1 00:01:14,208 --> 00:01:15,625 Hi, I'm Bob Lazar. 2 00:01:16,291 --> 00:01:18,208 In December of 1988, 3 00:01:18,375 --> 00:01:20,833 I was hired as a senior staff physicist 4 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,291 by a U.S. defense contractor called 5 00:01:23,458 --> 00:01:25,208 egandg special projects. 6 00:01:25,875 --> 00:01:27,500 I was told that I would be working 7 00:01:27,666 --> 00:01:29,500 on an advanced propulsion system 8 00:01:29,666 --> 00:01:32,291 out in a remote area of the Nevada test site 9 00:01:32,916 --> 00:01:35,333 known as area 51. 10 00:01:35,833 --> 00:01:38,000 Myself and 21 other people 11 00:01:38,166 --> 00:01:40,916 were responsible for back engineering a technology 12 00:01:41,083 --> 00:01:43,333 that originated from another civilization. 13 00:01:44,416 --> 00:01:46,958 Although this was a highly classified project, 14 00:01:47,208 --> 00:01:48,791 I was never comfortable knowing 15 00:01:48,958 --> 00:01:51,291 that this secret was being kept from the world. 16 00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:55,208 As work there progressed, I began to worry 17 00:01:55,375 --> 00:01:57,333 that what I knew could endanger my life. 18 00:01:57,875 --> 00:01:59,625 Wanting to protect myself, 19 00:01:59,791 --> 00:02:03,041 I decided to go public and reveal the secrets of s4. 20 00:02:03,375 --> 00:02:06,458 Since then, my story has been told countless times 21 00:02:06,625 --> 00:02:08,208 from people all over the world. 22 00:02:08,916 --> 00:02:11,000 No one has ever been able to show exactly 23 00:02:11,166 --> 00:02:12,875 what I saw with my own eyes. 24 00:02:13,500 --> 00:02:14,500 Until now. 25 00:03:05,875 --> 00:03:07,916 Wow, that's a big carrot you got there. 26 00:03:08,083 --> 00:03:12,041 Well... I'm sure they're gonna like the Greens too. 27 00:03:18,458 --> 00:03:20,500 Come here, come here. 28 00:03:22,375 --> 00:03:23,375 Boy! 29 00:03:27,916 --> 00:03:29,333 Rockstar hair on it. 30 00:03:38,708 --> 00:03:42,125 I get asked a lot if I regret going forward and... 31 00:03:43,291 --> 00:03:45,750 I have also said, for years, 32 00:03:46,625 --> 00:03:48,416 "my mind goes back and forth." 33 00:03:49,041 --> 00:03:51,291 If I go forward, I come to this point 34 00:03:51,625 --> 00:03:53,750 in my life, if I could go back in time, 35 00:03:54,458 --> 00:03:57,333 I do wonder what would happen if I didn't go forward and just 36 00:03:57,500 --> 00:03:59,291 played along and didn't take 37 00:03:59,458 --> 00:04:01,708 anyone out to the site to show 'em and... 38 00:04:02,041 --> 00:04:03,881 I don't know how things would have turned out. 39 00:04:04,625 --> 00:04:05,767 I don't know if that would have been the 40 00:04:05,791 --> 00:04:07,333 right thing to do anyway, 41 00:04:07,625 --> 00:04:08,958 'cause it really bothered me that 42 00:04:09,125 --> 00:04:10,625 all this was being kept secret. 43 00:04:12,041 --> 00:04:13,666 There's really no way I can prove it 44 00:04:13,833 --> 00:04:15,958 without revealing my identity and getting myself into 45 00:04:16,125 --> 00:04:17,583 more trouble than I have already. 46 00:04:18,291 --> 00:04:19,666 Exactly what's going on up there? 47 00:04:19,833 --> 00:04:21,416 Well, there's several, 48 00:04:21,625 --> 00:04:24,041 actually nine flying saucers, flying disks 49 00:04:24,208 --> 00:04:26,791 that are out there of extraterrestrial origin. 50 00:04:26,958 --> 00:04:28,625 They're basically being dismantled but 51 00:04:28,791 --> 00:04:31,250 some are, well, in various stages of... 52 00:04:31,500 --> 00:04:33,166 of completion built from other parts 53 00:04:33,333 --> 00:04:34,750 and they're being test flown 54 00:04:34,916 --> 00:04:36,666 and basically just analyzed. 55 00:04:39,458 --> 00:04:42,416 I was always interested in science and engineering, 56 00:04:42,583 --> 00:04:44,416 particularly things that 57 00:04:44,583 --> 00:04:47,458 operated or controlled huge amounts of power, like, 58 00:04:47,958 --> 00:04:50,875 high-powered lasers, rocket engines, jet engines, 59 00:04:51,041 --> 00:04:53,166 explosives, things of that sort, 60 00:04:53,541 --> 00:04:56,000 and started building small jet and rocket engines 61 00:04:56,166 --> 00:04:57,291 in my late teens. 62 00:04:59,208 --> 00:05:02,583 I remember, either buying this magazine or I... 63 00:05:02,750 --> 00:05:05,583 I might have been subscribed to it at the time, but, 64 00:05:06,083 --> 00:05:09,041 this is back when I was either in high school or junior high. 65 00:05:09,333 --> 00:05:11,625 And, yeah, I saw that... 66 00:05:12,750 --> 00:05:15,250 you know, a jet engine on a go-kart going, "well", 67 00:05:15,416 --> 00:05:18,500 nothing's cooler than that," you know, when you're a kid. 68 00:05:18,666 --> 00:05:20,916 Yeah, but I wanted to know everything about that. 69 00:05:21,083 --> 00:05:22,434 You know, a jet engine, you... you... 70 00:05:22,458 --> 00:05:24,125 you could build a jet engine and... 71 00:05:24,375 --> 00:05:26,791 anyway, I became fascinated with all this and 72 00:05:26,958 --> 00:05:28,666 the power and... and whatnot. 73 00:05:29,125 --> 00:05:32,500 And... you know, noted from the article that there was a 74 00:05:32,666 --> 00:05:35,416 guy named Eugene gluhareff and lived in 75 00:05:35,791 --> 00:05:37,375 California somewhere and, 76 00:05:37,791 --> 00:05:40,708 you know, time... time went on, years go by, and 77 00:05:40,958 --> 00:05:43,750 I moved with my parents out to California and, 78 00:05:44,083 --> 00:05:46,083 you know, I... I think at some point this... 79 00:05:46,250 --> 00:05:48,375 this magazine popped up again, 80 00:05:48,750 --> 00:05:52,000 you know, and I went... "Wait, there's... that... 81 00:05:52,208 --> 00:05:54,708 "that guy's out here," you know, and I looked and I... 82 00:05:54,875 --> 00:05:57,666 I think it was in garden a, California. 83 00:05:57,833 --> 00:06:00,375 I went, it's like a 30-minute drive. 84 00:06:00,541 --> 00:06:02,958 So, you know, I just drove out there 85 00:06:03,291 --> 00:06:05,166 and, you know, here's, 86 00:06:05,333 --> 00:06:07,458 this guy's shop was just in this little 87 00:06:07,625 --> 00:06:10,083 kind of disintegrating building, 88 00:06:10,250 --> 00:06:12,416 you know, knocked on the door and there's the guy. 89 00:06:12,583 --> 00:06:15,583 And, you know, we... we start talking and... 90 00:06:16,125 --> 00:06:17,500 In... in a short time, 91 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:20,000 you know, he saw how interested I was 92 00:06:20,166 --> 00:06:21,666 and explaining everything. 93 00:06:21,833 --> 00:06:23,208 And we... we became friends. 94 00:06:23,375 --> 00:06:25,083 Then it was me constantly going 95 00:06:25,250 --> 00:06:27,125 back and forth there and... 96 00:06:27,708 --> 00:06:31,125 and learning a lot about how... 97 00:06:31,916 --> 00:06:35,250 how everything worked, you know, supersonic aerodynamics and the... 98 00:06:35,416 --> 00:06:38,041 you know, the shock waves that work inside, the ju... 99 00:06:38,208 --> 00:06:39,416 stuff that you're not gonna 100 00:06:39,583 --> 00:06:41,208 learn in high school at that time. 101 00:06:41,541 --> 00:06:43,833 And I became more and more interested in... 102 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:46,208 you know, that really became the basis, 103 00:06:46,708 --> 00:06:49,541 the spark anyway, of what got me interested in, 104 00:06:49,708 --> 00:06:51,333 you know, that kind of propulsion. 105 00:07:03,208 --> 00:07:04,750 An old friend of mine, Jim, 106 00:07:04,916 --> 00:07:06,416 he worked in the same place I did, 107 00:07:06,583 --> 00:07:10,041 Fairchild electronics, and came in one day and said, 108 00:07:10,250 --> 00:07:12,166 "I went to the racetrack last night." 109 00:07:12,333 --> 00:07:14,416 I think it was orange county raceway 110 00:07:14,666 --> 00:07:17,083 "and they had jet cars. 111 00:07:17,291 --> 00:07:19,875 It's just this big jet engine with wheels on it. 112 00:07:20,041 --> 00:07:22,561 And they were racing, you know, fire is blasting out the back." 113 00:07:22,708 --> 00:07:24,541 I... and he said, "yeah, you gotta go." 114 00:07:24,708 --> 00:07:27,000 And I went there. I was, you know, 115 00:07:27,166 --> 00:07:29,625 probably... just my early 20s, maybe 21 years old. 116 00:07:29,791 --> 00:07:30,991 And, I... you know, I thought. 117 00:07:31,250 --> 00:07:33,125 "That is without a doubt the coolest thing 118 00:07:33,291 --> 00:07:34,833 I have ever seen." 119 00:07:35,083 --> 00:07:39,375 And I immediately... I have to have one of those things. 120 00:07:39,791 --> 00:07:43,333 And I think that was kind of the seed that started it. 121 00:08:02,333 --> 00:08:04,413 Well, it's so cool. I lit it and I just see this car 122 00:08:04,500 --> 00:08:05,875 pulling away from me. I said, 123 00:08:06,041 --> 00:08:07,601 "jeez, I wonder if I'm gonna catch it." 124 00:08:11,625 --> 00:08:17,958 Three... two... one... zero! 125 00:08:18,625 --> 00:08:20,750 My wife had a Honda civic. 126 00:08:20,916 --> 00:08:24,041 And as it turned out, just looking at it one day, 127 00:08:24,208 --> 00:08:28,000 just the hatchback really looked like a jet would fit in there. 128 00:08:28,166 --> 00:08:30,041 I just started taking it apart. 129 00:08:30,208 --> 00:08:32,458 And, to her surprise, 130 00:08:32,666 --> 00:08:35,750 there was a jet in there in a short period of time. 131 00:08:36,125 --> 00:08:38,750 But, she was okay with it and 132 00:08:38,916 --> 00:08:40,916 kind of became a project for a while. 133 00:08:41,083 --> 00:08:43,666 And, it turned out to be pretty cool. 134 00:08:52,083 --> 00:08:53,791 He also said he worked as a physicist at 135 00:08:53,958 --> 00:08:55,500 los Alamos national lab, 136 00:08:55,708 --> 00:08:57,508 where he experimented with one of the world's 137 00:08:57,541 --> 00:08:59,583 largest particle beam accelerators, 138 00:08:59,750 --> 00:09:01,250 a half mile long behemoth 139 00:09:01,416 --> 00:09:04,083 capable of generating 700 million volts. 140 00:09:04,250 --> 00:09:06,333 Los Alamos officials told us 141 00:09:06,500 --> 00:09:08,916 they had no records of a Robert Lazar ever working there. 142 00:09:09,125 --> 00:09:11,041 They were either mistaken or were lying. 143 00:09:11,333 --> 00:09:14,583 A 1982 phone book from the lab lists Lazar 144 00:09:14,750 --> 00:09:17,291 right there among the other scientists and technicians. 145 00:09:17,750 --> 00:09:20,541 A 1982 clipping from the los Alamos newspaper 146 00:09:20,708 --> 00:09:23,250 profiled Lazar and his interest in jet cars. 147 00:09:23,416 --> 00:09:26,500 It too mentioned his employment at the lab as a physicist. 148 00:09:26,708 --> 00:09:28,125 We called los Alamos again. 149 00:09:28,291 --> 00:09:29,958 An exasperated official told us 150 00:09:30,125 --> 00:09:32,291 he still had no records on Lazar. 151 00:09:32,708 --> 00:09:36,083 Well, while working at los Alamos national lab in 1982, 152 00:09:36,375 --> 00:09:38,375 the local newspaper did a front page story 153 00:09:38,541 --> 00:09:39,666 on a jet car I had built. 154 00:09:40,208 --> 00:09:41,875 Coincidentally, Dr. Edward teller 155 00:09:42,041 --> 00:09:44,541 was giving a speech at los Alamos that same day. 156 00:09:50,958 --> 00:09:53,500 One, two, three, four. 157 00:09:54,375 --> 00:09:57,875 We don't want war. 158 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:00,250 Reagan... 159 00:10:01,083 --> 00:10:03,375 is our first president... 160 00:10:04,166 --> 00:10:06,000 Who had the courage... 161 00:10:06,250 --> 00:10:09,250 To tell the American people... 162 00:10:09,750 --> 00:10:12,458 A big part... of the truth. 163 00:10:12,833 --> 00:10:14,583 When I arrived early to hear his speech, 164 00:10:14,750 --> 00:10:16,833 Dr. Teller was still sitting outside 165 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:19,000 reading a story about me in the newspaper. 166 00:10:19,375 --> 00:10:21,375 I used that to strike up a conversation 167 00:10:21,541 --> 00:10:23,583 and we had a short chat about the jet car. 168 00:10:23,875 --> 00:10:25,333 Then later I listened to his speech. 169 00:10:25,958 --> 00:10:28,666 Now, I never met Dr. Teller again, but in 1988 170 00:10:28,833 --> 00:10:31,375 when I decided to re-enter the scientific community, 171 00:10:31,541 --> 00:10:34,291 I sent him a resume, and inquired about a job. 172 00:10:34,958 --> 00:10:36,666 Dr. Teller responded by telephone 173 00:10:36,833 --> 00:10:38,473 and told me that he was no longer active, 174 00:10:38,625 --> 00:10:40,958 but just functioned in a chief consultant capacity. 175 00:10:41,583 --> 00:10:44,250 He gave me the name of a contact to call in Las Vegas. 176 00:10:44,500 --> 00:10:46,460 I made that call and things progressed from there 177 00:10:46,625 --> 00:10:48,583 until I got into the program at s4. 178 00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:52,291 I had left the lab, moved back and started sending out resumes 179 00:10:52,458 --> 00:10:54,875 and that's when he said, "I think I have" you know, 180 00:10:55,041 --> 00:10:56,809 "I have something you might be interested in." 181 00:10:56,833 --> 00:11:00,291 And that's when he directed me to egandg and 182 00:11:00,625 --> 00:11:02,875 their special projects division is where 183 00:11:03,041 --> 00:11:04,291 I had the interview and... 184 00:11:04,958 --> 00:11:07,583 That was actually apparently for yet another job. 185 00:11:08,208 --> 00:11:10,250 And after my interview, they said, 186 00:11:10,625 --> 00:11:12,916 "you know, there's actually a different position 187 00:11:13,250 --> 00:11:15,250 that you might plug into a little bit better." 188 00:11:15,708 --> 00:11:18,833 So, you know, it was kind of a... a bumpy road to s4, but 189 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:20,750 it's... was all through, teller. 190 00:11:22,208 --> 00:11:25,416 Egandg, which is where Lazar says he was interviewed 191 00:11:25,583 --> 00:11:28,333 for the job at s4, also has no record. 192 00:11:28,500 --> 00:11:30,583 It's as if someone has made him disappear. 193 00:11:30,791 --> 00:11:32,583 The consulting engineering firm 194 00:11:32,750 --> 00:11:35,125 of edgerton, grumershausen and grier, 195 00:11:35,500 --> 00:11:37,791 these three together with their staff 196 00:11:38,125 --> 00:11:39,500 will conduct the highly important 197 00:11:39,666 --> 00:11:41,083 teller Alpha experiment 198 00:11:41,250 --> 00:11:44,041 devised in 1947 by Dr. Edward teller, 199 00:11:44,250 --> 00:11:45,875 a university of Chicago physicist 200 00:11:46,041 --> 00:11:47,500 and los Alamos consultant, 201 00:11:47,833 --> 00:11:51,208 involves the zero tower and the teller Alpha reflectors. 202 00:11:52,750 --> 00:11:57,125 He is not your typical, straight-laced science guy, 203 00:11:57,500 --> 00:11:59,375 science nerd that, might 204 00:11:59,541 --> 00:12:02,750 typically be hired at a place like los Alamos or at s4. 205 00:12:03,083 --> 00:12:04,666 So, you know, 206 00:12:04,833 --> 00:12:08,208 if you wanted to hire a guy who could think clearly 207 00:12:08,375 --> 00:12:11,041 out of the box and help solve problems, 208 00:12:11,375 --> 00:12:14,041 but who could be discredited, if you needed to do that, 209 00:12:14,208 --> 00:12:16,916 Bob was probably the best person in the country at the time. 210 00:12:17,083 --> 00:12:18,333 He was perfect for it. 211 00:12:20,083 --> 00:12:21,083 My name is George knapp. 212 00:12:21,208 --> 00:12:22,958 I'm an investigative reporter, 213 00:12:23,125 --> 00:12:25,208 former anchor at klas-TV, 214 00:12:25,750 --> 00:12:27,916 and I'm the guy who broke the story about Bob Lazar. 215 00:12:28,083 --> 00:12:30,333 High school reunion or something. 216 00:12:30,500 --> 00:12:32,000 Yeah -look at you! 217 00:12:32,166 --> 00:12:33,916 - Hey, it's good to see you. - You too, man. 218 00:12:35,125 --> 00:12:38,500 I get more ufo books than... Anybody in... on the planet. 219 00:12:38,666 --> 00:12:39,833 No doubt. 220 00:12:40,375 --> 00:12:42,625 That's all CIA secret history stuff. 221 00:12:43,291 --> 00:12:45,916 I got some emmys and... "I got... 222 00:12:46,083 --> 00:12:47,483 I got some little emmys out there." 223 00:12:49,166 --> 00:12:51,208 Lazar, 51. 224 00:12:51,375 --> 00:12:53,333 Lazar, Lazar, 51. 225 00:12:54,375 --> 00:12:58,125 But it all starts with you, so it's your fault 226 00:12:58,500 --> 00:13:00,416 that my house looks like this. 227 00:13:00,583 --> 00:13:02,375 I remember you showed me a flying... 228 00:13:02,541 --> 00:13:04,625 - there it is! With the aliens inside. - Yeah. 229 00:13:04,833 --> 00:13:07,333 Yeah, I thought that was really cute. 230 00:13:11,583 --> 00:13:13,375 Let me start this way first, so... 231 00:13:14,333 --> 00:13:15,976 This is the first time Bob and I have ever 232 00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:17,291 been on camera together. 233 00:13:17,458 --> 00:13:18,708 You know, when I first met him, 234 00:13:18,875 --> 00:13:20,375 he... he came forward and spoke to us 235 00:13:20,541 --> 00:13:22,041 'cause he was afraid for his life. 236 00:13:22,250 --> 00:13:24,267 So I started trying to check out what's on his resume, 237 00:13:24,291 --> 00:13:26,171 where he had worked, where he'd gone to school. 238 00:13:26,666 --> 00:13:29,333 Started with the schools, and... 239 00:13:30,583 --> 00:13:32,083 it was an immediate roadblock. 240 00:13:32,250 --> 00:13:33,916 You know, mit and Caltech 241 00:13:34,083 --> 00:13:35,883 both said, "we don't have any record of him." 242 00:13:35,958 --> 00:13:38,583 I thought, "well, this series could end right here, you know." 243 00:13:38,833 --> 00:13:43,208 And then so this prompted conversations with me and Bob, 244 00:13:43,666 --> 00:13:46,041 and he explained some of what was going on. 245 00:13:46,666 --> 00:13:48,416 He said, "look, I worked at los Alamos. 246 00:13:48,583 --> 00:13:49,958 I was there. I was working in a 247 00:13:50,125 --> 00:13:52,625 scientific capacity on classified programs. 248 00:13:52,791 --> 00:13:53,833 That is a fact." 249 00:13:54,666 --> 00:13:56,958 And I decided, "well, that's what we'll focus on." 250 00:13:57,125 --> 00:13:58,500 If he worked at los Alamos 251 00:13:58,666 --> 00:14:01,000 in a scientific capacity on classified stuff, 252 00:14:01,333 --> 00:14:02,458 this is a go. 253 00:14:02,625 --> 00:14:05,750 And so I started a cop correspondence with los Alamos, 254 00:14:05,916 --> 00:14:08,436 and they were a pain in the ass right at... from the beginning. 255 00:14:08,583 --> 00:14:09,863 "We don't have any record of him 256 00:14:10,166 --> 00:14:12,833 ever being there in any capacity. Sorry." 257 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:14,708 Then we had the phone book. 258 00:14:14,875 --> 00:14:16,125 There he is in the phone book. 259 00:14:16,291 --> 00:14:18,666 I sent it to 'em. "Hey, folks, here he is." 260 00:14:18,833 --> 00:14:21,583 "Yeah, we... we can't find a..." I think they called it a z number. 261 00:14:21,750 --> 00:14:23,416 "Can't find it. Sorry." 262 00:14:23,791 --> 00:14:27,208 Then I had the los Alamos monitor front page story about 263 00:14:27,375 --> 00:14:30,000 Bob being a physicist working there. I sent that to 'em. 264 00:14:30,166 --> 00:14:31,708 "Have you guys seen this?" 265 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:33,458 Los Alamos is a small town. 266 00:14:33,958 --> 00:14:35,767 It's not like he could lie about it on the front page 267 00:14:35,791 --> 00:14:37,151 of the paper and get away with it. 268 00:14:37,583 --> 00:14:39,041 "Nope. Sorry, we don't have him. 269 00:14:39,208 --> 00:14:40,666 But maybe he worked for kirk meyer." 270 00:14:40,833 --> 00:14:42,708 So I started a correspondence with kirk meyer. 271 00:14:43,125 --> 00:14:44,685 This is a company that is a headhunter. 272 00:14:44,791 --> 00:14:46,125 They hire people. 273 00:14:46,291 --> 00:14:48,500 They find, people to fill positions, 274 00:14:48,666 --> 00:14:50,500 scientific and technical capabilities 275 00:14:50,666 --> 00:14:52,541 at places like los Alamos lab. 276 00:14:52,791 --> 00:14:54,875 "You have records on a guy named Robert Lazar." 277 00:14:55,041 --> 00:14:57,833 And they said, "yes, we do." I said, "can I get them?" 278 00:14:58,041 --> 00:15:00,458 Said, "yeah, if you get a signed letter from him 279 00:15:00,666 --> 00:15:02,791 or we can send them to him or you with a... 280 00:15:02,958 --> 00:15:04,416 with a letter with permission." 281 00:15:04,583 --> 00:15:06,500 I said, "great." And sent it to 'em. 282 00:15:06,833 --> 00:15:08,625 Weeks go by, no response. 283 00:15:09,250 --> 00:15:10,791 Months go by, no response. 284 00:15:10,958 --> 00:15:12,333 I'm writing back to him. 285 00:15:12,500 --> 00:15:14,142 There's a... I got a stack of letters like this 286 00:15:14,166 --> 00:15:16,000 to los Alamos and kirk meyer. 287 00:15:16,416 --> 00:15:18,875 And I'm asking 'em, "you said you had the... the records. 288 00:15:19,041 --> 00:15:20,250 You said you had hired him. 289 00:15:20,583 --> 00:15:22,500 You got him a job there. Can I get 'em?" 290 00:15:22,666 --> 00:15:25,000 And eventually, it was a back and forth. 291 00:15:25,166 --> 00:15:26,208 "Yes, we have 'em." 292 00:15:26,583 --> 00:15:27,791 "No, we can't find 'em." 293 00:15:27,958 --> 00:15:29,000 "No, we never had 'em." 294 00:15:29,541 --> 00:15:30,750 I knew they were lying to me. 295 00:15:31,500 --> 00:15:33,666 That really... is a key moment for me 296 00:15:33,833 --> 00:15:36,166 because I knew that los Alamos was lying to me. 297 00:15:36,333 --> 00:15:38,083 And I knew that kirk meyer was lying to me. 298 00:15:38,416 --> 00:15:39,416 And it pissed me off. 299 00:15:50,875 --> 00:15:53,583 He says he was hired to work at an area called s4, 300 00:15:53,750 --> 00:15:55,750 which is a few miles south of groom lake. 301 00:15:55,958 --> 00:15:58,166 At s4, he says, are flying saucers, 302 00:15:58,333 --> 00:16:00,958 antimatter reactors and other working examples 303 00:16:01,125 --> 00:16:04,458 of technology that is seemingly beyond human capabilities. 