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She had been written by men
and drawn by men

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because that was
the comics' tradition.

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When I was younger,

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my mother told me
superheroes were for boys.

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Some readers felt, "How come
you're writing so many girls?"

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You know,
there'd always be one girl,

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and she had the least powers.

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Whenever a woman gets there,
she's not worthy.

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The poor thing died
in solitude and poverty,

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and it's not fair.

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We have a serious problem
as a society, I think,

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with the hypersexualization
of women.

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And we are playing with 50% of
the world population's feelings!

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Today, we are seeing
a reversing trend.

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The idea has always been

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to look on these characters
as people who can grow,

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who can change,
who can surprise you.

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What's great is that
she actually reclaims

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the artifices of femininity.

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Minorities bonded with the team
to a remarkable extent.

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For the time, she was
a revolutionary character.

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She is a symbol
for the entire LGBT community.

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It was very fascinating to see
a woman in a leadership role.

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There are a lot
of female writers,

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a lot of female artists,
a lot of female editors.

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The reader is not
the traditional male reader.

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They will be our kids' heroes.

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Matriarchy will save the world!

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Wonder Woman, Captain Marvel,

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Black Widow, Supergirl...

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Superheroines are taking over
movie screens

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and people's hearts

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but they are also milestones
in a story

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that began over 80 years ago.

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Social progress
as well as sexist backward steps

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have marked the journey
of these superwomen

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and their female readers.

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We've met with men and women

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who spearhead
these characters' adventures.

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From the United States
to France, and even Italy,

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they all speak of the worldwide
influence of superheroines.

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Australian comic book artist
Nicola Scott, for instance,

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00:02:34,979 --> 00:02:38,019
has long been fascinated
by a particular amazon

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whose adventures
she draws today.

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The very first time
I saw Wonder Woman,

46
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it was the very first time
I saw a superhero.

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And it was when I was four,

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watching TV in the afternoon,

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and Lynda Carter's TV show
came on.

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And I had never seen anything
like it and it blew my mind,

51
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and I was 100% a convert
from that moment on.

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Before seeing the show,

53
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I didn't know
that superheroes were a thing,

54
00:03:03,620 --> 00:03:06,699
so that was the very first time
I saw a superhero.

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And it wasn't long after that

56
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that the Super Friends cartoon
started playing on TV

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and I'd go, "Oh my God,
there's Wonder Woman again!"

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I knew Wonder Woman
as a character before the movie

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because she's the superheroine.

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Perhaps not the most important
but an icon,

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the one everyone
is familiar with,

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because there aren't
that many superwomen.

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From the little
town of Cortona in Italy,

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comic book artist
Maria Laura Sanapo

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00:03:31,859 --> 00:03:35,460
works for American publishers
like DC Comics or Dynamite,

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producing pages
for Wonder Woman.

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My favorite superheroine is,
without a doubt, Wonder Woman.

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She marked my childhood
because when I was little,

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I discovered Lynda Carter.

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I really love Lynda Carter,

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her beauty, her elegance,

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because she is both
strong and elegant.

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And so, I love that Wonder Woman
I admired as a little girl.

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She is dear to me.

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00:04:13,819 --> 00:04:15,699
I also like the modern version
by Gal Gadot,

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but not to the same extent.

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When I was younger,

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my mother told me
superheroes were for boys.

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She said it was
out of the question,

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I had to act like a girl.

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So, I went to newsstands
in secret

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to buy my comic books,

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and I read them in bed under
the covers with a flashlight.

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That's when I began
to dive into that world

85
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and get caught up
in who was who,

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why did he do that,

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and oh, my God,
there are girls, too, awesome!

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In Rome, Emanuela
Lupacchino is one of the most

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00:04:48,059 --> 00:04:49,939
internationally renowned
figureheads

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00:04:50,020 --> 00:04:52,539
of this new generation
of female artists.

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In the course of my career,

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I've been able to work
mainly on superheroines

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because I feel that
it is with them

94
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that I can express myself
in the best possible way.

95
00:05:07,260 --> 00:05:14,140
And readers appreciate the way
I portray superwomen.

96
00:05:14,220 --> 00:05:18,100
But that doesn't mean
that I'm not also a big fan

97
00:05:18,179 --> 00:05:20,499
of how the male body
is represented

98
00:05:20,580 --> 00:05:23,619
with male superheroes,
such as Conan.

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Heroines are fierce
and intelligent,

100
00:05:25,700 --> 00:05:27,539
and they manage
to solve problems.

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It's been a source
of inspiration,

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Girl Power, as we call it.

103
00:05:33,020 --> 00:05:36,539
I want to be as strong
as they are mentally,

104
00:05:36,619 --> 00:05:38,379
perhaps even physically,
I don't know,

105
00:05:38,460 --> 00:05:40,220
but in any case,
it was a huge inspiration

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00:05:40,299 --> 00:05:43,739
for my professional life,
with drawing for instance.

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It was a source of inspiration
and motivation.

108
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But might not
Wonder Woman sometimes be

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the tree that hides the forest?

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Not only is she not
the only superheroine out there,

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but she is also not the first.

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Several months
before her appearance,

113
00:06:01,939 --> 00:06:04,780
a mysterious adventuress
disguised as a cat

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00:06:04,859 --> 00:06:06,140
was already turning heads,

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00:06:06,220 --> 00:06:07,900
but not the one you might think.

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00:06:07,979 --> 00:06:12,299
Miss Fury could be considered
as a kind of Catwoman,

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00:06:12,379 --> 00:06:13,939
but the truth is
she was there first.

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Miss Fury was created,

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She beat Wonder Woman

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to the stands.

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00:06:18,739 --> 00:06:22,939
By about six months, I think.

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00:06:23,020 --> 00:06:27,340
She was created in 1941
by a woman also,

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which makes her really
the first woman,

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00:06:30,460 --> 00:06:34,059
costumed action heroine
drawn by a woman,

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00:06:34,140 --> 00:06:35,900
created and written by a woman,

126
00:06:35,979 --> 00:06:37,100
Tarpé Mills,

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00:06:37,179 --> 00:06:39,700
who just happened to look
exactly like her heroine.

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She's a very wealthy woman.

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She's rich,
but she's very strong, too.

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00:06:48,539 --> 00:06:52,179
She's a very humane character,
and she's a crime-fighter.

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00:06:52,260 --> 00:06:58,499
She has a panther skin and at
one point she starts to wear it.

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At first,
she only pulls it on for fun.

133
00:07:03,939 --> 00:07:07,140
But then, things start to happen

134
00:07:07,220 --> 00:07:09,739
and she begins to show
extraordinary abilities.

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That's when she becomes
a superheroine.

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00:07:12,580 --> 00:07:15,260
This picture, in particular,

137
00:07:15,340 --> 00:07:18,580
was done as a pin-up
for the troops,

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00:07:18,660 --> 00:07:20,299
during the war.

139
00:07:20,379 --> 00:07:22,859
Miss Fury had a lot of fans.

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00:07:22,939 --> 00:07:26,299
And G.I.s would write
her fan letters.

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00:07:26,379 --> 00:07:28,900
And she had this picture
printed out,

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00:07:28,979 --> 00:07:31,580
and she would send it to them
and sign it for them.

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00:07:31,660 --> 00:07:34,739
Miss Fury is a heroine

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00:07:34,820 --> 00:07:37,179
that I'm lucky
to be drawing right now.

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00:07:37,260 --> 00:07:42,260
When they contacted me to draw
her, I said yes immediately,

146
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because she was not only drawn

147
00:07:46,539 --> 00:07:48,580
but also entirely created
by a woman in the 40s,

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00:07:48,660 --> 00:07:55,859
a woman who succeeded as a
comic book artist at that time.

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00:07:55,939 --> 00:07:59,900
This clearly inspired me
because, since the early 2000s,

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00:07:59,979 --> 00:08:03,460
many female artists
have become famous.

151
00:08:03,539 --> 00:08:07,700
But, in the 40s,
it was much harder.

152
00:08:07,780 --> 00:08:11,580
The other reason
why I accepted this project

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00:08:11,660 --> 00:08:14,619
is that it was an opportunity to
talk about June Tarpé Mills,

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who created Miss Fury.

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The poor thing died
in solitude and poverty,

156
00:08:20,780 --> 00:08:22,619
and it's not fair.

157
00:08:22,700 --> 00:08:25,539
It's not fair
that this woman was forgotten

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00:08:25,619 --> 00:08:28,460
because she had so much talent.

159
00:08:42,659 --> 00:08:45,300
In 1941, America
was on the brink of war.

160
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Superheroines took their cue
from patriotic tradition,

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00:08:48,899 --> 00:08:50,700
and most particularly
from Columbia,

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00:08:50,779 --> 00:08:53,340
the female personification
of the United States,

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00:08:53,420 --> 00:08:56,300
to find inspiration for
costumes reflecting the times.

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00:08:56,379 --> 00:08:59,019
Wonder Woman first made
her appearance in this context.

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00:08:59,100 --> 00:09:02,060
Wonder Woman was created
by William Moulton Marston

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00:09:02,139 --> 00:09:04,739
using the pseudonym
Charles Moulton,

167
00:09:04,820 --> 00:09:08,659
and he specifically aimed it
at girls.

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00:09:08,739 --> 00:09:11,820
He was quoted as saying,

169
00:09:11,899 --> 00:09:14,139
"Even girls don't want
to be girls."

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00:09:14,220 --> 00:09:18,460
Because they don't get to do
all the exciting things boys do.

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00:09:18,540 --> 00:09:22,979
So, he wanted to create
a role model for girls,

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00:09:23,060 --> 00:09:28,499
to show that they could be
as good, better, than boys.

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00:09:28,580 --> 00:09:33,739
All they needed

174
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was the training.

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Was to work at it.

176
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And they could do it.

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00:09:35,220 --> 00:09:37,379
We could all be Wonder Woman.

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00:09:37,460 --> 00:09:38,499
At the end of the day,

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00:09:38,580 --> 00:09:44,420
it's only doing what superhero
culture has been doing all along

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00:09:44,499 --> 00:09:46,619
namely following
the evolutions of society

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00:09:46,700 --> 00:09:48,739
and, ahead of time
or a little late,

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00:09:48,820 --> 00:09:51,220
addressing those questions.

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00:09:51,300 --> 00:09:53,820
All superheroines
are great characters,

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00:09:53,899 --> 00:09:56,139
but they were minor characters,

185
00:09:56,220 --> 00:09:57,580
and Wonder Woman...

186
00:09:58,420 --> 00:10:00,739
She was an amazon.

187
00:10:00,820 --> 00:10:02,859
None of the others were amazons.

188
00:10:04,060 --> 00:10:07,100
And she hit
at just the right time,

189
00:10:07,180 --> 00:10:10,820
just as America
was about to go to war.

190
00:10:10,899 --> 00:10:15,259
Just as the war was starting,
she shows up.

191
00:10:15,340 --> 00:10:18,300
And she goes to the man's world
with Steve Trevor

192
00:10:18,379 --> 00:10:21,139
to fight the bad guys,
to fight the Axis.

193
00:10:21,220 --> 00:10:23,420
She was just
at the right moment.

194
00:10:23,499 --> 00:10:25,499
She was an amazon.

195
00:10:25,580 --> 00:10:26,779
She didn't fly.

196
00:10:26,859 --> 00:10:28,580
She didn't have superpowers.

197
00:10:28,659 --> 00:10:31,100
She had amazon training,

198
00:10:31,180 --> 00:10:35,220
which made her
the best possible athlete.

199
00:10:35,300 --> 00:10:37,700
She could run, she could leap,

200
00:10:37,779 --> 00:10:40,180
and she did them
all marvelously.

201
00:10:40,259 --> 00:10:43,619
And it didn't hurt
that she was also beautiful

202
00:10:43,700 --> 00:10:45,940
and that she was a princess.

203
00:10:46,019 --> 00:10:49,019
William Moulton
Marston was also a psychologist

204
00:10:49,100 --> 00:10:50,540
whose research contributed

205
00:10:50,619 --> 00:10:53,100
to the development
of the lie detector.

206
00:10:53,180 --> 00:10:55,580
In the comic,
Wonder Woman's golden lasso

207
00:10:55,659 --> 00:10:57,379
is an illustration
of that research.

208
00:10:57,460 --> 00:10:59,940
It is a magical variant
of the lie detector.

209
00:11:00,019 --> 00:11:02,499
Wonder Woman's creator
was also very ahead of his time

210
00:11:02,580 --> 00:11:04,180
with the amazon's love life.

211
00:11:04,259 --> 00:11:08,979
William Moulton Marston
hypothesized,

212
00:11:09,060 --> 00:11:13,259
or suggested
in a rather evident way,

213
00:11:13,340 --> 00:11:16,460
that she was an LGBT character.

214
00:11:16,540 --> 00:11:20,739
She was bisexual at least,
or pansexual.

215
00:11:20,820 --> 00:11:23,340
Later, depending
on her evolution

216
00:11:23,420 --> 00:11:26,060
and the people who wrote her,

217
00:11:26,139 --> 00:11:29,420
we had a lesbian Wonder Woman,

218
00:11:29,499 --> 00:11:32,259
a bisexual or pansexual
Wonder Woman,

219
00:11:32,340 --> 00:11:34,739
or a heterosexual Wonder Woman.

220
00:11:34,820 --> 00:11:36,659
If Wonder Woman's costume

221
00:11:36,739 --> 00:11:38,540
is based on the American flag,

222
00:11:38,619 --> 00:11:41,700
a large part
of her roots and appearance

223
00:11:41,779 --> 00:11:44,259
is grounded
in Greek and Roman mythology.

224
00:11:44,340 --> 00:11:46,580
This could explain
why this particular heroine

225
00:11:46,659 --> 00:11:48,259
quickly reached beyond borders

226
00:11:48,340 --> 00:11:50,139
and why today,
in Italy or elsewhere,

227
00:11:50,220 --> 00:11:53,580
female artists can work on her
with such ease.

228
00:11:53,659 --> 00:11:55,499
It's a concept

229
00:11:55,580 --> 00:11:58,540
that has been brought
to my attention many times,

230
00:11:58,619 --> 00:12:00,259
although being immersed in it,

231
00:12:00,340 --> 00:12:01,739
I am not
consciously aware of it.

232
00:12:01,820 --> 00:12:04,580
Many American colleagues
tell me,

233
00:12:04,659 --> 00:12:07,700
"You're so lucky
to have been born in a country"

234
00:12:07,779 --> 00:12:10,259
with such a rich tradition
in art, ancient history...

235
00:12:12,580 --> 00:12:15,580
"and culture."

236
00:12:15,659 --> 00:12:20,060
Drawing Wonder Woman and
the island world of Themyscira

237
00:12:20,139 --> 00:12:22,420
has been relatively easy for me.

238
00:12:22,499 --> 00:12:24,820
Wonder Woman
is most certainly a warrior,

239
00:12:24,899 --> 00:12:26,460
but she fights
for the greater good.

240
00:12:27,820 --> 00:12:31,220
She has to fight because
she's in the middle of a war,

241
00:12:31,300 --> 00:12:34,739
but she never does it
in a perverse way

242
00:12:34,820 --> 00:12:37,259
or just to fight for herself.

243
00:12:37,340 --> 00:12:40,540
As soon as I was able
to cross two streets

244
00:12:40,619 --> 00:12:44,060
to get to the candy store
that sold comics,

245
00:12:44,139 --> 00:12:49,060
I would just look
at all the comics on the rack.

246
00:12:51,259 --> 00:12:53,060
Once a week,
I could buy a comic.

247
00:12:53,139 --> 00:12:55,220
I took my allowance
and I could buy a comic,

248
00:12:55,300 --> 00:13:00,180
and I would buy whatever comic
starred a woman.

249
00:13:00,259 --> 00:13:04,340
Whatever comic had a woman
or a girl on the cover

250
00:13:04,420 --> 00:13:05,820
who was powerful,

251
00:13:05,899 --> 00:13:08,859
not somebody
who was tied to a chair

252
00:13:08,940 --> 00:13:11,100
and waiting for a hero
to rescue her,

253
00:13:11,180 --> 00:13:15,580
but a woman who was
her own person, her own heroine,

254
00:13:15,659 --> 00:13:17,619
right there on the cover.

255
00:13:17,700 --> 00:13:20,820
And it even helped
if that was her name,

256
00:13:20,899 --> 00:13:23,180
her name was the title
of the book.

