1 00:00:21,050 --> 00:00:27,990 My first child by him, daughter, what I saw with her was she would not let 2 00:00:27,990 --> 00:00:33,330 me change her diapers. I just could not pry her legs apart, and she was afraid 3 00:00:33,330 --> 00:00:38,190 of her father. And he would take them in the bedroom and lock the door, and they 4 00:00:38,190 --> 00:00:43,890 would scream. I would have to break the door down and physically fight him. 5 00:00:45,240 --> 00:00:50,540 Court -appointed psychiatrists that have been doing evaluations for 12 years for 6 00:00:50,540 --> 00:00:55,580 this judge said that I was a suitable parent and the doctor was a sexually 7 00:00:55,580 --> 00:00:57,300 deviant schizoid. 8 00:00:57,520 --> 00:01:02,980 He refused to listen to what the, or at least abide by what the psychiatrist had 9 00:01:02,980 --> 00:01:06,200 to say, and I assume then he gave permanent custody to your husband? 10 00:01:07,240 --> 00:01:12,320 Permanent custody of two. This psychiatrist also gave testimony that 11 00:01:12,540 --> 00:01:19,220 meaning the doctor, was incapable of having relationships with females 12 00:01:19,220 --> 00:01:25,700 of his childlike nature. And this judge gives two little baby girls 13 00:01:25,700 --> 00:01:32,240 to this man. I went to court. My children were prepared now. They're 10 14 00:01:32,240 --> 00:01:36,540 old. They can verbalize. They were prepared to talk to this judge. 15 00:01:36,920 --> 00:01:42,960 I showed the judge pictures of them black and blue, and the judge says, 16 00:01:43,020 --> 00:01:45,440 I'm just a country judge. I don't interview children. 17 00:01:45,760 --> 00:01:46,760 Same judge. 18 00:01:46,840 --> 00:01:53,300 Same judge. Sent those kids back. So now my kids are alone with a 19 00:01:53,300 --> 00:01:59,120 stepmother addict who's taking them around to bars, sleeping with known 20 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:00,280 in front of my children. 21 00:02:01,320 --> 00:02:06,540 The judge refused to sign an order saying that I could take my children 22 00:02:06,540 --> 00:02:09,660 with me even though their father's whereabouts were unknown. 23 00:02:10,880 --> 00:02:17,480 Devin Weber tells her personal story of tragedy and triumph right now 24 00:02:17,480 --> 00:02:20,100 on Alternative Views. 25 00:03:21,480 --> 00:03:27,700 This edition of Alternative View is going to be very disturbing, but it 26 00:03:27,700 --> 00:03:29,880 be, in the final run, uplifting as well. 27 00:03:30,740 --> 00:03:35,960 It's a very complex story of Devin Weber, who's gone through hell for many 28 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:36,960 years. 29 00:03:37,480 --> 00:03:43,460 It's a story that includes sexual molestation of children, incest, 30 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:48,600 police corruption, political corruption, corruption of the medical community, 31 00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:51,060 abuse by... 32 00:03:51,340 --> 00:03:53,040 power structure in a small town. 33 00:03:54,360 --> 00:04:00,960 But it's also an uplifting story about how a woman can go through terrible 34 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:05,060 tragedy in her life and come out okay. 35 00:04:07,580 --> 00:04:13,900 Devin, you've told your story on several of the top talk shows in the 36 00:04:13,900 --> 00:04:16,399 country, on television and all. 37 00:04:16,600 --> 00:04:18,300 But we want to let you... 38 00:04:18,649 --> 00:04:22,910 You were with other people at the time, and your time was hacked up by 39 00:04:22,910 --> 00:04:27,330 commercials and all this. We want you to just tell your own story now about how 40 00:04:27,330 --> 00:04:32,430 you found out that your husband was sexually abusing your children and then 41 00:04:32,430 --> 00:04:35,770 happened as a result of all this. 42 00:04:37,530 --> 00:04:41,190 When did you find out? When did it appear to you that he was sexually 43 00:04:41,190 --> 00:04:41,989 your children? 44 00:04:41,990 --> 00:04:44,690 Well, I really started seeing it. 45 00:04:45,050 --> 00:04:51,610 For sure, when I had my second little baby. So my first child by him, 46 00:04:51,910 --> 00:04:55,990 what I saw with her was she would not let me change her diapers. 47 00:04:56,310 --> 00:04:57,310 How old was she? 48 00:04:57,450 --> 00:05:03,490 Well, this was ever since she was like three months old. And by the time she 49 00:05:03,490 --> 00:05:05,610 a year old, I had had another baby. 50 00:05:06,950 --> 00:05:13,830 And I just could not pry her legs apart. And she was afraid of her father. 51 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:17,460 And he kept saying that I was an overprotective mother. 52 00:05:17,700 --> 00:05:22,600 And he kept sending me to psychiatrists saying that I was crazy. So I started 53 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:24,080 sharing this with the psychiatrist. 54 00:05:24,300 --> 00:05:29,460 And by the time I had my second little girl, and she just, I mean, I couldn't, 55 00:05:29,460 --> 00:05:33,620 you couldn't pry a little baby, three -month -old baby's legs apart. 56 00:05:33,840 --> 00:05:38,120 I started realizing that something was wrong. And he would take them in the 57 00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:42,160 bedroom and lock the door, and they would scream it. I would have to break 58 00:05:42,160 --> 00:05:43,160 door down. 59 00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:49,320 uh fight him so i was starting to see it and the psychiatrist was helping me see 60 00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:54,920 it right about the time that the divorce and custody case started i was just 61 00:05:54,920 --> 00:06:01,500 starting to be able to see it and guess what the profession of her husband was 62 00:06:01,500 --> 00:06:08,380 a very prominent medical doctor in a small town in ohio near dayton 63 00:06:10,380 --> 00:06:15,980 Actually, he was an MD and also a specialist. So he had had additional 64 00:06:15,980 --> 00:06:17,960 to become a family practice specialist. 65 00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:23,400 Well, how long did this... Now, they were so young. How long did you live 66 00:06:23,400 --> 00:06:24,239 him knowing this? 67 00:06:24,240 --> 00:06:30,820 Well, I had only lived with him... My little girl was almost two years old 68 00:06:30,820 --> 00:06:35,480 I lost her in the custody case. So just from like one to two, I'd had two 69 00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:36,980 children very closely together. 70 00:06:38,319 --> 00:06:43,840 Now, there was a matter of drug problem in the family, too. What was that? 71 00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:50,580 Well, I had realized I had come from a poor background and had always worked 72 00:06:50,580 --> 00:06:55,800 had been on ADC but was always a working mother. And I'd had a previous child 73 00:06:55,800 --> 00:07:00,100 that came into this marriage. And it was very quickly into the marriage that I 74 00:07:00,100 --> 00:07:06,640 realized this doctor was on drugs. And he was on Valium and he was on... 75 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:13,140 large amounts of antidepressants, and he was on Ritalin for a high, and then he 76 00:07:13,140 --> 00:07:16,480 would take downers, and he was a pot smoker chronically. 77 00:07:16,700 --> 00:07:20,920 And so we used to have a lot of arguments about that, but the problem 78 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:25,800 was one of the things that how he manipulated me would be to find medical 79 00:07:25,800 --> 00:07:30,020 problems in me, and he had diagnosed that he had heard a clicking in my jaw. 80 00:07:30,420 --> 00:07:32,980 So he had sent me to a colleague of his who... 81 00:07:33,590 --> 00:07:38,270 Started to treat the jaw and gave me a severe jaw problem where I had to go to 82 00:07:38,270 --> 00:07:39,310 the hospital and have traction. 83 00:07:39,710 --> 00:07:43,530 But I was in pain, so this is how my husband introduced me to drugs. 84 00:07:43,810 --> 00:07:48,610 So he had me on codeine and he had me on large amounts of Valium. 85 00:07:48,990 --> 00:07:53,930 And he would tell me that Valium was a non -addicting drug and I could take 50 86 00:07:53,930 --> 00:07:56,530 or 60, 10 milligrams and it wouldn't bother me. 87 00:07:57,850 --> 00:08:02,370 Right about that time, I was starting to need that much Valium to live with this 88 00:08:02,370 --> 00:08:08,630 person. And what he did was he got me addicted. I didn't know anything about 89 00:08:08,630 --> 00:08:10,670 addictions because I'd never been on drugs. 90 00:08:10,930 --> 00:08:15,770 And then he gave me the key to the drug unit at his facility. So I was sneaking 91 00:08:15,770 --> 00:08:20,350 there getting drugs before I even realized I was an addict. Then he cut my 92 00:08:20,350 --> 00:08:23,030 supply off, and I had a grandma seizure. 93 00:08:23,790 --> 00:08:28,570 And I was in critical condition in an intensive care unit. I almost died 94 00:08:28,570 --> 00:08:32,750 I found out that Valium is a highly addictive drug. 95 00:08:33,210 --> 00:08:35,130 I guess he was trying to kill me. 96 00:08:35,970 --> 00:08:39,750 Well, at what point then did you file for divorce? 97 00:08:40,190 --> 00:08:43,710 Well, then right when that happened, I came home from the hospital. 