304 00:16:04,625 --> 00:16:06,309 Right. This... this came from somewhere else. 305 00:16:06,333 --> 00:16:07,851 I mean, as bizarre as that is to believe, 306 00:16:07,875 --> 00:16:09,583 but I mean, it's there. I saw it. 307 00:16:09,958 --> 00:16:11,958 I know what the current state of the art is and... 308 00:16:12,166 --> 00:16:15,500 in... in physics and it's... it can't be done. 309 00:16:16,750 --> 00:16:18,416 Groom lake, area 51. 310 00:16:18,583 --> 00:16:20,708 The, the installation is surrounded 311 00:16:20,875 --> 00:16:22,208 by the groom mountain range 312 00:16:22,375 --> 00:16:24,500 and there's a large dry lake bed. 313 00:16:24,791 --> 00:16:26,416 That's groom lake. 314 00:16:28,500 --> 00:16:32,208 Just south of that is s4 and papoose dry lake. 315 00:16:36,833 --> 00:16:40,958 The way it worked was they'd call me at random days and 316 00:16:41,125 --> 00:16:43,708 they'd say, "Mr. Lazar, it is now such and such time. 317 00:16:43,958 --> 00:16:45,500 We need you to come out today." 318 00:16:45,666 --> 00:16:46,916 So I'd go out there. 319 00:16:47,083 --> 00:16:49,125 I'd drive out to egandg special projects, 320 00:16:49,291 --> 00:16:52,250 which was right in mccarran airport at that time. 321 00:16:52,416 --> 00:16:54,458 I'd go through a little security there 322 00:16:54,625 --> 00:16:56,666 and then out on the tarmac 323 00:16:56,833 --> 00:16:58,500 and board one of the Janet flights. 324 00:16:58,750 --> 00:17:00,250 They were only used by the government 325 00:17:00,416 --> 00:17:02,458 for going back and forth to the test site. 326 00:17:02,625 --> 00:17:04,291 Flight 363 Las Vegas tower, 327 00:17:04,458 --> 00:17:06,666 runway 26 right, line up and wait, traffic down field. 328 00:17:08,125 --> 00:17:09,916 Flight 826 Ryder, I said. 329 00:17:10,916 --> 00:17:13,041 1313 straight in at bravo 5 330 00:17:13,208 --> 00:17:15,208 and contact the ramp traffic holds in position. 331 00:17:15,750 --> 00:17:17,750 Hey, cross 26 right, bravo 5, 332 00:17:17,916 --> 00:17:19,125 over to rant house, 1330. 333 00:17:22,458 --> 00:17:24,708 Now it's well known how people get to groom lake. 334 00:17:24,875 --> 00:17:27,333 The Janet planes are now infamous, you know, 335 00:17:27,500 --> 00:17:29,666 and the buses with the blacked out windows. 336 00:17:29,833 --> 00:17:31,673 But back then when Bob first shared it with me 337 00:17:31,791 --> 00:17:33,208 and we made it public, 338 00:17:33,458 --> 00:17:35,791 the... the general public had no idea how that worked. 339 00:17:36,333 --> 00:17:37,333 We put that out there. 340 00:17:37,500 --> 00:17:39,875 Bob knew about it and it would confirm, you know. 341 00:17:51,666 --> 00:17:53,166 When I got to area 51 342 00:17:53,333 --> 00:17:54,875 off the plane and into the facility, 343 00:17:55,041 --> 00:17:56,375 there were very few people. 344 00:17:56,541 --> 00:17:59,250 I just went into a... a small building 345 00:17:59,416 --> 00:18:02,666 and we had to sit down across the desk from somebody 346 00:18:02,833 --> 00:18:06,750 and they'd have a lot of papers explaining what I was signing 347 00:18:06,958 --> 00:18:09,500 and what I'm expected to do and what I'm 348 00:18:09,750 --> 00:18:12,291 expected not to talk about, so on and so forth. 349 00:18:17,875 --> 00:18:19,708 The next time I went out there, 350 00:18:19,875 --> 00:18:22,291 they had a bus, a blue bus, 351 00:18:22,458 --> 00:18:25,458 which was essentially a blue bird school bus, 352 00:18:25,625 --> 00:18:28,541 just painted Navy blue with the windows blacked out. 353 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:32,916 That I got onto with Dennis, who was my supervisor at the time, 354 00:18:33,083 --> 00:18:37,250 and we drove south to another facility, now known as s4. 355 00:18:41,083 --> 00:18:43,291 We're taken by bus south of there. 356 00:18:43,583 --> 00:18:45,416 The bus has the windows blocked out of it 357 00:18:45,625 --> 00:18:47,208 and they drive about 358 00:18:47,541 --> 00:18:50,291 15, 20 minutes, something like that, on a dirt road. 359 00:18:50,500 --> 00:18:52,083 Every time I got on the bus, 360 00:18:52,250 --> 00:18:54,291 I walked up and grabbed the 361 00:18:54,500 --> 00:18:56,833 long chrome pole that's right by the seat 362 00:18:57,041 --> 00:18:59,541 and pretty much just spun around and sat there 363 00:18:59,708 --> 00:19:01,125 or close to the front. 364 00:19:01,458 --> 00:19:03,708 Dennis always sat... he never sat next to me, 365 00:19:03,875 --> 00:19:05,500 he always sat across from me 366 00:19:05,833 --> 00:19:07,291 and looked at me the whole time, 367 00:19:07,458 --> 00:19:10,166 which was really uncomfortable. 368 00:19:10,416 --> 00:19:12,958 Now, the windows were blocked out, but 369 00:19:13,125 --> 00:19:16,708 if I leaned forward, I can see out the front window. 370 00:19:19,791 --> 00:19:23,166 As we slowed down, I could feel that we were... 371 00:19:23,333 --> 00:19:25,708 we were slowing and turning at the same time 372 00:19:25,875 --> 00:19:27,166 when we came to a stop. 373 00:19:28,041 --> 00:19:29,750 When I got out of the bus, 374 00:19:30,083 --> 00:19:32,375 I can see just desert around us. 375 00:19:32,541 --> 00:19:35,416 I can see part of papoose lake behind me 376 00:19:35,583 --> 00:19:37,875 and then when I walked around the front of the bus, 377 00:19:38,041 --> 00:19:40,125 we were at the hillside and 378 00:19:40,333 --> 00:19:45,000 Dennis was by me and all that was in front of us was a door 379 00:19:45,166 --> 00:19:47,208 and a security camera above it. 380 00:19:54,375 --> 00:19:56,583 We're going into the facility the first time. 381 00:19:56,750 --> 00:20:00,333 It's a relatively small room with a table and chair there. 382 00:20:00,500 --> 00:20:02,916 There was a security guard in the chair 383 00:20:03,333 --> 00:20:05,041 and he acknowledged Dennis. 384 00:20:05,208 --> 00:20:06,250 I walked in. 385 00:20:06,708 --> 00:20:11,000 Behind him on the right, there's the hand scanner. 386 00:20:22,250 --> 00:20:24,416 First time I went in there with Dennis, 387 00:20:24,708 --> 00:20:27,166 obviously I had no badge, it had to learn, 388 00:20:27,333 --> 00:20:29,666 so we had to, you know, train the machine, 389 00:20:29,958 --> 00:20:32,833 but subsequent times when I put my hand on there, 390 00:20:33,125 --> 00:20:35,625 the light shines through your hand and measures 391 00:20:35,791 --> 00:20:38,541 the bones in your finger, determines who you are 392 00:20:38,750 --> 00:20:40,708 and your badge comes up out of the slot. 393 00:20:44,083 --> 00:20:46,125 Each door you have, you have to swipe it 394 00:20:46,291 --> 00:20:47,833 to get access to the room 395 00:20:48,041 --> 00:20:51,458 and somewhere that records the time you went in, 396 00:20:51,625 --> 00:20:54,250 when you come out, etc. 397 00:20:57,166 --> 00:20:59,958 On the front is a picture of my face. 398 00:21:00,333 --> 00:21:04,208 There is a big m.A.J. Written sideways on it. 399 00:21:04,375 --> 00:21:06,125 I think they're locations 400 00:21:06,458 --> 00:21:08,218 and they get... they get punched with a star 401 00:21:08,375 --> 00:21:10,083 where you have access to them. 402 00:21:11,083 --> 00:21:12,791 There's an employee number on there. 403 00:21:13,583 --> 00:21:16,333 There's a dark blue and light blue 404 00:21:16,500 --> 00:21:18,750 diagonal stripe up in the corner. 405 00:21:19,291 --> 00:21:20,958 The department of naval intelligence, 406 00:21:21,125 --> 00:21:22,791 the stripes on the side. 407 00:21:23,416 --> 00:21:27,625 And the s... the star punch that you saw... Was on s4. 408 00:21:28,625 --> 00:21:29,666 Yeah. 409 00:21:42,291 --> 00:21:44,583 It's a long, desolate hallway, 410 00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:46,833 for the most part, dimly lit. 411 00:21:47,333 --> 00:21:51,000 Just a two-tone green cinder block hallway. 412 00:21:52,458 --> 00:21:55,666 Off to the right would be... The nurse station, 413 00:21:55,833 --> 00:21:59,000 which is just several steps down that way. 414 00:21:59,166 --> 00:22:00,926 But the main hallway, when you open the door 415 00:22:01,041 --> 00:22:02,500 and you look straight down, 416 00:22:02,666 --> 00:22:04,416 pretty much goes to a vanishing point. 417 00:22:04,583 --> 00:22:06,708 It's a long, long hallway. 418 00:22:07,083 --> 00:22:09,458 And you'll have doors off to the left 419 00:22:09,625 --> 00:22:12,250 that lead to the experimental areas and the hangars. 420 00:22:12,541 --> 00:22:16,083 The doors to the right will be: Bathroom and, 421 00:22:16,250 --> 00:22:18,250 the cafeteria, and then 422 00:22:18,500 --> 00:22:21,541 once you pass the main hangar, the big hangar, 423 00:22:21,708 --> 00:22:24,333 I have no idea what's past there. 424 00:22:27,875 --> 00:22:30,208 There is a small medical facility there. 425 00:22:30,541 --> 00:22:35,000 It's the only female I saw, ever, in the facility. 426 00:22:35,166 --> 00:22:37,958 She explained that we are potentially working with 427 00:22:38,125 --> 00:22:40,041 a lot of unknown materials 428 00:22:40,416 --> 00:22:43,958 and there could be sensitivities or allergic reactions to them. 429 00:22:44,208 --> 00:22:48,291 So she drew a small grid on the bottom of my arm 430 00:22:48,458 --> 00:22:51,291 and had a variety of 431 00:22:51,625 --> 00:22:54,541 small needles with different substances on them and 432 00:22:54,708 --> 00:22:58,750 pricked a little area inside each one of those squares, 433 00:22:59,166 --> 00:23:03,125 just to see, you know, if I'd have any reaction to them. 434 00:23:03,750 --> 00:23:06,333 I was also instructed to drink this 435 00:23:06,500 --> 00:23:08,458 liquid that I said smelled like pine. 436 00:23:09,125 --> 00:23:11,541 It's kind of an Amber-colored liquid, if I recall. 437 00:23:11,791 --> 00:23:15,333 And, it did give me a reaction that that evening, 438 00:23:15,500 --> 00:23:17,000 I think I had stomach cramps. 439 00:23:17,166 --> 00:23:20,250 But, I can't really say that caused them. 440 00:23:20,500 --> 00:23:22,125 You know, it's coincidental, so. 441 00:23:22,291 --> 00:23:24,958 But I... I can't officially blame it on that. 442 00:23:33,875 --> 00:23:35,458 When I first began at s4, 443 00:23:35,625 --> 00:23:37,583 I would randomly be taken into a small room, 444 00:23:37,833 --> 00:23:39,250 which contained a table, a chair, 445 00:23:39,416 --> 00:23:41,833 and 120 or so briefings in blue folders. 446 00:23:42,500 --> 00:23:45,833 These reports appeared to be an overview of alien information, 447 00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:48,166 which could be used to brief scientists from any field 448 00:23:48,333 --> 00:23:49,958 about the scope of the whole project, 449 00:23:50,125 --> 00:23:52,291 and not just their specific field of endeavor. 450 00:23:52,458 --> 00:23:55,291 The file on top was project Galileo. 451 00:23:55,541 --> 00:23:58,750 And as it turned out, that's the project that I was part of. 452 00:23:59,083 --> 00:24:03,375 And that clearly... referred to reverse engineering 453 00:24:03,541 --> 00:24:06,166 a recovered alien spacecraft. 454 00:24:06,708 --> 00:24:09,916 My job in this program was to be part of a back engineering team. 455 00:24:10,375 --> 00:24:12,791 Back engineering is the act of taking a finished product 456 00:24:12,958 --> 00:24:15,166 and tearing it apart to find out what makes it tick. 457 00:24:15,791 --> 00:24:17,625 The goal in this program was to see 458 00:24:17,791 --> 00:24:19,125 if the technology of the disc 459 00:24:19,291 --> 00:24:21,291 could be duplicated with earth materials. 460 00:24:23,083 --> 00:24:24,958 Dennis brought us into the lab. He said, 461 00:24:25,125 --> 00:24:27,485 "this is where you're gonna be spending most of your time." 462 00:24:28,125 --> 00:24:30,250 I can see it was a... Typical lab setup. 463 00:24:30,416 --> 00:24:33,333 There was stuff, components, everything all over the place. 464 00:24:33,500 --> 00:24:35,416 And one guy in there, Barry, who... 465 00:24:35,583 --> 00:24:37,375 who got up immediately and was 466 00:24:37,541 --> 00:24:39,750 clearly really happy to see me. 467 00:24:40,500 --> 00:24:43,166 It seems like he used to work with somebody else. 468 00:24:43,333 --> 00:24:45,250 He had a lot to say, he was excited 469 00:24:45,500 --> 00:24:48,083 to show me everything and bring me up to speed. 470 00:24:48,250 --> 00:24:50,208 It was kind of like a little kid at that point. 471 00:24:50,375 --> 00:24:51,500 "Wait till you see this." 472 00:24:51,666 --> 00:24:54,916 And, you know, he'd display how the amplifier, 473 00:24:55,083 --> 00:24:57,708 you know, operates connected to the emitters and 474 00:24:57,875 --> 00:25:01,041 how things operate, even though they're not connected, and... 475 00:25:01,375 --> 00:25:05,083 but yeah, he was... very anxious to show me everything 476 00:25:05,250 --> 00:25:07,583 and anxious to make some progress too. 477 00:25:13,041 --> 00:25:14,666 So this is where he said, 478 00:25:15,291 --> 00:25:17,458 "we're focusing primarily on the 479 00:25:17,625 --> 00:25:19,583 power and propulsion system of the craft." 480 00:25:20,166 --> 00:25:22,333 And I said, "great, 481 00:25:22,875 --> 00:25:25,083 w... what... craft?" 482 00:25:25,791 --> 00:25:28,250 I think he was holding off intentionally, 483 00:25:28,416 --> 00:25:31,791 telling me anything, because what he wanted me to do 484 00:25:32,041 --> 00:25:35,000 was to feel the gravitational field on the reactor. 485 00:25:35,750 --> 00:25:39,958 So he went over, he rotated the emitter and the reactor was on. 486 00:25:40,125 --> 00:25:42,041 He said, "go ahead and try and touch that." 487 00:25:42,541 --> 00:25:44,416 And when I pushed my hands on it, 488 00:25:45,041 --> 00:25:49,250 that was the biggest scientific shock I'd ever had 489 00:25:49,583 --> 00:25:53,666 because there's nothing in the world that can do that. 490 00:25:54,375 --> 00:25:57,541 And he said, "that's what propels the craft. 491 00:25:58,041 --> 00:26:00,541 And that is a gravity generator." 492 00:26:01,166 --> 00:26:04,958 And that... was the moment that... 493 00:26:05,500 --> 00:26:08,333 I realized what was going on. 494 00:26:09,375 --> 00:26:13,625 Barry indicated that what I saw there was 495 00:26:13,791 --> 00:26:16,166 the propulsion system in its entirety. 496 00:26:17,875 --> 00:26:20,000 He started with the reactor and 497 00:26:20,166 --> 00:26:22,166 the small hemisphere on the plate. 498 00:26:22,333 --> 00:26:25,000 Said, "this is apparently the power source." 499 00:26:25,166 --> 00:26:27,250 To the left of that on the ground 500 00:26:27,416 --> 00:26:30,500 was what he referred to as the amplifier. 501 00:26:30,666 --> 00:26:32,250 And to the left of that 502 00:26:32,416 --> 00:26:36,625 at 90 degrees, was a large pipe looking object. 503 00:26:36,791 --> 00:26:38,333 He said that was the emitter. 504 00:26:39,375 --> 00:26:41,375 These function together to produce 505 00:26:41,541 --> 00:26:43,416 a gravity propulsion system. 506 00:26:43,583 --> 00:26:47,125 The power base frequency was created by the reactor. 507 00:26:47,375 --> 00:26:50,291 The amplifier increased its amplitude 508 00:26:50,500 --> 00:26:52,541 and that was channeled into the emitter 509 00:26:52,708 --> 00:26:54,583 and focused or beamed, 510 00:26:54,750 --> 00:26:57,416 wherever you want to provide the propulsion. 511 00:26:57,708 --> 00:27:01,333 Barry shut the system off by rotating the emitter 512 00:27:01,625 --> 00:27:04,500 and then he proceeded to take apart the reactor to 513 00:27:04,666 --> 00:27:06,375 show me it had components too. 514 00:27:06,666 --> 00:27:08,266 When he did that, you were able to touch 515 00:27:08,416 --> 00:27:10,000 the hemisphere in the reactor, 516 00:27:10,625 --> 00:27:13,583 remove the hemisphere and then you can see a small tower 517 00:27:13,750 --> 00:27:15,333 with a tube coming off of it. 518 00:27:15,875 --> 00:27:17,833 That tower had a cap on it. 519 00:27:18,458 --> 00:27:21,541 The cap slid off and inside... 520 00:27:22,083 --> 00:27:24,166 Was a triangular piece of a... 521 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:27,750 almost copper-colored... Material. 522 00:27:29,041 --> 00:27:31,208 It had little slice marks on it 523 00:27:31,541 --> 00:27:34,625 and that material turned out to be element 115, 524 00:27:34,791 --> 00:27:38,583 a super heavy element yet to be discovered at the time. 525 00:27:38,750 --> 00:27:40,150 To start up the reactor, of course, 526 00:27:40,250 --> 00:27:42,000 we need some element 115. 527 00:27:42,166 --> 00:27:44,791 In fact, you need 223 grams, which is just 528 00:27:44,958 --> 00:27:48,291 under half a pound, machined into a wedge like this. 529 00:27:49,125 --> 00:27:52,333 And a piece of 115 this size can be utilized as fuel 530 00:27:52,500 --> 00:27:54,583 for a period of 20 to 30 years. 531 00:27:55,083 --> 00:27:58,958 Element 115's melting point is 1740 degrees celsius 532 00:27:59,125 --> 00:28:01,583 and its standard oxidation state is plus 3. 533 00:28:02,083 --> 00:28:05,708 The atomic radius of 115 is 1.87 angstroms. 534 00:28:06,208 --> 00:28:08,791 The frequency of the carrier wave for element 115's 535 00:28:08,958 --> 00:28:12,958 gravity a wave is 7.46 hertz at a one micron bandwidth. 536 00:28:16,416 --> 00:28:18,625 This is the reactor, and from what 537 00:28:18,791 --> 00:28:21,875 we've been able to determine, it's what powers the craft. 538 00:28:22,375 --> 00:28:24,000 It's made of several components. 539 00:28:25,083 --> 00:28:26,791 First is a removable hemisphere. 540 00:28:28,875 --> 00:28:30,041 There's a tower, 541 00:28:30,583 --> 00:28:32,500 and we'll call our drift tube on the side, 542 00:28:32,666 --> 00:28:33,875 a small cap, 543 00:28:34,625 --> 00:28:35,750 that comes off, 544 00:28:36,208 --> 00:28:38,041 and inside the tower... 545 00:28:39,791 --> 00:28:43,166 is what we think is the fuel, element 115. 546 00:28:44,125 --> 00:28:46,916 The fuel element is placed inside the tower, 547 00:28:48,250 --> 00:28:49,750 cap is placed on, 548 00:28:51,250 --> 00:28:54,125 and then, as soon as the hemisphere 549 00:28:54,750 --> 00:28:57,083 makes a flat connection to the base, 550 00:28:57,958 --> 00:29:00,000 it'll create its own gravitational field. 551 00:29:00,166 --> 00:29:01,333 It becomes operational. 552 00:29:01,500 --> 00:29:02,916 It will push your hands away 553 00:29:03,125 --> 00:29:04,833 as soon as that's sat on there. 554 00:29:05,291 --> 00:29:10,083 And the field is... feels similar to... 555 00:29:10,416 --> 00:29:12,166 Like Poles of a magnet. 556 00:29:12,333 --> 00:29:14,166 There's some elasticity to it. 557 00:29:14,750 --> 00:29:17,958 You could push back on it as hard as you want, 558 00:29:18,125 --> 00:29:20,750 but... and a... a really important thing is 559 00:29:20,916 --> 00:29:24,833 it's not transferring that force to the base. 560 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:26,583 Even though this would move, 561 00:29:27,833 --> 00:29:29,500 you can push on the field 562 00:29:29,875 --> 00:29:31,333 and it wouldn't slide this. 563 00:29:31,500 --> 00:29:33,750 I mean, if you had two magnets with like Poles 564 00:29:33,916 --> 00:29:36,684 and you pushed on one, the other one would go sliding across the table. 565 00:29:36,708 --> 00:29:38,208 That doesn't happen here. 566 00:29:39,041 --> 00:29:40,875 Through x-rays, we were able to determine 567 00:29:41,041 --> 00:29:42,625 that there's a hollow tube 568 00:29:43,125 --> 00:29:45,000 that goes around the base. 569 00:29:45,375 --> 00:29:47,666 We assume that's something like a cyclotron, 570 00:29:48,583 --> 00:29:50,958 where particles are accelerated around 571 00:29:51,125 --> 00:29:53,291 and there's, if you wanna call it an off ramp, 572 00:29:54,083 --> 00:29:57,666 is the drift tube, comes up and interacts in the tower 573 00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:00,333 in some way to produce energy. 574 00:30:00,625 --> 00:30:03,916 Now, this device doesn't produce any heat at all. 575 00:30:04,125 --> 00:30:08,375 It didn't produce one degree... Of temperature change, 576 00:30:08,541 --> 00:30:10,541 no matter how much load it was under. 577 00:30:10,833 --> 00:30:12,291 To turn the reactor on... 578 00:30:13,250 --> 00:30:15,333 the... all the components in the craft 579 00:30:15,500 --> 00:30:18,500 are connected in some way, but not physically. 580 00:30:18,875 --> 00:30:21,666 And we really don't know how that is. 581 00:30:22,333 --> 00:30:25,458 If you take one of the emitters 582 00:30:25,625 --> 00:30:27,625 and you rotate it past 20 degrees, 583 00:30:27,916 --> 00:30:29,333 the reactor will turn on, 584 00:30:30,208 --> 00:30:32,500 and you can no longer even get your hands by it. 585 00:30:33,208 --> 00:30:37,250 Conversely, to turn it off, rotate... the emitter, 586 00:30:37,583 --> 00:30:38,833 the reactor shuts down. 587 00:30:39,458 --> 00:30:42,375 And assuming that's removing the load from the reactor, 588 00:30:42,541 --> 00:30:44,083 I think it's just load sensing. 589 00:30:44,250 --> 00:30:47,041 It sees that the emitter and amplifier wants power 590 00:30:47,333 --> 00:30:49,583 and it turns on, but the exact mechanism 591 00:30:49,750 --> 00:30:52,416 that's taking place there is... is completely unknown. 