257
00:13:23,259 --> 00:13:25,779
So, it wasn't just Wonder Woman
that I bought.

258
00:13:25,859 --> 00:13:28,619
I bought Sheena,
Queen of the Jungle.

259
00:13:28,700 --> 00:13:31,700
She really was my favorite

260
00:13:31,779 --> 00:13:34,540
because my fantasy
was to live in a treehouse

261
00:13:34,619 --> 00:13:35,979
with my pet chimpanzee,

262
00:13:36,060 --> 00:13:38,779
in the jungle
and wearing leopard skin.

263
00:13:38,859 --> 00:13:40,619
And I still love leopard skin.

264
00:13:41,220 --> 00:13:43,899
Wonder Woman's
success quickly paved the way

265
00:13:43,979 --> 00:13:45,820
for the appearance
of other superwomen,

266
00:13:45,899 --> 00:13:47,460
like the all-powerful
Mary Marvel

267
00:13:47,540 --> 00:13:50,700
whose sales soon rivalled
those of Wonder Woman.

268
00:13:50,779 --> 00:13:52,580
I bought Mary Marvel.

269
00:13:52,659 --> 00:13:54,979
She was a girl.

270
00:13:55,060 --> 00:13:57,340
She was Mary Batson,

271
00:13:57,420 --> 00:14:00,659
and all she had to do
was say the magic word "Shazam"

272
00:14:00,739 --> 00:14:02,820
and she became Mary Marvel.

273
00:14:02,899 --> 00:14:05,379
And Mary Marvel could fly.

274
00:14:05,460 --> 00:14:10,060
And bullets bounced off her,
and she had fists of iron.

275
00:14:10,139 --> 00:14:12,700
And she was only 12 years old

276
00:14:12,779 --> 00:14:16,619
which meant that you didn't have
to become a woman.

277
00:14:16,700 --> 00:14:19,540
You could still be a girl
and have superpowers.

278
00:14:19,619 --> 00:14:25,619
So, I bought all the comics
that had female heroes.

279
00:14:33,220 --> 00:14:34,700
But during the 50s,

280
00:14:34,779 --> 00:14:36,659
things began to take
a backwards slide.

281
00:14:36,739 --> 00:14:39,899
Even Supergirl's spectacular
debut wasn't a step forward,

282
00:14:39,979 --> 00:14:41,460
at least at first.

283
00:14:42,019 --> 00:14:43,739
Supergirl was...

284
00:14:44,540 --> 00:14:47,379
She was so tame, really,
you know?

285
00:14:47,460 --> 00:14:50,420
Her cousin, Superman, told her

286
00:14:50,499 --> 00:14:53,499
that the world must not know
about her, you know,

287
00:14:53,580 --> 00:14:56,379
so she kept herself secret.

288
00:14:56,460 --> 00:14:59,940
And she lived in an orphanage,
for God's sake.

289
00:15:01,899 --> 00:15:03,820
She never interested me.

290
00:15:03,899 --> 00:15:09,379
She was only really
Superman's sidekick at the time.

291
00:15:09,460 --> 00:15:11,540
She wasn't
a very interesting character,

292
00:15:11,619 --> 00:15:14,019
except to expand
Superman's universe

293
00:15:14,100 --> 00:15:16,940
with what we call
the Super Family.

294
00:15:17,019 --> 00:15:18,499
The war was over.

295
00:15:18,580 --> 00:15:20,859
War had been over for 20 years,

296
00:15:20,940 --> 00:15:24,220
and women had been driven back.

297
00:15:24,300 --> 00:15:27,300
All these wonderful things
they had done,

298
00:15:27,379 --> 00:15:30,499
you know, driving the trucks,
and working in the factories,

299
00:15:30,580 --> 00:15:35,580
and making ships and planes,
and flying planes.

300
00:15:35,659 --> 00:15:36,859
That was over.

301
00:15:36,940 --> 00:15:39,019
They've been sent back
to the kitchen.

302
00:15:39,100 --> 00:15:41,940
The guys came back
and got their old jobs back.

303
00:15:42,019 --> 00:15:44,899
This is evident throughout
all the comics of that period,

304
00:15:44,979 --> 00:15:46,979
even with another heroine
like Wonder Woman.

305
00:15:47,060 --> 00:15:50,540
It really was a peculiar era

306
00:15:50,619 --> 00:15:54,499
in terms of how female
characters were represented.

307
00:16:03,340 --> 00:16:05,220
The 60s also saw the arrival

308
00:16:05,300 --> 00:16:07,100
of a new generation
of superheroines

309
00:16:07,180 --> 00:16:08,499
created by Marvel.

310
00:16:08,580 --> 00:16:11,739
But at first,
they were limited to unexciting,

311
00:16:11,820 --> 00:16:13,340
almost invisible roles.

312
00:16:13,420 --> 00:16:17,379
I think, for me,
the basic rationale was,

313
00:16:17,460 --> 00:16:20,180
I looked at all these teams.

314
00:16:20,259 --> 00:16:21,580
I looked at the Fantastic Four.

315
00:16:21,659 --> 00:16:22,979
I looked at the Justice League.

316
00:16:23,060 --> 00:16:25,379
I looked at the Avengers.

317
00:16:26,180 --> 00:16:29,820
And they were all predominantly
white men.

318
00:16:31,180 --> 00:16:32,340
With a girl.

319
00:16:32,420 --> 00:16:34,499
And it was always a girl.

320
00:16:34,580 --> 00:16:35,940
Marvel Girl.

321
00:16:36,019 --> 00:16:37,139
Supergirl.

322
00:16:37,220 --> 00:16:38,540
Aquagirl.

323
00:16:39,460 --> 00:16:40,739
The Invisible Girl!

324
00:16:40,820 --> 00:16:45,300
There'd always be one girl,
and she had the least powers.

325
00:16:45,379 --> 00:16:48,940
She didn't run around and jump
and punch people out.

326
00:16:49,019 --> 00:16:50,019
I mean, think about it.

327
00:16:50,100 --> 00:16:54,019
The Fantastic Four
is the core hero group

328
00:16:54,100 --> 00:16:56,420
in the Marvel universe.

329
00:16:56,499 --> 00:16:57,820
They are the foundation

330
00:16:57,899 --> 00:17:02,019
upon which all the subsequent
heroes derived.

331
00:17:02,100 --> 00:17:03,379
Mr. Fantastic.

332
00:17:03,460 --> 00:17:07,100
He's brilliant, he stretches,
he's a cool guy.

333
00:17:07,179 --> 00:17:08,300
The Thing.

334
00:17:08,379 --> 00:17:12,219
A giant monster,
the heart of the quartet.

335
00:17:12,300 --> 00:17:13,859
Johnny Storm.

336
00:17:13,939 --> 00:17:15,899
He catches fire

337
00:17:15,980 --> 00:17:19,939
and races around the world
to save things.

338
00:17:20,020 --> 00:17:21,419
And Sue...

339
00:17:21,500 --> 00:17:23,139
What is Sue Storm?

340
00:17:23,219 --> 00:17:25,179
She turns invisible.

341
00:17:25,260 --> 00:17:28,340
She vanishes. She disappears.

342
00:17:28,419 --> 00:17:33,540
It is, intentionally or not,
the most powerful metaphor

343
00:17:33,619 --> 00:17:37,820
for how the world
tended to view women,

344
00:17:37,899 --> 00:17:41,580
and women in the workplace
at that era.

345
00:17:41,659 --> 00:17:42,820
They were invisible.

346
00:17:42,899 --> 00:17:46,859
Oh, the Wasp, she's this tiny,
little character, you know?

347
00:17:46,939 --> 00:17:48,100
And what do they do?

348
00:17:48,179 --> 00:17:49,540
They go shopping a lot.

349
00:17:49,619 --> 00:17:52,980
You see this in the comics
of the period.

350
00:17:53,060 --> 00:17:56,980
Although I believe that Stan Lee
and Jack Kirby both thought

351
00:17:57,060 --> 00:18:00,179
that they were doing
the modern woman, you know?

352
00:18:00,260 --> 00:18:04,179
They really did think this,
but they were guys.

353
00:18:04,260 --> 00:18:06,179
There were no women involved!

354
00:18:07,659 --> 00:18:09,219
At the end of the day,

355
00:18:09,300 --> 00:18:13,419
truly independent heroines in
the 60s were mostly 'bad girls',

356
00:18:13,500 --> 00:18:16,139
like Catwoman or Poison Ivy.

357
00:18:16,699 --> 00:18:22,659
The very first time I saw Poison
Ivy was many years ago.

358
00:18:22,740 --> 00:18:25,020
It was in the cartoon

359
00:18:25,100 --> 00:18:27,500
in which Harley Quinn appears
for the first time.

360
00:18:27,580 --> 00:18:29,179
In the French version
of this cartoon,

361
00:18:29,260 --> 00:18:32,939
Poison Ivy was called
"the Poisoner"

362
00:18:33,020 --> 00:18:36,659
and I really liked her.

363
00:18:36,740 --> 00:18:39,540
Even if she's a little
too extreme

364
00:18:39,619 --> 00:18:42,020
in what she says and does,

365
00:18:42,100 --> 00:18:46,139
she really wants Nature
to take back its rightful place,

366
00:18:46,219 --> 00:18:49,699
and she thinks
that men damage Nature.

367
00:18:49,780 --> 00:18:52,379
This is something
I really like about her,

368
00:18:52,459 --> 00:18:55,659
even if she should
temper her actions.

369
00:18:55,740 --> 00:18:58,859
Today, Poison Ivy would probably
be considered a superheroine,

370
00:18:58,939 --> 00:19:00,939
because Nature
needs to be protected!

371
00:19:01,020 --> 00:19:04,899
But still, she does have
a rather evil side.

372
00:19:09,300 --> 00:19:11,740
Meanwhile,
far from mainstream books,

373
00:19:11,820 --> 00:19:14,379
American comics
began to present heroines

374
00:19:14,459 --> 00:19:17,100
enjoying much greater freedom
in magazines

375
00:19:17,179 --> 00:19:18,459
for an older readership.

376
00:19:18,540 --> 00:19:20,020
At the end of the 60s,

377
00:19:20,100 --> 00:19:22,740
Warren Publishing
launched the adventures

378
00:19:22,820 --> 00:19:25,939
of a bikini-clad bloodsucker,
Vampirella.

379
00:19:26,020 --> 00:19:29,980
Well, really, my only part in
the creation of Vampirella was,

380
00:19:30,060 --> 00:19:31,740
I designed her costume.

381
00:19:31,820 --> 00:19:33,899
And the costume, by the way,
that I designed

382
00:19:33,980 --> 00:19:37,820
was not as brief
as this little red ribbon

383
00:19:37,899 --> 00:19:39,340
that she wears these days.

384
00:19:39,419 --> 00:19:40,459
It wasn't a comic.

385
00:19:40,540 --> 00:19:45,540
It was really a comic magazine
published by Jim Warren.

386
00:19:45,619 --> 00:19:51,179
And it was the first of these
books that starred a woman,

387
00:19:51,260 --> 00:19:54,379
Vampirella, who told the stories

388
00:19:54,459 --> 00:19:57,699
and who also took part
in the stories.

389
00:19:57,780 --> 00:20:03,139
And that was very revolutionary
for comics in 1969.

390
00:20:03,219 --> 00:20:04,580
I really love Vampirella.

391
00:20:04,659 --> 00:20:06,619
That's partly because
she's a vampire,

392
00:20:06,699 --> 00:20:08,939
and vampires fascinate me.

393
00:20:09,020 --> 00:20:13,139
They always have because
they can do whatever they like.

394
00:20:13,219 --> 00:20:17,619
So, they're rather
sexual characters.

395
00:20:17,699 --> 00:20:20,500
They're mesmerizing,
and they're charming.

396
00:20:20,580 --> 00:20:22,540
It's therefore natural

397
00:20:22,619 --> 00:20:27,219
that their clothes reflect
that sexy side.

398
00:20:27,300 --> 00:20:28,500
You have to know

399
00:20:28,580 --> 00:20:32,780
that she has been exaggerated
and exaggerated and exaggerated,

400
00:20:32,859 --> 00:20:34,820
as the years go by.

401
00:20:34,899 --> 00:20:40,500
So, she really does not, today,
bear any resemblance,

402
00:20:40,580 --> 00:20:42,219
as far as I'm concerned,

403
00:20:42,300 --> 00:20:45,780
to the costume that I created.

404
00:20:47,340 --> 00:20:49,740
She was beautifully drawn
in those days

405
00:20:49,820 --> 00:20:52,899
by Spanish artists,
Filipino artists.

406
00:20:54,820 --> 00:20:59,740
For the time, she was
a revolutionary character.

407
00:20:59,820 --> 00:21:03,500
In those comics, they didn't
really deal with sex very much,

408
00:21:03,580 --> 00:21:06,139
but she was certainly
a sexy creature.

409
00:21:06,219 --> 00:21:08,219
True activism made its way

410
00:21:08,300 --> 00:21:10,939
through fanzines
and underground comics.

411
00:21:11,020 --> 00:21:16,659
In 1973, Trina Robbins brought
an icon from World War II,

412
00:21:16,740 --> 00:21:18,780
Rosie the Riveter,
back to life in her comics

413
00:21:18,859 --> 00:21:20,179
to give her new relevance

414
00:21:20,260 --> 00:21:22,060
in the context
of women's liberation.

415
00:21:22,139 --> 00:21:26,859
Rosie the Riveter, she's become
much more well-known now.

416
00:21:26,939 --> 00:21:28,419
She's famous, in fact.

417
00:21:28,500 --> 00:21:30,419
Everyone knows
Rosie the Riveter.

418
00:21:30,500 --> 00:21:33,419
But at the time, people had
kind of forgotten her.

419
00:21:33,500 --> 00:21:38,459
But she represented
the strength of women

420
00:21:38,540 --> 00:21:41,100
during World War II, you know?

421
00:21:41,179 --> 00:21:44,659
When suddenly women were taken
out of their homes

422
00:21:44,740 --> 00:21:48,379
and working in factories,
making planes,

423
00:21:48,459 --> 00:21:52,179
making ships,
even flying the planes.

424
00:21:52,260 --> 00:21:54,300
That's what she represented.

425
00:21:54,379 --> 00:21:58,139
That wonderful period
during the war,

426
00:21:58,219 --> 00:22:00,659
when women were
as strong as men,

427
00:22:00,740 --> 00:22:04,419
when women did all the things
that men had done before.

428
00:22:04,500 --> 00:22:06,780
Trina Robbins
is a personal icon.

429
00:22:06,859 --> 00:22:10,740
She's a living symbol
of feminism in comics.

430
00:22:10,820 --> 00:22:12,260
She's a real pioneer.

431
00:22:12,340 --> 00:22:14,340
She took the first step

432
00:22:14,419 --> 00:22:16,899
to turn the spotlight
on feminism in comics,

433
00:22:16,980 --> 00:22:19,780
when independent comics
began to appear in the 70s

434
00:22:19,859 --> 00:22:21,139
in San Francisco.

435
00:22:21,219 --> 00:22:24,580
She's a figurehead for
a whole comic book movement.

436
00:22:25,300 --> 00:22:27,379
Next to Vampirella or Rosie,

437
00:22:27,459 --> 00:22:30,260
traditional superheroines
seemed outdated.

438
00:22:30,340 --> 00:22:32,699
A young beginner writer
called Chris Claremont

439
00:22:32,780 --> 00:22:34,899
became part
of a new generation of writers

440
00:22:34,980 --> 00:22:37,139
who decided to shake things up.

441
00:22:37,219 --> 00:22:41,139
When I came aboard at Marvel,
ten years later,

442
00:22:41,219 --> 00:22:44,300
roughly ten years later,
very little had changed.

443
00:22:44,379 --> 00:22:48,179
Women were still primarily
an afterthought.

444
00:22:48,260 --> 00:22:50,619
With comic book
artist Dave Cockrum,

445
00:22:50,699 --> 00:22:53,260
Chris Claremont was rapidly
put in charge

446
00:22:53,340 --> 00:22:55,540
of producing new episodes
for X-Men.

447
00:22:55,619 --> 00:22:57,100
Female characters in the series

448
00:22:57,179 --> 00:22:59,419
quickly became
varied and strong.