98 00:08:45,950 --> 00:08:49,850 Doctors that were in practice with him called me up, and they said they knew 99 00:08:49,850 --> 00:08:51,770 I had a seizure. It was because of him. 100 00:08:52,070 --> 00:08:55,930 And they said that they were going to have a meeting with him saying that he 101 00:08:55,930 --> 00:08:59,650 psychiatric problems. They were seeing it in his practice, and they wanted to 102 00:08:59,650 --> 00:09:04,570 move me out for a few days just to make sure the children and I were safe while 103 00:09:04,570 --> 00:09:08,210 they confronted him with if he didn't get help, they'd have to get rid of him. 104 00:09:08,690 --> 00:09:12,510 But what happened is the schizoid that he is, 105 00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:18,420 Doesn't respond to, you know, rational behavior modification. He went, he got 106 00:09:18,420 --> 00:09:24,000 very irrational and angry and sued me for a divorce two days after I got out 107 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:27,600 the hospital saying that I was crazy from my recent seizure. 108 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:32,540 And the problem was when his colleagues knew they couldn't manage him, they 109 00:09:32,540 --> 00:09:37,660 protected him. So all the support that I thought I had, they all betrayed me and 110 00:09:37,660 --> 00:09:41,140 lied and protected him because they didn't want anybody to know they had a 111 00:09:41,140 --> 00:09:42,420 sexually deviant. 112 00:09:43,230 --> 00:09:48,470 weirdo in their private practice so you went before a judge then for a divorce 113 00:09:48,470 --> 00:09:55,350 hearing what was that like well i went into this it was just so bizarre i it 114 00:09:55,350 --> 00:10:00,510 five minutes long and i went in and this was the first time i met this judge and 115 00:10:00,510 --> 00:10:06,890 he just told me that he wanted me out of my home by the end of the evening and 116 00:10:06,890 --> 00:10:08,670 he put my children in foster homes 117 00:10:09,670 --> 00:10:14,370 All three of them, the little babies, my one was a year and my other was two, 118 00:10:14,530 --> 00:10:20,250 and my son was about eight at the time, for no reason. And his reason said was 119 00:10:20,250 --> 00:10:23,470 that my husband was a doctor and he needed a telephone. 120 00:10:23,810 --> 00:10:30,590 So after five minutes, I lost my children, my home, every belonging, and 121 00:10:30,590 --> 00:10:31,590 completely homeless. 122 00:10:31,690 --> 00:10:35,250 Well, they said that you were an unfit mother because the doctor, this 123 00:10:35,250 --> 00:10:39,540 upstanding gentleman in the community, said you were crazy. 124 00:10:39,740 --> 00:10:42,700 Well, you know, the bizarre thing is they never gave me a reason. 125 00:10:43,360 --> 00:10:47,160 They never gave a reason other than they just wanted this thing to settle down a 126 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:49,380 little bit. They never gave a reason, and I... 127 00:10:49,770 --> 00:10:53,670 just a year ago, was looking through testimony, and the clerk of court's 128 00:10:53,670 --> 00:10:58,130 to think, well, maybe there was so much happening, I forgot the reason. And all 129 00:10:58,130 --> 00:11:02,110 it states in the documents is that the judge ordered these children in a foster 130 00:11:02,110 --> 00:11:06,710 home. It doesn't give a reason. And the five minutes, that wasn't a real 131 00:11:06,710 --> 00:11:10,750 complete divorce hearing, was it? No, it was like a preliminary hearing. 132 00:11:11,949 --> 00:11:16,970 Before the trial, which was about a year later, that was eight and a half hours 133 00:11:16,970 --> 00:11:21,930 long. Okay, well, he kicked you out of your house. Did he give you any separate 134 00:11:21,930 --> 00:11:23,430 maintenance or alimony or something? 135 00:11:23,630 --> 00:11:27,590 Well, they gave me, they said I could have $50 a week. But you have to 136 00:11:27,590 --> 00:11:32,650 understand, I had no job. I was a housewife. I have no supportive family. 137 00:11:34,440 --> 00:11:39,300 I didn't really know a lot of people in this community, and the attorney that I 138 00:11:39,300 --> 00:11:44,760 had representing me told me that if I wanted my children, I had to leave that 139 00:11:44,760 --> 00:11:46,520 city. I had to get out of town. 140 00:11:46,780 --> 00:11:52,480 And I said, I don't want to leave the city. My children are here. He said, if 141 00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:58,840 wanted custody, I had to leave town. I bought into it because my husband, the 142 00:11:58,840 --> 00:12:02,220 doctor, said if I ever tried to leave him, he would take the kids. 143 00:12:03,640 --> 00:12:08,380 That was a fear that I had, so I was a victim. I did anything this attorney had 144 00:12:08,380 --> 00:12:13,480 said, and he at the time was the prosecutor of that town, of that city, 145 00:12:13,480 --> 00:12:14,480 private attorney. 146 00:12:14,580 --> 00:12:15,920 Oh, he had both jobs. 147 00:12:16,430 --> 00:12:20,050 Sometimes there's collusion among lawyers in a case like this. Was there 148 00:12:20,050 --> 00:12:24,010 case, too? I found that out eight months into it after my attorney, the 149 00:12:24,010 --> 00:12:28,770 prosecutor, was abusing me. I was trying to tell him, this man is sexually 150 00:12:28,770 --> 00:12:33,970 abusing my kids, and this prosecutor would use profanity with me, saying, who 151 00:12:33,970 --> 00:12:34,970 was I? 152 00:12:35,819 --> 00:12:40,100 having sex with to make it nice and he would say you better come up with money 153 00:12:40,100 --> 00:12:43,600 for me or I'm gonna quit you and you're gonna lose your kids this guy would talk 154 00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:47,540 to me and I didn't even have a home I would be in a phone booth saying please 155 00:12:47,540 --> 00:12:52,740 help my children I'm telling you he is abusing my kids and he was the 156 00:12:52,740 --> 00:12:58,620 but he wouldn't even look into it no he wouldn't did you have any counseling 157 00:12:58,620 --> 00:13:03,400 yourself to help you over this well I stayed with the psychiatrist that I was 158 00:13:04,609 --> 00:13:08,330 go into at the time all this happened and I tried to tell him that you know I 159 00:13:08,330 --> 00:13:12,910 think that my attorney is in on this because he's being cruel to me and he's 160 00:13:12,910 --> 00:13:17,050 doing anything to protect me and he's told me to get out of town and I don't 161 00:13:17,050 --> 00:13:20,650 understand this and I told him about the five -minute hearing and my 162 00:13:20,650 --> 00:13:25,800 psychiatrist didn't believe me so when he didn't believe me And you know your 163 00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:29,600 children are being abused, and you're homeless. I mean, I had to live with, 164 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:34,940 like, slime outlaws. I had to live there. I had no experience to be with 165 00:13:34,940 --> 00:13:40,260 criminal -type people. I was living in a rural community. I was a doctor's wife. 166 00:13:40,740 --> 00:13:42,640 And now I'm homeless. 167 00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:47,240 And the psychiatrist kept saying, well, you know, this just doesn't happen. 168 00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:52,060 You know, our system is going to take care of you. So I got very sick. I 169 00:13:52,060 --> 00:13:57,280 having some psychotic -type symptoms because if when no one hears you and 170 00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:01,800 your own doctor says it isn't happening, you start thinking, well, maybe it 171 00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:02,800 isn't happening. 172 00:14:03,220 --> 00:14:08,620 And so I would go to see the children in the foster home, and by then the 173 00:14:08,620 --> 00:14:12,520 doctor... was giving the foster parent all free medical. 174 00:14:12,780 --> 00:14:16,900 Your husband, the doctor. Yeah, my husband, the doctor, was taking care of 175 00:14:16,900 --> 00:14:22,580 foster parent, giving her all free medical care, giving her all free drugs. 176 00:14:23,240 --> 00:14:25,200 So I knew what was happening there. 177 00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:27,240 Was she treating the children all right? 178 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:33,820 She was treating my girls all right, but she wasn't treating my son because... 179 00:14:35,310 --> 00:14:40,230 I now know this. The doctor was trying to say that it was my son that was 180 00:14:40,230 --> 00:14:44,130 sexually abusing the kids to cover. And so she was being mean to him. 181 00:14:44,330 --> 00:14:47,810 I see. Well, you had a second divorce hearing. I mean, the divorce hearing 182 00:14:47,810 --> 00:14:51,990 proper. And custody. That was eight and a half hours long. 183 00:14:52,830 --> 00:14:55,850 How much longer after the first five hours? It was a good... 184 00:14:56,250 --> 00:15:02,930 Ten months. I had a long time to regress, and I had to adjust to a 185 00:15:03,330 --> 00:15:08,830 I had no money. I had to learn how to live with people that rob houses. 186 00:15:09,510 --> 00:15:11,990 I had to learn to live pimped. That was the only place where you could find a 187 00:15:11,990 --> 00:15:12,990 stay. I didn't know anybody. 188 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:18,680 You know, I didn't know anybody. So at first I went with this woman, and I 189 00:15:18,680 --> 00:15:23,200 cleaned her house for her for a room. But I kept getting sicker. And when 190 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:27,380 living with somebody that's sick, you know, I couldn't take care of myself. So 191 00:15:27,380 --> 00:15:32,460 she threw me out, and I was just drifting. And I went into this, like, 192 00:15:32,460 --> 00:15:36,960 bar thing, and some woman said I could live with her. And when you start 193 00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:39,040 sick, you start losing your... 194 00:15:40,360 --> 00:15:43,580 perception of things. You can't think things through when you're desperate. 