1 00:00:49,571 --> 00:00:52,330 The characters in the story... 2 00:00:52,810 --> 00:00:56,411 ...Yann Lem�e, alias Yann Andr�a... 3 00:00:56,611 --> 00:00:58,090 ...Mich�le Manceaux, writer... 4 00:00:58,130 --> 00:01:01,211 ...journalist, columnist in Marie Claire... 5 00:01:01,251 --> 00:01:06,371 ...Marguerite Duras, famous writer and filmmaker. 6 00:01:06,731 --> 00:01:09,690 7 00:01:09,971 --> 00:01:13,611 of my first love 8 00:01:13,771 --> 00:01:16,530 9 00:01:17,130 --> 00:01:20,490 10 00:01:23,452 --> 00:01:25,491 11 00:01:26,970 --> 00:01:29,451 12 00:01:30,611 --> 00:01:32,770 13 00:01:34,050 --> 00:01:36,371 14 00:01:37,730 --> 00:01:39,771 15 00:01:41,212 --> 00:01:43,331 16 00:01:44,851 --> 00:01:47,051 17 00:01:48,210 --> 00:01:50,531 18 00:01:52,851 --> 00:01:55,731 19 00:01:56,130 --> 00:01:59,771 of my first love 20 00:01:59,931 --> 00:02:02,611 21 00:02:03,051 --> 00:02:06,210 22 00:02:06,771 --> 00:02:09,770 23 00:02:10,010 --> 00:02:13,650 of my first love 24 00:02:13,821 --> 00:02:16,584 25 00:02:17,010 --> 00:02:20,371 26 00:02:44,310 --> 00:02:49,250 I WANT TO TALK ABOUT HARD 27 00:03:42,010 --> 00:03:44,450 Let's do the interview what you asked me for 28 00:03:44,609 --> 00:03:47,450 With Marguerite, who I saw downstairs. 29 00:03:48,210 --> 00:03:50,490 - She looks very good. - �La showed? 30 00:03:50,650 --> 00:03:53,411 I wanted to bring me a coffee, but I told him no: 31 00:03:53,571 --> 00:03:56,250 "I already took one. Thank you, Marguerite." 32 00:03:57,490 --> 00:03:59,850 - I hope it doesn't go up. - No... 33 00:04:05,370 --> 00:04:07,730 Let's do the interview What you asked me for. 34 00:04:08,129 --> 00:04:10,731 With Marguerite, who I saw below. 35 00:04:11,650 --> 00:04:13,930 - She looks very good. - �La showed? 36 00:04:25,529 --> 00:04:27,050 December 2... 37 00:04:28,490 --> 00:04:30,291 ...1982. 38 00:04:33,090 --> 00:04:35,930 - I would like to talk about Duras. - Yes. 39 00:04:37,810 --> 00:04:40,450 But it's such a big thing... 40 00:04:41,609 --> 00:04:43,570 Almost like madness... 41 00:04:43,930 --> 00:04:45,730 I don't know where to start. 42 00:04:45,891 --> 00:04:48,971 How to approach the character... Duras? 43 00:04:50,171 --> 00:04:52,610 Maybe because of your fascination... 44 00:04:54,531 --> 00:04:55,611 Yes. 45 00:04:56,129 --> 00:04:58,250 It will begin with our meeting. 46 00:04:58,610 --> 00:04:59,810 Very good. 47 00:05:02,289 --> 00:05:04,170 It was many years ago. I had... 48 00:05:04,331 --> 00:05:06,890 I don't know... like 22 years. 49 00:05:08,410 --> 00:05:12,850 Where I lived, there was a copy of The Little Horses of Tarquinia. 50 00:05:13,010 --> 00:05:15,450 It belonged to a girl who had lived there. 51 00:05:16,410 --> 00:05:18,249 And he read it. 52 00:05:19,929 --> 00:05:22,409 Immediately this text... 53 00:05:23,251 --> 00:05:25,050 ...it completely captivated me. 54 00:05:27,651 --> 00:05:31,250 Three days later, I had a Campari Bitter in a cafe. 55 00:05:32,970 --> 00:05:36,850 I was in Caen, a Campari Bitter was not very common. 56 00:05:41,610 --> 00:05:43,450 Afterwards, I read all his work. 57 00:05:45,051 --> 00:05:48,010 To such a degree that I only read it to her. 58 00:05:49,010 --> 00:05:51,170 I studied philosophy. 59 00:05:51,770 --> 00:05:54,610 I abandoned everything to read all his books. 60 00:05:55,650 --> 00:05:58,769 I even felt that the author was present. 61 00:05:59,369 --> 00:06:02,369 Curious because I didn't know her at all. 62 00:06:03,370 --> 00:06:09,130 No one - not a friend or teacher - He had told me to read Duras. 63 00:06:09,730 --> 00:06:11,249 It was just like that. 64 00:06:11,650 --> 00:06:14,489 I took the book and I immediately got involved. 65 00:06:31,209 --> 00:06:33,370 I'm 30 years old... almost. 66 00:06:33,730 --> 00:06:35,769 I was 21 or 22 then. 67 00:06:37,050 --> 00:06:39,411 So it was 7 or 8 years ago. 68 00:06:39,730 --> 00:06:42,809 The incredible thing is that it has never stopped. 69 00:06:43,370 --> 00:06:44,810 It has never stopped. 70 00:06:46,410 --> 00:06:51,490 On the contrary, I was creating a vacuum of reading around me, little by little... 71 00:06:51,650 --> 00:06:54,089 ...because it seemed to me... it seems to me... 72 00:06:55,170 --> 00:06:56,691 ...there was nothing else. 73 00:06:56,931 --> 00:06:58,370 Than those texts. 74 00:06:59,930 --> 00:07:03,650 I could only read a few pages, They were overwhelming. 75 00:07:05,890 --> 00:07:08,530 And I didn't want to meet her. Not at all. 76 00:07:12,650 --> 00:07:14,690 I was studying in Caen... 77 00:07:15,689 --> 00:07:17,090 ...in Normandy. 78 00:07:26,649 --> 00:07:30,370 Then he came out India Song. I saw it like 10 times. 79 00:07:30,530 --> 00:07:34,690 The event for me It was that Duras was going to come to Caen. 80 00:07:36,290 --> 00:07:37,610 And I was there. 81 00:07:38,570 --> 00:07:42,569 I attended the debate. I couldn't say anything, scared to death. 82 00:07:43,889 --> 00:07:47,009 At the end, there was a question session... 83 00:07:47,176 --> 00:07:49,216 ...and I ended up making one. 84 00:07:51,010 --> 00:07:52,499 Do you remember the question? 85 00:07:53,450 --> 00:07:55,769 It wasn't really a question. 86 00:07:56,890 --> 00:08:01,569 I wanted to say that I had not understood India Song's final plan... 87 00:08:01,730 --> 00:08:04,329 ...on the geography map. 88 00:08:05,649 --> 00:08:08,409 And suddenly, I said: 89 00:08:08,571 --> 00:08:14,170 "I understand. It's the same way of filming the remains of Anne-Marie Stretter"... 90 00:08:14,730 --> 00:08:18,329 ..."passing the camera through the wig, the jewelry, the dress." 91 00:08:18,490 --> 00:08:21,849 "It's the same way he films the map of Asia." 92 00:08:22,649 --> 00:08:24,809 She said, "Yes, you're right." 93 00:08:26,809 --> 00:08:28,289 I was delighted. 94 00:08:28,450 --> 00:08:30,010 And very self-conscious. 95 00:08:32,529 --> 00:08:34,409 I wanted to buy her flowers. 96 00:08:35,410 --> 00:08:36,890 Someone told me: "No..." 97 00:08:37,049 --> 00:08:40,809 "It's not done. Don't be ridiculous. It's Hard, please! 98 00:08:40,970 --> 00:08:42,410 Don't do it." 99 00:08:43,010 --> 00:08:44,468 And I didn't do it. 100 00:08:47,130 --> 00:08:50,450 But I wanted to distinguish myself, you know? 101 00:08:52,409 --> 00:08:56,529 He had a copy in his bag. Destroy, he says. 102 00:08:59,249 --> 00:09:01,048 Destroy, it says... 103 00:09:07,450 --> 00:09:11,609 At the end of the debate, There was no one there and she was already leaving. 104 00:09:11,769 --> 00:09:14,769 I asked him for an autograph. 105 00:09:14,969 --> 00:09:16,489 I signed my book. 106 00:09:17,608 --> 00:09:20,810 I told him if I could write to him to the publishing house. 107 00:09:21,649 --> 00:09:25,610 He said, "No, write to me at home: 5 rue Saint-Beno�t". 108 00:09:26,770 --> 00:09:29,409 It left me stunned to give me his address. 109 00:09:31,130 --> 00:09:34,889 Try to explore every detail in your memory 110 00:09:37,250 --> 00:09:41,009 The physical impression what it caused in you and things like that. 111 00:09:42,810 --> 00:09:45,729 - Am I interrupting too much? - No. 112 00:09:45,890 --> 00:09:47,249 Tell me if I do. 113 00:09:49,809 --> 00:09:52,009 The physical impression was... 114 00:09:52,769 --> 00:09:55,849 suddenly, when the lights came on... 115 00:09:56,008 --> 00:09:59,049 ...and it appeared next to the interviewer... 116 00:09:59,610 --> 00:10:01,730 ...it was as if she had written it. 117 00:10:02,369 --> 00:10:04,690 She is the one he had lived with. 118 00:10:04,850 --> 00:10:08,809 He was wearing his leather jacket, her plaid skirt... 119 00:10:08,969 --> 00:10:11,009 ...rings and bracelets. 120 00:10:11,169 --> 00:10:13,408 I saw her bracelets and rings a lot. 121 00:10:13,929 --> 00:10:15,129 It was her. 122 00:10:17,248 --> 00:10:18,770 And his voice... 123 00:10:19,010 --> 00:10:21,250 I discovered that voice. 124 00:10:22,689 --> 00:10:26,369 As soon as he started to speak, The silence was total. 125 00:10:27,170 --> 00:10:29,488 Someone said, "Duras is here." 126 00:10:29,649 --> 00:10:31,369 I answered: "Yes, here I am." 127 00:10:31,649 --> 00:10:35,809 "I'm Marguerite Duras, I made this film. "Ask anything." 128 00:10:37,490 --> 00:10:40,169 "If there are no questions, I will leave." "It doesn't matter." 129 00:10:40,729 --> 00:10:43,289 Imagine a silence of five minutes. 130 00:10:47,209 --> 00:10:48,849 And now I feel... 131 00:10:49,009 --> 00:10:51,608 ...that she knew. 132 00:10:52,369 --> 00:10:54,289 I feel like he had seen me. 133 00:10:55,450 --> 00:10:57,329 And then, in the cafe? 134 00:10:59,609 --> 00:11:02,689 My annoyance, now I know, They were the others. 135 00:11:03,449 --> 00:11:07,328 That there were 10 people. I wanted her just for myself. 136 00:11:07,489 --> 00:11:08,689 Just for you? 137 00:11:10,449 --> 00:11:14,330 After that day, of course, I wrote to him very often. 138 00:11:15,729 --> 00:11:20,489 The first letter was very clumsy, I think. 139 00:11:21,009 --> 00:11:24,649 "I love her, and I would love to meet her. 140 00:11:25,609 --> 00:11:30,008 But at the same time I don't know. "I don't want to ruin things." 141 00:11:31,649 --> 00:11:35,089 He answered me exactly a year later, telling me: 142 00:11:36,169 --> 00:11:40,208 "I read your letter again. I can't answer. It's your decision. 143 00:11:41,248 --> 00:11:44,289 I'm not the one who can decide if you must know me." 144 00:11:44,849 --> 00:11:48,248 He said: "I can't give an answer to your question." 