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RADIO HOST: And it's seven
minutes now past the hour.

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Our number across the country
is 1-800-449-GLKN,

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locally, 664-8255.

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I'm David Masters,
this is Radioactive Talk,

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on the Talk Radio.

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Our guests
on this particular program

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are Rick and Yvonne

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and they've devoted
their lives,

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along with a number of other
people on the planet,

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to awaken the rest of us up,

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uh, to some very important
truths as they see it.

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One of the important truths

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is the end of civilization
as we know it.

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Is this correct?

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Get right up on the mic.

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We feel very strongly

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that this is the end times

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that was prophesized by
in the Bible.

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DAVID: That is a known fact one
of the messages that you bring.

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That-- and this is part
of our message, yes.

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DAVID: Let me ask you this,

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how do you know
you're not hypnotized?

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Or deceased?
Or brainwashed?

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Do I look hypnotized?

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Do I look brainwashed?

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- Yeah.
- All right.

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[laughing]

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But then again,
so do I.

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MAN: No, I think you do--
you-- you have, uh,

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a particular look
on your face

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of a person who is
in a hypnotic trance.

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Well, when you mention
being brainwashed,

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I think we-- we thought
about that too.

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Over-- you know,
over some time

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and we feel that,
in a lot of ways,

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we hope we are.

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[music]

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[rain pattering]

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SAWYER: Ti and Do
gave us the tools

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to brainwash ourselves.

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Literally wash out
our humanness

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from our brains.

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And that's the same thing
that was meant by Baptism.

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There was washing your
humanness out of you

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and starting fresh,
like a new creature.

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Like the butterfly,

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the beginning
of the butterfly.

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DO: The mind
that you had as a human,

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is aborted and the soul
that was given to you

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is filled with next level
information,

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next level mind,

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and a new creature
is born.

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Brainwashing is one
of the controversial terms

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in this field.

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And-- and there
are some academics

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who want us to think
that it doesn't exist.

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But as someone who
brainwashed people,

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I can guarantee you
that it does exist.

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JANJA: One of the myths
about cults

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is that they're all
religious.

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And, in fact, there's many
kinds of cults.

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I myself was
in a political cult.

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The Democratic Workers Party.

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We were a very strict
Marxist-Leninist organization.

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I thought that
I was going to

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help bringing back
social change.

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After about the sixth year
I got very disillusioned.

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I didn't stay out of any kind
of loyalty to the leader,

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I didn't stay even

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out of any loyalty
to the belief system

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at that point.

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I stayed because
I was scared,

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and I couldn't figure out
how to leave.

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So I was in for about
10 and a half years,

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People do go through
a very deep

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psychological change
that is brought about

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by the indoctrination
methods in the group.

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And the group really
believed

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that they were training
for this trip to outer space.

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They said: "We want
to be part of a crew.

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A crew which
acts as a whole."

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And they looked at Star Trek
and said: "That's it."

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PICCARD: Captain's log,
stardate 41153.7.

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Our destination
is planet Deneb IV,

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beyond which lies the great
unexplored mass of the galaxy.

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We watched several
approved TV programs.

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Star Trek was one of them.

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It was about expanding

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our potential
into space travel.

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Which was analogous
to what we were doing.

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MAN: Initiate docking
procedures.

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Maneuvering thrusters only.

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...for as a benefit
of the overall collective.

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We do are on a quest
to better ourselves.

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Evolving toward
a state of perfection.

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Who are you?

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I am the Borg.

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DATA: The Borg have
a collective consciousness,

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there are no individuals.

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SAWYER: Do said that's like
depicting the Next Level.

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The members of the Borg.

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I thought: "Ooh."

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That's-- that's kind
of, like, uncomfortable,

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A cog in wheel
is a very significant item,

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when you are
in our Father's Kingdom

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serving as a member
of a crew.

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[robotic voice]
We are the Borg,
resistance is futile.

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FRANK: In the group

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we obviously didn't
go out and get haircuts

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at the barber shop.

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So we would
cut each other's hair.

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I was a hair cutter
at one point,

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I cut hair, you know?

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WOMAN: Oh!

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Well, next time you come
in you'll be cutting my hair.

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[laughing]

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Within the first
couple of years,

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after Ti passed,

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we were gathered
in the main room,

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Do is taking questions,

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and I raised my hand

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To make an observation

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because it was in the morning,
my...

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my voice was a little bit...

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huskier.

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Hence, we're moving into
a world that is genderless,

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we are doing everything
we can do

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to not identify
with a gender.

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But I was...

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humiliated.

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I felt this smoldering anger

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come up in me.

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And then, after that,

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I gradually developed
this severe

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inability to speak like--

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like I have still

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'cause there's always
this push-pull,

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always this suppression.

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I wrote a note to Do,

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telling him I'm feeling

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I can't be
in the group anymore.

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He came to talk to me
and said:

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"You are throwing away

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"your opportunity
to graduate.

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"You haven't done anything

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"to displease me.

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There's no reason
for you to leave."

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And I kept returning
to this, gut knowing,

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and saying: "I'm sorry,
I have no choice."

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A couple days after
I arrived in Calgary,

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Erika called me on the phone.

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And, of course,

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there would've been
somebody else

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on the extension.

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Check partner.

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I don't know if she would've
wanted to say anything

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but she had her check partner
in the extension.

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That was the last time
I spoke to her.

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JANJA: This is a thing people
don't understand

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about leaving cult,

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you're-- you're leaving
your whole world.

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And you don't know
what's out there

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and you've been fed
a bunch of bull

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about what's gonna
happen to you.

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In Heaven's Gate
you weren't this person.

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So you really had nothing
to go back to.

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And so, to me,

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that's a far deeper
type of indoctrination.

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Steve Hassan is a world
renowned cult expert.

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He himself was recruited
into a cult at 19 years of age.

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Now, he's written
a book called

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Combatting Cult Mind Control.

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[applause]

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Steve, what's going on here?

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People can be systematically
broken down,

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indoctrinated, through
controlling information,

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controlling their behavior,
controlling their thoughts,

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controlling their emotions,

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and made into obedient,
dependent slaves,

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or clones,
of the cult leader.

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In my work counseling
people who have left cults,

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you know, physically
leaving the cult

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doesn't get it
out of your head.

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Specially if you've been
in it for years.

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People tend to blame
the members,

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they did not appreciate

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the robust amount
of social psychological

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destructive mind
control techniques

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that were systematically
applied.

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They made people cut off
from their family and friends.

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They made people
be in couples.

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So they had no privacy.

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They changed their names.

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They changed their clothing.

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They change their diet.

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It's classic mind control,
in my opinion,

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to create a new pseudo-identity

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that was obedient.

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NARRATOR: The experiment
of Solomon Asch

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examines behavior
under the pressure

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00:12:10,211 --> 00:12:12,200
of social forces.

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STEVEN: In my practice,

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when I'm doing interventions
with people,

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I show videos
of the Asch Conformity Study.

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MAN: The experiment
you'll be taking part in today,

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involves the perception
of lengths of lines.

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You're to look
at the line on the left,

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and determine which of
the three lines on the right

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is equal to it in length.

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STEVE: And everybody was in
on the experiment

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00:12:36,091 --> 00:12:39,091
except the person in seat six.

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And they start giving
the correct answer

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for two rounds

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and then they all start
giving the wrong answer.

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MAN: Two.

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MAN 2: Two.

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MAN 3: Two.

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Two.

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Uh, two.

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NARRATOR: The subject
denies the evidence

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00:13:00,021 --> 00:13:02,080
of his own eyes and yields
to group influence.

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00:13:03,150 --> 00:13:05,111
And this experiment
has been done

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over and over again
for decades

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and the answer
universally is

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two thirds of everyone
who does this experiment

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starts giving
the wrong answer.

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One.

228
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They must be right,

229
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they're four of them
and one of me.

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00:13:21,111 --> 00:13:23,170
Uh, one.

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We all wanna think
that we're independent,

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and we would never agree.