449
00:22:59,500 --> 00:23:03,580
Mature or teenage,
powerful or even controlling,

450
00:23:03,659 --> 00:23:06,820
heroines acquired
a diversity of profiles.

451
00:23:06,899 --> 00:23:08,659
The point here is...

452
00:23:08,740 --> 00:23:13,300
I know women who are courageous,
who are smart,

453
00:23:13,379 --> 00:23:18,500
who are all of the attributes
of a superhero,

454
00:23:18,580 --> 00:23:22,219
except for one element,
their gender.

455
00:23:23,300 --> 00:23:26,139
So, I thought,
no one else is doing it,

456
00:23:27,020 --> 00:23:29,419
I'll take a shot
and see what happens.

457
00:23:29,500 --> 00:23:32,219
So, I found, with the X-Men,

458
00:23:32,300 --> 00:23:33,980
especially with the X-Men

459
00:23:34,060 --> 00:23:39,500
that Dave Cockrum and Len Wein
created in Giant-Size No.1,

460
00:23:39,580 --> 00:23:43,740
not only a diversity of gender,

461
00:23:43,820 --> 00:23:46,060
in Ororo and Jean,

462
00:23:46,139 --> 00:23:50,939
but of societal, racial gender.

463
00:23:51,020 --> 00:23:52,899
Seven years after the death

464
00:23:52,980 --> 00:23:53,980
of Martin Luther King,

465
00:23:54,060 --> 00:23:57,419
Ororo a.k.a. Storm
brought new changes.

466
00:23:57,500 --> 00:23:59,100
For the first time,

467
00:23:59,179 --> 00:24:02,899
a black woman became a regular
member of a superhero team.

468
00:24:02,980 --> 00:24:04,780
Under Chris Claremont's
leadership,

469
00:24:04,859 --> 00:24:07,619
this heroine evolved
to the point of becoming

470
00:24:07,699 --> 00:24:09,780
a leader of the team
a few years later.

471
00:24:09,859 --> 00:24:11,820
Basically, I gave shape to Storm

472
00:24:11,899 --> 00:24:13,820
the way I give shape
to all characters,

473
00:24:13,899 --> 00:24:15,820
which is look at them

474
00:24:15,899 --> 00:24:19,139
and try to imagine
who they are as people.

475
00:24:19,219 --> 00:24:24,899
Ororo has spent her adolescence
on top of Mount Kilimanjaro

476
00:24:24,980 --> 00:24:28,379
or a reasonable fac-simile,
in Kenya,

477
00:24:28,459 --> 00:24:30,780
being worshipped as a goddess,

478
00:24:30,859 --> 00:24:35,340
which is somewhat removed
from the reality of Kenya but...

479
00:24:35,419 --> 00:24:36,500
That's comics.

480
00:24:36,580 --> 00:24:38,500
And suddenly, she is uprooted

481
00:24:38,580 --> 00:24:42,100
and brought over
to the first world.

482
00:24:42,179 --> 00:24:45,379
If I had to mention one comic,
it would be X-Men.

483
00:24:45,459 --> 00:24:47,100
It's my favorite
superhero series.

484
00:24:47,179 --> 00:24:50,139
It's wonderful.

485
00:24:50,219 --> 00:24:53,179
The characters...
Everyone can identify.

486
00:24:53,260 --> 00:24:55,419
It was fun.

487
00:24:55,500 --> 00:25:02,379
She was distinct because she was
a leader of the X-Men team.

488
00:25:02,459 --> 00:25:05,820
Although I may have been exposed
to other X-Men members,

489
00:25:05,899 --> 00:25:10,659
it was very fascinating to see
a woman in a leadership role

490
00:25:10,740 --> 00:25:12,300
with that much power.

491
00:25:12,379 --> 00:25:14,219
With Ororo, it's more personal

492
00:25:14,300 --> 00:25:16,740
because her father
is from New York.

493
00:25:17,899 --> 00:25:22,820
But it takes time
for her to arrive

494
00:25:22,899 --> 00:25:25,619
at what that realization means.

495
00:25:25,699 --> 00:25:28,100
John Byrne and I did a story

496
00:25:28,179 --> 00:25:32,379
where she goes to what
she remembers as her home

497
00:25:32,459 --> 00:25:34,540
in New York City, in Harlem.

498
00:25:34,619 --> 00:25:37,699
And what she remembers
as a loving apartment

499
00:25:37,780 --> 00:25:40,379
has now become a drug den,

500
00:25:40,459 --> 00:25:43,139
full of young adolescents

501
00:25:43,219 --> 00:25:47,139
overdosing on crack and heroin.

502
00:25:47,219 --> 00:25:50,459
It is a voyage of discovery.

503
00:25:51,179 --> 00:25:53,699
For her,
as with all the characters,

504
00:25:53,780 --> 00:25:55,100
it's dealing with them

505
00:25:55,179 --> 00:26:01,179
as I imagine real people would
act in a similar situation.

506
00:26:01,260 --> 00:26:04,100
The change and
revival brought about by Storm

507
00:26:04,179 --> 00:26:05,899
was only the beginning
of a new wave.

508
00:26:05,980 --> 00:26:07,179
With new recruits,

509
00:26:07,260 --> 00:26:09,980
Chris Claremont diversified
female character profiles.

510
00:26:10,060 --> 00:26:12,179
Before then,
within a given comic book panel,

511
00:26:12,260 --> 00:26:13,980
heroines were
mostly distinguished

512
00:26:14,060 --> 00:26:15,139
by their hair colour.

513
00:26:15,219 --> 00:26:17,699
From that point on,
female members of the X-Men

514
00:26:17,780 --> 00:26:21,899
cultivated diversity in terms
of race, shape, and age.

515
00:26:21,980 --> 00:26:27,300
Yeah, probably Kitty Pryde and
Rachel Summers from Excalibur,

516
00:26:27,379 --> 00:26:31,740
because I think
that how I see female characters

517
00:26:31,820 --> 00:26:35,580
is very close to the work
of Chris Claremont.

518
00:26:36,459 --> 00:26:39,139
The reader response was varied.

519
00:26:39,219 --> 00:26:43,500
Some readers felt, "How come
you're writing so many girls?"

520
00:26:43,580 --> 00:26:48,899
I went to work on an X-Men book
with the X-Women.

521
00:26:48,980 --> 00:26:54,060
And I was so lucky because
we had the chance of doing X-Men

522
00:26:54,139 --> 00:26:58,379
with an all-female
character roster.

523
00:26:59,419 --> 00:27:02,300
The only guy was Colossus.

524
00:27:03,699 --> 00:27:06,580
I didn't have to make
too many sketches

525
00:27:06,659 --> 00:27:10,659
to find my Storm
or to find my Psylocke,

526
00:27:10,740 --> 00:27:12,699
or to find my Rogue.

527
00:27:12,780 --> 00:27:15,419
They were already there.

528
00:27:15,500 --> 00:27:18,100
The idea has always been

529
00:27:18,179 --> 00:27:22,859
to look on these characters
not as characters,

530
00:27:22,939 --> 00:27:28,419
not as functions
of a defined paradigm,

531
00:27:28,500 --> 00:27:31,500
but as people who can grow,

532
00:27:31,580 --> 00:27:34,899
who can change,
who can surprise you.

533
00:27:34,980 --> 00:27:37,100
The way women
began to take power

534
00:27:37,179 --> 00:27:40,580
is perfectly illustrated
by Jean Grey,

535
00:27:40,659 --> 00:27:43,379
formerly one of the weakest
members of the X-Men

536
00:27:43,459 --> 00:27:45,859
but then reinvented as Phoenix,

537
00:27:45,939 --> 00:27:48,939
the most powerful being
in the Universe.

538
00:27:49,020 --> 00:27:52,020
The Saga of the Phoenix
and then of the Dark Phoenix

539
00:27:52,100 --> 00:27:53,100
remains, to this day,

540
00:27:53,179 --> 00:27:56,540
one of the most famous stories
of the X-Men series,

541
00:27:56,619 --> 00:27:59,899
marking many generations
of male and female readers.

542
00:27:59,980 --> 00:28:03,060
Jean became Phoenix.

543
00:28:03,139 --> 00:28:07,740
Phoenix, within eight issues
of that transformation,

544
00:28:07,820 --> 00:28:10,300
saved the universe.

545
00:28:11,060 --> 00:28:13,060
That is not a small thing.

546
00:28:13,139 --> 00:28:19,020
She saved every living being
in Creation at that time.

547
00:28:19,780 --> 00:28:21,580
No hero had ever done that.

548
00:28:22,419 --> 00:28:27,419
And yet, within 25 issues,

549
00:28:27,500 --> 00:28:32,859
Phoenix became Dark Phoenix
and she destroyed a world.

550
00:28:32,939 --> 00:28:36,899
She killed eight billion,
six billion people.

551
00:28:36,980 --> 00:28:39,540
That action had consequences.

552
00:28:39,619 --> 00:28:43,740
It didn't matter
that she saved the universe.

553
00:28:43,820 --> 00:28:49,740
She did something unforgivable
that had to be atoned for.

554
00:28:49,820 --> 00:28:54,300
And the nice thing was that,

555
00:28:54,379 --> 00:28:57,300
for women characters,

556
00:28:57,379 --> 00:29:02,459
because they were new and the
readers weren't expecting them,

557
00:29:02,540 --> 00:29:07,780
their journeys could be
more dramatically portrayed.

558
00:29:08,659 --> 00:29:12,219
Changing Cyclops is a challenge

559
00:29:12,300 --> 00:29:16,379
because he'd existed for ten
years before I came on board.

560
00:29:16,459 --> 00:29:19,500
Whereas with Ororo,
she was brand new.

561
00:29:19,580 --> 00:29:21,939
Jean, by the time
I was done with her,

562
00:29:22,020 --> 00:29:24,260
was brand new, as Phoenix.

563
00:29:24,340 --> 00:29:26,260
Kitty was brand new.

564
00:29:26,340 --> 00:29:28,500
Rogue was brand new.

565
00:29:28,580 --> 00:29:30,699
There were
all these opportunities

566
00:29:30,780 --> 00:29:35,100
to change and to build
a new reality around the team,

567
00:29:35,179 --> 00:29:36,939
a reality which reached out

568
00:29:37,020 --> 00:29:41,780
to so many different aspects
of the audience,

569
00:29:41,859 --> 00:29:48,459
people who hadn't seen anything
like themselves in the X-Men.

570
00:29:48,540 --> 00:29:54,179
Minorities bonded with the team
to a remarkable extant.

571
00:29:54,939 --> 00:29:57,899
While women in the
X-Men series were emancipating,

572
00:29:57,980 --> 00:30:00,859
a feminist icon in comic books
returned to the fore

573
00:30:00,939 --> 00:30:02,300
through the TV series

574
00:30:02,379 --> 00:30:04,820
in which Lynda Carter
plays Wonder Woman.

575
00:30:04,899 --> 00:30:06,179
Thanks to Lynda Carter,

576
00:30:06,260 --> 00:30:09,219
Wonder Woman became a symbol
for several generations.

577
00:30:09,300 --> 00:30:14,939
The Wonder Woman TV series is
very important even for comics,

578
00:30:15,020 --> 00:30:16,300
for comic book creators

579
00:30:16,379 --> 00:30:21,580
who, still today, claim
the legacy of Lynda Carter,

580
00:30:21,659 --> 00:30:27,300
a character that really marked
American minds and even beyond.

581
00:30:27,379 --> 00:30:29,540
The series dates back to 1975

582
00:30:29,619 --> 00:30:33,219
and the context
of women's rights

583
00:30:33,300 --> 00:30:37,459
and the minorities' rights

584
00:30:37,540 --> 00:30:39,740
and civil rights movements
in the United States.

585
00:30:39,820 --> 00:30:42,459
This series really puts forward
a feminist agenda.

586
00:30:42,540 --> 00:30:46,980
It's very clear, very explicit,
as early as the first episode,

587
00:30:47,060 --> 00:30:49,219
and even the pilot episode
of the series,

588
00:30:49,300 --> 00:30:52,459
in which Wonder Woman,
played by Lynda Carter,

589
00:30:52,540 --> 00:30:55,219
says that
matriarchy will save the world.

590
00:30:55,300 --> 00:30:58,340
But, other fervent
super-feminists began to appear

591
00:30:58,419 --> 00:30:59,619
besides Wonder Woman.

592
00:30:59,699 --> 00:31:00,859
Aware of lost time,

593
00:31:00,939 --> 00:31:04,379
Marvel Comics launched
a new wave of comics

594
00:31:04,459 --> 00:31:06,659
such as Spider-Woman
and She-Hulk,

595
00:31:06,740 --> 00:31:09,939
all variations
of existing male heroes.

596
00:31:10,020 --> 00:31:12,219
One of these new characters
is Carol Danvers,

597
00:31:12,300 --> 00:31:14,340
first known as Ms. Marvel.

598
00:31:14,419 --> 00:31:15,500
In this version,

599
00:31:15,580 --> 00:31:17,300
she is first described
as the editor

600
00:31:17,379 --> 00:31:20,219
of a feminist magazine
called Woman.

601
00:31:20,300 --> 00:31:23,060
Then you had
Jim Starlin's Captain Marvel

602
00:31:23,139 --> 00:31:27,500
with the best costume in comics
for a superhero.

603
00:31:27,580 --> 00:31:29,219
It was great!

604
00:31:30,300 --> 00:31:32,020
And then, for Ms. Marvel,

605
00:31:32,100 --> 00:31:34,179
they just put that costume
on a woman.

606
00:31:35,139 --> 00:31:36,699
Except...

607
00:31:36,780 --> 00:31:41,260
This is where the train begins
to go off the rail a little.

608
00:31:41,340 --> 00:31:46,500
If you look
at a comic book male body,

609
00:31:46,580 --> 00:31:48,859
it is a perfect triangle.

610
00:31:48,939 --> 00:31:51,020
You have the broad shoulders

611
00:31:51,100 --> 00:31:56,419
and this ferocious descent
to the hips.

612
00:31:56,500 --> 00:31:57,939
And wow!

613
00:31:58,020 --> 00:32:02,139
You look at that and you think,
"Oh, baby, he's a hunk!'"

614
00:32:02,219 --> 00:32:04,859
But when you put
that same design

615
00:32:04,939 --> 00:32:06,379
on a woman's body,

616
00:32:06,459 --> 00:32:08,540
you run into problems.

617
00:32:08,619 --> 00:32:12,260
The reality was,
she's 29 years old.

618
00:32:12,340 --> 00:32:15,379
So, here's a woman who's 29

619
00:32:15,459 --> 00:32:19,379
and, in her life,
she's been a secret agent,

620
00:32:19,459 --> 00:32:22,820
chief of security
at Kennedy Space Center,

621
00:32:22,899 --> 00:32:24,780
thrown out of the Air Force.

622
00:32:24,859 --> 00:32:28,179
She becomes the editor-in-chief
of Woman Magazine.

623
00:32:28,260 --> 00:32:31,820
She has done
in a half dozen years

624
00:32:31,899 --> 00:32:35,500
what most of the rest of us

625
00:32:35,580 --> 00:32:40,379
would devote a lifetime,
an entire career, to achieving.

626
00:32:40,459 --> 00:32:42,419
And she isn't even 30 yet!

627
00:32:46,139 --> 00:32:48,859
When superheroes
began to appear in cinemas,

628
00:32:48,939 --> 00:32:51,020
superwomen swiftly followed.

629
00:32:51,100 --> 00:32:52,659
After Superman,

630
00:32:52,740 --> 00:32:56,500
Hollywood decided to devote
an entire film to Supergirl.

631
00:32:56,580 --> 00:33:00,379
However, the results
were rather mixed.

632
00:33:00,459 --> 00:33:03,619
When the movie Supergirl
was released in the early 80s,

633
00:33:03,699 --> 00:33:05,260
it was on the heels
of the success

634
00:33:05,340 --> 00:33:07,699
of Superman
with Christopher Reeve,

635
00:33:07,780 --> 00:33:10,659
a movie we know, and that was
the first big superhero movie

636
00:33:10,740 --> 00:33:12,260
shown in theaters.

637
00:33:12,340 --> 00:33:14,100
And what's interesting
about Supergirl

638
00:33:14,179 --> 00:33:15,459
is seeing how a character

639
00:33:15,540 --> 00:33:18,100
with exactly the same powers
and skills as Superman,

640
00:33:18,179 --> 00:33:19,980
so, Supergirl, his cousin,

641
00:33:20,060 --> 00:33:22,699
was not at all portrayed
in the same way

642
00:33:22,780 --> 00:33:24,540
and did not do the same things.