592 00:30:53,041 --> 00:30:56,083 So I began to feel the field about up here. 593 00:30:57,041 --> 00:30:59,666 And at... at this distance, there's... 594 00:30:59,833 --> 00:31:02,541 y... there's no way you're moving your hands any closer. 595 00:31:03,916 --> 00:31:06,958 But... I guess the most amazing thing is 596 00:31:07,208 --> 00:31:10,250 leaning into it, putting all your force on that, 597 00:31:10,458 --> 00:31:12,375 no... nothing moves at all. 598 00:31:12,833 --> 00:31:16,083 And when the reactor's off, you can easily slide it. 599 00:31:16,416 --> 00:31:19,500 You know, so, that's... that's really impressive. 600 00:31:20,250 --> 00:31:24,583 We call this a gravity propelled craft, a gravity generator. 601 00:31:24,958 --> 00:31:27,541 And we're calling it that because, 602 00:31:27,916 --> 00:31:30,041 we know what... we know the effects of gravity. 603 00:31:30,666 --> 00:31:31,916 We know how it works. 604 00:31:32,416 --> 00:31:35,125 We don't know everything about it, but... 605 00:31:36,041 --> 00:31:38,375 this produces an effect similar to gravity. 606 00:31:38,541 --> 00:31:39,708 So we're calling it that 607 00:31:39,875 --> 00:31:41,875 because we don't know of any other forces 608 00:31:42,416 --> 00:31:43,583 that exist like that. 609 00:31:43,791 --> 00:31:47,375 This could, of course, be something other than gravity. 610 00:31:47,541 --> 00:31:49,166 This could be a completely other force 611 00:31:49,333 --> 00:31:51,000 that we're just not familiar with. 612 00:31:51,166 --> 00:31:53,791 And we're just labeling it, you know, as gravity propulsion, 613 00:31:53,958 --> 00:31:56,916 a gravity field coming off of here, 614 00:31:57,083 --> 00:31:58,875 just because that's all we're familiar with. 615 00:31:59,208 --> 00:32:00,583 But... 616 00:32:01,208 --> 00:32:03,916 Keeping that in mind, we tried to see if it was 617 00:32:04,083 --> 00:32:05,416 possible to shield it 618 00:32:05,875 --> 00:32:08,000 with, different materials. 619 00:32:08,166 --> 00:32:12,333 You know, we tried cardboard, plastic, metal, everything. 620 00:32:12,500 --> 00:32:16,833 And the field... the field interacts with everything. 621 00:32:17,166 --> 00:32:20,583 And there's nothing really that shields it. 622 00:32:21,083 --> 00:32:22,958 So... 623 00:32:23,541 --> 00:32:25,500 You know, it's... again, it behaves like 624 00:32:25,666 --> 00:32:27,250 gravity does, but... 625 00:32:28,166 --> 00:32:29,916 it could certainly be something else. 626 00:32:32,458 --> 00:32:35,291 Part of the fear was based in the fact that 627 00:32:35,458 --> 00:32:37,791 they had said I was replacing somebody 628 00:32:37,958 --> 00:32:39,458 that was killed in the project. 629 00:32:39,958 --> 00:32:43,583 They were being pressed to produce some results. 630 00:32:44,333 --> 00:32:46,833 And, I think, from what I understand, 631 00:32:47,250 --> 00:32:51,625 they cut into an operating reactor and it detonated. 632 00:32:56,250 --> 00:32:57,666 It's not like it was a... 633 00:32:58,291 --> 00:33:00,708 you know, a research project where you're... 634 00:33:01,041 --> 00:33:02,375 you're really into it. 635 00:33:02,708 --> 00:33:06,250 It was... it was exactly like disarming a bomb... 636 00:33:07,250 --> 00:33:08,333 every single day. 637 00:33:08,750 --> 00:33:11,000 That's what it was like, because, a... once again, 638 00:33:11,166 --> 00:33:13,083 we had no idea what we were working with. 639 00:33:13,250 --> 00:33:16,750 And we were working with absolutely tremendous 640 00:33:16,916 --> 00:33:18,666 amounts of energy, 641 00:33:18,833 --> 00:33:22,458 tremendous amounts of power, in very condensed sources. 642 00:33:22,833 --> 00:33:24,166 The slightest wrong move 643 00:33:24,333 --> 00:33:26,333 could release a tremendous amount of energy. 644 00:33:32,625 --> 00:33:34,625 So as part of our investigation, 645 00:33:34,791 --> 00:33:36,708 we go through all the normal protocols. 646 00:33:36,875 --> 00:33:39,000 We contact the U.S. air force at nellis. 647 00:33:39,166 --> 00:33:41,166 I'm asking questions about area 51. 648 00:33:41,333 --> 00:33:42,791 They won't answer any. 649 00:33:42,958 --> 00:33:45,625 Later on, I asked them about a place called s4. 650 00:33:45,791 --> 00:33:47,708 I called the nellis air force base, 651 00:33:47,875 --> 00:33:49,833 with their public information office, 652 00:33:50,041 --> 00:33:51,875 somebody I had got to know over the years, 653 00:33:52,041 --> 00:33:54,250 "do you have any place called s4 654 00:33:54,583 --> 00:33:55,583 on the nellis range?" 655 00:33:55,708 --> 00:33:57,083 And the answer was yes. 656 00:33:57,291 --> 00:33:59,091 And in fact, they said there's more than one. 657 00:33:59,541 --> 00:34:01,583 I said "can you tell us where it is?" "No." 658 00:34:01,833 --> 00:34:03,916 "Can you tell us what goes on there?" "No." 659 00:34:04,666 --> 00:34:06,041 "But it's real?" "Yes." 660 00:34:06,208 --> 00:34:07,648 And I asked them about papoose lake. 661 00:34:07,791 --> 00:34:09,671 "You got anything there?" "No. Absolutely not." 662 00:34:09,750 --> 00:34:13,166 "Nothing, ever." And I'd asked people who worked out there, 663 00:34:13,416 --> 00:34:16,958 anything at s4, papoose lake. "Never, ever. 664 00:34:17,541 --> 00:34:20,021 We don't even have a way to get there. There's nothing there." 665 00:34:20,333 --> 00:34:21,791 I knew that was not true. 666 00:34:22,041 --> 00:34:24,001 You know, we eventually got some satellite photos 667 00:34:24,041 --> 00:34:26,958 that showed us there's a road from groom down to papoose. 668 00:34:27,250 --> 00:34:28,833 Why do you build a road down there to 669 00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:31,625 a place that doesn't exist and there's nothing there? 670 00:34:31,791 --> 00:34:34,083 The s4 installation is built into the mountain, 671 00:34:34,250 --> 00:34:36,041 and the hangar doors are built on an angle 672 00:34:36,208 --> 00:34:38,041 commensurate with the slope of the mountain. 673 00:34:38,333 --> 00:34:40,708 These doors are covered with a sand textured coating 674 00:34:40,875 --> 00:34:43,500 to blend in with the side of the mountain and the desert floor. 675 00:34:43,958 --> 00:34:45,833 - So here's the entrance, right here. - Okay. 676 00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:49,583 This is... this is the area where the... the hangar doors are. 677 00:34:49,750 --> 00:34:51,208 And then this is, let's say, 678 00:34:51,375 --> 00:34:53,083 the side door, where the mouse is here. 679 00:34:53,250 --> 00:34:57,083 And as of the f... 25th of June 2024, 680 00:34:57,541 --> 00:35:01,458 the terrain here is so, let's call it beige or yellow, 681 00:35:01,625 --> 00:35:03,583 which was not like that. 682 00:35:03,750 --> 00:35:07,583 Because if I click on the timeline, 683 00:35:07,750 --> 00:35:09,958 you can go back in time in Google earth.- 684 00:35:10,125 --> 00:35:12,708 so... if I go just one notch, 685 00:35:12,875 --> 00:35:14,250 look at... look at the difference 686 00:35:14,416 --> 00:35:15,392 - in color of the terrain. - Yeah, yeah- 687 00:35:15,416 --> 00:35:16,958 that's the actual color. 688 00:35:17,750 --> 00:35:23,125 And in the... the 2022 version of the satellite imagery, 689 00:35:23,333 --> 00:35:25,916 you actually see detail here. 690 00:35:26,500 --> 00:35:29,125 And if you get closer, you get... you even see 691 00:35:29,291 --> 00:35:30,958 the Joshua trees and all that. 692 00:35:31,125 --> 00:35:34,250 But if I bring this back to the latest, 693 00:35:34,416 --> 00:35:37,000 - look how... everything disappeared. - -Everything disappears. 694 00:35:37,166 --> 00:35:39,541 Which is clearly intentional. 695 00:35:39,708 --> 00:35:42,166 But what it did is 696 00:35:42,458 --> 00:35:44,958 you no longer... so, you can actually fade... zoom out 697 00:35:45,125 --> 00:35:48,500 - you'll see this beige... - Look how they... - wow! 698 00:35:48,666 --> 00:35:49,875 Isn't that in... interesting? 699 00:35:50,041 --> 00:35:51,750 Interesting. 700 00:35:51,916 --> 00:35:53,226 - It's unbelievably intentional. - It's... it's unbelievable. 701 00:35:53,250 --> 00:35:55,416 Look how incredibly... 702 00:35:55,583 --> 00:35:58,250 - look how they identified that area. - Let's just pick 703 00:35:58,416 --> 00:36:00,059 - papoose lake and fuck it up. - Yeah, did you... you saw that? 704 00:36:00,083 --> 00:36:01,603 - So you can't see anything. - Yeah. So 705 00:36:01,750 --> 00:36:03,708 - look at that. - Yeah. It's just s4. 706 00:36:03,875 --> 00:36:04,916 Exactly. 707 00:36:05,416 --> 00:36:07,583 Isn't that something? 708 00:36:07,750 --> 00:36:09,750 - Yeah. - So now their mistake 709 00:36:10,166 --> 00:36:16,000 is that as we zoom into their washed out terrain 710 00:36:16,333 --> 00:36:19,666 around the papoose area and about... and around s4, 711 00:36:19,958 --> 00:36:23,541 their new filter, that they put in there 712 00:36:23,708 --> 00:36:25,708 allows us to see... 713 00:36:26,041 --> 00:36:26,806 All right. 714 00:36:26,830 --> 00:36:29,791 The tracks, which you couldn't see earlier. 715 00:36:29,958 --> 00:36:33,500 So now you have this incredibly clear... 716 00:36:33,666 --> 00:36:35,875 yeah, they say where no one ever drives, it's, 717 00:36:36,041 --> 00:36:37,583 - it's to... yeah. - Yeah. 718 00:36:37,750 --> 00:36:41,750 And so you even have on bordering the terrain area 719 00:36:41,916 --> 00:36:43,500 and the actual dry lake, 720 00:36:43,791 --> 00:36:45,875 if you get really close, you can 721 00:36:46,041 --> 00:36:47,708 - yeah, yeah. - Actually see the tracks. 722 00:36:47,875 --> 00:36:49,934 Yeah, well, yeah, we drove right along that dry lake. 723 00:36:49,958 --> 00:36:52,125 That's unquestionably where we were. 724 00:36:55,166 --> 00:36:57,083 And so, interestingly, 725 00:36:57,250 --> 00:36:59,583 we see the tracks, which are literally 726 00:36:59,750 --> 00:37:01,500 - right by s4. - Yeah. 727 00:37:01,666 --> 00:37:03,791 And then if you go to this other road, 728 00:37:03,958 --> 00:37:05,541 see, there's a little road here.- 729 00:37:05,708 --> 00:37:09,250 okay, which is very near s4 and we go here. 730 00:37:09,416 --> 00:37:11,833 You can clearly see the tracks, look at them 731 00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:13,708 going in every direction, -yeah, yeah. 732 00:37:13,875 --> 00:37:15,555 And you... look at all the... the traffic. 733 00:37:15,708 --> 00:37:17,125 - Yeah. - Right? 734 00:37:17,291 --> 00:37:18,891 Yeah, that's not one guy driving around. 735 00:37:18,958 --> 00:37:20,642 No, that's not one guy dri... exactly, so... 736 00:37:20,666 --> 00:37:22,708 Again, there's no public out there. 737 00:37:23,000 --> 00:37:25,125 So, what are you doing? Yeah. 738 00:37:25,291 --> 00:37:27,017 This is Google earth, so it's not like we're... 739 00:37:27,041 --> 00:37:28,791 we're making this up. This is online. 740 00:37:28,958 --> 00:37:31,416 Anybody can actually go there and actually do the timeline. 741 00:37:31,583 --> 00:37:35,041 'Cause if I just click here on 2022... 742 00:37:35,750 --> 00:37:36,958 Oop, just let me do that. 743 00:37:37,166 --> 00:37:38,416 - There. There you go. - Yeah. 744 00:37:38,583 --> 00:37:40,083 It's... it's back to normal. 745 00:37:40,250 --> 00:37:43,416 And now you can actually see... the terrain. 746 00:37:43,875 --> 00:37:47,833 Now we'll go into the more interesting part where... 747 00:37:48,708 --> 00:37:50,291 There's a series of photographs. 748 00:37:50,458 --> 00:37:53,458 We already had gone through this, about a year ago. 749 00:37:53,625 --> 00:37:56,250 And there was a person who had 750 00:37:56,416 --> 00:37:59,541 flown into the restricted airspace out there 751 00:37:59,750 --> 00:38:03,125 and had a very good quality camera on board 752 00:38:03,291 --> 00:38:05,541 of his private plane, 753 00:38:05,875 --> 00:38:09,416 and snapped about eight to 900 images 754 00:38:09,583 --> 00:38:12,291 of area 51, the groom lake facility, 755 00:38:12,458 --> 00:38:15,750 papoose mountain range, papoose lake and all that area. 756 00:38:15,916 --> 00:38:18,833 And... and did an incredible tour. 757 00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:21,708 He even had the Nevada test site where there's all the craters 758 00:38:21,875 --> 00:38:23,291 of all the bombs that blew up. 759 00:38:24,041 --> 00:38:28,208 And there's this picture, that is publicly available. 760 00:38:28,375 --> 00:38:31,750 It's been publicly available now for over five years. 761 00:38:31,916 --> 00:38:36,666 And this is a picture that was taken at about 17 miles 762 00:38:36,833 --> 00:38:39,625 from the papoose lake area, 763 00:38:39,791 --> 00:38:42,208 where the hill is located, where 764 00:38:42,375 --> 00:38:44,416 you said s4 was located. 765 00:38:44,583 --> 00:38:47,333 Initially, the picture was utilized 766 00:38:47,500 --> 00:38:49,916 by a whole bunch of people online saying, 767 00:38:50,083 --> 00:38:53,833 "as you can see, whatever Bob Lazar said was untrue. 768 00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:55,375 There's nothing there." 769 00:38:55,541 --> 00:38:58,000 Obviously... the picture doesn't show anything. 770 00:38:58,166 --> 00:39:02,041 Well, all you have to do is play with the contrast, 771 00:39:02,208 --> 00:39:05,083 play with the... the... the levels in the image. 772 00:39:05,708 --> 00:39:07,458 And if you look carefully 773 00:39:07,625 --> 00:39:10,125 in this version here, where it's... 774 00:39:10,291 --> 00:39:11,916 the contrast has been changed, 775 00:39:12,458 --> 00:39:14,041 the... as we zoom... 776 00:39:16,291 --> 00:39:18,583 - look what you see. - -Yeah, you can start seeing... 777 00:39:19,708 --> 00:39:21,468 - You see them clearly right there. - -Yeah. 778 00:39:21,541 --> 00:39:24,125 Yeah, the slanted rectangular doors, yeah. 779 00:39:24,375 --> 00:39:26,291 And what's really interesting about it 780 00:39:26,583 --> 00:39:28,291 is that if you look carefully... 781 00:39:28,583 --> 00:39:30,625 They're like they're... I mean, they're made 782 00:39:30,791 --> 00:39:32,583 to not be visible. 783 00:39:32,791 --> 00:39:35,416 - Yeah. - So yeah, you wouldn't expect them, 784 00:39:35,583 --> 00:39:37,666 on a normal photo to show up. 785 00:39:37,833 --> 00:39:40,101 I mean, they're trying to hide them from satellite photos. 786 00:39:40,125 --> 00:39:43,666 So, but, yeah, this seems to be an effective way 787 00:39:43,833 --> 00:39:45,875 of bringing that resolution out. 788 00:39:46,041 --> 00:39:47,958 And if you look carefully, 789 00:39:48,500 --> 00:39:52,250 the first one is slightly wider. 790 00:39:52,708 --> 00:39:55,125 - That's a good point. That's a big hangar. - Then, that's... 791 00:39:55,291 --> 00:39:57,083 yeah. Hey, that's a really good point. 792 00:39:57,250 --> 00:39:59,208 - Look at that. - Yeah, you can actually see it. 793 00:39:59,375 --> 00:40:00,476 - Yeah. - Look at the difference 794 00:40:00,500 --> 00:40:01,750 between the... the first one 795 00:40:01,916 --> 00:40:03,125 and the second and the third. 796 00:40:03,291 --> 00:40:04,833 - Yeah! I've never seen that. - Yeah. 797 00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:06,601 - Yeah. That's... that's pretty cool. - Yeah. 798 00:40:06,625 --> 00:40:08,958 So it doesn't provide the world evidence that 799 00:40:09,125 --> 00:40:10,625 there were flying saucers there 800 00:40:10,791 --> 00:40:12,309 - or it doesn't say... - no, of course not. 801 00:40:12,333 --> 00:40:15,333 Yeah. But it... it is incredibly interesting 802 00:40:15,500 --> 00:40:19,208 that the image shows pretty much exactly what you had said 803 00:40:19,375 --> 00:40:21,041 in 1989. 804 00:40:21,333 --> 00:40:25,083 And if you hadn't been there, and you hadn't seen that, 805 00:40:25,250 --> 00:40:28,750 then you predicted something that was pretty amazing. 806 00:40:28,916 --> 00:40:31,625 Yeah. Yeah. Well, you could say that about a lot of stuff. 807 00:40:31,791 --> 00:40:33,333 I said... yeah, yeah, right. 808 00:40:33,500 --> 00:40:36,541 Everything I say just happens to be the way it is. 809 00:40:36,708 --> 00:40:39,833 But, yeah, that's... that's fascinating. 810 00:41:09,291 --> 00:41:12,500 The second time I went out to the site, 811 00:41:12,875 --> 00:41:15,875 the bus, as it arrived at the s4 facility 812 00:41:16,041 --> 00:41:18,916 did not make the left turn and slowed down. 813 00:41:19,208 --> 00:41:22,291 It stopped in front of the hill. 814 00:41:22,625 --> 00:41:25,750 And when I got out of the bus and walked around to the front, 815 00:41:25,916 --> 00:41:29,458 I can see a full view of where we were working. 816 00:41:29,625 --> 00:41:33,833 And this time I can see there was a large hangar door open 817 00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:35,791 in the side of the hill. 818 00:41:36,083 --> 00:41:38,708 Inside the hangar door... was... 819 00:41:39,250 --> 00:41:41,750 The sport model, the flying saucer. 820 00:42:04,875 --> 00:42:06,476 The first thing that went through my mind is, 821 00:42:06,500 --> 00:42:09,625 "well, this explains all the silly ufo reports 822 00:42:09,791 --> 00:42:12,166 where we are making a secret fighter 823 00:42:12,333 --> 00:42:14,083 that's in the shape of a flying saucer. 824 00:42:14,250 --> 00:42:16,708 And... that's all there is to it." 825 00:42:17,583 --> 00:42:21,958 We walked into the hangar and I was instructed to walk 826 00:42:22,125 --> 00:42:24,083 with my eyes forward and 827 00:42:24,333 --> 00:42:26,458 just enter the door at the end of the hangar. 828 00:42:26,666 --> 00:42:29,125 I slid my hand along the side of the craft, 829 00:42:29,291 --> 00:42:32,166 got reprimanded right away for doing that. 830 00:42:32,458 --> 00:42:36,458 But the craft itself had a part of the hatch was removed, or... 831 00:42:36,916 --> 00:42:38,583 I guess it's the entire hatch. 832 00:42:38,750 --> 00:42:41,875 And you could see right next to the hatch, 833 00:42:42,125 --> 00:42:45,500 there was a backwards American flag stuck on there. 834 00:42:45,750 --> 00:42:47,791 Again, that kind of cemented into my mind, 835 00:42:47,958 --> 00:42:49,625 "well, this is an American product." 836 00:42:49,916 --> 00:42:51,541 Why they put the backwards American flag 837 00:42:51,708 --> 00:42:52,916 on there, I'll never know. 838 00:42:53,083 --> 00:42:55,500 But, anyway, we continued in 839 00:42:55,833 --> 00:42:58,791 and, I went into the lab from there. 840 00:42:58,958 --> 00:43:02,250 But that was the first time I ever had contact with the craft. 841 00:43:07,625 --> 00:43:09,750 Barry was showing me how, 842 00:43:09,916 --> 00:43:12,166 the field comes out of the emitter 843 00:43:12,750 --> 00:43:13,916 and what it can do. 844 00:43:14,416 --> 00:43:17,125 And he took a regular kitchen candle, 845 00:43:17,291 --> 00:43:20,125 lit it, and he put it near the mouth 846 00:43:20,333 --> 00:43:22,083 of the... the emitter. 847 00:43:22,541 --> 00:43:23,625 And... 848 00:43:24,125 --> 00:43:25,916 When he rotated the emitter... 849 00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:28,583 the flame stopped flickering. 850 00:43:28,750 --> 00:43:31,541 It just stood like it was a photograph of itself. 851 00:43:31,791 --> 00:43:33,166 Barry said, you know, 852 00:43:33,333 --> 00:43:35,041 "what do you think is unusual about that?" 853 00:43:35,208 --> 00:43:37,791 I said, "aside from the fact the candle's not moving anymore?" 854 00:43:38,083 --> 00:43:39,750 And he said, "just think about it." 855 00:43:40,708 --> 00:43:42,125 I said, "yeah, it's still 856 00:43:42,291 --> 00:43:44,000 emitting light, and it's not moving. 857 00:43:44,166 --> 00:43:46,250 So the photons are still moving." 858 00:43:46,416 --> 00:43:48,166 But again, if it's a gravity wave 859 00:43:48,333 --> 00:43:50,208 coming out of there, gravity bends light. 860 00:43:50,375 --> 00:43:51,875 It should look distorted. 861 00:43:52,041 --> 00:43:54,208 I should... I should either not be able to see it 862 00:43:54,833 --> 00:43:58,333 or the whole image of it gets bent or distorted, but, 863 00:43:58,625 --> 00:44:01,208 how can the flame stop moving 864 00:44:01,625 --> 00:44:04,875 and it still be emitting light without any distortion? 865 00:44:05,041 --> 00:44:08,666 So, these are some of the things that really made me think, 866 00:44:09,458 --> 00:44:10,833 "it's not a gravity wave. 867 00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:12,958 There's something else 'cause it's not behaving 868 00:44:13,125 --> 00:44:15,125 exactly like that." 869 00:44:15,666 --> 00:44:19,250 So... and also he removed the candle 870 00:44:19,416 --> 00:44:21,833 and then rotated the emitter. 871 00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:23,226 I don't know if it was another direction 872 00:44:23,250 --> 00:44:24,541 or more of the same way, 873 00:44:24,791 --> 00:44:27,416 but it made a little black ball in the air 874 00:44:27,583 --> 00:44:29,458 where no light was esca... escaping, 875 00:44:29,625 --> 00:44:31,083 looking like a little black hole. 876 00:44:31,625 --> 00:44:33,875 But no, you could just tell there was no light 877 00:44:34,291 --> 00:44:36,416 at the focal point, right in the air. 878 00:44:36,583 --> 00:44:38,250 It was just, a dark area. 879 00:44:38,791 --> 00:44:40,791 So there it's affecting light, 880 00:44:41,666 --> 00:44:43,916 but it wasn't in the candle test before that. 881 00:44:44,083 --> 00:44:49,416 So, it... it's a really unusual, unusual thing. 882 00:44:52,750 --> 00:44:56,666 One time in particular that we got somewhat mischievous, 883 00:44:56,833 --> 00:45:01,375 we had a reactor operating and the field 884 00:45:01,666 --> 00:45:05,291 that develops around it is somewhat elastic. 885 00:45:05,500 --> 00:45:08,333 So, you can take and try and 886 00:45:08,666 --> 00:45:12,041 push on the hemisphere with your hands and you can't... 887 00:45:12,583 --> 00:45:14,791 can't touch it. It repels like... 888 00:45:15,041 --> 00:45:17,875 like Poles of a magnet, but somewhat elastic. 