145 00:11:50,929 --> 00:11:53,809 Then I thought that it was not worth knowing her. 146 00:11:54,770 --> 00:11:59,329 I really wanted, but I knew it wasn't worth it. 147 00:12:02,008 --> 00:12:05,089 I wrote every time I read one of his books. 148 00:12:06,049 --> 00:12:09,489 I wrote to her. My letters were very simple. 149 00:12:09,649 --> 00:12:11,889 I always ended up writing: 150 00:12:12,449 --> 00:12:13,689 "I love her." 151 00:12:14,368 --> 00:12:17,689 I took fragments from his books and he sent them to them. 152 00:12:19,369 --> 00:12:22,168 He never responded. I didn't expect an answer. 153 00:12:23,449 --> 00:12:25,888 - Can I ask you something? - Yes. 154 00:12:26,048 --> 00:12:29,249 I don't know if I should ask you questions or not. 155 00:12:29,769 --> 00:12:33,929 Can you tell me about your life? sentimental of that time? 156 00:12:34,569 --> 00:12:38,128 Could you share what did you feel for her, with others? 157 00:12:38,289 --> 00:12:41,248 Who could you love physically? 158 00:12:43,369 --> 00:12:48,369 Yes, I shared the passion I felt with the girl he lived with. 159 00:12:49,266 --> 00:12:54,088 Our evenings used to end with a whiskey and reading Duras. 160 00:12:56,128 --> 00:13:00,488 Then this girl, B�n�dicte, He did a master's degree on Duras. 161 00:13:00,649 --> 00:13:03,808 The people he frequented He admired Duras too. 162 00:13:05,209 --> 00:13:08,689 They liked Duras, but they also admired other things. 163 00:13:08,848 --> 00:13:11,929 - Did you love B�n�dicte, too? - Clear. 164 00:13:37,688 --> 00:13:41,210 The love he had for her was lived... 165 00:13:43,489 --> 00:13:45,249 ...in time. 166 00:13:48,409 --> 00:13:51,009 One does not think It's going to end, but... 167 00:13:51,169 --> 00:13:54,048 ...you live in time. That was the difference. 168 00:13:59,769 --> 00:14:05,128 My relationship with Duras, with her texts, with her... 169 00:14:05,288 --> 00:14:07,048 ...it was a complete love. 170 00:14:08,248 --> 00:14:10,648 It was eternity. 171 00:14:11,168 --> 00:14:13,528 And it belonged to me completely. 172 00:14:14,888 --> 00:14:19,009 Do you want to tell me now, or maybe later... 173 00:14:19,169 --> 00:14:22,768 ...what touched you most deeply, in addition to his texts. 174 00:14:24,169 --> 00:14:26,968 What touched you the most? 175 00:14:28,928 --> 00:14:32,247 I never analyzed what affected me, what moves me 176 00:14:32,408 --> 00:14:34,328 You have to speak in the present. 177 00:14:35,608 --> 00:14:38,569 Probably the dimension of time... 178 00:14:40,048 --> 00:14:41,809 ...and that of death. 179 00:14:42,129 --> 00:14:43,448 Passion, right? 180 00:14:45,728 --> 00:14:47,649 Yes, of course, the passion, but... 181 00:14:48,327 --> 00:14:52,528 Yes, the passion, but she who is struck by death... 182 00:14:52,888 --> 00:14:54,368 ...as if struck down. 183 00:15:01,489 --> 00:15:03,649 Immediately, I said to myself: 184 00:15:04,168 --> 00:15:05,808 "This is the truth." 185 00:15:06,008 --> 00:15:09,688 "The truth of passion, the truth of love... 186 00:15:09,848 --> 00:15:11,247 ...is death." 187 00:15:13,288 --> 00:15:17,128 Anne-Marie Stretter's love for... 188 00:15:17,488 --> 00:15:18,968 What is it called? It left me... 189 00:15:19,129 --> 00:15:22,088 That love that destroys everything... 190 00:15:22,768 --> 00:15:24,528 ...that destroys someone too. 191 00:15:25,969 --> 00:15:28,208 Nothing can be, love does not exist... 192 00:15:28,368 --> 00:15:31,248 ...without the destruction of someone, without death. 193 00:15:32,568 --> 00:15:36,328 What you say is very important. Do you realize? 194 00:15:40,088 --> 00:15:43,848 The vision I had of India Song where people are... 195 00:15:44,007 --> 00:15:47,848 ...like funeral celebrations, I don't know how to say it... 196 00:15:48,288 --> 00:15:49,849 Dead people. 197 00:15:52,168 --> 00:15:54,928 I felt like it was exactly that... 198 00:15:55,088 --> 00:15:57,769 ...perfectly correct, what life was. 199 00:15:58,328 --> 00:16:00,048 But dead life. 200 00:16:00,488 --> 00:16:01,968 Life recreated. 201 00:17:01,567 --> 00:17:04,929 - The vice-consul of France in Lahore. - Yes. 202 00:17:06,169 --> 00:17:08,568 Displaced in disgrace to Calcutta. 203 00:17:54,048 --> 00:17:56,048 �Have you returned to the park? 204 00:17:56,887 --> 00:17:58,087 Yes�. 205 00:17:59,329 --> 00:18:01,608 He comes every night. 206 00:18:08,208 --> 00:18:11,888 A world a little dead but totally passionate... 207 00:18:12,328 --> 00:18:14,247 ...that I saw struck down... 208 00:18:15,648 --> 00:18:17,768 ...that's what it meant to me. 209 00:18:20,007 --> 00:18:21,568 A total failure. 210 00:18:22,968 --> 00:18:24,408 A failure. 211 00:18:30,247 --> 00:18:33,927 Well, we were talking about the moment where you were going to see her. 212 00:18:35,126 --> 00:18:36,248 So... 213 00:18:37,048 --> 00:18:39,368 Maybe it's too soon, I don't know. 214 00:18:40,368 --> 00:18:41,568 Yes. 215 00:18:43,128 --> 00:18:45,208 He wrote very often. 216 00:18:45,887 --> 00:18:47,688 Many letters that I did not send. 217 00:18:48,567 --> 00:18:49,968 There was never a response. 218 00:18:50,127 --> 00:18:53,007 And one fine day, I received a letter. 219 00:18:53,967 --> 00:18:55,969 It said: "I was sick." 220 00:18:56,809 --> 00:18:59,607 I think it was February or March 1980. 221 00:18:59,888 --> 00:19:01,648 He said: 222 00:19:01,808 --> 00:19:03,888 "I think about you a lot." 223 00:19:05,047 --> 00:19:07,287 "Your letters are wonderful." 224 00:19:09,327 --> 00:19:13,048 Come on, you have to say what you feel. 225 00:19:13,328 --> 00:19:14,768 Yes. 226 00:19:15,048 --> 00:19:19,127 Don't be afraid to say something naive or very sensitive. 227 00:19:19,287 --> 00:19:20,647 Go for it. 228 00:19:23,448 --> 00:19:25,727 Your letter moved me. 229 00:19:26,207 --> 00:19:29,208 On the one hand, I knew I was part of his life. 230 00:19:29,688 --> 00:19:31,928 Then I was able to corroborate it... 231 00:19:32,088 --> 00:19:34,648 ...I had all my cards in a drawer. 232 00:19:36,127 --> 00:19:40,167 while I thought be the only one feeling this passion... 233 00:19:40,527 --> 00:19:45,048 ...with the letter received six years ago Suddenly, I realized... 234 00:19:45,207 --> 00:19:48,127 ...that this passion was reciprocal... 235 00:19:49,286 --> 00:19:52,208 She also, in a way, I shared it. 236 00:19:55,128 --> 00:19:58,367 So I wrote back... 237 00:19:58,527 --> 00:20:01,527 Crazy to have received such a letter. 238 00:20:02,647 --> 00:20:05,606 I knew he was in Trouville. One day, he called her. 239 00:20:05,967 --> 00:20:07,607 Had he given you his number? 240 00:20:07,767 --> 00:20:10,848 No, I had not given his number or anything like that. 241 00:20:11,648 --> 00:20:13,888 It was easy to find his number. 242 00:20:15,487 --> 00:20:18,768 He always said he wasn't there in the directory. 243 00:20:19,568 --> 00:20:23,727 I found out that Duras was not his last name. I was very excited. 244 00:20:24,007 --> 00:20:25,287 Explain yourself. 245 00:20:25,487 --> 00:20:28,568 For me, Duras was Duras. 246 00:20:30,608 --> 00:20:33,288 It couldn't be called anything else. 247 00:20:34,008 --> 00:20:39,327 A friend said: "His name is not Duras. "It's his pseudonym. It's Donnadieu." 248 00:20:41,247 --> 00:20:42,726 It was a drama! 249 00:20:44,447 --> 00:20:47,807 His name was so real to me. 250 00:20:48,087 --> 00:20:50,407 And suddenly I discovered that it was false. 251 00:20:51,327 --> 00:20:55,207 It was fiction because it had a pseudonym. 252 00:20:55,807 --> 00:20:57,528 I panicked. 253 00:20:57,687 --> 00:20:59,927 Fact, fiction... 254 00:21:00,086 --> 00:21:01,927 I wanted to forget about all that. 255 00:21:02,967 --> 00:21:05,527 But thanks to that, I had his phone. 256 00:21:06,247 --> 00:21:11,247 I called her. Someone answered: "He's not here. He went to the field." 257 00:21:12,727 --> 00:21:16,607 I lied when he told me: "Do you have the number?" 258 00:21:16,766 --> 00:21:20,407 "Sure, but not with me. "Can you give it to me again?" 259 00:21:20,567 --> 00:21:22,848 And so I could have his phone. 260 00:21:24,248 --> 00:21:25,767 And I called her here. 261 00:21:26,447 --> 00:21:27,887 In Neauphle. 262 00:21:29,447 --> 00:21:32,527 Immediately, I began to hesitate. 263 00:21:32,846 --> 00:21:34,646 I said, "I'm Yann." 264 00:21:35,087 --> 00:21:38,966 She said, "Gosh." I was very... 265 00:21:39,606 --> 00:21:42,608 He started talking about thousands of things. 266 00:21:44,847 --> 00:21:47,847 The phone bill was huge! 267 00:21:48,007 --> 00:21:50,287 He didn't have much money. 268 00:21:51,247 --> 00:21:54,566 That's why I started calling her on the phone. 269 00:21:56,046 --> 00:21:59,007 Do you remember what she told you? 270 00:22:00,007 --> 00:22:01,287 Yes. 271 00:22:02,208 --> 00:22:05,007 Told me: "You're the one who writes to me. It's great." 272 00:22:05,726 --> 00:22:09,767 It was the summer of 1980, when he wrote for Lib�ration. 273 00:22:09,927 --> 00:22:14,647 I told him it was very good. I didn't know what to say since it disturbed me... 274 00:22:14,807 --> 00:22:16,806 ...hear your voice on the phone. 275 00:22:24,287 --> 00:22:26,568 What caught my attention is that he laughed. 276 00:22:30,007 --> 00:22:32,647 I couldn't imagine Duras laughing. 277 00:22:33,646 --> 00:22:36,727 And suddenly, he started laughing. 278 00:22:37,407 --> 00:22:39,326 I don't even know what. 279 00:22:40,207 --> 00:22:43,886 But I said to myself: "He looks 18 years old." 280 00:22:44,807 --> 00:22:47,126 It was very touching. 281 00:22:55,447 --> 00:22:58,007 We talked and he told me: 282 00:22:59,167 --> 00:23:00,215 "I'm going back to Trouville." 