643
00:33:24,619 --> 00:33:27,419
When she arrives on Earth,
in order to try out her eyes,

644
00:33:27,500 --> 00:33:29,219
the rays that beam out
from her eyes,

645
00:33:29,300 --> 00:33:34,419
instead of destroying rocks
or something else as impressive,

646
00:33:34,500 --> 00:33:37,340
she makes a little flower grow
using her eyes,

647
00:33:37,419 --> 00:33:40,260
because of course, all girls
love flowers, don't they?

648
00:33:40,340 --> 00:33:43,580
So, she makes a daisy grow
using her eyes.

649
00:33:43,659 --> 00:33:45,100
And when Supergirl flies,

650
00:33:45,179 --> 00:33:48,580
it's not fist forwards
like a warrior,

651
00:33:48,659 --> 00:33:50,300
like a conqueror, like Superman.

652
00:33:50,379 --> 00:33:53,699
No, she flits,
she's very graceful,

653
00:33:53,780 --> 00:33:57,020
probably because she did ballet
as a girl, like all girls,.

654
00:33:57,100 --> 00:33:59,659
It's worth
mentioning that, for decades,

655
00:33:59,740 --> 00:34:02,820
most superheroines
had been created by men.

656
00:34:02,899 --> 00:34:08,100
Even Wonder Woman had to wait
40 years after her debut

657
00:34:08,179 --> 00:34:12,219
for a woman to finally be able
to illustrate her adventures.

658
00:34:12,299 --> 00:34:14,940
So, yes, I drew
the first Wonder Woman.

659
00:34:15,020 --> 00:34:16,860
Why did it take so long?

660
00:34:16,940 --> 00:34:19,219
Because comics, comic books,

661
00:34:19,299 --> 00:34:22,139
have traditionally been
male-oriented.

662
00:34:22,219 --> 00:34:24,380
I mean, she was created
by a man.

663
00:34:24,460 --> 00:34:26,860
He was a super-feminist,
you know,

664
00:34:26,940 --> 00:34:28,739
William Moulton Marston.

665
00:34:28,819 --> 00:34:31,380
And he really... In fact,

666
00:34:31,460 --> 00:34:35,860
I believe that he thought
women were better than men.

667
00:34:35,940 --> 00:34:39,139
He was definitely
a super-feminist.

668
00:34:39,219 --> 00:34:42,659
But she was created by a man,

669
00:34:42,739 --> 00:34:46,179
and she had been written by men
and drawn by men,

670
00:34:46,259 --> 00:34:49,259
because that was
the comics' tradition.

671
00:34:49,339 --> 00:34:52,380
And I just happened to be around

672
00:34:52,460 --> 00:34:55,739
when the tradition
was starting to be broken

673
00:34:55,819 --> 00:34:59,699
and women were
finally, finally, very slowly,

674
00:34:59,779 --> 00:35:01,179
getting into comics.

675
00:35:01,980 --> 00:35:04,100
The door opened by Trina Robbins

676
00:35:04,179 --> 00:35:06,179
paved the way for women
to play a bigger role

677
00:35:06,259 --> 00:35:08,259
in writing and illustrating
comic books.

678
00:35:08,339 --> 00:35:11,020
So, I made the decision
to draw comics,

679
00:35:11,100 --> 00:35:14,139
actually knowing nothing
about the industry

680
00:35:14,219 --> 00:35:16,179
or how to do the job,

681
00:35:16,259 --> 00:35:19,299
or the art
of sequential storytelling.

682
00:35:19,380 --> 00:35:23,420
So, to sort of make it happen,
I just had to push myself

683
00:35:23,500 --> 00:35:25,860
and learn as fast as possible,

684
00:35:25,940 --> 00:35:28,699
make sure I was
challenging myself all the time,

685
00:35:28,779 --> 00:35:31,100
asking a lot of questions,

686
00:35:31,179 --> 00:35:33,299
sometimes really dumb questions,

687
00:35:33,380 --> 00:35:36,179
so that I could get informed
and get better.

688
00:35:36,259 --> 00:35:37,900
And constantly drawing,

689
00:35:37,980 --> 00:35:41,860
constantly trying to stick
to short jobs,

690
00:35:41,940 --> 00:35:45,060
so that I could evolve quickly,

691
00:35:45,139 --> 00:35:48,980
and making sure
that I put myself out there

692
00:35:49,060 --> 00:35:52,259
and not be shy or embarrassed,

693
00:35:52,339 --> 00:35:56,219
just be arrogant

694
00:35:56,299 --> 00:35:59,339
about the potential
of my ability.

695
00:36:00,500 --> 00:36:02,219
I don't know
that it was difficult for me

696
00:36:02,299 --> 00:36:03,739
to break in as a woman,

697
00:36:03,819 --> 00:36:10,020
and I know that my story
is a little unique in that way

698
00:36:10,100 --> 00:36:12,020
because I know
a lot of my female peers

699
00:36:12,100 --> 00:36:14,219
have had a slightly harder time,

700
00:36:14,299 --> 00:36:17,420
or a much harder time,
depending.

701
00:36:17,500 --> 00:36:21,219
For me, I think
it was a combination

702
00:36:21,299 --> 00:36:23,299
of being a little older
when I started...

703
00:36:23,380 --> 00:36:27,420
I was already in my late 20s,
early 30s, when I was starting.

704
00:36:27,500 --> 00:36:31,739
Coupled with the fact that
being an Australian in America,

705
00:36:31,819 --> 00:36:35,420
and also I'm kind of loud,
and bossy and tall.

706
00:36:35,500 --> 00:36:40,139
And, so, people kind of were...

707
00:36:42,020 --> 00:36:46,819
a little surprised to see me.

708
00:36:46,900 --> 00:36:49,699
While Supergirl's
first appearance in cinemas

709
00:36:49,779 --> 00:36:51,259
was a missed opportunity,

710
00:36:51,339 --> 00:36:52,699
another character stepped in

711
00:36:52,779 --> 00:36:55,139
to represent women's rights
on the big screen.

712
00:36:55,219 --> 00:36:58,380
Catwoman became
more than just a criminal.

713
00:36:58,460 --> 00:37:01,219
I was moved by Catwoman

714
00:37:01,299 --> 00:37:04,100
because her journey
is not cliché, to my mind.

715
00:37:04,179 --> 00:37:05,940
Her story doesn't
give the impression

716
00:37:06,020 --> 00:37:08,900
of showing a revelation
or a political act,

717
00:37:08,980 --> 00:37:10,540
and, in the end,
it does become one

718
00:37:10,619 --> 00:37:12,219
because no one wants to show it.

719
00:37:12,299 --> 00:37:13,299
In fact, Catwoman,

720
00:37:13,380 --> 00:37:14,940
who was first
an enemy of Batman,

721
00:37:15,020 --> 00:37:19,020
appeared before Miss Fury but
with a very different disguise.

722
00:37:19,100 --> 00:37:21,699
She gradually drew inspiration
from Miss Fury

723
00:37:21,779 --> 00:37:24,819
and finally acquired the
costume we know her to wear.

724
00:37:25,299 --> 00:37:27,699
She most closely resembles
my own character.

725
00:37:27,779 --> 00:37:29,699
I love her costume.

726
00:37:29,779 --> 00:37:34,619
I love her whole personality.

727
00:37:35,179 --> 00:37:39,500
I drew Catwoman
for 30 issues in a row.

728
00:37:39,580 --> 00:37:44,460
That's 22 pages,
so that's 440...

729
00:37:46,100 --> 00:37:49,500
660 pages of Catwoman.

730
00:37:49,580 --> 00:37:52,580
I made those many pages

731
00:37:52,659 --> 00:37:55,460
for two years and a half.

732
00:37:55,540 --> 00:37:59,339
It was my daily job,
and it was super cool.

733
00:37:59,420 --> 00:38:03,060
She is sexy, and at the same
time, she is quite free.

734
00:38:03,139 --> 00:38:04,420
She has a bold personality.

735
00:38:04,500 --> 00:38:06,659
She is independent.
I really like this character.

736
00:38:06,739 --> 00:38:08,540
All the while,
she remains very feminine.

737
00:38:08,619 --> 00:38:12,460
For me, Catwoman is Tim Burton.
It's Tim Burton,

738
00:38:12,540 --> 00:38:15,540
and it's especially Michelle
Pfeiffer in Batman Returns.

739
00:38:15,619 --> 00:38:17,259
That was around 1992.

740
00:38:17,339 --> 00:38:23,540
She's really a superwoman
between good and evil.

741
00:38:23,619 --> 00:38:25,259
She's a super-feminist,

742
00:38:25,339 --> 00:38:27,659
she defends women
who are attacked in the streets,

743
00:38:27,739 --> 00:38:30,299
and she defies Batman.

744
00:38:30,380 --> 00:38:32,779
For me, she's the perfect
superheroine.

745
00:38:32,860 --> 00:38:35,139
I think it's modern poetry,
actually.

746
00:38:35,219 --> 00:38:38,860
It is about how
a being is suffocated

747
00:38:38,940 --> 00:38:40,940
to the point of forgetting
they even exist,

748
00:38:41,020 --> 00:38:43,580
and about how they awaken
to who they really are.

749
00:38:43,659 --> 00:38:45,460
It's a bit cliché of course,

750
00:38:45,540 --> 00:38:49,779
and it reflects the values
of the early 90s

751
00:38:49,860 --> 00:38:53,259
so, women are represented
in a very particular way.

752
00:38:53,339 --> 00:38:54,379
But at the end of the day,

753
00:38:54,420 --> 00:38:56,500
because the character
is played by an actress

754
00:38:56,580 --> 00:38:58,900
who is portrays her brilliantly,

755
00:38:58,980 --> 00:39:00,699
it's not cliché after all.

756
00:39:00,779 --> 00:39:02,699
And what's great about Catwoman

757
00:39:02,779 --> 00:39:04,540
is the fact
that she has a real life.

758
00:39:04,619 --> 00:39:06,860
She works, she has a boss,

759
00:39:06,940 --> 00:39:09,500
and like many women in real life
and many people in real life,

760
00:39:09,580 --> 00:39:13,179
she is harassed by her boss.
He throws her out the window,

761
00:39:13,259 --> 00:39:15,900
so, of course, that's a bit
more extreme than in real life.

762
00:39:15,980 --> 00:39:18,980
With Catwoman's character
in the movie by Tim Burton,

763
00:39:19,060 --> 00:39:21,460
what's great is that
she actually reclaims

764
00:39:21,540 --> 00:39:24,380
the artifices of femininity

765
00:39:24,460 --> 00:39:26,779
and everything
that's supposed to oppress her,

766
00:39:26,860 --> 00:39:30,779
like the clichés that women sow,

767
00:39:30,860 --> 00:39:36,739
that women have to be
gentle and sweet.

768
00:39:36,819 --> 00:39:40,020
Catwoman, Selina Kyle,
actually, reclaims all that

769
00:39:40,100 --> 00:39:41,259
to make her costume.

770
00:39:41,339 --> 00:39:43,940
And we see it in
her amazing transformation scene

771
00:39:44,020 --> 00:39:45,339
where she gets home

772
00:39:45,420 --> 00:39:48,420
after being thrown out the
window by her boss, Max Shreck.

773
00:39:48,500 --> 00:39:51,699
She gets home,
paints her whole house black,

774
00:39:51,779 --> 00:39:55,580
brings out her sowing machine,
and makes her costume.

775
00:39:55,659 --> 00:39:59,380
She reclaims what was a cliché
of traditional femininity

776
00:39:59,460 --> 00:40:01,020
to make a weapon,

777
00:40:01,100 --> 00:40:05,139
and she makes her costume
out of vinyl patchwork

778
00:40:05,219 --> 00:40:08,580
and creates her claws
at the end of her fingers.

779
00:40:08,659 --> 00:40:11,580
Her claws are made
of elements used for sowing,

780
00:40:11,659 --> 00:40:13,779
sowing machine spools.

781
00:40:13,860 --> 00:40:15,900
So, she really
reclaims everything

782
00:40:15,980 --> 00:40:18,779
that makes up
the oppression of women.

783
00:40:18,860 --> 00:40:21,100
And she rules the movie
by Tim Burton, in fact,

784
00:40:21,179 --> 00:40:24,100
something that future Catwomen
won't do.

785
00:40:24,179 --> 00:40:28,779
I remember the Tim Burton
movie, with Michelle Pfeiffer.

786
00:40:28,860 --> 00:40:32,699
She was really, really sexy,
but elegant, too.

787
00:40:33,540 --> 00:40:37,219
What interested me most
about superheroines

788
00:40:37,299 --> 00:40:39,500
is that they are both
elegant and strong.

789
00:40:39,980 --> 00:40:42,940
In the comics,
Catwoman, a.k.a. Selina Kyle,

790
00:40:43,020 --> 00:40:46,219
started out
as a clearly corrupt criminal.

791
00:40:46,299 --> 00:40:48,219
It was not until
about 30 years later

792
00:40:48,299 --> 00:40:50,739
that she began to display
a more ambiguous attitude

793
00:40:50,819 --> 00:40:53,580
and then was allowed to have
her own solo comics.

794
00:40:53,659 --> 00:40:56,339
Since then, she is clearly
a more positive character,

795
00:40:56,420 --> 00:40:59,100
with a role of her own
in Batman mythology.

796
00:40:59,179 --> 00:41:01,100
My understanding
of the character

797
00:41:01,179 --> 00:41:03,299
is that she's the queen
of Gotham

798
00:41:03,380 --> 00:41:07,219
because she can beat the heroes,

799
00:41:07,299 --> 00:41:08,500
because she's a villain,

800
00:41:08,580 --> 00:41:12,580
and she can beat the villains
because she's a hero.

801
00:41:12,659 --> 00:41:16,739
And she's the only one that
Batman is not going to beat up,

802
00:41:16,819 --> 00:41:18,739
because Batman
is in love with her.

803
00:41:18,819 --> 00:41:21,540
He deals with crazy people,

804
00:41:21,619 --> 00:41:26,420
but the only sane person
in Gotham City is Selina Kyle.

805
00:41:26,500 --> 00:41:29,380
And she fakes
to be crazy sometimes,

806
00:41:29,460 --> 00:41:32,060
but she's in charge
of everything.

807
00:41:32,139 --> 00:41:34,580
I like that about the character.
It's very deep.

808
00:41:34,659 --> 00:41:36,219
You know, someone like Catwoman,

809
00:41:36,299 --> 00:41:38,739
who kind of weaponizes
her sex-appeal,

810
00:41:38,819 --> 00:41:43,739
she's a character that
I would absolutely draw in...

811
00:41:45,500 --> 00:41:49,100
sexual and suggestive ways.

812
00:41:49,179 --> 00:41:52,900
But not in a way
that's compromising to her,

813
00:41:52,980 --> 00:41:54,619
because she's very much
in control.

814
00:41:55,540 --> 00:42:00,179
But then, in the late 90s,
early 2000s,

815
00:42:00,259 --> 00:42:03,580
Darwyn Cooke took Catwoman,

816
00:42:05,100 --> 00:42:07,100
not changing her backstory,

817
00:42:07,179 --> 00:42:09,860
but making her less sexualized

818
00:42:09,940 --> 00:42:11,980
and more utilitarian.

819
00:42:12,060 --> 00:42:18,060
Every single part of the costume
that he designed had a purpose.

820
00:42:18,139 --> 00:42:22,380
Versus putting on high heels,
like we saw in the 90s.

821
00:42:22,460 --> 00:42:24,100
She had boots,

822
00:42:24,179 --> 00:42:26,659
she was wearing things
that a thief would need,

823
00:42:26,739 --> 00:42:28,380
she had googles
to see in the dark.

824
00:42:28,460 --> 00:42:31,460
So, you can see Catwoman change,

825
00:42:31,540 --> 00:42:34,460
and she's a reflection
of the time that she's in,

826
00:42:34,540 --> 00:42:36,900
just like other characters
that old.

827
00:42:36,980 --> 00:42:39,060
Catwoman is a sexy character,

828
00:42:39,139 --> 00:42:44,100
but she uses that,
she's in charge of it.

829
00:42:44,179 --> 00:42:45,619
That's the difference.