889 00:45:18,250 --> 00:45:21,583 So, to demonstrate this, Barry had a golf ball. 890 00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:25,333 He threw it at the reactor, and it didn't hit it. 891 00:45:25,500 --> 00:45:29,125 It rebounded off and then knocked the ceiling tile loose, 892 00:45:29,291 --> 00:45:31,375 which we immediately panicked 893 00:45:31,541 --> 00:45:33,541 because we knew Dennis was coming back in. 894 00:45:33,708 --> 00:45:36,666 So we had to scramble to replace the ceiling tile and 895 00:45:36,958 --> 00:45:38,625 clean up all the little fragments of 896 00:45:38,791 --> 00:45:40,333 particles that dislodged from it. 897 00:45:43,375 --> 00:45:46,500 I heard it a couple times "meet me in the big hangar." 898 00:45:46,666 --> 00:45:49,875 And I don't remember if it was Dennis or Barry 899 00:45:50,083 --> 00:45:52,916 that also referred to where the sport model was. 900 00:45:53,083 --> 00:45:55,375 That hangar was the big hangar. 901 00:45:55,833 --> 00:45:57,375 The hangar that housed the sport model 902 00:45:57,541 --> 00:45:59,083 was like a typical airplane hangar 903 00:45:59,250 --> 00:46:00,541 with the exception of the angled 904 00:46:00,708 --> 00:46:02,166 doors that I mentioned before. 905 00:46:02,333 --> 00:46:03,934 This hangar was equipped with typical tools 906 00:46:03,958 --> 00:46:05,750 and extensive electronic equipment. 907 00:46:06,250 --> 00:46:08,333 It also had a machine with an X-ray emblem on it 908 00:46:08,500 --> 00:46:11,041 and an overhead crane rated at 20,000 pounds. 909 00:46:11,416 --> 00:46:14,166 Equipment in this hangar was marked with a black number 41 910 00:46:14,333 --> 00:46:15,833 with a white circle around it. 911 00:46:16,250 --> 00:46:19,791 Well, the hangar was lit by Mercury vapor lights. 912 00:46:20,166 --> 00:46:21,750 I don't... cone-shaped lights. 913 00:46:21,916 --> 00:46:24,125 There was a countless number of them on the ceiling. 914 00:46:24,291 --> 00:46:28,375 In addition to those, there were, tripod halogen lights, 915 00:46:28,541 --> 00:46:30,250 dual head halogen lights set up. 916 00:46:30,458 --> 00:46:32,625 And those really provided a lot of bright light 917 00:46:32,791 --> 00:46:34,250 for working close up and, 918 00:46:34,583 --> 00:46:37,875 those were a lot more useful than the overhead lights. 919 00:46:40,166 --> 00:46:41,625 I had at least partial views 920 00:46:41,791 --> 00:46:44,083 of the nine different discs out at s4. 921 00:46:44,250 --> 00:46:46,666 But the one I'm going to describe to you now 922 00:46:46,875 --> 00:46:48,583 is the one in which I not only saw 923 00:46:48,750 --> 00:46:50,541 two of the three interior levels, 924 00:46:51,083 --> 00:46:53,375 but I also saw it fully functional in flight. 925 00:46:53,916 --> 00:46:57,125 This particular disc appeared to be in excellent condition. 926 00:46:57,375 --> 00:46:58,815 And because of its sleek appearance, 927 00:46:58,958 --> 00:47:00,625 I nicknamed it "the sport model." 928 00:47:01,666 --> 00:47:04,083 Now, previously I had estimated the sport model to be 929 00:47:04,250 --> 00:47:06,750 about 15 feet high and about 40 feet wide. 930 00:47:06,958 --> 00:47:09,583 But since then I've enlisted some expert help 931 00:47:09,750 --> 00:47:11,375 from the field of computer imaging. 932 00:47:11,625 --> 00:47:13,500 And together we've scaled the disc up 933 00:47:13,666 --> 00:47:16,333 from the size of components which I had a close look at 934 00:47:16,500 --> 00:47:19,250 and could accurately establish their actual size. 935 00:47:19,541 --> 00:47:22,166 From this analysis I'm now presenting to you 936 00:47:22,333 --> 00:47:24,375 the most accurate information I can convey 937 00:47:24,541 --> 00:47:26,625 regarding the disc's physical structure. 938 00:47:26,833 --> 00:47:28,750 The sport model is 16 feet tall 939 00:47:28,916 --> 00:47:31,416 and 52 feet 9 inches in diameter. 940 00:47:32,375 --> 00:47:34,125 The exterior skin of the disc is metal, 941 00:47:34,291 --> 00:47:36,625 which is the color of unpolished stainless steel. 942 00:47:37,250 --> 00:47:39,875 The sport model sits on its belly when it's not energized 943 00:47:40,041 --> 00:47:42,458 and not the stereotypical tripod legs 944 00:47:42,750 --> 00:47:45,791 that folklore usually associates with this type of craft. 945 00:47:46,666 --> 00:47:48,166 As you can see the entry hatch 946 00:47:48,333 --> 00:47:50,500 is located on the upper half of the disc 947 00:47:50,750 --> 00:47:52,750 with just the bottom portion of the door 948 00:47:52,916 --> 00:47:54,875 wrapping around the center lip of the disc. 949 00:47:55,333 --> 00:47:58,166 The interior of the disc is divided into three levels. 950 00:47:58,750 --> 00:48:01,250 The lower level is where the three gravity emitters 951 00:48:01,416 --> 00:48:03,250 and their wave guides are located. 952 00:48:04,625 --> 00:48:05,958 These are the integral components 953 00:48:06,125 --> 00:48:07,708 of the propulsion system 954 00:48:07,875 --> 00:48:10,541 that are used to amplify and focus the gravity "a" wave. 955 00:48:10,875 --> 00:48:14,291 The reactor is located directly above the three gravity emitters 956 00:48:14,458 --> 00:48:17,500 on the center level, and is in fact, centered between them. 957 00:48:18,083 --> 00:48:20,458 The center level of the disc houses the amplifier heads 958 00:48:20,625 --> 00:48:22,708 as well as the seats which were too small and 959 00:48:22,875 --> 00:48:24,458 too low to the floor to be functional 960 00:48:24,625 --> 00:48:25,875 for adult human beings. 961 00:48:26,166 --> 00:48:27,750 The walls of the center level are all 962 00:48:27,916 --> 00:48:29,583 divided into archways. 963 00:48:29,750 --> 00:48:32,041 At one point in time when the disc was energized 964 00:48:32,333 --> 00:48:34,375 one of the archways became transparent 965 00:48:34,541 --> 00:48:36,666 and you could see the area outside of it, 966 00:48:36,916 --> 00:48:39,000 just as if the archway was a window. 967 00:48:39,541 --> 00:48:41,041 Then a form of writing, 968 00:48:41,208 --> 00:48:43,125 which was unlike any alphabetic, scientific, 969 00:48:43,291 --> 00:48:45,250 or mathematical symbols I've ever seen, 970 00:48:45,416 --> 00:48:48,458 began to appear on one side of the transparent archway. 971 00:48:48,750 --> 00:48:51,291 I was never given access to the upper level of the disc 972 00:48:51,458 --> 00:48:54,708 so I can't enlighten you as to what the porthole-like areas are 973 00:48:54,916 --> 00:48:57,291 other than that, I can assure you, they're not portholes. 974 00:49:00,583 --> 00:49:03,125 Any time... I was in the big hangar 975 00:49:03,291 --> 00:49:06,750 my eyes were always focused right on the sport model. 976 00:49:07,250 --> 00:49:10,208 There could have been fires going on on either side of me 977 00:49:10,375 --> 00:49:13,041 and I would still have been looking at it. 978 00:49:13,458 --> 00:49:15,500 It... it was that captivating. 979 00:49:16,083 --> 00:49:17,875 When I was close to the sport model, 980 00:49:18,250 --> 00:49:21,000 I really focused on the skin of the craft. 981 00:49:21,416 --> 00:49:24,000 What it looked like, how it changed, the color. 982 00:49:24,833 --> 00:49:28,041 It has a small antenna looking device which is actually 983 00:49:28,208 --> 00:49:30,500 a waveguide, that protrudes from the top. 984 00:49:30,833 --> 00:49:33,458 It is like a pewter gray in color. 985 00:49:33,750 --> 00:49:35,208 It appears to be metal. 986 00:49:35,375 --> 00:49:37,083 I felt it. It's cold. 987 00:49:37,333 --> 00:49:40,500 It may not be. It might be some advanced ceramic of some type. 988 00:49:42,041 --> 00:49:44,333 So the body of the craft had ripples. 989 00:49:44,500 --> 00:49:47,500 The... one of them we call the insulation ring. 990 00:49:47,708 --> 00:49:49,583 It was a dark black color. 991 00:49:49,958 --> 00:49:51,583 The only thing on the outside 992 00:49:51,750 --> 00:49:53,708 that was a different color than the craft. 993 00:49:53,958 --> 00:49:55,541 We call it the insulation ring because 994 00:49:55,708 --> 00:49:57,708 when the craft is in operation 995 00:49:58,166 --> 00:50:00,750 there is a high voltage detectable on... 996 00:50:01,291 --> 00:50:02,666 on the skin of the craft, 997 00:50:02,958 --> 00:50:05,833 but that high voltage is not present above that ring. 998 00:50:06,500 --> 00:50:09,375 The upper part of the craft above the insulation ring 999 00:50:09,583 --> 00:50:11,500 were what we call the planar arrays. 1000 00:50:11,666 --> 00:50:15,791 Flat window-looking, porthole-looking openings in the craft. 1001 00:50:15,958 --> 00:50:18,375 They... they were unusually dark. 1002 00:50:18,583 --> 00:50:22,333 Really dark. Almost looked like holes, although there weren't. 1003 00:50:23,208 --> 00:50:27,083 It was theorized that they were used to determine the craft's 1004 00:50:27,250 --> 00:50:28,750 location in space. 1005 00:50:28,958 --> 00:50:31,666 Each one of them, looking out in space 1006 00:50:31,833 --> 00:50:35,250 apparently looking at star positions or whatever e... 1007 00:50:35,541 --> 00:50:38,750 energy or light it uses to locate its place. 1008 00:50:38,916 --> 00:50:42,375 Each one looking in a different direction and then 1009 00:50:42,625 --> 00:50:44,750 some sort of computer, 1010 00:50:44,916 --> 00:50:47,416 in the upper level that takes that data 1011 00:50:47,875 --> 00:50:50,291 and figures out its location. 1012 00:50:51,500 --> 00:50:54,083 Again, I may be completely wrong, 1013 00:50:54,458 --> 00:50:56,642 or the people that came up with that may be completely wrong 1014 00:50:56,666 --> 00:50:59,125 but I would agree with that just looking at it, that... 1015 00:50:59,750 --> 00:51:02,500 that it has to be something along those lines. 1016 00:51:02,958 --> 00:51:04,166 I walked up to the stairs 1017 00:51:04,333 --> 00:51:06,041 that led to the entrance of the craft. 1018 00:51:06,875 --> 00:51:10,208 I remember, climbing the stairs, how excited I was, 1019 00:51:10,750 --> 00:51:13,625 to finally get to see what's inside the craft. 1020 00:51:15,041 --> 00:51:17,875 When I got to the top of the stairs I can clearly see 1021 00:51:18,041 --> 00:51:20,166 the reversed American flag to my left. 1022 00:51:20,958 --> 00:51:23,333 The hatchway is fairly small and I put 1023 00:51:23,666 --> 00:51:27,250 my hands on both sides of it to bend down to go inside 1024 00:51:27,583 --> 00:51:30,291 and when I did, my hand was near 1025 00:51:30,791 --> 00:51:33,666 the reversed American flag so I noticed the exact size, 1026 00:51:33,833 --> 00:51:36,958 it was just a little more than a span, a little more than 1027 00:51:37,375 --> 00:51:39,291 you know, as far as my fingers stretched 1028 00:51:39,458 --> 00:51:42,875 and I glanced down and looked at the security guard 1029 00:51:43,041 --> 00:51:45,958 who was staring at me and just kind of gave him a smile, 1030 00:51:46,416 --> 00:51:48,875 and, you know, proceeded into the craft. 1031 00:51:59,000 --> 00:52:02,875 I was shocked at how sparse the inside of the craft was. 1032 00:52:03,291 --> 00:52:06,291 Everything was the same color, the same texture, 1033 00:52:06,750 --> 00:52:09,083 and it all appeared to be the same material. 1034 00:52:09,416 --> 00:52:12,708 Virtually everything had a radius of curvature to it 1035 00:52:12,916 --> 00:52:15,125 and everything looked like it was molded together, 1036 00:52:15,375 --> 00:52:17,208 with the exception of the reactor. 1037 00:52:17,416 --> 00:52:19,583 Even though there were two tripod lights set up 1038 00:52:19,750 --> 00:52:22,500 inside the craft, it was still very dark. 1039 00:52:23,291 --> 00:52:25,375 I've often described the interior of the craft 1040 00:52:25,541 --> 00:52:27,166 as being very ominous. 1041 00:52:28,875 --> 00:52:30,625 I got to look inside and it had 1042 00:52:31,166 --> 00:52:33,958 really small chairs and I think that was the first... 1043 00:52:34,833 --> 00:52:37,458 confirmation I had, that was just a shocking thing 1044 00:52:37,625 --> 00:52:40,125 because it... every time before that I was able to label it 1045 00:52:40,291 --> 00:52:41,416 "well this is just..." 1046 00:52:42,875 --> 00:52:44,458 A little advance that a group of 1047 00:52:44,625 --> 00:52:46,309 scientists had formed and, you know, they're 1048 00:52:46,333 --> 00:52:48,059 keeping it secret " and," yeah, we could have built 1049 00:52:48,083 --> 00:52:49,958 a big disc like that, that's no problem and 1050 00:52:50,125 --> 00:52:52,583 "you know, we could have adapted these to make it fly," but... 1051 00:52:53,625 --> 00:52:55,309 why does it have little furniture inside? 1052 00:52:55,333 --> 00:52:57,053 Essentially a little seat and now and it... 1053 00:52:57,458 --> 00:53:00,083 and things began to click together just all too fast. 1054 00:53:01,583 --> 00:53:03,916 I was in there with my lab partner Barry 1055 00:53:04,458 --> 00:53:08,041 and there was also another team working elsewhere in the craft. 1056 00:53:08,833 --> 00:53:11,458 While going over the reactor placement 1057 00:53:11,625 --> 00:53:14,375 Barry drew my attention to the archways 1058 00:53:14,583 --> 00:53:16,625 that all surrounded the interior of the craft 1059 00:53:16,791 --> 00:53:19,916 explaining they were hollow, and actually waveguides. 1060 00:53:20,250 --> 00:53:21,791 The waveguide, which... 1061 00:53:22,125 --> 00:53:25,208 Terminates, is the antenna looking object from the top. 1062 00:53:25,666 --> 00:53:29,333 Yeah, that kind of folds down on itself so it 1063 00:53:29,833 --> 00:53:33,125 extends and retracts and that sits on the top of the reactor 1064 00:53:33,291 --> 00:53:37,708 that essentially channels the gravity wave up there 1065 00:53:37,916 --> 00:53:40,500 and into the superstructure around the craft 1066 00:53:40,666 --> 00:53:42,416 so it's dispersed evenly. 1067 00:53:42,833 --> 00:53:45,416 While we were working next to the reactor 1068 00:53:45,625 --> 00:53:48,333 I got a really good look at the three seats 1069 00:53:48,500 --> 00:53:50,375 or what we assumed to be seats, 1070 00:53:50,541 --> 00:53:54,708 that were far too small to be usable by an adult human. 1071 00:53:56,291 --> 00:53:58,291 You know, if you look at the seats 1072 00:53:58,458 --> 00:54:00,583 what I call the seats, the placement, 1073 00:54:00,750 --> 00:54:03,041 one of them, the waveguide in the reactor 1074 00:54:03,208 --> 00:54:05,666 is directly in front of a seat. 1075 00:54:07,541 --> 00:54:09,583 Why would you ever do that? 1076 00:54:09,750 --> 00:54:13,000 I mean, either... The guy that sits in that seat 1077 00:54:13,166 --> 00:54:15,750 is on reactor watch and he just sits there and 1078 00:54:15,916 --> 00:54:17,791 makes sure everything runs the all but... 1079 00:54:18,125 --> 00:54:20,750 It doesn't make any... and that's the only one 1080 00:54:20,916 --> 00:54:25,000 that faces directly at the panel that became transparent. 1081 00:54:25,458 --> 00:54:27,500 While we were working on the reactor 1082 00:54:27,666 --> 00:54:31,208 I saw one of the archways become completely transparent, 1083 00:54:31,375 --> 00:54:33,291 where I could see outside the craft. 1084 00:54:33,458 --> 00:54:35,541 This immediately caught my attention 1085 00:54:35,708 --> 00:54:37,083 and as I focused on it 1086 00:54:37,250 --> 00:54:40,083 half that archway turned an opaque blue, 1087 00:54:40,250 --> 00:54:42,750 and black symbols began to appear 1088 00:54:43,041 --> 00:54:45,416 on that blue portion of the archway. 1089 00:54:45,875 --> 00:54:48,541 I'd never really seen symbols like that before, 1090 00:54:48,708 --> 00:54:51,000 but my closest analogy to it 1091 00:54:51,375 --> 00:54:53,250 would be... Korean writing. 1092 00:54:53,708 --> 00:54:56,041 The symbols themselves were not completely static. 1093 00:54:56,208 --> 00:54:58,583 They were slowly tilting back and forth. 1094 00:54:59,083 --> 00:55:02,416 While that archway had my attention, my lab partner Barry 1095 00:55:02,708 --> 00:55:04,166 whispered my name to me 1096 00:55:04,333 --> 00:55:06,500 to get my attention back to where it belonged. 1097 00:55:07,708 --> 00:55:10,916 When I was in the craft... and 1098 00:55:11,250 --> 00:55:14,875 I was kneeling down by the reactor and looked up at 1099 00:55:15,125 --> 00:55:18,791 the screen, Barry just said, "Bob, Bob," 1100 00:55:19,500 --> 00:55:21,458 you know, like, "what are you doing?" 1101 00:55:21,750 --> 00:55:24,000 "That's not you," you know, "look down here," 1102 00:55:24,166 --> 00:55:26,750 which is what broke my attention, to go there. 1103 00:55:27,083 --> 00:55:29,625 But yeah, and... but when he... my point was when he said it, 1104 00:55:29,791 --> 00:55:31,191 he... he just kind of whispered it. 1105 00:55:31,333 --> 00:55:33,291 It's like... it's like you're in a library, 1106 00:55:33,458 --> 00:55:36,916 you know, so there's no... no loud talking. "Hey bill", 1107 00:55:37,083 --> 00:55:38,643 get me... "you know, it's just like..." 1108 00:55:40,625 --> 00:55:43,916 So, I don't know the reasoning behind that, but you know, 1109 00:55:44,083 --> 00:55:45,666 it's... it's like a library. 1110 00:55:46,583 --> 00:55:49,000 I can see that the craft had been worked on before 1111 00:55:49,166 --> 00:55:51,041 and probably for quite some time. 1112 00:55:51,208 --> 00:55:54,916 One of the amplifiers had been cut out with a plasma cutter. 1113 00:55:55,291 --> 00:55:59,000 Other teams were working on the skin of the craft, 1114 00:55:59,666 --> 00:56:02,875 and there were lights, extension cords, and other equipment 1115 00:56:03,416 --> 00:56:06,041 that were all over the inside of the craft. 1116 00:56:06,500 --> 00:56:09,708 You had noticed that one of the amplifiers 1117 00:56:09,875 --> 00:56:12,083 had been cut out of the craft. 1118 00:56:12,625 --> 00:56:13,666 Yeah. 1119 00:56:14,083 --> 00:56:17,291 You know, you said "they must have really been sure." 1120 00:56:17,541 --> 00:56:21,000 You had to been a hundred percent confident, 1121 00:56:21,791 --> 00:56:25,958 that... you weren't gonna ruin the operation of anything 1122 00:56:26,125 --> 00:56:29,166 if you went to the lenghts to remove 1123 00:56:29,791 --> 00:56:32,041 an entire amplifier out of the craft. 1124 00:56:32,208 --> 00:56:35,375 Now... look, once you remove that out, 1125 00:56:35,541 --> 00:56:38,916 the craft can't operate in... in delta mode anymore, 1126 00:56:39,208 --> 00:56:41,625 which makes you wonder if they did that... 1127 00:56:42,250 --> 00:56:45,375 Intentionally, so it couldn't operate in that mode, you know, 1128 00:56:45,541 --> 00:56:48,000 kind of the equivalent of clipping a bird's wings, 1129 00:56:48,166 --> 00:56:51,166 keeping it, you know, so it can't fly away anywhere. 1130 00:56:51,791 --> 00:56:55,750 Somewhere, someone, and probably certainly more than one person, 1131 00:56:56,250 --> 00:56:58,208 a group of people agreed that, 1132 00:56:58,375 --> 00:56:59,541 "let's go take that out," 1133 00:56:59,708 --> 00:57:01,833 and they had a damn good reason to do it. 1134 00:57:05,458 --> 00:57:07,258 But they must have been absolutely convinced, 1135 00:57:07,375 --> 00:57:09,250 they knew what was going on. Removed it. 1136 00:57:09,958 --> 00:57:11,416 Moved it into the lab, 1137 00:57:11,833 --> 00:57:14,500 and they were still able to operate the craft without it. 1138 00:57:14,666 --> 00:57:18,291 So, that - clearly a lot went on before I got there. 1139 00:57:20,958 --> 00:57:24,458 At one point, Barry instructed me to go behind the seats 1140 00:57:24,875 --> 00:57:27,333 and pointed towards a small 1141 00:57:27,500 --> 00:57:30,166 honeycombed hatchway, flush with the floor. 1142 00:57:30,875 --> 00:57:33,125 We both crawled over to the hatchway, 1143 00:57:33,291 --> 00:57:36,750 and Barry showed me where to put my finger in and pull backwards, 1144 00:57:37,166 --> 00:57:39,958 and... the little honeycombed hatchway collapsed, 1145 00:57:40,291 --> 00:57:42,083 leaving an opening in the floor, 1146 00:57:42,250 --> 00:57:44,166 big enough to barely squeeze through, 1147 00:57:44,333 --> 00:57:46,583 and look down into the lower level. 1148 00:57:47,125 --> 00:57:51,250 I was able to get the upper part of my body into the hatchway, 1149 00:57:51,416 --> 00:57:55,000 and got a good view of the three emitters, hanging below. 1150 00:57:55,333 --> 00:57:57,041 The lower level was very dark. 1151 00:57:57,291 --> 00:57:59,291 There was just enough light coming in, 1152 00:57:59,458 --> 00:58:02,791 under the entrance hatchway, to see the emitters 1153 00:58:02,958 --> 00:58:04,541 and the lower part of the craft. 1154 00:58:04,875 --> 00:58:06,666 The emitters were the only things that were 1155 00:58:06,833 --> 00:58:07,833 a... a different color. 1156 00:58:08,000 --> 00:58:09,166 They were black. 1157 00:58:09,375 --> 00:58:11,666 The bottoms of them... Were hollow 1158 00:58:11,958 --> 00:58:13,541 and you could see 1159 00:58:13,708 --> 00:58:17,416 some sort of copper colored plates inside there. 1160 00:58:17,750 --> 00:58:22,041 They were hung by large diameter tubes, 1161 00:58:22,208 --> 00:58:23,958 maybe three inches or so, 1162 00:58:24,291 --> 00:58:25,708 just like the waveguide 1163 00:58:25,875 --> 00:58:28,083 that extends down onto the reactor. 1164 00:58:30,958 --> 00:58:33,318 When all three of the amplifiers are being used for travel, 1165 00:58:33,416 --> 00:58:35,041 they're in the delta configuration. 1166 00:58:35,375 --> 00:58:37,208 And when only one is being used for travel, 1167 00:58:37,375 --> 00:58:38,735 it's in the omicron configuration. 