283 00:23:00,288 --> 00:23:02,287 "Don't stop calling me." 284 00:23:04,247 --> 00:23:06,566 At the end of the month, I called her. 285 00:23:07,566 --> 00:23:10,367 He told me: "Come to Trouville. We will try to see each other." 286 00:24:13,646 --> 00:24:15,967 It was complicated, I called her once... 287 00:24:16,127 --> 00:24:19,526 ...he told me: "No, I'm working. I'm afraid to see it... 288 00:24:19,686 --> 00:24:23,566 ...see new people. I don't know, maybe we shouldn't see each other." 289 00:24:23,725 --> 00:24:25,326 "Maybe it's not worth it." 290 00:24:26,727 --> 00:24:32,407 I told him: "It's true, It may not be worth it, but I'm here." 291 00:24:32,567 --> 00:24:34,167 Here I am. 292 00:24:35,246 --> 00:24:39,247 He told me: "Call me in two hours." So I called her. 293 00:24:39,686 --> 00:24:42,646 He told me: "Come on, but with a bottle of wine." 294 00:24:44,126 --> 00:24:48,326 I brought a bottle of wine to the Les Roches Noires hotel. 295 00:24:55,207 --> 00:24:57,126 When I arrived, he kissed me. 296 00:25:00,767 --> 00:25:02,326 With great tenderness. 297 00:25:04,166 --> 00:25:06,567 I immediately felt something. 298 00:25:08,606 --> 00:25:10,766 I never thought he would kiss me. 299 00:25:11,327 --> 00:25:15,606 But it was as if he had six years knowing me. 300 00:25:15,766 --> 00:25:18,566 I had been writing to him for six or seven years. 301 00:25:19,206 --> 00:25:22,807 It was like a friend arrived. Maybe not a friend... 302 00:25:23,567 --> 00:25:26,726 And we started talking about his books. 303 00:25:27,647 --> 00:25:29,407 And I stayed. 304 00:25:30,806 --> 00:25:34,926 I think you have more to say. 305 00:25:35,566 --> 00:25:38,806 - Because you said "like a friend." - No... 306 00:25:38,966 --> 00:25:41,406 - No. - I don't know, but... 307 00:25:42,846 --> 00:25:44,567 You have to give details. 308 00:25:50,486 --> 00:25:52,566 I have to explain. 309 00:25:58,006 --> 00:26:01,166 I can say that someone that I knew by name... 310 00:26:01,327 --> 00:26:04,606 ...someone who was a passion for me... 311 00:26:05,766 --> 00:26:07,607 I could see her live. 312 00:26:08,646 --> 00:26:11,126 And I said to myself: 313 00:26:11,286 --> 00:26:15,406 "Not only is he great in his books... 314 00:26:15,565 --> 00:26:17,207 ...it's great and that's it. 315 00:26:17,606 --> 00:26:19,087 "It's great." 316 00:26:21,566 --> 00:26:25,285 Suddenly, in my mind it happened, of fiction... 317 00:26:25,446 --> 00:26:27,446 ...to her, you understand? 318 00:26:29,846 --> 00:26:35,286 And at the same time, I was still enthusiastic, delighted... 319 00:26:35,447 --> 00:26:37,806 ...for his texts. Captivated... 320 00:26:37,967 --> 00:26:40,327 For years he didn't abandon me. 321 00:26:41,447 --> 00:26:45,046 In the same way, She captivated me. 322 00:26:47,166 --> 00:26:50,046 I left my job, my apartment. 323 00:26:51,766 --> 00:26:53,285 And I stayed with her. 324 00:26:59,326 --> 00:27:03,446 And the relationship he had with his writings, this relationship... 325 00:27:03,606 --> 00:27:06,806 ...of domination he had over me, according to your texts... 326 00:27:06,966 --> 00:27:09,286 ...the imagination that imposed itself on me... 327 00:27:09,886 --> 00:27:12,125 Immediately life was like that. 328 00:27:13,207 --> 00:27:17,406 I was in a relationship of fascination, of admiration... 329 00:27:18,287 --> 00:27:20,046 ...and also... 330 00:27:20,486 --> 00:27:22,486 ...of domination. 331 00:27:23,046 --> 00:27:24,926 Are you talking about submission? 332 00:27:25,766 --> 00:27:27,965 Yes, of submission. 333 00:27:29,406 --> 00:27:33,966 Can you tell me more... You had this same emotion again. 334 00:27:34,247 --> 00:27:37,127 Do you think that being a woman did it have anything to do with it? 335 00:27:37,966 --> 00:27:39,966 You know, that's complicated. 336 00:27:40,126 --> 00:27:42,246 You decide if you say more or not. 337 00:27:42,407 --> 00:27:43,846 Whatever you want. 338 00:27:47,526 --> 00:27:51,006 I don't like the word submission. It's more like... 339 00:27:53,965 --> 00:27:55,326 ...acceptance. 340 00:27:56,166 --> 00:27:59,006 Accept that she... 341 00:28:03,806 --> 00:28:06,245 Well, their first meeting. 342 00:28:08,327 --> 00:28:09,727 Yes. 343 00:28:10,726 --> 00:28:12,006 We drank something. 344 00:28:12,806 --> 00:28:14,846 We talked for a long time. 345 00:28:15,246 --> 00:28:16,765 I told him: 346 00:28:16,925 --> 00:28:21,046 "I don't have a hotel. Everything is full in August in Trouville". 347 00:28:31,367 --> 00:28:34,566 He told me: "If you want you can stay here." 348 00:28:34,726 --> 00:28:36,206 "In my son's room." 349 00:28:36,966 --> 00:28:38,525 It's that simple, you see? 350 00:28:39,406 --> 00:28:42,085 I said yes and I stayed there. 351 00:28:54,486 --> 00:28:57,526 Suddenly, in the following days... 352 00:28:57,685 --> 00:28:59,206 ...maybe after a week... 353 00:28:59,365 --> 00:29:01,965 ...our relationship she became more tender... 354 00:29:02,445 --> 00:29:06,205 ...very affectionate, in a way, very affectionate. 355 00:29:08,046 --> 00:29:11,765 I always had the idea that she was a woman... 356 00:29:11,965 --> 00:29:13,765 ...but popularized by his work. 357 00:29:13,926 --> 00:29:17,445 I would never have spoken to him if it weren't for his books. 358 00:29:18,245 --> 00:29:21,446 That's how I am. I'm not attracted to women. 359 00:29:22,486 --> 00:29:24,566 Because of my homosexuality... 360 00:29:26,126 --> 00:29:28,726 There has to be fiction... 361 00:29:29,326 --> 00:29:32,766 ...mediated, so that women are accessible. 362 00:29:43,086 --> 00:29:45,125 I mean, it's not... 363 00:29:45,605 --> 00:29:49,606 ...that she was approachable, but he wanted to get closer to me. 364 00:29:50,805 --> 00:29:53,725 He fell in love with me almost immediately. 365 00:29:53,885 --> 00:29:56,685 And knowing that, feeling it... 366 00:29:56,844 --> 00:29:59,166 ...because I fell in love with her. 367 00:30:13,245 --> 00:30:16,405 I don't think we went to bed right away. 368 00:30:17,126 --> 00:30:21,166 For two weeks, I kissed her on the mouth. 369 00:30:21,326 --> 00:30:23,685 We slept in separate rooms. 370 00:30:26,566 --> 00:30:31,245 The relationship she wanted with me It was a woman's relationship. 371 00:30:31,405 --> 00:30:35,886 A woman in love with a man and that she wants to sleep with him. 372 00:30:36,526 --> 00:30:37,726 I... 373 00:30:38,526 --> 00:30:40,366 ...I was surprised. 374 00:30:41,086 --> 00:30:43,606 First, because I am homosexual. 375 00:30:43,765 --> 00:30:45,765 He had been with women, but... 376 00:30:46,485 --> 00:30:49,726 I am homosexual, I have problems with women... 377 00:30:49,885 --> 00:30:52,644 ...I never take the first step with them. 378 00:30:53,445 --> 00:30:56,086 It has to come from them. 379 00:30:57,766 --> 00:31:00,726 And also, what confused everything... 380 00:31:00,886 --> 00:31:03,685 ...everything got confused because of fiction. 381 00:31:04,565 --> 00:31:07,285 Hard, and suddenly, the woman. 382 00:31:08,645 --> 00:31:13,285 He imposed himself, he asked me that completely changed register. 383 00:31:13,805 --> 00:31:16,765 "I am not only a writer, "I am also a woman." 384 00:31:18,965 --> 00:31:20,565 It was overwhelming... 385 00:31:20,725 --> 00:31:24,165 ...carry the fictitious relationship what he had with her... 386 00:31:24,324 --> 00:31:26,605 ...towards a real love relationship. 387 00:31:26,885 --> 00:31:29,045 A physical love relationship. 388 00:31:31,246 --> 00:31:34,286 She was in love with me, and then I of her. 389 00:31:35,845 --> 00:31:37,205 In love... 390 00:31:37,445 --> 00:31:42,485 What happened when he asked you to really Would you consider her as a woman? 391 00:31:43,885 --> 00:31:45,166 I was afraid. 392 00:31:47,085 --> 00:31:49,206 Explain a little more. 393 00:31:50,566 --> 00:31:55,325 You were afraid of death Why was it passion? 394 00:31:56,166 --> 00:31:59,005 Were you afraid of not being able to love her? 395 00:32:03,965 --> 00:32:07,486 I'm always afraid of not being able to handle a woman. 396 00:32:10,085 --> 00:32:13,326 And with Marguerite, there was something more. 397 00:32:13,566 --> 00:32:16,165 I felt like the words invaded me. 398 00:32:17,045 --> 00:32:19,644 As if it were going to destroy me. 399 00:32:21,485 --> 00:32:26,926 As I have always had suicidal tendencies, I felt this impulse. 400 00:32:27,406 --> 00:32:30,046 This woman was going to take me with her. 401 00:32:31,085 --> 00:32:33,245 And in those moments, you... 402 00:32:34,325 --> 00:32:38,445 He had a double role with me. I'm exaggerating when I say this. 403 00:32:39,485 --> 00:32:45,366 A man's role. It was the one who spoke, He suggested everything, he spoke in my name. 404 00:32:46,806 --> 00:32:49,605 He gave the orders. He behaved like a master. 405 00:32:52,006 --> 00:32:57,045 And he's not even happy with being the master who decides for me... 406 00:32:57,565 --> 00:32:59,124 ...or all over the world. 407 00:32:59,404 --> 00:33:01,884 What do you think... that believe me 408 00:33:05,405 --> 00:33:06,805 One day, he told me: 409 00:33:07,325 --> 00:33:09,605 "I'm going to destroy you to create you again." 410 00:33:37,044 --> 00:33:38,604 At first it was like that. 411 00:33:56,524 --> 00:34:00,285 When I met Marguerite, I was very self-conscious. 412 00:34:00,685 --> 00:34:05,364 I discovered the free woman with his body that said: 413 00:34:05,532 --> 00:34:07,532 "I want to fuck. Take me." 414 00:34:08,285 --> 00:34:14,165 I got even more complex because his body asked for pleasure. 415 00:34:14,885 --> 00:34:19,205 That sexual freedom, in its maximum splendor... 