830
00:42:45,699 --> 00:42:47,779
She's not an object.
She's an actor.

831
00:42:47,860 --> 00:42:49,500
Yes, she's sexy, of course,

832
00:42:49,580 --> 00:42:52,940
and she uses that to tease
people, men and women.

833
00:42:53,020 --> 00:42:56,659
But the line
between sexy and sexualisation

834
00:42:56,739 --> 00:42:58,659
can be a very fine one.

835
00:42:58,739 --> 00:43:01,659
Militant heroines claiming
ownership of their bodies

836
00:43:01,739 --> 00:43:05,339
sometimes gives way to clichés.

837
00:43:05,420 --> 00:43:10,819
What annoys me
is having to represent women

838
00:43:10,900 --> 00:43:13,540
through hyper-sexualized
objects.

839
00:43:14,380 --> 00:43:16,940
In everyday life
that just doesn't help us.

840
00:43:17,020 --> 00:43:21,739
When I work
on younger characters,

841
00:43:23,460 --> 00:43:26,619
I try to be respectful

842
00:43:26,699 --> 00:43:30,259
because we have a serious
problem as a society, I think,

843
00:43:30,339 --> 00:43:33,060
with the hypersexualization
of women,

844
00:43:33,139 --> 00:43:35,380
and especially teenage women.

845
00:43:35,460 --> 00:43:38,699
We have top models
that are 14 years old.

846
00:43:40,299 --> 00:43:42,380
Those are kids.

847
00:43:42,460 --> 00:43:45,100
They don't know about things.

848
00:43:45,179 --> 00:43:46,659
They're not allowed to vote,

849
00:43:46,739 --> 00:43:49,139
and they are selling stuff.

850
00:43:49,219 --> 00:43:50,940
I tend to think

851
00:43:51,020 --> 00:43:56,739
that things mustn't be
all of one or all of the other.

852
00:43:56,819 --> 00:43:58,460
Room must be made for stuff.

853
00:43:58,540 --> 00:44:03,100
Of course, is the
objectification of characters,

854
00:44:03,179 --> 00:44:08,619
who aren't always of age,
not a little controversial?

855
00:44:08,699 --> 00:44:12,860
We've beauty standards
that are absolutely impossible.

856
00:44:12,940 --> 00:44:14,420
I remember Cindy Crawford,

857
00:44:14,500 --> 00:44:16,619
the top model in the 90s,
saying,

858
00:44:16,699 --> 00:44:19,580
"Oh, I would love so much
to look like Cindy Crawford."

859
00:44:19,659 --> 00:44:21,100
It's impossible.

860
00:44:21,179 --> 00:44:23,900
There's a song by Ladytron.

861
00:44:23,980 --> 00:44:28,420
They sing, "You're only funny
when you're 17."

862
00:44:28,500 --> 00:44:30,339
"When you're 21, you're no fun."

863
00:44:30,420 --> 00:44:31,500
And we are selling that.

864
00:44:31,580 --> 00:44:35,219
That's not fine as a society.

865
00:44:35,299 --> 00:44:37,779
And as a comic book artist,

866
00:44:38,540 --> 00:44:42,179
you have to know how to draw
a 16-year-old woman.

867
00:44:42,940 --> 00:44:47,500
So, the girl has to be pretty,
she has to show cleavage...

868
00:44:47,580 --> 00:44:49,299
You have to have
a whole list of things

869
00:44:49,380 --> 00:44:51,779
that will really sexualize
the character.

870
00:44:51,860 --> 00:44:55,659
It's very hard
to handle certain things,

871
00:44:55,739 --> 00:45:00,100
like the fact of not looking
like that famous Power Girl

872
00:45:00,179 --> 00:45:01,980
with her big breasts,
dressed in a body,

873
00:45:02,060 --> 00:45:04,460
looking amazing and having
a lot of people drool.

874
00:45:04,540 --> 00:45:07,980
We're in a moment of our history

875
00:45:08,060 --> 00:45:11,619
that we have to know
what we are playing with.

876
00:45:11,699 --> 00:45:18,500
And we're playing with 50% of
the world population's feelings.

877
00:45:18,580 --> 00:45:20,259
You know, it's not fair!

878
00:45:20,339 --> 00:45:23,339
When I work on female
characters, whoever they are,

879
00:45:23,420 --> 00:45:27,259
I generally always try
to find their humanity.

880
00:45:27,339 --> 00:45:31,580
It's more of an inner
representation.

881
00:45:31,659 --> 00:45:33,540
I work on micro expressions
a lot.

882
00:45:33,619 --> 00:45:36,619
I work on the expression of
character and strength a lot.

883
00:45:36,699 --> 00:45:38,699
I try to give
a great deal of majesty

884
00:45:38,779 --> 00:45:40,779
to the characters I represent.

885
00:45:40,860 --> 00:45:42,259
But there is still this thing

886
00:45:42,339 --> 00:45:45,860
with your basic superheroine
having to be pretty and sexy,

887
00:45:45,940 --> 00:45:47,940
and that bothers me a little.

888
00:45:48,020 --> 00:45:50,179
Whenever a woman
in our society...

889
00:45:52,299 --> 00:45:55,860
looks far from
the beauty standards,

890
00:45:55,940 --> 00:45:58,580
the impossible beauty standards
that we have,

891
00:45:58,659 --> 00:46:03,500
whenever a woman gets there,
she's not worthy.

892
00:46:04,659 --> 00:46:05,900
And it's absurd!

893
00:46:05,980 --> 00:46:08,540
I feel like there are
some female characters

894
00:46:08,619 --> 00:46:11,779
whose sex-appeal is very much
part of their personality.

895
00:46:13,659 --> 00:46:16,219
And, for those characters,

896
00:46:16,299 --> 00:46:20,219
I'm interested in finding

897
00:46:20,299 --> 00:46:25,420
the different flavors of female
sexuality and sensuality

898
00:46:25,500 --> 00:46:29,339
that are appropriate
to that specific character.

899
00:46:30,179 --> 00:46:31,819
But there are
other female characters

900
00:46:31,900 --> 00:46:33,619
where I find it
really inappropriate.

901
00:46:33,699 --> 00:46:37,420
There certainly was
a whole period

902
00:46:37,500 --> 00:46:41,900
when female characters,
in particular,

903
00:46:41,980 --> 00:46:44,219
were shown
in very improbable poses.

904
00:46:44,299 --> 00:46:46,259
Especially on covers

905
00:46:46,339 --> 00:46:48,980
with that traditional pose
called the "broke back".

906
00:46:49,060 --> 00:46:51,219
There are characters
that I couldn't...

907
00:46:51,299 --> 00:46:53,860
that I wouldn't like to draw,
because...

908
00:46:55,380 --> 00:46:56,540
Well.

909
00:46:57,380 --> 00:47:01,619
Some characters
don't inspire me.

910
00:47:01,699 --> 00:47:04,619
They just wear too few clothes.

911
00:47:04,699 --> 00:47:10,100
At first, I was very inspired
by male artists to draw women,

912
00:47:10,179 --> 00:47:11,580
the interpretation of women.

913
00:47:11,659 --> 00:47:13,299
My vision was very masculine.

914
00:47:13,380 --> 00:47:15,619
A character like Wonder Woman,

915
00:47:15,699 --> 00:47:22,179
who is beautiful, and is sexy,
and is empowered,

916
00:47:22,259 --> 00:47:23,699
she's not someone

917
00:47:23,779 --> 00:47:26,500
who I would necessarily
be doing a butt shot of,

918
00:47:26,580 --> 00:47:31,139
because she represents a
different kind of feminine power

919
00:47:31,219 --> 00:47:36,860
and a different kind

920
00:47:31,219 --> 00:47:33,779
of feminine sexuality

921
00:47:33,860 --> 00:47:36,860
of sex-appeal.

922
00:47:36,940 --> 00:47:38,580
It was very sexy,
very accentuated

923
00:47:38,659 --> 00:47:40,299
in terms of appearance and pose.

924
00:47:40,380 --> 00:47:42,940
It wasn't that natural.

925
00:47:43,020 --> 00:47:45,460
I wanted keep that sexy side

926
00:47:45,540 --> 00:47:48,819
because that's what I like most
about male characters,

927
00:47:48,900 --> 00:47:50,860
but in a more natural,
less forced way.

928
00:47:50,940 --> 00:47:53,819
There are things
that I couldn't draw

929
00:47:53,900 --> 00:47:59,219
because I find them overkill.

930
00:47:59,299 --> 00:48:05,339
Like those poses showing
the character's bottom.

931
00:48:05,420 --> 00:48:08,619
It looks misshapen.

932
00:48:08,699 --> 00:48:10,819
The body is not natural.

933
00:48:12,060 --> 00:48:14,100
Superheroines have therefore

934
00:48:14,179 --> 00:48:15,980
sometimes been looked upon
as bimbos.

935
00:48:16,060 --> 00:48:17,380
But things started to change

936
00:48:17,460 --> 00:48:19,179
as more female writers
and readers

937
00:48:19,259 --> 00:48:20,659
made their voices heard.

938
00:48:20,739 --> 00:48:22,619
The injustice
began to be redressed

939
00:48:22,699 --> 00:48:26,779
through projects that reinvent
and restore a forgotten past.

940
00:48:26,860 --> 00:48:28,739
Women have been fighting
for a long time,

941
00:48:28,819 --> 00:48:30,380
and it is time
to point that out.

942
00:48:30,460 --> 00:48:32,860
In this regard,
the modern comic DC Bombshells

943
00:48:32,940 --> 00:48:33,940
is rewriting history

944
00:48:34,020 --> 00:48:36,619
by giving the principal heroines
in DC Comics

945
00:48:36,699 --> 00:48:39,779
the lead role in World War II.

946
00:48:39,860 --> 00:48:45,219
I've worked on the DC Bombshells
heroines for DC Comics.

947
00:48:45,299 --> 00:48:48,179
It's a very special project

948
00:48:48,259 --> 00:48:50,259
because it's not every day
that you're asked

949
00:48:50,339 --> 00:48:52,339
to improvise heroines
from the 40s,

950
00:48:52,420 --> 00:48:53,779
to draw something

951
00:48:53,860 --> 00:48:57,460
that's supposed to work
in the context of the 40s.

952
00:48:57,540 --> 00:49:01,100
When I started working
for DC Comics,

953
00:49:01,179 --> 00:49:04,380
the Bombshells project was
still in its development stage.

954
00:49:04,460 --> 00:49:07,020
I saw it come alive
and grow before my very eyes.

955
00:49:07,100 --> 00:49:09,980
So, all the superheroes
in the DC world

956
00:49:10,060 --> 00:49:14,060
have been reinvented,

957
00:49:14,139 --> 00:49:18,900
with clothes, contextualizations

958
00:49:18,980 --> 00:49:21,020
and references
to a historical period

959
00:49:21,100 --> 00:49:24,659
that more or less goes
from the 1920s to the 1950s.

960
00:49:24,739 --> 00:49:28,739
Therefore, everything we find
in the Bombshells world

961
00:49:28,819 --> 00:49:31,219
is determined
by a specific historical period.

962
00:49:31,299 --> 00:49:32,779
And the nice thing is that

963
00:49:32,860 --> 00:49:38,659
each character is reinvented in
relation to their specific role.

964
00:49:38,739 --> 00:49:41,940
Working on Bombshells
was an amazing experience

965
00:49:42,020 --> 00:49:46,779
because, like I said,

966
00:49:46,860 --> 00:49:51,259
heroines from the 1940s
have largely been forgotten,

967
00:49:51,339 --> 00:49:52,500
except for Wonder Woman

968
00:49:52,580 --> 00:49:55,060
who lasted well beyond that era.

969
00:49:55,139 --> 00:49:59,179
And then,
we added modern heroines

970
00:49:59,259 --> 00:50:03,139
who were reinvented
to adapt to the 1940s.

971
00:50:03,219 --> 00:50:08,299
I had the privilege
of creating the designs

972
00:50:08,380 --> 00:50:14,179
for a number of these characters
from scratch with Ant Lucia,

973
00:50:14,259 --> 00:50:15,860
a very good colleague,

974
00:50:15,940 --> 00:50:17,739
who is involved
in the development

975
00:50:17,819 --> 00:50:19,900
of the entire
DC Bombshells world.

976
00:50:19,980 --> 00:50:22,739
I was also offered
to create statues

977
00:50:22,819 --> 00:50:25,380
and DC Bombshells-version busts

978
00:50:25,460 --> 00:50:29,380
of Supergirl, Mera,
and Wonder Woman,

979
00:50:29,460 --> 00:50:33,060
restyled according
to a particular concept

980
00:50:33,139 --> 00:50:37,380
evoking the various sectors
of the American army.

981
00:50:37,460 --> 00:50:43,219
One of the characteristics found
in the Bombshells characters

982
00:50:43,299 --> 00:50:46,500
is a reference, by analogy, to
the poster of Rosie the Riveter.

983
00:50:46,580 --> 00:50:51,460
You can see it in the statues
of Supergirl and Wonder Woman,

984
00:50:51,540 --> 00:50:55,139
represented with
that classic gesture

985
00:50:55,219 --> 00:51:00,540
of raised arm and closed fist,
as a sign of courage,

986
00:51:00,619 --> 00:51:04,420
to convey the idea
that we can do anything.

987
00:51:04,500 --> 00:51:06,699
This concept is inseparable
from the Bombshells.

988
00:51:06,779 --> 00:51:10,819
Their job is
to encourage enthusiasm,

989
00:51:10,900 --> 00:51:14,299
to send a positive message
to people,

990
00:51:14,380 --> 00:51:17,699
the message that
we can all roll up our sleeves

991
00:51:17,779 --> 00:51:21,259
and move on
at any point in our life

992
00:51:21,339 --> 00:51:23,060
and face any difficulty.

993
00:51:23,139 --> 00:51:26,940
I think that the combination
of Supergirl and Wonder Woman

994
00:51:27,020 --> 00:51:29,460
is perfect for expressing
that concept

995
00:51:29,540 --> 00:51:34,259
and that it fully represents
the spirit of the Bombshells.

996
00:51:36,860 --> 00:51:38,500
Marvel's Black Widow

997
00:51:38,580 --> 00:51:40,739
was born out of another
conflict, the Cold War.

998
00:51:42,139 --> 00:51:44,699
She starts out
as a dangerous Soviet spy

999
00:51:44,779 --> 00:51:47,779
before redeeming herself and
going over to the heroes' side.

1000
00:51:48,659 --> 00:51:51,860
But her popularity with the
general public remained limited

1001
00:51:51,940 --> 00:51:53,659
until she began to appear
in cinemas

1002
00:51:53,739 --> 00:51:56,179
alongside Iron Man
and the Avengers.

1003
00:51:56,259 --> 00:51:58,299
At first, Black Widow
is incredible,

1004
00:51:58,380 --> 00:51:59,580
and then, as time goes by,

1005
00:51:59,659 --> 00:52:02,060
a few small things
shift her back onto the rails

1006
00:52:02,139 --> 00:52:05,139
of a more admissible femininity.

1007
00:52:05,219 --> 00:52:07,460
She starts taking care
of Hawkeye's baby,

1008
00:52:07,540 --> 00:52:10,940
she takes an interest
in how people are doing.

1009
00:52:11,020 --> 00:52:13,339
She's involved with care,
with how people are doing,

1010
00:52:13,420 --> 00:52:16,699
while Iron Man, Thor,
and Captain America

1011
00:52:16,779 --> 00:52:18,699
sort out
the world's real problems.

1012
00:52:18,779 --> 00:52:19,980
It also presents a problem

1013
00:52:20,060 --> 00:52:22,380
because the characters'
costumes in the movies

1014
00:52:22,460 --> 00:52:25,900
are much more elaborate
than the original costumes.

1015
00:52:25,980 --> 00:52:28,299
For example,
if you look at Black Widow,

1016
00:52:28,380 --> 00:52:31,460
her costume basically
is just a black leather jumpsuit

1017
00:52:31,540 --> 00:52:34,339
with bracelets, the belt,
and that's it.

1018
00:52:34,420 --> 00:52:37,299
The jumpsuit she wears
in the movie

1019
00:52:37,380 --> 00:52:42,500
has lots of little seams
everywhere, accessories...

