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This could have been any house in Kerala,
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but what unfolded within its confines
was something unheard of.
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Today in Koodathayi,
during the quiet hours of the morning,
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while most in town were still sleeping,
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Jolly Joseph, a respected local mother,
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was taken into custody in a case
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which has sent shockwaves
through all of India.
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{\an8}Present at the time of her arrest
was her son, Remo.
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She was arrested
early in the morning.
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My brother and I were the only
family members present at that time.
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The police team suddenly showed up.
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A police officer, uh...
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A police officer named Jeevan
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and two other female officers
arrived to make the arrest.
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{\an8}They said they had come to take her away,
that she was being taken into custody.
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And we were in a state of shock.
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I mean, we were completely stunned
with what was happening.
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We didn't know what to do.
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Because until now, we had always been
under the impression
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that our family members have died
because of natural causes.
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{\an8}And for a long time,
we didn't believe
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what they were saying about my mother.
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And now, I'll never be able to accept
this person as my mother again.
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A shocking story
is emerging out of Koodathayi,
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a sleepy village
in Kozhikode district of north Kerala.
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Jolly Joseph
has been arrested for allegedly
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killing her mother-in-law, father-in-law,
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husband, and three others
over a period of 14 years
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without raising anyone's suspicions.
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In a first for Kerala police,
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the mortal remains of the six victims
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are being exhumed
from their graves on the same day.
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And the mastermind behind
it all is a woman named Jolly Joseph.
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Who was this person Jolly?
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How was she able to commit six murders
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without her family or neighbors
suspecting anything?
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Jolly, the prime accused in this case,
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{\an8}was a faculty
at the National Institute of Technology.
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{\an8}As long as I know, uh, she had
a good connection with the church also.
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Many find it hard
to believe that a woman,
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known to be family-oriented,
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well-respected, and liked,
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could be a cold-blooded killer.
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{\an8}KARUNYA RESIDENCE ASSOCIATION
K.G. SIMON IPS, KAIYYALAKYAGATTU
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I am K.G. Simon, IPS.
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Now retired.
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I've devoted 37 years of my life
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to working as a police officer.
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00:03:50,416 --> 00:03:54,666
I was the District Police Superintendent
in Kollam back in 2019,
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00:03:54,750 --> 00:03:57,583
and then I was transferred
to Kozhikode Rural District
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as the Superintendent of Police.
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00:04:01,000 --> 00:04:03,333
During my time in Kozhikode,
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a report from the Thamarassery DYSP
was brought to me.
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The report referred to the death
of a person named
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Roy Thomas of the Ponnamattam family.
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He had died there in 2011.
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The Ponnamattam family
was a prominent family in Koodathayi.
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The eldest son was Roy Thomas.
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The report was based on a complaint
filed by Roy's sister,
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Renji and his younger brother, Rojo.
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The report clearly stated that Roy's death
was caused by cyanide poisoning.
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But it didn't say where he got
the cyanide from or how he consumed it,
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nor did it mention any difficulties
Roy might have had,
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that led him to commit suicide.
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After I read the report,
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I decided to get involved
in the Koodathayi case.
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This marked the beginning
of the investigation into Roy's death.
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As for my first meeting
with the accused Jolly Joseph,
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it took place at the crime branch office.
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It was only after she was arrested
and taken into custody
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that I actually started questioning her.
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It was very difficult at first
because she wouldn't say anything.
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It was only after showing her
all the evidence that she started to talk.
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She confessed everything.
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All I can say is we have been
investigating this for two months.
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We have questioned at least 200 people.
And no one knew about this.
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Our investigation and, uh...
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uh, all the evidence points
to the accused,
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a woman named Jolly Joseph.
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Further investigations are still on.
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Is she cooperating with the police, sir?
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Has she been cooperative so far?
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To answer your questions,
yes, she has been cooperative.
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Confessions that are made
in police custody,
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cannot be taken at face value.
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{\an8}The person probably said things
under duress
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{\an8}so we cannot accept it as the truth.
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{\an8}Therefore, it can never be used
as evidence against the accused.
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{\an8}Whether the prosecution team
uses it as evidence,
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{\an8}or the defense team uses it,
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00:06:26,625 --> 00:06:30,208
{\an8}this kind of confession
will have absolutely no validity in court.
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But the crimes mentioned
in the charge sheet did not really happen.
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The most important thing Jolly said to me
during our first interaction was,
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"I did not commit this crime."
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This story has absolutely
exploded across India.
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Kerala, a region known for its high levels
of education and employment,
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is now in the headlines
for this bizarre tragedy.
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Everything changed after the story broke.
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Koodathayi was thronged by a lot
of people, who were mere spectators.
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Almost every day for a month,
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reporters were camping outside
the Ponnamattam home.
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{\an8}In fact, I am, uh,
one such reporter, you know,
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{\an8}who actually camped out.
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There were a lot of neighbors
who were very upset about Jolly.
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00:07:21,875 --> 00:07:24,708
And there were contradicting takes
on who she was.
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Some would say
that she was very, uh, good.
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00:07:27,791 --> 00:07:29,083
Others would say that,
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"No, but she always had
this dark side to her."
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She was always friendly
and cordial with everyone,
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and, uh, she was a very kind person.
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In fact, they never saw Jolly
ill-treat anyone.
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Jolly must have had
some psychological problems.
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Like some kind of mental disability.
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Now, our sources suggest
that she was, in fact, connected
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to a sex racket.
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I heard people making catcalls
around that time,
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saying that, you know,
"Kattappana, Kattappana."
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And, uh, she's "high range,
high range," you know.
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So I realized that
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because of the place
that she came from, Kattappana,
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the fact that it was from the high ranges,
uh, a hilly terrain...
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All these things were actually posed
as some sort of a bad thing against her.
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00:08:17,541 --> 00:08:20,833
I felt like most reports,
uh, were trying to showcase
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the most salacious aspects of the story.
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No one seemed to be asking
the most important questions.
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Who was Jolly Joseph
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00:08:28,125 --> 00:08:31,166
and what made her do the things
that she allegedly did?
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And I think that was one of the reasons
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why I felt that I should do a story
about, uh, Jolly Joseph.
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I'll go to, uh, Kattappana
and see where did Jolly grow up.
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And after speaking to Jolly's family
in Kattappana, I came to understand.
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Jolly's family is actually
a family of farmers.
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She was really not comfortable
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00:08:59,166 --> 00:09:03,625
being in a house where people
were expected to do work for a living.
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She was flamboyant.
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She wanted to live a cool life.
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I think that was there when
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Jolly decided to get married to Roy
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because the Ponnamattam family is a very
established family in Koodathayi.
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Uh, this is a family which is settled in
a different part of the state altogether,
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a different culture and everything, so...
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getting married into a,
a family of employed people
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could mean
a different lifestyle altogether.
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Maybe she would have
the kind of luxury which she had wanted.
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As children,
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{\an8}we grew up in the same circumstances
and conditions
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{\an8}as any other normal family would.
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My elder brother, sister and I.
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Rojo, myself,
and the neighborhood kids,
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we were a big gang
and we would play together all the time.
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{\an8}But in those days, my eldest
brother, Roy, was a bit introverted.
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{\an8}He wasn't interested in coming out
and playing with us.
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There was an age difference of six
and a half years between Roy and me.
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So I always regarded him
with a lot of respect
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and, of course, I was also
a little scared of him.
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{\an8}My mother was a teacher
in a nearby school.
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{\an8}By that time, almost all the children
in our village had been taught by her.
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My father worked
in the education department,
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which is why he was highly respected
and influential in the community.
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A lot of importance
was given to education in our family.
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A few years later, when Roy
was studying for his pre-degree,
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uh, Rojo, who was a very
mischievous kid at the time,
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came and told me something
that took me totally by surprise.
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Rojo came and told me
that he had found a letter
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and that it was addressed to Roy,
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it was from someone called Jolly,
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and it looked like
some kind of a love letter.
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I opened the letter and read it,
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and I immediately understood what it was.
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Jolly Joseph of Kattappana
had sent the letter.
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{\an8}The very first time I met Jolly,
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{\an8}we were at my Uncle Mathew Manchadiyil's
housewarming ceremony.
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{\an8}Jolly happens to be the daughter
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{\an8}of my Uncle Manchadiyil Mathew's
wife's brother.
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Um, she was a lot shorter than I expected
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and I noticed her
because of her high-heeled sandals.
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People didn't wear high heels
very often in those days, but Jolly did.
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Back then, when youngsters
liked each other,
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they would exchange such letters.
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They didn't have any other means
of communication.
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So it was through these love letters
that their relationship grew.
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Roy finally admitted that he was in love.
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He made it very clear
that he was serious about her.
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My father did not approve
of this relationship.
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00:12:06,916 --> 00:12:11,083
The main reason for his disapproval
was that she was related to the family.
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Jolly told everyone
she was a qualified professional,
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that she received a Master's degree
in Commerce with 50% marks.
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On hearing this, my mother said,
"That's good,
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once Jolly comes here to live with us,
she can always pursue her career.
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00:12:26,875 --> 00:12:28,916
And since she has studied commerce,
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00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:31,125
it will be easy for her
to get a good job."
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00:12:32,541 --> 00:12:35,166
So my mother was already thinking
along those lines.
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She wanted them to settle down
as soon as possible.
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I remember it was raining
throughout the wedding.
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{\an8}Now, people look back on that day
and say that the rain was a bad omen.
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A sign of bad things to come.
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My father wasn't happy at all.
198
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He seemed quite upset about the marriage
even during the wedding ceremony.
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00:13:01,541 --> 00:13:04,333
I remember noticing that he was
avoiding her as much as possible.
200
00:13:11,416 --> 00:13:13,583
This was
the first wedding in the family,
201
00:13:13,666 --> 00:13:15,750
so naturally,
there was a lot of excitement.
202
00:13:18,250 --> 00:13:21,583
We never imagined that this marriage
would be such a disaster.
203
00:13:24,166 --> 00:13:27,125
Seventeen years ago,
Jolly Joseph married Roy
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00:13:27,208 --> 00:13:28,458
and moved here to Koodathayi
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00:13:28,541 --> 00:13:31,583
and into the home
of Tom and Annamma Thomas.
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00:13:31,666 --> 00:13:35,166
This well-respected family
welcomed her with open arms,
207
00:13:35,250 --> 00:13:38,958
which makes what Jolly did in this house
all the more shocking.
208
00:13:41,416 --> 00:13:43,875
The Ponnamattam house
is right in front of ours,
209
00:13:43,958 --> 00:13:45,750
so we are next-door neighbors.
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00:13:46,958 --> 00:13:50,750
I first met Jolly when she got married
and moved here.
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00:13:52,375 --> 00:13:53,958
She was very warm and friendly,
212
00:13:54,041 --> 00:13:56,583
she always had a smile
and a kind word for everyone.
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00:13:56,666 --> 00:13:58,500
She always used to ask how we are doing.
214
00:13:58,583 --> 00:14:02,500
She was very popular around here.
She was the star of the neighborhood.
215
00:14:04,250 --> 00:14:05,541
That's all she was.
216
00:14:07,083 --> 00:14:10,416
Since they were newlyweds, they
were invited to lunch by the neighbors.
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00:14:10,500 --> 00:14:13,708
They were welcomed into my father
and my mother's circle of friends
218
00:14:13,791 --> 00:14:15,333
and by our extended family.
219
00:14:15,916 --> 00:14:17,333
And gradually over time,
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00:14:17,416 --> 00:14:19,916
Jolly managed to carve out
a place for herself
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00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:22,708
within our family and also our community.
222
00:14:23,583 --> 00:14:26,250
Roy would leave
for work every morning.
223
00:14:26,333 --> 00:14:28,333
So Jolly would be free all day.
224
00:14:29,666 --> 00:14:32,666
She learned how to cook
and take care of the house.
225
00:14:32,750 --> 00:14:35,291
She also liked to cook traditional food.
226
00:14:36,166 --> 00:14:38,500
We would go out
to eat together at restaurants,
227
00:14:38,583 --> 00:14:40,375
we would wander around the city.
228
00:14:40,916 --> 00:14:43,291
We would also go shopping together.
229
00:14:43,375 --> 00:14:47,916
Um, Jolly was crazy about shopping,
especially when it came to jewelry.
230
00:14:49,208 --> 00:14:50,750
Jolly seemed very happy.
231
00:14:51,750 --> 00:14:52,958
But then my mother said,
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00:14:53,041 --> 00:14:56,166
"You shouldn't sit idle at home,
especially with your qualifications.
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00:14:56,250 --> 00:14:58,208
You should get a job and settle down.
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00:14:58,291 --> 00:15:01,833
Once you start working and supporting Roy
by earning a good living,
235
00:15:01,916 --> 00:15:05,208
then both husband and wife
can share life's burdens equally."
236
00:15:05,291 --> 00:15:08,833
I would tell my mother that,
"Amma, let her make her own decisions."
237
00:15:10,541 --> 00:15:12,416
Jolly Joseph's mother-in-law came
238
00:15:12,500 --> 00:15:16,166
from a completely different background
and culture.
239
00:15:16,666 --> 00:15:19,333
When a mother-in-law says
that an educated girl
240
00:15:19,416 --> 00:15:21,083
should not sit idle at home,
241
00:15:21,166 --> 00:15:24,166
then that's a...
very healthy outlook, you know.
242
00:15:24,250 --> 00:15:27,000
It's a very good perspective
for a woman to have.
243
00:15:27,083 --> 00:15:30,000
But where Jolly was concerned,
it was a lot of pressure.
244
00:15:31,125 --> 00:15:34,166
Some young women
don't want to go out and get a job.
245
00:15:34,250 --> 00:15:35,958
They prefer to stay at home.
246
00:15:38,458 --> 00:15:42,416
And then, it turned out she was pregnant,
she was pregnant with Remo.
247
00:15:42,500 --> 00:15:44,375
So my mother dropped the whole issue.
248
00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:53,125
The house
in Ponnamattam, Koodathayi
249
00:15:53,208 --> 00:15:55,083
is where I was born and raised.
250
00:15:55,166 --> 00:15:57,791
I have a very strong attachment
to that place
251
00:15:57,875 --> 00:16:00,708
because I spent a lot part
of my life there.
252
00:16:00,791 --> 00:16:03,000
I was the first child in the family.
253
00:16:03,083 --> 00:16:06,625
I got all the love and attention
that the first child usually does.
254
00:16:08,583 --> 00:16:10,875
{\an8}Our family was very large.
255
00:16:11,541 --> 00:16:14,625
{\an8}And I remembered us
being a very happy family.
256
00:16:17,083 --> 00:16:19,916
After Remo was born,
my mother raised the issue again.
257
00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:22,333
She tried to reassure Jolly saying,
258
00:16:22,416 --> 00:16:26,125
"You can go to work now, Jolly,
I'll take care of the baby."
259
00:16:26,708 --> 00:16:29,875
She said, "You don't have to worry,
he'll be fine with us."
260
00:16:29,958 --> 00:16:31,791
Because Jolly was so qualified,
261
00:16:31,875 --> 00:16:34,791
she wanted her to get a good job
and be set for life.
262
00:16:34,875 --> 00:16:36,500
My mother said this repeatedly.
263
00:16:39,791 --> 00:16:41,958
What I learned
from my investigation,
264
00:16:42,041 --> 00:16:44,833
is that ever since Jolly married
into that family,
265
00:16:44,916 --> 00:16:48,250
she'd been claiming that she had
a Master's degree in Commerce.
266
00:16:48,750 --> 00:16:51,541
She admitted to me, uh, this degree...
267
00:16:52,291 --> 00:16:54,583
"This degree that I created in my name
268
00:16:54,666 --> 00:16:57,791
was the greatest mistake I ever made
in my entire life."
269
00:17:00,166 --> 00:17:01,708
She told me that her mother-in-law,
270
00:17:01,791 --> 00:17:04,000
Annamma Thomas had no idea
271
00:17:04,083 --> 00:17:07,875
that Jolly did not have
these education qualifications.
272
00:17:08,500 --> 00:17:12,791
Annamma was always telling Jolly,
"You have such high qualifications,
273
00:17:12,875 --> 00:17:16,458
why aren't you trying to get a job,
why aren't you going out and working?"
274
00:17:16,541 --> 00:17:20,291
So there was a lot of arguments
about this in the family.
275
00:17:20,375 --> 00:17:24,875
And when this issue intensified,
Jolly's father decided to visit her.
276
00:17:26,250 --> 00:17:29,500
Jolly knew that Annamma
would speak to her father
277
00:17:29,583 --> 00:17:31,166
about her getting a job.