416 00:34:19,366 --> 00:34:21,324 ...he passed it on to me. 417 00:34:21,605 --> 00:34:25,765 He put me in the role of the guy, saying: "Yes, you're a great guy." 418 00:34:26,245 --> 00:34:29,805 discover that, It's a fantastic recognition, isn't it? 419 00:34:29,964 --> 00:34:34,124 Yes, definitely. "You're not a faggot, you're a man." 420 00:34:34,364 --> 00:34:37,285 And what were you saying? "Of course"... 421 00:34:37,445 --> 00:34:39,965 He said yes. Clear. 422 00:34:44,284 --> 00:34:47,604 What I experienced with Marguerite was enormous. 423 00:34:48,565 --> 00:34:51,604 For the first time, a woman gave herself to me... 424 00:34:52,324 --> 00:34:55,325 ...saying: "Do with me whatever you want." 425 00:34:56,565 --> 00:34:59,806 Owning is very pleasant... 426 00:34:59,964 --> 00:35:04,125 ...be able to dominate to someone completely. 427 00:35:06,324 --> 00:35:07,845 It's her... 428 00:35:11,603 --> 00:35:13,685 And it was the first time. 429 00:35:14,325 --> 00:35:16,564 Age was not a problem. 430 00:35:25,684 --> 00:35:28,084 It was a meeting with a woman. 431 00:35:28,244 --> 00:35:32,645 And I had the deep feeling of being a man. 432 00:35:32,965 --> 00:35:38,165 Honestly... I don't think I ever He had made love before meeting her. 433 00:35:47,524 --> 00:35:50,604 I came here very naive. 434 00:35:50,805 --> 00:35:53,885 Innocent and even almost virgin. 435 00:35:55,125 --> 00:35:58,044 I didn't know what it was a real orgasm. 436 00:35:58,204 --> 00:36:01,163 Have a body that does what you want. 437 00:36:01,324 --> 00:36:03,844 It was the first time I felt like this. 438 00:36:04,924 --> 00:36:08,085 At first... well, maybe always... 439 00:36:08,244 --> 00:36:13,005 ...it scared or terrified me be with a woman 440 00:36:13,365 --> 00:36:15,005 Women are scary. 441 00:36:33,405 --> 00:36:37,084 Maybe it's because I'm gay, but I don't believe. 442 00:36:37,245 --> 00:36:39,964 All men feel the same. 443 00:36:40,124 --> 00:36:45,084 Maybe more homosexuals because they feel more afraid... 444 00:36:45,244 --> 00:36:50,245 ...but even for the straight people who hide or deny the fear, it's still there. 445 00:36:50,964 --> 00:36:53,244 There is that fear: 446 00:36:53,404 --> 00:36:56,723 "But what's wrong with me? No, I don't want it." 447 00:36:59,484 --> 00:37:02,925 And I'm doing it, making love... 448 00:37:03,804 --> 00:37:07,644 ...reacting, carrying someone even to orgasm... 449 00:37:07,804 --> 00:37:11,925 The first time is incredible. It was the first time for me. 450 00:37:13,604 --> 00:37:16,924 That's how it was for the first month. It was incredible. 451 00:37:17,084 --> 00:37:19,443 Everything I tell you crossed my mind. 452 00:37:19,604 --> 00:37:23,804 Everything I thought about Duras, and then, I met Duras. 453 00:37:24,004 --> 00:37:26,284 A woman who revealed to me... 454 00:37:26,604 --> 00:37:29,723 ...passion and sexuality. 455 00:37:31,244 --> 00:37:34,284 Everything was mixed in my mind. When I say dread... 456 00:37:34,444 --> 00:37:36,683 ...it's just that I didn't want to leave my imagination. 457 00:37:36,844 --> 00:37:40,165 I didn't want to penetrate the reality of his passion. 458 00:37:47,724 --> 00:37:49,404 - Do you understand me? - Yes. 459 00:37:56,724 --> 00:37:59,685 I understood that passion was not real. 460 00:38:00,165 --> 00:38:05,204 It's so powerful and fictitious like books. They match, you understand? 461 00:38:07,444 --> 00:38:09,884 So, did it last all summer? 462 00:38:10,043 --> 00:38:12,284 No, it lasted... I don't know. 463 00:38:13,244 --> 00:38:15,284 I didn't know what was happening. 464 00:38:21,524 --> 00:38:23,205 He was a very young man. 465 00:38:24,964 --> 00:38:28,684 I'm sure he was as old as he is, that day on the beach. 466 00:38:29,924 --> 00:38:32,564 23 years, I seem to remember. 467 00:38:38,484 --> 00:38:40,365 The sea seems as if it were asleep. 468 00:38:41,764 --> 00:38:43,204 There is no wind. 469 00:38:44,564 --> 00:38:46,004 There is no one. 470 00:38:48,284 --> 00:38:50,644 The beach is smooth as in winter. 471 00:39:00,844 --> 00:39:02,805 I can still see him out there. 472 00:39:04,683 --> 00:39:08,204 I used to look for the waves, and I screamed with fear. 473 00:39:08,364 --> 00:39:10,163 He didn't listen to me. 474 00:39:11,163 --> 00:39:12,604 I was crying. 475 00:39:17,684 --> 00:39:19,804 I used to think I knew everything. 476 00:39:20,684 --> 00:39:21,884 Everything. 477 00:39:22,523 --> 00:39:23,684 Yes�. 478 00:39:24,724 --> 00:39:26,243 Having foreseen everything. 479 00:39:27,083 --> 00:39:28,283 Everything. 480 00:39:28,923 --> 00:39:32,724 Everything that could happen between you and me. 481 00:39:33,564 --> 00:39:34,724 Yes�. 482 00:39:36,244 --> 00:39:38,963 I thought I had thought of everything. 483 00:39:39,124 --> 00:39:40,364 Everything. 484 00:39:40,964 --> 00:39:43,323 The pain, no. 485 00:39:44,523 --> 00:39:46,244 That is never possible. 486 00:39:51,444 --> 00:39:53,163 Let's get there... 487 00:39:53,324 --> 00:39:56,164 I imagine so that you can define yourself... 488 00:39:56,484 --> 00:40:01,004 ...at the first moment when You couldn't stand it anymore. 489 00:40:01,724 --> 00:40:03,923 Because sometimes you can't anymore. 490 00:40:08,284 --> 00:40:10,804 We were living in Trouville... 491 00:40:10,964 --> 00:40:14,524 ...two or three months, until November. Just the two of us. 492 00:40:16,283 --> 00:40:19,684 It was wonderful. I didn't know what was happening to me. 493 00:40:20,003 --> 00:40:23,123 I wasn't thinking about anything. I was... 494 00:40:23,523 --> 00:40:25,444 ...totally in it... 495 00:40:26,124 --> 00:40:28,324 ...in the passion he felt. I was... 496 00:40:29,444 --> 00:40:30,684 ...crazy. 497 00:40:32,243 --> 00:40:36,404 I would have accepted any of your proposals. 498 00:40:37,483 --> 00:40:39,163 Wait. 499 00:41:10,164 --> 00:41:13,083 I think it was happiness. 500 00:41:16,084 --> 00:41:19,483 I felt the love she had... has. 501 00:41:19,643 --> 00:41:22,083 It is absurd to speak in the past tense. 502 00:41:22,244 --> 00:41:23,963 That's what I was going to say. 503 00:41:24,524 --> 00:41:27,763 It's because always I tell it in the past tense. 504 00:41:27,923 --> 00:41:32,842 Maybe we have to leave it in the text that you tell it in the past. 505 00:41:33,003 --> 00:41:35,083 But it's still in the present. 506 00:41:35,243 --> 00:41:37,604 You should leave it like that. 507 00:41:39,364 --> 00:41:43,764 Maybe you can say what you contributed to the relationship... 508 00:41:45,123 --> 00:41:48,244 ...what made her that was material for a novel. 509 00:41:49,163 --> 00:41:51,443 What was your part in all this? 510 00:41:51,763 --> 00:41:55,003 Did you give the entrance? What were you doing? 511 00:41:55,762 --> 00:41:58,124 What was your role in the seduction? 512 00:41:58,684 --> 00:41:59,964 �It�s-- 513 00:42:01,083 --> 00:42:02,403 Are you recording? 514 00:42:02,564 --> 00:42:03,803 Yes, yes. 515 00:42:08,123 --> 00:42:11,123 I don't know what my role in seduction was. 516 00:42:11,284 --> 00:42:14,323 You think she... 517 00:42:14,483 --> 00:42:17,084 ...�invent� your character... 518 00:42:17,243 --> 00:42:19,124 ...or did you really exist? 519 00:42:20,324 --> 00:42:23,043 - Of course you existed. - Yes. 520 00:42:23,763 --> 00:42:25,244 You existed. 521 00:42:25,643 --> 00:42:28,923 Yes, it existed, but at the same time... 522 00:42:29,083 --> 00:42:31,963 ...I felt reflected in his imagination. 523 00:42:32,123 --> 00:42:34,964 He saw me as the object of his passion. 524 00:42:35,963 --> 00:42:41,324 He gave me things, he dressed me with their coats, sweaters, shirts. 525 00:42:42,276 --> 00:42:46,515 It made me change my perfume. He didn't like me seeing my friends. 526 00:42:49,724 --> 00:42:53,524 At first, I accepted all that. I was very happy... 527 00:42:53,684 --> 00:42:55,987 I can't call it anything else. It was very pleasant. 528 00:43:01,084 --> 00:43:04,243 I immediately participated to what he wrote. 529 00:43:04,403 --> 00:43:06,962 He immediately integrated the process. 530 00:43:07,162 --> 00:43:09,682 Typing your texts on a typewriter. 531 00:43:09,843 --> 00:43:13,484 There was no interruption between being together every day... 532 00:43:14,084 --> 00:43:18,243 ...go for a walk, make love, and on the other hand, his writing. 533 00:43:18,403 --> 00:43:21,083 Everything was immediately transparent. 534 00:43:22,763 --> 00:43:26,283 He offered himself to me saying: "That's how I am." 535 00:43:27,003 --> 00:43:28,683 "And that's how I write." 536 00:43:29,882 --> 00:43:33,364 "This is how I write, and you must accept everything." 537 00:43:34,803 --> 00:43:36,443 And I accepted everything. 538 00:43:37,083 --> 00:43:40,762 His writing, his way of being, how he undressed... 539 00:43:41,203 --> 00:43:43,043 ...his way of eating... 540 00:43:44,203 --> 00:43:48,122 ...to walk, to observe... In two months he taught me everything. 541 00:43:49,564 --> 00:43:51,723 His way of seeing things... 542 00:43:52,483 --> 00:43:56,683 ...the people, their way of writing, his tastes, what he ate. 543 00:43:57,763 --> 00:44:00,403 "I'm all yours But you have to accept everything." 544 00:44:00,563 --> 00:44:04,243 I don't think I'm exaggerating. "You must accept everything." 545 00:44:05,602 --> 00:44:08,483 And I tried to accept it all. 546 00:44:09,323 --> 00:44:13,882 Be part of everything, but shortly after, It became crazy. 547 00:44:15,563 --> 00:44:19,922 For example, if I want to wear this shirt today, why not? 548 00:44:21,082 --> 00:44:26,083 Then, I resisted doing it daily, but... 549 00:44:26,963 --> 00:44:31,723 I knew it was impossible, As she said: "Take it or leave it." 550 00:44:32,723 --> 00:44:36,043 Say that it bothers you to speak in the past tense. Say it. 551 00:44:37,083 --> 00:44:40,163 Yes, it bothers me to speak in the past tense... 