1020
00:52:42,580 --> 00:52:43,659
In Age of Ultron,

1021
00:52:43,739 --> 00:52:46,299
she suddenly becomes the one
who has to appease the Hulk,

1022
00:52:46,380 --> 00:52:47,980
who has to pat his hand.

1023
00:52:48,060 --> 00:52:52,139
In a scene where she is opposed
to the Hulk, to Bruce Banner,

1024
00:52:52,219 --> 00:52:55,420
she even describes herself
as a monster

1025
00:52:55,500 --> 00:52:57,739
because she can't have children.

1026
00:52:57,819 --> 00:53:00,179
It's completely unbelievable.

1027
00:53:00,259 --> 00:53:02,940
The issue of refusing or being
unable to become a mother

1028
00:53:03,020 --> 00:53:05,219
comes up at that point
in Black Widow's story

1029
00:53:05,299 --> 00:53:09,580
and makes her a monster,
which is just staggering.

1030
00:53:11,139 --> 00:53:12,259
In France,

1031
00:53:12,339 --> 00:53:15,500
film director Simon Astier
created Hero Corp,

1032
00:53:15,580 --> 00:53:17,980
a television series
that turned out to be so popular

1033
00:53:18,060 --> 00:53:20,179
as to be turned
into a comic book.

1034
00:53:20,259 --> 00:53:22,739
The comedy series
describes the adventures

1035
00:53:22,819 --> 00:53:24,860
of very French supermen.

1036
00:53:24,940 --> 00:53:26,819
There aren't many superheroines
in HeroCorp.

1037
00:53:26,900 --> 00:53:30,139
In my writing today,
I do things differently.

1038
00:53:30,219 --> 00:53:33,179
I think it's to counter
that pattern.

1039
00:53:33,259 --> 00:53:36,739
What I did
with my last projects,

1040
00:53:36,819 --> 00:53:41,380
specifically to counter that law

1041
00:53:41,460 --> 00:53:43,739
or way of doing things,

1042
00:53:43,819 --> 00:53:47,739
was write characters that
I find cool, stylish, and funny,

1043
00:53:47,819 --> 00:53:49,380
and give them names at the end.

1044
00:53:49,460 --> 00:53:53,659
I also tried to create
other characters,

1045
00:53:53,739 --> 00:53:55,179
female characters,

1046
00:53:55,259 --> 00:53:58,219
that are double-sided

1047
00:53:58,299 --> 00:54:04,219
with a cool side
and a darker side.

1048
00:54:04,299 --> 00:54:06,940
The first movies
featuring superheroines,

1049
00:54:07,020 --> 00:54:08,020
far from successful,

1050
00:54:08,100 --> 00:54:11,540
were booed and ignored by the
general public and by critics.

1051
00:54:11,619 --> 00:54:13,420
There was a saying in Hollywood

1052
00:54:13,500 --> 00:54:17,659
to the effect that superwomen
movies were guaranteed to bomb.

1053
00:54:17,739 --> 00:54:20,100
Real filmmaking success
began to happen

1054
00:54:20,179 --> 00:54:23,580
when Wonder Woman finally
appeared on the big screen,

1055
00:54:23,659 --> 00:54:25,980
and shortly after
in films of her own.

1056
00:54:26,060 --> 00:54:29,580
I decided to make
this Wonder Woman costume

1057
00:54:29,659 --> 00:54:32,779
for a competition at Japan Expo.

1058
00:54:32,860 --> 00:54:34,420
That choice was based
on an idea I'd had

1059
00:54:34,500 --> 00:54:36,299
for a performance
with the character.

1060
00:54:36,380 --> 00:54:39,100
I wanted to create something
that could really move on stage,

1061
00:54:39,179 --> 00:54:41,299
and we were in full
Wonder Woman craze.

1062
00:54:41,380 --> 00:54:42,819
The movie had just
been released.

1063
00:54:42,900 --> 00:54:46,380
And superheroines were something
I was interested in.

1064
00:54:46,460 --> 00:54:48,020
She remains an icon.

1065
00:54:48,100 --> 00:54:52,100
When you see her, you can hardly
mistake her for someone else.

1066
00:54:52,179 --> 00:54:56,219
In the movie by Patty Jenkins,

1067
00:54:56,299 --> 00:54:58,420
Wonder Woman is also a feminist.

1068
00:54:58,500 --> 00:54:59,900
I think that can be argued,

1069
00:54:59,980 --> 00:55:06,219
even if it's a much more
tender, soft kind of feminism

1070
00:55:06,299 --> 00:55:11,219
compared to Lynda Carter
and the 70s version

1071
00:55:11,299 --> 00:55:14,580
where it was really displayed,
explicit and really stated.

1072
00:55:14,659 --> 00:55:17,339
Wonder Woman is justice.

1073
00:55:17,420 --> 00:55:19,060
I mean, she fights for truth,

1074
00:55:19,139 --> 00:55:23,380
she has her Lasso of Truth
to which no one can lie.

1075
00:55:23,460 --> 00:55:25,060
In the movie by Patty Jenkins,

1076
00:55:25,139 --> 00:55:26,540
Wonder Woman still has the idea

1077
00:55:26,619 --> 00:55:28,219
of making the world
a better place,

1078
00:55:28,299 --> 00:55:30,420
with as little violence
as possible it seems,

1079
00:55:30,500 --> 00:55:31,659
even if she does fight.

1080
00:55:31,739 --> 00:55:35,699
It's a lot more low-key
than in the series.

1081
00:55:35,779 --> 00:55:39,540
Despite her very powerful,
"nothing can touch me" side,

1082
00:55:39,619 --> 00:55:41,460
she does have
an inner sensitivity

1083
00:55:41,540 --> 00:55:44,460
and something that makes her
a bit human.

1084
00:55:44,540 --> 00:55:45,779
Even if...

1085
00:55:45,860 --> 00:55:48,139
Well, if I were to take a bullet
in the shoulder,

1086
00:55:48,219 --> 00:55:49,779
I'd burst into tears!

1087
00:55:49,860 --> 00:55:52,259
What's interesting
about the film by Patty Jenkins

1088
00:55:52,339 --> 00:55:53,940
is the way
she films Wonder Woman.

1089
00:55:54,020 --> 00:55:58,339
Unlike Zack Snyder, she doesn't
focus on her buttocks,

1090
00:55:58,420 --> 00:56:01,580
with tons of shots of Wonder
Woman viewed from behind

1091
00:56:01,659 --> 00:56:03,259
when she's fighting,
for example.

1092
00:56:03,339 --> 00:56:05,339
Patty Jenkins takes
a greater interest

1093
00:56:05,420 --> 00:56:09,819
in everything that has to do
with actual action.

1094
00:56:09,900 --> 00:56:12,460
So, she focuses on Wonder
Woman's biceps, her calves...

1095
00:56:12,540 --> 00:56:16,100
She also films her views
from the front and in motion.

1096
00:56:16,179 --> 00:56:18,259
Like that incredible scene

1097
00:56:18,339 --> 00:56:21,100
where Wonder Woman
runs through the trenches,

1098
00:56:21,179 --> 00:56:25,779
with wide, front shots of her
in full motion.

1099
00:56:26,900 --> 00:56:28,860
The Boys, a comic book series

1100
00:56:28,940 --> 00:56:30,619
by Garth Ennis
and Darick Robertson,

1101
00:56:30,699 --> 00:56:33,980
is a blithe pastiche
of the Justice League.

1102
00:56:34,060 --> 00:56:36,299
But under false airs
of trashy parody,

1103
00:56:36,380 --> 00:56:40,900
room is given to a feminist
message through two superwomen,

1104
00:56:40,980 --> 00:56:45,339
cynical Queen Maeve
and innocent Starlight.

1105
00:56:45,420 --> 00:56:49,020
The concept has become a hit
TV series on Amazon Prime.

1106
00:56:49,100 --> 00:56:51,940
Even The Boys talk about girls!

1107
00:56:52,020 --> 00:56:53,020
As far as the women

1108
00:56:53,100 --> 00:56:55,659
and how they're treated
in the original Boys comic,

1109
00:56:55,739 --> 00:56:58,219
the idea back then
that Garth had

1110
00:56:58,299 --> 00:57:02,580
was inspired by true stories
from the 1930s

1111
00:57:02,659 --> 00:57:04,420
about Hollywood casting couches

1112
00:57:04,500 --> 00:57:07,540
and the way women were treated
back in the day.

1113
00:57:07,619 --> 00:57:09,819
Queen Maeve is not Wonder Woman.

1114
00:57:09,900 --> 00:57:13,060
She just does things like Wonder
Woman would do with her powers.

1115
00:57:13,139 --> 00:57:14,619
But she's not Wonder Woman

1116
00:57:14,699 --> 00:57:17,020
because Wonder Woman has
a good heart, a good soul,

1117
00:57:17,100 --> 00:57:18,259
and cares about people,

1118
00:57:18,339 --> 00:57:21,100
and Queen Maeve
is shattered inside.

1119
00:57:21,179 --> 00:57:23,739
The conversation that,
in the comic,

1120
00:57:23,819 --> 00:57:25,940
Starlight and Queen Maeve have

1121
00:57:26,020 --> 00:57:29,299
when she first meets her after
she's throwing up in the toilet

1122
00:57:29,380 --> 00:57:31,940
and runs into Queen Maeve
in the bathroom,

1123
00:57:32,020 --> 00:57:34,699
that was based on
a real conversation

1124
00:57:34,779 --> 00:57:37,619
between Marilyn Monroe and
Bette Davis that Garth had read,

1125
00:57:37,699 --> 00:57:40,179
where Marilyn Monroe
said to Bette Davis,

1126
00:57:40,259 --> 00:57:43,779
"Oh, I'm so happy to meet you,
I'm your biggest fan!"

1127
00:57:43,860 --> 00:57:46,619
And Bette Davis told her
to fuck off.

1128
00:57:46,699 --> 00:57:50,299
In the television show,
they're doing a great job

1129
00:57:50,380 --> 00:57:54,259
of updating that concept
to a more socially aware world,

1130
00:57:54,339 --> 00:57:58,339
where Starlight is
fighting back a little bit more,

1131
00:57:58,420 --> 00:58:01,219
and she's not as victimized.

1132
00:58:01,299 --> 00:58:03,860
And Queen Maeve is a little bit
more sensitive to the fact

1133
00:58:03,940 --> 00:58:07,179
that, you know, she's not going
to make it easy on her

1134
00:58:07,259 --> 00:58:12,060
but at the same time, Queen
Maeve is more sympathetic

1135
00:58:12,139 --> 00:58:14,380
to what Starlight
is going through.

1136
00:58:28,619 --> 00:58:30,980
While Wonder Woman
and her variations

1137
00:58:31,060 --> 00:58:32,339
began to appear on-screen,

1138
00:58:32,420 --> 00:58:36,339
Marvel profoundly reinvented
another heroine, Carol Danvers.

1139
00:58:36,420 --> 00:58:38,460
Divested of her identity
as Ms. Marvel,

1140
00:58:38,540 --> 00:58:41,420
she was promoted
to Captain Marvel

1141
00:58:41,500 --> 00:58:43,179
with a less tight-fitting
costume

1142
00:58:43,259 --> 00:58:45,940
and a soaring popularity.

1143
00:58:46,020 --> 00:58:48,779
When I started working
with Captain Marvel,

1144
00:58:48,860 --> 00:58:52,219
I had conversations
with Kelly Sue DeConnick.

1145
00:58:52,299 --> 00:58:55,779
She worked her ass off to make
her from a very small character

1146
00:58:55,860 --> 00:58:57,139
to something huge.

1147
00:58:57,219 --> 00:58:59,100
For a couple of years,
maybe three,

1148
00:58:59,179 --> 00:59:01,380
she went to all the conventions
in the tour.

1149
00:59:01,460 --> 00:59:06,940
She wanted a character
that's power in the best ways.

1150
00:59:07,020 --> 00:59:09,900
I think that sometimes,
people make comparisons

1151
00:59:09,980 --> 00:59:12,980
between Captain Marvel
and Wonder Woman.

1152
00:59:13,060 --> 00:59:14,139
But that's wrong.

1153
00:59:14,219 --> 00:59:16,060
Captain Marvel is Superman.

1154
00:59:16,139 --> 00:59:21,100
In the comparison,
she's the strongest one,

1155
00:59:21,179 --> 00:59:24,980
the fairest one,
the best human being possible,

1156
00:59:25,060 --> 00:59:28,139
and she knows
that if she's that powerful,

1157
00:59:28,219 --> 00:59:30,699
she must be good.

1158
00:59:30,779 --> 00:59:33,900
It's like, "With great powers
comes great responsibility."

1159
00:59:33,980 --> 00:59:37,779
And today, Captain Marvel
sends out a stronger message

1160
00:59:37,860 --> 00:59:40,619
that "I'm a woman and I take
care of myself in this world",

1161
00:59:40,699 --> 00:59:41,900
today, as I am."

1162
00:59:41,980 --> 00:59:43,619
"I'm a woman
and I take care of myself."

1163
00:59:43,699 --> 00:59:48,219
She's never threatening unless
she must threaten somebody.

1164
00:59:48,299 --> 00:59:50,460
She knows people can fail,

1165
00:59:50,540 --> 00:59:53,100
because she has failed
so many times.

1166
00:59:53,179 --> 00:59:56,819
I think she's a good example
for people,

1167
00:59:56,900 --> 00:59:58,540
not only for women of course.

1168
00:59:58,619 --> 01:00:02,100
A hero is not the one who flies.

1169
01:00:02,179 --> 01:00:06,060
A hero is the one who, when
he falls down, he gets up again.

1170
01:00:06,139 --> 01:00:10,020
You're never beat until the
moment you don't get up again.

1171
01:00:10,100 --> 01:00:11,980
And that's the thing
about Captain Marvel.

1172
01:00:12,060 --> 01:00:13,619
She's been an alcoholic.

1173
01:00:13,699 --> 01:00:16,540
She's been through a lot
of crazy shit.

1174
01:00:16,619 --> 01:00:18,380
In the movies, Captain Marvel

1175
01:00:18,460 --> 01:00:22,540
sort of embodies the message
driven home by Wonder Woman

1176
01:00:22,619 --> 01:00:26,420
that yes, female superheroes
can carry a film

1177
01:00:26,500 --> 01:00:27,980
and be box office hits.

1178
01:00:28,060 --> 01:00:30,339
Did you think
that being a cosplayer

1179
01:00:30,420 --> 01:00:32,860
was just about the costume?
Think again.

1180
01:00:32,940 --> 01:00:34,940
While it's true
that reproducing costumes

1181
01:00:35,020 --> 01:00:38,299
is technically difficult,
there's also a moral challenge.

1182
01:00:38,380 --> 01:00:40,259
Wearing these heroines' clothes

1183
01:00:40,339 --> 01:00:42,259
also means
representing their values.

1184
01:00:42,339 --> 01:00:45,739
From the moment you become
Wonder Woman or Captain Marvel,

1185
01:00:45,819 --> 01:00:47,699
that also involves another form
of heroism.

1186
01:00:49,020 --> 01:00:52,420
I found out about Captain Marvel
through her movie.

1187
01:00:52,500 --> 01:00:55,100
And then I said to myself,

1188
01:00:55,179 --> 01:01:01,219
"I have to start reading the
comics in which she appears."

1189
01:01:01,299 --> 01:01:06,900
After fighting my body
for a long time,

1190
01:01:06,980 --> 01:01:09,699
because, if I may say so,
I used to be obese,

1191
01:01:09,779 --> 01:01:10,860
I lost weight and I said,

1192
01:01:10,940 --> 01:01:14,500
"I too, one day, will not be
vulgar, for one thing,"

1193
01:01:14,580 --> 01:01:16,980
and for another,
I will wear a morph suit

1194
01:01:17,060 --> 01:01:20,179
"and interpret a strong heroine."

1195
01:01:20,259 --> 01:01:21,420
She's just great.

1196
01:01:21,500 --> 01:01:24,100
She's really amazing

1197
01:01:24,179 --> 01:01:29,659
because she's a character
that reveals nothing.

1198
01:01:29,739 --> 01:01:31,980
We get the feeling
she keeps everything to herself,

1199
01:01:32,060 --> 01:01:33,100
she's very sensitive.