233
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But the science,
the social science says,

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we're programmed
to fit into groups,

235
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we're gonna start adapting

236
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to the people
in our environment

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00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:40,131
in order to fit in.

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MAN: Hi.

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WOMAN: We're good you're here.

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JANJA: When you're in a cult,

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00:13:44,241 --> 00:13:46,131
specially for
any length of time,

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you're in what I call
a self-sealing system.

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This is a social system

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that's closed in
on itself.

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Your free will
is under the will

246
00:13:55,211 --> 00:13:57,131
of the leader
and the group.

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So, you're only doing
what you need to do

248
00:14:00,211 --> 00:14:03,111
to stay in the good graces
of the group.

249
00:14:05,060 --> 00:14:06,111
What ended up happening

250
00:14:06,131 --> 00:14:08,080
was there's these
idle threats,

251
00:14:08,101 --> 00:14:09,231
from my point of view,

252
00:14:09,251 --> 00:14:14,200
of fear, that if you
missed the boat,

253
00:14:14,221 --> 00:14:17,111
you may not get
another chance.

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00:14:20,091 --> 00:14:22,040
MAN: Come on.

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00:14:22,060 --> 00:14:23,141
JANJA: Peer pressure

256
00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:25,021
is so important
in these groups, right?

257
00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:26,160
So you can see,

258
00:14:26,180 --> 00:14:28,070
you know, SRRODY doing it,

259
00:14:28,091 --> 00:14:29,221
so that you know
that you should be at least

260
00:14:29,241 --> 00:14:32,060
as dedicated as SRRODY.

261
00:14:33,211 --> 00:14:35,111
So you are often
comparing yourself

262
00:14:35,131 --> 00:14:38,070
to the people who looked
like they're more devoted,

263
00:14:38,091 --> 00:14:39,180
so you can be
ridding yourself

264
00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:42,060
of all these human
characteristics

265
00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:43,180
that are in this...

266
00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:45,211
body that you happen
to be living in.

267
00:14:47,101 --> 00:14:51,070
DO: I'm afraid that here
I need to get a little personal,

268
00:14:51,091 --> 00:14:55,040
sex is the strongest drug,

269
00:14:55,060 --> 00:14:57,150
there's not a drug,
there's not a morphine

270
00:14:57,170 --> 00:14:59,251
or anything that
is produced by

271
00:15:00,030 --> 00:15:02,131
chemicals or plants
of this world,

272
00:15:02,150 --> 00:15:05,231
as strong as that drug.

273
00:15:07,111 --> 00:15:11,121
It's something we have to
go through the withdrawal of,

274
00:15:11,141 --> 00:15:14,180
we have to overcome.

275
00:15:14,200 --> 00:15:16,251
Just looking at a female,

276
00:15:17,030 --> 00:15:20,111
would inflame the--
the--, you know,

277
00:15:20,131 --> 00:15:22,170
the hormones in my body.

278
00:15:22,190 --> 00:15:28,070
And he would just constantly
tried to find techniques

279
00:15:28,091 --> 00:15:31,251
that would eliminate
that desire.

280
00:15:32,030 --> 00:15:33,251
We had a procedure

281
00:15:34,030 --> 00:15:36,180
that if you had
a nocturnal emission,

282
00:15:36,200 --> 00:15:39,211
they had wash clothes set aside
in the bath chambers

283
00:15:39,231 --> 00:15:43,221
so you can clean up
before you went back to bed.

284
00:15:45,231 --> 00:15:47,131
And I didn't want to use them,

285
00:15:47,150 --> 00:15:49,131
because I didn't want
to expose

286
00:15:49,150 --> 00:15:52,091
that I had a nocturnal emission.

287
00:15:52,111 --> 00:15:53,231
I did feel guilty about it.

288
00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:57,190
And then they made it
into a sign out.

289
00:15:57,211 --> 00:16:02,150
So that they would know
who had a nocturnal emission.

290
00:16:04,170 --> 00:16:08,050
Having to admit to it
and the same around it,

291
00:16:08,070 --> 00:16:10,070
the defeated feeling,

292
00:16:10,091 --> 00:16:13,030
like, you know, almost had
to go back to square one,

293
00:16:13,050 --> 00:16:15,241
uh, was enough for me

294
00:16:16,021 --> 00:16:18,070
and, I think I can speak
for everybody,

295
00:16:18,091 --> 00:16:20,170
to keep them in check.

296
00:16:20,190 --> 00:16:25,180
And this is,
uh, Dick Joslyn.

297
00:16:27,070 --> 00:16:31,251
He had been recruited
in Los Angeles in 1975.

298
00:16:32,030 --> 00:16:34,141
He's obviously
a very attractive guy,

299
00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:37,211
and he became
one of Do's helpers

300
00:16:37,231 --> 00:16:40,030
after Ti died.

301
00:16:40,050 --> 00:16:42,221
One of the core
members of the group.

302
00:16:42,241 --> 00:16:47,030
Do, of course,
was gay,

303
00:16:47,050 --> 00:16:50,040
and Dick Joslyn was gay,

304
00:16:50,060 --> 00:16:54,070
and one day Do called him aside

305
00:16:54,091 --> 00:16:56,111
and said,

306
00:16:56,131 --> 00:16:58,030
"I hate
to tell you this,

307
00:16:58,050 --> 00:17:02,030
"but my vehicle is becoming
attracted to your vehicle

308
00:17:02,050 --> 00:17:05,140
"and so I got to relieve
you of your responsibility

309
00:17:05,161 --> 00:17:08,070
of being
one of my helpers."

310
00:17:08,090 --> 00:17:12,191
And Dick was absolutely
devastated.

311
00:17:12,211 --> 00:17:16,070
Marshall Applewhite
didn't like his homosexuality.

312
00:17:16,090 --> 00:17:20,191
So he created a myth around
that piece he didn't like.

313
00:17:20,211 --> 00:17:23,171
He came to a conclusion
about his body

314
00:17:23,191 --> 00:17:25,201
that it was abhorrent.

315
00:17:25,221 --> 00:17:27,120
SAWYER: Do held a meeting

316
00:17:27,140 --> 00:17:30,080
and he said that
he had a nocturnal emission

317
00:17:30,100 --> 00:17:35,191
and he was investigating
having himself castrated.

318
00:17:35,211 --> 00:17:38,040
Will any of you
have reservations

319
00:17:38,060 --> 00:17:40,080
of having the same
procedure done?

320
00:17:40,100 --> 00:17:43,161
And I didn't have
any reservations.

321
00:17:43,181 --> 00:17:45,211
I was committed
to being celibate

322
00:17:45,231 --> 00:17:47,130
for the rest of my life.

323
00:17:47,151 --> 00:17:50,171
If-- if your eye offend you,
block it out.

324
00:17:50,191 --> 00:17:52,251
It's the same idea,

325
00:17:53,030 --> 00:17:55,021
if something
is so offensive to you

326
00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:58,030
that your control
is threatened by it

327
00:17:58,050 --> 00:17:59,241
then why shouldn't you
dispose of it

328
00:18:00,021 --> 00:18:01,080
if you have that
option to do it.

329
00:18:01,100 --> 00:18:03,120
Not that I have ever
talked to anyone

330
00:18:03,140 --> 00:18:05,221
into taking that action.

331
00:18:05,241 --> 00:18:08,241
JANJA: And I think Do
was greatly influenced

332
00:18:09,021 --> 00:18:11,211
by some of the stronger
members at that point

333
00:18:11,231 --> 00:18:15,050
who fed him some of the more
extreme ideas.

334
00:18:15,070 --> 00:18:17,211
And that's not unusual
in a group.

335
00:18:17,231 --> 00:18:20,251
It kind of
took control of him.

336
00:18:21,030 --> 00:18:22,120
I think, in a sense,

337
00:18:22,140 --> 00:18:25,171
he was also a victim.

338
00:18:27,110 --> 00:18:29,100
I was told that,
for example,

339
00:18:29,120 --> 00:18:32,251
the castrations, uh,
was not his idea.