552 00:44:40,323 --> 00:44:43,562 ...because I keep living like in the first months. 553 00:44:44,283 --> 00:44:47,122 I continue in that same passion... 554 00:44:47,283 --> 00:44:52,282 ...although I resist because sometimes I think it's too much. 555 00:44:54,163 --> 00:44:57,283 Maybe I feel like that like an hour a day... 556 00:44:57,443 --> 00:45:00,242 ...or during an evening with her even now. 557 00:45:01,803 --> 00:45:05,403 It's fantastic that it continues to last. 558 00:45:06,523 --> 00:45:12,203 But we've been talking for like an hour. and I feel like the... 559 00:45:12,603 --> 00:45:14,083 ...was betraying. 560 00:45:15,883 --> 00:45:18,003 She put that into my head. 561 00:45:19,761 --> 00:45:22,963 Feeling guilty all the time. 562 00:45:23,924 --> 00:45:28,683 If I talk to someone else or leave For a long time, I am guilty. 563 00:45:30,483 --> 00:45:33,122 be talking to you, makes me think: 564 00:45:34,282 --> 00:45:36,202 "Would you like that?" 565 00:45:36,682 --> 00:45:40,203 "Would you be flattered?" "Is it okay?" 566 00:45:42,643 --> 00:45:47,083 I need your approval when This is something I want... 567 00:45:47,283 --> 00:45:50,842 ...but I'm so into this... 568 00:45:51,802 --> 00:45:53,122 What time is it? 569 00:45:55,162 --> 00:45:56,563 It's 6:15 in the afternoon. 570 00:45:58,204 --> 00:46:01,523 You said you had I have to go down at 6:15 in the afternoon. 571 00:46:01,683 --> 00:46:03,123 Incredible, don't you think? 572 00:46:03,884 --> 00:46:05,402 Well, that's it. 573 00:46:06,082 --> 00:46:08,963 We should stop here... It's extraordinary! 574 00:46:09,123 --> 00:46:10,362 Crazy! 575 00:46:12,562 --> 00:46:13,963 Well then... 576 00:46:14,602 --> 00:46:16,483 ...I think we have to leave it. 577 00:46:17,443 --> 00:46:18,843 I'm going to stop it here. 578 00:49:35,802 --> 00:49:39,323 I was in Caen, a Campari Bitter was not very common. 579 00:49:42,442 --> 00:49:45,642 But dead life. Life recreated. 580 00:49:50,482 --> 00:49:52,641 A total failure. 581 00:49:53,522 --> 00:49:54,801 A failure... 582 00:49:57,562 --> 00:50:00,763 - Because you said "like a friend"-- - No. 583 00:50:00,922 --> 00:50:02,121 No. 584 00:50:05,402 --> 00:50:07,921 "I want to fuck. Take me." 585 00:50:09,362 --> 00:50:10,682 I turned... 586 00:50:14,841 --> 00:50:18,003 I don't think I've ever made love before meeting her. 587 00:56:15,800 --> 00:56:17,321 -How are you? - Well? 588 00:56:27,121 --> 00:56:29,001 Here is your you. 589 00:56:29,561 --> 00:56:30,761 Thank you. 590 00:56:38,441 --> 00:56:42,520 I thought about Agatha all night. I need to talk about this. 591 00:56:42,720 --> 00:56:43,761 Good. 592 00:56:43,921 --> 00:56:46,361 December 3, 1982. 593 00:56:47,360 --> 00:56:49,281 I have to add that... 594 00:56:49,481 --> 00:56:54,041 ...a few months after the meeting, in March, six months later... 595 00:56:55,040 --> 00:56:57,160 ...he made me participate in a film. 596 00:56:58,560 --> 00:57:00,560 He put me in front of the camera. 597 00:57:01,520 --> 00:57:03,680 This is important, too. 598 00:57:04,441 --> 00:57:06,161 Important for your love? 599 00:57:08,001 --> 00:57:10,721 He told me: "I'm going to destroy you to create you." 600 00:57:10,880 --> 00:57:12,761 This was essential, too. 601 00:57:14,400 --> 00:57:16,200 He taught me how to read a text... 602 00:57:16,361 --> 00:57:19,360 ...to separate words, to speak like her. 603 00:57:20,321 --> 00:57:21,881 And to walk in the movies, for example. 604 00:57:24,720 --> 00:57:26,761 But not only in cinema. 605 00:57:27,080 --> 00:57:30,320 This domination It even concerned the body. 606 00:57:30,480 --> 00:57:32,640 Look again! 607 00:57:33,080 --> 00:57:35,000 More time. 608 00:57:38,721 --> 00:57:40,041 No! 609 00:57:41,960 --> 00:57:43,880 I tell you when you move. 610 00:57:46,161 --> 00:57:49,961 Look the other way. Forget the camera. 611 00:57:50,120 --> 00:57:52,081 More... more. 612 00:57:52,680 --> 00:57:55,760 No, do it naturally. Really look at it. 613 00:57:55,920 --> 00:57:57,321 Look at the sea. 614 00:57:57,481 --> 00:57:59,161 Never pretend. 615 00:57:59,840 --> 00:58:02,201 Never! Not even a second! 616 00:58:06,720 --> 00:58:08,321 Go to the window. 617 00:58:09,720 --> 00:58:12,000 That's right, start walking. 618 00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:15,841 The camera bothers you. See her again. 619 00:58:16,441 --> 00:58:17,641 That is. 620 00:58:18,601 --> 00:58:20,960 Good. That's perfect. Come to me. 621 00:58:21,120 --> 00:58:24,080 No! Just do what I tell you. 622 00:58:24,841 --> 00:58:26,960 Don't see the sea again. 623 00:58:29,081 --> 00:58:31,200 No! "Look at me!" 624 00:58:37,001 --> 00:58:40,321 You're not seeing me, you are thinking about your walk. 625 00:58:40,481 --> 00:58:41,761 It's not possible! 626 00:58:41,921 --> 00:58:44,720 Look at me and don't think about your walk. 627 00:58:44,880 --> 00:58:47,480 Walk well or I'll put you in a chair. 628 00:58:47,640 --> 00:58:50,160 I sit you down and take a photo of you. 629 00:58:50,760 --> 00:58:52,921 He wasn't an actor, he was her lover. 630 00:58:54,920 --> 00:58:58,920 could never stand that he had homosexual desires. 631 00:58:59,440 --> 00:59:02,441 He asked me if he was homosexual. I told him yes. 632 00:59:04,240 --> 00:59:06,120 And none of this stopped us. 633 00:59:06,600 --> 00:59:09,000 We fell in love with each other. 634 00:59:09,600 --> 00:59:11,600 Nothing ceased for this. 635 00:59:11,761 --> 00:59:14,561 But she saw that if this path was left open... 636 00:59:14,721 --> 00:59:16,880 ...if I didn't seal it... 637 00:59:17,040 --> 00:59:21,760 ...my homosexual desires They would be out of your control... 638 00:59:21,919 --> 00:59:23,680 ...and I couldn't stand it. 639 00:59:25,120 --> 00:59:29,960 He said: "Pederasty is nothing" and "you are not homosexual"... 640 00:59:30,121 --> 00:59:32,480 ...and "I am the only thing you want." 641 00:59:33,840 --> 00:59:37,201 He immediately knew that she had to be strict with this. 642 00:59:40,080 --> 00:59:43,879 Of course it is a trait of love because it's unbearable... 643 00:59:44,039 --> 00:59:46,519 ...when a lover has other desires. 644 00:59:46,680 --> 00:59:50,561 But I see something more general about the way it works. 645 00:59:51,360 --> 00:59:55,400 is asking May I abandon all my desires. 646 00:59:55,560 --> 00:59:56,760 Others? 647 00:59:57,200 --> 01:00:01,039 Other than my desire for her and his desire for me. 648 01:00:05,479 --> 01:00:10,280 The most obvious example is that of homosexuality, but every day... 649 01:00:10,441 --> 01:00:12,480 ...it happened with other things. 650 01:00:12,640 --> 01:00:16,680 If one day, I wanted meat, and her tomato soup... 651 01:00:16,840 --> 01:00:18,319 ...meat did not exist. 652 01:00:18,480 --> 01:00:21,560 It was a false wish. The real desire was mine. 653 01:00:21,719 --> 01:00:22,840 Hers. 654 01:00:22,999 --> 01:00:25,121 Yes, hers. 655 01:00:28,400 --> 01:00:29,640 Because... 656 01:00:30,720 --> 01:00:34,159 ...you give in to the pores, about your homosexuality... 657 01:00:34,320 --> 01:00:38,399 ...the way you dress, the way you walk, your perfume, your friends... 658 01:00:38,560 --> 01:00:40,439 ...about what you can say. 659 01:00:40,960 --> 01:00:43,840 After a while, "You no longer exist." 660 01:00:46,080 --> 01:00:47,960 "Who am I?" 661 01:00:49,280 --> 01:00:51,000 And his answer is: 662 01:00:51,199 --> 01:00:53,560 "You are nothing, you do not exist." 663 01:00:54,000 --> 01:00:55,199 "What?" 664 01:00:55,360 --> 01:00:57,199 "No, you don't exist." 665 01:00:57,720 --> 01:00:59,920 "You only exist through me." 666 01:01:00,879 --> 01:01:05,040 At first, I said: "I want leeks, I don't need permission." 667 01:01:05,201 --> 01:01:07,360 "If I am homosexual, I exist." 668 01:01:07,519 --> 01:01:10,961 At first, This is how I reacted to defend myself. 669 01:01:13,440 --> 01:01:17,319 And what happens... Which is fascinating. 670 01:01:17,479 --> 01:01:22,160 It's just that to associate myself with your fascination, There is nothing left but to give in. 671 01:01:22,840 --> 01:01:27,281 "It's true that leeks don't matter, that homosexuality does not exist. 672 01:01:27,600 --> 01:01:29,479 It's true that you are fine." 673 01:01:30,600 --> 01:01:31,840 And I give in. 674 01:01:41,080 --> 01:01:43,121 Going even further: 675 01:01:44,441 --> 01:01:48,960 "You don't exist. Yes. You are, because I make you exist." 676 01:01:49,640 --> 01:01:54,319 It is not totally contradictory because he loves me. It must be enough. 677 01:01:56,559 --> 01:01:57,840 I wait for... 678 01:01:58,040 --> 01:02:01,040 ...to finish talking, eat, write... 679 01:02:01,200 --> 01:02:05,800 I have to be available, Thus he attributes a feminine role to me. 680 01:02:07,319 --> 01:02:10,639 If I say I do the shopping and I choose the menu... 681 01:02:10,800 --> 01:02:13,999 ...although she accepts, what you do is wrong. 682 01:02:14,159 --> 01:02:18,000 And in fact, I do it wrong. It's classic. 683 01:02:27,640 --> 01:02:30,959 Don't believe, I never had much security... 684 01:02:31,399 --> 01:02:32,959 ...confidence in me. 685 01:02:35,239 --> 01:02:36,960 But now... 686 01:02:40,240 --> 01:02:42,119 ...I have nothing left. 687 01:02:45,679 --> 01:02:47,920 Instead... 688 01:02:50,640 --> 01:02:52,279 ...I have the super guarantee... 689 01:02:52,480 --> 01:02:55,560 ...what is she, because she speaks the truth. 