this was in November.
1093
00:59:41,967 --> 00:59:45,667
So they were trying to hurry
up and get it done before
it defaulted.
1094
00:59:45,767 --> 00:59:47,567
[Travis] The skeptics made
much of this
1095
00:59:47,634 --> 00:59:50,266
that this whole things
was some kind of a scheme
1096
00:59:50,333 --> 00:59:52,567
to get out of, uh,
finishing the contract,
1097
00:59:52,634 --> 00:59:55,767
but it was not at all
to Mike's advantage
1098
00:59:55,867 --> 00:59:57,567
for the contract to end.
1099
00:59:59,000 --> 01:00:01,000
There was a lot of money
being held back.
1100
01:00:02,333 --> 01:00:04,166
And we had completed
most of it,
1101
01:00:05,266 --> 01:00:08,166
but once the incident happened
there was no way
1102
01:00:08,233 --> 01:00:10,233
that the contract
was gonna get finished.
1103
01:00:11,667 --> 01:00:13,266
[Angie] After that happened,
1104
01:00:13,333 --> 01:00:16,333
Mike couldn't get that crew
to go back out there.
1105
01:00:16,333 --> 01:00:18,367
Maybe some of them
might've been willing,
1106
01:00:18,467 --> 01:00:20,333
but most of them were not.
1107
01:00:22,767 --> 01:00:25,467
[Travis] They brought
in another crew
1108
01:00:25,533 --> 01:00:27,567
to finish
what little we had left.
1109
01:00:27,667 --> 01:00:31,033
Much to Mike's
financial disadvantage.
1110
01:00:31,100 --> 01:00:34,467
[narrator] And if
Mike Rogers did think up
the UFO story,
1111
01:00:35,567 --> 01:00:37,367
how did he get
his six crewmates
1112
01:00:37,433 --> 01:00:39,934
to go along with his
farfetched scheme?
1113
01:00:41,000 --> 01:00:42,934
[Bryce] If you really think
about it,
1114
01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:46,867
the idea that you would
conspire with, uh, six
or seven people
1115
01:00:46,967 --> 01:00:49,767
to tell an outrageous story
that would cause people
1116
01:00:49,867 --> 01:00:51,767
to think you might be
a murderer,
1117
01:00:51,867 --> 01:00:53,367
it just defies logic.
1118
01:00:54,433 --> 01:00:56,467
[narrator] The level of
criticism he and the crew
1119
01:00:56,567 --> 01:01:00,333
faced is yet another shock
to Travis and his family.
1120
01:01:01,467 --> 01:01:03,467
I don't like it
when people came out
1121
01:01:03,533 --> 01:01:04,867
with accusations against him.
1122
01:01:04,934 --> 01:01:06,233
I knew he was telling
the truth,
1123
01:01:06,233 --> 01:01:09,634
I believed him
and that was it.
1124
01:01:12,166 --> 01:01:14,567
[Travis] Well,
there was from the get-go
1125
01:01:14,634 --> 01:01:16,767
a great deal of resistance.
1126
01:01:16,834 --> 01:01:20,033
The idea that there
could be any life
1127
01:01:20,100 --> 01:01:22,233
in the universe,
other than human life.
1128
01:01:24,734 --> 01:01:28,000
And I think that's
a very close minded
1129
01:01:28,066 --> 01:01:29,467
and limited thinking.
1130
01:01:30,867 --> 01:01:36,233
It's maybe partially
motivated out of fear
or people
1131
01:01:36,233 --> 01:01:39,533
feeling that it was a threat
to religious convictions.
1132
01:01:40,567 --> 01:01:40,573
But whatever it was,
many of the accusations
1133
01:01:40,573 --> 01:01:45,233
But whatever it was,
many of the accusations
1134
01:01:45,233 --> 01:01:49,233
that were levied
were easily disproved
1135
01:01:50,467 --> 01:01:54,166
because they were contraries
to verifiable facts.
1136
01:01:56,033 --> 01:01:57,934
[narrator] Yet some
allegations would haunt
1137
01:01:58,000 --> 01:02:02,433
Travis Walton for years,
leading him to wonder
1138
01:02:02,433 --> 01:02:05,767
if there's a coordinated
campaign underway
1139
01:02:05,834 --> 01:02:07,533
to discredit him,
1140
01:02:07,533 --> 01:02:10,573
and if so, who's behind it?
1141
01:02:10,573 --> 01:02:10,767
and if so, who's behind it?
1142
01:02:17,567 --> 01:02:19,133
[instrumental music playing]
1143
01:02:22,433 --> 01:02:24,634
In Snowflake, Arizona,
1144
01:02:24,634 --> 01:02:28,166
alien abductee Travis Walton
and his loved ones
1145
01:02:28,266 --> 01:02:31,767
struggle to get some
semblance of normal life.
1146
01:02:33,834 --> 01:02:35,667
About two years later
we were married.
1147
01:02:37,867 --> 01:02:40,166
We dated steady
for those two years.
1148
01:02:41,567 --> 01:02:43,433
Fell in love
and decided to get married.
1149
01:02:44,634 --> 01:02:44,731
We tried to make it
like nothing happened,
1150
01:02:44,731 --> 01:02:47,133
We tried to make it
like nothing happened,
1151
01:02:47,133 --> 01:02:48,634
so we didn't talk
about it a lot.