278
00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:34,458
She also knew
that when Annamma brought up this issue,
279
00:17:34,541 --> 00:17:37,666
her father would say that Jolly
does not have such qualifications
280
00:17:37,750 --> 00:17:40,041
and Jolly's lies would be exposed.
281
00:18:03,958 --> 00:18:07,875
We were all sitting down
having a nice breakfast in the morning.
282
00:18:08,541 --> 00:18:11,375
My elder brother
was playing loud music upstairs.
283
00:18:14,625 --> 00:18:16,416
I had a clear view
of the dining room
284
00:18:16,500 --> 00:18:18,500
from where I was in the kitchen.
285
00:18:22,291 --> 00:18:24,291
I was busy making chicken curry.
286
00:18:27,166 --> 00:18:30,416
I saw my mother pick up a glass of water
and carry it away.
287
00:18:31,333 --> 00:18:35,500
I still remember that after about
20 minutes, I got a nagging feeling,
288
00:18:35,583 --> 00:18:37,625
"I better check on Amma,
I better check on Amma."
289
00:18:37,708 --> 00:18:39,500
That thought kept running in my mind.
290
00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:45,375
When I got there,
I saw my mother sitting on the bed
291
00:18:45,458 --> 00:18:47,250
with her legs stretched out,
292
00:18:47,333 --> 00:18:48,958
leaning against the window.
293
00:18:50,041 --> 00:18:53,625
She had tears in her eyes. So I asked her,
"What happened? What's wrong?"
294
00:18:53,708 --> 00:18:56,041
She said, "I'm going to die.
Call everyone."
295
00:18:59,208 --> 00:19:02,208
I rushed and shut off
the electricity fuse.
296
00:19:05,083 --> 00:19:07,541
I ran downstairs
to be by my mother's side.
297
00:19:08,250 --> 00:19:11,166
She was lying on the bed
looking terrified.
298
00:19:11,250 --> 00:19:15,541
All the blood had rushed upwards
and her face had gone bright red,
299
00:19:15,625 --> 00:19:18,250
she said, "I can't breathe,
I think I'm gonna die."
300
00:19:18,833 --> 00:19:22,041
So I told my brother
to call the doctor immediately.
301
00:19:24,916 --> 00:19:27,875
My mother's legs went up
like she was having a seizure,
302
00:19:27,958 --> 00:19:29,583
her body began to convulse.
303
00:19:29,666 --> 00:19:31,375
The doctor finally arrived.
304
00:19:31,458 --> 00:19:35,541
He checked her pulse and told us
to take her to the hospital immediately.
305
00:19:37,916 --> 00:19:40,125
We rushed her to Omassery Hospital
306
00:19:40,208 --> 00:19:43,708
in a jeep, it was going at full speed
with its headlights on.
307
00:19:44,541 --> 00:19:46,916
I didn't even wait for the jeep to stop,
308
00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:49,916
I rushed straight into the emergency ward
at the hospital.
309
00:19:50,833 --> 00:19:53,375
I told the doctor, "Please do
whatever you can to save her."
310
00:19:54,083 --> 00:19:56,291
They wheeled her inside quickly.
311
00:20:00,750 --> 00:20:03,666
Five minutes later,
the doctor said she was no more.
312
00:20:11,166 --> 00:20:13,333
All of Koodathayi
mourned her death.
313
00:20:14,166 --> 00:20:15,875
We were just devastated.
314
00:20:18,208 --> 00:20:23,125
I could not get over my mother's death.
It consumed me mentally and physically.
315
00:20:25,416 --> 00:20:27,583
My mind kept telling me
that she'll come back.
316
00:20:28,750 --> 00:20:31,125
But, of course, she never came back.
317
00:20:40,541 --> 00:20:43,916
At that time, we didn't have any
suspicions about our mother's death.
318
00:20:45,583 --> 00:20:47,375
It looked like a hereditary stroke.
319
00:20:48,291 --> 00:20:51,250
The circumstances
didn't raise any suspicions.
320
00:20:54,541 --> 00:20:58,958
The first victim
was Annamma, who died in 2002.
321
00:20:59,041 --> 00:21:02,875
Because she was a little old and she was
suffering from a lot of illnesses,
322
00:21:02,958 --> 00:21:06,791
the family did not really insist
on a postmortem.
323
00:21:08,625 --> 00:21:11,000
A suspicious death in 2002
324
00:21:11,083 --> 00:21:14,666
was reported to the police
after a span of 18 years.
325
00:21:16,125 --> 00:21:19,875
So tell me, what kind
of evidential value can it have now?
326
00:21:19,958 --> 00:21:23,583
Yes, it is a fact that Jolly's
mother-in-law died a sudden death.
327
00:21:23,666 --> 00:21:26,625
But there's no way to know
if it's a murder,
328
00:21:26,708 --> 00:21:29,916
or let's say a heart attack,
or maybe a case of suicide?
329
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:32,958
It is completely up to the prosecution
to prove one of the three.
330
00:21:33,041 --> 00:21:36,000
And I can tell you right now
that in Annamma's case,
331
00:21:36,083 --> 00:21:39,500
the evidence they have
is simply not strong enough.
332
00:21:44,333 --> 00:21:48,333
After the funeral,
I noticed that Jolly had changed.
333
00:21:48,416 --> 00:21:51,416
She had a complete different personality
334
00:21:51,500 --> 00:21:54,583
from the one she had
before my mother's death.
335
00:21:55,875 --> 00:21:59,166
Jolly took over all
of my mother's duties inside the house
336
00:21:59,250 --> 00:22:01,125
and out in the community,
337
00:22:01,208 --> 00:22:02,875
and she did it very well.
338
00:22:03,708 --> 00:22:08,708
And just like my mother, Jolly became
the most important person in the family.
339
00:22:10,541 --> 00:22:12,291
My mother had written in her diary
340
00:22:12,375 --> 00:22:15,083
that she had deposited
some money in my name.
341
00:22:15,166 --> 00:22:18,833
She had also left some gold jewelry
for me. I had no idea about it.
342
00:22:18,916 --> 00:22:21,125
Then suddenly, Jolly tells me,
343
00:22:21,208 --> 00:22:22,448
"Your mother wrote in her diary
344
00:22:22,500 --> 00:22:24,333
that she's left
certain things for you, right?
345
00:22:24,416 --> 00:22:25,541
Apart from those things,
346
00:22:25,625 --> 00:22:28,708
you're not going to get
anything else from this property here."
347
00:22:29,291 --> 00:22:31,541
But this behavior was only towards me.
348
00:22:31,625 --> 00:22:35,125
Her behavior towards outsiders
and of course towards my father
349
00:22:35,208 --> 00:22:37,166
was very different.
350
00:22:37,250 --> 00:22:40,166
I always used to wonder that,
"Why does she treat me like this?
351
00:22:40,250 --> 00:22:41,833
What has she got against me?"
352
00:22:41,916 --> 00:22:43,375
Uh, like one morning,
353
00:22:43,458 --> 00:22:46,916
someone asked me for something
and I handed it all like I usually do.
354
00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:49,291
And Jolly immediately told me that,
355
00:22:49,375 --> 00:22:53,458
"You can't give anyone things from this
house without asking for my permission."
356
00:22:53,541 --> 00:22:57,875
She literally told me, "You can't do
anything without asking me first."
357
00:22:57,958 --> 00:23:00,375
I couldn't tell my father
what was going on.
358
00:23:00,458 --> 00:23:03,291
I couldn't tell him that Jolly
was mentally torturing me.
359
00:23:03,375 --> 00:23:07,500
I couldn't tell him because he was going
through a very traumatic time himself.
360
00:23:09,166 --> 00:23:12,875
A few days later,
Jolly came up to me and said,
361
00:23:12,958 --> 00:23:15,291
"I have decided, I'm not going to work.
362
00:23:15,958 --> 00:23:19,625
Someone needs to be at home
and I have to take care of your father.
363
00:23:19,708 --> 00:23:22,541
I can't go off
and leave the family like that."
364
00:23:22,625 --> 00:23:24,625
I think this was always the plan.
365
00:23:24,708 --> 00:23:27,166
That once my mother was gone,
Jolly would take over.
366
00:23:27,250 --> 00:23:29,750
And that's exactly what happened.
367
00:23:32,166 --> 00:23:34,166
With the death of her mother-in-law,
368
00:23:34,250 --> 00:23:37,125
Jolly assumed the role of the matriarch.
369
00:23:37,875 --> 00:23:40,708
As the authoritative figure
in the Ponnamattam family,
370
00:23:40,791 --> 00:23:44,583
she'd relish the respect and attention
she received from everyone.
371
00:23:44,666 --> 00:23:47,916
And in fact, uh, she must have desired it.
372
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:49,680
It's probably something she always wanted.
373
00:23:50,625 --> 00:23:54,458
Jolly Joseph must have thought
that by taking her mother-in-law's place,
374
00:23:54,541 --> 00:23:57,833
her family, her relatives,
and her entire community
375
00:23:57,916 --> 00:24:00,666
would now see her
as a very important person.
376
00:24:02,333 --> 00:24:04,208
Jolly soon realized one thing.
377
00:24:04,291 --> 00:24:06,666
That my mother had a reputation
as a teacher.
378
00:24:06,750 --> 00:24:09,458
She had the love and respect
of the whole community.
379
00:24:09,541 --> 00:24:11,750
So if Jolly wanted the same respect,
380
00:24:11,833 --> 00:24:13,875
she would have to go
and get a teacher's job.
381
00:24:21,375 --> 00:24:23,916
One day, when I called my father,
382
00:24:24,583 --> 00:24:26,500
he gave me a surprising news.
383
00:24:26,583 --> 00:24:31,541
He said Jolly had got a job
as a guest lecturer at NIT.
384
00:24:35,041 --> 00:24:38,375
My father said, "It's a good thing
because it's not far from our house."
385
00:24:39,083 --> 00:24:41,541
And even though
she's a guest lecturer now,
386
00:24:41,625 --> 00:24:43,625
she could be made permanent later.
387
00:24:44,250 --> 00:24:46,583
When I asked him what her salary would be,
388
00:24:46,666 --> 00:24:49,291
he said, "She mentioned 40,000 a month."
389
00:24:51,291 --> 00:24:54,666
I was very young
when she got the job at NIT.
390
00:24:54,750 --> 00:24:58,125
{\an8}And NIT is a very large institution.
391
00:24:58,750 --> 00:25:02,125
They have a canteen where we would go
and have a meal together
392
00:25:02,208 --> 00:25:03,791
and then come back home.
393
00:25:07,916 --> 00:25:11,791
Once she got the job, she earned
a great deal of respect
394
00:25:11,875 --> 00:25:13,958
among the people of Koodathayi.
395
00:25:14,041 --> 00:25:17,708
She was always given a special preference
because she was a lecturer at NIT.
396
00:25:18,416 --> 00:25:21,500
People in the community
were very impressed
397
00:25:21,583 --> 00:25:23,791
with how humble and pleasant she was.
398
00:25:23,875 --> 00:25:28,291
How she easily mingled with everyone
being an NIT lecturer.
399
00:25:29,166 --> 00:25:31,375
NATIONAL INSTITUTE
OF TECHNOLOGY, CALICUT
400
00:25:31,458 --> 00:25:34,416
When you tell people
you're a professor at NIT,
401
00:25:34,500 --> 00:25:35,875
they always go, "Wow."
402
00:25:35,958 --> 00:25:37,750
You immediately earned their respect.
403
00:25:38,250 --> 00:25:40,666
Especially since
Jolly's background shows that
404
00:25:40,750 --> 00:25:42,958
she was born and raised
in a family of farmers.
405
00:25:44,541 --> 00:25:49,166
It was a big achievement for a girl
from a farming family to come this far.
406
00:25:51,333 --> 00:25:55,958
This was when Jolly had finally earned
the respect of the whole family,
407
00:25:56,041 --> 00:25:58,583
my mother's family and my father's family.
408
00:26:01,958 --> 00:26:03,666
When relatives visited our home,
409
00:26:03,750 --> 00:26:06,083
Jolly would always welcome them
very warmly.
410
00:26:06,166 --> 00:26:09,666
She enjoyed playing the hostess,
cooking their favorite meals, et cetera.
411
00:26:11,250 --> 00:26:14,125
I remember very often
when guests were present,
412
00:26:14,208 --> 00:26:16,041
Jolly would bring my father's shirts
413
00:26:16,125 --> 00:26:19,125
and put them on the ironing table
which was just below the stairs.
414
00:26:19,208 --> 00:26:22,416
That way, everyone could see her
ironing his clothes.
415
00:26:23,500 --> 00:26:25,333
I got married in 2005,
416
00:26:25,416 --> 00:26:29,083
and then I moved to Colombo
with my husband.
417
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:33,875
In April 2007, my father came over
for a one-month visit.
418
00:26:33,958 --> 00:26:38,791
Then in 2008, he came to visit us again
and stayed for a month.
419
00:26:38,875 --> 00:26:42,375
That's when I noticed that he was looking
very thin and unhealthy.
420
00:26:42,458 --> 00:26:43,833
He wasn't his old self.
421
00:26:43,916 --> 00:26:48,500
I had a feeling that he was mentally down
and that something was troubling him.
422
00:26:50,166 --> 00:26:53,041
Tom Thomas was upset
with Jolly Joseph
423
00:26:53,125 --> 00:26:57,333
because M.S. Mathew had begun
to visit their home very often.
424
00:27:00,458 --> 00:27:03,916
{\an8}M.S. Mathew is the son
of Annamma's elder brother.
425
00:27:05,083 --> 00:27:09,375
Mathew was working
as a salesman in a jewelry store.
426
00:27:10,166 --> 00:27:12,541
And he had grown close to Jolly.
427
00:27:13,708 --> 00:27:16,958
Tom Thomas had become aware
of Mathew's visits
428
00:27:17,041 --> 00:27:19,916
and he confronted Jolly Joseph about this.
429
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:22,750
He asked her why Mathew
came home so often,
430
00:27:22,833 --> 00:27:25,041
what was the purpose of his visits.
431
00:27:25,125 --> 00:27:28,833
Jolly never gave any explanations,
she just made up excuses.
432
00:27:29,708 --> 00:27:32,250
It was then that my father
started opening up to me.
433
00:27:32,333 --> 00:27:35,916
He said, "Jolly leaves the house
saying that she's going somewhere
434
00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:37,600
and then I see her going somewhere else.
435
00:27:37,666 --> 00:27:40,625
When I ask her about it,
she just beats around the bush.
436
00:27:40,708 --> 00:27:43,750
And she's always in a corner
talking on the phone,
437
00:27:43,833 --> 00:27:45,958
or she's out in the garden
with her phone."
438
00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:51,250
My father was very upset.
He couldn't understand what was going on.
439
00:28:06,083 --> 00:28:09,125
Tom Thomas was in the habit
of having a capsule, uh,
440
00:28:09,208 --> 00:28:11,375
after his evening coffee.
441
00:28:12,916 --> 00:28:15,500
They were some sort of mushroom capsules.
442
00:28:17,916 --> 00:28:22,500
That evening, it was Jolly
who handed Tom Thomas his capsule.
443
00:28:23,250 --> 00:28:24,583
Thomas swallowed the capsule
444
00:28:24,666 --> 00:28:27,708
and he immediately began to experience
some discomfort.
445
00:28:32,083 --> 00:28:34,958
He suddenly became
unconscious and fell on the floor.
446
00:28:35,625 --> 00:28:37,416
Very close to the washbasin.
447
00:28:38,375 --> 00:28:41,375
But did Jolly make more attempts
to help her father-in-law?
448
00:28:41,458 --> 00:28:43,750
She just quietly left the room.
449
00:28:47,208 --> 00:28:48,833
Then she called up a neighbor
450
00:28:48,916 --> 00:28:51,958
who brought an auto rickshaw
and took him to the hospital.
451
00:28:56,458 --> 00:28:59,875
Tom Thomas died
before he could reach the hospital.
452
00:29:03,458 --> 00:29:06,208
They took too much time
to get my father to the hospital.
453
00:29:06,291 --> 00:29:08,583
I asked them, "Why did it take so long?"
454
00:29:10,291 --> 00:29:14,041
She said, "Renji, I couldn't find
the car keys, that's why it took so long."
455
00:29:17,416 --> 00:29:19,916
Everyone thought
that Roy's father's death
456
00:29:20,000 --> 00:29:21,791
was caused by a heart attack.
457
00:29:22,375 --> 00:29:24,291
By calling it a heart attack,
458
00:29:24,375 --> 00:29:27,666
Jolly managed, uh, to prevent
an autopsy from being done
459
00:29:27,750 --> 00:29:29,583
and his body was taken home.