1200
01:01:33,179 --> 01:01:36,980
And I thought,
"Yes, she's you, really,"

1201
01:01:37,060 --> 01:01:40,779
because I really compared myself

1202
01:01:40,860 --> 01:01:45,500
to the actress's attitude
in the movie,

1203
01:01:45,580 --> 01:01:47,819
and in fact, we have a lot
of things in common,

1204
01:01:47,900 --> 01:01:49,339
even in terms of my personality.

1205
01:01:49,420 --> 01:01:51,460
I had to make
my very own Captain Marvel.

1206
01:01:51,540 --> 01:01:55,980
So, my costume
is 100% designed...

1207
01:01:57,299 --> 01:01:58,299
in here.

1208
01:01:59,380 --> 01:02:00,580
It's my very own creation.

1209
01:02:00,659 --> 01:02:02,219
It's my Captain Marvel.

1210
01:02:02,299 --> 01:02:05,779
The position she's in
at the end of the movie

1211
01:02:06,500 --> 01:02:11,980
when she sends her former boss
packing, when she beats him up

1212
01:02:12,060 --> 01:02:13,860
and tells him,
"I have nothing to prove,"

1213
01:02:13,940 --> 01:02:15,139
that's kind of how I feel.

1214
01:02:15,219 --> 01:02:16,779
Today, I have nothing to prove.

1215
01:02:16,860 --> 01:02:19,179
I've taken a 180 degree turn.

1216
01:02:19,259 --> 01:02:22,020
It's the same with work.

1217
01:02:22,100 --> 01:02:23,940
I made certain decisions
a year ago,

1218
01:02:24,020 --> 01:02:27,259
and it really coincided
with the moment

1219
01:02:27,339 --> 01:02:30,819
when I decided to play Captain
Marvel's character in cosplay.

1220
01:02:30,900 --> 01:02:31,900
Captain Marvel,

1221
01:02:31,980 --> 01:02:34,299
from an economic and strategic
point of view,

1222
01:02:34,380 --> 01:02:38,259
is very important because
she gives the green light,

1223
01:02:38,339 --> 01:02:40,739
somehow, to other projects

1224
01:02:40,819 --> 01:02:44,739
and to the possibility of having
superheroines in movies.

1225
01:02:44,819 --> 01:02:47,619
And she's a message
sent out to producers too,

1226
01:02:47,699 --> 01:02:49,420
telling them to go ahead.

1227
01:02:50,980 --> 01:02:52,659
Over the past 15 years,

1228
01:02:52,739 --> 01:02:54,659
female cosplayers
have become more present

1229
01:02:54,739 --> 01:02:56,020
in geek festivals than men.

1230
01:02:56,100 --> 01:02:58,179
They have profoundly changed
an atmosphere

1231
01:02:58,259 --> 01:03:00,739
that until recently
was mostly masculine.

1232
01:03:00,819 --> 01:03:03,819
Female readers
used to feel isolated

1233
01:03:03,900 --> 01:03:05,420
in a hobby for boys.

1234
01:03:05,500 --> 01:03:06,980
But when young women cosplayers

1235
01:03:07,060 --> 01:03:09,420
began to appear
as Oracle, Starfire, or Raven,

1236
01:03:09,500 --> 01:03:11,980
their presence
changed the rules.

1237
01:03:12,060 --> 01:03:13,980
Thanks to cosplay,
women have gained

1238
01:03:14,060 --> 01:03:16,619
increasing visibility
in comic book culture.

1239
01:03:16,699 --> 01:03:18,860
When we cosplay,
there's the character aspect

1240
01:03:18,940 --> 01:03:20,940
but there also the challenge
of the costume.

1241
01:03:21,020 --> 01:03:22,980
I hadn't made armors
in a very long time,

1242
01:03:23,060 --> 01:03:25,219
I wanted to test new materials,

1243
01:03:25,299 --> 01:03:28,139
so my costume became
a matter of course.

1244
01:03:28,219 --> 01:03:29,779
What's cool in cosplay

1245
01:03:29,860 --> 01:03:32,060
is that it involves more
than just the conventions.

1246
01:03:32,139 --> 01:03:34,699
Yes, we have the photoshoots
and the interviews,

1247
01:03:34,779 --> 01:03:36,739
but then there are
the hospitals.

1248
01:03:36,819 --> 01:03:42,060
I would like to create a group
of people or something,

1249
01:03:42,139 --> 01:03:44,139
to go and visit
those poor children

1250
01:03:44,219 --> 01:03:48,100
or even adult enthusiasts
or people who are suffering.

1251
01:03:48,179 --> 01:03:50,219
Success changes everything.

1252
01:03:50,299 --> 01:03:51,299
For a long time,

1253
01:03:51,380 --> 01:03:53,580
the point was to give heroines
a place in comics.

1254
01:03:53,659 --> 01:03:55,339
But now that this place
is acquired,

1255
01:03:55,420 --> 01:03:57,779
variety can be brought
to these women's profiles.

1256
01:03:57,860 --> 01:03:59,540
Rather than fitting
a unique model,

1257
01:03:59,619 --> 01:04:01,619
superwomen are unlimited
in their types.

1258
01:04:01,699 --> 01:04:03,339
This provides room
for diversity,

1259
01:04:03,420 --> 01:04:06,179
including for characters
that have been around for ages.

1260
01:04:06,259 --> 01:04:12,259
The first superheroine I
followed as a kid was She-Ra.

1261
01:04:12,339 --> 01:04:15,699
I think everyone remembers
the Masters of the Universe.

1262
01:04:15,779 --> 01:04:18,580
For me, the first superheroine
was She-Ra.

1263
01:04:18,659 --> 01:04:21,060
I became so enthusiastic
about this genre,

1264
01:04:21,139 --> 01:04:23,219
this fantasy genre,

1265
01:04:23,299 --> 01:04:26,900
in which the protagonist
isn't a damsel in distress

1266
01:04:26,980 --> 01:04:32,060
but the person
in charge of her own actions

1267
01:04:32,139 --> 01:04:35,060
and with the power
to save people.

1268
01:04:35,139 --> 01:04:39,100
I think it's something that has
brought me to perceive women

1269
01:04:39,179 --> 01:04:41,699
as unlimited
in what they can do.

1270
01:04:41,779 --> 01:04:43,819
It's true that I was impressed
by She-Ra

1271
01:04:43,900 --> 01:04:46,540
because it was
a rather revolutionary cartoon

1272
01:04:46,619 --> 01:04:48,259
in the sense that...

1273
01:04:48,339 --> 01:04:49,540
Careful, spoiler!

1274
01:04:49,619 --> 01:04:53,380
The female protagonist
ends up with a woman.

1275
01:04:53,460 --> 01:04:57,699
Today, I've come out, and that's
why I did She-Ra because...

1276
01:04:57,779 --> 01:05:00,779
Like I said, my cosplay therapy
always matches something,

1277
01:05:00,860 --> 01:05:04,179
and She-Ra matched
my coming out.

1278
01:05:04,940 --> 01:05:06,779
Supergirl also evolved.

1279
01:05:06,860 --> 01:05:09,020
No longer just Superman's
unassuming cousin,

1280
01:05:09,100 --> 01:05:11,219
living in his shadow,
she began to be described

1281
01:05:11,299 --> 01:05:13,619
as having come to Earth
to protect her cousin.

1282
01:05:13,699 --> 01:05:15,860
Today, she even has
her own TV series,

1283
01:05:15,940 --> 01:05:19,339
in which Superman starts out
as a secondary character.

1284
01:05:19,420 --> 01:05:21,900
Supergirl is acquiring
new relevance

1285
01:05:21,980 --> 01:05:24,060
and becoming a positive symbol
for young girls.

1286
01:05:25,339 --> 01:05:27,460
Supergirl...

1287
01:05:28,259 --> 01:05:34,659
Well, I'm not a huge fan
of Superman and that world,

1288
01:05:34,739 --> 01:05:37,659
but I liked Supergirl

1289
01:05:37,739 --> 01:05:41,380
because she's was
a bit different, a bit younger.

1290
01:05:41,460 --> 01:05:44,420
For me,
Supergirl symbolizes hope.

1291
01:05:45,380 --> 01:05:47,860
It's the symbol
she wears on her chest.

1292
01:05:47,940 --> 01:05:51,100
She's also a young character,

1293
01:05:51,179 --> 01:05:53,900
quite juvenile
in the ways she responds

1294
01:05:53,980 --> 01:05:55,940
to the world in which she lives.

1295
01:05:56,020 --> 01:05:59,940
She doesn't react like Superman,
for instance.

1296
01:06:00,020 --> 01:06:05,699
She's a bit rough around
the edges, a bit hotheaded.

1297
01:06:05,779 --> 01:06:11,699
Supergirl is the first
important superheroine

1298
01:06:11,779 --> 01:06:12,900
in my life

1299
01:06:12,980 --> 01:06:16,900
because the first major title
I worked on

1300
01:06:16,980 --> 01:06:20,339
for DC Comics was Supergirl.

1301
01:06:20,420 --> 01:06:23,060
She opened the door to the vista
of the whole DC world for me.

1302
01:06:23,139 --> 01:06:24,699
And I liked her from the start,

1303
01:06:24,779 --> 01:06:28,460
maybe because
when I began to draw her,

1304
01:06:28,540 --> 01:06:34,100
we were pretty much the same
age, Supergirl and I.

1305
01:06:34,179 --> 01:06:36,779
To me, she was very clear
as a character.

1306
01:06:36,860 --> 01:06:37,860
I understood her well,

1307
01:06:37,940 --> 01:06:39,219
because she was my age

1308
01:06:39,299 --> 01:06:41,540
and I assumed she could do
the same things I did,

1309
01:06:41,619 --> 01:06:45,219
have the same friends
I hung out with.

1310
01:06:45,299 --> 01:06:52,139
For me, representing her
almost came from the gut

1311
01:06:52,219 --> 01:06:56,779
because I didn't have to study
much for her.

1312
01:06:56,860 --> 01:06:59,299
She's also
a very sunny character,

1313
01:06:59,380 --> 01:07:02,299
and I like that positive side
she embodies.

1314
01:07:04,580 --> 01:07:07,779
I think that, in the series,

1315
01:07:07,860 --> 01:07:10,219
that aspect of her
is very well represented.

1316
01:07:10,299 --> 01:07:14,060
What's nice is that the audience
is very different,

1317
01:07:14,139 --> 01:07:16,860
not necessarily people
who are comics fans,

1318
01:07:16,940 --> 01:07:21,020
but pretty much anyone can
recognize this character

1319
01:07:21,100 --> 01:07:24,179
from her symbol.

1320
01:07:24,259 --> 01:07:26,940
So, it's fun to play her

1321
01:07:27,020 --> 01:07:31,219
because you can really reach
and bond with everyone,

1322
01:07:31,299 --> 01:07:32,500
with children too.

1323
01:07:32,580 --> 01:07:35,219
You can see a lot more
in this character

1324
01:07:35,299 --> 01:07:37,420
than just a super-strong heroine

1325
01:07:37,500 --> 01:07:40,100
that is an absolute symbol
or something like that.

1326
01:07:40,179 --> 01:07:42,860
While Batwoman
was an uninspiring variation

1327
01:07:42,940 --> 01:07:44,420
of Batman in the 50s,

1328
01:07:44,500 --> 01:07:47,659
she was entirely reinvented
in the early 2000s

1329
01:07:47,739 --> 01:07:51,299
as a much more competent
and modern character.

1330
01:07:51,380 --> 01:07:52,460
An LGBT heroine

1331
01:07:52,540 --> 01:07:54,619
claiming ownership
of her own place in Gotham.

1332
01:07:55,779 --> 01:07:57,779
Batwoman is
exactly the same thing.

1333
01:07:57,860 --> 01:07:58,980
She's a symbol.

1334
01:07:59,060 --> 01:08:03,900
But she's a symbol for
the entire LGBT community.

1335
01:08:05,819 --> 01:08:07,020
And, at the same time,

1336
01:08:07,100 --> 01:08:09,739
she's gone through almost
the same evolution as Supergirl.

1337
01:08:09,819 --> 01:08:11,259
In the 50s,

1338
01:08:11,339 --> 01:08:16,539
Batwoman was not represented
in the way she is now.

1339
01:08:17,459 --> 01:08:21,419
Rather like Supergirl,

1340
01:08:21,499 --> 01:08:26,900
she wasn't charismatic
or a feminist.

1341
01:08:26,980 --> 01:08:31,980
She used all sorts
of rather useless accessories,

1342
01:08:32,060 --> 01:08:38,539
like her famous eyeshadow.

1343
01:08:38,620 --> 01:08:41,339
She was also
just Batman's sidekick, really,

1344
01:08:41,419 --> 01:08:44,419
and, for the same reason,
here to develop the Bat Family.

1345
01:08:44,499 --> 01:08:46,980
But in the early 2000s...

1346
01:08:47,060 --> 01:08:50,060
It was in 2006 that Greg Rucka,
the screenwriter,

1347
01:08:50,139 --> 01:08:51,740
created that character.

1348
01:08:51,820 --> 01:08:55,539
We are poles apart
from the 50s Batwoman.

1349
01:08:55,620 --> 01:08:58,459
She becomes a very strong,
very charismatic character,

1350
01:08:58,539 --> 01:09:01,820
she's a soldier,
part of the army,

1351
01:09:01,900 --> 01:09:05,179
and she goes through a lot
of terrible things in her life.

1352
01:09:05,259 --> 01:09:09,419
That's the character
that appealed to me,

1353
01:09:09,499 --> 01:09:13,020
even with regard
to my own experience,

1354
01:09:13,100 --> 01:09:15,179
and that helped me move forward,

1355
01:09:15,259 --> 01:09:18,259
especially with regard
to her own sexuality

1356
01:09:18,339 --> 01:09:20,579
and her own personal journey.

1357
01:09:20,660 --> 01:09:24,060
Today, we have Batwoman, who's
in a relationship with a woman.

1358
01:09:24,860 --> 01:09:25,980
It's a cause of mine,

1359
01:09:26,060 --> 01:09:28,700
not only women in movies
but also homosexuality,

1360
01:09:28,780 --> 01:09:30,459
and I think it is important
to say it.

1361
01:09:30,539 --> 01:09:32,780
And today, things are
being taken even further.

1362
01:09:32,860 --> 01:09:37,299
To me, LGBT representation
in comics is essential

1363
01:09:37,379 --> 01:09:42,780
because it brings diversity
to comics,

1364
01:09:42,860 --> 01:09:44,860
even if that diversity
has always been there.

1365
01:09:46,020 --> 01:09:48,139
What was impossible in 1941,

1366
01:09:48,219 --> 01:09:49,700
when Wonder Woman's creator

1367
01:09:49,780 --> 01:09:52,660
only implied
the heroine's bisexuality,

1368
01:09:52,740 --> 01:09:55,339
is, today, explicit
in many titles.

1369
01:09:55,419 --> 01:09:58,219
She-Ra and Batwoman aren't
the only characters concerned.

1370
01:09:58,299 --> 01:10:02,499
Even Marvel's Asgard takes
an interest in LGBT issues.

1371
01:10:02,579 --> 01:10:05,740
Angela is a pansexual character.

1372
01:10:07,579 --> 01:10:11,299
She's in a relationship
with a trans woman,

1373
01:10:11,379 --> 01:10:12,980
who was developed
for the series.

1374
01:10:13,060 --> 01:10:15,980
She's Thor
and Loki's forgotten sister.

1375
01:10:16,060 --> 01:10:18,219
There was
no particular pressure.

1376
01:10:19,219 --> 01:10:21,820
With Kieron and Jimenez,

1377
01:10:21,900 --> 01:10:28,299
we tried to deal with
the question rather quickly

1378
01:10:28,379 --> 01:10:31,700
because that wasn't
the most important point.

1379
01:10:31,780 --> 01:10:32,980
The character is important

1380
01:10:33,060 --> 01:10:35,539
but that particular story
isn't the focus.

1381
01:10:35,620 --> 01:10:37,299
Their collective story
is the focus.

1382
01:10:37,379 --> 01:10:38,940
She's a character
like any other,

1383
01:10:39,020 --> 01:10:40,820
with a background
like everyone else.

1384
01:10:40,900 --> 01:10:42,900
That's one of the things
I appreciate the most,

1385
01:10:42,980 --> 01:10:47,379
I have always been given free
rein to interpret things my way.

1386
01:10:47,459 --> 01:10:53,060
I was never asked to reframe
things one way or another.