1152
01:02:51,133 --> 01:02:52,834
[narrator] But try
as they might,
1153
01:02:52,834 --> 01:02:55,266
Travis and Dana
find themselves hounded
1154
01:02:55,333 --> 01:02:57,734
by small town gossip.
1155
01:02:57,734 --> 01:02:59,767
You know, I could see
people looking at me
1156
01:02:59,867 --> 01:03:02,567
in the store and I could tell
they were thinking, you know,
1157
01:03:02,667 --> 01:03:04,133
things about me.
1158
01:03:04,133 --> 01:03:06,333
[Ben] And they start
making up rumors
1159
01:03:06,333 --> 01:03:09,667
saying, "Well, the crew was
probably all using drugs.
1160
01:03:09,734 --> 01:03:11,867
They were all hallucinating."
1161
01:03:11,967 --> 01:03:14,233
[Shelley] We're talking
in the '70s
1162
01:03:14,233 --> 01:03:14,731
and what really happened
1163
01:03:14,731 --> 01:03:15,567
and what really happened
1164
01:03:15,667 --> 01:03:18,867
if there was drugs involved,
alcohol or whatever.
1165
01:03:20,133 --> 01:03:22,367
[narrator]
Travis' medical tests reveal
1166
01:03:22,467 --> 01:03:25,634
no sign of drugs
in his system.
1167
01:03:25,634 --> 01:03:29,333
Travis didn't do drugs.
Travis hardly even ever drank.
1168
01:03:29,333 --> 01:03:31,467
If he did, I don't even think
he did drink.
1169
01:03:32,967 --> 01:03:35,233
[John] That job was
pretty dangerous, actually.
1170
01:03:35,233 --> 01:03:38,033
Those chainsaws
don't slice you,
1171
01:03:40,433 --> 01:03:42,567
they tear chunks of meat out.
1172
01:03:42,667 --> 01:03:44,731
You can't get high or drink
and do that job, you know.
1173
01:03:44,731 --> 01:03:45,834
You can't get high or drink
and do that job, you know.
1174
01:03:45,834 --> 01:03:47,367
I don't know
anybody who could.
1175
01:03:50,367 --> 01:03:52,066
[narrator]
Despite the naysayers,
1176
01:03:52,133 --> 01:03:54,734
Travis and the crew
have their champions.
1177
01:03:55,834 --> 01:03:58,033
Most notably groups
like A.P.R.O.,
1178
01:03:58,100 --> 01:04:02,166
who gather and examine
evidence to support
the abduction claims.
1179
01:04:03,033 --> 01:04:04,367
First on their list,
1180
01:04:04,433 --> 01:04:07,166
Travis Walton's
physical condition.
1181
01:04:08,266 --> 01:04:10,567
The people who came
and got Travis Walton
1182
01:04:10,667 --> 01:04:14,731
found a severely dehydrated
guy who didn't look good.
1183
01:04:14,731 --> 01:04:15,266
found a severely dehydrated
guy who didn't look good.
1184
01:04:15,367 --> 01:04:18,767
He was in the same clothes
that he was wearing
1185
01:04:18,834 --> 01:04:20,066
when he had disappeared
1186
01:04:20,133 --> 01:04:22,066
and when they
weighed him later,
1187
01:04:22,133 --> 01:04:25,367
uh, that next morning,
they found out he was
at least ten pounds
1188
01:04:25,467 --> 01:04:28,000
lighter than when he had gone
up in the mountains.
1189
01:04:30,767 --> 01:04:33,533
[narrator] Yet Travis' blood
test provides the A.P.R.O.
1190
01:04:33,533 --> 01:04:36,367
doctors with some
striking information.
1191
01:04:38,033 --> 01:04:40,033
[Travis] Part of, uh,
what they were looking for
1192
01:04:40,100 --> 01:04:43,166
was the presence
of what they call ketones,
1193
01:04:43,233 --> 01:04:44,731
which was to indicate
whether my body
1194
01:04:44,731 --> 01:04:46,166
which was to indicate
whether my body
1195
01:04:46,233 --> 01:04:50,433
had been consuming
its own reserves, you know,
1196
01:04:50,433 --> 01:04:53,333
fat, even muscle
in order to maintain life.
1197
01:04:54,266 --> 01:04:56,834
[Ben] He did lose
ten to 12 pounds
1198
01:04:56,834 --> 01:04:58,266
in a short period of time.
1199
01:04:58,367 --> 01:05:00,266
He was severely dehydrated
1200
01:05:00,333 --> 01:05:02,667
but yet no ketones
were present.
1201
01:05:02,767 --> 01:05:07,100
So, it is possible that these
visitors knew enough
1202
01:05:07,166 --> 01:05:08,333
about human biology.
1203
01:05:08,333 --> 01:05:10,767
They tried to nourish him
in some way.
1204
01:05:12,100 --> 01:05:13,667
[narrator] And if he
wasn't picked up
1205
01:05:13,734 --> 01:05:14,731
after his crewmates left him
in the woods,
1206
01:05:14,731 --> 01:05:16,166
after his crewmates left him
in the woods,
1207
01:05:16,266 --> 01:05:20,100
how did Travis survive
for those five days?
1208
01:05:22,000 --> 01:05:23,867
To believe he was left out
1209
01:05:23,934 --> 01:05:27,033
in Sitgreaves National Forest,
not only overnight,
1210
01:05:27,100 --> 01:05:28,834
but for five days
is outrageous.