195 00:15:43,900 --> 00:15:50,360 So I had to adjust to learning how to live with street, hardcore people that 196 00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:54,740 have no values, that have no morals, plus fight a custody case. 197 00:15:55,220 --> 00:16:02,020 So I had to get another attorney, a well -known attorney, and I found him 198 00:16:02,020 --> 00:16:05,280 because the gal I was living with, he got her off from murder. 199 00:16:06,230 --> 00:16:09,510 This is the kind of people I was living with. So I go to this guy. 200 00:16:09,710 --> 00:16:10,710 I have no money. 201 00:16:11,390 --> 00:16:17,870 He helps me see that my other attorney has been in on it because we could pick 202 00:16:17,870 --> 00:16:20,390 up that he was feeding the doctor's attorney all the information. 203 00:16:20,890 --> 00:16:22,970 About you? About me, yes. Oh, boy. 204 00:16:24,570 --> 00:16:27,490 Now, what happened, what did the judge do? The same judge, right? 205 00:16:27,690 --> 00:16:30,410 Yeah. And what did he do on the second hearing? 206 00:16:30,990 --> 00:16:33,230 Well, that was eight and a half hours long. 207 00:16:34,910 --> 00:16:40,050 I had to subpoena about half of that town that I was living in because they 208 00:16:40,050 --> 00:16:44,270 given testimony of things that were negative about me because, you know, my 209 00:16:44,270 --> 00:16:47,870 doctor husband had had me followed. He had wiretapped my telephone. 210 00:16:48,170 --> 00:16:52,370 He put little babies up to the phone having them cry. And when you know your 211 00:16:52,370 --> 00:16:56,690 children are being tortured and you hear a baby cry on the phone, you get sick. 212 00:16:57,010 --> 00:16:58,750 I mean, you just get really sick. 213 00:17:00,490 --> 00:17:02,030 I kept pulling myself together. 214 00:17:02,230 --> 00:17:07,550 I graduated from school. I got a job, so I was halfway stable by the time my 215 00:17:07,550 --> 00:17:11,369 trial came up, and I was living in a low -income housing project. 216 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:18,800 The judge appointed a court -appointed psychiatrist to examine both of us. And 217 00:17:18,800 --> 00:17:24,619 the court -appointed psychiatrist that had been doing evaluations for 12 years 218 00:17:24,619 --> 00:17:30,100 for this judge said that I was a suitable parent and the doctor was a 219 00:17:30,100 --> 00:17:31,780 deviant schizoid. 220 00:17:32,140 --> 00:17:34,080 My goodness. So he believed your story. 221 00:17:34,540 --> 00:17:38,100 Well, he believed it because he tested me out. 222 00:17:38,300 --> 00:17:42,920 You know, I mean, they do these psychiatric tests. four -hour 223 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:47,360 both of us and I mean it surprised me because I mean I would have been the 224 00:17:47,360 --> 00:17:52,080 to tell you I was crazy at that point because I felt crazy but he said it was 225 00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:56,800 because of him it was because of what this man was doing to me and that I felt 226 00:17:56,800 --> 00:18:00,280 that desperateness because no one would help me I mean children's services 227 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:04,020 wouldn't help me in that community I went to them they said they can't go 228 00:18:04,020 --> 00:18:09,520 against a doctor or the judge so when your options run out You start wearing 229 00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:15,520 that. But in the trial, not one negative thing came out about me. And the judge 230 00:18:15,520 --> 00:18:20,920 tried to keep the psychiatrist's evaluation out by refusing to accept his 231 00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:27,820 deposition. So I had to subpoena this psychiatrist in from a city that was 232 00:18:27,820 --> 00:18:32,900 about three hours away from where this county was and pay for all the time that 233 00:18:32,900 --> 00:18:37,640 he missed just to get his testimony in. And then the judge locked it up. 234 00:18:37,900 --> 00:18:41,420 So there's not public record to these evaluations. 235 00:18:42,060 --> 00:18:47,700 Oh, my gosh. So he refused to listen to what the, or at least abide by what the 236 00:18:47,700 --> 00:18:51,460 psychiatrist had to say, and I assume then he gave... permanent custody to 237 00:18:51,460 --> 00:18:56,920 husband? He gave permanent custody of two. This psychiatrist also gave 238 00:18:56,920 --> 00:19:03,820 that this man, meaning the doctor, was incapable of having relationships with 239 00:19:03,820 --> 00:19:10,500 females because of his childlike nature. And this judge gives two little baby 240 00:19:10,500 --> 00:19:13,200 girls to this man. 241 00:19:15,050 --> 00:19:19,770 I did get my son, but that's because I had my son from a previous marriage. 242 00:19:20,050 --> 00:19:21,570 What kind of treatment? 243 00:19:21,850 --> 00:19:26,370 So he had custody of the children. Was he remarried by this time? 244 00:19:26,790 --> 00:19:27,389 Oh, yeah. 245 00:19:27,390 --> 00:19:31,490 These type of people, they have patterns. 246 00:19:31,850 --> 00:19:37,770 I mean, they have absolute patterns. And he was already engaged by the custody 247 00:19:37,770 --> 00:19:39,550 trial time and got married. 248 00:19:40,490 --> 00:19:44,410 Since then, there's been a drama with that marriage and the children. But 249 00:19:44,410 --> 00:19:49,350 already he had another woman to present. Here's this healthy wife I have now. 250 00:19:49,570 --> 00:19:53,910 And I not only lost my children, that this guy didn't take me back into court 251 00:19:53,910 --> 00:20:00,070 and try to take all my legal rights away from me so that I could never see my 252 00:20:00,070 --> 00:20:01,070 kids again. 253 00:20:02,030 --> 00:20:06,870 And did the abuse continue after he got remarried? 254 00:20:08,700 --> 00:20:12,060 With the children or with me? I mean, he kept abusing me. 255 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:18,500 Well, these type of people are so out of control that initially he gained some 256 00:20:18,500 --> 00:20:21,280 control by having another woman that would care for the children. 257 00:20:21,700 --> 00:20:27,360 But he's a deviant person, so his abuse became more covert. 258 00:20:27,640 --> 00:20:32,120 But he was still abusing the children because I would go to pick up my kids, 259 00:20:32,120 --> 00:20:35,720 the only way they had to communicate with me at that age was like banging 260 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:36,720 head. 261 00:20:40,070 --> 00:20:44,630 Yeah. And so there wasn't any way they could really let you know, what about 262 00:20:44,630 --> 00:20:45,630 this? Because they couldn't talk. 263 00:20:45,810 --> 00:20:49,970 They were just babies, you know. So that, you'll never forget that. 264 00:20:55,830 --> 00:20:59,230 Do you want to stop for a while? 265 00:20:59,510 --> 00:21:00,510 Okay. 266 00:21:01,430 --> 00:21:05,090 What about your son? Did he see anything that he could tell you about? He 267 00:21:05,090 --> 00:21:07,170 started, he was able to talk. 268 00:21:07,550 --> 00:21:13,070 years later, and he would say that when I wasn't there, this doctor would call 269 00:21:13,070 --> 00:21:19,850 him a homosexual, and he would beat him and things like that. But I never saw 270 00:21:19,850 --> 00:21:25,230 that when I was living there because, you know, you're so afraid of this man. 271 00:21:25,230 --> 00:21:27,130 mean, you are so afraid of him. 272 00:21:27,430 --> 00:21:32,130 And then through the years, my children now, they start getting older. 273 00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:37,640 So they go from two years old to now they're eight and ten, and I went back 274 00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:43,240 court because my little girl was at my house for a visit, and she was changing 275 00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:46,560 her clothes, and her whole body was black and blue. 276 00:21:47,360 --> 00:21:52,860 And the stepmother had beat her and thrown her down some steps, so I kept 277 00:21:52,860 --> 00:21:58,440 didn't return her, and I got another attorney, and he asked for an ex parte 278 00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:00,100 order, which I received. 279 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:06,120 the cleaning woman that the the stepmother and doctor had had called me 280 00:22:06,120 --> 00:22:11,680 that they're on drugs there's guns going off get these children out of here and 281 00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:17,260 so i did and so the judge signed an ex parte order i went to court my children 282 00:22:17,260 --> 00:22:23,280 were prepared now they're 10 years old they can verbalize they were prepared to 283 00:22:23,280 --> 00:22:29,570 talk to this judge I showed the judge pictures of them black and blue, and the 284 00:22:29,570 --> 00:22:33,070 judge says, well, I'm just a country judge. I don't interview children. 285 00:22:33,450 --> 00:22:34,449 Same judge. 286 00:22:34,450 --> 00:22:38,030 Same judge sent those kids back. 287 00:22:38,470 --> 00:22:43,610 Can you imagine their faces when they finally tell the truth, and then they're 288 00:22:43,610 --> 00:22:44,610 sent back? 289 00:22:44,810 --> 00:22:48,170 Was there continuing sexual abuse by the father? 290 00:22:49,550 --> 00:22:52,630 The children would act out things like that. 291 00:22:52,950 --> 00:22:59,310 After he got them, before he had another woman living in there with him, when I 292 00:22:59,310 --> 00:23:03,230 would have them on visits, they went from how they would never spread their 293 00:23:03,230 --> 00:23:08,070 to when I changed their diapers, they would take their legs and throw it back 294 00:23:08,070 --> 00:23:11,610 over their head and hold their vaginas apart. 