690 01:02:57,799 --> 01:03:00,960 She says, "That's what's true." 691 01:03:01,160 --> 01:03:06,079 "There is no need to compete... nor distinguish, nor approach, etc. 692 01:03:06,359 --> 01:03:07,919 "What I say is true." 693 01:03:08,079 --> 01:03:10,720 "You, on the other hand, "You can only lie." 694 01:03:10,880 --> 01:03:12,600 "And you lie all the time." 695 01:03:13,279 --> 01:03:16,560 The worst thing is not being able to try that you don't lie 696 01:03:17,240 --> 01:03:21,839 With Marguerite, that's clear. You always have to try something... 697 01:03:22,840 --> 01:03:25,959 ...that I love her, that I don't lie. 698 01:03:27,599 --> 01:03:30,079 She never has to prove anything. 699 01:03:30,239 --> 01:03:34,720 Because she has the language and he stripped me of what I had. 700 01:03:35,639 --> 01:03:39,679 It's part of this whole process... 701 01:03:39,960 --> 01:03:43,679 ...what I would call passionate and... 702 01:03:44,079 --> 01:03:47,640 ...of total domination from A to Z. 703 01:03:49,760 --> 01:03:53,680 But if you put up with it, do you want it? 704 01:04:01,000 --> 01:04:03,318 I talk to Marguerite about all this... 705 01:04:03,479 --> 01:04:05,639 ...but he can't stand it. 706 01:04:05,880 --> 01:04:07,760 He takes it as an attack. 707 01:04:12,520 --> 01:04:15,999 The fundamental object that gives me is that she is... 708 01:04:16,519 --> 01:04:18,760 ...for me, the truth. 709 01:04:19,039 --> 01:04:20,399 I think that's it. 710 01:04:20,598 --> 01:04:23,359 It's encouraging. She gives me everything... 711 01:04:23,519 --> 01:04:27,359 ...language, love, writing... 712 01:04:28,360 --> 01:04:31,759 It became a drug. I can't without her. 713 01:04:34,279 --> 01:04:37,319 When we go somewhere, she goes ahead... 714 01:04:37,479 --> 01:04:38,959 ...I stay behind. 715 01:04:39,879 --> 01:04:41,719 And that is very comfortable. 716 01:04:42,399 --> 01:04:43,840 I don't need to talk. 717 01:04:43,999 --> 01:04:48,159 Sometimes he has the kindness to smile at me or talk to me... 718 01:04:48,319 --> 01:04:50,359 ...but always under their rules. 719 01:04:53,199 --> 01:04:54,799 �And you suffer for this? 720 01:05:00,959 --> 01:05:05,959 I want to say two things with this. It is very comfortable, but... 721 01:05:06,119 --> 01:05:07,679 ...it's not just that. 722 01:05:10,199 --> 01:05:15,118 It surely fills me a weakness that I have, which consists... 723 01:05:15,738 --> 01:05:17,913 ...in not having an anchor point. 724 01:05:24,720 --> 01:05:27,079 "Am I gay? Am I heterosexual?" 725 01:05:29,239 --> 01:05:32,679 I need to be faithful to what she makes of me. 726 01:05:33,279 --> 01:05:35,079 I have convinced myself of that. 727 01:05:37,278 --> 01:05:38,839 And I still do it. 728 01:05:40,680 --> 01:05:43,039 I know it is a failure foretold. 729 01:05:43,679 --> 01:05:47,560 You will never have the perfect image What she wants from me. 730 01:05:49,679 --> 01:05:54,399 Sometimes I have these crises in which I say to myself: 731 01:05:55,318 --> 01:05:57,199 "You'll never get it." 732 01:06:00,759 --> 01:06:02,719 And I say to myself... 733 01:06:02,879 --> 01:06:05,598 ...that trying is admirable. 734 01:06:09,799 --> 01:06:11,559 Completely... 735 01:06:12,118 --> 01:06:14,079 ...excessive, totally crazy. 736 01:06:16,759 --> 01:06:20,839 I think maybe it's not worth it. 737 01:06:30,359 --> 01:06:32,279 Sometimes you walked away. 738 01:06:32,758 --> 01:06:36,040 you left, saying that it was no longer possible. 739 01:06:38,199 --> 01:06:40,799 She left. Well, we both went. 740 01:06:42,679 --> 01:06:44,718 What happened then? 741 01:06:46,959 --> 01:06:48,519 In that case, I ran away. 742 01:06:48,679 --> 01:06:53,320 The first time, it was very serious because I tried to commit suicide. 743 01:06:54,678 --> 01:06:58,639 If you talk about it, You're going to have to explain more. 744 01:07:01,799 --> 01:07:06,918 Self-destructive behavior to put it simply... 745 01:07:07,078 --> 01:07:08,919 ...I took a lot of pills. 746 01:07:14,079 --> 01:07:15,520 It's more than that. 747 01:07:17,278 --> 01:07:18,959 Why want to die? 748 01:07:19,199 --> 01:07:21,999 I could have gone out with friends... 749 01:07:22,159 --> 01:07:26,159 ...have a normal attitude to heal, It didn't even occur to me. 750 01:07:27,078 --> 01:07:30,679 I thought that without her, nothing could exist. 751 01:07:31,600 --> 01:07:33,839 So I only had to die. 752 01:07:35,799 --> 01:07:37,719 I still think the same. 753 01:07:38,639 --> 01:07:42,318 You did it once, You're not going to commit suicide incessantly! 754 01:07:46,318 --> 01:07:48,280 I had this feeling... 755 01:07:48,439 --> 01:07:51,759 ...that it couldn't be what she wanted it to be. 756 01:07:56,998 --> 01:07:59,559 When I couldn't stand it anymore, I left. 757 01:07:59,999 --> 01:08:02,678 But I was totally unhappy. 758 01:08:24,159 --> 01:08:25,999 Since I got on the train... 759 01:08:26,159 --> 01:08:29,838 ...my anxiety was 10 times greater than being with her. 760 01:08:42,198 --> 01:08:43,879 Immediately... 761 01:08:44,039 --> 01:08:46,679 ...the only thing I could think of was to call her. 762 01:08:48,159 --> 01:08:50,119 Then he returned. 763 01:08:57,038 --> 01:08:59,758 I knew that nothing could change. 764 01:09:07,079 --> 01:09:11,799 I want to talk about this. I haven't told anyone in two years. 765 01:09:13,998 --> 01:09:16,118 Saying it wouldn't change anything. 766 01:09:27,639 --> 01:09:31,678 I'm in front of someone that exists completely. 767 01:09:31,958 --> 01:09:33,918 If someone exists... 768 01:09:35,157 --> 01:09:36,638 ...it's Marguerite. 769 01:09:36,797 --> 01:09:39,359 10 times more than anyone! 770 01:09:39,839 --> 01:09:45,359 Faced with this existence, It is non-existence. 771 01:09:46,558 --> 01:09:50,638 To mitigate this non-existence and get something back... 772 01:09:50,799 --> 01:09:52,997 ...I'm talking about all this. 773 01:10:03,158 --> 01:10:06,879 To the point where I don't read a book if not recommended. 774 01:10:07,839 --> 01:10:10,958 Why go to the cinema? if India Song exists? 775 01:10:12,238 --> 01:10:16,599 As soon as I say I'm going to see another movie... 776 01:10:16,758 --> 01:10:19,878 ...destroy something, this block. 777 01:10:20,198 --> 01:10:22,158 I destroy the love block. 778 01:10:22,318 --> 01:10:25,718 I live it as betrayal, talk about her with someone else... 779 01:10:25,877 --> 01:10:29,318 ...it's like a betrayal or at least it is suspicious. 780 01:10:31,637 --> 01:10:34,999 I like this situation, I have to be honest. 781 01:10:36,598 --> 01:10:38,638 �Why did you choose Yann Lem�e? 782 01:10:40,518 --> 01:10:42,838 To make Agatha's husband. 783 01:10:44,758 --> 01:10:47,918 If I hadn't met this one... 784 01:10:48,998 --> 01:10:51,999 How to say it? Tramp. 785 01:10:53,038 --> 01:10:56,158 This subject man to a modern nomadism... 786 01:10:56,319 --> 01:11:00,918 ...who arrived and settled with me, leaving work and home... 787 01:11:01,758 --> 01:11:02,998 ...and friends. 788 01:11:03,159 --> 01:11:06,238 Probably never would have writtenAgatha. 789 01:11:07,558 --> 01:11:11,158 It's funny to see someone appear at your house. 790 01:11:14,079 --> 01:11:17,038 Ready to leave everything: work... 791 01:11:18,078 --> 01:11:19,398 ...house. 792 01:11:22,478 --> 01:11:24,398 What else could it be? 793 01:11:25,518 --> 01:11:28,238 Only the role of the lover... 794 01:11:29,319 --> 01:11:30,558 ...from Agatha. 795 01:11:39,077 --> 01:11:41,798 No one has ever loved me like this. 796 01:11:42,158 --> 01:11:43,838 I'm sure of that. 797 01:11:43,997 --> 01:11:47,199 Also safe that no one can love me like that. 798 01:11:47,358 --> 01:11:49,598 Such great attention... 799 01:11:49,758 --> 01:11:53,399 ...until you want it to no longer exist. Let only love remain. 800 01:11:53,837 --> 01:11:57,758 Marguerite's cunning, his brilliant intelligence... 801 01:11:57,918 --> 01:12:01,078 ...is that it is not premeditated. She is like that. 802 01:12:01,238 --> 01:12:04,438 Not even she knows what she's doing. He's sorry. 803 01:12:10,478 --> 01:12:12,518 What was he talking about? 804 01:12:14,318 --> 01:12:16,517 When I talk about his love for me... 805 01:12:16,677 --> 01:12:19,998 ...I feel like I'm talking about my love for her. Isn't that so? 806 01:12:21,837 --> 01:12:24,798 No, because you don't talk about your intentions. 807 01:12:24,958 --> 01:12:27,238 Of wanting to take care of her. 808 01:12:37,598 --> 01:12:38,877 For example... 809 01:12:43,239 --> 01:12:45,278 When I get up in the morning... 810 01:12:45,958 --> 01:12:48,917 ...my first thought is her. It's for her. 811 01:12:49,718 --> 01:12:54,357 How did you spend the night? Is she still alive? How is he? That kind of thing. 812 01:12:57,317 --> 01:12:59,398 And I have to say, it's... 813 01:13:00,397 --> 01:13:02,038 I have to say this. 814 01:13:02,638 --> 01:13:05,199 It's adorable, it's... 815 01:13:06,038 --> 01:13:08,558 ...so full of love that... 816 01:13:09,678 --> 01:13:11,397 ...I can't help but love her. 817 01:13:12,278 --> 01:13:15,278 And I can't help but wish for her... 818 01:13:15,638 --> 01:13:17,317 ...wanting to kiss her. 819 01:13:20,199 --> 01:13:23,158 And I can't help but want to leave her either... 820 01:13:24,038 --> 01:13:25,318 ...kill her. 821 01:13:26,238 --> 01:13:29,717 She invites this violence, to be hit. 822 01:13:29,957 --> 01:13:33,757 It moves so many things in me, And I'm not violent. 823 01:13:33,917 --> 01:13:36,597 It leads me to act strongly with her. 824 01:13:37,118 --> 01:13:40,598 But since he has language, love... 825 01:13:40,757 --> 01:13:43,558 ...makes me fall in love. 826 01:13:44,957 --> 01:13:46,757 This physical attraction... 