1211
01:05:28,834 --> 01:05:31,100
At night it gets very,
very cold.
1212
01:05:31,166 --> 01:05:34,166
The guy had a jean jacket
and, and a pair of jeans on.
1213
01:05:34,233 --> 01:05:36,634
It would've been a tough,
tough things to survive.
1214
01:05:37,767 --> 01:05:40,033
[narrator] A.P.R.O.
researches in Arizona
1215
01:05:40,100 --> 01:05:41,567
also uncover evidence
1216
01:05:41,634 --> 01:05:44,731
of an increasing level
of UFO activity
1217
01:05:44,731 --> 01:05:44,734
of an increasing level
of UFO activity
1218
01:05:44,734 --> 01:05:47,867
in the months leading
up to the abduction.
1219
01:05:47,967 --> 01:05:50,467
[Ben] We had an event
that takes place in May,
1220
01:05:50,567 --> 01:05:53,133
just outside
the hills of Tucson.
1221
01:05:53,133 --> 01:05:56,100
We have a mother with her
children who comes across
1222
01:05:56,166 --> 01:06:01,333
a silvery glowing object,
but most interestingly,
1223
01:06:01,333 --> 01:06:04,634
she hears a low rumbling sound
1224
01:06:04,634 --> 01:06:07,734
that's very similar
to what Travis described
1225
01:06:07,734 --> 01:06:09,834
right before this thing
appeared to take off.
1226
01:06:14,266 --> 01:06:14,731
[narrator] Perhaps
the strongest evidence of all
1227
01:06:14,731 --> 01:06:17,867
[narrator] Perhaps
the strongest evidence of all
1228
01:06:17,934 --> 01:06:20,166
comes from
the sheriff's department.
1229
01:06:21,333 --> 01:06:23,767
[Travis] To have six
witnesses all testifying
1230
01:06:23,867 --> 01:06:28,467
in detail to the same events,
and all passing
1231
01:06:28,567 --> 01:06:31,567
lie detector tests
from the state police.
1232
01:06:33,066 --> 01:06:35,033
[Bryce] People have gone
back and forth over the years
1233
01:06:35,100 --> 01:06:37,000
about what a polygraph
actually means,
1234
01:06:37,066 --> 01:06:40,467
but one thing we do know,
though, is when somebody
passes it
1235
01:06:40,567 --> 01:06:44,333
and it's just them,
it gives you a certain
amount of legitimacy.
1236
01:06:45,433 --> 01:06:47,066
But when you have six
different people
1237
01:06:47,133 --> 01:06:48,734
taking a lie detector test
1238
01:06:49,734 --> 01:06:51,567
and they all tell
the same story,
1239
01:06:51,667 --> 01:06:54,934
your chances that the story
they're telling is accurate
1240
01:06:55,000 --> 01:06:57,000
is about,
uh, a million to one.
1241
01:06:59,467 --> 01:07:02,233
[Travis] Dr. James Harder,
he was saying
1242
01:07:02,233 --> 01:07:05,433
that the evidence to support
that this really happened
1243
01:07:05,433 --> 01:07:08,333
would've been sufficient
to convict a person
1244
01:07:08,333 --> 01:07:10,867
of murder
in an American court of law.
1245
01:07:12,734 --> 01:07:14,731
[narrator]
On February 7th, 1976,
1246
01:07:14,731 --> 01:07:15,867
[narrator]
On February 7th, 1976,
1247
01:07:15,967 --> 01:07:17,967
Travis and his brother Duane
1248
01:07:18,033 --> 01:07:20,533
take their own
lie detector tests.
1249
01:07:21,433 --> 01:07:24,367
The results shocked everyone.
1250
01:07:29,266 --> 01:07:31,567
In February of 1976,
1251
01:07:31,667 --> 01:07:34,333
Travis Walton
and his brother Duane
1252
01:07:34,333 --> 01:07:36,867
submit to
polygraph examinations.
1253
01:07:39,133 --> 01:07:40,533
They both pass.
1254
01:07:42,367 --> 01:07:44,367
Landing further credibility
1255
01:07:44,433 --> 01:07:46,667
to Travis' UFO
abduction claims.
1256
01:07:54,266 --> 01:07:56,266
For years after the incident,
1257
01:07:56,333 --> 01:07:56,409
Travis and his
six crew members
1258
01:07:56,409 --> 01:07:58,266
Travis and his
six crew members
1259
01:07:58,367 --> 01:08:00,867
never waver from their story.
1260
01:08:00,934 --> 01:08:04,166
Eventually, the tide
of public opinion
1261
01:08:04,233 --> 01:08:06,000
turns in their favor.
1262
01:08:08,266 --> 01:08:12,166
[Bryce] In 1975, when
the Walton case is big news,
1263
01:08:12,233 --> 01:08:16,033
the government's institutional
response to UFOs back then
1264
01:08:16,100 --> 01:08:19,333
was, "It's probably not
a real thing, don't sweat it.
1265
01:08:19,333 --> 01:08:20,867
Go on about your lives."
1266
01:08:22,533 --> 01:08:24,166
Now the government
says a couple
1267
01:08:24,266 --> 01:08:25,834
of really profound things.