460
00:29:32,375 --> 00:29:34,250
He was buried next to my mother.
461
00:29:35,166 --> 00:29:37,625
While my father was being laid to rest,
462
00:29:37,708 --> 00:29:40,583
I saw Jolly and M.S. Mathew
standing on one side,
463
00:29:40,666 --> 00:29:42,500
having a private conversation.
464
00:29:44,250 --> 00:29:45,666
So I asked my brother,
465
00:29:46,416 --> 00:29:47,750
"What's going on between them?
466
00:29:47,833 --> 00:29:51,083
Why are they standing separately,
whispering to each other?"
467
00:29:51,875 --> 00:29:53,750
To which my brother replied,
468
00:29:53,833 --> 00:29:57,541
"They've had some cash transactions.
It must be about that."
469
00:30:03,500 --> 00:30:06,208
When I went through
the second case in detail,
470
00:30:06,291 --> 00:30:09,041
I found the evidence presented
to be very weak.
471
00:30:09,750 --> 00:30:12,041
I mean, she told everyone
that her father-in-law
472
00:30:12,125 --> 00:30:15,333
had suddenly died of a severe heart attack
and they just believed her.
473
00:30:15,416 --> 00:30:17,375
And that's quite possible
that's what happened.
474
00:30:17,458 --> 00:30:19,625
But why did the doctor believe her?
475
00:30:19,708 --> 00:30:23,250
Wasn't it the doctor's job
to investigate whether
476
00:30:24,166 --> 00:30:26,666
the patient had died of a heart attack?
477
00:30:26,750 --> 00:30:28,958
What if there was any other reason
for his death?
478
00:30:29,041 --> 00:30:33,416
Since when has medical science
relied on the statement of a mere witness
479
00:30:33,500 --> 00:30:35,750
to determine the actual cause of death?
480
00:30:37,541 --> 00:30:39,833
The next victim
in the case was Tom Thomas
481
00:30:39,916 --> 00:30:41,541
who died in 2008.
482
00:30:41,625 --> 00:30:43,750
There was a difference of six years
483
00:30:43,833 --> 00:30:47,250
between the first two deaths in this case.
484
00:30:47,333 --> 00:30:48,833
But because there was a huge gap
485
00:30:48,916 --> 00:30:52,416
between the first and the second deaths,
or the murders in this case,
486
00:30:52,500 --> 00:30:55,291
it was very difficult
for the family members
487
00:30:55,375 --> 00:30:57,333
to assume something suspicious in this,
488
00:30:57,416 --> 00:31:00,041
because there was nothing
unusual about it.
489
00:31:00,125 --> 00:31:03,708
Because of the way this poison was used,
there wasn't any visible injuries
490
00:31:03,791 --> 00:31:07,083
or visible... Or anything that would
suggest that this was a murder.
491
00:31:10,166 --> 00:31:13,875
I remember Jolly was crying
uncontrollably during the funeral,
492
00:31:13,958 --> 00:31:15,416
especially towards the end
493
00:31:15,500 --> 00:31:18,500
when the body
was being lowered into the grave.
494
00:31:18,583 --> 00:31:20,875
But when we got back home that day,
495
00:31:20,958 --> 00:31:25,041
she was back to being the same Jolly
she was after my mother died,
496
00:31:25,125 --> 00:31:27,125
managing everything efficiently,
497
00:31:27,208 --> 00:31:28,416
taking over everything.
498
00:31:30,541 --> 00:31:33,208
After my mother's death,
we already felt like
499
00:31:33,291 --> 00:31:35,791
there wasn't much place
for us in that house.
500
00:31:35,875 --> 00:31:39,208
Now with my father gone,
there was no place left at all.
501
00:31:53,416 --> 00:31:57,083
From the time I have known Jolly,
I had never been very close to her.
502
00:31:58,916 --> 00:32:00,666
At the time of the deaths,
503
00:32:00,750 --> 00:32:02,666
she called me over to that teak tree
504
00:32:02,750 --> 00:32:04,833
and said that she had something
to tell me.
505
00:32:04,916 --> 00:32:06,583
I asked her, "What is it?"
506
00:32:07,125 --> 00:32:10,208
She said, "There will be three deaths
in this house."
507
00:32:10,291 --> 00:32:13,791
She said, "The house and the land
are not in the right place
508
00:32:13,875 --> 00:32:16,291
and that the well
is in the wrong place too.
509
00:32:16,833 --> 00:32:19,416
For that, we need to build a wall
around the well
510
00:32:19,500 --> 00:32:22,166
and the tree in front
needs to be cut down.
511
00:32:26,083 --> 00:32:29,000
If all these issues are resolved,
the deaths will stop."
512
00:32:30,416 --> 00:32:32,666
I asked Jolly how she knew all this.
513
00:32:33,250 --> 00:32:37,250
She said, "Our Priests and our Elders
have told me to do this."
514
00:32:38,625 --> 00:32:39,875
I stopped talking to her.
515
00:32:39,958 --> 00:32:42,791
I decided I wasn't going
to have any more contact
516
00:32:42,875 --> 00:32:45,291
with any member of the Ponnamattam family.
517
00:32:45,375 --> 00:32:46,666
You won't believe
518
00:32:46,750 --> 00:32:49,708
I used to be so close to them,
they were like my family.
519
00:32:49,791 --> 00:32:52,541
But now, I just avoid them. No contact.
520
00:32:54,208 --> 00:32:57,416
After Tom and Annamma,
the next death in the Ponnamattam family
521
00:32:57,500 --> 00:32:59,208
wouldn't occur for another two years,
522
00:32:59,291 --> 00:33:03,375
which allowed Jolly the opportunity
to quell any suspicions about the deaths
523
00:33:03,458 --> 00:33:07,333
and rebuild trust with her neighbors
and people in the town.
524
00:33:09,291 --> 00:33:11,916
After that,
our family became even smaller.
525
00:33:12,666 --> 00:33:16,750
Then, when I was four or five years old,
studying in lower or upper kindergarten,
526
00:33:16,833 --> 00:33:19,250
my mother, uh, became pregnant
with my brother.
527
00:33:21,875 --> 00:33:25,750
{\an8}I, uh, was very excited
when my younger brother was born.
528
00:33:25,833 --> 00:33:27,666
{\an8}The whole family celebrated his arrival.
529
00:33:27,750 --> 00:33:30,833
{\an8}After many years,
our family was happy again.
530
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:35,750
We had some wonderful moments
531
00:33:35,833 --> 00:33:38,583
and we were a happy family
for quite a long time.
532
00:33:38,666 --> 00:33:41,250
But gradually, as I grew older,
533
00:33:41,333 --> 00:33:44,541
I began to understand more about
what was happening in the family.
534
00:33:44,625 --> 00:33:47,208
I could see the issues
that were happening in the house.
535
00:33:47,291 --> 00:33:49,291
When we were younger,
we weren't really bothered
536
00:33:49,375 --> 00:33:51,916
about all these kinds of problems,
we didn't pay much attention.
537
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:56,375
But as time went on, we gradually began
to grow a little apart,
538
00:33:56,458 --> 00:33:58,291
meaning distance from my mother,
539
00:33:58,375 --> 00:34:00,666
even my father and she
had started to grow apart.
540
00:34:04,541 --> 00:34:07,041
It was really sad
that as if everyone had split up,
541
00:34:07,125 --> 00:34:09,325
with each one living in a different corner
of the house,
542
00:34:09,375 --> 00:34:10,666
it felt lonely.
543
00:34:11,458 --> 00:34:13,375
My mother always seemed to be busy,
544
00:34:13,458 --> 00:34:17,125
saying she had some paper evaluations
or college work or something.
545
00:34:17,208 --> 00:34:18,541
She never had any time.
546
00:34:19,625 --> 00:34:21,416
This meant me and my brother feel like
547
00:34:21,500 --> 00:34:23,208
we didn't have a place
in her life anymore.
548
00:34:25,416 --> 00:34:28,166
Then it turned out
that Roy's business was in trouble,
549
00:34:28,250 --> 00:34:31,208
it was not doing as well
as he had expected.
550
00:34:31,291 --> 00:34:33,583
They had run out of money.
551
00:34:33,666 --> 00:34:35,958
Roy didn't have any other means of income
552
00:34:36,041 --> 00:34:38,041
and this became a problem towards the end.
553
00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:43,208
A few days before the incident,
Rojo told me that Jolly had called
554
00:34:43,291 --> 00:34:45,916
to say that she was thinking
of getting a divorce.
555
00:34:46,583 --> 00:34:50,333
She said that Roy wasn't taking good care
of the family and whatnot.
556
00:34:52,500 --> 00:34:54,666
Then one evening at the house,
557
00:34:54,750 --> 00:34:57,708
while Rojo and I
were sitting in my father's room,
558
00:34:58,250 --> 00:34:59,791
Roy suddenly walked in.
559
00:34:59,875 --> 00:35:01,291
I saw that Roy had...
560
00:35:02,833 --> 00:35:06,791
a photocopy of my father's will,
two pages.
561
00:35:06,875 --> 00:35:10,625
He said that my father had left
the house and property
562
00:35:11,250 --> 00:35:13,416
to Jolly and him in his will.
563
00:35:15,083 --> 00:35:17,458
Renji immediately
took it from him and asked,
564
00:35:17,541 --> 00:35:19,291
"Is this the will?"
565
00:35:20,041 --> 00:35:21,708
It's not on a stamp paper
566
00:35:21,791 --> 00:35:23,833
and there are no witness signatures on it.
567
00:35:25,750 --> 00:35:27,875
Suddenly,
there was pin-drop silence.
568
00:35:27,958 --> 00:35:30,375
And then,
they both walked out of the room.
569
00:35:30,458 --> 00:35:33,666
I just told Rojo,
"Keep this will with you."
570
00:35:35,875 --> 00:35:39,000
I do think that there was
some sort of give-and-take
571
00:35:39,083 --> 00:35:42,458
between Jolly and Roy as far as lies go.
572
00:35:42,541 --> 00:35:45,583
Roy definitely knew some of her lies
573
00:35:45,666 --> 00:35:48,875
because, uh, he himself
was part of those lies.
574
00:35:49,750 --> 00:35:51,750
I think they had a fallout.
575
00:35:51,833 --> 00:35:55,458
Uh, perhaps that is when the lies
started coming out.
576
00:35:55,541 --> 00:35:58,916
And Jolly must have thought
that something has to be done about it.
577
00:36:01,166 --> 00:36:03,625
Roy was fully aware
of Jolly's affair with Mathew.
578
00:36:03,708 --> 00:36:05,708
He and Jolly had arguments about it.
579
00:36:05,791 --> 00:36:07,416
He started asking her angrily
580
00:36:07,500 --> 00:36:09,458
about her relationship with Mathew,
581
00:36:09,541 --> 00:36:12,458
and why she insisted
on continuing the affair.
582
00:36:13,458 --> 00:36:16,916
Jolly must have thought it was pointless
583
00:36:17,666 --> 00:36:19,125
to stay married to Roy.
584
00:36:27,083 --> 00:36:29,833
{\an8}On 30th September 2011,
585
00:36:32,250 --> 00:36:34,583
Jolly gave the children an early dinner
586
00:36:34,666 --> 00:36:37,875
then she took them upstairs
and put them to sleep.
587
00:36:39,541 --> 00:36:41,750
Then at 8:00, she came downstairs,
588
00:36:41,833 --> 00:36:43,208
she went into the kitchen,
589
00:36:43,875 --> 00:36:47,291
and prepared some rice and chickpea curry
for Roy's dinner.
590
00:36:50,666 --> 00:36:53,666
When Roy came home, he went upstairs
591
00:36:53,750 --> 00:36:57,083
and jokingly asked the kids
if they were pretending to sleep.
592
00:36:58,666 --> 00:37:03,458
Then he came downstairs, ate his dinner,
and began to feel uneasy.
593
00:37:04,208 --> 00:37:06,333
He went straight to the bathroom.
594
00:37:12,708 --> 00:37:15,541
She told me that Roy
had come home at around 3:00 p.m.
595
00:37:15,625 --> 00:37:17,916
and he had rice and chickpea curry.
596
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,625
And then, he didn't eat anything
for the rest of the night.
597
00:37:20,708 --> 00:37:23,458
When she went to make an omelet,
Roy was in the bathroom.
598
00:37:24,875 --> 00:37:27,583
After frying the omelet, she went
and knocked on the bathroom door
599
00:37:27,666 --> 00:37:29,000
but he didn't respond.
600
00:37:31,250 --> 00:37:34,375
The day Roy died, I was sitting
right here when I got a call.
601
00:37:34,458 --> 00:37:36,017
She said, "Roy isn't opening the door,"
602
00:37:36,041 --> 00:37:38,333
and she asked me
if I could come over and help her.
603
00:37:38,416 --> 00:37:40,916
I rushed to their house
and found Roy lying on the floor
604
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:42,625
and foam was coming out of his mouth.
605
00:37:43,708 --> 00:37:46,583
Roy's uncle, Mathew,
had also arrived by then.
606
00:37:48,666 --> 00:37:51,000
We picked him up
and rushed him to the hospital.
607
00:37:51,083 --> 00:37:54,458
But they said his condition was critical
and that he was too far gone.
608
00:38:00,750 --> 00:38:02,708
I got a call at 11 o'clock...
609
00:38:05,708 --> 00:38:07,791
my brother Roy had passed away.
610
00:38:11,750 --> 00:38:15,416
We woke up and saw
the lights on in the house.
611
00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:20,208
One of our relatives, an aunt,
was sitting beside us on the bed.
612
00:38:22,583 --> 00:38:24,208
I looked at her half asleep,
613
00:38:24,291 --> 00:38:27,541
and she said my father had slipped
and fallen in the bathroom
614
00:38:27,625 --> 00:38:29,375
and that he had been taken
to the hospital.
615
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:31,708
So I quickly went downstairs
616
00:38:31,791 --> 00:38:35,750
and saw my papa's framed photograph
on the table in the living room.
617
00:38:35,833 --> 00:38:38,291
There were candles burning
618
00:38:38,375 --> 00:38:42,291
and there were flowers arranged
all around the photograph.
619
00:38:43,166 --> 00:38:46,791
That's when we finally realized
our father wasn't coming back.
620
00:38:49,291 --> 00:38:50,750
Their Uncle Mathew felt
621
00:38:50,833 --> 00:38:53,625
that there was something suspicious
about Roy's death.
622
00:38:53,708 --> 00:38:56,625
He insisted that a postmortem
be carried out on Roy.
623
00:38:56,708 --> 00:38:58,791
{\an8}Jolly argued that he's already gone.
624
00:38:58,875 --> 00:39:00,583
{\an8}Why is the need for a postmortem?
625
00:39:00,666 --> 00:39:03,583
However, it was due
to Manchadiyil Mathew's insistence
626
00:39:03,666 --> 00:39:07,750
that the case was taken up
and a postmortem was conducted.
627
00:39:10,208 --> 00:39:14,333
The report from the doctor
who conducted Roy's postmortem
628
00:39:14,416 --> 00:39:19,041
very clearly states that Roy's death
was caused by the consumption of cyanide.
629
00:39:22,291 --> 00:39:24,875
{\an8}Jolly told us that Roy had debts
630
00:39:24,958 --> 00:39:26,958
{\an8}amounting to lakhs of rupees.
631
00:39:27,041 --> 00:39:29,041
{\an8}And that's why he had committed suicide.
632
00:39:31,125 --> 00:39:33,333
I blamed my brother for what happened.
633
00:39:35,375 --> 00:39:38,791
I thought how could he kill himself
after going into so much debt?
634
00:39:43,625 --> 00:39:45,625
We were angry and disgusted with him.
635
00:39:45,708 --> 00:39:48,625
{\an8}I told Renji,
"He owes people lakhs of rupees.
636
00:39:48,708 --> 00:39:51,583
{\an8}How in God's name
are we going to repay it all?"
637
00:39:53,416 --> 00:39:55,291
{\an8}But no person came forward.
638
00:39:56,500 --> 00:40:01,291
Till this very day, not a single person
has called Renji or me
639
00:40:01,375 --> 00:40:05,166
to say that Roy
had borrowed any money from them.
640
00:40:08,083 --> 00:40:11,291
His own wife said
there was no need for an inquiry.
641
00:40:12,791 --> 00:40:14,291
Then how could we push for it?
642
00:40:15,875 --> 00:40:19,250
So we put it down in writing
that we had no doubts about his death.
643
00:40:22,125 --> 00:40:24,708
After Roy's death,
three members of the same family
644
00:40:24,791 --> 00:40:27,083
had died in eerily similar ways.