340
00:18:33,030 --> 00:18:35,100
And was, actually SRRODY's idea,

341
00:18:35,120 --> 00:18:39,021
who was one of the more
gung ho members.

342
00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:41,171
DO: SRRODY is the clown
of the class, or--

343
00:18:41,191 --> 00:18:43,050
All right,
I shouldn't say that.

344
00:18:43,070 --> 00:18:46,201
I'm teasing him,
as I always do.

345
00:18:46,221 --> 00:18:49,100
SRRODY was always
a go getter.

346
00:18:49,120 --> 00:18:50,221
You know,
his Irish vehicle.

347
00:18:50,241 --> 00:18:53,191
And he was very quick.

348
00:18:53,211 --> 00:18:55,181
He would run to go do things,

349
00:18:55,201 --> 00:18:56,221
there was a task

350
00:18:56,241 --> 00:18:58,241
and people would
criticize him for running.

351
00:18:59,021 --> 00:19:00,201
DO: Never shy of energy,

352
00:19:00,221 --> 00:19:03,140
you always have to
tone him down.

353
00:19:03,161 --> 00:19:05,120
We keep saying,
"Down, SRRODY."

354
00:19:06,201 --> 00:19:07,231
Had this thought,

355
00:19:07,251 --> 00:19:10,140
SRRODY was gonna beat me
to the punch

356
00:19:10,161 --> 00:19:12,231
of having this castration
experience.

357
00:19:12,251 --> 00:19:15,221
In my mind, it was like--
giving proof to the Next Level

358
00:19:15,241 --> 00:19:18,060
that I was all the way in.

359
00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:20,130
This is terribly human.

360
00:19:20,151 --> 00:19:22,080
It was, like, competitive.

361
00:19:24,070 --> 00:19:25,060
Do said,

362
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:27,181
"We've set up
a sterile room

363
00:19:27,201 --> 00:19:29,201
"and we're gonna proceed
doing the castrations

364
00:19:29,221 --> 00:19:33,241
that you all have convinced me
that you wanted."

365
00:19:34,021 --> 00:19:37,130
He made a sign,
and the sing said "Mexico".

366
00:19:37,151 --> 00:19:39,060
And he put that above the door.

367
00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:42,231
So that if we ever were
questioned by authorities,

368
00:19:42,251 --> 00:19:47,040
we could honestly say
that we went to Mexico to do it.

369
00:19:47,060 --> 00:19:50,120
LVVODY and JNNODY were there.

370
00:19:50,140 --> 00:19:52,070
And LVVODY was gonna
perform the procedure

371
00:19:52,090 --> 00:19:53,110
'cause she is the nurse

372
00:19:53,130 --> 00:19:56,191
and she had worked for
orchidectomist

373
00:19:56,211 --> 00:19:59,021
and individual
that removed testicles.

374
00:20:00,100 --> 00:20:02,161
Do said,
"Who's gonna go first?"

375
00:20:06,090 --> 00:20:08,070
And so he flipped the coin,

376
00:20:08,090 --> 00:20:10,161
and SRRODY won the toss,

377
00:20:10,181 --> 00:20:12,161
so he got to choose
who would go first,

378
00:20:12,181 --> 00:20:13,171
and he wanted to go first.

379
00:20:15,231 --> 00:20:18,251
LVVODY cut
the testicle sack open,

380
00:20:19,030 --> 00:20:21,211
and I almost fainted.

381
00:20:23,181 --> 00:20:25,251
So I was done,
but then,

382
00:20:26,030 --> 00:20:29,251
SRRODY's testicle sack
started to get bigger.

383
00:20:30,030 --> 00:20:32,021
And, uh...

384
00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:33,191
You know...

385
00:20:33,211 --> 00:20:35,231
getting a little iffy.

386
00:20:35,251 --> 00:20:38,231
And SRRODY started to moan.

387
00:20:41,050 --> 00:20:43,251
And Do said that...

388
00:20:44,030 --> 00:20:46,080
he did a terrible thing.

389
00:20:46,100 --> 00:20:48,140
[sniffles]

390
00:20:51,030 --> 00:20:53,050
He-- he went too far, he said.

391
00:20:53,070 --> 00:20:54,151
He said, "I went too far

392
00:20:54,171 --> 00:20:56,171
"to allow this to happen

393
00:20:56,191 --> 00:20:59,040
and you need to take me
to the police."

394
00:21:03,140 --> 00:21:05,171
And LVVODY
and JNNODY and I said,

395
00:21:05,191 --> 00:21:07,140
"No way.

396
00:21:07,161 --> 00:21:10,140
We'll take care of it."

397
00:21:10,161 --> 00:21:11,241
We didn't want to go to a
hospital

398
00:21:12,021 --> 00:21:13,130
'cause we were afraid that

399
00:21:13,151 --> 00:21:16,241
something would be
seen as, uh,

400
00:21:17,021 --> 00:21:18,251
illegal.

401
00:21:19,030 --> 00:21:22,021
And we didn't want that
to get back to Do.

402
00:21:24,090 --> 00:21:27,090
And so we ended up
calling a priest.

403
00:21:27,110 --> 00:21:30,201
Seeing if they had any
experience with anybody that

404
00:21:30,221 --> 00:21:33,060
chose to be castrated.

405
00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:36,201
And the priest didn't know
what we were talking about.

406
00:21:36,221 --> 00:21:38,161
He wasn't any worse,

407
00:21:38,181 --> 00:21:41,171
but he wasn't
any better either.

408
00:21:41,191 --> 00:21:45,030
It was just,
what can we do to, you know,

409
00:21:45,050 --> 00:21:48,050
uh, to fix this.

410
00:21:48,070 --> 00:21:50,070
We decided to bring him
to a hospital.

411
00:21:50,090 --> 00:21:52,231
SRRODY stayed there overnight
for observation.

412
00:21:52,251 --> 00:21:55,100
I was wired,
I mean, it was like,

413
00:21:55,120 --> 00:21:57,021
people say that
when they're

414
00:21:57,040 --> 00:21:59,100
in a big crime scene or
something is like surreal.

415
00:21:59,120 --> 00:22:01,100
That's what
I was experiencing.

416
00:22:01,120 --> 00:22:03,221
I was... surreal about this.

417
00:22:03,241 --> 00:22:07,181
And JNNODY and I
went to the pier

418
00:22:07,201 --> 00:22:10,060
and we threw the testicles
in there.

419
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:12,060
[splashing]

420
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:14,060
I don't know if that
was necessary or not,

421
00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:16,070
but we didn't want
any evidence.

422
00:22:16,090 --> 00:22:18,151
And Do at that point said,

423
00:22:18,171 --> 00:22:20,191
that, um,

424
00:22:20,211 --> 00:22:23,151
he didn't want to
continue with the castrations

425
00:22:23,171 --> 00:22:26,021
and I know
I was disappointed.

426
00:22:29,241 --> 00:22:32,030
But then,
they found some doctors

427
00:22:32,050 --> 00:22:34,151
that would do the procedure.

428
00:22:34,171 --> 00:22:38,040
And Do was also castrated.

429
00:22:38,060 --> 00:22:39,231
Eventually, they were,

430
00:22:39,251 --> 00:22:42,070
depending on which
source you look to,

431
00:22:42,090 --> 00:22:44,201
between seven and nine men
within the group

432
00:22:44,221 --> 00:22:47,110
who had been castrated.

433
00:22:47,130 --> 00:22:49,221
But most of the men
were not interested

434
00:22:49,241 --> 00:22:51,161
in having the surgery done.

435
00:23:12,060 --> 00:23:14,140
KELLY: My father had issue

436
00:23:14,161 --> 00:23:18,030
with how they castrated
themselves

437
00:23:18,050 --> 00:23:21,040
to overcome
their sexuality.

438
00:23:23,231 --> 00:23:27,231
That was something really
couldn't identify with doing.

439
00:23:29,100 --> 00:23:32,130
And he-- he just left.

440
00:23:34,060 --> 00:23:36,130
And then my mom came back.