1268
01:08:25,834 --> 01:08:26,409
First of all, they have
confirmed that there are
1269
01:08:26,409 --> 01:08:28,967
First of all, they have
confirmed that there are
1270
01:08:29,033 --> 01:08:32,266
many objects out there
and that they're real
1271
01:08:32,367 --> 01:08:34,767
and that they're unidentified.
1272
01:08:34,867 --> 01:08:36,967
And secondly, they said,
"We don't make them."
1273
01:08:38,266 --> 01:08:40,834
So, lots of people
believed in them before,
1274
01:08:40,834 --> 01:08:43,166
but now
we have a more of a sense
1275
01:08:43,233 --> 01:08:45,867
they are real because our own
government is admitting it.
1276
01:08:47,767 --> 01:08:49,567
[pilot] Oh, got it!
1277
01:08:55,166 --> 01:08:56,409
[narrator] And the attitude
in the Southwestern state,
1278
01:08:56,409 --> 01:08:58,066
[narrator] And the attitude
in the Southwestern state,
1279
01:08:58,133 --> 01:09:00,734
known for some
of the biggest UFO sightings
1280
01:09:00,734 --> 01:09:03,467
in the world has also changed.
1281
01:09:04,767 --> 01:09:09,667
I've known, uh,
Travis Walton for a long time.
1282
01:09:09,767 --> 01:09:12,967
After seeing UFOs
in New Mexico, Arizona
1283
01:09:13,033 --> 01:09:16,533
and California,
I said, "Well, there must be
1284
01:09:16,533 --> 01:09:18,867
something that,
uh... To what he said."
1285
01:09:20,233 --> 01:09:22,066
I do believe
that there are UFOs.
1286
01:09:24,100 --> 01:09:26,266
But you see things
cruising around up there
1287
01:09:26,333 --> 01:09:26,409
it's like,
"What the heck was that?
1288
01:09:26,409 --> 01:09:27,800
it's like,
"What the heck was that?
1289
01:09:27,867 --> 01:09:31,266
No, okay, is that a satellite?
No, it's moving a little bit
too fast."
1290
01:09:31,367 --> 01:09:33,233
[producer] Do you believe
there's something out there?
1291
01:09:33,233 --> 01:09:34,367
I think so.
1292
01:09:37,867 --> 01:09:40,266
Our tales completely
switched around
1293
01:09:40,333 --> 01:09:42,567
where four out of five
people do believe it now.
1294
01:09:42,667 --> 01:09:44,367
Before they didn't.
1295
01:09:44,433 --> 01:09:47,367
You know, it was
exactly the opposite.
1296
01:09:47,433 --> 01:09:51,767
[Steve] I'm sorry that Allen
and Dwayne Smith aren't here,
1297
01:09:51,867 --> 01:09:55,767
because for years people
just thought we were nuts.
1298
01:09:55,867 --> 01:09:56,409
Now, you've got people
who do believe,
1299
01:09:56,409 --> 01:09:59,166
Now, you've got people
who do believe,
1300
01:09:59,233 --> 01:10:03,667
and Allen and Dwayne Smith
aren't here to, to see that.
1301
01:10:05,266 --> 01:10:07,367
[narrator] The shift
in public perception
1302
01:10:07,467 --> 01:10:09,367
began in 1978
1303
01:10:11,467 --> 01:10:13,734
when Travis Walton wrote
1304
01:10:13,734 --> 01:10:16,634
and published a book
about his ordeal.
1305
01:10:18,367 --> 01:10:21,367
The Walton Experience
is the first book written
1306
01:10:21,433 --> 01:10:23,266
by a UFO abductee,
1307
01:10:23,367 --> 01:10:25,834
and it's sort of withstood
the test of time.
1308
01:10:26,934 --> 01:10:28,467
[Ben] My impression
of first reading
1309
01:10:28,567 --> 01:10:31,467
Travis' book,
it was so well written
1310
01:10:31,533 --> 01:10:35,333
that he presents the arguments
before his case
1311
01:10:35,333 --> 01:10:37,266
and against his case
1312
01:10:37,367 --> 01:10:41,634
and takes each individual
criticism and debunks it
one by one.
1313
01:10:43,467 --> 01:10:45,266
[Bryce] What it allowed
readers to do
1314
01:10:45,333 --> 01:10:47,867
for the first time
is to get in his head.
1315
01:10:47,934 --> 01:10:52,066
This is an honest man,
who' trying to tell us
1316
01:10:52,133 --> 01:10:53,734
what really happened to him.
1317
01:10:56,567 --> 01:10:58,667
[narrator] Travis' story
catches the attention
1318
01:10:58,734 --> 01:11:00,367
of Hollywood
1319
01:11:00,467 --> 01:11:03,166
and on March 12th, 1993,
1320
01:11:03,233 --> 01:11:07,433
Paramount Pictures
releases Fire in the Sky.
1321
01:11:09,567 --> 01:11:12,433
A film based on his book.
1322
01:11:12,433 --> 01:11:14,767
[Bryce] Talking about
the Travis Walton abduction,
1323
01:11:14,867 --> 01:11:17,834
there was X-amount of people
that sort of watched it
1324
01:11:17,834 --> 01:11:20,266
when it happened real time
with news coverage,
1325
01:11:20,333 --> 01:11:22,867
there were a few more
that read the book,
1326
01:11:22,967 --> 01:11:26,000
but then there were a lot more
that watched the movie.