295 00:23:13,310 --> 00:23:17,510 Oh, my God. So I knew that he was doing something to these kids. 296 00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:23,240 called 800 numbers and what they'll tell you is go to your local you have to go 297 00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:27,220 to the children's service number i mean i tried all that stuff that people say 298 00:23:27,220 --> 00:23:34,060 to do and meantime i'm getting very sick trying to deal with this and so i had 299 00:23:34,060 --> 00:23:39,740 to take a break just to get healthy again and i ended up going from low 300 00:23:39,740 --> 00:23:44,260 housing home homeless and i i knew that the only way to save the kids is i had 301 00:23:44,260 --> 00:23:45,260 to become reputable 302 00:23:46,060 --> 00:23:52,380 I had to have credibility, and that's what I did. I started a business, became 303 00:23:52,380 --> 00:23:54,460 speaker. I got some national success. 304 00:23:55,860 --> 00:24:02,620 And then two years ago, I went public with it myself to get my 305 00:24:02,620 --> 00:24:06,620 children back at ages 11 and 12. 306 00:24:07,140 --> 00:24:13,100 At what point did you suspect more dope activity? 307 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:17,580 and narcotic activity within the family of the doctor and the stepmother? 308 00:24:18,060 --> 00:24:22,680 Well, I suspected it because of the things that the children were saying. 309 00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:28,960 And the kids, see, children, they learn to own this than to be helpless. So the 310 00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:33,900 children, he controlled them like he would put them in a room after they'd 311 00:24:33,900 --> 00:24:39,100 home from me and play music and force them to sing the song that he wanted 312 00:24:39,100 --> 00:24:42,880 to sing at his funeral if they choose to live with their mom. 313 00:24:43,970 --> 00:24:48,110 So my kids, they stopped talking, but every once in a while they'd bring a 314 00:24:48,110 --> 00:24:52,590 little friend down. The little friend would say, Alicia, did you tell your 315 00:24:52,590 --> 00:24:54,010 about finding Betsy dead? 316 00:24:55,690 --> 00:24:56,810 And I said, what? 317 00:24:57,370 --> 00:25:01,890 Alicia said, well, mommy, I got up to go to school, and Betsy was dead on the 318 00:25:01,890 --> 00:25:07,170 floor, and daddy had to give her mouth -to -mouth, and we had to call the 319 00:25:07,170 --> 00:25:08,730 ambulance. She overdosed. 320 00:25:09,410 --> 00:25:10,570 What was he giving them? 321 00:25:11,350 --> 00:25:12,510 She was given... 322 00:25:12,840 --> 00:25:16,940 This was the stepmother. She was taking all the drugs. Now he's turned her into 323 00:25:16,940 --> 00:25:19,000 an addict like he tried to do with me. 324 00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:26,120 So I tried to get the children out of there. This judge, I got another 325 00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:32,160 The judge refused to sign an ex parte order. I found out that the doctor had 326 00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:37,000 been shipped to a drug treatment center. So now my kids are alone with a 327 00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:41,020 stepmother addict who's taking them around to bars. 328 00:25:41,550 --> 00:25:43,990 sleeping with known dealers in front of my children. 329 00:25:44,850 --> 00:25:50,230 The judge refused to sign an order saying that I could take my children 330 00:25:50,230 --> 00:25:56,090 with me even though their father's whereabouts were unknown, using the 331 00:25:56,090 --> 00:26:00,250 that I've had to deal with Devin Weber for years, and I'm sick of it. 332 00:26:00,670 --> 00:26:04,630 Well, how is it that your husband was sent off for drug treatment? Apparently 333 00:26:04,630 --> 00:26:07,610 his drug activity was found out. 334 00:26:07,850 --> 00:26:08,850 Well, there... 335 00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:13,820 The hospital that he was working at, there was missing drugs, large amount of 336 00:26:13,820 --> 00:26:18,560 missing drugs. Now, you have to understand, this doctor went from like a 337 00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:24,880 well -built person down to about 100 pounds. He looked like a corpse walking. 338 00:26:25,120 --> 00:26:28,600 And no one at this hospital confronted this man. 339 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:32,780 I know this because I went and confronted the hospital people myself. 340 00:26:33,610 --> 00:26:38,390 But what happened after this missing drugs, they connected it with this 341 00:26:38,390 --> 00:26:41,990 and shipped them away to clean them up and to keep the story quiet. 342 00:26:42,630 --> 00:26:47,030 Meantime, what I had to do, because the judge wouldn't give me the children, I 343 00:26:47,030 --> 00:26:53,750 had to go in and file with the sheriff's department, you know, a criminal 344 00:26:53,750 --> 00:26:58,570 suit saying that I believe there's illegal drugs going on in the house. 345 00:26:58,570 --> 00:26:59,730 brought in a detective. 346 00:27:00,510 --> 00:27:05,150 who found out that there was drug trafficking and busted both the doctor 347 00:27:05,150 --> 00:27:06,150 wife. 348 00:27:06,330 --> 00:27:09,030 Because, see, I had to play a hunch. 349 00:27:09,590 --> 00:27:14,530 My thinking was, I'll never get custody of these kids. I gave up on that. This 350 00:27:14,530 --> 00:27:15,930 judge isn't going to give them to me. 351 00:27:16,150 --> 00:27:20,150 But if I could get them on a criminal charge and they had to go to prison, how 352 00:27:20,150 --> 00:27:24,190 could this judge not give me my kids then? But it turned out that the... 353 00:27:25,460 --> 00:27:29,760 This detective, who is the hero, interviewed the children for three and a 354 00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:31,840 hours, heard horror stories. 355 00:27:32,120 --> 00:27:33,099 Like what? 356 00:27:33,100 --> 00:27:38,280 Stories like the doctor was doing pelvics on them. He would give them 357 00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:44,440 say that if they cried, he'd take the needle and break it off in their arms. 358 00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:48,800 He took their cat and tried to kill it in front of it by stuffing it in a 359 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:49,800 sweeper. 360 00:27:50,340 --> 00:27:53,880 He threw firecrackers at them in the house. 361 00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:59,860 They showed bullet holes in the walls where he was stoned and shooting his gun 362 00:27:59,860 --> 00:28:04,440 off and just missed where my daughter was coming out of the bathroom. They 363 00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:07,220 an Uzi machine gun out of this house. 364 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:10,140 And this judge, he knew all of this stuff. 365 00:28:10,540 --> 00:28:12,500 Did they find drugs in the house? Oh, yeah. 366 00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:17,660 The wife was busted while trafficking. 367 00:28:17,980 --> 00:28:22,180 She was caught right doing it. There was no question about it. 368 00:28:23,450 --> 00:28:28,350 The real problem comes in. Now we got the doctor busted and the wife busted, 369 00:28:28,350 --> 00:28:30,590 it goes to a prosecutor's office. 370 00:28:30,830 --> 00:28:35,190 And this is a different prosecutor now. I wasn't familiar with this guy. He 371 00:28:35,190 --> 00:28:37,750 refuses to indict them. 372 00:28:38,450 --> 00:28:43,490 This thing sat there for a year, and the detectives kept on it and on it, and 373 00:28:43,490 --> 00:28:48,650 the prosecutor refused to indict the doctor, and nobody could figure out why. 374 00:28:48,650 --> 00:28:51,870 said it wasn't conflict of interest, and that's how... 375 00:28:52,330 --> 00:28:53,410 I got involved. 376 00:28:53,770 --> 00:28:59,290 I had to go talk to this prosecutor and say, why aren't you prosecuting? And 377 00:28:59,290 --> 00:29:04,890 then I had to do my own investigative work, and I had to bring TV cameras in 378 00:29:04,890 --> 00:29:08,870 from the city that I lived in to try to expose these people. And this guy still 379 00:29:08,870 --> 00:29:12,130 would not prosecute this drug trafficking doctor. 380 00:29:12,350 --> 00:29:14,810 He shipped the case to another county. 381 00:29:15,350 --> 00:29:18,510 That county refused to prosecute, shipped it back. 382 00:29:18,990 --> 00:29:24,550 to dark county dark county shipped it back to shelby county so it really 383 00:29:24,550 --> 00:29:30,510 like they were protecting the doctor i mean that's what it looked like and so i 384 00:29:30,510 --> 00:29:37,490 found in the ohio revised code it's a 30905 and it's it's a code and it says 385 00:29:37,490 --> 00:29:42,530 as a tax paying citizen if you feel a prosecutor is in gross neglect of duty 386 00:29:42,530 --> 00:29:48,350 this code will enable you to file suit which i did so i went public and and 387 00:29:48,830 --> 00:29:54,130 filed charges as a citizen against this prosecutor and i pulled court records 388 00:29:54,130 --> 00:30:00,710 and i found over 40 criminal cases that got including aggravated attempted 389 00:30:00,710 --> 00:30:07,370 murder and drug trafficking and child molesting that these these outlaws 390 00:30:07,370 --> 00:30:13,030 completely free because this prosecutor refused to prosecute within time stature 391 00:30:13,030 --> 00:30:18,600 and no other reason And the judge didn't look into it? The judge signed all of 392 00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:25,220 the case dismisses. The same judge signed all these case dismisses. See, 393 00:30:25,220 --> 00:30:29,080 indictment, a prosecutor has 250 days to take that to trial. 