1168 00:58:38,875 --> 00:58:40,333 So as far as propulsion, 1169 00:58:40,500 --> 00:58:42,750 the craft operates in two different modes, 1170 00:58:43,083 --> 00:58:45,500 called omicron and delta. 1171 00:58:45,791 --> 00:58:48,541 Omicron meaning one and delta meaning three, 1172 00:58:48,708 --> 00:58:51,333 and that's referring to how many of the amplifiers and 1173 00:58:51,500 --> 00:58:53,000 emitters are being used. 1174 00:58:53,291 --> 00:58:57,125 So in omicron configuration, the craft lifts off the ground 1175 00:58:57,458 --> 00:58:59,625 using one amplifier and one emitter. 1176 00:59:00,041 --> 00:59:03,166 The other two emitters can swing all the way up to 1177 00:59:03,333 --> 00:59:05,875 180 degrees out the side of the craft, 1178 00:59:06,208 --> 00:59:08,750 and what that does is cause distortion 1179 00:59:09,333 --> 00:59:12,458 in space and kind of forces the craft 1180 00:59:12,791 --> 00:59:15,000 to fall into that distortion. 1181 00:59:15,375 --> 00:59:18,166 Kind of the opposite of the way our aircraft work. 1182 00:59:18,333 --> 00:59:21,208 Instead of throwing material out the back, 1183 00:59:21,375 --> 00:59:23,625 this causes some sort of distortion 1184 00:59:23,958 --> 00:59:26,333 in front of it, where it's drawn into. 1185 00:59:29,625 --> 00:59:33,791 The other mode of operation, delta configuration, 1186 00:59:34,291 --> 00:59:38,166 is really used when the craft is outside the atmosphere 1187 00:59:38,333 --> 00:59:39,916 where it's sitting in free space. 1188 00:59:40,291 --> 00:59:42,791 In that mode, the craft rotates on its side. 1189 00:59:42,958 --> 00:59:46,500 It does a belly roll, and faces the bottom of the craft 1190 00:59:46,666 --> 00:59:48,250 towards the destination. 1191 00:59:48,625 --> 00:59:52,000 The three emitters, in the bottom of the craft, 1192 00:59:52,166 --> 00:59:53,791 focus on the destination. 1193 00:59:54,125 --> 00:59:56,875 They're brought up to power and the craft makes a jump. 1194 00:59:57,458 --> 01:00:01,958 Now, the amplifiers don't operate on a continuous fashion. 1195 01:00:02,208 --> 01:00:03,416 They pulse. 1196 01:00:03,583 --> 01:00:05,458 They produce a pulse of energy 1197 01:00:05,625 --> 01:00:08,875 and then require a recycle time. 1198 01:00:09,125 --> 01:00:10,958 It's somewhere around 10 milliseconds 1199 01:00:11,125 --> 01:00:12,708 or something like that, 1200 01:00:13,416 --> 01:00:16,541 but... then they essentially can fire again 1201 01:00:16,791 --> 01:00:17,791 and make another jump. 1202 01:00:17,916 --> 01:00:20,583 So, in traveling to a distant location, 1203 01:00:20,750 --> 01:00:22,875 the craft will make several jumps. 1204 01:00:23,166 --> 01:00:25,750 It's never just one long jump, you know, 1205 01:00:25,916 --> 01:00:27,833 across the galaxy or something like that. 1206 01:00:28,000 --> 01:00:30,041 It's just a series of jumps and that's... 1207 01:00:30,208 --> 01:00:31,375 that's how it moves. 1208 01:00:31,625 --> 01:00:33,291 When it arrives to where it is, 1209 01:00:33,541 --> 01:00:35,583 it'll get close to the destination, 1210 01:00:35,916 --> 01:00:37,666 switch over to omicron mode, 1211 01:00:38,000 --> 01:00:41,583 and... set down or cruise around or whatever its plan was. 1212 01:00:47,541 --> 01:00:50,416 As I went through the other folders, there was, 1213 01:00:50,666 --> 01:00:53,166 another project called sidekick, which dealt 1214 01:00:53,333 --> 01:00:57,041 with any weapon potential of this spacecraft. 1215 01:00:57,208 --> 01:00:58,608 That was w... weapons applications, 1216 01:00:58,666 --> 01:01:00,541 and I knew a little bit more about that. 1217 01:01:00,708 --> 01:01:04,083 That was because the... the gravity amplifiers were used 1218 01:01:04,708 --> 01:01:09,166 as a... a collimating device to... I mean, to... to narrow the beam 1219 01:01:09,500 --> 01:01:12,416 of something that appeared to be like a particle weapon. 1220 01:01:12,583 --> 01:01:15,416 And it seemed to be dealing with an accelerated particle 1221 01:01:15,583 --> 01:01:18,958 of some kind that was focused or held in place, 1222 01:01:19,458 --> 01:01:23,250 and prevented from dispersing by the gravity amplifiers, 1223 01:01:23,416 --> 01:01:25,666 by the emitters, actually. 1224 01:01:29,416 --> 01:01:32,958 Project looking glass had to do with using the... 1225 01:01:33,541 --> 01:01:35,916 Gravity amplifiers to distort time. 1226 01:01:36,666 --> 01:01:38,958 And, you know, th... this isn't implying that 1227 01:01:39,125 --> 01:01:40,958 they were trying to make a time machine, 1228 01:01:41,166 --> 01:01:44,250 but they were trying to create a time differential, 1229 01:01:44,416 --> 01:01:47,333 whether it was in milliseconds or fractions of a second. 1230 01:01:47,541 --> 01:01:50,708 But it had... it had to do just with... 1231 01:01:51,750 --> 01:01:53,833 that force distorting time. 1232 01:01:54,208 --> 01:01:56,958 Now, I mean, we weren't a 100% sure that... 1233 01:01:57,125 --> 01:01:59,291 That was even gravity what we were dealing with. 1234 01:01:59,625 --> 01:02:02,166 But anyway, the group that was working on that was 1235 01:02:02,583 --> 01:02:06,000 attempting to see if that can distort the flow of time. 1236 01:02:07,000 --> 01:02:10,625 The information in the overview of project Galileo was accurate. 1237 01:02:10,916 --> 01:02:13,375 I read the overview and later witnessed evidence 1238 01:02:13,541 --> 01:02:14,916 which proved it to be accurate. 1239 01:02:15,541 --> 01:02:17,041 So it is possible that 1240 01:02:17,208 --> 01:02:18,808 scientists involved with other projects, 1241 01:02:19,125 --> 01:02:20,517 could have seen evidence that these 1242 01:02:20,541 --> 01:02:22,000 other overviews were accurate. 1243 01:02:22,458 --> 01:02:24,458 But I can't make that assertion. 1244 01:02:24,833 --> 01:02:27,500 To me, these reports were simply words and pictures on paper. 1245 01:02:36,208 --> 01:02:38,041 The hangars are all connected together 1246 01:02:38,208 --> 01:02:40,750 and there are large bay doors between each one. 1247 01:02:41,166 --> 01:02:44,083 And, there were nine total that I saw. 1248 01:02:44,250 --> 01:02:46,000 Each one being different. 1249 01:02:47,666 --> 01:02:51,416 I was in the lab with Barry and Dennis came in and said, 1250 01:02:51,666 --> 01:02:54,333 "we're conducting a test flight, why don't you guys come out?" 1251 01:02:54,708 --> 01:02:57,500 We left the lab through the side door, 1252 01:02:57,666 --> 01:03:00,750 which leads directly into the... the large hangar. 1253 01:03:00,916 --> 01:03:02,333 And when I opened the door, 1254 01:03:02,625 --> 01:03:06,083 all the doors between the hangars were open. 1255 01:03:06,250 --> 01:03:10,666 And I looked down and I saw how big the installation was 1256 01:03:10,833 --> 01:03:13,625 and that there were other craft, 1257 01:03:13,958 --> 01:03:15,583 in those other hangars. 1258 01:03:15,750 --> 01:03:18,500 I couldn't see very far because they weren't well lit, 1259 01:03:18,708 --> 01:03:21,291 but it did go on for quite a ways. 1260 01:03:21,541 --> 01:03:25,666 In the hanger adjacent to the sport model was another craft 1261 01:03:25,958 --> 01:03:27,333 that sometimes I refer to as the 1262 01:03:27,500 --> 01:03:29,708 jello mold or the... the bundt cake. 1263 01:03:29,875 --> 01:03:32,833 It looks like a bundt cake mold without the hole in the middle. 1264 01:03:33,083 --> 01:03:36,666 It appeared to be made of the same material 1265 01:03:36,958 --> 01:03:40,208 as the sport model, same color, same sheen. 1266 01:03:40,375 --> 01:03:42,291 I couldn't see much going on with it. 1267 01:03:42,458 --> 01:03:44,125 Again, this was just a single glance. 1268 01:03:44,291 --> 01:03:47,541 The other craft looked like a top hat or a straw hat, 1269 01:03:47,708 --> 01:03:50,750 straw carnival hat, with a large brim on it. 1270 01:03:50,916 --> 01:03:54,166 This one, same color, same sheen, 1271 01:03:54,333 --> 01:03:56,083 apparently the same material, 1272 01:03:56,291 --> 01:03:59,333 also slightly smaller than the sport model. 1273 01:03:59,625 --> 01:04:01,465 But this one wasn't laying flat on the ground. 1274 01:04:01,541 --> 01:04:03,125 It was leaning on the wall. 1275 01:04:03,375 --> 01:04:06,041 And, what was interesting about this one, 1276 01:04:06,208 --> 01:04:07,666 it had a hole, 1277 01:04:07,833 --> 01:04:10,375 in the side of the brim, if you wanna call it that, 1278 01:04:10,708 --> 01:04:13,083 as if it was shot from underneath with a projectile, 1279 01:04:13,250 --> 01:04:15,625 'cause you could see some of the metal bent outward. 1280 01:04:19,166 --> 01:04:21,791 The craft was already outside of the hangar. 1281 01:04:21,958 --> 01:04:25,416 There were some researchers and some other security personnel 1282 01:04:25,583 --> 01:04:28,500 standing at the opening to the hangar. 1283 01:04:28,916 --> 01:04:30,375 Everybody was looking at the craft. 1284 01:04:30,541 --> 01:04:33,875 There was, what appeared to be a vhf radio 1285 01:04:34,041 --> 01:04:36,000 because what caught my attention was 1286 01:04:36,291 --> 01:04:39,041 they were in communication with someone in the craft 1287 01:04:39,333 --> 01:04:42,416 and... they were using a conventional 1288 01:04:42,583 --> 01:04:45,250 vhf radio... to talk to them. 1289 01:04:45,583 --> 01:04:49,541 And I believe it was in the 140 or 150 megahertz bandwidth 1290 01:04:49,708 --> 01:04:52,333 because it said right on the radio. 1291 01:04:52,500 --> 01:04:54,916 And knowing how the craft worked, 1292 01:04:55,083 --> 01:04:58,250 it would be impossible for it to receive 1293 01:04:58,416 --> 01:05:00,958 a radio signal through the gravitational field. 1294 01:05:01,125 --> 01:05:03,041 I mean, it even... it bends light around it. 1295 01:05:03,208 --> 01:05:05,958 There's no way a radio wave is getting inside the craft, 1296 01:05:06,125 --> 01:05:08,375 yet they were talking, to it. 1297 01:05:08,541 --> 01:05:10,583 So I was really perplexed by that 1298 01:05:10,750 --> 01:05:12,791 and for a minute just focused on that 1299 01:05:13,166 --> 01:05:14,916 and looked at the craft and wondered, 1300 01:05:15,291 --> 01:05:18,041 "you know, obviously there's something I'm not getting here." 1301 01:05:18,333 --> 01:05:21,416 Dennis instructed me to go out and I stopped, 1302 01:05:21,666 --> 01:05:24,041 looked at the craft that was sitting on there and 1303 01:05:24,208 --> 01:05:26,875 began to lift off the ground silently. 1304 01:05:27,041 --> 01:05:29,458 There was a little hiss from a corona discharge, 1305 01:05:29,625 --> 01:05:32,250 kind of a bluish purplish glow at the bottom, 1306 01:05:32,541 --> 01:05:34,666 which dissipated as it took off. 1307 01:05:34,833 --> 01:05:36,416 Once it was sitting in the air, 1308 01:05:36,583 --> 01:05:38,333 Dennis instructed me to go further. 1309 01:05:38,625 --> 01:05:39,833 And I went out. 1310 01:05:40,000 --> 01:05:41,541 I didn't look up. I was just 1311 01:05:41,708 --> 01:05:44,125 walking forward and then looked up under the craft 1312 01:05:44,291 --> 01:05:45,666 and I looked back at... 1313 01:05:46,416 --> 01:05:49,250 at Dennis and he motioned me to come back. 1314 01:05:49,416 --> 01:05:50,791 And I started walking back. 1315 01:05:50,958 --> 01:05:52,333 I saw his hand go up... 1316 01:05:53,416 --> 01:05:56,458 and he set the indicators for me to look up and I looked up, 1317 01:05:57,583 --> 01:05:59,416 and the craft wasn't there. 1318 01:06:00,708 --> 01:06:02,250 And I looked over at Dennis 1319 01:06:02,416 --> 01:06:05,416 and he... he s... he motioned for me to go... go back 1320 01:06:05,583 --> 01:06:08,541 and I... I looked and as I moved forward, 1321 01:06:08,791 --> 01:06:10,625 the craft comes into view. 1322 01:06:10,791 --> 01:06:14,875 So you... you could actually see the photons bending around 1323 01:06:15,041 --> 01:06:17,750 the gravitational envelope the... of the craft. 1324 01:06:17,916 --> 01:06:20,291 You can see the sky above the craft 1325 01:06:20,541 --> 01:06:24,083 bending and as you walk by, it comes into view 1326 01:06:24,250 --> 01:06:25,875 and then out of view. It's really... 1327 01:06:26,041 --> 01:06:28,208 it's... it really leaves an impression. 1328 01:06:28,375 --> 01:06:30,000 It's a pretty impressive thing to see. 1329 01:06:38,250 --> 01:06:40,500 The hope was ...That... 1330 01:06:41,541 --> 01:06:43,708 even something small and insignificant, 1331 01:06:43,875 --> 01:06:45,666 what we would think is insignificant, 1332 01:06:46,000 --> 01:06:47,750 but something small that we can grasp, 1333 01:06:47,916 --> 01:06:49,916 if we really understood it... 1334 01:06:51,500 --> 01:06:53,750 as opposed to a big, complicated... 1335 01:06:53,958 --> 01:06:56,000 you know, like the entire propulsion system. 1336 01:06:56,166 --> 01:06:58,250 But if you can find a single piece and... 1337 01:06:58,833 --> 01:07:02,000 Just understood exactly how that worked and how 1338 01:07:02,541 --> 01:07:05,791 their science works, that that would be the key 1339 01:07:06,333 --> 01:07:08,875 and it would... the rest would all fall down like dominoes. 1340 01:07:09,041 --> 01:07:11,125 Like, "we... we got it." 1341 01:07:11,291 --> 01:07:13,541 You know, it's like... 1342 01:07:13,708 --> 01:07:16,416 You know, I have an understanding of transistor 1343 01:07:16,791 --> 01:07:19,416 and then, "that's how... and a group of these makes an 1344 01:07:19,583 --> 01:07:22,333 integrated circuit and then an array of these 1345 01:07:22,500 --> 01:07:24,267 and it's in the memory and computer, I would... 1346 01:07:24,291 --> 01:07:25,958 we got it. It's... it's done." 1347 01:07:26,125 --> 01:07:29,000 So we were hoping for that chain reaction to take place. 1348 01:07:29,166 --> 01:07:33,375 Maybe it has, but, you know, when I was there, it was just... 1349 01:07:33,875 --> 01:07:35,875 we wanna focus on some small 1350 01:07:36,291 --> 01:07:38,666 aspects of it, and see what happens. 1351 01:07:40,750 --> 01:07:42,875 Right, they had a poster and it looked like a 1352 01:07:43,041 --> 01:07:45,333 commercial poster almost, like it was lithographed 1353 01:07:45,500 --> 01:07:47,458 and you could buy it at a K-Mart or something, 1354 01:07:47,625 --> 01:07:49,625 but they were all over the place and it had the... 1355 01:07:50,208 --> 01:07:52,750 the disk that I coined the term, the sport model 1356 01:07:52,916 --> 01:07:56,500 was lifted off the ground about three feet at... at, area s4 1357 01:07:56,666 --> 01:07:58,083 on the dry lake there, and, 1358 01:07:58,250 --> 01:08:00,166 the caption on the bottom said, "they're here." 1359 01:08:00,708 --> 01:08:03,291 Looked like a commercially printed poster 1360 01:08:03,458 --> 01:08:06,125 with the sport model above the desert 1361 01:08:06,291 --> 01:08:08,416 floor that said, "they're here" on it. 1362 01:08:08,625 --> 01:08:11,500 I... I can't fathom why they did that. 1363 01:08:11,666 --> 01:08:13,791 Or for... or where they did it, 1364 01:08:14,333 --> 01:08:17,500 but... it was there. It was there. 1365 01:08:17,666 --> 01:08:19,458 Somebody made it, "they're here" poster. 1366 01:08:19,625 --> 01:08:22,875 You know, I even... I went up to it and stopped and walked back 1367 01:08:23,041 --> 01:08:24,625 and looked at it and felt it. 1368 01:08:25,166 --> 01:08:27,166 And it was just... it was just a poster. 1369 01:08:28,125 --> 01:08:31,625 And I... I st... to this day, I can't imagine why 1370 01:08:31,791 --> 01:08:34,541 they did that, but I wish I had one. 1371 01:08:34,708 --> 01:08:37,375 They were... they were pretty cool. 1372 01:08:37,541 --> 01:08:39,541 This technology that you've learned about thus far 1373 01:08:39,708 --> 01:08:41,375 was brought here by some alien beings 1374 01:08:41,541 --> 01:08:44,166 from the zeta reticuli 1 and 2 star system. 1375 01:08:45,375 --> 01:08:47,541 Zeta reticuli is a binary star system, 1376 01:08:47,708 --> 01:08:49,666 which means it has two stars and is located 1377 01:08:49,833 --> 01:08:52,000 approximately 38 light years from earth. 1378 01:08:53,291 --> 01:08:55,041 These beings are from reticulum 4, 1379 01:08:55,208 --> 01:08:57,875 which is the fourth planet out from zeta 2 reticuli. 1380 01:08:58,500 --> 01:08:59,791 This is the way star systems 1381 01:08:59,958 --> 01:09:01,666 were referred to in these reports. 1382 01:09:01,833 --> 01:09:03,875 They simply designate the name of the star 1383 01:09:04,041 --> 01:09:05,801 and then number the planets from the nearest 1384 01:09:05,875 --> 01:09:07,250 to the furthest from the star. 1385 01:09:07,583 --> 01:09:10,166 Our star, the sun, was designated as sol, 1386 01:09:10,333 --> 01:09:12,333 and the earth was referred to as sol 3, 1387 01:09:12,541 --> 01:09:14,666 because we're the third planet out from the sun. 1388 01:09:15,333 --> 01:09:17,250 These beings said that man was the product 1389 01:09:17,416 --> 01:09:19,375 of externally corrected evolution. 1390 01:09:19,666 --> 01:09:21,250 They said that man as a species 1391 01:09:21,416 --> 01:09:23,958 had been genetically altered 65 times. 1392 01:09:24,250 --> 01:09:25,958 They referred to humans as containers, 1393 01:09:26,125 --> 01:09:28,250 yet I don't know what we're containers of. 1394 01:09:29,125 --> 01:09:30,476 These beings said that they had been 1395 01:09:30,500 --> 01:09:31,875 visiting earth for a long time 1396 01:09:32,041 --> 01:09:33,625 and presented photographic evidence 1397 01:09:33,791 --> 01:09:36,541 which they contended was over 10,000 years old. 1398 01:09:36,916 --> 01:09:38,876 There was an exchange of hardware and information 1399 01:09:38,958 --> 01:09:41,291 in central Nevada until 1979, 1400 01:09:41,458 --> 01:09:43,041 at which time there was a conflict 1401 01:09:43,208 --> 01:09:45,083 which brought the program to an abrupt halt. 1402 01:09:45,541 --> 01:09:48,958 The beings left, but were to return at a 1623 date 1403 01:09:49,125 --> 01:09:50,916 and I don't know what that date is. 1404 01:09:51,458 --> 01:09:53,934 With the remaining hardware and information, the U.S. government 1405 01:09:53,958 --> 01:09:55,916 started the back engineering program. 1406 01:09:56,333 --> 01:09:58,000 The parts that Bob read that he was 1407 01:09:58,166 --> 01:10:01,250 least willing to talk to me about, even back then, 1408 01:10:01,583 --> 01:10:04,000 that they had been involved with our... our DNA, 1409 01:10:04,166 --> 01:10:06,000 with our evolution as a species, 1410 01:10:06,166 --> 01:10:07,846 that they've been tinkering along the way. 1411 01:10:07,916 --> 01:10:09,708 That's pretty disturbing stuff. 1412 01:10:09,875 --> 01:10:11,125 It... it is disturbing stuff. 1413 01:10:11,291 --> 01:10:12,625 Gene huff brings that up a lot. 1414 01:10:12,791 --> 01:10:14,500 I mean, I don't talk about it... 1415 01:10:14,666 --> 01:10:16,166 the main reason is because 1416 01:10:16,333 --> 01:10:18,750 when Barry and I did discuss about their reports, 1417 01:10:18,916 --> 01:10:20,796 he said, "take everything with a grain of salt", 1418 01:10:20,875 --> 01:10:23,916 because they'll, you know, intentionally inject 1419 01:10:24,416 --> 01:10:25,916 ridiculous things in there. 1420 01:10:26,083 --> 01:10:28,875 So if anything ever gets out, they know exactly 1421 01:10:29,041 --> 01:10:30,500 "who to track it back to." 1422 01:10:30,958 --> 01:10:34,500 There were references to, you know, beings 1423 01:10:34,666 --> 01:10:36,083 or pilots or 1424 01:10:36,250 --> 01:10:39,416 whatever, and it s... some entities that were 1425 01:10:39,583 --> 01:10:41,541 related to the craft, but they were always 1426 01:10:41,708 --> 01:10:43,000 referred to as "the kids." 1427 01:10:46,833 --> 01:10:48,791 In the documentation, 1428 01:10:48,958 --> 01:10:51,333 you saw some pictures of... of some creature, 1429 01:10:51,500 --> 01:10:52,875 an autopsy of some type. 1430 01:10:53,041 --> 01:10:55,208 Yeah, I did. I saw, some sort... 1431 01:10:55,375 --> 01:10:57,708 if you even wanna call it some sort of autopsy report. 1432 01:10:57,875 --> 01:10:59,184 I don't know what a normal -yeah. 1433 01:10:59,208 --> 01:11:00,625 Autopsy report looks like, but... 1434 01:11:01,291 --> 01:11:04,041 Yeah, it had to do with a... a photograph and drawing of a 1435 01:11:04,208 --> 01:11:08,291 dead creature, with the chest cut open in a t fashion, 1436 01:11:08,458 --> 01:11:11,708 the skin peeled back, and what appeared to be one large 1437 01:11:11,875 --> 01:11:15,291 organ as opposed to a bunch of smaller ones, as if, 1438 01:11:15,458 --> 01:11:16,875 I believe I said it before, 1439 01:11:17,125 --> 01:11:19,875 as if all the organs in our body just grew together 1440 01:11:20,083 --> 01:11:21,666 and operated as one unit. 1441 01:11:21,916 --> 01:11:23,000 That's what it looked like. 1442 01:11:23,166 --> 01:11:24,750 And that's what it referred to. 1443 01:11:24,916 --> 01:11:27,250 The beings themselves are three to four feet tall 1444 01:11:27,416 --> 01:11:29,333 and weigh 25 to 50 pounds. 1445 01:11:29,875 --> 01:11:31,666 Their bodies would most closely resemble 1446 01:11:31,833 --> 01:11:33,291 a human toddler's torso, 1447 01:11:33,458 --> 01:11:35,375 if the child was emaciated from hunger. 1448 01:11:35,833 --> 01:11:37,666 They have grayish skin with large heads 1449 01:11:37,833 --> 01:11:39,916 with almond-shaped wraparound eyes. 1450 01:11:40,458 --> 01:11:42,916 They have very slight nose, mouth and ear positions 1451 01:11:43,083 --> 01:11:44,500 and are essentially hairless. 1452 01:11:48,583 --> 01:11:51,500 I believe I was leaving the hangar 1453 01:11:51,833 --> 01:11:55,625 and walked up and glanced through the window of one of the 1454 01:11:55,791 --> 01:11:58,583 other do... doors as I was proceeding down the hallway. 