1327
01:11:27,066 --> 01:11:29,166
And the people
who watched the movie
1328
01:11:29,266 --> 01:11:31,166
had their minds open
1329
01:11:31,233 --> 01:11:34,233
to the possibility that
an abduction could happen
1330
01:11:34,233 --> 01:11:37,100
because the movie starts with
"based on a true story."
1331
01:11:39,967 --> 01:11:41,367
[Dana]
After the movie was made,
1332
01:11:41,467 --> 01:11:44,033
people became more
and more enlightened I guess.
1333
01:11:44,767 --> 01:11:46,367
More and more people believed.
1334
01:11:46,467 --> 01:11:49,233
And more people came up
to me and said that they
supported us,
1335
01:11:49,233 --> 01:11:51,133
so... That was...
That was great.
1336
01:11:52,233 --> 01:11:53,834
[narrator] The media
forces Travis
1337
01:11:53,834 --> 01:11:56,409
into the spotlight
once more to share
1338
01:11:56,409 --> 01:11:57,066
into the spotlight
once more to share
1339
01:11:57,133 --> 01:12:00,567
the terrifying true story
behind the movie.
1340
01:12:01,467 --> 01:12:04,567
It was glowing,
disk-shaped object.
1341
01:12:04,667 --> 01:12:06,834
Uh, it's kinda, like,
shaped like two pie pans.
1342
01:12:06,834 --> 01:12:09,867
Placed lip to lip
with a dome on top
1343
01:12:09,934 --> 01:12:13,233
and it was glowing,
kind of a golden, uh,
yellow color.
1344
01:12:15,667 --> 01:12:18,066
[narrator]
Like clockwork,
Travis' credibility
1345
01:12:18,133 --> 01:12:19,367
comes under attack.
1346
01:12:20,867 --> 01:12:23,667
All the familiar
skeptics re-emerge,
1347
01:12:23,734 --> 01:12:25,634
including Philip Klass.
1348
01:12:26,667 --> 01:12:29,867
But this time,
Travis has the last word.
1349
01:12:32,367 --> 01:12:34,567
Are you saying,
Phillip, that all seven
1350
01:12:34,667 --> 01:12:36,133
of these people are lying?
1351
01:12:36,133 --> 01:12:38,834
I'm afraid we have
to say that on the basis
1352
01:12:38,834 --> 01:12:40,467
of physical evidence.
1353
01:12:40,567 --> 01:12:41,634
[Larry King] Meaning?
1354
01:12:41,667 --> 01:12:43,634
Physical evidence
that should've been there
1355
01:12:43,634 --> 01:12:44,767
but was not.
1356
01:12:44,767 --> 01:12:46,567
[Larry King] Why are
you laughing, Travis?
1357
01:12:46,634 --> 01:12:49,066
Well, because
this is typical of the sort
of reasoning pattern
1358
01:12:49,133 --> 01:12:51,767
this man uses in attacking
all UFO cases.
1359
01:12:51,867 --> 01:12:54,567
Uh, he's equating
the absence of evidence
1360
01:12:54,667 --> 01:12:56,100
to be the evidence of absence.
1361
01:12:58,066 --> 01:13:00,634
[narrator] The film's release
is a moral victory
1362
01:13:00,634 --> 01:13:03,433
for Travis Walton
and his crewmates.
1363
01:13:05,000 --> 01:13:06,233
[Ben] Fire in the Sky.
1364
01:13:06,233 --> 01:13:09,033
It wasn't just a close
encounters of the third kind
1365
01:13:09,100 --> 01:13:11,767
type of movie, this is
something based on real life.
1366
01:13:11,867 --> 01:13:14,533
This is what happened
to a man and six other
1367
01:13:14,533 --> 01:13:15,934
of his crewmembers.
1368
01:13:19,433 --> 01:13:22,133
We can't just easily
dismiss abduction cases
1369
01:13:22,133 --> 01:13:24,767
because look at all
the evidence in favor
of this one.
1370
01:13:26,634 --> 01:13:29,266
[narrator] In the aftermath
of Fire in the Sky,
1371
01:13:29,367 --> 01:13:32,066
a new generation
of UFO investigators
1372
01:13:32,133 --> 01:13:34,333
take up Travis' cause.
1373
01:13:34,333 --> 01:13:37,166
Can they find actual
physical evidence
1374
01:13:37,233 --> 01:13:39,367
to prove Travis' story
1375
01:13:39,433 --> 01:13:41,567
beyond any doubt?
1376
01:13:45,767 --> 01:13:47,266
In 2014,
1377
01:13:49,266 --> 01:13:50,667
UFO researcher
1378
01:13:50,767 --> 01:13:52,667
and documentarian, Ben Hansen,
1379
01:13:52,734 --> 01:13:54,333
meets Travis Walton
1380
01:13:54,333 --> 01:13:57,533
at the site of his UFO
abduction to examine
1381
01:13:57,533 --> 01:14:01,567
any remaining evidence
of Travis' alien encounter.
1382
01:14:02,867 --> 01:14:06,734
Years ago Travis, uh,
and I were filming, um,
1383
01:14:06,734 --> 01:14:10,767
kind of a survey before
we had a conference here.