441
00:23:37,211 --> 00:23:41,221
They had a way
of relating to each other

442
00:23:41,241 --> 00:23:43,130
since they've both
been in the cult.

443
00:23:43,151 --> 00:23:48,120
And that became
very isolating to them.

444
00:23:48,140 --> 00:23:50,251
So I knew there was
a possibility

445
00:23:51,030 --> 00:23:53,251
for them to rejoin the cult.

446
00:23:54,030 --> 00:23:56,070
They didn't say when,

447
00:23:56,090 --> 00:23:59,251
it was just a matter of time.

448
00:24:00,030 --> 00:24:05,050
I living in this
constant state of limbo.

449
00:24:13,151 --> 00:24:15,241
This was a group where people
were free to come and go.

450
00:24:16,021 --> 00:24:18,100
There were many people who left
of their own free will,

451
00:24:18,120 --> 00:24:20,140
including some who
were told to leave

452
00:24:20,161 --> 00:24:22,060
because they weren't
following the rules.

453
00:24:25,130 --> 00:24:29,231
DO: This little
classroom dwindled to 50

454
00:24:29,251 --> 00:24:34,050
and then dwindled down
to couple dozen.

455
00:24:36,151 --> 00:24:38,151
BENJAMIN: Starting in 1991,

456
00:24:38,171 --> 00:24:40,251
the group engaged
in a media onslaught,

457
00:24:41,030 --> 00:24:44,021
trying to reach out
to new members.

458
00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:46,211
Part because the group
had really shrunk,

459
00:24:46,231 --> 00:24:48,201
but it's also because
for many members

460
00:24:48,221 --> 00:24:50,070
and leaders of the group,

461
00:24:50,090 --> 00:24:52,080
they thought they were
approaching the end.

462
00:24:52,100 --> 00:24:53,211
Not just the end
of the group

463
00:24:53,231 --> 00:24:55,090
but the potential
for the end of the world.

464
00:24:55,110 --> 00:24:57,100
Now the end of the age,

465
00:24:57,120 --> 00:25:01,060
I'm afraid I feel
is right upon us.

466
00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:02,191
It's gonna come...

467
00:25:02,211 --> 00:25:06,060
and I-- I don't want
to sound like a prophet,

468
00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:09,181
but my gut says,
and everything else that I know,

469
00:25:09,201 --> 00:25:13,021
points to that
it's going to come

470
00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:15,080
before the turn
of the century.

471
00:25:17,060 --> 00:25:18,251
BENJAMIN: This was a time

472
00:25:19,030 --> 00:25:21,231
that was rife with
end-of-the-world fears.

473
00:25:21,251 --> 00:25:24,221
And there were a lot of new
religious movements

474
00:25:24,241 --> 00:25:26,140
in the 1990s

475
00:25:26,161 --> 00:25:28,151
that looked to the year 2000

476
00:25:28,171 --> 00:25:31,070
and a few years
before and after that,

477
00:25:31,090 --> 00:25:35,171
as a moment at which
the world was going to end.

478
00:25:35,191 --> 00:25:38,120
This is the countdown
to the coming of Christ, folks.

479
00:25:38,140 --> 00:25:41,060
We don't know the day
and the hour in Matthew 24:36,

480
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:43,140
but Jesus said,
you'll know when it's near.

481
00:25:43,161 --> 00:25:45,151
CHUCK: And as far
as our departure,

482
00:25:45,171 --> 00:25:47,120
we don't really know
whether we're gonna depart

483
00:25:47,140 --> 00:25:50,040
with that end
or whether our departure

484
00:25:50,060 --> 00:25:52,191
will be before
or somewhere in between

485
00:25:52,211 --> 00:25:54,100
or anything like that.

486
00:25:54,120 --> 00:25:56,181
And that for 16 years

487
00:25:56,201 --> 00:25:58,251
we haven't shared this truth.

488
00:26:00,130 --> 00:26:03,050
And now, all of a sudden,
we're getting instruction

489
00:26:03,070 --> 00:26:05,130
to give it out

490
00:26:05,151 --> 00:26:07,070
more clearly.

491
00:26:07,090 --> 00:26:11,241
And this is what
you're witnessing tonight.

492
00:26:12,021 --> 00:26:14,120
BENJAMIN: They began
a satellite television series

493
00:26:14,140 --> 00:26:16,050
called "Beyond Human."

494
00:26:16,070 --> 00:26:19,080
They paid for 14 hours of time.

495
00:26:19,100 --> 00:26:20,241
Where were we?

496
00:26:21,021 --> 00:26:22,181
Remind me
of our question again.

497
00:26:22,201 --> 00:26:25,221
Um, how do I identify
which god?

498
00:26:25,241 --> 00:26:28,120
BENJAMIN: They took out
an ad in USA Today,

499
00:26:28,140 --> 00:26:30,021
a national newspaper.

500
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:32,251
SAWYER: It was, uh, third
on the page, I believe,

501
00:26:33,030 --> 00:26:34,171
and it cost $30,000.

502
00:26:34,191 --> 00:26:36,251
They put a PO box there,

503
00:26:37,030 --> 00:26:41,130
and we got people who would
correspond with us.

504
00:26:41,151 --> 00:26:44,090
And we started responding
to the correspondence.

505
00:26:46,090 --> 00:26:48,171
They created several VHS tapes

506
00:26:48,191 --> 00:26:51,221
which they mailed around
to anyone who wanted copy.

507
00:26:51,241 --> 00:26:53,120
From this they were
able to reconnect

508
00:26:53,140 --> 00:26:54,130
with several
ex members,

509
00:26:54,151 --> 00:26:57,130
some new members joined,

510
00:26:57,151 --> 00:27:00,171
and then, of course,
they went back on the road.

511
00:27:00,191 --> 00:27:04,171
♪ ♪

512
00:27:04,191 --> 00:27:06,181
Here we go.

513
00:27:17,090 --> 00:27:19,050
Sometimes use an analogy
of Star Trek,

514
00:27:19,070 --> 00:27:21,040
most everybody
hopefully have seen

515
00:27:21,060 --> 00:27:22,140
some kind
of Star Trek show.

516
00:27:22,161 --> 00:27:24,231
DENISE: You know, we've been
in seclusion for 18 years

517
00:27:24,251 --> 00:27:26,140
and our description
of this material

518
00:27:26,161 --> 00:27:28,100
is probably lacking,

519
00:27:28,120 --> 00:27:31,050
and if you can help us know
where your areas are

520
00:27:31,070 --> 00:27:33,251
that we've left unclear
then we can help fill 'em in.

521
00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:46,241
♪ I had to praise you ♪

522
00:27:47,021 --> 00:27:48,100
♪ ♪

523
00:27:48,120 --> 00:27:51,030
♪ I had to praise you
like I should ♪

524
00:27:51,050 --> 00:27:53,251
HOST: Members are not often
intellectually deprived,

525
00:27:54,030 --> 00:27:55,060
sociologically deprived,

526
00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:56,231
but often times
very intelligent people.

527
00:27:56,251 --> 00:27:59,110
What would make an intelligent
person then,

528
00:27:59,130 --> 00:28:02,050
essentially, give up
their life to somebody else.

529
00:28:02,070 --> 00:28:04,060
Well, as a former cult member,

530
00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:05,191
and a licensed mental
health counselor

531
00:28:05,211 --> 00:28:07,060
who's been working
for 20 years,

532
00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:09,070
I can tell you that
I've counseled, literally,

533
00:28:09,090 --> 00:28:12,221
thousands of people who are
very bright, educated.

534
00:28:12,241 --> 00:28:14,080
And, essentially,

535
00:28:14,100 --> 00:28:16,040
they're ignorant
about cult tactics,

536
00:28:16,060 --> 00:28:18,100
the cults use deception,
manipulation,

537
00:28:18,120 --> 00:28:21,090
hypnosis, behavior modification
to get people in.

538
00:28:21,110 --> 00:28:23,231
And they're also
situationally vulnerable.