1387
01:10:53,139 --> 01:10:56,179
Alters, a series
by Paul Jenkins and Leila Leiz,

1388
01:10:56,259 --> 01:10:58,660
issued by independent publisher
Aftershock,

1389
01:10:58,740 --> 01:11:00,499
also addresses these issues

1390
01:11:00,579 --> 01:11:02,299
through the prism
of superheroes.

1391
01:11:02,379 --> 01:11:06,539
Alters is the story
of a young boy, Charlie,

1392
01:11:06,620 --> 01:11:09,179
who is transitioning
to become a woman.

1393
01:11:09,259 --> 01:11:10,860
In the meantime,
he also discovers

1394
01:11:10,940 --> 01:11:12,539
that he has special powers.

1395
01:11:12,620 --> 01:11:16,900
And as he's in that transition
to become a woman,

1396
01:11:16,980 --> 01:11:20,419
he transforms into Chalice
to do justice in the city.

1397
01:11:22,020 --> 01:11:25,060
Diversity also
means differences in appearance

1398
01:11:25,139 --> 01:11:27,940
as well as in tone
and story type.

1399
01:11:28,020 --> 01:11:29,740
Who would have thought
that one day

1400
01:11:29,820 --> 01:11:32,459
we would meet a superwoman
with squirrel powers?

1401
01:11:32,539 --> 01:11:33,620
At the same time,

1402
01:11:33,700 --> 01:11:39,700
there's a lot of superheroes
who don't have that standard,

1403
01:11:39,780 --> 01:11:43,259
that unrealistic proportions
that they had in the 90s,

1404
01:11:43,339 --> 01:11:45,499
and they find
their audience too.

1405
01:11:45,579 --> 01:11:49,139
For example, Squirrel Girl
is a college student

1406
01:11:49,219 --> 01:11:55,700
who's drawn, these days,
a little bigger,

1407
01:11:55,780 --> 01:11:56,860
not tiny-waisted,

1408
01:11:56,940 --> 01:12:00,379
the way characters
in the 90s were drawn.

1409
01:12:00,459 --> 01:12:03,299
I found out about her
in the comics,

1410
01:12:03,379 --> 01:12:07,579
and, for me,
she was completely kitsch.

1411
01:12:07,660 --> 01:12:11,539
A woman with squirrel powers,
to me, was completely absurd.

1412
01:12:11,620 --> 01:12:13,820
What are your superpowers?

1413
01:12:13,900 --> 01:12:15,419
Well, I have squirrel powers

1414
01:12:15,499 --> 01:12:19,020
and I can beat the biggest
bad guys in the Marvel world.

1415
01:12:19,100 --> 01:12:23,780
But she's also intelligent
enough to build strategies

1416
01:12:23,860 --> 01:12:27,179
to defeat bad guys

1417
01:12:27,259 --> 01:12:29,780
that no other character
has managed to overcome.

1418
01:12:29,860 --> 01:12:32,419
Following in
Captain Marvel's footsteps,

1419
01:12:32,499 --> 01:12:33,499
a number of heroines

1420
01:12:33,579 --> 01:12:35,459
are claiming equality
with male heroes

1421
01:12:35,539 --> 01:12:36,740
by replacing them.

1422
01:12:36,820 --> 01:12:40,499
In comics, Jane Foster,
Thor's former fiancée,

1423
01:12:40,579 --> 01:12:44,219
ended up taking on her friend's
identity and powers.

1424
01:12:44,299 --> 01:12:45,860
And Wolverine, for a few years,

1425
01:12:45,940 --> 01:12:47,940
took a back seat
to a female clone,

1426
01:12:48,020 --> 01:12:50,100
his biological daughter
of sorts.

1427
01:12:50,179 --> 01:12:56,259
Sometimes,
a character takes the mantle

1428
01:12:56,339 --> 01:12:58,219
of another superhero.

1429
01:12:58,299 --> 01:13:00,020
We have seen it in Thor.

1430
01:13:00,100 --> 01:13:02,740
We have seen it in Wolverine.

1431
01:13:03,539 --> 01:13:05,820
The point is that,

1432
01:13:05,900 --> 01:13:11,299
lately,
there's a reactionary movement

1433
01:13:11,379 --> 01:13:15,780
against women becoming powerful,

1434
01:13:15,860 --> 01:13:20,100
having their part of power,
the part they deserve.

1435
01:13:21,299 --> 01:13:22,539
And they get angry

1436
01:13:22,620 --> 01:13:26,780
because now Wolverine can be
a woman for a while.

1437
01:13:26,860 --> 01:13:30,339
But they didn't complain
when Thor was a frog.

1438
01:13:30,419 --> 01:13:32,660
And Thor was a frog
for some time,

1439
01:13:32,740 --> 01:13:35,020
and nobody cared about that!

1440
01:13:35,100 --> 01:13:40,980
I think it's OK as long
as the story is a good story.

1441
01:13:41,060 --> 01:13:44,020
And All-New Wolverine
was a good story.

1442
01:13:44,100 --> 01:13:45,419
I think that

1443
01:13:45,499 --> 01:13:51,980
the perfect image of superheroes
was readjusted over the years.

1444
01:13:52,060 --> 01:13:56,620
They began to be designed
as more human

1445
01:13:56,700 --> 01:13:58,060
in terms of appearance.

1446
01:13:58,139 --> 01:14:00,499
I remember Ms. Marvel.

1447
01:14:00,579 --> 01:14:01,660
As the years went by,

1448
01:14:01,740 --> 01:14:03,459
she was
completely revolutionized

1449
01:14:03,539 --> 01:14:09,820
to become closer to a concept
of someone we could meet

1450
01:14:09,900 --> 01:14:13,700
in our neighborhood, someone we
could meet at the supermarket.

1451
01:14:13,780 --> 01:14:15,900
And I think
that's a very beautiful thing.

1452
01:14:16,579 --> 01:14:19,980
Carol Danvers
abandoned the name Ms. Marvel

1453
01:14:20,060 --> 01:14:21,940
in order for her
to better become Captain,

1454
01:14:22,020 --> 01:14:23,299
and the Ms. Marvel identity

1455
01:14:23,379 --> 01:14:25,339
was attributed
to a young, modern heiress

1456
01:14:25,419 --> 01:14:27,579
in Marvel's first regular series

1457
01:14:27,660 --> 01:14:30,060
with a Muslim female
protagonist.

1458
01:14:30,139 --> 01:14:34,339
Ms. Marvel, Kamala Khan,
is really a small revolution.

1459
01:14:34,419 --> 01:14:35,740
She was even a big revolution

1460
01:14:35,820 --> 01:14:37,459
at the time
when she first appeared.

1461
01:14:37,539 --> 01:14:38,860
She was everywhere.

1462
01:14:38,940 --> 01:14:41,499
It was amazing to see a new
generation of heroines arrive

1463
01:14:41,579 --> 01:14:44,940
and represent a new generation
of female readers too.

1464
01:14:45,020 --> 01:14:47,900
She's a young Pakistani
and Muslim girl,

1465
01:14:47,980 --> 01:14:51,980
created by two Muslim women.

1466
01:14:52,060 --> 01:14:55,499
At the time, when she appeared
in the Marvel world,

1467
01:14:55,579 --> 01:14:56,900
it was a small revolution,

1468
01:14:56,980 --> 01:15:00,299
not only because her character
didn't exist before that point,

1469
01:15:00,379 --> 01:15:03,700
but also because she reached
a new readership.

1470
01:15:03,780 --> 01:15:06,539
Other people,
other female readers,

1471
01:15:06,620 --> 01:15:09,900
began to take an interest
in this type of heroine,

1472
01:15:09,980 --> 01:15:12,259
and it really revolutionized,
in a way,

1473
01:15:12,339 --> 01:15:14,060
the comic's readership
at the time.

1474
01:15:14,139 --> 01:15:16,940
Maybe a Muslim girl
might find herself

1475
01:15:18,100 --> 01:15:20,259
sharing stories of Ms. Marvel

1476
01:15:20,339 --> 01:15:23,539
more than sharing stories
about Captain America and stuff.

1477
01:15:23,620 --> 01:15:25,459
But I think...

1478
01:15:25,539 --> 01:15:28,980
I like the growth, but it should
only be the beginning.

1479
01:15:38,900 --> 01:15:41,620
Diversity can be
achieved at any level.

1480
01:15:41,700 --> 01:15:45,740
There is room for heroines such
as Kamala Khan or Squirrel Girl,

1481
01:15:45,820 --> 01:15:48,940
but also for more cynical
female characters

1482
01:15:49,020 --> 01:15:52,100
marked by life,
such as Jessica Jones.

1483
01:15:52,179 --> 01:15:56,940
Jessica Jones is superheroine
meets American film detective.

1484
01:15:57,020 --> 01:16:01,139
To me, she's really
a true-fake superheroine.

1485
01:16:01,219 --> 01:16:04,740
She's a heroine adapted
from a comic for Netflix,

1486
01:16:04,820 --> 01:16:07,139
but she's been adapted
by a woman

1487
01:16:07,219 --> 01:16:11,020
who has, to my mind,
brought new balance to things

1488
01:16:11,100 --> 01:16:12,299
compared to the comics.

1489
01:16:12,379 --> 01:16:14,379
A woman who has changed
a few things.

1490
01:16:14,459 --> 01:16:16,379
She doesn't wear a sexy costume
in the series.

1491
01:16:16,459 --> 01:16:18,539
She won't smile,

1492
01:16:18,620 --> 01:16:22,219
and so, she's actually
an anti-supergirl.

1493
01:16:22,299 --> 01:16:23,339
In Jessica Jones,

1494
01:16:23,419 --> 01:16:25,860
the first bad guy
sent against her is Kilgrave,

1495
01:16:25,940 --> 01:16:29,379
a man who invades her thoughts
and forces her to do things.

1496
01:16:29,459 --> 01:16:34,060
And even if it's not
very explicit in the series,

1497
01:16:34,139 --> 01:16:36,740
it seems that Kilgrave raped
and assaulted Jessica Jones

1498
01:16:36,820 --> 01:16:38,539
before we meet her
in the series.

1499
01:16:38,620 --> 01:16:41,419
So, Jessica Jones is a very
modern series and character

1500
01:16:41,499 --> 01:16:43,539
because if she raises
the issue of consent,

1501
01:16:43,620 --> 01:16:45,860
she raises the issue of rape.

1502
01:16:45,940 --> 01:16:50,100
What Kilgrave forces her to do
is smile.

1503
01:16:50,179 --> 01:16:51,740
He tells her, "Smile."

1504
01:16:51,820 --> 01:16:56,299
as Jessica Jones' smile
is a mark of her submission.

1505
01:16:56,379 --> 01:16:59,020
It's why she refuses to smile

1506
01:16:59,100 --> 01:17:00,579
for a very long time
in the series

1507
01:17:00,660 --> 01:17:04,499
and it's why, for her, smiling
is a form of domination.

1508
01:17:04,579 --> 01:17:06,139
Be it in the movies
or in real life,

1509
01:17:06,219 --> 01:17:08,620
there's always this thing
about women having to smile,

1510
01:17:08,700 --> 01:17:10,940
to be nice, to be cute.
Jessica Jones rejects all that.

1511
01:17:14,700 --> 01:17:17,179
At the end
of our trip, it is clear

1512
01:17:17,259 --> 01:17:20,860
that 80 years after Miss Fury
and Wonder Woman were created,

1513
01:17:20,940 --> 01:17:23,579
superheroines have become
a phenomenon

1514
01:17:23,660 --> 01:17:26,020
representing many profiles
of women.

1515
01:17:26,100 --> 01:17:28,100
A female comic book artist
in San Francisco

1516
01:17:28,179 --> 01:17:29,980
now speaks
much the same language

1517
01:17:30,060 --> 01:17:32,700
as other female artists
in Rome or Toulouse.

1518
01:17:32,780 --> 01:17:35,139
New heroines
are created every month

1519
01:17:35,219 --> 01:17:36,940
and are gradually helping
to make up

1520
01:17:37,020 --> 01:17:38,299
for decades of lost time.

1521
01:17:38,379 --> 01:17:40,820
As long as injustice remains,

1522
01:17:40,900 --> 01:17:42,740
superwomen will be there
to fight it.

1523
01:17:42,820 --> 01:17:47,259
Today, I think we are seeing
a reversing trend,

1524
01:17:47,339 --> 01:17:49,499
and we now have
interesting heroines.

1525
01:17:49,579 --> 01:17:50,700
We started off

1526
01:17:50,780 --> 01:17:53,539
with more female customers
than male customers here,

1527
01:17:53,620 --> 01:17:56,219
from 2017.

1528
01:17:56,299 --> 01:17:59,539
Whatever the direction
comics were going,

1529
01:18:00,740 --> 01:18:05,940
we were benefitting from
it being more open to others.

1530
01:18:06,020 --> 01:18:09,419
I think the representation
of women in comics,

1531
01:18:09,499 --> 01:18:12,499
both in the stories
as characters and as creators,

1532
01:18:12,579 --> 01:18:16,339
has been problematic in the past

1533
01:18:16,419 --> 01:18:18,539
but it's getting
better and better.

1534
01:18:18,620 --> 01:18:21,620
The reader is not
the traditional male reader.

1535
01:18:21,700 --> 01:18:25,419
The fanbase really shifted
in the last ten years.

1536
01:18:26,459 --> 01:18:31,060
I think around 2009, 2010,

1537
01:18:31,139 --> 01:18:35,740
there was a definite shift
in the fanbase

1538
01:18:35,820 --> 01:18:39,700
towards a more
female-dominated group.

1539
01:18:39,780 --> 01:18:41,700
We are not an exception.

1540
01:18:41,780 --> 01:18:46,259
I am convinced that a great many
of us in the world read comics.

1541
01:18:46,339 --> 01:18:50,900
We realize that the girls
can save the day for the guys,

1542
01:18:50,980 --> 01:18:53,419
that they can succeed in
finding the necessary solution

1543
01:18:53,499 --> 01:18:55,339
to solving one problem
or another.

1544
01:18:55,419 --> 01:18:57,900
Today we have our place
in comics and that's beautiful.

1545
01:18:57,980 --> 01:19:01,860
It's nice to see girls and
superheroines finally come along

1546
01:19:01,940 --> 01:19:05,179
and prove that
they're just as strong as men.

1547
01:19:05,259 --> 01:19:06,620
That does feel good.

1548
01:19:06,700 --> 01:19:08,259
There are
a lot of female writers,

1549
01:19:08,339 --> 01:19:11,620
a lot of female artists,
a lot of female editors.

1550
01:19:11,700 --> 01:19:15,299
The era of Supergirl, Catwoman,
Elektra characters,

1551
01:19:15,379 --> 01:19:18,860
who were box office duds,
is over.

1552
01:19:18,940 --> 01:19:21,259
Now, money can be made
with superwomen,

1553
01:19:21,339 --> 01:19:25,820
and I think that's helping
to start new projects

1554
01:19:25,900 --> 01:19:27,339
with such characters.

1555
01:19:27,419 --> 01:19:29,379
There's a huge female audience

1556
01:19:29,459 --> 01:19:31,459
and so, I think
that's really exciting.

1557
01:19:31,539 --> 01:19:32,820
It's make comics better.

1558
01:19:32,900 --> 01:19:36,259
We're in an era where the girls
are taking their place.

1559
01:19:36,339 --> 01:19:40,700
They will be our kids' heroes.

1560
01:19:40,780 --> 01:19:44,780
I think there is a wide variety
of superheroes

1561
01:19:44,860 --> 01:19:49,780
of different races, and ages,
and genders,

1562
01:19:49,860 --> 01:19:51,860
but it is only the beginning,
I think.

1563
01:19:53,020 --> 01:19:54,900
Superheroines of tomorrow

1564
01:19:54,980 --> 01:19:57,740
will be invented by young
female readers of today,

1565
01:19:57,820 --> 01:20:00,179
just as Trina Robbins
or Nicola Scott

1566
01:20:00,259 --> 01:20:03,700
once admired these characters
before starting to draw them.

1567
01:20:04,740 --> 01:20:07,299
Today, young girls in turn
are passionately interested

1568
01:20:07,379 --> 01:20:09,060
in Wonder Woman
and Captain Marvel.

1569
01:20:09,139 --> 01:20:11,539
They will be the ones to carry
the torch into the future.

1570
01:20:12,419 --> 01:20:15,459
The reign of superwomen
is far from over!