394 00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:35,120 If he doesn't do it within that time frame, they walk free, no matter how 395 00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:38,980 hideous the crime is. So I have frustrated cops. 396 00:30:39,580 --> 00:30:43,600 starting to call me their hero because I'm exposing all of this. My life was 397 00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:46,460 indirectly threatened, the detective on my case. 398 00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:53,220 I had to do stakeouts and watch the house to get the mother subpoenaed. I 399 00:30:53,220 --> 00:30:57,080 do all of this to get my kids out of that environment, which I did. 400 00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:01,920 I finally got them with no thanks to this judge. My children are with me. 401 00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:06,620 They've been determined victims of crime by the Ohio Supreme Court. 402 00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:08,660 It's an automatic, mandatory. 403 00:31:09,560 --> 00:31:15,540 that the court sends the prosecutor a report of this decision. The prosecutor 404 00:31:15,540 --> 00:31:20,080 still does not indict this doctor. 405 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:22,180 Your ex -husband? 406 00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:24,280 Yeah, the ex -husband. I didn't understand that. 407 00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:31,300 You know, this sounds so much like either movies or novels or short stories 408 00:31:31,300 --> 00:31:36,860 read about small towns where the local power structure is so tight with each 409 00:31:36,860 --> 00:31:38,080 other, including the... 410 00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:44,560 legal system the corporate system the the whole judicial system and the media 411 00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:51,040 where they just protect each other and they don't let anything mess that up 412 00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:54,980 and of course the doctors are considered prominent members of the local power 413 00:31:54,980 --> 00:32:00,300 structure the judges and then the prosecutors and the sheriffs or whatever 414 00:32:00,300 --> 00:32:05,580 you know they do the bidding of these people is that the feel that you get 415 00:32:05,580 --> 00:32:09,180 a step further, it's not just like the good old boys club. 416 00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:14,340 In this particular case, I knew that what I experienced in that courtroom 417 00:32:14,340 --> 00:32:20,840 just a bad deal. It was evil. And since I've been investigating street buzzes, 418 00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:26,000 the judge does cocaine, the first attorney that I told you I had that was 419 00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:30,160 prosecutor just got kicked out of the Elks Club for profanity. 420 00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:35,360 That stuff, can you imagine being too bad for the Elks Club? Yeah, really. 421 00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:40,860 But the point that I'm making is that these players within this judicial 422 00:32:40,860 --> 00:32:47,360 are inadequate, deviant personalities, not just scratching each other's backs. 423 00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:54,300 Who knows what the covert dealings are? Because any judge that would give 424 00:32:54,300 --> 00:32:57,180 little babies to a known pedophile... 425 00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:02,080 Which brings up an interesting point. When I did all my own investigating and 426 00:33:02,080 --> 00:33:05,260 hit the papers, people would write me their stories. 427 00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:12,040 And I interviewed a former detective who told me that years ago at a 428 00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:18,660 high school, there was a teacher by the same last name as this judge who was 429 00:33:18,660 --> 00:33:20,720 accused of molesting one of his students. 430 00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:25,760 The community was outraged because there was a cover -up because this teacher, 431 00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:32,160 who has the same last name as this judge, his mother was in a political 432 00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:36,140 and they got it off. And people were even trying to get 60 Minutes to come in 433 00:33:36,140 --> 00:33:39,400 and expose these people because there was a molested child. 434 00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:46,200 Well, I found out through the detective that this judge was teaching at this 435 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:49,980 high school during that time before he became an attorney. 436 00:33:51,639 --> 00:33:53,960 So, you know, I mean, I don't know. 437 00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:59,560 That's the missing link. We know that they're protecting him. The best that I 438 00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:04,780 was able to accomplish was I went to the hospital director and said, you know, 439 00:34:04,820 --> 00:34:08,900 this guy comes in here 90 pounds. You never confront the doctor. Didn't you 440 00:34:08,900 --> 00:34:10,840 to know if he had a terminal illness even? 441 00:34:11,219 --> 00:34:12,719 He's been practicing medicine. 442 00:34:13,159 --> 00:34:18,020 They called me up. The president of the board of directors of this hospital 443 00:34:18,020 --> 00:34:19,020 called me up. 444 00:34:19,639 --> 00:34:24,500 said, what would it take from that hospital to get me to shut up? 445 00:34:25,540 --> 00:34:31,760 I said, you know, mister, you insult my integrity because if you have one 446 00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:38,280 practicing pedophile, I will speak out not just for my children, but any child 447 00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:44,840 with any nearness to that hospital. Next thing I know, they buy the doctor's 448 00:34:44,840 --> 00:34:45,840 medical community. 449 00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:49,860 Send her out and throw him out of town. Of course, they write headlines. 450 00:34:50,420 --> 00:34:54,420 This hospital, doctor leaving to help the community. 451 00:34:54,699 --> 00:34:58,200 They're going to buy the practice. Well, the funny thing is his practice sat 452 00:34:58,200 --> 00:35:01,120 empty for over 10 years before he took it. 453 00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:06,180 They never bought it then. It's just cover -up. It's cover -up after cover 454 00:35:06,240 --> 00:35:11,060 I mean, the doctor, your ex -husband, moved out of town. Well, he was thrown 455 00:35:11,060 --> 00:35:16,260 of town. And he can still practice? Did they remove his license to practice? 456 00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:23,240 Because we could not get an indictment on this guy, a detective from 457 00:35:23,240 --> 00:35:28,380 the Ohio Pharmaceutical Board on a federal level came all the way down to 458 00:35:28,380 --> 00:35:30,680 County and walked in the... 459 00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:36,940 clerk of courts to to personally thank me for my work because he said without 460 00:35:36,940 --> 00:35:42,380 they wouldn't even have gotten this far so we forced this other county that dart 461 00:35:42,380 --> 00:35:49,140 county sent it to to um uh force a plea bargain so seven 462 00:35:49,140 --> 00:35:53,840 criminal felonies by the doctor was plea bargain down to like three criminal 463 00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:59,470 misdemeanors and all we got was his license to prescribe medicine taken 464 00:35:59,730 --> 00:36:05,010 Then his three criminal misdemeanors went through this same judge who, of 465 00:36:05,010 --> 00:36:08,330 course, which we knew, would give him treatment in lieu of conviction. 466 00:36:08,590 --> 00:36:15,410 He dropped the trafficking charges on the wife and sentenced her to like a 467 00:36:15,410 --> 00:36:20,810 in jail and gave her job duty where all she had to do was sleep in jail. The 468 00:36:20,810 --> 00:36:24,170 judge let her out from like 10 in the morning until 10 at night. 469 00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:29,780 for her job and she wasn't even working anywhere i couldn't get press up there 470 00:36:29,780 --> 00:36:36,100 just recently the prosecutor that i went after he had to hire the best attorney 471 00:36:36,100 --> 00:36:40,080 in ohio to go after little me i mean i didn't know anything about being an 472 00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:45,000 attorney but i scared the heck out of this prosecutor of course he got my case 473 00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:49,620 dismissed but just within the last three weeks i found out that he has been 474 00:36:49,620 --> 00:36:54,660 shipped off to a treatment center for drug abuse yeah Drug alcohol. 475 00:36:54,940 --> 00:36:59,220 So they were all doing it. Yeah, so I go up to the little town newspaper. 476 00:36:59,820 --> 00:37:04,600 Have you heard anything about the prosecutor? And he goes, the reporter 477 00:37:04,720 --> 00:37:09,560 he goes, you mean that he's been shipped off to a treatment center in Wisconsin? 