539
00:28:23,251 --> 00:28:27,140
I've had a hundred
or more cases

540
00:28:27,161 --> 00:28:29,030
where people described

541
00:28:29,050 --> 00:28:31,110
a vulnerable moment
in their life

542
00:28:31,130 --> 00:28:33,110
when they were approached.

543
00:28:33,130 --> 00:28:35,211
Death of a loved one,
illness,

544
00:28:35,231 --> 00:28:38,120
uh, moving to a new city,
state or country,

545
00:28:38,140 --> 00:28:39,221
losing a job...

546
00:28:39,241 --> 00:28:42,040
Where the person goes,

547
00:28:42,060 --> 00:28:46,251
"God, tell me what I'm supposed
to be doing with my life."

548
00:28:47,030 --> 00:28:49,060
And then, knock, knock,

549
00:28:49,080 --> 00:28:52,021
"Can we study
the Bible with you?"

550
00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:55,140
♪ ♪

551
00:28:57,171 --> 00:28:59,211
JASON: I first met up
with the class

552
00:28:59,231 --> 00:29:03,090
in July of 1994
in Madison, Wisconsin,

553
00:29:03,110 --> 00:29:04,251
after I dropped out
of college.

554
00:29:07,251 --> 00:29:11,050
I didn't really have
a whole lot at that point.

555
00:29:11,070 --> 00:29:13,021
A really close friend of mine

556
00:29:13,040 --> 00:29:15,021
brought home a flyer
for the meeting.

557
00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,050
Immediately we both were
fascinated by it

558
00:29:17,070 --> 00:29:19,171
and said
"We have to do this."

559
00:29:21,191 --> 00:29:24,100
He was talking about
how there are

560
00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:28,090
beings here right now from
another level of existence

561
00:29:28,110 --> 00:29:30,040
doing their last
circuit around,

562
00:29:30,060 --> 00:29:32,110
gathering up individuals.

563
00:29:34,070 --> 00:29:36,171
As I was at the meeting,
it was just

564
00:29:36,191 --> 00:29:38,191
a deep sense of recognition.

565
00:29:38,211 --> 00:29:40,090
I-- I knew who they were

566
00:29:40,110 --> 00:29:42,050
and I knew what
they were saying.

567
00:29:44,201 --> 00:29:45,251
DEB: For my brother,

568
00:29:46,030 --> 00:29:49,021
I think he was,
in colloquial terms,

569
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:50,130
ripe for the picking.

570
00:29:50,151 --> 00:29:56,100
He'd had an attempted suicide
once before the cult,

571
00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:59,221
and someone had left
the copy of the USA Today

572
00:29:59,241 --> 00:30:03,211
in the breakroom
at work and he picked it up.

573
00:30:03,231 --> 00:30:07,021
The cult had placed
a full page ad

574
00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:10,221
making comments like the Earth
is about to be recycled,

575
00:30:10,241 --> 00:30:12,231
this is your last opportunity...

576
00:30:12,251 --> 00:30:15,060
And he was drawn to that.

577
00:30:16,231 --> 00:30:19,211
He was looking
for a place to belong.

578
00:30:19,231 --> 00:30:23,181
People that he felt
he could align with.

579
00:30:23,201 --> 00:30:24,251
WOMAN: Hey, Gail, are you ready?

580
00:30:25,030 --> 00:30:26,191
- For what?
- The big day?

581
00:30:26,211 --> 00:30:28,100
To entertain you?
[laughing]

582
00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:32,080
She had just broken off with a
boyfriend of four, five years.

583
00:30:32,100 --> 00:30:33,251
And the store
wasn't going well.

584
00:30:34,030 --> 00:30:35,221
I think that was a trigger,

585
00:30:35,241 --> 00:30:37,151
because a couple
of months later

586
00:30:37,171 --> 00:30:39,151
we got one of these
recruitment flyers

587
00:30:39,171 --> 00:30:40,191
for this group.

588
00:30:40,211 --> 00:30:42,080
Talking about UFOs
and all that.

589
00:30:42,100 --> 00:30:44,021
Then we knew
we were in trouble.

590
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:45,110
ALICE: When she called home,

591
00:30:45,130 --> 00:30:46,231
I said, "Hi, Gail,
what are you doing?"

592
00:30:46,251 --> 00:30:48,201
And she said,
"Did you get my flyer?"

593
00:30:48,221 --> 00:30:50,070
And we said yes,
and she said,

594
00:30:50,090 --> 00:30:51,221
well, that's what I'm doing,
what do you think of it?

595
00:30:51,241 --> 00:30:54,030
Oh, when you're coming home?

596
00:30:56,030 --> 00:30:58,171
Oh, no, Gail,
you've got to come.

597
00:30:58,191 --> 00:31:00,201
So, what kind of group
are you with?

598
00:31:03,171 --> 00:31:05,070
Oh, really?

599
00:31:05,090 --> 00:31:07,231
Yeah?

600
00:31:07,251 --> 00:31:09,191
Do you have an address
or a phone number

601
00:31:09,211 --> 00:31:11,251
where I can get a hold
of you if you need be?

602
00:31:12,030 --> 00:31:14,040
Well, keep in contact, baby,

603
00:31:14,060 --> 00:31:16,231
because I love you so much
and I miss you awfully.

604
00:31:17,021 --> 00:31:19,130
And, uh, we figured,
all right, all right,

605
00:31:19,151 --> 00:31:22,201
someday she'll realize
this is not for her

606
00:31:22,221 --> 00:31:24,151
and she'll walk out.

607
00:32:11,211 --> 00:32:13,161
BENJAMIN: While they were
able to attract,

608
00:32:13,181 --> 00:32:16,050
uh, some new members,

609
00:32:16,070 --> 00:32:17,251
the attempts of the members
of Heaven's Gate and Do

610
00:32:18,030 --> 00:32:21,050
to reach out, really met
widely with rejection.

611
00:32:23,070 --> 00:32:26,171
RADIO HOST: There must be some
thing, some experience

612
00:32:26,191 --> 00:32:28,120
some knowledge, some truth

613
00:32:28,140 --> 00:32:32,241
some something
that has given you to know

614
00:32:33,021 --> 00:32:34,130
what you say you know.

615
00:32:34,151 --> 00:32:35,221
And I'm only asking you
what is it.

616
00:32:35,241 --> 00:32:37,110
What makes you different?

617
00:32:37,130 --> 00:32:40,130
Besides the fact that you
recognize truth or--

618
00:32:40,151 --> 00:32:41,130
[laughing]

619
00:32:41,151 --> 00:32:43,130
Any questions?

620
00:34:44,060 --> 00:34:45,211
[laughing]

621
00:35:00,060 --> 00:35:03,240
[indistinct chattering]

622
00:35:04,021 --> 00:35:06,100
WOMAN: You are plugged
into a tree, literally!

623
00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:07,251
You see?

624
00:35:08,031 --> 00:35:10,251
WOMAN: I said, "Look, there's
JWNODY plugged into a tree!"

625
00:35:11,031 --> 00:35:13,071
MAN: Here we have
JWNODY with this,

626
00:35:13,091 --> 00:35:16,131
and we understand that you have
something you'd like to share?

627
00:35:16,151 --> 00:35:19,100
Well, yes, this is
for our clients.

628
00:35:19,120 --> 00:35:21,140
And you may ask
who are our clients.

629
00:35:22,231 --> 00:35:25,060
We have a little business
that we call Higher Source,

630
00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:29,021
from which we earn our income
so we can consume

631
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:30,151
while we are on this planet.

632
00:35:32,251 --> 00:35:34,180
We always were self-supporting,

633
00:35:34,200 --> 00:35:37,220
which a lot of entities
that are in our position

634
00:35:37,240 --> 00:35:39,140
might not be.

635
00:35:40,240 --> 00:35:44,021
ROBERT BALCH: At the time,
there weren't that many people

636
00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:46,120
who were heavily
into computers,

637
00:35:46,140 --> 00:35:48,211
as far as going out
and making money.

638
00:35:48,231 --> 00:35:53,021
One of the early members,
RKKODY, Chuck Humphrey,

639
00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:55,231
we actually had
a computer shop.