1384
01:14:10,834 --> 01:14:13,166
So, right here
is where we determined
1385
01:14:13,266 --> 01:14:14,386
through the witnesses
and especially Travis'
recollection
1386
01:14:14,386 --> 01:14:15,934
through the witnesses
and especially Travis'
recollection
1387
01:14:16,000 --> 01:14:18,734
where this object
was hovering.
1388
01:14:18,734 --> 01:14:21,367
This is the first time
we're gonna open it up
to the public.
1389
01:14:21,467 --> 01:14:23,166
We didn't want
the public coming in here,
1390
01:14:23,266 --> 01:14:27,367
knowing the location
and start taking stuff
or planting things.
1391
01:14:27,467 --> 01:14:30,266
We wanted to know exactly
what kind of evidence,
1392
01:14:30,367 --> 01:14:31,567
if anything, was left over.
1393
01:14:32,834 --> 01:14:34,433
[narrator]
Ben and the research team
1394
01:14:34,433 --> 01:14:37,000
take a methodical approach
to the date collection.
1395
01:14:40,100 --> 01:14:43,834
[Ben] We gritted this
whole area and we treated it
1396
01:14:43,834 --> 01:14:44,386
like a crime scene.
1397
01:14:44,386 --> 01:14:45,000
like a crime scene.
1398
01:14:46,233 --> 01:14:49,667
While we're going through
everything, the topsoil, uh,
1399
01:14:49,734 --> 01:14:52,266
we're looking at rocks
to see if they're magnetic,
1400
01:14:52,367 --> 01:14:54,867
we come across some
of these tree stumps.
1401
01:14:56,066 --> 01:14:58,967
Now these have broken off
shortly after the incident.
1402
01:14:59,033 --> 01:15:01,567
You can actually count
back the rings, of course,
1403
01:15:01,634 --> 01:15:04,066
and see this tree
would've been here 1975.
1404
01:15:05,133 --> 01:15:06,533
[narrator]
On closer inspection
1405
01:15:06,533 --> 01:15:09,934
of the tree rings,
Ben and Travis noticed
1406
01:15:10,000 --> 01:15:12,433
something very strange indeed.
1407
01:15:12,433 --> 01:15:14,386
[Ben] If you think
of a tree ring,
1408
01:15:14,386 --> 01:15:14,667
[Ben] If you think
of a tree ring,
1409
01:15:14,767 --> 01:15:17,967
they're usually
very equally sized,
1410
01:15:18,033 --> 01:15:20,567
uh, concentric circles.
1411
01:15:21,133 --> 01:15:22,867
Okay, on all sides.
1412
01:15:25,066 --> 01:15:28,367
But these trees
had something unique.
1413
01:15:28,433 --> 01:15:31,467
The rings on the side
facing the clearing
1414
01:15:32,166 --> 01:15:33,767
was spaced out further.
1415
01:15:37,567 --> 01:15:39,667
Meaning there was a greater
volume of growth
1416
01:15:39,767 --> 01:15:42,367
on that side
of the tree alone.
1417
01:15:42,467 --> 01:15:44,386
And we started noticing
this as we're going around
1418
01:15:44,386 --> 01:15:44,634
And we started noticing
this as we're going around
1419
01:15:44,634 --> 01:15:47,867
in a circle and came across
the discovery
1420
01:15:47,967 --> 01:15:50,033
that they all seemed
to be pointing
1421
01:15:50,100 --> 01:15:52,066
in a direction
towards the center.
1422
01:15:52,133 --> 01:15:54,834
The epicenter where
the craft was hovering.
1423
01:16:01,433 --> 01:16:03,867
[narrator] Could radiation
from the UFO,
1424
01:16:03,934 --> 01:16:07,133
as evidenced by the Geiger
counter readings at the site
1425
01:16:07,133 --> 01:16:11,834
in 1975, have caused
these trees to mutate?
1426
01:16:13,033 --> 01:16:14,386
[Ben] I started
researching a bit
1427
01:16:14,386 --> 01:16:14,634
[Ben] I started
researching a bit
1428
01:16:15,533 --> 01:16:16,834
and I found
a couple of studies
1429
01:16:16,834 --> 01:16:18,467
that happened after Chernobyl.
1430
01:16:27,567 --> 01:16:30,467
The studies found
that these trees grow
1431
01:16:30,533 --> 01:16:33,233
exponentially greater
than any other time period.
1432
01:16:34,767 --> 01:16:36,166
So is that what happened here?
1433
01:16:39,166 --> 01:16:41,667
[narrator] At an independent
lab in Ohio,
1434
01:16:41,734 --> 01:16:44,386
the soil samples taken from
the site are tested against
1435
01:16:44,386 --> 01:16:44,734
the soil samples taken from
the site are tested against
1436
01:16:44,734 --> 01:16:46,467
to control group.
1437
01:16:46,533 --> 01:16:49,934
The findings
blow everyone away.
1438
01:16:52,233 --> 01:16:55,533
There was a higher
concentration of iron
1439
01:16:55,533 --> 01:17:00,233
and other ferrous materials
as compared to the controlled
1440
01:17:00,233 --> 01:17:02,467
samples which were
much further away.
1441
01:17:02,567 --> 01:17:03,834
Now what does that mean?