478 00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:12,840 And I said, yeah, that's exactly what I mean. Are you going to print it? 479 00:37:13,080 --> 00:37:14,080 And he says, 480 00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:19,540 well, no, why would I? It's not local news. The treatment center is in another 481 00:37:19,540 --> 00:37:23,990 state. That's how, by the way, I ended up here. Thank you to you. 482 00:37:24,290 --> 00:37:27,130 I can share it because, again, I was frustrated. 483 00:37:27,410 --> 00:37:28,770 Here this is going on. 484 00:37:29,030 --> 00:37:30,570 No one wants to hear this. 485 00:37:30,990 --> 00:37:36,050 And it's still going on. I mean, three days before I came down here, it's still 486 00:37:36,050 --> 00:37:41,150 going on. It's still going on. Years, for ten years, this has been happening. 487 00:37:41,830 --> 00:37:42,830 It's unbelievable. 488 00:37:44,030 --> 00:37:48,310 Well, you have your little girls now, and they're, what, teenagers now? How 489 00:37:48,310 --> 00:37:49,310 are they? 490 00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:51,120 14 and 15. 491 00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:56,860 And how have they come through all this? They must be disturbed. 492 00:37:57,180 --> 00:37:58,600 Well, yeah, they're disturbed. 493 00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:05,760 In what way? How does this show up? Well, just like when they were maybe 10 494 00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:11,040 11 and living with him, my daughter had a birthday party, slumber party with 20 495 00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:17,380 little girls. And the doctor pulls his penis out and funded 20 little girls. 496 00:38:18,730 --> 00:38:24,070 Every year now, for the two years that I have my daughter on her birthday, see, 497 00:38:24,150 --> 00:38:29,390 children will block all this. She's depressed, helpless, hopeless. 498 00:38:29,790 --> 00:38:34,870 I have to get her to doctors. She feels like there's things going on wrong with 499 00:38:34,870 --> 00:38:36,230 her body, and it's him. 500 00:38:36,550 --> 00:38:41,730 A mother called me that was their babysitter, said that he pulled out his 501 00:38:41,730 --> 00:38:42,830 in front of her daughter. 502 00:38:43,050 --> 00:38:45,350 And so I said, will you talk? 503 00:38:45,710 --> 00:38:49,570 Will you talk? And she said, yes. So I send my detective over there. And guess 504 00:38:49,570 --> 00:38:52,590 what? She says, well, I'm afraid because he's a doctor. 505 00:38:53,910 --> 00:38:55,690 So, I mean, the guy's a pedophile. 506 00:38:56,530 --> 00:38:57,530 He's a pedophile. 507 00:38:58,270 --> 00:39:01,930 Do either of your children date boys yet? 508 00:39:02,150 --> 00:39:03,150 Not yet. 509 00:39:03,190 --> 00:39:08,570 They're getting that puberty. We go to my husband that I'm married to. We go to 510 00:39:08,570 --> 00:39:13,210 family therapy. We go to all these therapies. You know, my children are. 511 00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:15,280 They get massage therapy. 512 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:21,680 Victims of crime have been very good and helped me pay for the compensation of 513 00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:26,280 some of this. My children had to have their jaws, treatment for their jaws 514 00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:32,220 because of holding in anger. They had temporal mandibular joint syndrome, so 515 00:39:32,220 --> 00:39:33,220 they had severe pain. 516 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,140 My husband and I have gotten them off of all drugs. 517 00:39:36,560 --> 00:39:40,100 When they'd come to our house, he'd have codeine and everything packed. 518 00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:42,260 He treated the kids chronically. 519 00:39:42,860 --> 00:39:47,100 And then he would say that, you know, I was making them sick. Well, he was 520 00:39:47,100 --> 00:39:52,680 making them sick. Because my kids are hardly sick now. We've done major work 521 00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:57,820 that. But the horror is I only have temporary custody. 522 00:39:58,200 --> 00:40:00,760 Still? Yeah, because I have to go to that judge. 523 00:40:01,700 --> 00:40:07,500 See, to get custody, I have to go where the case was in that county. And so what 524 00:40:07,500 --> 00:40:09,320 if this judge says, well, he's had treatment? 525 00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:12,800 So all the expense and everything has been on me. 526 00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:20,020 I don't take him to court for even child support because I'd have to go through 527 00:40:20,020 --> 00:40:21,020 this judge. 528 00:40:21,100 --> 00:40:25,500 So, I mean, I only have temporary custody. So you still could lose your 529 00:40:25,500 --> 00:40:29,620 back to this? I still could lose my children if I had to go through that 530 00:40:29,620 --> 00:40:30,620 system, yes. 531 00:40:31,080 --> 00:40:35,060 Well, how have you survived all this? Tell us the story of you now. Well, I 532 00:40:35,060 --> 00:40:36,280 guess it took... 533 00:40:37,690 --> 00:40:43,150 when i was homeless and drifting and a little crazy i was so broken and so 534 00:40:43,150 --> 00:40:49,510 stripped i was so sick that just to brush my teeth took so much energy my 535 00:40:49,510 --> 00:40:55,830 bled i was raped i was exposed to things that i never knew existed but there was 536 00:40:55,830 --> 00:41:00,950 this voice inside of me that said if i do survive this i don't want to be 537 00:41:00,950 --> 00:41:05,690 because i've not done anything wrong here and this could ruin me and i was 538 00:41:05,690 --> 00:41:12,100 to go in And take responsibility that I chose this evil man. And that is 539 00:41:12,100 --> 00:41:18,080 something about me. And I was able to connect with my own childhood sexual 540 00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:22,700 and torture when I was an infant. But see, I had blocked it. You were abused 541 00:41:22,700 --> 00:41:27,740 your own father. By my father, yes. And so I took responsibility for my pain. 542 00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:34,300 and um became healthier and in fact i even went back and paid the 90 bucks to 543 00:41:34,300 --> 00:41:40,000 sit in front of that psychiatrist just to tell him that i was right and that 544 00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:45,040 telling me this didn't happen i became a very sick person and he said i know 545 00:41:45,040 --> 00:41:51,300 that now and he does a lot better work for other patients but when did you find 546 00:41:51,300 --> 00:41:55,220 out at what point did you become aware that you had been abused by your father 547 00:41:55,220 --> 00:42:01,580 or were you always aware of it I really wasn't aware to the extent of torture. 548 00:42:02,100 --> 00:42:08,400 I wasn't aware in that I was so young. I had some memory of violent, very 549 00:42:08,400 --> 00:42:09,860 violent sexual abuse. 550 00:42:10,420 --> 00:42:15,540 My father, when I was six, had me out in a cottage in the woods, and I was very 551 00:42:15,540 --> 00:42:18,960 afraid of the dark, and he made me sleep down in the... 552 00:42:19,190 --> 00:42:23,490 living room by a window and he went upstairs so the only way he could get 553 00:42:23,490 --> 00:42:27,350 me was to come down the stairs about an hour later there was this monster 554 00:42:27,350 --> 00:42:32,790 banging at the window and at the door and it broke the door in and this 555 00:42:32,790 --> 00:42:37,970 viciously was strangling me and i screamed and was about to lose 556 00:42:37,970 --> 00:42:44,790 and this monster took off his mask and it was my father he had a nylon stocking 557 00:42:44,790 --> 00:42:50,940 on his uh face and he said you know mom is little baby so it was daddy can i 558 00:42:50,940 --> 00:42:56,360 sleep with you i mean this was my life so it made sense that i would choose an 559 00:42:56,360 --> 00:43:03,100 evil sexually molesting person because i was working that through which i own i 560 00:43:03,100 --> 00:43:10,020 own that and i uh my own healing i have helped hundreds of thousands of people 561 00:43:10,020 --> 00:43:15,040 across the country by sharing what I found out about myself. But I had to see 562 00:43:15,040 --> 00:43:18,320 that I hated myself, and that's why I was a victim. 563 00:43:19,460 --> 00:43:24,580 You know, now I'm on the Sex Offenders Committee at courthouses. I train cops 564 00:43:24,580 --> 00:43:26,580 and prosecutors and social workers. 565 00:43:26,820 --> 00:43:31,780 I train therapists how to teach them to work with survivors and perpetrators. 