1455 01:11:58,875 --> 01:12:00,916 And what I saw was 1456 01:12:01,083 --> 01:12:04,125 two technicians or scientists looking down 1457 01:12:04,291 --> 01:12:09,291 and had either one of the seats or a model of one of the seats 1458 01:12:09,458 --> 01:12:12,625 with what I thought was a doll, 1459 01:12:12,791 --> 01:12:15,250 like a small creature or something like that, 1460 01:12:15,416 --> 01:12:17,333 something that would be designed to fit. 1461 01:12:17,708 --> 01:12:20,166 And I think they were just sizing up 1462 01:12:20,375 --> 01:12:24,208 what kind of creature would sit in a seat that size. 1463 01:12:30,083 --> 01:12:33,333 From what I understood, there were Russians working there 1464 01:12:33,500 --> 01:12:35,958 right before I got to the project. 1465 01:12:36,375 --> 01:12:39,916 And apparently there was some big discovery made. 1466 01:12:40,958 --> 01:12:43,166 I... I don't know what it had to do with 1467 01:12:43,333 --> 01:12:44,708 or what project it had to do with, 1468 01:12:44,875 --> 01:12:46,125 but it was a big deal. 1469 01:12:46,291 --> 01:12:48,500 And as soon as we found that out, 1470 01:12:48,833 --> 01:12:51,625 we stopped the Russians from working with us. 1471 01:12:51,791 --> 01:12:54,541 I mean, they were kicked out of sight and... 1472 01:12:54,916 --> 01:12:56,625 Whatever cooperation we had 1473 01:12:57,333 --> 01:12:59,458 going on came to an end. To me, 1474 01:12:59,625 --> 01:13:02,416 obviously Russia had something we needed. 1475 01:13:02,666 --> 01:13:04,666 They must have had some other... 1476 01:13:05,333 --> 01:13:09,375 Et information, some technology 1477 01:13:09,625 --> 01:13:11,065 maybe that was compatible with this. 1478 01:13:11,208 --> 01:13:14,291 Maybe they had some other craft or parts or some... 1479 01:13:14,458 --> 01:13:16,250 they had something that we wanted, 1480 01:13:16,416 --> 01:13:19,166 where we'd go to the in... unbelievable length 1481 01:13:19,333 --> 01:13:21,583 of allowing them, not just the information, 1482 01:13:21,750 --> 01:13:23,875 but to be on site with us, so, 1483 01:13:24,416 --> 01:13:27,291 there... there had to be a good reason to do that. 1484 01:13:35,875 --> 01:13:37,875 Dennis instructed me one day that 1485 01:13:38,041 --> 01:13:40,250 I'd be taking a piece of element 115 1486 01:13:40,416 --> 01:13:43,166 to los Alamos national labs, in new Mexico. 1487 01:13:43,958 --> 01:13:46,916 I left on one of their planes from the test site 1488 01:13:47,083 --> 01:13:48,458 and while on the plane, 1489 01:13:48,625 --> 01:13:50,291 I was looking through the documentation 1490 01:13:50,458 --> 01:13:53,750 and that's where I noticed, that they had a code name for it. 1491 01:13:53,916 --> 01:13:55,791 It was la-1000 1492 01:13:55,958 --> 01:13:59,250 and it was classified as a new armor material. 1493 01:13:59,666 --> 01:14:01,541 And that's all that the people at los Alamos 1494 01:14:01,708 --> 01:14:04,083 were supposed to know, that they were just machining 1495 01:14:04,333 --> 01:14:05,666 an armor material. 1496 01:14:05,875 --> 01:14:07,791 So I had to remain there, 1497 01:14:07,958 --> 01:14:10,125 while they were machining the material 1498 01:14:10,291 --> 01:14:13,000 and return, with not just the material, 1499 01:14:13,166 --> 01:14:16,541 but any waste material or shavings back to s4. 1500 01:14:18,083 --> 01:14:20,291 The strange thing is how it was packed. 1501 01:14:20,458 --> 01:14:21,916 It was packed in aerogel. 1502 01:14:22,833 --> 01:14:26,041 At the time, I had never seen aerogel. 1503 01:14:26,208 --> 01:14:28,666 I had never heard of aerogel. 1504 01:14:29,041 --> 01:14:32,125 It's... essentially silicon dioxide. 1505 01:14:32,291 --> 01:14:34,083 It's... it's the lightest known solid. 1506 01:14:34,250 --> 01:14:35,833 It's 98% air. 1507 01:14:36,125 --> 01:14:39,375 Why it was packed in this material, I have no idea. 1508 01:14:39,958 --> 01:14:44,625 This contained... had a cutout for the 115 in it, 1509 01:14:44,791 --> 01:14:47,291 and then that was inside of a lead case. 1510 01:14:47,458 --> 01:14:50,333 I can't explain why it was packed that way at all. 1511 01:14:57,708 --> 01:15:01,125 You went public in the 1980s 1512 01:15:01,291 --> 01:15:03,416 and even in the interview with George, you said you 1513 01:15:03,583 --> 01:15:06,000 had a piece of element 115 in a puck 1514 01:15:06,166 --> 01:15:08,458 with an x on it, or a plus on it 1515 01:15:08,625 --> 01:15:10,166 with a laser pointed at it. 1516 01:15:10,333 --> 01:15:12,875 Now, that was something that you could have said, 1517 01:15:13,041 --> 01:15:15,125 "yeah, I got a piece of plutonium in my pocket." 1518 01:15:15,416 --> 01:15:17,333 - You know... and it's not true. - Yeah. 1519 01:15:17,500 --> 01:15:18,958 - You know what I mean? - -Right. 1520 01:15:19,416 --> 01:15:21,583 Because you did say you had a piece back then 1521 01:15:21,750 --> 01:15:23,708 - and then you never said it again. - -Yeah. 1522 01:15:24,000 --> 01:15:25,041 But you stopped saying it 1523 01:15:25,208 --> 01:15:26,625 because it was just like, just... 1524 01:15:26,791 --> 01:15:29,250 yeah, I stopped saying it because, yeah, 1525 01:15:29,458 --> 01:15:31,416 I had it too close to me. 1526 01:15:36,000 --> 01:15:38,166 Bob made sure to have the... 1527 01:15:38,750 --> 01:15:41,375 the gel stuff in a beaker and back. 1528 01:15:42,375 --> 01:15:44,583 - Yeah, aero... the aerogel. - Aerogel. 1529 01:15:44,750 --> 01:15:46,110 It was something like pointing the 1530 01:15:46,250 --> 01:15:49,458 particle accelerator at the 115 in a pocket, 1531 01:15:49,625 --> 01:15:51,291 with a target on it. 1532 01:15:51,458 --> 01:15:53,041 Yeah. 1533 01:15:53,500 --> 01:15:54,791 Yeah. 1534 01:15:54,958 --> 01:15:57,208 That was real. 1535 01:15:59,541 --> 01:16:01,625 I know 115 doesn't exist 1536 01:16:01,791 --> 01:16:04,875 and a stable form of it is non-existent and nobody's ever 1537 01:16:05,041 --> 01:16:08,125 seen it and the only wispy piece of it that we've got now, 1538 01:16:08,708 --> 01:16:10,125 it only lasts microseconds 1539 01:16:10,291 --> 01:16:12,500 and then it's gone, and it's radioactive. 1540 01:16:12,666 --> 01:16:14,666 Nothing like the stable form 1541 01:16:14,833 --> 01:16:17,916 that, he describes has been found by humans. 1542 01:16:18,083 --> 01:16:20,000 But he had a piece of it and I don't care 1543 01:16:20,166 --> 01:16:21,875 whether people believe it or not, he did. 1544 01:16:22,291 --> 01:16:24,458 And I saw an experiment at his house, 1545 01:16:24,625 --> 01:16:26,875 with a cloud chamber that seemed to bend light. 1546 01:16:27,041 --> 01:16:29,083 Now, I'm not a physicist, but it looked like it was 1547 01:16:29,250 --> 01:16:31,625 bending light to me and that was impressive. 1548 01:16:31,791 --> 01:16:34,666 I know that when Bob thought he was gonna die, 1549 01:16:34,958 --> 01:16:37,083 that he was gonna be killed and there was good reason 1550 01:16:37,250 --> 01:16:38,333 for him thinking that. 1551 01:16:38,500 --> 01:16:40,625 He had that piece of 115 in this 1552 01:16:40,791 --> 01:16:42,458 pewter round disc thing 1553 01:16:42,625 --> 01:16:44,833 in front of his particle accelerator 1554 01:16:45,000 --> 01:16:47,625 with an x in the middle and if he was gonna go, 1555 01:16:47,791 --> 01:16:48,833 they were going with him. 1556 01:16:51,583 --> 01:16:55,041 I became concerned as the days went on. 1557 01:16:55,500 --> 01:16:59,750 There were always cars parked across from my driveway, 1558 01:17:00,125 --> 01:17:02,166 and normally there's nothing there. 1559 01:17:02,333 --> 01:17:03,583 There's no traffic 1560 01:17:04,125 --> 01:17:07,458 and even driving places, 1561 01:17:07,875 --> 01:17:09,875 I was always being followed. 1562 01:17:10,041 --> 01:17:12,625 Even when my friend and I went to the gym, 1563 01:17:12,791 --> 01:17:14,625 even he noticed wherever we stopped, 1564 01:17:14,791 --> 01:17:16,666 a car would follow us anywhere. 1565 01:17:16,833 --> 01:17:19,375 I began to get a little concerned and 1566 01:17:19,625 --> 01:17:22,708 took a few of my closest friends, and told them, 1567 01:17:22,875 --> 01:17:24,500 "the job I had at the test site, 1568 01:17:24,916 --> 01:17:26,666 I want you to see what's going on." 1569 01:17:26,916 --> 01:17:28,875 Working with Barry, it became obvious 1570 01:17:29,041 --> 01:17:32,583 he had something to do with the test flight schedule. 1571 01:17:32,833 --> 01:17:36,166 And in... on one occasion, he was sitting across from me 1572 01:17:36,458 --> 01:17:39,333 and had a list of the test flights, the dates, 1573 01:17:39,500 --> 01:17:42,000 the duration, and... and exactly what was going on. 1574 01:17:42,166 --> 01:17:45,000 I saw him working on it and read it upside down, 1575 01:17:45,166 --> 01:17:47,416 seeing that every day was a Wednesday. 1576 01:17:47,583 --> 01:17:48,934 And I asked him what it was, he said 1577 01:17:48,958 --> 01:17:50,238 it was the test flight schedule. 1578 01:17:50,291 --> 01:17:51,875 And I said, "what's with Wednesday?" 1579 01:17:52,041 --> 01:17:54,791 And he mentioned that Wednesday was... statistically, 1580 01:17:54,958 --> 01:17:56,583 was the least amount of traffic 1581 01:17:56,750 --> 01:17:58,625 on the adjacent highway to the test site. 1582 01:17:58,791 --> 01:18:00,750 So there'd be the least number of eyes 1583 01:18:00,916 --> 01:18:02,666 when they were testing the craft. 1584 01:18:02,875 --> 01:18:05,500 So I knew when one of the test flights was. 1585 01:18:05,833 --> 01:18:08,833 On a Wednesday night, gathered everyone together, 1586 01:18:09,000 --> 01:18:12,375 we went out there, and exactly at the prescribed time, 1587 01:18:12,541 --> 01:18:15,416 the craft Rose up over the Ridge of mountains. 1588 01:18:15,583 --> 01:18:18,458 Everyone got to see it maneuver and perform 1589 01:18:18,625 --> 01:18:22,166 and basically told everybody what I was doing. 1590 01:18:22,875 --> 01:18:26,208 We rented a car, took my wife, a few friends, and 1591 01:18:26,458 --> 01:18:28,375 drove out to this... this place and... 1592 01:18:29,000 --> 01:18:32,083 Turned the lights out and snuck into a little area, and... 1593 01:18:33,416 --> 01:18:35,083 we all watched it. 1594 01:18:35,250 --> 01:18:37,833 A month before he ever took us out there, you know, 1595 01:18:38,125 --> 01:18:40,708 they had him at arm's length not calling him back to work 1596 01:18:40,875 --> 01:18:42,541 and he was suspicious about it. 1597 01:18:42,958 --> 01:18:44,875 You know, I knew what he was doing and... 1598 01:18:45,041 --> 01:18:46,583 and I was looking at all the... 1599 01:18:46,791 --> 01:18:48,934 History, what happened in Russia and the United States. 1600 01:18:48,958 --> 01:18:51,375 I said, "man, I wanna be where it's happening right now." 1601 01:18:51,541 --> 01:18:53,583 Bob says, "what are you doing on Wednesday night?" 1602 01:18:53,750 --> 01:18:55,416 I go, "nothing," because he knows 1603 01:18:55,583 --> 01:18:56,983 they're testing on Wednesday night. 1604 01:18:57,791 --> 01:18:58,831 Well, my name's gene huff. 1605 01:18:58,875 --> 01:19:00,166 I'm a real estate appraiser. 1606 01:19:00,333 --> 01:19:03,166 I've lived in Las Vegas for 44 years. 1607 01:19:03,750 --> 01:19:06,333 Been a real estate appraiser about 40 years of that. 1608 01:19:07,166 --> 01:19:09,766 You know, for... for someone just watching this who doesn't know, 1609 01:19:09,916 --> 01:19:12,458 I'm sure they... for them to believe what I'm going to say, 1610 01:19:12,625 --> 01:19:13,684 they wanna know something about me. 1611 01:19:13,708 --> 01:19:15,000 I've never been arrested 1612 01:19:15,333 --> 01:19:16,833 or convicted of any crime. 1613 01:19:17,000 --> 01:19:19,083 I've been a real estate appraiser for 40 years. 1614 01:19:19,250 --> 01:19:21,291 There's never been one complaint against me. 1615 01:19:21,583 --> 01:19:24,833 So as just a normal citizen, I'd say I'm pretty upstanding. 1616 01:19:25,000 --> 01:19:26,920 I have had speeding tickets in the past, though. 1617 01:19:27,000 --> 01:19:28,750 That's... that's about my biggest crime. 1618 01:19:28,916 --> 01:19:32,916 Gene huff was the person at the time, that I confided in 1619 01:19:33,083 --> 01:19:34,833 almost on a daily basis. 1620 01:19:35,000 --> 01:19:37,125 When I came back from s4, 1621 01:19:37,541 --> 01:19:40,208 I would tell gene kind of what happened. 1622 01:19:40,708 --> 01:19:44,708 You know, I was really concerned about talking to anybody else. 1623 01:19:44,875 --> 01:19:47,000 And I just... you know, I picked gene, 1624 01:19:47,166 --> 01:19:50,250 who was the closest friend at that time in Las Vegas. 1625 01:19:51,541 --> 01:19:54,291 When he took us out there, we went in lear's rv. 1626 01:19:54,458 --> 01:19:56,666 It was Bob and his wife and lear and me and... 1627 01:19:56,833 --> 01:19:59,750 we saw what we could later identify 1628 01:19:59,916 --> 01:20:01,791 as a flying disc because it has... 1629 01:20:02,083 --> 01:20:03,541 Novel movements in the sky. 1630 01:20:03,708 --> 01:20:07,166 Helicopters and blimps and airplanes don't do this. 1631 01:20:07,333 --> 01:20:09,708 You know, it... it can float around very softly 1632 01:20:09,875 --> 01:20:11,625 and then dart up here and then be here. 1633 01:20:11,791 --> 01:20:13,351 And then you wouldn't even see it move. 1634 01:20:13,416 --> 01:20:14,625 And now it's down here. 1635 01:20:14,916 --> 01:20:16,666 It moved around. It did a step move. 1636 01:20:16,833 --> 01:20:19,750 It actually went up in the air like this and hovered, 1637 01:20:20,041 --> 01:20:21,583 then dropped way down. 1638 01:20:21,875 --> 01:20:23,755 Then it just floated around and cruised around. 1639 01:20:23,833 --> 01:20:25,793 And then it started coming up the mountain range. 1640 01:20:26,000 --> 01:20:28,708 But again, I couldn't have said that was a flying saucer. 1641 01:20:28,875 --> 01:20:30,625 It was an anomalous thing. 1642 01:20:30,791 --> 01:20:34,375 And... and of course, Bob said there's a static charge 1643 01:20:34,541 --> 01:20:36,291 that dances around on the skin of the disc. 1644 01:20:36,625 --> 01:20:38,416 And as the disc gets further powered up, 1645 01:20:38,583 --> 01:20:40,416 the brighter this discharge is. 1646 01:20:41,041 --> 01:20:45,708 When the craft is energized, there's a... a high DC voltage on it. 1647 01:20:46,125 --> 01:20:47,445 That's just always present there. 1648 01:20:47,541 --> 01:20:49,583 We knew there was high voltage visually 1649 01:20:49,750 --> 01:20:53,583 when the craft takes off, but it... that it just appears to be 1650 01:20:53,750 --> 01:20:56,875 a byproduct of the way the reactor's working. 1651 01:20:57,125 --> 01:21:00,541 So anyway, we did see, you know, jumping around and lear 1652 01:21:00,708 --> 01:21:02,833 had a good shot at it through... through a telescope. 1653 01:21:03,250 --> 01:21:04,916 Good evening. This is John lear. 1654 01:21:05,083 --> 01:21:07,666 And today is march 22nd, 1989. 1655 01:21:08,041 --> 01:21:11,041 We're standing just about, eight miles due east of 1656 01:21:11,208 --> 01:21:14,666 groom lake, Nevada, the super government, secret test site. 1657 01:21:15,166 --> 01:21:17,708 And just a few minutes ago, we saw one of the government, 1658 01:21:17,875 --> 01:21:21,291 extraterrestrial ufos fly over there. 1659 01:21:21,458 --> 01:21:24,583 We all watched it for about, seven or eight minutes. 1660 01:21:25,000 --> 01:21:26,791 Right here, I have my celestron scope. 1661 01:21:26,958 --> 01:21:28,583 It's eight, inches. 1662 01:21:29,000 --> 01:21:32,500 And I had... I had it focused in for about 15 seconds 1663 01:21:32,666 --> 01:21:35,958 and saw for myself that in fact, it was a disc. 1664 01:21:36,458 --> 01:21:39,708 We're going to, stay here for another 1665 01:21:39,875 --> 01:21:42,041 couple hours here to see if we can show you folks, 1666 01:21:42,208 --> 01:21:45,333 an actual, extraterrestrial flying saucer 1667 01:21:45,500 --> 01:21:47,166 being, flown by the government. 1668 01:21:49,375 --> 01:21:50,625 Okay, good luck. 1669 01:21:52,583 --> 01:21:54,125 No way, did you see that move it did? 1670 01:21:54,291 --> 01:21:55,267 - No, I didn't. - It was like... 1671 01:21:55,291 --> 01:21:57,250 it kept going, woo woo. 1672 01:21:57,583 --> 01:21:59,743 - Wow, look how bright it's getting. - Look at it now. 1673 01:22:01,291 --> 01:22:02,100 It's getting bright. 1674 01:22:02,124 --> 01:22:04,017 Not bright enough for me to get the time of day. 1675 01:22:04,041 --> 01:22:05,166 Hey, hold on right here. 1676 01:22:07,416 --> 01:22:09,958 So is this the first time on camera we're gonna talk about 1677 01:22:10,125 --> 01:22:11,500 what we actually saw the 1678 01:22:11,666 --> 01:22:12,851 second time out there, me and you and Jim? 1679 01:22:12,875 --> 01:22:14,125 - Yeah. Yeah. - Okay. 1680 01:22:14,291 --> 01:22:16,333 So this is going to be the exposure. 1681 01:22:16,500 --> 01:22:16,912 Yeah. That's right. 1682 01:22:16,936 --> 01:22:17,851 You're gonna be the first one to get this. 1683 01:22:17,875 --> 01:22:19,583 Two weeks later, he takes us out there. 1684 01:22:19,750 --> 01:22:22,250 This must be... April, whatever it was. 1685 01:22:22,416 --> 01:22:25,916 And it's Jim togliani, Bob, his wifey and me. 1686 01:22:26,250 --> 01:22:30,250 This time, we see the elliptical shaped light down 1687 01:22:30,416 --> 01:22:32,500 by the mountains, which would be the south of us. 1688 01:22:32,666 --> 01:22:34,186 And there it is. And we can tell that, 1689 01:22:34,333 --> 01:22:35,833 "look, we've seen it before." 1690 01:22:36,041 --> 01:22:38,708 And then without seeing it move at all, 1691 01:22:38,875 --> 01:22:41,458 suddenly it's halfway between us and the mountain range. 1692 01:22:41,666 --> 01:22:45,083 And then suddenly it's much closer to us. 1693 01:22:45,250 --> 01:22:50,166 I'd say 75 yards away and 150 feet up in the air, maybe. 1694 01:22:50,708 --> 01:22:53,583 During the test flight, when the craft Rose up, 1695 01:22:53,750 --> 01:22:57,083 it made very abrupt moves to the left and right, 1696 01:22:57,250 --> 01:23:01,125 and then, made a very dramatic move toward us. 1697 01:23:01,291 --> 01:23:03,416 And I remember gene huff looking at it, 1698 01:23:03,583 --> 01:23:05,125 even took a step back going, 1699 01:23:05,291 --> 01:23:06,916 "my god," because it just... 1700 01:23:07,083 --> 01:23:10,833 it came from such a great distance to so close so quickly. 1701 01:23:11,166 --> 01:23:13,625 Did that a couple of times. I mean, to the point 1702 01:23:13,791 --> 01:23:16,125 it glowed extremely bright when it did it. 1703 01:23:16,291 --> 01:23:19,750 In fact, so much so they backed up behind the car 1704 01:23:19,916 --> 01:23:21,956 because they thought it might explode or something. 1705 01:23:22,000 --> 01:23:24,916 So now after it jumps down close to us, 1706 01:23:25,083 --> 01:23:28,333 it starts glowing brighter and brighter and brighter. 1707 01:23:28,708 --> 01:23:32,375 And then what we never told anybody until now, 1708 01:23:32,791 --> 01:23:34,083 it disappeared. 1709 01:23:38,500 --> 01:23:40,791 Now, this is all silent, by the way, there's no noise. 1710 01:23:40,958 --> 01:23:42,208 And it was just gone. 1711 01:23:42,375 --> 01:23:44,166 Now, we did later see it floating around 1712 01:23:44,333 --> 01:23:46,666 and go back down by the mountains, by papoose and... 1713 01:23:46,833 --> 01:23:48,166 It's like a... like the movies, 1714 01:23:48,333 --> 01:23:50,166 it drops down behind the mountains. 1715 01:23:55,125 --> 01:23:57,583 This was a thing that Bob could not effect. 1716 01:23:57,791 --> 01:24:00,791 He had no idea that there was gonna be a disk 1717 01:24:00,958 --> 01:24:03,625 out by way 375 that would come that close to us, 1718 01:24:03,875 --> 01:24:07,458 power up and disappear for all practical purposes. 1719 01:24:07,916 --> 01:24:10,000 He couldn't have made that happen unless he was 1720 01:24:10,291 --> 01:24:12,458 in cahoots with somebody at s4. 1721 01:24:12,625 --> 01:24:14,958 But even then, they wouldn't have known 1722 01:24:15,125 --> 01:24:17,083 where we were and when we were there, and... 1723 01:24:17,250 --> 01:24:20,208 I still pose the question, is, "did they see us?" 1724 01:24:21,125 --> 01:24:23,041 Bob couldn't have been working at... 1725 01:24:23,208 --> 01:24:25,166 at the lunchroom at area 51. 1726 01:24:25,583 --> 01:24:27,103 And I just believe everything he says, 1727 01:24:27,208 --> 01:24:28,351 and this would have happened. 1728 01:24:28,375 --> 01:24:30,125 He couldn't make it happen. 1729 01:24:30,291 --> 01:24:33,416 That proved, and I believed it before that, but that proved, 1730 01:24:33,916 --> 01:24:35,333 that's empirical evidence. 1731 01:24:35,500 --> 01:24:38,666 I saw a craft to do that, thanks to him. 1732 01:24:38,916 --> 01:24:40,083 And it can't be denied, 1733 01:24:40,250 --> 01:24:42,208 but that's presuming they believe me. 1734 01:24:43,750 --> 01:24:45,083 We got caught out there. 1735 01:24:45,541 --> 01:24:47,041 There were... 1736 01:24:47,208 --> 01:24:48,851 we got stopped by... initially by the guards 1737 01:24:48,875 --> 01:24:51,500 that are out in that area, that 1738 01:24:51,666 --> 01:24:53,541 John lear spoke about. He was with us. 1739 01:24:54,000 --> 01:24:56,541 Then stopped right afterwards by the sheriff who... 1740 01:24:57,375 --> 01:25:00,375 I guess, called in all our names 1741 01:25:00,541 --> 01:25:02,916 from our driver's licenses and social security numbers, 1742 01:25:03,083 --> 01:25:05,958 whatever they do, into area 51 out there. 1743 01:25:07,208 --> 01:25:09,750 Yeah, we went out there two or three times. 1744 01:25:10,166 --> 01:25:11,708 So we'd go out there in the dark 1745 01:25:11,875 --> 01:25:14,166 and you can't see your hand in front of your face. 1746 01:25:14,708 --> 01:25:17,041 And we'd pull out there, stand around. 