645
00:40:27,583 --> 00:40:32,000
One has to wonder why the remaining
family members were not more alarmed,
646
00:40:32,083 --> 00:40:35,291
why so many red flags
were missed at the time,
647
00:40:35,375 --> 00:40:38,041
and why more could not have been done
648
00:40:38,125 --> 00:40:42,458
to prevent the most shocking
and horrific deaths yet to come.
649
00:40:56,500 --> 00:40:59,166
I am the chief
of Poison Control Center
650
00:40:59,250 --> 00:41:02,166
at Amrita Institute
of Medical Sciences in Kerala.
651
00:41:03,833 --> 00:41:06,750
There is a toxicological dictum.
652
00:41:07,333 --> 00:41:11,541
When you come across cyanide
in a case of death,
653
00:41:12,500 --> 00:41:16,166
first suspect murder,
regardless of what anybody may say.
654
00:41:16,708 --> 00:41:19,875
Relatives or the others around may say,
"This is accidental, this is suicide..."
655
00:41:19,958 --> 00:41:22,375
But first, rule out murder.
656
00:41:22,958 --> 00:41:24,791
Then you can latch on to suicide.
657
00:41:24,875 --> 00:41:28,708
I'm surprised that, uh,
it did not strike the police.
658
00:41:30,916 --> 00:41:34,750
{\an8}They knew about the cyanide
in the 2011 postmortem report.
659
00:41:35,333 --> 00:41:39,000
Which makes one wonder that
why Manchadiyil Mathew
660
00:41:39,083 --> 00:41:40,958
did not ask for further investigation?
661
00:41:41,041 --> 00:41:42,833
Why didn't the siblings ask for it?
662
00:41:42,916 --> 00:41:45,833
The substance that was mentioned
in the postmortem report,
663
00:41:45,916 --> 00:41:48,156
why did the police let it go
and not investigate further?
664
00:41:48,416 --> 00:41:52,708
Instead of conducting a thorough
investigation into Roy's death,
665
00:41:53,208 --> 00:41:57,041
the police preferred to blame my client
Jolly for this murder.
666
00:42:00,125 --> 00:42:02,875
The truth is
the police completely overlooked
667
00:42:02,958 --> 00:42:04,291
the suspect of the case
668
00:42:04,375 --> 00:42:06,708
and therefore,
they failed to take any action.
669
00:42:07,375 --> 00:42:09,500
When they went to Roy's house
to investigate,
670
00:42:09,583 --> 00:42:12,291
Jolly must have told them
that this was a suicide
671
00:42:12,375 --> 00:42:15,750
and asked them to leave the matter alone.
672
00:42:15,833 --> 00:42:18,166
Normally, the police, uh...
673
00:42:18,666 --> 00:42:20,583
would never expect the housewife
674
00:42:20,666 --> 00:42:23,541
to commit such crimes
against her own family.
675
00:42:24,750 --> 00:42:26,416
Especially this family.
676
00:42:26,500 --> 00:42:31,291
That turned out to work in Jolly's favor.
677
00:42:35,125 --> 00:42:38,041
Cyanide is very hazardous,
everybody knows.
678
00:42:38,125 --> 00:42:39,583
When cyanide attacks,
679
00:42:39,666 --> 00:42:42,166
even if oxygen is present in the body,
680
00:42:42,250 --> 00:42:45,125
it cannot be utilized by tissues,
that's how the person dies.
681
00:42:45,875 --> 00:42:47,375
Generally speaking,
682
00:42:47,458 --> 00:42:49,916
cyanide poisoning
can mimic a heart attack.
683
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:53,375
If a large quantity
has been administered or ingested,
684
00:42:53,458 --> 00:42:56,625
or that is swallowed,
it will cause the same kind of collapse.
685
00:42:57,208 --> 00:43:03,583
{\an8}However, cyanide is almost impossible
to get by legitimate means in Kerala.
686
00:43:03,666 --> 00:43:06,791
So anybody who wants cyanide
687
00:43:06,875 --> 00:43:08,791
will have to get the license first.
688
00:43:09,458 --> 00:43:15,166
For instance, goldsmiths use
salts of cyanide for polishing the metal.
689
00:43:15,250 --> 00:43:17,833
Now, a person
who wants to kill may not have,
690
00:43:17,916 --> 00:43:20,583
you know, the patience to go hunting
and get hold of cyanide.
691
00:43:21,208 --> 00:43:25,666
As I said, it would be extremely difficult
for Jolly to acquire the cyanide.
692
00:43:25,750 --> 00:43:28,375
So if she did,
how did she possibly get it?
693
00:43:28,458 --> 00:43:30,166
Or who helped her get it?
694
00:43:41,416 --> 00:43:44,875
Losing our father
was very traumatic
695
00:43:44,958 --> 00:43:48,041
as death was the greatest tragedy
of our lives.
696
00:43:49,541 --> 00:43:52,791
The thing is, at that age,
it's really difficult to, you know,
697
00:43:52,875 --> 00:43:57,083
open up to your friends about
your father's death and your feelings
698
00:43:57,166 --> 00:44:00,250
and how hard it is for you to lose
your father at a young age.
699
00:44:01,583 --> 00:44:03,000
We were losing everyone.
700
00:44:03,083 --> 00:44:05,416
First, our grandmother,
then our grandfather,
701
00:44:05,500 --> 00:44:06,958
and now we lost our father.
702
00:44:07,041 --> 00:44:09,875
It was a time of constant grief and loss.
703
00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:13,208
And then gradually, we adjusted to a life
704
00:44:13,291 --> 00:44:15,251
where it was just the three of us
living together.
705
00:44:16,250 --> 00:44:18,750
It was then that the real struggle began.
706
00:44:18,833 --> 00:44:21,625
We had to face life's challenges
one after another
707
00:44:21,708 --> 00:44:23,791
and figure out a way
to cope with everything.
708
00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:40,916
When I went to the panchayat office
to pay the land tax,
709
00:44:41,708 --> 00:44:44,375
{\an8}I found that Jolly had started the process
710
00:44:44,458 --> 00:44:47,416
{\an8}of transferring the house
and property to her name.
711
00:44:48,291 --> 00:44:50,750
Rojo immediately called
to tell me what had happened.
712
00:44:52,083 --> 00:44:53,666
I was shocked, I said,
713
00:44:53,750 --> 00:44:56,291
"How can the ownership
be changed just like that?"
714
00:44:56,375 --> 00:44:59,541
I asked Rojo to find out
what kind of document she had produced
715
00:44:59,625 --> 00:45:01,708
to transfer the ownership to her name.
716
00:45:02,583 --> 00:45:04,291
She had a fake will made.
717
00:45:07,083 --> 00:45:09,666
I saw that
this will included all the details
718
00:45:09,750 --> 00:45:12,250
that I had said were missing
in the previous will.
719
00:45:13,125 --> 00:45:16,291
The ownership that was initially
in the name of Tom Thomas
720
00:45:16,375 --> 00:45:18,375
had been transferred to Roy Thomas,
721
00:45:18,458 --> 00:45:20,791
and from there,
it had been transferred to Jolly Joseph.
722
00:45:20,875 --> 00:45:23,416
This time there was a notary's signature
723
00:45:23,500 --> 00:45:25,916
and all the stamps were in place.
724
00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:29,583
I had told Rojo long back to lock
the previous will away in his cupboard.
725
00:45:29,666 --> 00:45:31,875
Luckily, he still had it.
726
00:45:31,958 --> 00:45:34,500
I told him this one document
is enough to prove
727
00:45:34,583 --> 00:45:36,833
that she's making a false claim.
728
00:45:38,083 --> 00:45:40,625
Rojo said we have to put a stop to this.
729
00:45:40,708 --> 00:45:44,125
We have to transfer the ownership
of the property back in our father's name.
730
00:45:44,208 --> 00:45:48,625
We simply cannot allow Jolly
to illegally lay claim to this property.
731
00:45:48,708 --> 00:45:50,375
We have to get it back somehow.
732
00:45:52,333 --> 00:45:54,166
I called all the elders
of the family
733
00:45:54,250 --> 00:45:56,333
and told them what was going on.
734
00:45:56,416 --> 00:45:58,458
I showed them the previous will.
735
00:45:59,541 --> 00:46:02,208
I told them, "This is the document
that was shown to us
736
00:46:02,291 --> 00:46:04,083
just after our father passed away.
737
00:46:04,875 --> 00:46:08,250
Now take a good look at this document,
did my father come back from the dead
738
00:46:08,333 --> 00:46:10,053
and add all these details
to this new will?"
739
00:46:10,083 --> 00:46:11,500
That's all I asked them.
740
00:46:13,500 --> 00:46:16,458
I went back
to the panchayat office several times
741
00:46:16,541 --> 00:46:19,208
and got everything transferred back
to my father's name.
742
00:46:20,791 --> 00:46:23,333
For the sake of the children,
we didn't sue her then.
743
00:46:23,916 --> 00:46:25,458
My brother had died just a year ago.
744
00:46:25,541 --> 00:46:27,583
If she went to jail,
what would the children do?
745
00:46:28,666 --> 00:46:31,166
So thinking about their future,
we forgave her
746
00:46:31,250 --> 00:46:33,583
and allowed them to stay in that house.
747
00:46:37,375 --> 00:46:39,708
At that time,
my Uncle Mathew Manchadiyil
748
00:46:39,791 --> 00:46:40,791
would call very often
749
00:46:40,833 --> 00:46:42,958
and tell me about everything
that was going on.
750
00:46:43,541 --> 00:46:46,125
And so, uh, Jolly began to realize
751
00:46:46,208 --> 00:46:50,166
that Uncle Manchadiyil and I
shared a close rapport
752
00:46:50,250 --> 00:46:52,958
and that we used to talk
to each other all the time,
753
00:46:53,041 --> 00:46:55,958
sharing our thoughts,
and even discussing Jolly.
754
00:46:57,083 --> 00:47:00,875
He had always been
a bit suspicious of Jolly's behavior.
755
00:47:01,958 --> 00:47:04,375
So, on the day Roy died,
756
00:47:04,958 --> 00:47:09,208
it was Manchadiyil Mathew
who insisted that Roy's body be sent
757
00:47:09,291 --> 00:47:10,416
for the postmortem.
758
00:47:10,500 --> 00:47:14,750
After the postmortem, Manchadiyil Mathew
would keep telling people,
759
00:47:14,833 --> 00:47:16,833
"I don't know what it is,
but something's wrong.
760
00:47:16,916 --> 00:47:18,875
How could Roy die suddenly like that?
761
00:47:18,958 --> 00:47:20,291
Something is very fishy."
762
00:47:23,500 --> 00:47:27,375
But at the same time,
he kept in touch with Jolly, um,
763
00:47:27,458 --> 00:47:30,083
and he was a frequent visitor
at her house.
764
00:47:32,875 --> 00:47:37,333
And that's how he found out that Jolly
was having an affair with M.S. Mathew.
765
00:47:37,416 --> 00:47:39,000
He warned Jolly, telling her
766
00:47:39,083 --> 00:47:43,125
she shouldn't continue the affair
with Mathew, that it wasn't right.
767
00:47:43,208 --> 00:47:44,625
Jolly didn't like his advice.
768
00:47:59,625 --> 00:48:03,125
One day, around 5:30 to 6:00
in the evening,
769
00:48:03,208 --> 00:48:05,666
I suddenly got a call from Jolly.
770
00:48:07,083 --> 00:48:09,541
"Kunjumon Achayan" was the name we had
for Uncle Manchadiyil.
771
00:48:09,625 --> 00:48:11,583
She said, "Kunjumon Achayan is no more."
772
00:48:12,333 --> 00:48:13,875
I said, "Kunjumon Achayan is dead?
773
00:48:13,958 --> 00:48:17,458
I just spoke to him in the afternoon
not more than two hours ago."
774
00:48:17,541 --> 00:48:20,416
"Yes, Renji, I brought him to the hospital
but he passed away.
775
00:48:20,500 --> 00:48:23,125
In fact, I'm calling you
from the hospital."
776
00:48:24,458 --> 00:48:28,250
In 2014 was when Mathew had died
777
00:48:28,333 --> 00:48:31,416
under very similar circumstances as that
778
00:48:31,500 --> 00:48:34,583
of the three people who died initially.
779
00:48:34,666 --> 00:48:36,250
According to the police,
780
00:48:36,333 --> 00:48:39,583
Mathew started becoming a threat to Jolly
781
00:48:39,666 --> 00:48:44,708
and that is when Jolly decided
that Mathew should also be dead.
782
00:48:47,666 --> 00:48:50,666
I haven't seen
any evidence to suggest
783
00:48:50,750 --> 00:48:54,458
that Jolly Joseph administered
any kind of poisonous substance
784
00:48:54,541 --> 00:48:57,208
to murder this person
named Mathew Manchadiyil.
785
00:48:57,291 --> 00:49:00,791
Unfortunately,
no postmortem was conducted.
786
00:49:00,875 --> 00:49:02,333
From what I understand,
787
00:49:03,458 --> 00:49:05,541
there was some kind of rift
or disagreement
788
00:49:05,625 --> 00:49:09,458
between Jolly and Mathew Manchadiyil
since 2011.
789
00:49:09,541 --> 00:49:11,666
Now if that was really the case,
790
00:49:11,750 --> 00:49:16,208
then Mathew Manchadiyil would have avoided
having any kind of contact with Jolly.
791
00:49:16,291 --> 00:49:20,291
Instead, he maintained
a close relationship with her.
792
00:49:29,625 --> 00:49:33,041
When you look at all
six murders in total, you can see
793
00:49:33,791 --> 00:49:37,416
that they've been committed
over a long span of 17 years,
794
00:49:37,500 --> 00:49:41,416
from 2002 to 2019.
795
00:49:42,375 --> 00:49:46,375
From Annamma Thomas's murder
down to the last murder,
796
00:49:46,458 --> 00:49:49,666
the gap between each killing
keeps decreasing.
797
00:49:49,750 --> 00:49:52,250
At first, there's a six-year gap,
798
00:49:52,333 --> 00:49:54,083
then a five-year-gap,
799
00:49:54,166 --> 00:49:55,916
and then it comes down to just two years.
800
00:49:58,250 --> 00:50:01,500
That she took so many years
in between each murder
801
00:50:01,583 --> 00:50:04,625
could have helped her
obfuscate her crimes.
802
00:50:04,708 --> 00:50:07,541
The lady alleged
to have committed the crimes,
803
00:50:08,125 --> 00:50:10,416
I think, did a lot of study
over a period of time
804
00:50:10,500 --> 00:50:13,000
and became more and more perfect
as the time went by.
805
00:50:13,083 --> 00:50:15,083
How to use the poison, how much to use it,
806
00:50:15,166 --> 00:50:16,666
what situation to use it in.
807
00:50:17,666 --> 00:50:21,500
But even though in this particular case,
the alleged perpetrator
808
00:50:21,583 --> 00:50:24,791
did kill a number of people
over a period of time,
809
00:50:24,875 --> 00:50:27,500
she is not the classical serial killer.
810
00:50:27,583 --> 00:50:33,125
Because the motives,
they're completely different.
811
00:50:35,000 --> 00:50:39,083
Serial killers are anyone
who commits more than two murders
812
00:50:39,166 --> 00:50:44,250
and, uh, they commit it
in between having cooling periods.
813
00:50:44,333 --> 00:50:48,375
Uh, serial murders also have
a specific kind of signature
814
00:50:48,458 --> 00:50:51,166
or a pattern that is followed.
815
00:50:53,125 --> 00:50:55,416
As far as Jolly is concerned,
816
00:50:55,500 --> 00:51:00,250
she tried her best to maintain
two versions of herself for so long,
817
00:51:00,333 --> 00:51:02,750
doing what the society expects out of her.
818
00:51:02,833 --> 00:51:04,333
But on the other hand, she is
819
00:51:04,416 --> 00:51:07,916
allegedly planning murders,
committing these acts.
820
00:51:08,833 --> 00:51:12,291
Whether we want to call her
a serial killer or not,
821
00:51:12,375 --> 00:51:17,416
the only consistent thing
is the use of cyanide as poison,
822
00:51:17,500 --> 00:51:22,500
but she also, um, seemed to have
a legitimate motive,
823
00:51:22,583 --> 00:51:23,708
which is financial gain.
824
00:51:25,291 --> 00:51:27,958
She wanted to acquire
her husband's property
825
00:51:28,041 --> 00:51:31,791
and her own family's property
which is understandable.
826
00:51:32,375 --> 00:51:34,666
She dreamed of being well-off.
827
00:51:34,750 --> 00:51:37,500
In fact,
she wanted all the comfort in life.