566 00:43:31,820 --> 00:43:36,900 You know, I have a purpose. So, I mean, that's the light at the end of this. 567 00:43:37,710 --> 00:43:44,150 horrible dark tunnel but it's people have no idea that in this 568 00:43:44,150 --> 00:43:50,550 universe that there's deviance in these power positions 569 00:43:50,550 --> 00:43:55,030 these are people that come from these dysfunctional sexually abusive families 570 00:43:55,030 --> 00:44:01,150 they run our country and people don't know this and it's the most horrifying 571 00:44:01,150 --> 00:44:02,150 reality 572 00:44:02,780 --> 00:44:06,600 just that reality alone if i'd come from a normal healthy family would have 573 00:44:06,600 --> 00:44:11,780 wiped me out because you believe that good are protected and that is not true 574 00:44:11,780 --> 00:44:17,300 that is not true and i urge people to if they know in their hearts that they're 575 00:44:17,300 --> 00:44:23,540 innocent never never give up how would you advise a family a parent 576 00:44:23,540 --> 00:44:30,460 what signs would they look for if there was sexual abuse and their children 577 00:44:31,180 --> 00:44:36,980 Well, the younger the child, you'll see a lot of withdrawal or severe acting 578 00:44:36,980 --> 00:44:42,760 out. If you see little kids fondling themselves for long periods or sticking 579 00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:47,320 things in one another, I saw these behaviors with my children. Little 580 00:44:47,320 --> 00:44:51,880 do not know how to do these kinds of sexual behaviors. Little at what age? 581 00:44:52,100 --> 00:44:56,540 Any age. I do training so that I can work with infants that have been 582 00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:59,540 An infant that has been molested will tell you... 583 00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:03,980 They'll have post -traumatic stress. If they were molested in a crib, they'll 584 00:45:03,980 --> 00:45:09,180 scream. This was my children. At three months old, if they heard his car pulled 585 00:45:09,180 --> 00:45:10,360 up, they screamed. 586 00:45:11,000 --> 00:45:15,920 They know. But we're not trained to listen. We're not trained to listen to 587 00:45:15,920 --> 00:45:22,000 children. But children that have not gone through puberty yet do not sexually 588 00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:23,380 act out extensively. 589 00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:27,220 So if you have a child that's masturbating a lot when they're little, 590 00:45:27,220 --> 00:45:28,440 these little kids... 591 00:45:28,830 --> 00:45:32,590 will do exactly what they're taught. A three -year -old can be taught to 592 00:45:32,590 --> 00:45:36,930 sexually perform if they're molested over and over and over. That's what my 593 00:45:36,930 --> 00:45:41,750 daughter was doing when I changed her diapers. She was taught to do that. And 594 00:45:41,750 --> 00:45:42,750 those are signs. 595 00:45:42,990 --> 00:45:48,110 Those are signs. And children, when they can't talk... We'll tell you through 596 00:45:48,110 --> 00:45:52,570 behaviors, and you have to listen. Children that can talk, even with all 597 00:45:52,570 --> 00:45:58,570 education, children will not tell because they are shamed. They are 598 00:45:58,570 --> 00:46:04,770 perpetrator, all of his defenses that enable him to do that sift right into 599 00:46:04,770 --> 00:46:11,770 openness of this wounded, open, innocent child, and they wear every ounce of 600 00:46:11,770 --> 00:46:15,750 shame that the perpetrator should experience, and kids won't tell. 601 00:46:16,380 --> 00:46:21,320 They won't tell. My kids right now, they'll jump up and down and tell you 602 00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:23,160 he never did one thing to them. 603 00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:28,280 They'll lie. They'll protect them because they're not ready to deal with 604 00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:33,620 shame. That's the part that hurts, to see that they're going to be victims 605 00:46:33,620 --> 00:46:39,480 probably their entire life because of this. Their entire life they will have. 606 00:46:39,600 --> 00:46:44,320 Because sexual abuse doesn't just affect you in the bedroom. It affects you at 607 00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:49,800 work. It affects you in relationships. It affects you in every aspect of your 608 00:46:49,800 --> 00:46:50,980 life, everywhere. 609 00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:56,240 Are there special places where people can get therapy for this? I've noticed 610 00:46:56,240 --> 00:47:01,700 here in Austin, for instance, there are organizations that have therapy sessions 611 00:47:01,700 --> 00:47:04,420 for children who are victims of incest. 612 00:47:04,660 --> 00:47:11,060 Well, the sad reality is very few professional people have been trained to 613 00:47:11,060 --> 00:47:13,040 with the sexually abused. So what I... 614 00:47:13,810 --> 00:47:19,750 highly encourage is that you know who your child's working with. You know that 615 00:47:19,750 --> 00:47:22,790 they specialize in this area, that they're trained in this area. 616 00:47:24,570 --> 00:47:29,810 It's just now coming out, the sexual abuse, and it's a completely different 617 00:47:29,810 --> 00:47:34,610 of abuse. It's unlike any other to heal from. It's the most devastating, 618 00:47:34,850 --> 00:47:36,650 traumatic abuse there is. 619 00:47:37,210 --> 00:47:42,790 For me, a part of my becoming psychotic was working through the child in me that 620 00:47:42,790 --> 00:47:48,890 became psychotic to hide the abuse. So I had to create these dramas in my life 621 00:47:48,890 --> 00:47:54,950 where I had the star role in the horror flick just to strip me down of my 622 00:47:54,950 --> 00:47:59,250 defenses that I could feel because I was armor. 623 00:47:59,670 --> 00:48:01,330 It took homeless. 624 00:48:01,610 --> 00:48:03,130 It took losing my kids. 625 00:48:03,470 --> 00:48:08,310 So think of these little children that are molested as little ones. One out of 626 00:48:08,310 --> 00:48:13,690 three females are molested before they're 18 years old. And that's just 627 00:48:13,690 --> 00:48:15,050 reported cases. 628 00:48:15,750 --> 00:48:17,250 One out of five males. 629 00:48:18,310 --> 00:48:23,610 I just worked with a man. A nurse in the hospital molested him when he was a 630 00:48:23,610 --> 00:48:24,910 child. It's everywhere. 631 00:48:25,230 --> 00:48:26,570 It's unbelievable. 632 00:48:26,950 --> 00:48:28,970 And our system is in denial. 633 00:48:29,230 --> 00:48:30,630 They don't want to see this. 634 00:48:31,130 --> 00:48:32,970 And to see it, they have to see their own. 635 00:48:33,330 --> 00:48:37,770 So you really want to make sure you know who the people are with your children. 636 00:48:38,130 --> 00:48:42,710 Right before I came here, a case broke out in Dayton. A teacher in a Catholic 637 00:48:42,710 --> 00:48:47,350 school, which scared me because I send my children to private schools, was 638 00:48:47,350 --> 00:48:52,950 molesting the kids. This happened right as I'm sitting here. This just broke in 639 00:48:52,950 --> 00:48:53,950 Dayton, Ohio. 640 00:48:54,110 --> 00:48:57,650 Well, usually we hear about men molesting little girls and little boys. 641 00:48:58,120 --> 00:49:01,660 Do women do this? Women do it as well. They really do. Yes, they do. Yes, they 642 00:49:01,660 --> 00:49:03,660 do. It must be to a much lesser extent, isn't it? 643 00:49:04,200 --> 00:49:10,720 Not really. Really? See, the tragedy is that 99 % of a sexual 644 00:49:10,720 --> 00:49:16,540 deviant perpetrator tells you that this person has been done themselves. 645 00:49:17,000 --> 00:49:22,060 So they're acting out their own sexual abuse by identifying with their 646 00:49:22,060 --> 00:49:24,720 perpetrator instead of being a victim. 647 00:49:25,080 --> 00:49:27,340 So they feel the kid deserves it. 648 00:49:28,390 --> 00:49:32,190 Because they don't want to look at the pain in the child because they'd have to 649 00:49:32,190 --> 00:49:33,390 see their own sexual abuse. 650 00:49:33,950 --> 00:49:38,950 So you have perpetrators that are in denial. They have no idea that they were 651 00:49:38,950 --> 00:49:39,950 ever sexually abused. 652 00:49:40,050 --> 00:49:41,370 So it could be a teacher. 653 00:49:42,090 --> 00:49:43,370 It could be the coach. 654 00:49:43,850 --> 00:49:45,750 It could be the doctor that you go to. 655 00:49:46,510 --> 00:49:52,290 It could be the first psychiatrist that my doctor husband sent me to. 656 00:49:52,970 --> 00:49:55,850 He started hitting on me when I was eight months pregnant. 657 00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:01,400 using everything that I ever told him about my history. When I said, what? I 658 00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:05,040 wouldn't want to be with you. This guy was the president of the psychiatric 659 00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:07,520 association in that state. 660 00:50:08,640 --> 00:50:11,420 I mean, it happens all the time. 661 00:50:11,660 --> 00:50:16,080 You mentioned a while ago that children wouldn't, if they are sticking things in 662 00:50:16,080 --> 00:50:17,160 each other or exploring. 663 00:50:17,420 --> 00:50:21,080 What about the children who... 664 00:50:22,190 --> 00:50:26,150 quote, play doctor, unquote, just among themselves, not with adults. Is this 665 00:50:26,150 --> 00:50:30,750 considered... If they're playing doctor to the extent that they're really 666 00:50:30,750 --> 00:50:36,250 probing, it depends on the age of that child, they have been taught that. 667 00:50:36,890 --> 00:50:37,890 Bedwetting. 668 00:50:38,330 --> 00:50:41,950 Bedwetting with little girls is a sign of sexual abuse. 669 00:50:42,370 --> 00:50:43,370 Bedwetting. 670 00:50:43,790 --> 00:50:44,790 Frequent... 671 00:50:45,550 --> 00:50:50,630 Urine infections, vaginitis in children. When I got my child, she had 672 00:50:50,630 --> 00:50:55,990 infections, vaginitis. The doctor that tried to do a pelvic, my daughter 673 00:50:55,990 --> 00:50:59,950 panicked so bad that they said that they'd have to put her to sleep. 674 00:51:00,810 --> 00:51:06,210 You know, infections are a sign of it. Children will have frequent infections, 675 00:51:06,430 --> 00:51:08,550 nightmares. They will have nightmares. 676 00:51:08,950 --> 00:51:14,370 As a child, myself as a child, I had blisters all over my eyes. 677 00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:16,240 trying to block out that abuse. 