827 01:13:47,798 --> 01:13:50,717 ...wanting to kiss her, make love to her. 828 01:13:52,238 --> 01:13:55,197 All this in gruesome scenes. 829 01:13:57,958 --> 01:14:01,197 And what keeps it going, which means it lasts... 830 01:14:01,598 --> 01:14:03,758 ...is telling myself: "I'm fed up!" 831 01:14:04,198 --> 01:14:07,717 This is impossible, horrible, monstrous, inhuman. 832 01:14:08,357 --> 01:14:10,277 You can't treat someone like that. 833 01:14:11,917 --> 01:14:14,237 And it comes and goes like waves. 834 01:14:14,397 --> 01:14:18,597 I forgive him everything. A kind of immense forgiveness... 835 01:14:19,678 --> 01:14:21,558 I can't blame her. 836 01:14:21,838 --> 01:14:24,398 Our love endures... 837 01:14:25,358 --> 01:14:28,078 I will always love her, no matter what happens. 838 01:14:29,477 --> 01:14:33,798 For example, I can't imagine that you can die. 839 01:14:34,598 --> 01:14:37,598 Maybe it's an imaginary world, but I can't. 840 01:14:39,238 --> 01:14:40,757 And I can't see myself... 841 01:14:40,917 --> 01:14:43,118 ...after her. 842 01:14:45,556 --> 01:14:48,037 At the same time I don't see myself before. 843 01:14:48,197 --> 01:14:52,198 I feel like I've lived with her for centuries, forever. 844 01:14:52,757 --> 01:14:54,798 Maybe my life started there. 845 01:14:55,838 --> 01:14:58,598 I think so, my life started with her. 846 01:15:01,877 --> 01:15:04,237 Likewise I cannot see the end. 847 01:15:04,958 --> 01:15:08,557 So, I see it as a way... 848 01:15:08,997 --> 01:15:10,918 ...of immortality... 849 01:15:11,078 --> 01:15:12,558 ...of eternity. 850 01:15:13,397 --> 01:15:18,437 But the tragic thing is that it does go to finish, just for the practical side. 851 01:15:18,597 --> 01:15:21,197 For example, the age difference. 852 01:15:22,317 --> 01:15:25,437 For a while now, I want to ask you a question. 853 01:15:26,637 --> 01:15:29,918 What concerns you? The evil of death? 854 01:15:34,678 --> 01:15:36,197 The proposal... 855 01:15:36,917 --> 01:15:40,636 ...in the text, the proposal made to man to love. 856 01:15:41,836 --> 01:15:44,277 It's exactly what she made for me. 857 01:15:45,117 --> 01:15:48,197 Are you affected by this disease? 858 01:15:48,358 --> 01:15:49,558 Yes. 859 01:15:50,678 --> 01:15:53,837 Do you think it is the evil of homosexuals? 860 01:15:54,357 --> 01:15:56,398 Yes, I think... 861 01:15:57,637 --> 01:16:02,956 A long time ago, before I met her, when I dated homosexuals... 862 01:16:03,796 --> 01:16:06,718 ...I thought I was inside and out at the same time. 863 01:16:06,878 --> 01:16:10,077 And I had, I always had... 864 01:16:10,677 --> 01:16:13,756 ...a certain lucidity regarding to the vanity of this. 865 01:16:16,197 --> 01:16:20,476 I will go further. I don't think that you should stop at homosexuality. 866 01:16:20,637 --> 01:16:22,877 It is not the cause of everything. 867 01:16:25,757 --> 01:16:30,077 The problem is the incredible lack... 868 01:16:30,556 --> 01:16:31,997 ...of not loving... 869 01:16:32,877 --> 01:16:35,318 ...don't get out of one... 870 01:16:35,756 --> 01:16:37,437 ...not feeling love. 871 01:16:39,717 --> 01:16:43,317 It was what I lived with Marguerite, this proposal. 872 01:16:43,718 --> 01:16:45,677 "Have you never loved a woman?" 873 01:16:46,277 --> 01:16:47,757 It is she who speaks. 874 01:16:48,237 --> 01:16:49,397 "No never. 875 01:16:50,397 --> 01:16:52,636 Have you never desired a woman? 876 01:16:53,877 --> 01:16:54,957 No... 877 01:16:55,677 --> 01:16:56,917 ...never. 878 01:17:00,037 --> 01:17:01,397 Not once? 879 01:17:02,558 --> 01:17:03,797 Not for a moment? 880 01:17:04,597 --> 01:17:05,837 No never. 881 01:17:07,838 --> 01:17:09,157 �Nunca? �Jam�s? 882 01:17:09,997 --> 01:17:11,077 Never. 883 01:17:12,517 --> 01:17:13,597 Jam�s. 884 01:17:15,637 --> 01:17:17,677 And see a woman? 885 01:17:20,277 --> 01:17:24,398 How to see a woman? Have you never seen a woman? 886 01:17:24,557 --> 01:17:25,677 No. 887 01:17:26,077 --> 01:17:27,237 Never. 888 01:17:28,557 --> 01:17:30,037 What do you see? 889 01:17:31,837 --> 01:17:33,037 Everything else." 890 01:17:34,717 --> 01:17:37,356 The men in The evil of death They are homosexuals. 891 01:17:40,157 --> 01:17:41,597 Y... 892 01:17:42,117 --> 01:17:43,917 ...many people don't see it. 893 01:17:46,637 --> 01:17:48,836 It's extraordinary, but you don't see it. 894 01:17:50,476 --> 01:17:55,117 I had convinced you that it was evil or did you feel it was? 895 01:17:56,198 --> 01:17:58,238 No, I felt like it was... 896 01:17:59,557 --> 01:18:03,917 I would never talk about illness because the medical term disturbs. 897 01:18:04,396 --> 01:18:06,436 I would say that it is a deficiency. 898 01:18:08,797 --> 01:18:10,316 A lack of love. 899 01:18:12,196 --> 01:18:13,556 I mean... 900 01:18:13,717 --> 01:18:17,397 ...have to possess, belong to someone 901 01:18:18,957 --> 01:18:21,196 I know that is my weakness. 902 01:18:21,837 --> 01:18:24,317 I became homosexual for a reason. 903 01:18:24,477 --> 01:18:28,516 My strange defect is having the feeling... 904 01:18:29,156 --> 01:18:30,796 ...of not belonging. 905 01:18:33,077 --> 01:18:35,517 To almost feel like I'm not alive. 906 01:18:36,357 --> 01:18:38,317 Feel... 907 01:18:41,597 --> 01:18:43,276 ...incapable of something... 908 01:18:44,756 --> 01:18:46,036 ...to do something. 909 01:18:47,437 --> 01:18:49,156 Feeling massive failure. 910 01:18:50,996 --> 01:18:54,877 And at the end of the day, in a sense, not having an identity. 911 01:18:55,197 --> 01:18:58,277 And that is homosexuality, in one aspect. 912 01:19:00,196 --> 01:19:02,797 When you live like I lived. 913 01:19:05,556 --> 01:19:09,196 you are finding in a group, with certain codes. 914 01:19:09,356 --> 01:19:11,757 There are networks, like anywhere. 915 01:19:12,676 --> 01:19:15,677 You feel comfortable to talk like everyone else... 916 01:19:16,237 --> 01:19:18,837 ...to dress the same, and appreciate the same. 917 01:19:20,157 --> 01:19:23,316 I don't appreciate those who say: "Homosexuals." 918 01:19:24,356 --> 01:19:25,996 I speak for myself. 919 01:19:26,156 --> 01:19:30,557 I don't think it is necessarily a misfortune. 920 01:19:31,317 --> 01:19:33,196 Were you able to tell him this? 921 01:19:33,517 --> 01:19:34,717 What? 922 01:19:34,876 --> 01:19:36,316 Do you dare to tell him? 923 01:19:36,477 --> 01:19:37,310 What? 924 01:19:37,397 --> 01:19:40,996 That is not a misfortune how she thinks it. 925 01:19:41,156 --> 01:19:42,957 Yes, I do, but... 926 01:19:43,557 --> 01:19:45,236 It's impossible for her. 927 01:19:45,396 --> 01:19:46,997 You can't hear this. 928 01:19:47,197 --> 01:19:50,236 You do not fully agree with this text. 929 01:19:50,476 --> 01:19:52,317 Yes, of course. 930 01:19:52,477 --> 01:19:55,236 I agree as far as I'm concerned. 931 01:19:55,556 --> 01:19:57,397 Is that what you think? 932 01:19:57,956 --> 01:19:59,596 That's what I think. 933 01:19:59,757 --> 01:20:01,316 For her, it is death. 934 01:20:01,476 --> 01:20:03,796 Homosexuality is absolute death. 935 01:20:04,717 --> 01:20:07,837 Yes, but I think that when it comes to me. 936 01:20:09,557 --> 01:20:13,156 I don't think it's the truth of all homosexuals. 937 01:20:13,316 --> 01:20:16,117 But I think it is for me. 938 01:20:16,597 --> 01:20:19,436 But it shouldn't address a category. 939 01:20:19,596 --> 01:20:21,157 Which is what it does. 940 01:20:21,637 --> 01:20:23,716 Yes, but that's how she works. 941 01:20:24,196 --> 01:20:28,356 all homosexuals They are not struck by death. 942 01:20:29,596 --> 01:20:31,237 Did you see this woman? 943 01:20:32,476 --> 01:20:34,956 He says that homosexuals don't see it. 944 01:20:36,076 --> 01:20:37,676 It's true. 945 01:20:39,555 --> 01:20:41,196 That's what I told you. 946 01:20:41,396 --> 01:20:45,037 I discovered what a woman's body is. 947 01:20:45,196 --> 01:20:47,596 What is a woman's desire. 948 01:20:48,076 --> 01:20:51,556 And a woman's desire for a man. 949 01:20:51,916 --> 01:20:53,756 It goes from both sides. 950 01:20:54,836 --> 01:20:56,955 Is it preferable to the other? 951 01:20:57,555 --> 01:20:59,836 Yeah, well, I wouldn't use that word. 952 01:20:59,996 --> 01:21:02,516 It's completely different. 953 01:21:03,116 --> 01:21:04,636 Better for you? 954 01:21:04,797 --> 01:21:07,636 Yeah. Well, isn't it more satisfying... 955 01:21:08,076 --> 01:21:09,596 It's another continent. 956 01:21:10,676 --> 01:21:14,196 Another type of relationship. Can't compare... 957 01:21:15,196 --> 01:21:18,115 �It is such that you don't like men anymore? 958 01:21:21,117 --> 01:21:22,757 I don't like men. 959 01:21:23,596 --> 01:21:25,236 Do you like sleeping with them? 960 01:21:25,396 --> 01:21:26,756 Wait. 961 01:21:27,556 --> 01:21:31,276 I'm not talking about love. I'm talking about sexuality. 962 01:21:32,156 --> 01:21:33,997 There is a clear difference. 963 01:21:34,156 --> 01:21:38,877 It doesn't stop me from having homosexual desires. I told Marguerite. 964 01:21:39,237 --> 01:21:43,477 He can't stand it, but I don't know what can I do about it. 965 01:21:43,636 --> 01:21:46,316 But loving a man, no. 966 01:21:47,356 --> 01:21:49,396 What attracts you in men? 967 01:21:50,716 --> 01:21:52,995 What attracts me is... 968 01:21:53,196 --> 01:21:54,956 ...for example, bodies. 969 01:21:58,036 --> 01:22:00,957 Maybe we strayed from the topic, I don't know... 970 01:22:01,117 --> 01:22:03,316 We can talk about that. 971 01:22:03,596 --> 01:22:05,356 Well, I think... 