828
00:51:37,583 --> 00:51:39,666
She wanted to make her life better,
you know.
829
00:51:39,750 --> 00:51:41,500
To make it more... To make it more secure.
830
00:51:41,583 --> 00:51:44,291
But to acquire that, she committed crimes
831
00:51:44,375 --> 00:51:47,541
and she lost track of, uh, reality
832
00:51:47,625 --> 00:51:52,625
and, uh, instead, she slowly slipped
into a world of, uh, fantasy,
833
00:51:52,708 --> 00:51:53,791
which is very unfortunate.
834
00:51:55,541 --> 00:51:59,333
I see Jolly as a woman
who created a wall of her own,
835
00:51:59,416 --> 00:52:00,833
an unrealistic wall,
836
00:52:00,916 --> 00:52:03,375
where she felt she could do
whatever she wanted,
837
00:52:03,458 --> 00:52:06,833
but her actions
had real-life consequences.
838
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:14,458
Jolly's relentless pursuit
of the life she desired was unquenchable.
839
00:52:14,541 --> 00:52:17,083
And with her options
more limited than before,
840
00:52:17,166 --> 00:52:19,000
she began searching for a way forward.
841
00:52:25,208 --> 00:52:28,875
Jolly set her eyes on Shaju
as her second husband.
842
00:52:30,000 --> 00:52:33,875
She told everyone that
if she had a husband like Shaju,
843
00:52:33,958 --> 00:52:36,416
she would be a very happy woman.
844
00:52:38,541 --> 00:52:41,833
Shaju Zacharias
was Roy's first cousin.
845
00:52:41,916 --> 00:52:45,333
Jolly was sure that Shaju would be able
to take care of all her needs.
846
00:52:45,416 --> 00:52:49,833
He had a good job as a teacher
and was financially well-off.
847
00:52:49,916 --> 00:52:53,458
And Jolly didn't want to have
any more responsibilities.
848
00:52:55,541 --> 00:52:57,875
{\an8}I remember Jolly always
used to tell me.
849
00:52:57,958 --> 00:52:59,416
{\an8}"Sili is so lucky.
850
00:52:59,500 --> 00:53:02,125
{\an8}Shaju has a steady job.
She can take it easy.
851
00:53:02,208 --> 00:53:05,708
{\an8}She doesn't have to do much work at home,"
she always used to say this.
852
00:53:06,875 --> 00:53:08,958
Shaju Zacharias had two children.
853
00:53:09,041 --> 00:53:12,375
The elder child was Abel
and the little one was Alphine.
854
00:53:12,458 --> 00:53:14,458
But for Jolly to marry Shaju,
855
00:53:14,541 --> 00:53:16,666
she would have had to get rid of Sili.
856
00:53:17,791 --> 00:53:19,708
She had already killed her husband,
857
00:53:19,791 --> 00:53:23,250
her husband's mother and father,
and then his uncle,
858
00:53:23,333 --> 00:53:25,333
and she'd got away with it.
859
00:53:25,416 --> 00:53:27,541
And now she was planning the next one.
860
00:53:30,041 --> 00:53:32,166
On May 1st, 2014,
861
00:53:32,750 --> 00:53:35,333
the family was celebrating
Abel's first Holy Communion.
862
00:53:35,416 --> 00:53:39,375
Everyone had gathered
at Shaju Zacharias' house for lunch.
863
00:53:39,458 --> 00:53:41,708
And just as everyone
was sitting down to eat,
864
00:53:41,791 --> 00:53:43,750
Jolly and her kids walked in.
865
00:53:45,333 --> 00:53:47,916
We were all invited
to the first Holy Communion,
866
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:49,958
and we were having a really good time.
867
00:53:50,041 --> 00:53:52,500
We told Sili to come
and join us for lunch.
868
00:53:52,583 --> 00:53:55,583
We invited her to come and sit with us
so we could eat together.
869
00:53:55,666 --> 00:53:57,625
The four of us sat down at the table
870
00:53:57,708 --> 00:54:00,250
and we asked them
to start serving the food to everyone.
871
00:54:02,750 --> 00:54:06,208
During this time,
Alphine's aunt was trying to feed her
872
00:54:06,291 --> 00:54:08,166
while holding her in her arms.
873
00:54:09,958 --> 00:54:12,333
And suddenly,
Alphine's body started jerking.
874
00:54:12,416 --> 00:54:15,083
She fell forward
and she was pushing her aunt back.
875
00:54:15,166 --> 00:54:17,875
It was like she was trying to jump
out of her aunt's arms.
876
00:54:17,958 --> 00:54:19,375
Even though I was in shock,
877
00:54:19,458 --> 00:54:22,750
I could clearly see
that Alphine's pupils were disappearing.
878
00:54:22,833 --> 00:54:23,750
They were moving...
879
00:54:23,833 --> 00:54:26,375
I mean her eyeballs were moving upwards.
880
00:54:28,250 --> 00:54:30,625
Everyone went running
towards the child.
881
00:54:30,708 --> 00:54:32,291
There was complete panic.
882
00:54:32,375 --> 00:54:34,000
No one knew what had happened.
883
00:54:34,083 --> 00:54:35,500
When the child fell unconscious,
884
00:54:35,583 --> 00:54:38,791
Sili got so upset, she went into shock.
885
00:54:39,958 --> 00:54:42,458
They rushed her
to Omassery Hospital.
886
00:54:43,291 --> 00:54:46,250
Uh, the doctors there said
her condition was critical
887
00:54:46,333 --> 00:54:48,750
and they shifted her to, uh, a ventilator.
888
00:54:56,000 --> 00:54:58,666
{\an8}At the time, the family
believed Alphine had choked
889
00:54:58,750 --> 00:55:00,666
{\an8}on the food her aunt was feeding her.
890
00:55:00,750 --> 00:55:04,958
But to learn that a two-year-old child
had been poisoned was just horrific.
891
00:55:05,041 --> 00:55:07,416
Jolly was not just a woman, but a mother.
892
00:55:07,500 --> 00:55:09,291
How could someone with her background
893
00:55:09,375 --> 00:55:12,291
callously murder a baby
and feel no remorse?
894
00:55:13,250 --> 00:55:14,708
She was a two-year-old child.
895
00:55:14,791 --> 00:55:17,375
That, you know, brings to question
896
00:55:17,458 --> 00:55:20,708
the basic humanity of the person
who committed this.
897
00:55:20,791 --> 00:55:26,083
Women are looked up to
as mothers, as nurturers, as caregivers.
898
00:55:26,166 --> 00:55:30,958
And the fact that a woman
is capable of killing an innocent child
899
00:55:31,041 --> 00:55:34,500
shatters that belief system
to the, uh, to the core.
900
00:55:36,125 --> 00:55:39,250
Alphines case
has left everyone baffled
901
00:55:39,333 --> 00:55:43,541
because why would Jolly kill
an innocent little child?
902
00:55:43,625 --> 00:55:45,541
What could her motive possibly be?
903
00:55:46,125 --> 00:55:48,875
I pushed her by repeatedly
asking her this question,
904
00:55:48,958 --> 00:55:51,958
"Jolly, why would you want to
kill an innocent child?"
905
00:55:52,041 --> 00:55:54,166
To my question, Jolly replied,
906
00:55:54,250 --> 00:56:00,666
"Tell me what would I achieve by taking
the life of an innocent little child?
907
00:56:01,750 --> 00:56:03,875
The child wouldn't have got in the way
of my marriage.
908
00:56:03,958 --> 00:56:05,125
She was a minor."
909
00:56:06,291 --> 00:56:08,208
Even if she had killed the mother,
910
00:56:08,291 --> 00:56:10,875
she could have gotten married
and brought up the little child.
911
00:56:10,958 --> 00:56:14,041
Why kill the child when she could
easily take care of her?
912
00:56:14,125 --> 00:56:15,958
That's why I strongly believe that
913
00:56:16,041 --> 00:56:18,666
the truth behind this case
lies somewhere else.
914
00:56:27,750 --> 00:56:31,083
After Alphine's death in 2014,
915
00:56:31,166 --> 00:56:33,125
Sili began to struggle.
916
00:56:33,208 --> 00:56:36,208
She went into a severe mental depression.
917
00:56:38,041 --> 00:56:41,458
It was during this time
that Jolly befriended Sili
918
00:56:41,541 --> 00:56:43,416
and they became very close.
919
00:56:44,708 --> 00:56:46,875
Jolly had taken the initiative.
920
00:56:47,458 --> 00:56:48,833
Soon, Sili started telling Jolly
921
00:56:48,916 --> 00:56:50,791
everything about her and Shaju.
922
00:56:50,875 --> 00:56:52,958
She mentioned
that they wanted another child
923
00:56:53,041 --> 00:56:54,625
and during one of these chats,
924
00:56:54,708 --> 00:56:58,166
she just happened to mention
that they wanted another baby girl.
925
00:56:59,041 --> 00:57:01,375
Then Jolly suddenly tells Sili,
926
00:57:01,458 --> 00:57:04,208
"My father-in-law used to take
this particular capsule."
927
00:57:06,500 --> 00:57:09,750
Jolly persuaded Sili
to buy the mushroom capsules
928
00:57:09,833 --> 00:57:12,833
saying that they are good
for her overall health.
929
00:57:12,916 --> 00:57:15,458
And that they are particularly good
at providing relief
930
00:57:15,541 --> 00:57:17,791
from fatigue and depression.
931
00:57:22,000 --> 00:57:24,000
The last in this case was Sili,
932
00:57:24,083 --> 00:57:25,958
who was Shaju's wife.
933
00:57:26,041 --> 00:57:30,708
Shaju's wife actually died
while she was waiting at the reception
934
00:57:30,791 --> 00:57:34,833
of a dental hospital or a dental clinic
in Thamarassery.
935
00:57:34,916 --> 00:57:37,041
Shaju was also there, Sili was there,
936
00:57:37,125 --> 00:57:38,916
and also Jolly was there.
937
00:57:39,000 --> 00:57:43,291
Sili and Jolly were sitting outside,
in the visitor's... visitor's room.
938
00:57:43,375 --> 00:57:46,000
Not really a room, but a hall of sorts.
939
00:57:46,083 --> 00:57:47,166
They were waiting there.
940
00:57:47,916 --> 00:57:50,916
Now Jolly already had
a mushroom capsule ready
941
00:57:51,000 --> 00:57:52,166
filled with cyanide.
942
00:57:52,250 --> 00:57:53,791
She handed it to Sili and said,
943
00:57:53,875 --> 00:57:56,500
"Take this mushroom capsule,
you'll feel better."
944
00:57:56,583 --> 00:57:58,625
Sili believed her and took it.
945
00:57:59,750 --> 00:58:03,291
As soon as she took it,
her body began to jerk.
946
00:58:03,375 --> 00:58:05,375
She fell backwards almost immediately.
947
00:58:09,916 --> 00:58:11,666
After Sili passed away,
948
00:58:11,750 --> 00:58:15,083
the doctors at this hospital
where Sili was admitted told me
949
00:58:15,166 --> 00:58:18,750
that they had insisted on a postmortem.
950
00:58:19,375 --> 00:58:23,958
So at that time,
Shaju outrightly refused a postmortem.
951
00:58:24,041 --> 00:58:26,291
He said that postmortem is not required
952
00:58:26,916 --> 00:58:31,041
and he said that postmortems
are not common in our families.
953
00:58:32,875 --> 00:58:34,416
As a lawyer,
954
00:58:34,500 --> 00:58:40,583
I have to wonder if it was actually
the 13th witness in this case, Shaju,
955
00:58:40,666 --> 00:58:44,708
who really wanted to eliminate
his first wife Sili,
956
00:58:44,791 --> 00:58:46,041
and his child Alphine.
957
00:58:46,708 --> 00:58:51,875
As we investigate this case further,
we start to look at other evidence.
958
00:58:51,958 --> 00:58:55,791
We can see another scenario
where Shaju is probably the one
959
00:58:55,875 --> 00:58:57,583
who killed his wife and child,
960
00:58:57,666 --> 00:59:00,291
so he could get married
to Jolly unhindered.
961
00:59:07,291 --> 00:59:09,208
Then I heard about Sili's death,
962
00:59:09,291 --> 00:59:11,458
I made a point to go to her funeral.
963
00:59:11,541 --> 00:59:15,083
Because I hadn't been able to visit
when she'd lost her child.
964
00:59:15,166 --> 00:59:17,458
I felt like I must go this time.
965
00:59:18,666 --> 00:59:21,833
When Jolly saw me arrive,
she came out of the house and said,
966
00:59:21,916 --> 00:59:23,708
"Come in, Sili's body is inside."
967
00:59:23,791 --> 00:59:26,375
I looked at Sili lying in her coffin.
968
00:59:28,208 --> 00:59:31,500
I told Jolly she looked so beautiful
as if she's sleeping.
969
00:59:32,416 --> 00:59:35,333
And she said, "Yes, Renji,
but what can be done?
970
00:59:35,416 --> 00:59:37,250
It's just so unfortunate."
971
00:59:37,833 --> 00:59:41,958
And then she said, "I'm going to get
her body ready for the next ritual."
972
00:59:42,041 --> 00:59:44,000
And I said, "Yes, please carry on."
973
00:59:45,541 --> 00:59:48,541
I watched Jolly tend
to Sili's body in the coffin.
974
00:59:48,625 --> 00:59:52,541
Jolly was taking care of everything
during Sili's funeral.
975
00:59:53,125 --> 00:59:54,541
Sili's brother was there too,
976
00:59:54,625 --> 00:59:58,375
but it was Jolly who ordered him
to get the candles, to get the flowers.
977
00:59:58,458 --> 01:00:01,416
It was Jolly who prepared
and arranged for everything.
978
01:00:02,625 --> 01:00:04,083
As I was watching her,
979
01:00:04,166 --> 01:00:08,166
I felt mentally disturbed
about what was going on.
980
01:00:09,500 --> 01:00:11,750
My eyes moved away
from Sili's body
981
01:00:11,833 --> 01:00:13,875
and I started watching Jolly
982
01:00:13,958 --> 01:00:16,875
who was moving around
tending to Sili's body,
983
01:00:16,958 --> 01:00:19,208
picking up a flower here,
placing it there.
984
01:00:19,291 --> 01:00:20,916
I looked at Jolly's face
985
01:00:21,000 --> 01:00:23,666
and I felt there was
something strange about it.
986
01:00:23,750 --> 01:00:26,833
Um, I sense that there was
something different about them.
987
01:00:27,541 --> 01:00:32,625
By different, I mean, uh,
I felt that deep inside, Jolly was happy.
988
01:00:34,458 --> 01:00:38,583
And somehow, this was reflected
on her face, her expression.
989
01:00:38,666 --> 01:00:40,250
I could feel it.
990
01:00:46,291 --> 01:00:48,375
I just stood there stunned.
991
01:00:50,125 --> 01:00:52,250
A thought suddenly struck my mind.
992
01:00:53,750 --> 01:00:58,375
"Had Jolly taken Sili out of the equation
so that she could be with Shaju?
993
01:00:58,458 --> 01:01:00,833
Did Jolly kill Sili?"
994
01:01:00,916 --> 01:01:04,291
This horrifying thought began
to haunt me all the time,
995
01:01:04,375 --> 01:01:06,083
it was very disturbing.
996
01:01:06,666 --> 01:01:09,541
Then I thought that maybe the baby
had also been an obstacle.
997
01:01:09,625 --> 01:01:13,666
Because even after getting rid of Sili,
a little two-year-old child
998
01:01:13,750 --> 01:01:15,541
would have been a burden for Jolly.
999
01:01:19,541 --> 01:01:22,416
I just knew that something was not right.
1000
01:01:27,208 --> 01:01:30,166
Time went by
and, uh, a whole year passed
1001
01:01:30,250 --> 01:01:32,208
after Sili Auntie's death.
1002
01:01:32,291 --> 01:01:37,458
And everyone, uh, mourn her passing
on her first death anniversary.
1003
01:01:37,541 --> 01:01:39,708
Then one day, Amma called me
1004
01:01:39,791 --> 01:01:42,958
and she said she had
some personal news to give me.
1005
01:01:43,041 --> 01:01:44,721
She said that she had received a proposal.
1006
01:01:47,750 --> 01:01:51,416
She said, "Kariachan Pappan
had bought a marriage proposal
1007
01:01:51,500 --> 01:01:55,041
and he was suggesting that Shaju and I
1008
01:01:55,125 --> 01:01:57,375
should get married
and settle down together."
1009
01:01:57,458 --> 01:02:02,083
And then she asked me
if she should accept the proposal or not.