1747 01:25:17,208 --> 01:25:19,708 And we're... the first time we were as quiet as possible. 1748 01:25:20,125 --> 01:25:22,125 By the second or third time, 1749 01:25:22,416 --> 01:25:24,916 we were making noise and joking around and... 1750 01:25:25,250 --> 01:25:29,375 Unbeknownst to us, they had seen us pull up there. 1751 01:25:29,958 --> 01:25:32,750 We're going down the first road in the area 51. 1752 01:25:32,916 --> 01:25:34,236 We just went there to park to see 1753 01:25:34,291 --> 01:25:35,708 if we could see what was going on. 1754 01:25:36,541 --> 01:25:38,875 Then the wackenhut guards, who are the guys that guard 1755 01:25:39,041 --> 01:25:41,500 the outside of the base, were watching us. 1756 01:25:41,666 --> 01:25:42,916 But we... we didn't know it. 1757 01:25:43,083 --> 01:25:44,523 We're out there with a telescope and 1758 01:25:44,833 --> 01:25:46,000 video cameras, and... 1759 01:25:46,625 --> 01:25:48,059 You know, Bob points out that there's a 1760 01:25:48,083 --> 01:25:49,875 green light down there on the road. 1761 01:25:50,333 --> 01:25:52,416 And then the green light dropped from, like, 1762 01:25:52,583 --> 01:25:54,083 head level down to the ground. 1763 01:25:54,250 --> 01:25:56,170 And we realized those were night vision goggles. 1764 01:25:56,250 --> 01:25:57,490 And somebody just dropped their 1765 01:25:57,625 --> 01:25:59,166 night vision goggles and we saw it. 1766 01:25:59,416 --> 01:26:02,833 There was five or six security personnel there. 1767 01:26:03,000 --> 01:26:05,375 And one of them dropped a night vision scope. 1768 01:26:05,541 --> 01:26:08,666 And we just saw it rolling down the road to us going, 1769 01:26:08,958 --> 01:26:10,541 "what is that?" 1770 01:26:10,708 --> 01:26:12,059 And then when they saw they dropped it, 1771 01:26:12,083 --> 01:26:13,403 they turned the lights on, and... 1772 01:26:13,500 --> 01:26:14,708 Everyone was there. 1773 01:26:14,875 --> 01:26:16,333 There were cars and a lot of guys. 1774 01:26:16,500 --> 01:26:18,333 So it was... it was very shocking. 1775 01:26:18,500 --> 01:26:21,000 But yeah, that's when we got discovered. 1776 01:26:21,458 --> 01:26:24,208 You know, the consensus was, if they find me, 1777 01:26:24,375 --> 01:26:26,083 there's gonna be big trouble. 1778 01:26:26,291 --> 01:26:28,458 So if I take off into the desert, 1779 01:26:28,708 --> 01:26:30,041 they're just gonna look like 1780 01:26:30,208 --> 01:26:31,726 a bunch of tourists that are out there. 1781 01:26:31,750 --> 01:26:34,041 So I ran out into the desert. 1782 01:26:34,208 --> 01:26:35,250 They got caught. 1783 01:26:35,416 --> 01:26:36,416 Everybody got questioned. 1784 01:26:36,541 --> 01:26:37,833 They eventually let them go. 1785 01:26:38,000 --> 01:26:39,375 There were four people there. 1786 01:26:39,708 --> 01:26:41,000 And then on their way out, 1787 01:26:41,166 --> 01:26:42,625 before they got to the main road, 1788 01:26:42,791 --> 01:26:44,916 I joined up with them, got back in the car. 1789 01:26:45,083 --> 01:26:46,291 We continued on and then 1790 01:26:46,458 --> 01:26:48,333 were stopped by the local sheriff. 1791 01:26:48,583 --> 01:26:50,416 And the sheriff called it in and he said, 1792 01:26:50,583 --> 01:26:52,875 "yeah, I got five people here," and wackenhut said, 1793 01:26:53,041 --> 01:26:54,833 "well, there were only four there. 1794 01:26:55,000 --> 01:26:56,500 Where'd you get the other guy?" 1795 01:26:56,750 --> 01:27:00,333 So he asked for everybody's ID and we gave it to him. 1796 01:27:00,500 --> 01:27:03,041 So that's how they found out that I was there. 1797 01:27:03,250 --> 01:27:05,833 As soon as they mentioned my name, from what I recall, 1798 01:27:06,250 --> 01:27:09,250 they just said, "okay," and they let everybody go. 1799 01:27:09,708 --> 01:27:11,416 And that's how... 1800 01:27:12,541 --> 01:27:14,083 that's how it went. Yeah. 1801 01:27:18,458 --> 01:27:20,250 Dennis contacted me in the morning and said, 1802 01:27:20,416 --> 01:27:22,458 "instead of going into s4, 1803 01:27:22,875 --> 01:27:24,875 we're gonna go to Indian Springs," 1804 01:27:25,041 --> 01:27:27,125 which was an auxiliary air force base, 1805 01:27:27,500 --> 01:27:29,875 you know, in that general area, part of the test site. 1806 01:27:30,208 --> 01:27:33,458 So we went... to Indian Springs that morning. 1807 01:27:33,916 --> 01:27:37,541 And, that's where I was debriefed and interrogated. 1808 01:27:37,916 --> 01:27:40,458 Literally said two or three words the entire trip. 1809 01:27:40,625 --> 01:27:43,125 It's like a half hour, 45 minute drive. 1810 01:27:43,458 --> 01:27:46,166 The only thing he did say on the way down there was, 1811 01:27:46,333 --> 01:27:48,791 "you know, when we said this was highly classified, 1812 01:27:49,041 --> 01:27:50,333 we didn't mean that you can tell 1813 01:27:50,500 --> 01:27:52,166 your friends and family about it." 1814 01:27:52,375 --> 01:27:54,215 And that was, I think, the only thing he said. 1815 01:27:54,791 --> 01:27:56,767 There was someone at the guard station to let us in, 1816 01:27:56,791 --> 01:27:58,351 and then someone in the building and... 1817 01:27:58,541 --> 01:27:59,875 He left after that. 1818 01:28:00,958 --> 01:28:03,000 Guards there with m-16s and guys 1819 01:28:03,166 --> 01:28:05,446 slamming their finger into my chest, screaming in my ear. 1820 01:28:05,500 --> 01:28:06,976 Some people were pointing weapons at me. 1821 01:28:07,000 --> 01:28:08,560 There were a couple of guys in the room 1822 01:28:08,625 --> 01:28:10,125 that they sat me down with. 1823 01:28:10,291 --> 01:28:12,916 And they were more angry than anything else. 1824 01:28:13,083 --> 01:28:15,333 I don't think they exactly knew what to say, 1825 01:28:15,500 --> 01:28:16,958 but they kept going over. 1826 01:28:17,125 --> 01:28:19,791 "Didn't you understand the security briefings?" 1827 01:28:19,958 --> 01:28:23,166 And you know, one of the guys had a sidearm, a rifle, 1828 01:28:23,333 --> 01:28:25,625 that he kept poking me with. 1829 01:28:26,291 --> 01:28:29,416 We had a story all made up why I was out there 1830 01:28:30,333 --> 01:28:33,875 about me being dropped off at the stop sign up on... 1831 01:28:34,250 --> 01:28:36,250 up on the top of the hill and that I really didn't 1832 01:28:36,291 --> 01:28:38,166 go out there and I didn't wanna and all that. 1833 01:28:38,333 --> 01:28:40,293 And the first thing that they said when I got in, 1834 01:28:40,666 --> 01:28:42,416 was, "forget about the stop sign story." 1835 01:28:42,583 --> 01:28:44,303 And we only talked about that on the phone. 1836 01:28:44,458 --> 01:28:46,726 And it was just all too obvious that the phone was tapped. 1837 01:28:46,750 --> 01:28:49,625 And eventually they brought up the fact that they said, 1838 01:28:49,916 --> 01:28:51,833 "you know, we've been monitoring your phone 1839 01:28:52,291 --> 01:28:54,416 and, we've been reviewing your... 1840 01:28:54,583 --> 01:28:55,791 you know, your clearance 1841 01:28:56,000 --> 01:28:57,750 and there've been some problems with it. 1842 01:28:58,125 --> 01:29:00,750 Your wife's been having an affair with your... 1843 01:29:00,916 --> 01:29:03,666 "her flight instructor and here's the transcripts." 1844 01:29:04,125 --> 01:29:06,708 And, you know, they just kind of explained it, 1845 01:29:07,083 --> 01:29:10,583 opened a couple places and was reading stuff into me, 1846 01:29:10,750 --> 01:29:13,083 some particularly unpleasant areas. 1847 01:29:13,250 --> 01:29:16,916 And... I kind of put most of this out of my mind. 1848 01:29:17,125 --> 01:29:18,583 They let me go after that. 1849 01:29:18,750 --> 01:29:20,666 And I think they were gonna yank the clearance 1850 01:29:20,833 --> 01:29:22,416 anyway, because of what was going on. 1851 01:29:22,583 --> 01:29:24,625 They were simply waiting to see if it was something 1852 01:29:24,958 --> 01:29:26,458 that was gonna fizzle out or not. 1853 01:29:26,625 --> 01:29:27,833 And apparently it wasn't. 1854 01:29:28,333 --> 01:29:30,013 It's something I don't like to talk about. 1855 01:29:30,375 --> 01:29:32,625 It's upsetting... and it... 1856 01:29:33,291 --> 01:29:36,208 You know, it's probably the least of what I remember 1857 01:29:36,375 --> 01:29:38,291 about the entire situation. 1858 01:29:39,041 --> 01:29:42,958 And that was essentially the last day that I had ever worked. 1859 01:29:43,416 --> 01:29:44,625 But yeah, they were... 1860 01:29:44,958 --> 01:29:46,208 upset was... 1861 01:29:47,458 --> 01:29:48,791 an understatement. 1862 01:29:52,958 --> 01:29:54,458 They shot at you, somebody shot, 1863 01:29:54,625 --> 01:29:56,125 maybe as a warning, perhaps. 1864 01:29:56,541 --> 01:29:58,809 That's a good warning, I had my back tire shot out on my car 1865 01:29:58,833 --> 01:30:00,583 as I was getting on the freeway. 1866 01:30:00,750 --> 01:30:04,416 I was dropping some real estate photos off at gene huff's office 1867 01:30:04,583 --> 01:30:07,000 on eastern Avenue in Las Vegas. 1868 01:30:07,458 --> 01:30:09,833 And I drove down, Charleston boulevard went 1869 01:30:10,000 --> 01:30:11,791 completely across the valley. 1870 01:30:12,000 --> 01:30:14,000 And just as I was heading back, 1871 01:30:14,458 --> 01:30:16,208 heading toward the freeway on-ramp, 1872 01:30:16,625 --> 01:30:17,958 another car kept 1873 01:30:18,291 --> 01:30:19,458 running up beside me. 1874 01:30:19,625 --> 01:30:21,166 And, you know, they'd fall back, 1875 01:30:21,333 --> 01:30:22,916 I'd move forward, they'd fall back. 1876 01:30:23,083 --> 01:30:25,416 I thought it was some kid trying to race me. 1877 01:30:26,000 --> 01:30:28,458 And they shot, they fired it. 1878 01:30:28,625 --> 01:30:30,392 They weren't... they weren't trying to race me. 1879 01:30:30,416 --> 01:30:31,875 They were trying to shoot me. 1880 01:30:32,041 --> 01:30:34,291 They shot and hit the back tire, 1881 01:30:34,458 --> 01:30:36,625 where Charleston boulevard 1882 01:30:36,791 --> 01:30:39,750 curves... the on-ramp that goes on to i-15. 1883 01:30:40,000 --> 01:30:41,916 There's, a big dirt area. 1884 01:30:42,125 --> 01:30:44,291 So instead of following the turn, 1885 01:30:44,458 --> 01:30:47,791 I went straight into the dirt and stopped 1886 01:30:47,958 --> 01:30:51,416 and was kind of petrified and just froze there in the car 1887 01:30:51,583 --> 01:30:53,541 because I thought they had pulled up behind me 1888 01:30:53,708 --> 01:30:55,500 and I was waiting to get shot. 1889 01:30:55,750 --> 01:30:58,791 And I just sat there for a long period of time and realized 1890 01:30:58,958 --> 01:31:00,125 they had kept going. 1891 01:31:00,291 --> 01:31:01,458 So I kind of relaxed. 1892 01:31:01,625 --> 01:31:03,250 I went out and looked at the tire 1893 01:31:03,416 --> 01:31:05,208 and I didn't have a spare. 1894 01:31:05,375 --> 01:31:09,000 I just got back in the car and started driving up the on-ramp, 1895 01:31:09,166 --> 01:31:11,458 of course, you know, with a shot-out tire. 1896 01:31:11,708 --> 01:31:14,166 You know, was it somebody from the government? 1897 01:31:14,458 --> 01:31:16,333 Was it a random shooting? 1898 01:31:16,500 --> 01:31:17,708 Was it a gangbanger? 1899 01:31:18,000 --> 01:31:19,208 I... I don't know. 1900 01:31:19,375 --> 01:31:21,125 But that... that happened at that time. 1901 01:31:21,916 --> 01:31:23,291 But you said, 1902 01:31:23,458 --> 01:31:25,101 you were referred to getting into trouble. 1903 01:31:25,125 --> 01:31:26,625 Have you had some repercussions? 1904 01:31:26,791 --> 01:31:28,416 Yeah, I've been threatened with... 1905 01:31:28,583 --> 01:31:29,958 being charged with espionage. 1906 01:31:30,125 --> 01:31:32,083 I've had my life threatened by them, 1907 01:31:32,250 --> 01:31:34,291 my wife's life threatened by them. 1908 01:31:34,458 --> 01:31:36,684 And, I... I mean, I don't know where else you can go from there. 1909 01:31:36,708 --> 01:31:39,875 I, at that time, you know, had people following me, 1910 01:31:40,041 --> 01:31:42,291 was beginning to get scared and at some point stayed at 1911 01:31:42,458 --> 01:31:44,166 John lear's house and, you know, 1912 01:31:44,333 --> 01:31:46,208 was kind of hiding from what was going on. 1913 01:31:46,583 --> 01:31:49,458 And he said, "look, I know this guy, George knapp." 1914 01:31:49,875 --> 01:31:53,125 He's... you know, part of klas-TV. 1915 01:31:53,291 --> 01:31:54,916 He's an investigative reporter. 1916 01:31:55,083 --> 01:31:57,916 What you should do, you should say all this stuff, 1917 01:31:58,083 --> 01:31:59,416 get it on the record. 1918 01:31:59,625 --> 01:32:01,375 Like that way, if anything happens to you, 1919 01:32:01,541 --> 01:32:02,958 it's just gonna explode. 1920 01:32:03,125 --> 01:32:04,809 "And the... you know, maybe they'll leave you alone." 1921 01:32:04,833 --> 01:32:07,000 And, you know, initially that sounded ridiculous. 1922 01:32:07,166 --> 01:32:09,750 And eventually I said, "I gotta do something. 1923 01:32:09,916 --> 01:32:11,291 So... okay." 1924 01:32:11,458 --> 01:32:13,750 So, they came up to the house 1925 01:32:13,916 --> 01:32:15,625 and in John lear's driveway, 1926 01:32:16,041 --> 01:32:18,541 we did that Dennis interview. 1927 01:32:29,166 --> 01:32:31,875 George knapp attached the name to Dennis to me. 1928 01:32:32,041 --> 01:32:33,791 That was my superior at the time. 1929 01:32:33,958 --> 01:32:35,916 It was kind of a poke in the eye to him. 1930 01:32:36,083 --> 01:32:39,208 I had heard about Bob in 1988. 1931 01:32:39,375 --> 01:32:43,666 This guy, John lear walks into the TV station in 1987. 1932 01:32:43,833 --> 01:32:45,166 He had a stack of documents 1933 01:32:45,333 --> 01:32:46,708 and he pushed them across the desk 1934 01:32:46,875 --> 01:32:48,208 to a guy named ned day. 1935 01:32:48,375 --> 01:32:50,958 Ned had broken a big story about area 51. 1936 01:32:51,125 --> 01:32:54,625 He and Bob snowdall got this tip from lear and his associates 1937 01:32:54,791 --> 01:32:56,041 that there was a secret plane 1938 01:32:56,208 --> 01:32:57,750 being developed in the Nevada desert. 1939 01:32:57,916 --> 01:32:59,666 Something that was invisible to radar, 1940 01:32:59,833 --> 01:33:01,666 which sounded preposterous at the time, 1941 01:33:01,833 --> 01:33:03,166 but turned out to be true. 1942 01:33:03,541 --> 01:33:06,125 Lear had credibility with klas because 1943 01:33:06,291 --> 01:33:08,375 he had given us information that turned out to be 1944 01:33:08,541 --> 01:33:09,708 this really big story. 1945 01:33:09,875 --> 01:33:11,375 It was John lear that introduced me 1946 01:33:11,541 --> 01:33:13,000 to George knapp and... 1947 01:33:13,333 --> 01:33:16,208 John lear was one of the first people that I spoke to. 1948 01:33:16,375 --> 01:33:19,583 Actually, I think it was gene huff, but John lear had 1949 01:33:19,875 --> 01:33:21,625 a lot of connections and 1950 01:33:21,875 --> 01:33:23,583 familiar with a lot of, 1951 01:33:23,750 --> 01:33:26,916 area 51 stories and that sort of thing, so. 1952 01:33:27,375 --> 01:33:29,625 He was an unusual guy, but a good friend 1953 01:33:29,791 --> 01:33:32,458 and had some, you know, strange beliefs. 1954 01:33:32,791 --> 01:33:35,333 But he did direct me to, George knapp. 1955 01:33:35,833 --> 01:33:39,750 And, that was an important... an important meeting. 1956 01:33:40,666 --> 01:33:43,291 I'm the anchor of the five o'clock newscast. 1957 01:33:43,541 --> 01:33:44,781 And every night we would have a 1958 01:33:44,833 --> 01:33:46,541 five-minute live interview segment. 1959 01:33:46,708 --> 01:33:49,291 It might be a local celebrity, a comedian, 1960 01:33:49,458 --> 01:33:51,041 an entertainer, a politician, 1961 01:33:51,208 --> 01:33:53,458 somebody interesting who was traveling through town. 1962 01:33:53,958 --> 01:33:55,708 And I remember the day that it happened. 1963 01:33:55,875 --> 01:33:58,541 It's in may of... of 1989. 1964 01:33:59,208 --> 01:34:01,041 Whoever our guest was, canceled. 1965 01:34:01,833 --> 01:34:03,726 We're scrambling to figure out who we're gonna fill 1966 01:34:03,750 --> 01:34:05,000 this five-minute hole with. 1967 01:34:05,458 --> 01:34:07,559 And I thought about lear. Lear said he knew this guy. 1968 01:34:07,583 --> 01:34:09,833 It might work out there. I had no idea who Bob was. 1969 01:34:10,000 --> 01:34:12,250 I had no idea what had been going on in his life. 1970 01:34:12,833 --> 01:34:14,193 And so, I called up lear and said, 1971 01:34:14,333 --> 01:34:16,291 "hey, you said your... this guy might..." 1972 01:34:16,458 --> 01:34:17,666 Your flying saucer guy, 1973 01:34:18,166 --> 01:34:19,333 might get a job out there. 1974 01:34:19,500 --> 01:34:20,666 "You think he'd talk to us?" 1975 01:34:21,333 --> 01:34:22,809 And lear says, "I'll get back to you." 1976 01:34:22,833 --> 01:34:24,309 He calls back a couple minutes later. 1977 01:34:24,333 --> 01:34:25,333 "Yeah, he'll do it." 1978 01:34:25,500 --> 01:34:27,041 George sent over his cameraman. 1979 01:34:27,208 --> 01:34:28,875 His name was frank, in a Van, and 1980 01:34:29,041 --> 01:34:31,708 they set Bob up in silhouette inside the Van. 1981 01:34:31,875 --> 01:34:33,083 He told the story, you know. 1982 01:34:33,333 --> 01:34:34,875 There were nine flying 1983 01:34:35,041 --> 01:34:37,458 disks... flying saucers, and... and told the story. 1984 01:34:37,625 --> 01:34:40,500 And... and then it hit the news and, man, 1985 01:34:40,666 --> 01:34:42,416 did their newsroom go crazy. 1986 01:34:42,583 --> 01:34:44,833 We send a live unit up to lear's house. 1987 01:34:45,125 --> 01:34:46,625 They arrange this interview. 1988 01:34:46,791 --> 01:34:48,750 We have to block out this guy's identity. 1989 01:34:48,916 --> 01:34:50,625 We have to put him in silhouette. 1990 01:34:50,958 --> 01:34:52,750 He used a pseudonym, Dennis. 1991 01:34:53,583 --> 01:34:55,500 Weren't exactly sure what he was gonna say, 1992 01:34:56,000 --> 01:34:58,250 but we started asking him some generic questions 1993 01:34:58,416 --> 01:35:01,583 in our five o'clock newscast and out this story spills 1994 01:35:01,958 --> 01:35:03,041 and the world changed. 1995 01:35:04,458 --> 01:35:06,125 There's really no way I can prove it 1996 01:35:06,291 --> 01:35:08,211 without revealing my identity and getting myself 1997 01:35:08,291 --> 01:35:09,811 into more trouble than I have already. 1998 01:35:10,125 --> 01:35:12,041 The choice of Dennis was an inside joke. 1999 01:35:12,208 --> 01:35:14,875 He says that's the name of his superior at groom lake. 2000 01:35:15,083 --> 01:35:17,563 - It wasn't a joke to Dennis. - He called right after, he said, 2001 01:35:17,708 --> 01:35:19,642 "you have any idea what we're going to do to you now?" 2002 01:35:19,666 --> 01:35:22,041 And I... I said, "well, no," and he's yelling up the phone. 2003 01:35:22,208 --> 01:35:25,500 When he did this, I told, I... I was astonished because 2004 01:35:25,666 --> 01:35:27,916 it was courageous when he was on as Dennis 2005 01:35:28,083 --> 01:35:29,833 and silhouette on the news and stuff. 2006 01:35:30,250 --> 01:35:32,375 I mean, I was amazed by this guy 2007 01:35:32,541 --> 01:35:34,181 'cause he was putting it all on the line. 2008 01:35:34,583 --> 01:35:36,541 Look, they're doing everything they can 2009 01:35:36,958 --> 01:35:38,625 to keep this information secret. 2010 01:35:39,375 --> 01:35:41,166 And if they're gonna silence me, 2011 01:35:41,333 --> 01:35:43,416 whether it's something, you know, ridiculous, 2012 01:35:43,583 --> 01:35:45,583 like try to hurt me... 2013 01:35:46,083 --> 01:35:48,043 That would kind of prove what I'm saying is true. 2014 01:35:48,125 --> 01:35:50,208 Why would this guy suddenly get, you know, 2015 01:35:50,375 --> 01:35:51,791 murdered or hurt in some way? 2016 01:35:52,375 --> 01:35:55,750 And, it just kind of seemed like 2017 01:35:55,916 --> 01:35:58,916 getting the information out would be a good idea. 2018 01:36:03,125 --> 01:36:04,365 I used to always travel around. 2019 01:36:04,458 --> 01:36:05,791 I always held the weapon 2020 01:36:05,958 --> 01:36:07,708 and... because I mean, he's been shot at. 2021 01:36:07,875 --> 01:36:09,035 And I... I was aware of that. 2022 01:36:09,125 --> 01:36:10,625 And I was... I was willing to... 2023 01:36:10,875 --> 01:36:13,125 to fire back, you know, that was my friend. 2024 01:36:13,333 --> 01:36:17,000 Mario, who drove a motorcycle, was into racing and all that 2025 01:36:17,166 --> 01:36:19,291 came riding by one day and was paralyzed 2026 01:36:19,458 --> 01:36:20,625 by the fact that there was a 2027 01:36:20,791 --> 01:36:22,375 jet dragster in his neighborhood and 2028 01:36:22,541 --> 01:36:24,625 stopped his motorcycle and immediately got out 2029 01:36:24,791 --> 01:36:26,666 and started talking to me, and, you know. 2030 01:36:26,833 --> 01:36:29,166 From that point on, we kind of became friends over time 2031 01:36:29,333 --> 01:36:30,875 and, you know, still to this day, 2032 01:36:31,041 --> 01:36:34,250 he remains a really good friend and, 2033 01:36:34,416 --> 01:36:37,041 went through a lot of... a lot with me... 2034 01:36:37,208 --> 01:36:39,833 As all this unfolded in Las Vegas. 2035 01:36:40,625 --> 01:36:44,000 He knew and I knew that he was targeted. 2036 01:36:44,166 --> 01:36:46,791 And I mean, I... I think even before that, at one point 2037 01:36:46,958 --> 01:36:48,416 he was shot on the freeway. 2038 01:36:48,583 --> 01:36:50,500 You know, Mario was with me frequently 2039 01:36:50,666 --> 01:36:53,458 because we go to the gym every day and that's when, 2040 01:36:53,833 --> 01:36:56,250 you know, sometimes we park the car, come back out, 2041 01:36:56,416 --> 01:36:59,291 all the doors, hoods and back would be open, 2042 01:36:59,458 --> 01:37:02,166 even though we locked it and checked it before we left. 2043 01:37:02,333 --> 01:37:03,791 But nothing would be taken. 