640
00:35:55,251 --> 00:35:58,031
Um, it was probably one of
the very first computer shops

641
00:35:58,051 --> 00:35:59,240
way back in the 70s.

642
00:36:01,140 --> 00:36:04,131
He introduced people
to computers,

643
00:36:04,151 --> 00:36:06,071
a lot were self-taught.

644
00:36:06,091 --> 00:36:09,031
JASON: There was a core group

645
00:36:09,051 --> 00:36:10,151
who were, uh,
computer people

646
00:36:10,171 --> 00:36:13,111
and so they had the kind
of nine to five jobby jobs

647
00:36:13,131 --> 00:36:15,191
and they would-- they would
leave the warehouse every day.

648
00:36:17,131 --> 00:36:21,220
FRANK: About half the group
worked outside the class,

649
00:36:21,240 --> 00:36:26,191
to bring in funds after
the trust fund ran out.

650
00:36:28,031 --> 00:36:29,191
SAWYER: We had pretty
good tasks at that point,

651
00:36:29,211 --> 00:36:33,200
working, you know,
professional jobs in computers.

652
00:36:35,051 --> 00:36:37,071
SRRODY was a great
Assembly programmer,

653
00:36:37,091 --> 00:36:39,071
and C programmer,
you know, I couldn't...

654
00:36:39,091 --> 00:36:42,060
really get with it, like to
that degree of technicalities.

655
00:36:45,060 --> 00:36:48,021
ROBERT: They did have some
really great people

656
00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:51,060
and they tried to put their
message out on the Internet.

657
00:36:55,021 --> 00:36:56,200
BENJAMIN:
They did look the Internet

658
00:36:56,220 --> 00:36:58,040
as a way to reach out

659
00:36:58,060 --> 00:36:59,160
and connect with people.

660
00:36:59,180 --> 00:37:01,091
[modem hissing]

661
00:37:01,111 --> 00:37:03,151
They began uploading
content to the website

662
00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:10,120
Bu they were greeted with,
affectively, cyber bullying.

663
00:37:12,021 --> 00:37:15,140
I think the best example of this
are Do's Usenet postings.

664
00:37:17,031 --> 00:37:19,160
Usenet is an online
bulletin board system

665
00:37:19,180 --> 00:37:21,200
where you can post
really almost anything.

666
00:37:21,220 --> 00:37:24,160
And it's organized
by topic.

667
00:37:24,180 --> 00:37:26,231
Do posted to, uh, topics

668
00:37:26,251 --> 00:37:29,200
associated with
artificial intelligence,

669
00:37:29,220 --> 00:37:33,100
with science fiction,
with Christianity,

670
00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:36,080
And he posted a,
really, a manifesto,

671
00:37:36,100 --> 00:37:37,160
that he was Jesus
that he had come back,

672
00:37:37,180 --> 00:37:38,251
that the world was ending,

673
00:37:39,031 --> 00:37:42,160
the way to leave the Earth
was to join with him.

674
00:37:42,180 --> 00:37:44,200
Within the group
it made sense

675
00:37:44,220 --> 00:37:48,231
to talk about
disincarnated space aliens,

676
00:37:48,251 --> 00:37:51,040
it made sense to talk
about the Next Level.

677
00:37:51,060 --> 00:37:54,171
These vehicles we occupy
or human vehicles,

678
00:37:54,191 --> 00:37:57,100
that we also recognize
that the mind

679
00:37:57,120 --> 00:38:00,200
that we are attempting
to graft into,

680
00:38:00,220 --> 00:38:04,021
and receive
our nourishment from

681
00:38:04,040 --> 00:38:06,100
comes from
the Kingdom Level of Heaven.

682
00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:08,180
BENJAMIN: Outside the group
it looks like nonsense.

683
00:38:08,200 --> 00:38:10,040
And it was treated as nonsense.

684
00:38:12,071 --> 00:38:14,220
People posted
incendiary rude responses,

685
00:38:14,240 --> 00:38:16,100
saying that you are
an idiot to believe this,

686
00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:18,021
you must be crazy,
are you occultist...

687
00:38:19,240 --> 00:38:21,191
The members of the group
began to feel

688
00:38:21,211 --> 00:38:24,071
as if their attempts
to reach out had failed

689
00:38:24,091 --> 00:38:28,171
and the sign had come for them
to give up on our planet.

690
00:38:31,040 --> 00:38:33,021
It's a very short time

691
00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:35,140
before our departure.

692
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:39,111
Our thoughts
will be of you,

693
00:38:39,131 --> 00:38:41,251
we hope that your thoughts
will be...

694
00:38:42,031 --> 00:38:44,160
[voice breaking]
of our Father's Kingdom.

695
00:38:45,251 --> 00:38:47,051
Thank you.

696
00:38:48,251 --> 00:38:51,140
They had become,
in their words, a class.

697
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:53,051
And what happens
with a class?

698
00:38:53,071 --> 00:38:54,111
They graduate.

699
00:38:54,131 --> 00:38:55,140
And that was
the term they used.

700
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:56,211
They called it a graduation.

701
00:39:14,211 --> 00:39:17,031
They talked about it
in a variety of ways,

702
00:39:17,051 --> 00:39:20,071
but they never
talked about it as suicide.

703
00:39:20,091 --> 00:39:22,100
There was always the exit,

704
00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:26,100
suicide would be
to stay here on this planet.

705
00:39:26,120 --> 00:39:28,051
This world is rotten

706
00:39:28,071 --> 00:39:31,021
And I would rather die
in service to my interpretation

707
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:33,160
of what God is
than stay here.

708
00:39:33,180 --> 00:39:38,080
And they didn't always
talk about the exit

709
00:39:38,100 --> 00:39:41,200
as something that
they would do to themselves.

710
00:39:41,220 --> 00:39:43,200
There was a series of events
that demonstrated,

711
00:39:43,220 --> 00:39:45,140
at least to the members
of Heaven's Gate,

712
00:39:45,160 --> 00:39:47,231
that there was a war
between the US Government

713
00:39:47,251 --> 00:39:50,040
and people who believed
and acted differently.

714
00:39:51,140 --> 00:39:54,200
People who loved their God
so, in their own way,

715
00:39:54,220 --> 00:39:56,111
that they end up being--

716
00:39:56,131 --> 00:39:59,040
like what happened
to Randy Weaver.

717
00:39:59,060 --> 00:40:00,191
Ruby Ridge.

718
00:40:00,211 --> 00:40:03,140
What happened at Waco.

719
00:40:05,191 --> 00:40:07,171
[gunshots firing]

720
00:40:07,191 --> 00:40:08,180
REPORTER: The stand-off's
been going on

721
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:09,240
for about 45 minutes now.

722
00:40:10,021 --> 00:40:11,100
OFFICER: You hear what
we're talking about?

723
00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:12,160
REPORTER: Yes, sir.

724
00:40:12,180 --> 00:40:14,031
OFFICER: I gotta
take the shot.

725
00:40:14,051 --> 00:40:15,120
- Get the hell off of here.
- I'll get off the property,

726
00:40:15,140 --> 00:40:16,160
that's what I'm doing, sir.

727
00:40:16,180 --> 00:40:17,240
[sirens blaring]

728
00:40:18,021 --> 00:40:19,160
REPORTER: The credo
of the Branch Davidians cult

729
00:40:19,180 --> 00:40:21,200
was preparing for
the end of the world

730
00:40:21,220 --> 00:40:23,180
and it has been said
that David Koresh

731
00:40:23,200 --> 00:40:25,091
and his followers
have been seeking

732
00:40:25,111 --> 00:40:27,211
some kind of confrontation.

733
00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:34,251
I'm sure every cult
in the United States,

734
00:40:35,031 --> 00:40:37,231
like, glued to the TV,
during that whole event.

735
00:40:37,251 --> 00:40:39,040
And they're all thinking

736
00:40:39,060 --> 00:40:40,231
"Could this happen to us?"