1010
01:02:02,708 --> 01:02:06,791
She was just asking me
as a formality, nothing else.
1011
01:02:06,875 --> 01:02:09,875
It was a way for her to get my approval.
1012
01:02:11,791 --> 01:02:15,125
If my mother and Shaju
wanted to get married to each other,
1013
01:02:15,208 --> 01:02:17,458
I wasn't going to be the one
to stand in their way.
1014
01:02:17,541 --> 01:02:21,166
And that's how I felt about it
at that time.
1015
01:02:27,791 --> 01:02:30,541
By now I'd realized
that Jolly always had
1016
01:02:30,625 --> 01:02:33,416
every intention
of getting married to Shaju.
1017
01:02:34,041 --> 01:02:36,875
And once the two of them made it official,
1018
01:02:36,958 --> 01:02:39,333
it became clear
that she had achieved her goal.
1019
01:02:43,958 --> 01:02:48,291
I always used to tell Rojo,
there is a verse in the bible that says,
1020
01:02:48,916 --> 01:02:52,500
"Whatever is done in the dark
will come to light someday."
1021
01:02:52,583 --> 01:02:55,041
I said, "Whatever she's hiding
from all of us,
1022
01:02:55,125 --> 01:02:59,083
it's all going to come out
into the open someday, at the right time.
1023
01:02:59,166 --> 01:03:01,791
You wait and see,"
that's what I told Rojo.
1024
01:03:02,416 --> 01:03:05,916
I truly believe that no matter how clever
a criminal might have been
1025
01:03:06,000 --> 01:03:07,833
covering all her crimes,
1026
01:03:07,916 --> 01:03:09,625
however brilliant she may be,
1027
01:03:09,708 --> 01:03:13,583
God will make sure that she leaves
some evidence behind,
1028
01:03:13,666 --> 01:03:15,166
and there will be justice.
1029
01:03:17,375 --> 01:03:19,166
And that's when I decided
1030
01:03:19,250 --> 01:03:22,083
that I was going to do
something about this.
1031
01:03:22,166 --> 01:03:26,000
I told Rojo that I wanted
a copy of Roy's postmortem report.
1032
01:03:27,791 --> 01:03:30,166
When I looked at Roy's death certificate,
1033
01:03:30,250 --> 01:03:35,916
I noticed that the time of death recorded
was 11:20 p.m. late at night.
1034
01:03:36,916 --> 01:03:40,083
We know that cyanide immediately
shuts down respiration
1035
01:03:40,166 --> 01:03:42,375
by stopping the body from using oxygen.
1036
01:03:43,000 --> 01:03:47,541
I noticed that the food he had last eaten,
the rice and the chickpea curry,
1037
01:03:47,625 --> 01:03:49,791
was still undigested.
1038
01:03:49,875 --> 01:03:54,208
It was through this food
that the substance had entered his body.
1039
01:03:54,958 --> 01:03:59,375
Then a conversation I had with Jolly
suddenly came back to me.
1040
01:03:59,458 --> 01:04:02,416
I had come home after Roy'd passed away.
1041
01:04:02,500 --> 01:04:05,916
I was just talking casually
with Jolly the next day
1042
01:04:06,000 --> 01:04:07,875
and I remember asking her,
1043
01:04:07,958 --> 01:04:10,791
"What was the last thing
that Roy ate yesterday?"
1044
01:04:11,375 --> 01:04:14,375
And Jolly said, "Roy had a plate of rice
and chickpea curry.
1045
01:04:14,458 --> 01:04:15,708
He used to love that curry.
1046
01:04:15,791 --> 01:04:17,625
It used to be his favorite dish.
1047
01:04:17,708 --> 01:04:19,166
I asked, "What time did he eat?"
1048
01:04:19,250 --> 01:04:22,541
She said, "He ate around 2:30 to 3:00
in the afternoon."
1049
01:04:23,333 --> 01:04:26,041
She also said,
"He didn't have dinner that night."
1050
01:04:26,875 --> 01:04:31,125
Now, while I was reading all the details
written down in the postmortem report.
1051
01:04:31,708 --> 01:04:36,958
This conversation kept coming back
repeatedly in my mind.
1052
01:04:37,041 --> 01:04:39,333
Especially these particular words.
1053
01:04:41,041 --> 01:04:43,375
"He didn't have dinner that night."
1054
01:04:44,041 --> 01:04:47,125
It was as if a lightning bolt
went through my body.
1055
01:04:47,208 --> 01:04:49,833
I literally had shivers down my spine.
1056
01:04:49,916 --> 01:04:52,000
I quickly looked at the report again.
1057
01:04:53,208 --> 01:04:54,708
Oh, my god.
1058
01:04:54,791 --> 01:04:58,000
This does not match
what she told me that day.
1059
01:04:58,083 --> 01:04:59,875
This report says something different.
1060
01:05:00,833 --> 01:05:02,916
He did not eat this for lunch.
1061
01:05:03,708 --> 01:05:06,750
Because the body didn't get enough time
to digest the food.
1062
01:05:06,833 --> 01:05:10,250
And since the time of death was 11:20 p.m...
1063
01:05:12,041 --> 01:05:14,000
Roy had definitely eaten dinner.
1064
01:05:14,750 --> 01:05:16,916
And that's when I realized
1065
01:05:17,000 --> 01:05:19,333
that Jolly was behind all the deaths.
1066
01:05:26,500 --> 01:05:29,875
I went to meet K.G. Simon Sir
at his house in Thodupuzha.
1067
01:05:29,958 --> 01:05:32,583
I sat there for three hours
telling him everything
1068
01:05:32,666 --> 01:05:34,458
that had happened in the last few years.
1069
01:05:34,541 --> 01:05:37,000
I told him about the sequence of deaths
1070
01:05:37,083 --> 01:05:40,083
and about my suspicions after reading
the postmortem report.
1071
01:05:40,166 --> 01:05:41,333
I told him everything.
1072
01:05:41,916 --> 01:05:44,083
Sir said, "Renji, we will look into it.
1073
01:05:44,166 --> 01:05:46,333
It's a lot of work
but we'll investigate it."
1074
01:05:48,333 --> 01:05:50,458
{\an8}So we started
by transferring the case
1075
01:05:50,541 --> 01:05:52,083
{\an8}to the crime branch.
1076
01:05:52,166 --> 01:05:56,166
We put a team of ten people together
and proceeded to open the investigation.
1077
01:05:56,750 --> 01:05:59,833
She presented herself
as a teacher to everyone,
1078
01:05:59,916 --> 01:06:02,458
a teacher from NIT, at least.
1079
01:06:02,958 --> 01:06:04,916
That's how she introduced herself.
1080
01:06:06,958 --> 01:06:11,416
So it was very important
that we carry out an investigation at NIT.
1081
01:06:11,500 --> 01:06:14,583
{\an8}The investigation team
arrived here on August 20th.
1082
01:06:14,666 --> 01:06:18,416
They asked us to check the records
and see if this lady had worked here
1083
01:06:18,500 --> 01:06:20,916
on a permanent or temporary basis.
1084
01:06:21,000 --> 01:06:24,458
We then went through all the records,
all the way back to the year 2000.
1085
01:06:24,541 --> 01:06:27,791
We gave it in writing
that no such woman with that name
1086
01:06:27,875 --> 01:06:29,458
had ever been employed here.
1087
01:06:32,375 --> 01:06:34,791
He said,
"There's no such person here.
1088
01:06:34,875 --> 01:06:37,625
No such woman has ever worked here
on a temporary
1089
01:06:37,708 --> 01:06:40,166
or even a daily wage basis."
1090
01:06:41,041 --> 01:06:43,416
But Jolly always had an ID card
around her neck.
1091
01:06:43,500 --> 01:06:45,208
We have a photo of it.
1092
01:06:45,291 --> 01:06:48,250
That was the source of confusion
for everyone.
1093
01:06:48,875 --> 01:06:50,416
So Jolly destroyed the ID card.
1094
01:06:52,333 --> 01:06:54,375
Even though she wasn't a professor,
1095
01:06:54,458 --> 01:06:57,375
we expected her
to have some similar qualifications.
1096
01:06:57,458 --> 01:06:59,333
She didn't even have that.
1097
01:06:59,416 --> 01:07:01,541
But Jolly Joseph
had certificates showing
1098
01:07:01,625 --> 01:07:04,791
that she had passed the Bachelor's
and Master's degree in Commerce
1099
01:07:04,875 --> 01:07:07,208
and other professional qualifications.
1100
01:07:08,625 --> 01:07:11,916
When we investigated
the authenticity of the certificates.
1101
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:14,791
We discovered that those certificates
1102
01:07:14,875 --> 01:07:16,583
belonged to someone else.
1103
01:07:18,208 --> 01:07:20,125
So how did she manage to do this?
1104
01:07:21,625 --> 01:07:27,500
Tom Thomas was an Administrative Assistant
in the education department.
1105
01:07:27,583 --> 01:07:30,333
After his retirement,
he opened up a consultancy,
1106
01:07:30,416 --> 01:07:32,375
it was an educational consultancy.
1107
01:07:32,458 --> 01:07:36,375
Now, a lot of students
used to send photocopies
1108
01:07:36,458 --> 01:07:38,541
of their certificates
1109
01:07:38,625 --> 01:07:40,416
to his consultancy firm.
1110
01:07:40,500 --> 01:07:44,333
Jolly knew about this
so she went into his office
1111
01:07:44,416 --> 01:07:46,958
and took a couple of certificates,
1112
01:07:47,041 --> 01:07:49,666
she erased the name
and marks from the certificate
1113
01:07:49,750 --> 01:07:53,083
and then added her name
and the marks that she wanted.
1114
01:07:53,166 --> 01:07:55,958
Then she made photocopies
and put them away.
1115
01:07:57,125 --> 01:07:59,958
Every single thing
that Jolly ever said was a lie.
1116
01:08:00,041 --> 01:08:02,916
During our investigation,
we found that Jolly had only
1117
01:08:03,000 --> 01:08:04,291
studied up to her pre-degree
1118
01:08:04,375 --> 01:08:06,215
and this was a very crucial
detail in the case.
1119
01:08:15,250 --> 01:08:18,833
I had decided to go to Shimla
to pursue my college degree.
1120
01:08:19,875 --> 01:08:23,541
But, uh, since it was so far away,
I couldn't go home very often.
1121
01:08:23,625 --> 01:08:26,000
And then one day, my mother called me up
1122
01:08:26,083 --> 01:08:28,958
to say that there's a legal document
that's been delivered to our home.
1123
01:08:30,000 --> 01:08:32,125
The document said
that there had been six deaths
1124
01:08:32,208 --> 01:08:33,666
in the Ponnamattam family
1125
01:08:33,750 --> 01:08:35,875
and that they were suspicious.
1126
01:08:35,958 --> 01:08:38,916
And that, uh, there was
a newfound evidence
1127
01:08:39,000 --> 01:08:41,875
that had led them
to reinvestigate the case.
1128
01:08:41,958 --> 01:08:43,708
And they were convinced that
1129
01:08:43,791 --> 01:08:47,666
Jolly was the chief suspect
behind this string of crimes
1130
01:08:47,750 --> 01:08:49,390
and this was based on a written petition.
1131
01:08:50,541 --> 01:08:53,541
It turned out that the petition
had been filed
1132
01:08:53,625 --> 01:08:55,833
by my paternal uncle and aunt.
1133
01:08:55,916 --> 01:08:59,458
My mother was informed of this
by the Thamarassery police
1134
01:08:59,541 --> 01:09:02,000
when they... when they delivered
the document.
1135
01:09:02,583 --> 01:09:06,166
It was around this time
that my mother started calling me
1136
01:09:06,250 --> 01:09:09,416
and she was telling me
that we have to get rid of this case.
1137
01:09:09,500 --> 01:09:13,041
"Please, you have to ask them
to withdraw this case."
1138
01:09:13,125 --> 01:09:14,458
It was unbelievable.
1139
01:09:14,541 --> 01:09:18,041
Unbelievable that one person
could commit so many murders.
1140
01:09:18,125 --> 01:09:20,375
It was something we only saw
in the movies.
1141
01:09:20,458 --> 01:09:23,000
We never heard
of such a thing in real life.
1142
01:09:23,708 --> 01:09:26,083
And so I believed
what Jolly told me.
1143
01:09:27,541 --> 01:09:31,375
Later, uh, I called up my paternal aunt
and told her that,
1144
01:09:31,458 --> 01:09:34,375
"Look, if there's no concrete evidence
1145
01:09:34,458 --> 01:09:36,875
then maybe we should just
close this case, maybe."
1146
01:09:36,958 --> 01:09:41,000
Because I'm facing a lot of issues
and it's been mentally disturbing for me.
1147
01:09:42,250 --> 01:09:45,000
He said, "My mother says
when these deaths took place
1148
01:09:45,083 --> 01:09:47,541
everyone was present, it wasn't just her."
1149
01:09:47,625 --> 01:09:49,750
He said, "Tell Uncle that my mother said
1150
01:09:49,833 --> 01:09:52,333
she's going to file
a defamation case against him
1151
01:09:52,416 --> 01:09:54,291
if he doesn't stop
and take the case back."
1152
01:09:54,833 --> 01:09:56,916
Then my aunt got very
emotional and said that,
1153
01:09:57,000 --> 01:09:58,875
"Remo, you don't know the half of it.
1154
01:09:58,958 --> 01:10:00,666
These deaths are very suspicious.
1155
01:10:00,750 --> 01:10:03,083
Uh, and we have
a lot of doubts about them."
1156
01:10:04,291 --> 01:10:06,875
I said, "Remo, son,
1157
01:10:06,958 --> 01:10:10,750
you can call me all you want
but I'm not going to change my mind."
1158
01:10:10,833 --> 01:10:14,291
I remember speaking to him
in a very stern tone of voice.
1159
01:10:14,375 --> 01:10:15,750
I told him very clearly that,
1160
01:10:16,333 --> 01:10:19,375
"Come what may,
I'm not going to withdraw my complaint."
1161
01:10:35,625 --> 01:10:40,041
Then one day, an article came out
in the, uh, in the newspaper.
1162
01:10:41,125 --> 01:10:44,375
One of my friends took a photo
of the news article
1163
01:10:44,458 --> 01:10:46,583
and he had sent it to me.
1164
01:10:46,666 --> 01:10:49,625
{\an8}On Friday, the crime branch
will open the graves of six people
1165
01:10:49,708 --> 01:10:52,708
{\an8}who died mysteriously in Koodathayi
and conduct forensic analysis.
1166
01:10:52,791 --> 01:10:55,875
{\an8}The police has the district
administration's permission to do this.
1167
01:10:55,958 --> 01:10:58,458
A shocking story
is emerging out of Koodathayi.
1168
01:10:58,541 --> 01:11:02,250
Six members of a family named Ponnamattam
1169
01:11:02,333 --> 01:11:03,916
are suspected to have been murdered
1170
01:11:04,000 --> 01:11:05,708
between 2002 and 2016.
1171
01:11:05,791 --> 01:11:08,291
On TV channels, it was written as, uh,
1172
01:11:08,375 --> 01:11:10,875
"Deaths by the Koodathayi serial murderer.
1173
01:11:10,958 --> 01:11:12,142
The police are investigating."
1174
01:11:12,166 --> 01:11:15,458
{\an8}In a span of 14 years,
six mysterious deaths.
1175
01:11:16,708 --> 01:11:19,083
All the TV channels
were showing our house
1176
01:11:19,166 --> 01:11:21,875
saying that six deaths had occurred there.
1177
01:11:21,958 --> 01:11:23,541
The news spread like wildfire.
1178
01:11:23,625 --> 01:11:26,545
My friends started calling and asking me,
"Remo, what's happening inside?"
1179
01:11:26,625 --> 01:11:28,750
I said, "I have no idea
what's going on over there."
1180
01:11:30,208 --> 01:11:33,500
I was traveling
from Shimla to, uh, Delhi
1181
01:11:33,583 --> 01:11:38,500
because my connecting flight to Kerala
was from Delhi.
1182
01:11:38,583 --> 01:11:40,666
And I was continuously listening
to the news
1183
01:11:40,750 --> 01:11:44,208
trying to keep up with what was happening
at home at that time.
1184
01:11:44,291 --> 01:11:47,000
The police are investigating
the murders that took place
1185
01:11:47,083 --> 01:11:48,708
at Koodathayi.
1186
01:11:48,791 --> 01:11:51,000
{\an8}We need to determine
if there was any foul play
1187
01:11:51,083 --> 01:11:53,333
{\an8}and we have our own methods
of finding that out.