972 01:22:05,676 --> 01:22:07,477 ...is not in the text. 973 01:22:07,676 --> 01:22:09,236 No, but... 974 01:22:09,396 --> 01:22:12,236 I don't know if you want me to record it or not. 975 01:22:13,395 --> 01:22:14,876 I'm scared of it. 976 01:22:15,436 --> 01:22:16,717 Do you want? 977 01:22:17,236 --> 01:22:18,397 Yes. 978 01:22:23,156 --> 01:22:26,996 At best it is simplistic, but I think that... 979 01:22:27,516 --> 01:22:30,156 ...a homosexual relationship is a mirror. 980 01:22:30,315 --> 01:22:31,836 It is exactly this. 981 01:22:31,995 --> 01:22:33,637 Yes, but it is death. 982 01:22:33,796 --> 01:22:35,796 Yes, it is death, but... 983 01:22:38,196 --> 01:22:40,117 It's not bad, in a sense. 984 01:22:59,036 --> 01:23:02,797 These meetings exist clandestine nights... 985 01:23:02,956 --> 01:23:06,315 ...the bodies that are barely distinguishable, its ephemeral side. 986 01:23:11,756 --> 01:23:15,036 You are with someone for an hour or two, It's nothing. 987 01:24:04,435 --> 01:24:09,076 Can you talk more about the dimension of death in his passion? 988 01:24:09,516 --> 01:24:11,355 Do you talk about that a lot? 989 01:24:11,955 --> 01:24:14,236 Does one kill the other? 990 01:24:15,675 --> 01:24:18,315 Did they both have these murderous impulses? 991 01:24:19,155 --> 01:24:20,316 Yes. 992 01:24:21,435 --> 01:24:24,397 Well, I discovered this impulse... 993 01:24:24,556 --> 01:24:27,956 ...the violence of killing to someone for the first time... 994 01:24:28,116 --> 01:24:30,316 ...with her. It's her. 995 01:24:30,716 --> 01:24:32,995 Marguerite provokes this violence. 996 01:24:36,795 --> 01:24:38,995 It's the first time... 997 01:24:40,435 --> 01:24:42,037 ...I feel this. 998 01:24:42,236 --> 01:24:44,196 Really, in my entire life. 999 01:24:44,636 --> 01:24:47,036 It had never been like this with boys. 1000 01:24:47,396 --> 01:24:49,275 Nothing was at stake. 1001 01:24:49,435 --> 01:24:54,675 If this violence starts, I think it's between a man and a woman. 1002 01:24:55,475 --> 01:24:59,115 I am sure that our relationship He's straight... 1003 01:24:59,275 --> 01:25:02,836 ...but there are some homosexual aspects in it. 1004 01:25:02,996 --> 01:25:05,475 The way he talks to me in feminine. 1005 01:25:06,675 --> 01:25:09,195 Yes, he speaks to me in feminine. 1006 01:25:11,035 --> 01:25:15,236 Do you like it when he talks to you in feminine terms? 1007 01:25:15,756 --> 01:25:20,396 Yeah... It bothers me after a while. I don't see myself that way. 1008 01:25:22,995 --> 01:25:26,995 That's where my homosexual side plays with Marguerite. 1009 01:25:28,875 --> 01:25:33,035 Like there is a connection beyond love with her. 1010 01:25:35,315 --> 01:25:38,035 And this connection is sealed... 1011 01:25:38,196 --> 01:25:40,436 ...and will continue until death. 1012 01:25:41,676 --> 01:25:44,796 he writes it so he immortalizes it too. 1013 01:25:45,675 --> 01:25:47,876 It's a way to kill me too. 1014 01:25:51,915 --> 01:25:54,115 When I saw The Atlantic Man... 1015 01:25:54,794 --> 01:25:57,796 ...I became hysterical, I was shaking... 1016 01:25:57,956 --> 01:26:00,076 ...crying when I woke up... 1017 01:26:00,235 --> 01:26:03,555 ...crying at the thought to see myself on the screen... 1018 01:26:03,716 --> 01:26:06,355 ...watch me die, I understood it later. 1019 01:26:12,074 --> 01:26:13,555 She made me die... 1020 01:26:13,996 --> 01:26:16,356 ...when filming me. It's extraordinary. 1021 01:26:16,516 --> 01:26:20,156 His love, the object of his passion in a static shot. 1022 01:26:20,316 --> 01:26:23,155 I don't move, almost always in a chair. 1023 01:26:23,315 --> 01:26:26,475 He made him die. It made me die! 1024 01:26:27,955 --> 01:26:32,516 And by making me die, I created an image of me... 1025 01:26:32,676 --> 01:26:36,276 my immortality that was escaping from me. 1026 01:26:36,435 --> 01:26:40,475 How did he not recognize me? on the screen, it wasn't me. 1027 01:26:42,475 --> 01:26:45,155 Suddenly, a jolt. I fought with her. 1028 01:26:45,314 --> 01:26:48,915 I told him no: "You say I'm a faggot. Yes, I'm a faggot." 1029 01:26:49,083 --> 01:26:51,843 "So what? What do you say?" 1030 01:26:52,196 --> 01:26:54,195 And she told me: 1031 01:26:54,596 --> 01:26:56,475 "It's totally horrible." 1032 01:26:56,835 --> 01:26:58,515 "But I also adore him." 1033 01:27:11,436 --> 01:27:13,035 Now it's different. 1034 01:27:15,715 --> 01:27:19,875 I am homosexual. I feel desire by other kids and it's easier. 1035 01:27:24,515 --> 01:27:27,555 This homosexual aspect It must fascinate you. 1036 01:27:29,315 --> 01:27:31,075 Yesterday he told me: 1037 01:27:31,635 --> 01:27:35,795 "You should talk about this." How I am. Be precise." 1038 01:27:37,875 --> 01:27:41,315 But I need to talk to you first to be able to do it. 1039 01:27:42,115 --> 01:27:45,314 I need to talk to you, talk. 1040 01:27:46,915 --> 01:27:50,396 He said, "Talk about me." Why do you let me talk?" 1041 01:27:53,035 --> 01:27:55,476 Of course I want to talk about her. 1042 01:27:57,434 --> 01:28:00,035 But I want to say other things too. 1043 01:28:00,995 --> 01:28:03,875 Can you talk about their suffering? 1044 01:28:04,154 --> 01:28:06,036 His suffering in passion? 1045 01:28:13,715 --> 01:28:16,355 I think that is his suffering. 1046 01:28:16,795 --> 01:28:18,315 Live to the fullest. 1047 01:28:19,194 --> 01:28:21,554 Experience it all, make love... 1048 01:28:21,715 --> 01:28:24,435 ...drink alone all night to stupor... 1049 01:28:24,595 --> 01:28:26,916 ...eat until you get sick. 1050 01:28:27,075 --> 01:28:29,396 A type of excess that makes you suffer. 1051 01:28:29,556 --> 01:28:32,195 We don't love each other enough. 1052 01:28:32,355 --> 01:28:36,114 It's never pretty enough, It's never cool enough. 1053 01:28:36,755 --> 01:28:39,115 The key word is "more, more." 1054 01:28:41,595 --> 01:28:45,836 What surprises me is that he wrote The outburst of Lol V. Stein... 1055 01:28:45,996 --> 01:28:51,355 ...she understands the false illusion of passion, failure, mortality. 1056 01:28:51,995 --> 01:28:55,034 And still he lives like a 15 year old girl: 1057 01:28:55,874 --> 01:28:58,354 "We will love each other forever." 1058 01:28:59,075 --> 01:29:02,115 "I will leave everything. "I won't see anyone else." 1059 01:29:03,434 --> 01:29:05,195 "It will be completely there." 1060 01:29:06,875 --> 01:29:08,834 He completely believes it. 1061 01:29:09,474 --> 01:29:10,994 Like I was 15. 1062 01:29:11,594 --> 01:29:14,674 I feel like 80, totally fed up. 1063 01:29:14,834 --> 01:29:18,314 He fights for everything, nothing matters to him, He doesn't doubt anything. 1064 01:29:20,715 --> 01:29:22,795 Every day I think he is going to die. 1065 01:29:22,955 --> 01:29:24,795 Play with it all the time: 1066 01:29:24,954 --> 01:29:26,875 "I'm dying, I'm sick." 1067 01:29:28,034 --> 01:29:30,634 The next day, runs all over the house. 1068 01:29:30,794 --> 01:29:32,675 When he gets up, he says: 1069 01:29:32,834 --> 01:29:34,634 "Let's make a stew." 1070 01:29:36,234 --> 01:29:39,835 And... "I adore you, let's make love." 1071 01:29:42,995 --> 01:29:45,635 A type of fundamental innocence. 1072 01:29:49,554 --> 01:29:52,514 The best thing you have It's that he forgets everything. 1073 01:29:52,674 --> 01:29:56,115 You forget your age, his past lovers, friends... 1074 01:29:56,275 --> 01:29:57,675 There is only me. 1075 01:30:03,115 --> 01:30:08,435 I am quite discreet, She is the opposite, she opens up completely. 1076 01:30:09,674 --> 01:30:11,394 It is totally present. 1077 01:30:11,994 --> 01:30:15,755 It says: "I have a body, I exist, I'm hungry, thirsty, I want to drink." 1078 01:30:16,835 --> 01:30:20,834 It has no limits. It's a good definition of it. 1079 01:30:22,034 --> 01:30:25,595 It's not going to be just that, want to share it... 1080 01:30:25,755 --> 01:30:27,474 ...has the meaning of the others. 1081 01:30:32,995 --> 01:30:37,034 Maybe I love her less than she loves me. I'm always one step behind. 1082 01:30:38,435 --> 01:30:43,634 As always it's something better than anyone, and I... 1083 01:30:44,474 --> 01:30:49,994 In love, cooking, writing, in the way he sees things and people. 1084 01:30:50,154 --> 01:30:52,476 One always feels behind. 1085 01:30:54,554 --> 01:30:58,475 She wants to elevate me to this intensity. 1086 01:31:01,074 --> 01:31:03,955 You can see I can't. 1087 01:31:05,674 --> 01:31:08,394 I think that hurts him. 1088 01:31:11,354 --> 01:31:13,115 It hurts him a lot. 1089 01:31:24,074 --> 01:31:25,274 Good. 1090 01:31:25,514 --> 01:31:27,193 - Are we finished? - Yes. 1091 01:31:35,395 --> 01:31:37,355 Yann, do you have an envelope? 1092 01:31:38,954 --> 01:31:40,714 Yes, let me bring you one. 1093 01:31:51,674 --> 01:31:53,795 How do you see this one? It's not very big. 1094 01:31:53,954 --> 01:31:55,714 Yes, it's a little small. 1095 01:31:57,674 --> 01:31:59,435 You will keep them better. 1096 01:32:02,434 --> 01:32:03,634 Here. 1097 01:32:03,800 --> 01:32:06,921 I prefer that you keep them for the moment. 1098 01:32:07,394 --> 01:32:09,235 I'll get them back. 1099 01:32:09,395 --> 01:32:11,034 - Are you sure? - Yes. 1100 01:32:11,474 --> 01:32:12,674 Well. 1101 01:32:27,515 --> 01:32:28,954 Well, I'm leaving. 1102 01:32:34,554 --> 01:32:37,314 Yann never recovered the tapes. 1103 01:32:38,833 --> 01:32:43,515 When Mich�le Manceaux died, His partner gave them to a friend. 1104 01:32:43,675 --> 01:32:49,675 Later, when Yann died, they they gave to his sister, Pascale Lem�e... 1105 01:32:49,873 --> 01:32:53,074 ...who copied the content word after word. 1106 01:32:54,914 --> 01:32:57,874 These were the interviews. 1107 01:33:03,554 --> 01:33:05,954 I WANT TO TALK ABOUT HARD 1108 01:33:06,154 --> 01:33:12,154 Subtitles by ARGENTeaM www.argenteam.net