1442
01:17:03,834 --> 01:17:07,934
Other, uh, notable UFO cases
have indicated sometimes
1443
01:17:08,000 --> 01:17:12,000
a trace evidence
of ferrous materials
1444
01:17:12,066 --> 01:17:14,386
as if something, um, creating
a large magnetic field
1445
01:17:14,386 --> 01:17:16,567
as if something, um, creating
a large magnetic field
1446
01:17:16,634 --> 01:17:19,967
was pulling these particles up
from the lower layers.
1447
01:17:24,066 --> 01:17:26,233
[narrator]
Based on these findings,
1448
01:17:26,233 --> 01:17:29,567
Ben Hansen and many other
open-minded researchers
1449
01:17:29,634 --> 01:17:31,767
draw the same conclusion.
1450
01:17:34,033 --> 01:17:36,533
The Travis Walton
abduction case
1451
01:17:36,533 --> 01:17:39,634
offers perhaps
the best evidence to date
1452
01:17:39,634 --> 01:17:43,066
of alien visitation
to planet Earth.
1453
01:17:45,033 --> 01:17:48,467
I can say that I fully
believe what he experienced
1454
01:17:48,567 --> 01:17:51,734
is how he
and the crew experiences
1455
01:17:51,734 --> 01:17:53,066
very strange event.
1456
01:17:55,266 --> 01:17:57,433
[narrator] But as Walton's
story continues to be
1457
01:17:57,433 --> 01:18:01,066
more accepted as truth,
frightening questions remain.
1458
01:18:03,166 --> 01:18:07,467
Who are these alien creatures
and what do they want?
1459
01:18:18,567 --> 01:18:21,533
Travis Walton
makes one final trip
1460
01:18:21,533 --> 01:18:25,433
from his home in
Snowflake to the site
of his alien abduction.
1461
01:18:27,066 --> 01:18:30,867
It's, It's just, um, kind of
a PTSD kind of a thing.
1462
01:18:32,467 --> 01:18:35,333
I still feel apprehension.
1463
01:18:38,467 --> 01:18:39,418
We're getting close.
1464
01:18:39,418 --> 01:18:40,066
We're getting close.
1465
01:18:42,767 --> 01:18:46,233
[narrator] For Travis, this is
still an emotional journey.
1466
01:18:57,467 --> 01:18:59,367
[sighs]
1467
01:19:02,567 --> 01:19:04,266
[Travis] This was really
a turning point
1468
01:19:04,367 --> 01:19:05,867
in my life what happened here.
1469
01:19:07,433 --> 01:19:09,418
It's amazing to think
how much time has gone by.
1470
01:19:09,418 --> 01:19:10,367
It's amazing to think
how much time has gone by.
1471
01:19:11,266 --> 01:19:13,367
Little did I know, uh,
1472
01:19:14,533 --> 01:19:16,467
my life would
never be the same.
1473
01:19:17,867 --> 01:19:19,934
[narrator] Four decades later,
1474
01:19:20,000 --> 01:19:23,000
Travis reflects
on what it all means.
1475
01:19:23,066 --> 01:19:26,467
[Travis] Well, I had a choice
after this incident happened.
1476
01:19:26,567 --> 01:19:29,333
Could I just shut up about
it and hope people
1477
01:19:29,333 --> 01:19:31,567
will forget about it
and it'll go away
1478
01:19:31,634 --> 01:19:34,166
or get out there
and defend myself
1479
01:19:34,266 --> 01:19:36,634
and, uh,
set the record straight?
1480
01:19:41,834 --> 01:19:45,266
Aliens exist, we're not alone
in the universe.
1481
01:19:46,467 --> 01:19:51,066
I think people need to realize
that there is a reality here.
1482
01:19:52,934 --> 01:19:55,000
[narrator] And no one knows
this better
1483
01:19:55,066 --> 01:19:59,100
than the six men who
witnessed Travis'
alien encounter.
1484
01:20:00,266 --> 01:20:04,967
Every one of those
crewmen has stood by the story
1485
01:20:05,033 --> 01:20:07,667
of that happened
throughout their lives
1486
01:20:08,967 --> 01:20:09,418
and some of them are
no longer with us.
1487
01:20:09,418 --> 01:20:10,934
and some of them are
no longer with us.
1488
01:20:12,166 --> 01:20:14,467
They've had the courage
to stand up
1489
01:20:14,533 --> 01:20:17,133
to the naysayers and they
endured that
1490
01:20:17,133 --> 01:20:19,967
from the beginning, even...
Even before I was returned.
1491
01:20:22,066 --> 01:20:24,767
[Steve] I lived it and it's
still hard to believe.
1492
01:20:24,834 --> 01:20:27,433
Man, I've been called
a liar so many times.
1493
01:20:27,433 --> 01:20:29,667
[laughing]
1494
01:20:29,767 --> 01:20:32,266
I'm just used to it, I guess.
It doesn't really bother me.
1495
01:20:32,333 --> 01:20:34,367
If you believe it,
you believe it.
You don't, you don't.
1496
01:20:35,667 --> 01:20:38,767
[John] It's always
gonna be there, you know.
1497
01:20:38,867 --> 01:20:39,418
And sometime
if bothers me a lot,
1498
01:20:39,418 --> 01:20:41,266
And sometime
if bothers me a lot,
1499
01:20:41,333 --> 01:20:43,934
you know, but it did happen
and why did it happen?
1500
01:20:44,000 --> 01:20:45,333
Why was it us?