1188
01:11:58,875 --> 01:12:01,583
This is the first time
in the history of Kerala Police
1189
01:12:01,666 --> 01:12:04,625
that six bodies have been exhumed
at the same time.
1190
01:12:04,708 --> 01:12:07,750
Only those who are required
to be present should enter.
1191
01:12:10,500 --> 01:12:13,125
When you exhume a body after six years,
1192
01:12:13,208 --> 01:12:15,541
then there's no guarantee
1193
01:12:15,625 --> 01:12:18,250
that you'll find any trace
of cyanide in it.
1194
01:12:18,333 --> 01:12:20,291
You may find it but not for sure.
1195
01:12:23,166 --> 01:12:25,875
The problem in this series of cases
1196
01:12:25,958 --> 01:12:29,125
is no doubt going to be
the chemical analysis.
1197
01:12:29,708 --> 01:12:33,041
Only in one case,
the autopsy was done on time,
1198
01:12:33,125 --> 01:12:35,916
maybe within a few hours or a day,
1199
01:12:36,000 --> 01:12:38,833
chemical analysis was done
and cyanide was detected.
1200
01:12:39,958 --> 01:12:42,750
Now we have a series
of five dead bodies,
1201
01:12:43,333 --> 01:12:45,625
where we have to prove
the presence of cyanide,
1202
01:12:45,708 --> 01:12:49,791
and some of these are buried
for more than a decade.
1203
01:12:50,958 --> 01:12:54,791
I think it is virtually like hunting
for a needle in a haystack,
1204
01:12:54,875 --> 01:12:55,791
trying to find
1205
01:12:55,875 --> 01:12:59,416
cyanide in a decomposing
or decomposed body.
1206
01:13:01,791 --> 01:13:04,291
When news spread
that the bodies were being exhumed,
1207
01:13:04,375 --> 01:13:06,208
everyone was furious with us.
1208
01:13:06,291 --> 01:13:07,500
There was a lot of pressure,
1209
01:13:07,583 --> 01:13:10,500
from my mother's side of the family
and father's side of the family.
1210
01:13:10,583 --> 01:13:13,000
They even called a meeting
to try and stop us.
1211
01:13:13,083 --> 01:13:15,125
Uh, I heard that they had
actually talked about
1212
01:13:15,208 --> 01:13:18,291
summoning Rojo to the house
and breaking his legs.
1213
01:13:25,958 --> 01:13:29,833
A lot of people had gathered
to watch the exhumation.
1214
01:13:29,916 --> 01:13:31,833
{\an8}And since they didn't know
the reason for it,
1215
01:13:31,916 --> 01:13:34,916
{\an8}they felt a lot of anger and resentment
towards Rojo and me.
1216
01:13:35,000 --> 01:13:36,680
They kept asking, "Why are you doing this?
1217
01:13:36,708 --> 01:13:39,041
What are you going to get out of it?"
1218
01:13:39,125 --> 01:13:41,458
I was just standing there
watching the crowd
1219
01:13:41,541 --> 01:13:43,625
when I heard someone say,
"Poor Thomas Sir,
1220
01:13:43,708 --> 01:13:45,750
they won't even leave him alone in death.
1221
01:13:45,833 --> 01:13:47,833
They won't let him rest in peace."
1222
01:13:48,500 --> 01:13:50,958
I know what I'm doing is absolutely wrong.
1223
01:13:51,041 --> 01:13:53,500
I know everybody will say this.
1224
01:13:53,583 --> 01:13:56,208
They'll say that this is
the biggest blunder I'll ever make.
1225
01:13:56,291 --> 01:13:57,916
But I told them clearly,
1226
01:13:58,000 --> 01:14:00,708
"I know my parents are with me.
I know," I told them.
1227
01:14:01,791 --> 01:14:03,083
I have a mission.
1228
01:14:08,666 --> 01:14:11,750
So I didn't pay any attention
to the crowd gathered around
1229
01:14:11,833 --> 01:14:13,583
and I ignored their comments.
1230
01:14:23,041 --> 01:14:26,666
When I got home that evening,
uh, there was no one there
1231
01:14:26,750 --> 01:14:28,291
except for my brother.
1232
01:14:29,875 --> 01:14:32,125
Then Jolly arrived home
a little bit later.
1233
01:14:32,208 --> 01:14:35,166
One look at her face
and I knew she was in trouble.
1234
01:14:35,250 --> 01:14:37,583
She looked completely exhausted
and almost...
1235
01:14:37,666 --> 01:14:38,791
almost panic-stricken.
1236
01:14:38,875 --> 01:14:40,750
Deep down, she was full of fear.
1237
01:14:40,833 --> 01:14:42,708
She was absolutely terrified at that time.
1238
01:14:42,791 --> 01:14:44,875
I told Jolly that I needed
to speak with her
1239
01:14:44,958 --> 01:14:47,798
and I needed to know what's going on
so both of us went to another room.
1240
01:14:49,583 --> 01:14:52,625
As soon as we entered the room,
I turned around and asked her,
1241
01:14:52,708 --> 01:14:54,166
"What is going on?"
1242
01:14:54,250 --> 01:14:57,416
I was really upset that time
and I told her that,
1243
01:14:57,500 --> 01:14:59,958
"All the news channels
are pointing their fingers at you,
1244
01:15:00,041 --> 01:15:01,321
saying that you're the culprit."
1245
01:15:01,916 --> 01:15:03,750
Then I asked her very sternly,
1246
01:15:03,833 --> 01:15:05,708
"Did you make any mistakes in the past?
1247
01:15:05,791 --> 01:15:07,458
Did you have a hand in these murders?"
1248
01:15:07,541 --> 01:15:09,166
She's started crying and protesting.
1249
01:15:09,250 --> 01:15:12,250
And I remember there was
complete panic in her voice.
1250
01:15:12,333 --> 01:15:14,684
But she said, "I didn't have anything
to do with their deaths.
1251
01:15:14,708 --> 01:15:16,375
I'm completely innocent."
1252
01:15:16,458 --> 01:15:18,375
I told her,
"I want you to tell me the truth
1253
01:15:18,458 --> 01:15:19,938
and I want you to tell me everything.
1254
01:15:20,000 --> 01:15:22,125
Every single detail
of what had actually happened.
1255
01:15:22,208 --> 01:15:25,791
You've definitely done something
and I want you to tell me what you did."
1256
01:15:25,875 --> 01:15:29,916
And I finally managed to, uh,
break her down a little.
1257
01:15:30,000 --> 01:15:32,166
And then in a very feeble voice,
she admitted that,
1258
01:15:32,250 --> 01:15:34,083
"Hmm, I may have made a few mistakes."
1259
01:15:34,166 --> 01:15:36,916
I asked her again,
"Tell me, did you commit these murders?
1260
01:15:37,000 --> 01:15:39,500
I think it's time you tell me
everything that you have done."
1261
01:15:44,375 --> 01:15:46,708
I was at a relative's house
in Kozhikode
1262
01:15:46,791 --> 01:15:49,000
when Remo called me.
1263
01:15:50,083 --> 01:15:53,083
I asked him, "What's wrong, son?
What happened?"
1264
01:15:54,916 --> 01:15:56,708
"This woman killed everyone."
1265
01:15:59,625 --> 01:16:01,208
This is what he told me.
1266
01:16:01,791 --> 01:16:04,416
Then I asked him, "How do you know?
1267
01:16:05,166 --> 01:16:06,833
Who told you about this, son?"
1268
01:16:07,833 --> 01:16:09,375
"She told me herself."
1269
01:16:11,375 --> 01:16:13,333
"Call the police right now, Auntie."
1270
01:16:13,416 --> 01:16:15,875
"Call the police and get her arrested."
1271
01:16:18,125 --> 01:16:20,291
I quickly realized
that the rest of the cyanide
1272
01:16:20,375 --> 01:16:21,583
was still in the house.
1273
01:16:21,666 --> 01:16:24,041
Just a small amount was enough
for the two boys.
1274
01:16:24,666 --> 01:16:28,083
I told him, "Grab a piece of cloth
or bed sheet and stuff it in your mouth,
1275
01:16:28,166 --> 01:16:29,625
and don't fall asleep.
1276
01:16:29,708 --> 01:16:31,916
Make sure nothing goes into your mouth.
1277
01:16:32,000 --> 01:16:33,750
Don't eat or drink anything there."
1278
01:16:33,833 --> 01:16:35,625
I kept repeating this again and again.
1279
01:16:36,458 --> 01:16:38,958
And then I heard someone
knocking on his door.
1280
01:16:42,000 --> 01:16:45,833
Then I heard the door open
and I heard Remo asking.
1281
01:16:46,708 --> 01:16:49,833
"Why are you standing there?
What exactly are you hoping to hear?"
1282
01:16:52,125 --> 01:16:55,375
As I listened from the other end,
I realized that it was Jolly
1283
01:16:55,458 --> 01:16:59,416
who was standing outside
and Remo was talking to her.
1284
01:17:01,291 --> 01:17:05,458
I told him, "I'll call you later,"
and quickly disconnected the call.
1285
01:17:07,208 --> 01:17:08,875
I was waiting for the night to end,
1286
01:17:08,958 --> 01:17:11,458
so I could go and get those kids
out of the house.
1287
01:17:11,541 --> 01:17:14,625
The first thing I did then was call
the superintendent of police.
1288
01:17:28,333 --> 01:17:30,500
This morning,
Jolly Joseph was arrested
1289
01:17:30,583 --> 01:17:32,375
and taken to police custody
1290
01:17:32,458 --> 01:17:34,250
at her home in Koodathayi.
1291
01:17:34,333 --> 01:17:37,666
She will be formally charged
with killing her husband, Roy.
1292
01:17:37,750 --> 01:17:41,708
But she is under suspicion for the five
other deaths in question as well.
1293
01:17:44,708 --> 01:17:46,791
I had been watching
all the news clips.
1294
01:17:48,125 --> 01:17:51,541
They brought Jolly out of the house
and put her in the police jeep.
1295
01:17:51,625 --> 01:17:53,500
Remo was standing in the veranda.
1296
01:17:53,583 --> 01:17:56,000
But there was no sign of the younger son.
1297
01:17:56,083 --> 01:17:58,750
I kept searching for him
in the news clips,
1298
01:17:58,833 --> 01:18:00,208
wondering where he was,
1299
01:18:00,291 --> 01:18:02,416
if he was still in the house or not.
1300
01:18:03,000 --> 01:18:05,375
The first thing I did
when we got to the house was
1301
01:18:05,458 --> 01:18:06,708
checking on the younger son.
1302
01:18:06,791 --> 01:18:08,625
He was still sleeping.
1303
01:18:08,708 --> 01:18:11,000
The whole house had an air of neglect.
1304
01:18:11,083 --> 01:18:13,250
There were dishes
lying unwashed in the sink.
1305
01:18:13,333 --> 01:18:15,791
I could see leftover food everywhere.
1306
01:18:15,875 --> 01:18:20,208
It seemed like nobody had bothered
to clean the place for weeks.
1307
01:18:21,416 --> 01:18:23,000
I just closed the door and left
1308
01:18:23,083 --> 01:18:25,583
but by then, a crowd had gathered
around the house.
1309
01:18:29,041 --> 01:18:30,916
Some of them tried to speak to me.
1310
01:18:31,000 --> 01:18:34,500
But by now, the yard had filled
with people from the media.
1311
01:18:34,583 --> 01:18:37,041
I realized we wouldn't be able to get out.
1312
01:18:39,666 --> 01:18:41,166
But then something happened.
1313
01:18:41,250 --> 01:18:43,583
It was almost like it was a miracle.
1314
01:18:43,666 --> 01:18:45,541
At around three-thirty, four o'clock,
1315
01:18:45,625 --> 01:18:49,000
there was a huge thunderstorm
with falling rain.
1316
01:18:49,083 --> 01:18:50,625
It rained so heavily
1317
01:18:50,708 --> 01:18:52,958
that the media had to disperse
and move away.
1318
01:18:53,666 --> 01:18:56,000
I thought now is the time
to leave with the kids.
1319
01:18:56,916 --> 01:18:59,208
Then I told the boys,
"Go and pack your bags.
1320
01:18:59,291 --> 01:19:03,375
And take whatever you think
is important to you, but do it quickly."
1321
01:19:04,416 --> 01:19:07,166
And then I locked the house
and we left from there.
1322
01:19:08,708 --> 01:19:11,333
That night,
while we were on our way home,
1323
01:19:11,416 --> 01:19:15,416
Remo showed me all the news clippings
related to our case.
1324
01:19:15,500 --> 01:19:17,958
I saw Shaju was defending Jolly.
1325
01:19:18,041 --> 01:19:21,750
By this time, they had started responding
to all the different news channels.
1326
01:19:21,833 --> 01:19:24,750
They were saying,
"This is a dispute over property.
1327
01:19:24,833 --> 01:19:26,313
They're just doing it for the money."
1328
01:19:27,541 --> 01:19:30,875
I looked at Remo and said,
"Just ignore these people.
1329
01:19:30,958 --> 01:19:32,875
Don't pay attention
to what they're saying."
1330
01:19:37,166 --> 01:19:40,041
We reached Vyttila at exactly 5:00 p.m.
1331
01:19:42,791 --> 01:19:45,708
Then I got out of the taxi
and opened the gate.
1332
01:19:49,541 --> 01:19:52,625
And as soon I walked through the gate...
1333
01:19:53,541 --> 01:19:56,291
I stood there for a moment
looking up at the sky,
1334
01:19:56,375 --> 01:19:57,958
and I said to my parents,
1335
01:19:58,041 --> 01:20:00,458
and also to my elder brother Roy,
1336
01:20:01,083 --> 01:20:02,833
"I did what I could do."
1337
01:20:04,041 --> 01:20:07,791
Because I knew that my parents
and all these other souls were with me.
1338
01:20:07,875 --> 01:20:09,416
That's what I believe.
1339
01:20:09,500 --> 01:20:12,125
I felt like they wanted
to carry out this mission through me
1340
01:20:12,208 --> 01:20:13,291
and that's why it worked.
1341
01:20:13,375 --> 01:20:14,750
I'm convinced of it.
1342
01:20:24,833 --> 01:20:27,208
She murdered her
mother-in-law to gain power.
1343
01:20:27,291 --> 01:20:29,333
Her father-in-law for his property.
1344
01:20:29,416 --> 01:20:31,458
Her husband
for questioning her relationships.
1345
01:20:31,541 --> 01:20:34,583
Her uncle for growing suspicious
about her activities.
1346
01:20:34,666 --> 01:20:38,000
Sili and her daughter Alphine
for getting in the way of her plans
1347
01:20:38,083 --> 01:20:40,500
to marry Sili's husband, Shaju.
1348
01:20:40,583 --> 01:20:43,125
Was Jolly the mastermind
behind all the murders?
1349
01:20:44,750 --> 01:20:46,208
The court has remanded Jolly
1350
01:20:46,291 --> 01:20:48,125
in police custody for six days,
1351
01:20:48,208 --> 01:20:50,458
until the 16th of this month.
1352
01:20:51,250 --> 01:20:53,791
During that time,
they will be questioning her,
1353
01:20:53,875 --> 01:20:56,333
and perhaps the biggest
unanswered question is,
1354
01:20:57,041 --> 01:20:59,166
"Did Jolly act alone?"
1355
01:21:02,458 --> 01:21:04,291
This is what Jolly told me.
1356
01:21:05,041 --> 01:21:06,791
Jolly had read in the newspaper
1357
01:21:06,875 --> 01:21:10,958
about the highly poisonous substance
that acts quickly.
1358
01:21:11,041 --> 01:21:13,666
This poison was called cyanide.
1359
01:21:13,750 --> 01:21:17,208
And it was easily accessible
to goldsmiths who made jewelry.
1360
01:21:17,916 --> 01:21:21,291
Now M.S. Mathew was in the business
of selling gold jewelry.
1361
01:21:21,375 --> 01:21:25,625
He had been working as a salesman
in a jewelry store for quite some time.
1362
01:21:25,708 --> 01:21:28,791
Keeping this in mind,
Jolly formed a friendship with Mathew.
1363
01:21:28,875 --> 01:21:31,500
She asked Mathew for some cyanide,
1364
01:21:31,583 --> 01:21:34,916
saying that she needed to kill a stray dog
that kept coming into the house.
1365
01:21:35,541 --> 01:21:37,000
Now Praji Kumar used to work
1366
01:21:37,083 --> 01:21:39,625
at the same jewelry store as M.S. Mathew.
1367
01:21:39,708 --> 01:21:40,916
He was a goldsmith
1368
01:21:41,000 --> 01:21:43,875
and had a very good relationship
with Mathew.