2044 01:37:04,041 --> 01:37:07,208 You know, and there was a loaded machine gun in the car 2045 01:37:07,375 --> 01:37:09,625 and wallets, but nothing would be touched. 2046 01:37:09,791 --> 01:37:10,958 My phone was tapped. 2047 01:37:11,333 --> 01:37:12,976 We were being followed all over the place. 2048 01:37:13,000 --> 01:37:15,166 I mean, I was being followed 'cause I was with Lazar. 2049 01:37:15,541 --> 01:37:17,833 The things that they were doing to mess with his life 2050 01:37:18,000 --> 01:37:20,583 were really happening, breaking into his house 2051 01:37:20,750 --> 01:37:23,666 and moving things around or opening the doors to his car 2052 01:37:23,833 --> 01:37:25,625 and leaving the gun sitting there or... 2053 01:37:25,791 --> 01:37:27,875 Shooting at his tire or just messing with him. 2054 01:37:28,333 --> 01:37:30,500 There's no way to convey that to people 2055 01:37:30,666 --> 01:37:33,083 how real that was, unless you were there. 2056 01:37:33,250 --> 01:37:34,500 But that it was real. 2057 01:37:34,666 --> 01:37:38,750 We were scared and there was pressure on Bob and me 2058 01:37:38,916 --> 01:37:41,208 and our station to knock it off. 2059 01:37:46,291 --> 01:37:48,416 I got a call from Dennis mariani 2060 01:37:48,875 --> 01:37:51,083 and he said, "we need to talk. 2061 01:37:51,250 --> 01:37:53,541 Let's meet at the union Plaza casino." 2062 01:37:54,041 --> 01:37:56,833 After I got that call, I spoke to gene huff, 2063 01:37:57,041 --> 01:37:58,541 my other friend Joe at the time. 2064 01:37:58,708 --> 01:38:00,068 I wanted some... you know, finally 2065 01:38:00,125 --> 01:38:02,125 some other witnesses to come with me. 2066 01:38:02,458 --> 01:38:05,666 And we all went to the union Plaza casino. 2067 01:38:05,833 --> 01:38:08,000 I think it was around eight o'clock or 8:30 at night. 2068 01:38:08,541 --> 01:38:11,666 If I recall, as I was walking 2069 01:38:12,166 --> 01:38:15,375 to where he wanted me to meet him, 2070 01:38:15,750 --> 01:38:18,333 I passed not one, but two guys 2071 01:38:18,500 --> 01:38:21,000 that looked super familiar to me 2072 01:38:21,166 --> 01:38:23,625 like they were security guards at s4. 2073 01:38:23,916 --> 01:38:26,583 And that really alerted me. 2074 01:38:26,750 --> 01:38:28,125 And I said something to gene. 2075 01:38:28,291 --> 01:38:31,166 I said, "something's... something's weird here." 2076 01:38:31,750 --> 01:38:37,250 And I went up and I saw, Dennis playing at a... 2077 01:38:37,875 --> 01:38:39,333 I don't remember what game it was, 2078 01:38:39,500 --> 01:38:41,166 but I went up alongside of him 2079 01:38:41,791 --> 01:38:43,125 and said, "hey, Dennis." 2080 01:38:43,458 --> 01:38:45,378 And he didn't... he wouldn't even look up at me. 2081 01:38:45,791 --> 01:38:47,791 And I said, you know, "okay." 2082 01:38:47,958 --> 01:38:49,708 And... and walked away, 2083 01:38:50,083 --> 01:38:53,791 and connected up with gene who had eyes on him the entire time. 2084 01:38:54,083 --> 01:38:56,333 Bob sees Dennis at a Blackjack table. 2085 01:38:56,625 --> 01:38:58,083 This guy won't even look at him. 2086 01:38:58,291 --> 01:39:00,750 Now, if he was a complete stranger that Bob wasn't 2087 01:39:01,000 --> 01:39:02,791 trying to pretend was Dennis, 2088 01:39:02,958 --> 01:39:05,142 he would have looked at him and said, "get out of here, buddy." 2089 01:39:05,166 --> 01:39:08,333 "What... you know," he... he keeps looking down at his cards and 2090 01:39:08,500 --> 01:39:09,666 he won't talk to Bob. 2091 01:39:09,833 --> 01:39:11,541 So Bob comes back and tells me that. 2092 01:39:11,791 --> 01:39:14,101 I mean, we weren't behind the slot machines for five seconds. 2093 01:39:14,125 --> 01:39:16,333 We looked back. Dennis is gone. 2094 01:39:16,541 --> 01:39:19,041 So it was... it was weird to see him acting like this. 2095 01:39:19,291 --> 01:39:22,500 I wonder if those other guys weren't supposed to be there. 2096 01:39:22,666 --> 01:39:24,750 They saw him and he decided to shut up 2097 01:39:25,291 --> 01:39:27,291 and he really did want to talk to me 2098 01:39:27,750 --> 01:39:30,916 or they were with him or... something like that. 2099 01:39:31,083 --> 01:39:34,083 But why did his attitude change so much between 2100 01:39:34,333 --> 01:39:35,958 when he called me, "hey, we gotta talk." 2101 01:39:36,125 --> 01:39:38,625 And I got there and now I'm not... I don't even exist. 2102 01:39:38,791 --> 01:39:41,083 So it almost made me think 2103 01:39:41,333 --> 01:39:44,666 somebody was privy to the conversation, scared him. 2104 01:39:44,833 --> 01:39:47,083 And, you know, that... that was it. 2105 01:39:47,250 --> 01:39:49,750 We all got back together, gene, Joe, and I, 2106 01:39:49,916 --> 01:39:53,250 we went back to the house, and my house had been broken into. 2107 01:39:53,416 --> 01:39:55,208 So was this entire thing set up 2108 01:39:55,375 --> 01:39:58,416 just to get us out of the house so they'd have access, 2109 01:39:58,791 --> 01:40:02,958 and, you know, who knows, or was it a coincidence? 2110 01:40:04,125 --> 01:40:05,541 Did anything happen at the house? 2111 01:40:05,708 --> 01:40:07,666 Like, they broke in, did they take anything? 2112 01:40:08,000 --> 01:40:09,041 Yeah, they did. 2113 01:40:14,250 --> 01:40:17,083 As time went on, my name became known, 2114 01:40:17,666 --> 01:40:21,000 but as far as the reception from people, 2115 01:40:21,416 --> 01:40:24,250 for the most part, only my friends and family 2116 01:40:24,416 --> 01:40:25,875 really believed my story 2117 01:40:26,041 --> 01:40:27,958 because they knew me before and after 2118 01:40:28,125 --> 01:40:29,875 some, of course, had seen the test flights. 2119 01:40:30,041 --> 01:40:32,458 And so there was no doubts in their mind, 2120 01:40:32,875 --> 01:40:34,958 but the general public certainly did not. 2121 01:40:35,125 --> 01:40:36,791 So, I looked like... 2122 01:40:37,791 --> 01:40:40,708 You know, just some hoaxster or some, you know, 2123 01:40:40,875 --> 01:40:43,416 weird guy out there telling strange stories. 2124 01:40:47,000 --> 01:40:49,416 The weeks and months that followed that time 2125 01:40:49,583 --> 01:40:52,208 were very stressful and... 2126 01:40:54,625 --> 01:40:58,000 probably the... the worst time in my life. 2127 01:41:05,875 --> 01:41:07,916 Take your time. 2128 01:41:15,458 --> 01:41:17,934 I tried to say, "I'm the same guy who did these other stories." 2129 01:41:17,958 --> 01:41:20,666 And I could not understand why people did not believe it. 2130 01:41:21,000 --> 01:41:22,833 And it was important to me at the time, like, 2131 01:41:23,000 --> 01:41:24,800 "hey, I'm... I'm telling you the truth here." 2132 01:41:25,333 --> 01:41:27,708 I'm... I'm telling you how we went through this process 2133 01:41:27,875 --> 01:41:30,541 "of what steps we took to tell the Bob Lazar story." 2134 01:41:31,291 --> 01:41:33,267 And there were those who would just... would not look at it, 2135 01:41:33,291 --> 01:41:34,708 would not take it seriously. 2136 01:41:34,875 --> 01:41:36,416 And I could not understand it. 2137 01:41:36,583 --> 01:41:38,208 And it bothered me in those days. 2138 01:41:38,375 --> 01:41:39,791 And it bothered me for a while, 2139 01:41:40,083 --> 01:41:42,250 but now we're looking at 34 years later 2140 01:41:42,583 --> 01:41:43,823 and it doesn't bother me a bit. 2141 01:41:43,875 --> 01:41:46,666 I do not give a shit if people be... believe Bob Lazar. 2142 01:41:46,833 --> 01:41:48,041 I know what I reported. 2143 01:41:48,208 --> 01:41:49,250 I know what he said. 2144 01:41:49,416 --> 01:41:50,616 I know he's telling the truth. 2145 01:41:50,750 --> 01:41:51,726 And I know there are other people 2146 01:41:51,750 --> 01:41:52,833 that know it's the truth. 2147 01:41:53,125 --> 01:41:54,750 And I don't care whether, 2148 01:41:54,916 --> 01:41:57,500 they wanna drag me or him over the coals anymore. 2149 01:41:57,666 --> 01:41:58,875 Screw it. 2150 01:42:00,125 --> 01:42:01,791 Bob played a dangerous chess game 2151 01:42:01,958 --> 01:42:03,238 with some very dangerous people. 2152 01:42:03,375 --> 01:42:04,708 And he made the first move. 2153 01:42:05,208 --> 01:42:06,916 They were astonished that anybody had the 2154 01:42:07,083 --> 01:42:09,000 audacity to defy them. 2155 01:42:09,375 --> 01:42:11,875 And while they were thinking about that, Bob went public. 2156 01:42:12,333 --> 01:42:14,916 And he forced their hand. They either had to arrest him 2157 01:42:15,083 --> 01:42:17,000 and prove that what he was saying is true, 2158 01:42:17,291 --> 01:42:19,041 or they had to let him go and hope to exact 2159 01:42:19,208 --> 01:42:20,541 their revenge another time. 2160 01:42:20,791 --> 01:42:22,541 And I say this all the time. 2161 01:42:22,708 --> 01:42:24,851 A... all this stuff is something that happened to him. 2162 01:42:24,875 --> 01:42:26,750 It's not who he is. Like he said before, 2163 01:42:26,916 --> 01:42:28,956 "I'd rather you not believe me and leave me alone." 2164 01:42:29,458 --> 01:42:31,916 A lot of stuff that Bob said turned out to be true 2165 01:42:32,083 --> 01:42:33,291 and was verifiable. 2166 01:42:33,458 --> 01:42:34,791 And it drives people crazy. 2167 01:42:34,958 --> 01:42:36,166 But, you know, the fact that 2168 01:42:36,333 --> 01:42:37,791 he knew about a place called s4. 2169 01:42:37,958 --> 01:42:40,166 You know, nellis confirmed that, it was real. 2170 01:42:40,333 --> 01:42:41,601 He wouldn't tell me where it was, 2171 01:42:41,625 --> 01:42:43,041 but they confirmed it was real. 2172 01:42:43,375 --> 01:42:45,434 That whole hand scanner thing turned out to be real. 2173 01:42:45,458 --> 01:42:46,708 How did he know that stuff? 2174 01:42:47,291 --> 01:42:49,250 Element 115. You know? 2175 01:42:49,583 --> 01:42:52,500 We still don't have a stable form of it, but, you know, 2176 01:42:52,666 --> 01:42:55,166 it makes sense that it could exist, that 2177 01:42:55,333 --> 01:42:58,333 we have a reverse engineering program, that these 2178 01:42:58,708 --> 01:43:00,958 big defense contractors have been conducting. 2179 01:43:01,125 --> 01:43:03,500 All that stuff coming out now, it is true. 2180 01:43:03,708 --> 01:43:04,750 He knew about it. 2181 01:43:04,916 --> 01:43:06,041 How did he know? 2182 01:43:06,208 --> 01:43:08,041 Just making it up, out of thin air. 2183 01:43:08,291 --> 01:43:10,500 The way it affected me, I felt bad for him 2184 01:43:10,666 --> 01:43:12,833 because I knew who he was, you know. 2185 01:43:13,166 --> 01:43:14,833 And what people were saying about him. 2186 01:43:15,000 --> 01:43:17,583 I mean, there was a lot of good people, but, 2187 01:43:18,041 --> 01:43:20,041 still, you always heard the bad stuff. 2188 01:43:20,208 --> 01:43:21,583 It's like, "you know, no wonder 2189 01:43:21,750 --> 01:43:23,430 he didn't wanna talk about it to anybody." 2190 01:43:23,583 --> 01:43:27,541 You know? He was very quiet and... and I understand that. 2191 01:43:27,708 --> 01:43:30,375 So we really didn't focus on that at all. 2192 01:43:30,541 --> 01:43:34,166 It's just, let's do what we wanna do, have some goals in life 2193 01:43:34,333 --> 01:43:36,583 and things that we wanna do and focus on that. 2194 01:43:42,541 --> 01:43:44,333 It's a quiet place, 2195 01:43:44,500 --> 01:43:47,166 way up in the mountains, away from everything. 2196 01:43:47,416 --> 01:43:51,083 My wife has her barn and arena out there. 2197 01:43:51,250 --> 01:43:54,750 The house is here, and I have my lab at home. 2198 01:43:54,916 --> 01:43:56,541 And it's, you know, it's sizable. 2199 01:43:56,708 --> 01:43:58,000 It's 1500 square feet. 2200 01:43:58,166 --> 01:44:00,666 It's bigger than the... You know, 2201 01:44:00,833 --> 01:44:02,958 house I used to have in new Mexico to live in, 2202 01:44:03,375 --> 01:44:07,458 but I can carry on multiple experiments, 2203 01:44:07,625 --> 01:44:10,333 work on multiple projects, all at the same time. 2204 01:44:10,500 --> 01:44:12,458 And it's... it's a blast. 2205 01:44:12,625 --> 01:44:14,345 I c... I could almost live in here, it's... 2206 01:44:14,416 --> 01:44:16,416 to me, it's the ultimate man cave. 2207 01:44:17,125 --> 01:44:18,625 I spend more and more time 2208 01:44:19,291 --> 01:44:22,083 in here kinda working towards retiring. 2209 01:44:22,708 --> 01:44:24,000 And... 2210 01:44:24,250 --> 01:44:25,583 yeah, my wife is really... 2211 01:44:25,750 --> 01:44:27,833 my wife, joy, is really into horses. 2212 01:44:28,000 --> 01:44:31,875 And so, she can be in her... I call it her lab, 2213 01:44:32,333 --> 01:44:34,250 is, the... the horse lab. 2214 01:44:34,583 --> 01:44:36,166 And I'm in here and, you know, 2215 01:44:36,333 --> 01:44:38,583 we come and hang out with each other, but 2216 01:44:38,750 --> 01:44:40,059 you know, we can have a good time 2217 01:44:40,083 --> 01:44:42,333 by ourselves doing our own thing. 2218 01:44:42,666 --> 01:44:45,291 This is joy, my wife. 2219 01:44:45,458 --> 01:44:46,625 Are you filming? 2220 01:44:46,791 --> 01:44:48,041 Okay, let's start. 2221 01:44:49,333 --> 01:44:50,666 Cut! 2222 01:44:50,958 --> 01:44:52,541 This is my wife, joy. 2223 01:44:52,708 --> 01:44:54,291 - This is my husband, Bob. - Yeah. 2224 01:44:54,458 --> 01:44:58,458 - We met... -In... - 23 years ago 2225 01:44:59,166 --> 01:45:01,875 in 2000, August, in Las Vegas. 2226 01:45:02,041 --> 01:45:03,916 We were introduced by a mutual friend 2227 01:45:04,208 --> 01:45:07,500 and, it took us a while to figure out that we were 2228 01:45:07,666 --> 01:45:09,500 okay to date each other. 2229 01:45:10,208 --> 01:45:12,083 He liked horses. He hated Vegas. 2230 01:45:12,250 --> 01:45:13,875 And... what was the other reason? 2231 01:45:15,041 --> 01:45:16,934 - I don't know. It was just time to move. - He was very nice. 2232 01:45:16,958 --> 01:45:18,208 He was very nice. 2233 01:45:20,166 --> 01:45:21,767 - Which was the reason... - that was the reason to move? 2234 01:45:21,791 --> 01:45:24,166 - No, no, no... - I was nice? 2235 01:45:24,916 --> 01:45:26,958 Yeah, so we left and then we went 2236 01:45:27,125 --> 01:45:28,416 - to new Mexico... - New Mexico. 2237 01:45:29,333 --> 01:45:30,500 And then Michigan, 2238 01:45:30,916 --> 01:45:33,333 and now we're here in the mountains of Oregon. 2239 01:45:44,083 --> 01:45:46,291 I believe that some of the technology, 2240 01:45:46,625 --> 01:45:49,833 it may be all... of the technology should be kept secret 2241 01:45:50,000 --> 01:45:52,541 until we have a handle on everything, but certainly 2242 01:45:52,833 --> 01:45:54,583 the overview of what happened 2243 01:45:55,041 --> 01:45:57,083 just cannot be a secret from... 2244 01:45:57,458 --> 01:46:00,142 from anyone, not just the American people, but the rest of the world. 2245 01:46:00,166 --> 01:46:03,416 Let out the basic fact, that we have these crafts. 2246 01:46:03,583 --> 01:46:07,250 At one time, aliens did at least visit 2247 01:46:07,833 --> 01:46:09,875 and dropped off something, however they got here. 2248 01:46:10,208 --> 01:46:12,500 That there was some contact made and then cut it short. 2249 01:46:12,666 --> 01:46:14,333 You don't need to release information on 2250 01:46:14,500 --> 01:46:16,434 the gravity generators, the weapon potential, was... 2251 01:46:16,458 --> 01:46:18,416 which is enormous, and... and so on. 2252 01:46:18,583 --> 01:46:20,458 And how... how would it affect life on earth 2253 01:46:20,625 --> 01:46:22,666 if this stuff was widely available? 2254 01:46:22,875 --> 01:46:24,541 That's tough to say. I mean, you have 2255 01:46:25,083 --> 01:46:28,000 a different... a completely different mode of travel. 2256 01:46:28,166 --> 01:46:31,416 What happens when you can play with time? 2257 01:46:32,041 --> 01:46:34,250 That gets into a... a really 2258 01:46:34,416 --> 01:46:36,708 deep philosophical, you know, question there. 2259 01:46:36,875 --> 01:46:38,583 But I mean, we could... it would change 2260 01:46:38,875 --> 01:46:40,583 a lot of stuff, change everything. 2261 01:46:40,750 --> 01:46:42,510 Yeah, it would change absolutely everything. 2262 01:46:42,791 --> 01:46:44,125 Think it'll ever come out? 2263 01:46:44,916 --> 01:46:45,958 Personally, no. 2264 01:46:54,041 --> 01:46:56,916 I have yet to be able to really prove my story. 2265 01:46:57,375 --> 01:46:59,791 I've been accused of lying and fabricating 2266 01:46:59,958 --> 01:47:02,250 this story for many, many years. 2267 01:47:02,750 --> 01:47:04,250 Although I've always said 2268 01:47:04,416 --> 01:47:06,416 there's no way for me to prove my story, 2269 01:47:06,583 --> 01:47:08,083 I always thought it was important to 2270 01:47:08,250 --> 01:47:11,208 let the world know what I saw at s4. 2271 01:47:12,041 --> 01:47:14,833 There's no doubt in my mind that these crafts exist. 2272 01:47:15,500 --> 01:47:18,708 I saw one, and was personally inside one. 2273 01:47:19,625 --> 01:47:22,000 This is possibly one of the biggest secrets, 2274 01:47:22,166 --> 01:47:25,666 if not the biggest secret, held in the world today. 2275 01:47:26,583 --> 01:47:28,791 Prior to becoming involved with the project, 2276 01:47:29,333 --> 01:47:32,041 I really never believed in flying saucers. 2277 01:47:32,541 --> 01:47:35,125 I didn't follow flying saucer stories, 2278 01:47:35,416 --> 01:47:37,625 read the literature associated with it, 2279 01:47:37,958 --> 01:47:41,500 or pay attention to any of the news reports. 2280 01:47:42,208 --> 01:47:45,833 My experience at s4 certainly changed my outlook on all this. 2281 01:47:46,875 --> 01:47:50,000 And now I know for a fact that we are not alone. 2282 01:49:34,166 --> 01:49:38,833 These original maps, were sent to us on behalf of gene huff. 2283 01:49:39,083 --> 01:49:41,208 Gene huff was kind enough to order these 2284 01:49:41,500 --> 01:49:43,291 from the United States government and have 2285 01:49:43,458 --> 01:49:45,083 these original maps sent to us. 2286 01:49:45,250 --> 01:49:48,708 These are from the United States department of the interior 2287 01:49:49,125 --> 01:49:53,416 and these are maps of the groom lake area, 2288 01:49:53,666 --> 01:49:57,250 the ticaboo valley as you can see right here, and 2289 01:49:57,416 --> 01:49:59,291 the papoose lake area. 2290 01:49:59,458 --> 01:50:04,458 So these two are from provisional editions of 1983. 2291 01:50:04,666 --> 01:50:06,375 And the one that I have right here 2292 01:50:06,541 --> 01:50:07,791 is the one I was looking for. 2293 01:50:08,000 --> 01:50:09,833 This is the one of papoose lake. 2294 01:50:10,000 --> 01:50:11,250 So this one here 2295 01:50:11,583 --> 01:50:14,333 represents the exact location where, 2296 01:50:14,500 --> 01:50:16,083 s4 is supposedly located. 2297 01:50:16,250 --> 01:50:18,000 So you've got papoose lake right here, 2298 01:50:18,291 --> 01:50:20,833 you've got the hillside where the base is located, 2299 01:50:21,291 --> 01:50:23,708 obviously the United States department of the interior. 2300 01:50:24,000 --> 01:50:25,583 And as I was looking at this, 2301 01:50:25,750 --> 01:50:28,291 what I noticed in the bottom left corner, it said 2302 01:50:28,458 --> 01:50:32,250 "compiled from aerial photographs taken in 1968." 2303 01:50:32,833 --> 01:50:35,750 So, we had actually referred to some of these 2304 01:50:35,916 --> 01:50:37,666 back at the beginning of our project to 2305 01:50:37,833 --> 01:50:39,750 recreate the entire landscape there. 2306 01:50:40,083 --> 01:50:42,916 But what I noticed on the map when I got it 2307 01:50:43,250 --> 01:50:46,958 was it said, "map edited in 1989." 2308 01:50:47,250 --> 01:50:51,041 So on the bottom right corner, it says "papoose lake, Nevada, 2309 01:50:51,333 --> 01:50:53,000 provisional edition 1989." 2310 01:50:53,166 --> 01:50:54,208 These are original maps. 2311 01:50:54,708 --> 01:50:56,125 These are numbered as well. 2312 01:50:56,291 --> 01:50:58,458 So these are not... these are not copies. 2313 01:50:58,625 --> 01:51:00,065 These are your original ones from... 2314 01:51:00,125 --> 01:51:01,791 that you have to order and pay for. 2315 01:51:01,958 --> 01:51:04,166 And I really wanna thank gene huff for this. 2316 01:51:04,625 --> 01:51:06,416 And when you go on their website, 2317 01:51:06,750 --> 01:51:09,916 and you get to see the exact maps, you... you can actually, 2318 01:51:10,166 --> 01:51:11,708 see them and download them. 2319 01:51:12,166 --> 01:51:14,750 They have a stamp on this particular one 2320 01:51:14,916 --> 01:51:17,291 of the papoose lake, area. 2321 01:51:17,750 --> 01:51:22,416 And the provisional edition was stamped may 1989. 2322 01:51:22,958 --> 01:51:26,291 And why that's important is because it just so happened 2323 01:51:26,458 --> 01:51:29,916 that that is exactly when Bob Lazar went public. 2324 01:51:30,125 --> 01:51:34,916 He went public with the Dennis interview in may of 1989. 2325 01:51:56,125 --> 01:51:57,375 Do you believe 2326 01:51:57,875 --> 01:52:01,500 that it's possible that the government will 2327 01:52:01,666 --> 01:52:06,250 come clean anytime soon with what's really going on? 2328 01:52:07,291 --> 01:52:10,041 You know, I think probably 2329 01:52:10,333 --> 01:52:12,916 because of religion, they'd be hesitant to do it. 2330 01:52:31,291 --> 01:52:33,166 You got the seat really well. 2331 01:52:41,750 --> 01:52:43,250 Bob! Bob! 2332 01:52:44,500 --> 01:52:47,000 Shit! 2333 01:53:00,000 --> 01:53:02,125 Don't do it! 2334 01:53:14,416 --> 01:53:16,833 W... it's not gonna hurt you. 2335 01:53:25,583 --> 01:53:28,083 You have to keep your options open and... 2336 01:53:28,875 --> 01:53:30,875 Maybe they've narrowed down or proven 2337 01:53:31,041 --> 01:53:33,416 you know, where they came from. 2338 01:53:35,291 --> 01:53:38,000 Somebody has to have a lot more answers.