678 00:51:16,860 --> 00:51:20,960 When I was a little girl like three, I would get in a corner and scream bloody 679 00:51:20,960 --> 00:51:22,280 murder, don't get near me. 680 00:51:22,540 --> 00:51:24,460 Little three -year -olds don't behave this way. 681 00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:25,538 To your father? 682 00:51:25,540 --> 00:51:29,500 To my grandmother told me this. My grandmother is the only person that ever 683 00:51:29,500 --> 00:51:30,500 validated me. 684 00:51:31,060 --> 00:51:36,840 Of course, she didn't know my dad was doing that, but she knew something was 685 00:51:36,840 --> 00:51:37,840 wrong with me. 686 00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:39,440 Do you think that you're... 687 00:51:40,700 --> 00:51:45,540 girls will be able to break that cycle, which seems to repeat itself over and 688 00:51:45,540 --> 00:51:50,680 over. Yeah, I am going to hope for that. I'm not going to ever give up hope on 689 00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:56,720 that. I think if they're treated, I make sure that my children, even when they 690 00:51:56,720 --> 00:52:00,320 have physical complaints, I work with their doctors to make sure that their 691 00:52:00,320 --> 00:52:05,560 medical doctors know how to work with a sexually abused child to rule out what 692 00:52:05,560 --> 00:52:08,640 is somatic from the incest and what is really... 693 00:52:09,070 --> 00:52:12,490 needing to be treated because they do not believe they're normal. 694 00:52:12,790 --> 00:52:17,490 So I've been blessed because you don't get near my child unless I know your 695 00:52:17,490 --> 00:52:19,950 history, unless I know you're healthy. 696 00:52:20,190 --> 00:52:24,370 And that's how I pull from hope. And their doctors have been wonderful. 697 00:52:24,870 --> 00:52:30,190 Because my children panic in medical treatment because he abused them 698 00:52:30,330 --> 00:52:31,330 He'd be stoned. 699 00:52:31,850 --> 00:52:36,550 Give them shots. And God only knows what he did to them. One time he took my 700 00:52:36,550 --> 00:52:40,850 daughter's picture and put it on a post and made her stand there while he took a 701 00:52:40,850 --> 00:52:44,890 gun and shot her picture and said, this is what I really want to do to you. 702 00:52:45,710 --> 00:52:49,710 Now, how is a kid supposed to deal with this? They throw up. 703 00:52:49,950 --> 00:52:54,490 They bang their heads on walls because they're not able to verbalize this. But 704 00:52:54,490 --> 00:52:59,650 my doctor was, the professionals are working with them and they're becoming 705 00:52:59,650 --> 00:53:00,650 more relaxed. 706 00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:03,720 The doctor gave her a physical because my little girl didn't think she was 707 00:53:03,720 --> 00:53:08,080 normal. And he said her name, and he says, you look like a healthy. And then 708 00:53:08,080 --> 00:53:09,840 when he got to normal, he goes, normal. 709 00:53:10,920 --> 00:53:16,440 A 14 -year -old girl to me, and she jumped off. She says, Mommy, my doctor 710 00:53:16,440 --> 00:53:17,440 I'm normal. 711 00:53:18,060 --> 00:53:22,880 And everybody was hugging her. I mean, she really had that fear. My husband 712 00:53:22,880 --> 00:53:27,740 helps me with them, and we've been working with these kids for years with 713 00:53:27,740 --> 00:53:29,680 headaches and their somatic complaints. 714 00:53:31,500 --> 00:53:37,060 switching them from drugs to herbal vitamins and things like that. So we've 715 00:53:37,060 --> 00:53:38,780 working with them for a long time. 716 00:53:39,160 --> 00:53:42,760 Problem is, this was chronic for 10 years. 717 00:53:43,640 --> 00:53:45,120 They had to live with this. 718 00:53:45,400 --> 00:53:47,240 So I've only had them for two. 719 00:53:48,260 --> 00:53:53,580 Plus, I get them right when they're going through puberty. So I have two 720 00:53:53,580 --> 00:53:55,620 problems with that. 721 00:53:56,380 --> 00:53:58,260 How do they relate to your new husband? 722 00:53:58,990 --> 00:54:00,590 They really, really like him. 723 00:54:01,050 --> 00:54:04,850 They went through a period when they... See, when you get an abused child, love 724 00:54:04,850 --> 00:54:10,210 doesn't just take care of that abuse. The safety of love allows them to act 725 00:54:10,570 --> 00:54:14,670 That's the dynamic that occurs because they're not able to act out their fear 726 00:54:14,670 --> 00:54:15,569 and rage. 727 00:54:15,570 --> 00:54:20,530 So first they acted out their rage towards me. Then they started getting 728 00:54:20,530 --> 00:54:24,210 paranoid, like, would my husband come in their room? And they still have to 729 00:54:24,210 --> 00:54:28,370 have, even in the summer, they can't have windows open and blinds open. They 730 00:54:28,370 --> 00:54:32,730 think their dad's looking in on them. My little girl said that, well, he didn't 731 00:54:32,730 --> 00:54:35,450 get me because I used to hold the shower doors tight. 732 00:54:36,210 --> 00:54:37,970 You know, that kind of stuff. 733 00:54:39,560 --> 00:54:45,100 But now, I say that we're a pretty healthy, dysfunctional family. 734 00:54:45,300 --> 00:54:50,340 I mean, you know, we get help because it's hard to see your own child's abuse 735 00:54:50,340 --> 00:54:55,000 when that child's attacking you. I mean, you can only take so much, and you get 736 00:54:55,000 --> 00:55:01,960 angry. So he comes to family therapy with me, and they can talk to him, and 737 00:55:01,960 --> 00:55:06,240 get their little backs tickled. They beat me out of all of that, but, you 738 00:55:06,280 --> 00:55:07,520 I don't get in on that anymore. 739 00:55:08,170 --> 00:55:12,870 You know, he's been really... See, he's had to live with me all these years of 740 00:55:12,870 --> 00:55:17,730 me being in and out of court. This doctor would refuse to let me see my 741 00:55:17,730 --> 00:55:21,110 saying that my boxer dog was giving them strep throat. 742 00:55:21,370 --> 00:55:26,570 Oh, my God. I couldn't take it to court because of the judge. 743 00:55:27,810 --> 00:55:33,210 Have you discussed your sexual abuse as a child with your children? 744 00:55:33,430 --> 00:55:35,010 They know just... 745 00:55:36,850 --> 00:55:42,230 briefly, when they go into shame issues, I'm able to say that I understand how 746 00:55:42,230 --> 00:55:46,770 that... I'll say things like, I know my dad did really bad things to me, but I 747 00:55:46,770 --> 00:55:52,570 don't tell him what. My children don't know that I was homeless and raped. You 748 00:55:52,570 --> 00:55:58,450 know, you can't tell your children. When my daughter was, I guess she was five, 749 00:55:58,710 --> 00:56:01,010 she told me, she told... 750 00:56:01,450 --> 00:56:05,550 My son, and he came down and told me that she said a little boy, she let a 751 00:56:05,550 --> 00:56:08,910 little boy at school, the F word her. 752 00:56:09,270 --> 00:56:15,670 And she was five. And so I went to her and I said, what did you tell, you know, 753 00:56:15,670 --> 00:56:18,970 your brother? And she said, I told him that little Johnny at school, I let him. 754 00:56:19,510 --> 00:56:23,270 And she said the F word. And I said back to her, do you know what that means? 755 00:56:23,410 --> 00:56:25,110 And she proceeded to tell me. 756 00:56:25,410 --> 00:56:30,110 So I had to be like a therapist and work with her saying, well, honey. 757 00:56:30,750 --> 00:56:34,910 You know, it's better if you have little friends. But, you know, that's your 758 00:56:34,910 --> 00:56:38,710 private part. You don't have to let them touch you. And then when she's not in 759 00:56:38,710 --> 00:56:40,630 the room, I would just go crazy. 760 00:56:41,090 --> 00:56:45,830 But you can't show your kids that because you've got to keep it separate. 761 00:56:46,010 --> 00:56:50,070 Healthy people don't work their stuff out. Now, what they'll see is a mom when 762 00:56:50,070 --> 00:56:55,070 I'm out fighting crime and being Batwoman, they'll see me being grouchy. 763 00:56:55,070 --> 00:56:56,870 see me, you know, being wiped out. 764 00:56:57,270 --> 00:56:58,970 And, you know, one day. 765 00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:04,560 If they want to know, I'll tell them. But we validate. I validate them. But 766 00:57:04,560 --> 00:57:08,100 that reason, I can't be their healer. I'm taken somewhere else. 767 00:57:08,600 --> 00:57:13,320 You do a lot of speaking and counseling and all now. How would somebody get in 768 00:57:13,320 --> 00:57:17,940 contact with you if they wanted to do so? Well, they could write me or call 769 00:57:18,060 --> 00:57:20,480 You have a phone number and address that you can give us? 770 00:57:20,760 --> 00:57:26,060 Can I give it now? It would be area code 513 -461 771 00:57:26,060 --> 00:57:28,660 -7720. 772 00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:31,440 And what about your address? 773 00:57:31,760 --> 00:57:35,120 That would be 332 Jones Street. 774 00:57:35,820 --> 00:57:40,020 That's Dayton, Ohio, 45410. 775 00:57:42,020 --> 00:57:45,860 45410. Well, thank you for being with us. Thank you for having me, Frank. I 776 00:57:45,860 --> 00:57:46,860 appreciate it. 777 00:57:47,020 --> 00:57:52,360 I'm sorry it was painful to recall and relive all these things, but maybe it 778 00:57:52,360 --> 00:57:55,280 will help somebody else too. I hope so. Thank you. 779 00:57:59,530 --> 00:58:02,250 And that's the end of another Alternative Views. 780 00:58:02,690 --> 00:58:07,510 We'd like to thank our crew, our director Brian Lynch, our camera people 781 00:58:07,510 --> 00:58:11,630 Henderson and Susan Ginsberg, and our audio man was Jack Hopper. 782 00:58:12,610 --> 00:58:17,350 Alternative Views is a presentation of the Alternative Information Network, P 783 00:58:17,350 --> 00:58:22,570 .O. Box 7279, Austin, Texas, 78713. 784 00:58:23,670 --> 00:58:26,110 If you'd like to write to us, that's our address. 785 00:58:28,970 --> 00:58:29,970 Goodbye.