1369
01:21:44,458 --> 01:21:47,375
It was Praji Kumar
who gave Mathew the cyanide.
1370
01:21:47,458 --> 01:21:49,916
Mathew... Mathew...
Were you aware of what she was doing?
1371
01:21:50,000 --> 01:21:51,708
How many times did you
give cyanide to her?
1372
01:21:51,791 --> 01:21:53,875
Mathew, are you trapped
in this case by someone?
1373
01:21:55,208 --> 01:21:57,291
Mathew was given the opportunity to tell
1374
01:21:57,375 --> 01:21:59,625
his side of the story in the court.
1375
01:22:00,125 --> 01:22:02,458
He had a chance to tell the court
that he was innocent,
1376
01:22:02,541 --> 01:22:03,791
that this was a false case,
1377
01:22:03,875 --> 01:22:06,750
and that he had nothing to do
with the six murders.
1378
01:22:06,833 --> 01:22:09,541
But when asked
if he had anything to say at all,
1379
01:22:09,625 --> 01:22:11,416
he didn't deny being involved.
1380
01:22:13,458 --> 01:22:15,250
With Jolly and her accomplices
1381
01:22:15,333 --> 01:22:16,333
in the police custody,
1382
01:22:16,416 --> 01:22:20,833
K.G. Simon's case is complicated
by the lack of physical evidence.
1383
01:22:20,916 --> 01:22:24,416
No doubt finding the cyanide used
in these murders
1384
01:22:24,500 --> 01:22:27,458
would make that case much stronger.
1385
01:22:31,916 --> 01:22:33,583
The evidence-gathering process
1386
01:22:33,666 --> 01:22:36,041
during this case was very challenging.
1387
01:22:36,125 --> 01:22:37,833
Because wherever we took Jolly,
1388
01:22:37,916 --> 01:22:40,625
there was always
a lot of intense media attention
1389
01:22:40,708 --> 01:22:42,208
followed by crowd and chaos.
1390
01:22:48,250 --> 01:22:49,416
This way.
1391
01:22:49,500 --> 01:22:52,083
Haven't you seen
enough photos of me already?
1392
01:22:52,166 --> 01:22:54,291
Yes,
we have seen you a lot already.
1393
01:22:54,375 --> 01:22:58,083
Then we took
Jolly Joseph to the Ponnamattam house.
1394
01:22:58,166 --> 01:23:02,000
We felt as though the evidence fell
right into our hands.
1395
01:23:02,083 --> 01:23:05,333
This is a turning point
in the Koodathayi serial murder case.
1396
01:23:05,416 --> 01:23:07,416
Last night, the police found
crucial evidence,
1397
01:23:07,500 --> 01:23:09,083
a bottle containing a powder,
1398
01:23:09,166 --> 01:23:12,041
suspected to be cyanide
at the Ponnamattam house.
1399
01:23:15,625 --> 01:23:18,958
With all due respect
to the honorable court
1400
01:23:19,041 --> 01:23:21,916
and with all due respect
to the prosecution,
1401
01:23:22,000 --> 01:23:25,541
as a defense lawyer,
I find it hard to believe,
1402
01:23:25,625 --> 01:23:28,416
that such a substance
would be found in her home,
1403
01:23:28,500 --> 01:23:30,333
after all these years.
1404
01:23:30,416 --> 01:23:32,250
It's beyond my imagination.
1405
01:23:33,125 --> 01:23:35,916
In order to incriminate Jolly
1406
01:23:36,000 --> 01:23:39,083
and to prove that the allegations
against her were true,
1407
01:23:39,166 --> 01:23:43,208
the prosecution fabricated the evidence,
the potassium cyanide,
1408
01:23:43,833 --> 01:23:46,375
the bottle in which it was kept,
1409
01:23:46,458 --> 01:23:48,458
and the place where it was hidden.
1410
01:23:49,750 --> 01:23:53,333
I believe the whole thing was set up
to fit the narrative,
1411
01:23:53,416 --> 01:23:55,833
to serve the purpose of their case.
1412
01:23:57,375 --> 01:23:59,500
Whenever I spoke
to police officers,
1413
01:23:59,583 --> 01:24:02,208
they did not give me clear-cut answers,
1414
01:24:02,291 --> 01:24:03,541
which made me feel
1415
01:24:03,625 --> 01:24:06,541
that the police investigation
was not complete.
1416
01:24:06,625 --> 01:24:09,708
There could have been holes
in the police, uh, narrative,
1417
01:24:09,791 --> 01:24:12,458
which was never questioned.
1418
01:24:12,541 --> 01:24:15,000
These questions would actually
stare back at you,
1419
01:24:15,083 --> 01:24:16,958
the loopholes in the case.
1420
01:24:22,583 --> 01:24:25,875
Jolly's case is
actually made up of six cases
1421
01:24:25,958 --> 01:24:28,916
with a total of 263 witnesses.
1422
01:24:31,125 --> 01:24:34,291
If we were to conduct a trial
for each case,
1423
01:24:34,375 --> 01:24:36,250
which is how it should be,
1424
01:24:36,333 --> 01:24:39,083
then the first trial
would take at least one year,
1425
01:24:39,166 --> 01:24:41,208
the others following in succession.
1426
01:24:41,291 --> 01:24:44,625
So it would take six years
for six cases to be concluded.
1427
01:24:46,125 --> 01:24:49,166
So what legal benefits
is the defendant entitled to?
1428
01:24:49,250 --> 01:24:51,541
First, give us those legal provisions,
1429
01:24:51,625 --> 01:24:55,083
and I will get to the truth
and prove her innocence in court.
1430
01:24:55,166 --> 01:24:59,541
I believe 100%
that Jollyamma will succeed.
1431
01:24:59,625 --> 01:25:03,208
She will not be convicted
at any point of time.
1432
01:25:17,333 --> 01:25:20,125
The case is now
in the hands of the court,
1433
01:25:20,208 --> 01:25:21,458
our work is done.
1434
01:25:23,083 --> 01:25:26,875
After I retired, I got a lot of offers
to take up other cases.
1435
01:25:27,458 --> 01:25:28,916
But I turned them down
1436
01:25:29,000 --> 01:25:31,375
because I wanted to spend
more time with my family
1437
01:25:31,458 --> 01:25:32,708
and take care of them.
1438
01:25:32,791 --> 01:25:35,208
And that's exactly what I'm doing now.
1439
01:25:42,791 --> 01:25:45,375
When they filed a case against her
and she was arrested...
1440
01:25:46,250 --> 01:25:48,125
some people didn't speak to me,
1441
01:25:48,208 --> 01:25:51,666
and there were some people
who called me to apologize.
1442
01:25:53,791 --> 01:25:57,250
Yeah, but everyone was dumbstruck,
our relatives too.
1443
01:26:00,833 --> 01:26:02,250
Looking back...
1444
01:26:02,333 --> 01:26:03,541
I think it was fate.
1445
01:26:03,625 --> 01:26:04,875
What else could it be?
1446
01:26:05,791 --> 01:26:07,458
Pure bad luck.
1447
01:26:10,083 --> 01:26:13,000
We planned to renovate
the Ponnamattam house and make it...
1448
01:26:14,000 --> 01:26:16,666
our ancestral home again.
1449
01:26:17,416 --> 01:26:19,625
We want to continue living there
like we used to.
1450
01:26:20,833 --> 01:26:25,791
Maybe then the souls of our parents
will finally get some peace.
1451
01:26:27,083 --> 01:26:29,541
Because this was the house
of their dreams.
1452
01:26:33,041 --> 01:26:34,392
Remo, do you think
your mother acted alone?
1453
01:26:34,416 --> 01:26:35,958
Is she the only one who is guilty?
1454
01:26:36,041 --> 01:26:39,125
I'm sorry I can't say anything right now
because it's not over yet
1455
01:26:39,208 --> 01:26:41,208
and we're still waiting
for the end result.
1456
01:26:41,291 --> 01:26:43,916
We all want to know the end result,
don't we? Huh?
1457
01:26:44,000 --> 01:26:45,958
I can't afford to be worn down
by this process.
1458
01:26:46,041 --> 01:26:47,681
I have to take care of my little brother.
1459
01:26:47,750 --> 01:26:50,000
That I have a responsibility.
I have to take care of him.
1460
01:26:50,083 --> 01:26:53,625
So I'm going to overcome this
and I'm going to move on and that's all.
1461
01:26:53,708 --> 01:26:55,416
Well, I just want to say one thing.
1462
01:26:55,500 --> 01:26:59,750
Whether it takes 17 years or 25 years,
truth will triumph.
1463
01:27:02,208 --> 01:27:04,708
A lot of people
have asked this question.
1464
01:27:06,250 --> 01:27:08,041
"All of you are such educated people,
1465
01:27:08,125 --> 01:27:11,125
how did you not suspect
what Jolly was doing?"
1466
01:27:11,208 --> 01:27:13,833
"How could you not know
about her educational qualifications?"
1467
01:27:14,416 --> 01:27:17,708
To all the people who've been
asking us these questions,
1468
01:27:17,791 --> 01:27:19,500
I have only one thing to ask them,
1469
01:27:20,125 --> 01:27:23,416
"When you're son is about to get married,
how many of you asked to see
1470
01:27:23,500 --> 01:27:25,875
your daughter-in-law's
educational qualifications,
1471
01:27:25,958 --> 01:27:28,958
her graduation certificates,
or her portfolios?"
1472
01:27:30,208 --> 01:27:33,458
We trusted her,
that's what family does, right?
1473
01:27:35,750 --> 01:27:39,083
She knew very well
that no one would ever doubt her.
1474
01:27:41,250 --> 01:27:44,291
You know there is a phrase
that describes people like her.
1475
01:27:44,375 --> 01:27:46,541
"A wolf in sheep's clothing."
1476
01:27:50,333 --> 01:27:55,625
If a wolf disguises itself as a sheep,
then no one will know it for what it is.
1477
01:27:55,708 --> 01:27:58,458
Maybe that's why, in Jolly's case,
she was able to hide
1478
01:27:58,541 --> 01:28:00,833
who she really was from everyone.
1479
01:28:04,083 --> 01:28:05,625
I've often wondered...
1480
01:28:07,625 --> 01:28:10,250
What was Jolly trying to gain
with all this?
1481
01:28:12,375 --> 01:28:15,916
Was it for money? For power? Property?
1482
01:28:16,875 --> 01:28:20,708
I wanted to hear the answers
directly from Jolly herself.
1483
01:28:28,625 --> 01:28:30,583
I was waiting upstairs.
1484
01:28:30,666 --> 01:28:35,041
Then Jolly came in, accompanied
by several policemen and women.
1485
01:28:36,041 --> 01:28:37,250
When she saw me,
1486
01:28:37,333 --> 01:28:40,583
there was no change
in her facial expression.
1487
01:28:42,333 --> 01:28:46,500
To be honest, I didn't have any
particular feelings towards this woman.
1488
01:28:48,250 --> 01:28:50,958
I said, "Look, I came here to tell you
1489
01:28:51,041 --> 01:28:52,625
that you shouldn't call Remo so often.
1490
01:28:52,708 --> 01:28:54,500
It makes him very upset.
1491
01:28:54,583 --> 01:28:58,125
I know because I overheard him
speaking very angrily with you.
1492
01:28:58,750 --> 01:29:01,833
You're always calling him up and saying,
"Look at how they're punishing me.
1493
01:29:01,916 --> 01:29:03,708
Listen, I'm going to get out of here.
1494
01:29:03,791 --> 01:29:06,958
Come here and show me the proof
that I did something wrong."
1495
01:29:07,041 --> 01:29:10,041
"If you keep saying these things,
he's going to get more angry.
1496
01:29:10,125 --> 01:29:13,041
So I don't want you bothering him again."
1497
01:29:13,125 --> 01:29:15,666
I told her, "What bothers Remo the most
1498
01:29:15,750 --> 01:29:18,416
is that you have shown no remorse
for what you've done.
1499
01:29:18,500 --> 01:29:21,458
You still haven't understood
the seriousness of what you've done.
1500
01:29:21,541 --> 01:29:24,625
The impact that's had on the children
and the rest of the family.
1501
01:29:25,208 --> 01:29:28,625
The children never received
what they wanted from their mother.
1502
01:29:28,708 --> 01:29:31,791
And now they're going through
this terrible time because of you.
1503
01:29:31,875 --> 01:29:33,958
I don't want them going through
this hell anymore,
1504
01:29:34,041 --> 01:29:36,416
so the sole purpose of my visit is to...
1505
01:29:36,500 --> 01:29:37,958
put a stop to this.
1506
01:29:39,541 --> 01:29:42,208
I accept the fact that you are the one
who gave birth to them,
1507
01:29:42,291 --> 01:29:43,500
I don't deny that,
1508
01:29:43,583 --> 01:29:45,500
I will always acknowledge you
as their mother,
1509
01:29:45,583 --> 01:29:47,416
and I'm sure the children will too.
1510
01:29:47,500 --> 01:29:48,958
But this present situation
1511
01:29:49,041 --> 01:29:50,625
has been very hard on them
1512
01:29:50,708 --> 01:29:52,541
and I will not allow them
to suffer anymore."
1513
01:29:52,625 --> 01:29:55,166
I told her, "As long as I'm alive,
I won't allow it.
1514
01:29:57,458 --> 01:29:59,125
They're my children now.
1515
01:29:59,750 --> 01:30:02,583
I'm going to raise them
as if they are my own."
1516
01:30:10,625 --> 01:30:14,500
What our aunt has done for us
can't be described in just a word
1517
01:30:14,583 --> 01:30:16,166
or even a sentence.
1518
01:30:18,791 --> 01:30:21,125
The way she's loved us and cared for us
1519
01:30:21,208 --> 01:30:23,791
is far beyond anything
we could ever imagine.
1520
01:30:27,541 --> 01:30:30,500
It's only now
that we've really become a family.
1521
01:30:32,041 --> 01:30:33,833
It may seem like we're a new family,
1522
01:30:33,916 --> 01:30:35,041
but we're not...
1523
01:30:35,125 --> 01:30:37,166
We're... we're all of the same blood.
1524
01:30:39,000 --> 01:30:42,583
Many of our loved ones
are no longer with us.
1525
01:30:42,666 --> 01:30:44,708
But I know that their blessings
are with us.
1526
01:30:44,791 --> 01:30:46,625
And... and I'm sure
1527
01:30:46,708 --> 01:30:48,708
that they're all here with us in spirit.
1528
01:30:50,916 --> 01:30:54,333
And we don't dwell on the past anymore,
we don't have any regrets.
1529
01:30:54,416 --> 01:30:57,500
Instead, we've moved on
and we've all become stronger.
1530
01:31:07,708 --> 01:31:11,041
The person who held
such a high position in our family,
1531
01:31:11,125 --> 01:31:14,041
who lived such a privileged life
in our house,
1532
01:31:14,125 --> 01:31:17,875
with an army of servants
and countless possessions.
1533
01:31:17,958 --> 01:31:21,041
Now, had to be escorted in
by ten police officers.
1534
01:31:21,125 --> 01:31:24,625
While I was speaking to her,
I couldn't help but feel a little pity.
1535
01:31:24,708 --> 01:31:29,083
I kept thinking what a terrible situation
this person Jolly
1536
01:31:29,166 --> 01:31:31,583
has landed herself in so unnecessarily.
1537
01:31:35,666 --> 01:31:39,458
I asked her, "How do you feel
about what you've done?"
1538
01:31:41,500 --> 01:31:42,666
"It just happened."
1539
01:31:43,375 --> 01:31:45,291
That's what she said, "It just happened."
1540
01:31:47,875 --> 01:31:51,375
"You consciously and deliberately
murdered these six people.
1541
01:31:51,458 --> 01:31:53,666
And you didn't even spare a little child.
1542
01:31:53,750 --> 01:31:56,083
And now you're telling, it just happened?"
1543
01:31:58,166 --> 01:32:00,708
"That's because I have
the mind of a criminal,
1544
01:32:00,791 --> 01:32:02,833
I'm very good at hiding things."
1545
01:32:03,500 --> 01:32:05,125
That was her reply.
1546
01:32:10,250 --> 01:32:14,541
Then after we finished talking,
she told me, you know.
1547
01:32:15,708 --> 01:32:17,583
"It's written in the Bible that
1548
01:32:17,666 --> 01:32:21,083
no matter how much we sinned,
God will always forgive us.
1549
01:32:21,625 --> 01:32:23,875
So God will forgive me too."
1550
01:32:26,833 --> 01:32:29,375
I said, "Yeah, God will forgive you.
1551
01:32:29,458 --> 01:32:32,083
After all, God forgives everyone,
you're right."
130613
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