1501
01:20:46,567 --> 01:20:49,266
[Mike] Everybody was affected
differently, you know.
1502
01:20:49,333 --> 01:20:53,066
Greatly affected my life,
but it's all for the better
I think.
1503
01:20:53,133 --> 01:20:54,433
For the better.
1504
01:20:57,467 --> 01:20:58,567
It was real.
1505
01:21:00,066 --> 01:21:01,734
It was real that day.
1506
01:21:04,967 --> 01:21:07,266
[Dana] What I would say
to skeptics is
1507
01:21:08,100 --> 01:21:09,418
walk a mile in my shoes.
1508
01:21:09,418 --> 01:21:10,100
walk a mile in my shoes.
1509
01:21:10,166 --> 01:21:12,000
They need to do more research,
1510
01:21:12,066 --> 01:21:13,967
they need to be more
open minded.
1511
01:21:14,634 --> 01:21:17,066
[pilot] Oh, got it!
1512
01:21:17,133 --> 01:21:19,634
[laughing] Woo-hoo!
1513
01:21:19,634 --> 01:21:22,767
[narrator] Now, recent
government disclosures
1514
01:21:22,867 --> 01:21:25,266
lend further credence
to the experiences
1515
01:21:25,333 --> 01:21:27,967
of Travis
and his fellow crewmembers.
1516
01:21:29,000 --> 01:21:31,767
The last three years,
basically,
1517
01:21:31,834 --> 01:21:35,367
we have seen story after story
that establishes,
1518
01:21:35,433 --> 01:21:38,967
uh, that UFOs are more real
than anybody's ever believed.
1519
01:21:40,467 --> 01:21:43,266
[Ben] Perhaps the most
important modern-day
1520
01:21:43,333 --> 01:21:46,000
revelation from our
government is an official
1521
01:21:46,066 --> 01:21:48,266
acknowledgement that
the phenomenon is real.
1522
01:21:48,967 --> 01:21:50,533
Something is going on.
1523
01:21:52,233 --> 01:21:55,467
We definitely cannot
rule out extraterrestrial.
1524
01:21:55,533 --> 01:21:59,467
If the world had felt
the same back in 1975,
1525
01:21:59,567 --> 01:22:01,367
I don't think that
the case would've received
1526
01:22:01,433 --> 01:22:04,066
so much negative
criticism and ridicule.
1527
01:22:05,634 --> 01:22:07,567
[Travis] I think
that the reason
1528
01:22:07,634 --> 01:22:09,418
the Pentagon disclosures
film and statements
1529
01:22:09,418 --> 01:22:11,367
the Pentagon disclosures
film and statements
1530
01:22:11,467 --> 01:22:14,133
that they have evidence,
it's basically they're saying,
1531
01:22:14,133 --> 01:22:17,233
"It's a matter
of fact." It's very..
1532
01:22:17,233 --> 01:22:18,667
It's very good progress.
1533
01:22:18,734 --> 01:22:21,367
So it's a relief
that they're going to come
1534
01:22:21,467 --> 01:22:23,767
so far as to say,
"Yes, there's something here
1535
01:22:23,867 --> 01:22:25,567
and we don't know what it is."
1536
01:22:27,033 --> 01:22:29,367
[Bryce] I think that one
of the things
you're going to see
1537
01:22:29,467 --> 01:22:31,767
happening in the next
few years are we're
gonna have
1538
01:22:31,834 --> 01:22:34,567
congressional hearings
on this very topic
1539
01:22:35,333 --> 01:22:37,367
and I would submit
to the senators
1540
01:22:37,433 --> 01:22:38,867
and the congress people
1541
01:22:38,934 --> 01:22:39,418
who are thinking of putting
those hearings together
1542
01:22:39,418 --> 01:22:41,467
who are thinking of putting
those hearings together
1543
01:22:41,567 --> 01:22:44,133
that they might want
to consider calling up
Travis Walton
1544
01:22:44,133 --> 01:22:46,834
and bringing him up
to Washington and asking him
1545
01:22:46,834 --> 01:22:49,767
to tell his story directly.
I think they'd like to
hear it.
1546
01:22:54,767 --> 01:22:59,066
[Travis] This is the place
where my life
was changed forever.
1547
01:22:59,133 --> 01:23:02,166
Eventually I'm hoping
something good will
come of it.
1548
01:23:03,567 --> 01:23:05,166
At the minimum,
1549
01:23:05,266 --> 01:23:09,418
uh, make humans realize
that we're not so special,
1550
01:23:09,418 --> 01:23:09,867
uh, make humans realize
that we're not so special,
1551
01:23:09,967 --> 01:23:12,767
uh, that, uh,
the world there is.
1552
01:23:15,834 --> 01:23:18,967
The fact that these aliens
exist after all this time
1553
01:23:19,033 --> 01:23:22,467
with vastly
superior technology
1554
01:23:23,066 --> 01:23:25,467
has to mean that they, uh,
1555
01:23:25,567 --> 01:23:29,100
ceased to be war like
in attacking each other.
1556
01:23:29,166 --> 01:23:32,033
So it's, uh, sort of
a message to humanity
1557
01:23:32,100 --> 01:23:35,266
to figure out to be a whole
lot less savage
1558
01:23:35,333 --> 01:23:38,867
and a whole lot smarter
about where we're going
with all this.