737
00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:47,211
BENJAMING: So, members of
Heaven's Gate

738
00:40:47,231 --> 00:40:51,031
feared the government was
going to come and kill them.

739
00:40:51,051 --> 00:40:53,131
However, in a twist,

740
00:40:53,151 --> 00:40:57,021
they actually thought
this would be a good thing.

741
00:40:57,040 --> 00:41:01,051
FRANK: Do openly talked
with us, as a group,

742
00:41:01,071 --> 00:41:04,171
saying, "Perhaps we could

743
00:41:04,191 --> 00:41:08,140
"buy firearms,
learn to use them,

744
00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:11,140
"and be seen as a threat

745
00:41:11,160 --> 00:41:15,251
that would trigger
our demise."

746
00:41:16,031 --> 00:41:19,051
And it's like, ah,
that doesn't sound very nice,

747
00:41:19,071 --> 00:41:21,100
you know, and half
of us would be dead,

748
00:41:21,120 --> 00:41:23,200
and the other half will
end up maimed and crippled,

749
00:41:23,220 --> 00:41:25,211
and still stuck here
on planet Earth.

750
00:41:25,231 --> 00:41:27,100
And sounds painful

751
00:41:27,120 --> 00:41:29,151
and so they didn't
really like that idea.

752
00:41:32,100 --> 00:41:37,080
I mean, I don't care
for any of...

753
00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:41,220
the fame or glory
of the human role

754
00:41:41,240 --> 00:41:43,180
it's absolutely
worthless to me.

755
00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:45,111
I can't wait
to get out of here.

756
00:41:45,131 --> 00:41:50,031
I apologize
for being so emotional,

757
00:41:50,051 --> 00:41:52,151
But that happens
to be the truth,

758
00:41:52,171 --> 00:41:54,220
I want to leave here.

759
00:41:54,240 --> 00:41:59,071
Now, I'm in a vehicle that
is already falling apart on me.

760
00:41:59,091 --> 00:42:00,220
I feel that he got to a point

761
00:42:00,240 --> 00:42:02,160
where he didn't know
any other way out.

762
00:42:02,180 --> 00:42:04,111
That he had created this--

763
00:42:04,131 --> 00:42:06,160
this enormous belief system

764
00:42:06,180 --> 00:42:08,211
this, um, this structure,

765
00:42:08,231 --> 00:42:10,100
and this people that were

766
00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:12,231
totally, totally
committed to him.

767
00:42:12,251 --> 00:42:14,100
Personally.

768
00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:16,051
He was their god.

769
00:42:25,040 --> 00:42:27,200
We had a meeting in
the top floor of the warehouse,

770
00:42:27,220 --> 00:42:29,191
where we always
had our meetings.

771
00:42:31,131 --> 00:42:32,211
SAWYER: Do had said

772
00:42:32,231 --> 00:42:34,220
he wants to hear
from each individual

773
00:42:34,240 --> 00:42:39,200
if they have any reservations
about suicide as an exit.

774
00:42:39,220 --> 00:42:42,200
We would be taking
a strong barbituric,

775
00:42:42,220 --> 00:42:45,240
and that would, basically,
put our vehicles to sleep.

776
00:42:46,021 --> 00:42:50,031
Of the gentlest way
he could think about doing it.

777
00:42:50,051 --> 00:42:52,160
There was some tear shed
by some individuals,

778
00:42:52,180 --> 00:42:55,220
definitely, who I think
had some real difficulties,

779
00:42:55,240 --> 00:42:58,031
with contemplating it.

780
00:42:58,051 --> 00:42:59,100
And I said,
wow, that's huge.

781
00:42:59,120 --> 00:43:01,040
I mean, Do even said,

782
00:43:01,060 --> 00:43:02,200
he's only been here
two weeks,

783
00:43:02,220 --> 00:43:04,060
you know, and I'm talking about

784
00:43:04,080 --> 00:43:06,240
something incredibly
drastic here.

785
00:43:07,021 --> 00:43:09,080
At the same time,
I said, well,

786
00:43:09,100 --> 00:43:12,091
if that's something I have
to consider down the line,

787
00:43:12,111 --> 00:43:13,251
then that's something
I have to consider, you know?

788
00:43:14,031 --> 00:43:16,171
I wasn't saying we are
gonna go do this tomorrow.

789
00:43:16,191 --> 00:43:18,140
I said I had no reservations.

790
00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:20,131
I always felt right
from the beginning now

791
00:43:20,151 --> 00:43:22,031
I was gonna lose my vehicle.

792
00:43:22,051 --> 00:43:23,191
Even though that's what--

793
00:43:23,211 --> 00:43:26,091
not the way we would do
the teaching in the beginning.

794
00:43:28,111 --> 00:43:31,021
BENJAMIN:
This is a powerful moment.

795
00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:33,251
This was in mid 1990s,

796
00:43:34,031 --> 00:43:36,251
some of them have been
members since 1974.

797
00:43:37,031 --> 00:43:39,251
20 years in a group.

798
00:43:40,031 --> 00:43:43,200
20 years in a group,
living, breathing and vibing

799
00:43:43,220 --> 00:43:45,171
the teachings,
the doctrines,

800
00:43:45,191 --> 00:43:47,100
the practices of the group

801
00:43:47,120 --> 00:43:48,220
and being asked
in that moment,

802
00:43:48,240 --> 00:43:51,040
"What do you think?
Do you wanna exit with us?"

803
00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:57,131
After that meeting,
five people eventually left.

804
00:43:57,151 --> 00:43:58,231
Including Sawyer.

805
00:44:00,240 --> 00:44:02,180
I left in September of '94.

806
00:44:02,200 --> 00:44:04,100
Not long after that.

807
00:44:04,120 --> 00:44:06,031
But not for that reason.

808
00:44:18,111 --> 00:44:21,111
I was invested
in just being in the program,

809
00:44:21,131 --> 00:44:23,180
being, uh,
with my teachers.

810
00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:25,251
The people that
I recognize

811
00:44:26,031 --> 00:44:27,211
that I believed
were from outer space

812
00:44:27,231 --> 00:44:29,100
and from Next Level

813
00:44:29,120 --> 00:44:30,240
and that created the planet.

814
00:44:37,211 --> 00:44:41,060
I was given so much.

815
00:44:41,080 --> 00:44:45,040
I was overseer of a crew.

816
00:44:45,060 --> 00:44:48,191
Yeah, tomorrow is gonna be,
uh, a zillion people...

817
00:44:48,211 --> 00:44:51,180
It's a little bit of
an exaggeration for the camera.

818
00:44:51,200 --> 00:44:54,031
I was looked up to
by some of the students.

819
00:44:54,051 --> 00:44:57,111
They kind of told me that.

820
00:44:57,131 --> 00:44:59,120
So when I-- when I fell,

821
00:44:59,140 --> 00:45:02,120
I think a number of people
were pretty shocked.

822
00:45:02,140 --> 00:45:05,231
We refer to our lifestyle
as a monastic lifestyle.

823
00:45:05,251 --> 00:45:07,120
On a sense,
like a monastery.

824
00:45:08,251 --> 00:45:11,231
I was holding meetings where
I was the primary speaker,

825
00:45:12,021 --> 00:45:13,240
Telling people
that we had to give up

826
00:45:14,021 --> 00:45:15,151
all sexuality
and everything

827
00:45:15,171 --> 00:45:18,040
to become a member
of the next level.

828
00:45:18,060 --> 00:45:20,191
And yet I was the hypocrite.

829
00:45:25,071 --> 00:45:27,120
I remember turning on
MTV one time

830
00:45:27,140 --> 00:45:29,231
and, boy,
did that inflame me.

831
00:45:29,251 --> 00:45:32,080
You know, just seeing
women dancing around, you know,

832
00:45:32,100 --> 00:45:34,220
half-clad, you know.

833
00:45:34,240 --> 00:45:36,151
I was off the wagon!

834
00:45:36,171 --> 00:45:38,080
I was...

835
00:45:38,100 --> 00:45:40,200
occasionally masturbating,

836
00:45:40,220 --> 00:45:42,191
I would have a thought

837
00:45:42,211 --> 00:45:44,220
and the thought
was so powerful I couldn't--

838
00:45:44,240 --> 00:45:46,031
I couldn't hold back.

839
00:45:48,031 --> 00:45:50,120
I didn't know how--
I didn't even--

840
00:45:50,140 --> 00:45:52,040
have the desire
to ask for help.

841
00:45:52,060 --> 00:45:54,051
It was that intense.

842
00:45:54,071 --> 00:45:57,091
But I was like, you know,
like two people,

843
00:45:57,111 --> 00:46:00,031
I was like a schizophrenic
person in-- in a sense.

844
00:46:04,171 --> 00:46:07,080
Well, see,
I-- I didn't recognize...

845
00:46:09,071 --> 00:46:11,091
that I was breaking
those procedures,

846
00:46:11,111 --> 00:46:13,151
it was leading up to something.

847
00:46:22,080 --> 00:46:24,051
So I was in the house
where we were living,

848
00:46:24,071 --> 00:46:26,071
and I was walking up
the staircase,

849
00:46:26,091 --> 00:46:28,131
and Do was walking down,

850
00:46:28,151 --> 00:46:29,180
and he said,

851
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:31,131
"You've been distant."

852
00:46:32,200 --> 00:46:34,151
And, um...

853
00:46:42,231 --> 00:46:44,140
Sorry, it's just--

854
00:46:44,160 --> 00:46:46,211
That, uh, he was--

855
00:46:49,091 --> 00:46:51,240
Well, I told him
what I was doing.

856
00:46:52,021 --> 00:46:54,040
And, uh...

857
00:46:54,060 --> 00:46:56,100
Do, he said,

858
00:46:56,120 --> 00:46:57,220
"So, you already you have

859
00:46:57,240 --> 00:47:01,091
"the potential to become
a really good member

860
00:47:01,111 --> 00:47:03,051
"of the Next Level

861
00:47:03,071 --> 00:47:05,211
and I don't want
to throw you away."

862
00:47:08,071 --> 00:47:11,231
Because I wasn't
influencing anyone else

863
00:47:11,251 --> 00:47:15,040
to get involved
with sensuality.

864
00:47:15,060 --> 00:47:18,151
He was willing
to help me with it

865
00:47:18,171 --> 00:47:22,220
while I stay
in the classroom.

866
00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:26,231
But, then,
it didn't change me.

867
00:47:26,251 --> 00:47:30,231
I kept on giving in
to masturbation.

868
00:47:30,251 --> 00:47:35,031
And I told Do, "I feel
like I need to leave the group."

869
00:47:35,051 --> 00:47:38,151
And so he got me a plane
ticket and gave me $600.

870
00:47:43,200 --> 00:47:45,191
You know, it's-- it's--

871
00:47:45,211 --> 00:47:46,251
It's really, uh...

872
00:47:47,031 --> 00:47:49,080
I'm really kind
of a pitiful person, really.

873
00:47:49,100 --> 00:47:53,100
But, then again, you know,
I'm not the judge of myself.

874
00:47:53,120 --> 00:47:57,071
And, uh, maybe I was doing
the best I could.

875
00:47:57,091 --> 00:47:59,111
[fire crackling]

876
00:48:00,191 --> 00:48:02,100
Whenever I come home
at night,

877
00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:04,131
I look up at the heavens.

878
00:48:09,100 --> 00:48:11,211
People say to me frequently,

879
00:48:11,231 --> 00:48:13,120
"Oh, you were duped."

880
00:48:13,140 --> 00:48:14,240
You know, "Why don't
you go on with your life,

881
00:48:15,021 --> 00:48:17,211
instead of, you know,
continuing to think about this."

882
00:48:17,231 --> 00:48:19,060
But, uh...

883
00:48:20,140 --> 00:48:23,031
I still believe in all
the teachings of Ti and Do.

884
00:48:23,051 --> 00:48:24,231
And, uh,

885
00:48:24,251 --> 00:48:27,131
that if I continue to grow

886
00:48:27,151 --> 00:48:30,040
then I will...

887
00:48:30,060 --> 00:48:34,040
potentially pass through the
Heaven's Gate.

888
00:48:34,060 --> 00:48:35,220
The birth canal.

889
00:48:49,131 --> 00:48:52,021
It's gotta be a UFO,
everything is.

890
00:49:02,071 --> 00:49:04,051
Well, this comet is amazing
because it's very bright

891
00:49:04,071 --> 00:49:05,140
even to the naked eye.

892
00:49:05,160 --> 00:49:06,180
You really don't need
a telescope.

893
00:49:06,200 --> 00:49:09,231
Oh, yes, I can, yeah.

894
00:49:11,071 --> 00:49:12,120
REPORTER: The Hale-Bopp comet

895
00:49:12,140 --> 00:49:14,060
is making its closest pass
to Earth

896
00:49:14,080 --> 00:49:17,200
coming to withing 122 million
miles of our planet.

897
00:49:21,040 --> 00:49:22,131
MAN: It's the brightest comet

898
00:49:22,151 --> 00:49:25,140
that's passed through
the Solar System since 1577.

899
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:29,060
REPORTER: Comets, so different
from anything else in the sky,

900
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:33,060
that through history
they've inspired and terrified.

901
00:49:33,080 --> 00:49:34,220
People used to go out
and kill themselves,

902
00:49:34,240 --> 00:49:37,060
uh, getting scared
that the comet will...

903
00:49:37,080 --> 00:49:38,231
you know, blow up
or something.

904
00:49:42,080 --> 00:49:44,091
REPORTER: Now, as we get
closer to the year 2000

905
00:49:44,111 --> 00:49:45,151
and the end
of the millennium,

906
00:49:45,171 --> 00:49:47,021
more and more fringe groups

907
00:49:47,040 --> 00:49:48,220
are spreading
Doomsday predictions

908
00:49:48,240 --> 00:49:51,051
of the end
of the human species.

909
00:49:51,071 --> 00:49:53,131
RADIO HOST: Chuck Shramek
in Houston, Texas,

910
00:49:53,151 --> 00:49:56,031
- Chuck, welcome to the program.
- CHUCK: Thanks, Art.

911
00:49:56,051 --> 00:49:57,120
ART: A lot of people
have felt

912
00:49:57,140 --> 00:49:59,111
something is going on
with Hale-Bopp.

913
00:49:59,131 --> 00:50:00,231
CHUCK: Well, I have too.

914
00:50:00,251 --> 00:50:02,180
Wow.

915
00:50:02,200 --> 00:50:04,160
HOST: And now maybe
you got it on film?

916
00:50:04,180 --> 00:50:08,140
CHUCK: Well, I photographed
tonight, just showed up.

917
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:11,140
This is a big thing.

918
00:50:11,160 --> 00:50:14,160
It appears to be several times
larger than the Earth.

919
00:50:14,180 --> 00:50:17,180
Maybe about 150,000 miles
away from Hale-Bopp.

920
00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:20,220
RADIO HOST: What could it be?

921
00:50:20,240 --> 00:50:23,140
[chuckles]
CHUCK: I have no idea.

922
00:50:28,051 --> 00:50:30,160
♪ ♪

923
00:50:34,211 --> 00:50:37,071
♪ Oh, yeah ♪

924
00:50:37,091 --> 00:50:39,100
♪ I saw the sign ♪

925
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:41,100
♪ And it opened up
my eyes ♪

926
00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:42,191
♪ I saw the sign ♪

927
00:50:42,211 --> 00:50:47,051
♪ Life is demanding
without understanding ♪

928
00:50:47,071 --> 00:50:49,111
♪ I saw the sign ♪

929
00:50:49,131 --> 00:50:51,111
♪ And it opened up my eyes ♪

930
00:50:51,131 --> 00:50:52,200
♪ I saw the sign ♪

931
00:50:52,220 --> 00:50:54,100
♪ No one's gonna drag you up ♪

932
00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:57,211
♪ To get into the light
where you belong ♪♪


